[pitlove]

Katie-

Your dog is not improving on a rX diet because it is grain free. It is because it is free of an ingredient that bothers your dogs GI tract. As Crazy4cats stated I am a licensed vet tech and I 100% support rX diets as I’ve seen the wonders they do. I am talking about OTC grain free diets that are designed with the sole purpose of marketing to naive pet owners who think they are feeding a superior product because grains are absent from the diet. Not rX diets that are formulated through extensive testing and research.

[pitlove]

Katie-

Grain free literally has ZERO benefits to your dog. Why would you risk even a SMALL possibility of your dog getting DCM from the food your feeding when there is no reward?

[pitlove]

I’ve never tried the Mal-A-Ket one. Knowing that ketoconazole and michonazole do the same thing I’ve for some reason always prefer michonazole based shampoos. Probably just because thats what I’m familiar with.

I’m hoping though that Bayer is not discontinuing Malaseb, as it is a great product and cheaper than Dechra products. Might decide to call the company myself and ask them about the out of stock issues.

[pitlove]

Hi Sandy-

Your post is confusing. Your dog was brought in for a hot spot but you ended up doing blood work and an SDMA test. Why? Because of the weight loss and the poor appetite? Was a diagnosis given? Kidney disease is common in a pet of your dogs age, but you didnt say that the vet was thinking she had kidney disease or was in kidney failure. RC is not the only company that makes kidney diets. Hill’s and Purina do as well. Perhaps she would prefer one of those. There is nothing wrong with the ingredients in the prescription diets. They do their job. It is far more important to find a diet that will support the kidneys vs one that fits your ideals for feeding a dog.

[pitlove]

Last time it was out of stock on chewy.com I bought Dechra MichonaHex+ Triz which is very similar and works just as well. Just smells worse IMO.

[pitlove]

Patricia-

Susan is right on this one. The dog in your video is gulping and licking not reverse sneezing. These attacks often also involve the dog licking anything and everything in sight. Mine will lick the floor uncontrollably. I do not know what is causing it, but he reverse sneezes as well sometimes and the two are completely different.

[pitlove]

No Susan, we only used it for a short time. He hasn’t had it happen in a while, but it likely will again.

[pitlove]

Hi Debi-

Was there ever any discussion that there could have been damage to her trachea when they extubated her after the pyo surgery? If the cuff is not deflated properly when they attempt to extubate or they do not wait for a swallow reflex before they remove the trach tube it can cause some damage/inflammation to the trachea.

Also you said this was a Pom. Have radiographs been done to rule out collapsing trachea? It is very common in small breeds and will cause a cough like what you are talking about.

If none of these things have been visited at the vet I would bring them up.

As far as the frantic swallowing and gulping goes, one of my dogs started doing this maybe around a year ago. I tried a lot of suggested remedies, but so far I haven’t found anything that eliminates it completely. He will go for quite a few months before he has an episode, but its random and doesn’t seem to be triggered by anything specific. I’ve talked to a couple of doctors I work with about it and they were stumped as well.

[pitlove]

Katie-

It isn’t very challenging for a company with a veterinary nutritionist and multiple veterinarians on staff to be able to formulate a food that is appropriate for both sensitive skin and sensitive stomach. Salmon tends to be a good protein for dogs with skin allergies (the main protein in Pro Plan Sensitive Skin & Stomach is salmon) and the right types of fiber and % of fiber can help dogs with sensitive stomachs. Plus limiting the amount of ingredients in the food, adding probiotics to the food and having ingredients that are easy on the GI system.

As someone with a dog with both skin allergies and a very sensitive GI system, I can attest to the fact that Pro Plan Sensitive Skin & Stomach was a miracle for my dog. We only switched when we found a cheaper food of similar quality that came in a larger bag.

[pitlove]

Hi Ashlee-

Both BalanceIt.com and petdiets.com offer consultation services with their staff of veterinary nutritionists. They can work with your pets vet if they have a medical condition as well.

[pitlove]

There are a lot of GSD breed specific rescues out there, mainly because this is a breed that is frequently rehomed due to potential buyers not understanding working breeds. I’m sure there is one in the Philly area that could help you. A shelter is no place for a dog, especially not a 9 year old one. Look for a breed specific rescue dedicated to the GSD. If they have fosters available I’m sure they will help.

