[haleycookie]

Rotate. As long as you are keeping your dog physically fit you shouldn’t have any issues with feeding only red meats. Dogs are a type of carnivore so they are more capable of eating high fat high protein diets then humans are.

[haleycookie]

Lowing protein and raising carbs is going to result in a fat old dog.

The gassy dog is likely sensitive to something in the wellness. I would try to transition to another quality food and see if getting away from the chicken in wellness may help the gassy dog.

Edit: or if you’re happy with wellness with the older dog just feed gassy dog a different LID food.

• This reply was modified 4 years, 12 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

I would get with a vet nutritionist on this. They can help you formulate a proper balanced diet. Currently your dog is only getting half the nutrients it needs. Plain ground chicken isn’t balanced and shouldnt take up more than 10% of the daily diet. The raw you feed should also contain bone organs liver etc not just raw chicken.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 1 month ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

Hund and flocken is a grain in food. Did your vet explain how more grains would help her anal gland issues? I’ve never heard of such a thing. Sometimes dogs just need help expressing their glans. A groomer or a vet can do this.

My friend has a shepherd whom has the same issue. She’s been giving her dog a table spoon of pumpkin at each mean for a few months now and she says the dogs anal gland issues have all but dissipated. So maybe try upping her fiber intake with some plain canned pumpkin.

[haleycookie]

How about doing research of your own? Find a low carb food and feed that. You’re dog will be more satiated and loose weight while keeping muscle. Vets usually don’t know much about nutrition unfortunately. The big three are all filled with carbs which will lead to weight gain in most dogs if not careful. As far as allergies go. My lab has seasonal allergies outside so I have to wipe his paws off and his lower belly if he walks in grass while outside. That helps a little but some of those allergies aren’t possible to completely get rid of.

[haleycookie]

The only case where a dog should be permanently on a soy based food is if they have EXTREME allergies to every other protein. Which is incredibly rare and will probably be a life long struggle for u and him if that is the case. Diets like the one he’s on are usually given for elimination diets to narrow down ingredients the dog is sensitive to. I’ve have seen ppl who feed chicken based diets and the dogs are horribly allergic to chicken but when switched to a fresh or raw food diet they don’t have the reaction anymore. If you’re interested in adopting the dog I would see if the rescue (or your vet) can refer u to a vet nutritionalist whom can make u up a proper balanced diet using fresh foods that wouldn’t flare up his allergies.

[haleycookie]

As far as wet chicken free chunky foods go some to try would be taste of the wild canned, merrick regualr line has several chicken free, weruva has a few. Steak frites is a chunky shredded whole food canned food they make that’s beef based. Wellness core has the hearty cuts in a couple different flavors, merrick backountry has some chunky formulas without chicken too. Wholehearted also has some chunky chicken free foods as well.

[haleycookie]

The fda actually recommends staying on whatever food you feed as there is little to no real research done yet. It’s been over a year and still crickets on what is actually the cause. It’s also only been reported in a few hundred dogs. Hundred. Not thousand, million, etc. now let’s compare that to the rate of cancer and diabetes in dogs and ask why those diseases aren’t being looked into a little more.

I’ll be sticking with low carb high meat foods. Which usually are grain free.

[haleycookie]

I would say the mass majority of dog foods don’t contain pumpkin. What have you tried?

[haleycookie]

I’d say it’s a lower quality food. Dogs should be on a meat based food. Preferably raw or freeze dried or a cooked refrigerated food. Or canned/kibble if the fresher foods aren’t an option for u. I’m not sure what foods are available to you, but the kibble you choose to feed should have meat as the first 2-3 ingredients at the very least. No corn, no vegetable protein, no rice etc. if they (or any vegetable matter)are on the list they need to be fairly low and after all the meat meals.

[haleycookie]

I break out in hives over stress sometimes haha. It could really be anything. As I’ve gotten older the last few years I’ve even developed allergies to things I’ve been exposed to all my life. If they come back then you’ll know it’s something he’s still being exposed to and you can figure what to do then. But hopefully it’ll just be a one time reaction.