[pitlove]

The only foods I would pick from that list are NutriSource or Instinct.

[pitlove]

This level of calcium would be ok for a fully matured adult dog.

[pitlove]

2 Dogs on Bravecto in our household. No issues.

[pitlove]

Rose B-

Breeders are not doctors or researchers and only can do what they believe works for them. A regular puppy formula is not meant for a giant breed puppy. This is probably what was being fed to the dog with H/D. Or it was genetic. 30-40 years ago (when your breeder started breeding) there were no appropriate puppy foods designed for large and giant breeds like Mastiffs. Now there are more than enough. Even my teacher (who graduated vet school over 30 years ago) used to tell her clients to feed adult food to giant breed pups. Now she said, she absolutely does not. Too much research to prove the harm in doing so and with all the great large and giant breed puppy foods on the market, she does not agree with that anymore.

[pitlove]

As Susan said, the only way for you to properly determine if this is a food allergy is by process of an elimination trial. This is the gold standard.

If the dog is food allergic, one of the worst things you can do is rotate their foods. Find one food that does not cause a break out of symptoms and stick to that. My food allergic dog has always done awful when his food is switched too much due to the fact that I could not figure out what was causing the symptoms. We now have him on one food that he does well on and we don’t change it. It has made him and us happier.

[pitlove]

Hi Peggy-

No I would not change her food. If she was doing fine up until the antibiotics, then food is not the issue. I would also not be adding yogurt to her diet. There are other/better probiotics the vet can prescribe for her.

Also a BCS of 4 is not thin. It is ideal. Wolfhound/GSD are both lean and active breeds. Do not allow her to gain more weight, try to put muscle on her now and maintain a BCS of 4.

[pitlove]

The extra vitamins that you are supplementing are really unnecessary when feeding a high quality balanced food. I would personally d/c them at this time. I’m not saying they are related to the repro issues you are having, but they are just not doing anything but wasting your money.

When you went to a repro vet where did you go? A vet school? Or a private practice? The theirogenology department at the vet school in my state is really excellent. Maybe try a different one. Are both bitches litter mates? Could it be genetic?

[pitlove]

Uh, not true. This is still done when needed. Especially for clients who can not afford diagnostics.

[pitlove]

You do know that vets will often treat based on suspicion right? Especially if it means possibly providing some relief for the patient.

[pitlove]

I mean, if your only solution is to ignore me then by all means go right ahead. I won’t be offended.

The vet is suspecting IBD or IBS, which I said before, which is a diagnosis. And AGAIN, I never told her to demand the Mirtazapine from her vet, I advised her to ASK him if that is something he thinks could benefit her dog. Reading comprehension.

Trust me, I have no issue understanding how medication is prescribed. I work with 5 vets.

[pitlove]

How does the dog not being able to undergo anesthesia mean it can not tolerate a medication meant to stimulate appetite?

Also why are you choosing to argue this point, when it is not my decision or yours if the dog is prescribed this medication. I made her aware of the option, nothing more. Yet here we are continuing to argue about something that we have zero control over and the owner of the dog has not even responded back.

[pitlove]

Being underweight =/= malnutrition. Now you are attempting to diagnosis the dog. Her vet believes the dog has either IBS or IBD.

[pitlove]

I’m sorry, but I fail to understand how the doctor would be doing any harm to her dog by choosing whether or not he wanted to prescribe that medication?

He is the professional here after right? So if he goes “yeah if you’d like to give her an appetite stimulant that is a great idea!” that is HIS professional call. And if he says “no I do not want to prescribe that to her just yet” that is also his choice as a professional. So either way, a professional who IS her vet would be making the ultimate decision.

All I did was make her aware that there are medications for poor appetite available that she could inquire about.

Edit:

A spay is not a basic procedure. Not sure what made you think that. If the dog is actually underweight, it is an anesthetic risk. Spaying a dog requires the doctor to make a midline incision into the abdominal wall. I’m very glad the doctor did not spay this dog. Does not mean the dog is too underweight to have a perfectly safe drug meant to stimulate appetite.

[pitlove]

“The poor appetite is a symptom, not the cause.”

And treating symptoms is important. Are you the examining doctor? What tests did you run through the internet on this dog that allowed you to determine that poor appetite does not need to be addressed at this current time?

I advised her to ASK her VET if he is COMFORTABLE prescribing it, not to DEMAND that he prescribe it to her whether he wants to or not.

There is absolutely ZERO harm in this because it is at the doctors discretion.

[pitlove]

Hi Jan-

If I were you, I’d be looking for peer reviewed articles to back up that claim before assuming food is related.

In general what type of issues are you experiencing and what breed are you in? Do you have a mentor? Have you talked to the vet about your concerns?

[pitlove]

Hi 2doodlemom-

If you are having trouble getting your dog to eat and she is TRULY underweight, I would ask your vet if he is comfortable prescribing Mirtazapine.

It is used as an appetite stimulant in dogs and cats and may be helpful in jump starting your dog to want to eat again.

One food that I find typically settles well with dogs with sensitive stomachs is Purina Pro Plan. This is a food that may be worth trying for your dog. I find it is palatable and easy on the digestive tract and they make a sensitive skin and stomach formula that I used for a long time for my dog with GI issues.

Since your dog is almost 2 and having trouble gaining weight (again if he really is underweight and not just in good physical condition) blood work is always a good idea. If anything this gives your vet a baseline and if something comes up later they can look back and see what normal looks like for your dog.

[pitlove]

You keep saying “antibiotic on his food”. I think you mean probiotic. A probiotic is perfectly safe for long term use.

Also why are you so against using a large breed puppy food?

“– Would a diet change help (he eats BlackHawk lamb and rice ‘adult’) now no matter what anyone says im not feeding him any puppy food of any kind ‘giant/large breed’ or not.”

^This is a poor attitude to have and will only cause problems for your dog in the future.

[pitlove]

@SpyCar

Again, I am disappointed in your post. What you posted is not proof. I have already done the research myself and my conclusion has not changed. I was looking for new information that I may have missed during my own studies. What you have provided is not worthy of an apology.

Your statements are most certainly slanderous, especially since you are posting them to a public forum where they can be viewed by any lay person. I’m sure in college you were taught the importance of finding credible sources when citing. This rule doesn’t change in real world application.

If you are unable to provide proof that by-products are being mishandled in the way you speak of, I will be forced to believe your statements are only fueled by emotion and bias hatred of the pet food industry. Not fact.

[pitlove]

Susan K-

One of the biggest concerns with this discovery is that breeds NOT commonly known to get DCM or be genetically predisposed to it are coming up with it.

I know that your dog got back good taurine levels (as of right now), but is it worth the risk when there are many quality grain inclusive foods out there?

[pitlove]

Spy Car-

I know you are capable of making a well thought out post, that is logically sound with good reason. So what happened with your post about the way by products are treated at manufacturing facilities? It was thoroughly disappointing. One can not simply just state something as you’ve done with literally zero proof to back it up and call it bible. Please, if you are going to out right slander the large pet food companies like that, provide a link that can, beyond a shadow of a doubt, provide clear and obvious evidence for such a statement.

Shouldn’t be too much to ask of someone that prides themselves on being enlightened about pet nutrition ey?

[pitlove]

Hi Cynthia-

I would avoid grain free foods for the moment until the FDA can determine what is the cause of DCM being seen in non common breeds. Better safe than sorry, right?!

[pitlove]

Gonna have to agree with Acroyali. Telling someone to go back to the vet and demand they redo the dental and remove healthy teeth sounds like giving out medical advice. Pretty dangerous medical advice at that.

[pitlove]

Anon, why would someone who has literally just had their dogs teeth cleaned, and stated no extractions were needed, go BACK to the vet, have another dental done her on dog and get extractions done on teeth that are not diseased? You know this would be malpractice right?

I’m really starting to think you’ve stopped reading people posts since you don’t think anyone should ask for advice on the internet.

[pitlove]

S B-

GSD’s were originally bred for herding, but they also excel at protection sports like IPO. I’ve seen them compete in agility and barn hunt as well. Also something you can do on your walks is to put a weighted back pack on him. That way he has a job to do by carrying your supplies. If you have inclines and mountains where you live, go hiking with him. Also practicing basic obedience daily mental stimulates them and helps them build confidence. Even simple things like sitting and waiting for food, not walking out the door before you do. Small things like that. They make a big difference. Also consistency is important for dogs. They like routine and can often get anxious when something is changed, so try to keep feeding times the same and bathroom break times the same as much as possible.

[pitlove]

Hi S B-

I second every thing that Acroyali said. This dog needs a trainer that is experienced with German Shepherds. Also, please do not forget, GSD’s are working dogs. They tend to be very badly behaved and have anxiety when they are not given a job. They can not thrive as couch potatoes. I see a lot of under worked and under stimulated working breeds have anxiety issues due to this. Also just taking him on walks and playing in the yard is not enough for these breeds.

[pitlove]

Great update Aimee. I havent looked in the pet section of Walmart in a long time, so I’ve never seen these. Sad how even Ol’Roy can make a product more true to what it states it to be than E.A can.

[pitlove]

Please take your dog to the vet. A blocked urinary system can be life threatening.

[pitlove]

@susan k

The dogs tested back with low taurine because their bodies aren’t able to absorb it due to the legumes in the food. See what I’m saying now?

Golden Retrievers were the original breed studied for this some time ago, but now the concern is that it is effecting breeds that do not commonly have DCM issues genetically.

If you are willingly to take such a large risk for such small reward (grain free is not superior to grain inclusive just so you understand) that is your choice. But the only thing being accomplished here is the grain free pushing companies getting to laugh their way to the bank with your money in hand.

[pitlove]

For puppies, especially toy breed puppies, yes 3-4 meals per day. ALWAYS. You can absolutely continue this practice as adults.

[pitlove]

@susan k

The issue is actually not foods being deficient in taurine like it was in the 80s with cats, but that the legumes in grain free diets are actually preventing the absorption of taurine. Big difference. So yes grain free products right now ARE the problem. Why take the risk?

Wellness makes plenty of grain inclusive products if you want to stay with that company. There is nothing at all superior about a food simply because it is free of grains.

[pitlove]

Oh Joanne, sorry! I thought you were the person that made this thread!

[pitlove]

Joanne-

I too havent been a fan of grain free diets for a while now. I used to be, but I’ve learned grain free doesn’t equal better quality.

We used Purina Pro Plan for 2 1/2 years with my dogs and they did excellent on it. I recently switched to Victor (grain inclusive) due to the price being better and they are doing just as well on it as Pro Plan. I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend either brand from my personal experiences with them.

Since your dog already has DCM, stay FAR away from grain free foods until this whole thing can be cleared up.

[pitlove]

Acroyali-

Totally off topic, but it sounds like you breed? If so what breed?

[pitlove]

Victor or Pro Plan

[pitlove]

Have you had a fecal done to make sure the hookworms are actually gone? Also have you been picking up the poop in your yard as soon as she goes? Hookworms can give in the ground for a long time. Also make sure you are not walking barefoot in your yard as hookworms are zoonotic and can cause cutaneous larva migrans.

[pitlove]

I actually have that same issue of Today’s Breeder next to me on my desk right now! I really enjoyed the article on IVDD and am very thankful personally for the research U.C Davis does.

I’d be curious as to if the people who get up in arms about Purina donating money to fund research that otherwise might not get done, would get that mad if it was oh idk, Champion Pet Foods?

[pitlove]

Lauren-

You are very welcome. Right now I feed Victor dry food. A lot of people seem to be using that food lately, even people that feed raw and kibble together. Might be a good option for you. A girl I follow on Insta gram who shows her pit bull uses the teal bag of Victor and mixes raw meat from the grocery with it. I would however stay away from the grain free line until the FDA can figure out what is going on with the DCM issue and grain free foods.

[pitlove]

Lauren-

The girl that runs The Raw Feeding Community has stated that research has shown that feeding raw and kibble together is not a problem.

[pitlove]

I definitely agree with Acroyali. Quality of the meat is going to matter a lot if you plan to continue to feed raw. I think that is part of what your vet was concerned about.

If you were to do a commercially prepared raw brand, I’d go with Nature’s Variety personally. Or if you want to use a food service like We Feed Raw to continue feeding PMR that would be a good idea as well.

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