[haleycookie]

KD is almost nothing but carbs with a tad bit of fat and even a smaller amount of protein. I would honestly switch to a canned or raw/cooked diet. You’ll want low phos which is what KD does in the cheapest (but most expensive price tag) way. I would ask the vet to be sent to a vet nutritionalist to see if they can help u formulate a high protein low fat low carb diet for your dogs using fresh ingredients. You’ll see the fat melt off your male and his allergies will likely improve as well.

[haleycookie]

Probably cut out bully sticks and try to find less fatty cuts of meat. That’s what I’d do. No beef. Keep to fish and chicken

[haleycookie]

Every dog food has horror stories. Heck most have recalls at this point. The most important thing to me is rotational feeding meat based foods along with adding in as much fresh foods as possible. Frozen raw, freeze dried raw, bone broths, canned food are all less processed than kibble. Some good kibbles as a base I like to use are Nature’s variety raw boost, orijen, and canidae ancestral.

[haleycookie]

You will never find a low carb grain inclusive food sorry to say. See if you can be referred out to a vet nutritionalist to help formulate a low carb low fat homemade either raw or cooked diet. Kibbles HAVE to have a lot of carb to hold them together. Even the highest meat content in a kibble will still have ~30% carb. Might look into canned food options as well but again they will not be grain inclusive if they are low sugar carb fat etc. the closest I can think of are weruva and tiki dog. Usually dog foods that are in shreds of clearly chicken meat are going to be the lowest carb and lowest fat because they are basically just shredded muscle meat.

[haleycookie]

Dogs are actually mesocarnivores. And should be on a diet with <~30 carb. Which youll never find in a grain in food. In fact I’d say 90% of grain free kibbles aren’t even formulated that way. That’s why it’s important to find a meat based kibble as just a base. Add in less processed foods like canned, freeze dried raw, bone broths, and frozen raw etc for a better more varied diet. Raw and home cooked properly formulated would be best. Especially for a dog with allergies where u want to control the foods they ingest as most of not all dog kibbles are exposed to cross contamination in factories.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 5 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

Hi, I went digging for you and it appears I am able to order most things on their site. There are just a couple bag sizes out of stock.
I see you might mean the treats. Which are all out of stock. Maybe they are discontinuing production? Just keep calling or email if they have a customer service email

• This reply was modified 5 years, 5 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

There has been no proof found of dcm being caused my grain free diets. The fda has instructed to not switch foods as there is not a reason to at the moment. There are very few cases and a lot of them include grain in foods. I would focus on feeding a meat based kibble (meat as first three ingredients minimum) as the base and adding in fresh meats, canned foods, and raw/freeze dried raw into your dogs diet to make it as protein and taurine rich and fresh as possible.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 6 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

An echo and blood testing is THE ONLY WAY to check the inside of your dog and their heart. It’s also much more helpful to know if a food with potato is indeed having a negative effect on your dog or not. Much more helpful than just willy nilly changing foods.

[haleycookie]

I wouldn’t worry at the moment. It’s a small handful of dogs affected and there is still so little understood about what is happening to these few dogs.
If you are seriously concerned schedule and echo of your dogs heart and send findings to the fda so they have more info to go on. The fda is suggesting to not switch foods as it is of little concern right now. Some of the foods these affected dogs were eating included purina, hills, and other big brands with grains as well.
https://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/truth-grain-free-dog-foods-dcm/
This article gives a non bias view of the issue at hand.
Bottom line, don’t switch. Have an echo done if you’re seriously concerned. Report findings and go from there

[haleycookie]

So your dog is about 31 lbs at 5 months. First do you know if she’ll be over 50 lbs at full size? Is you think she will be I would switch to the large breed puppy food. If you think she’ll stay under 50 lbs follow the medium sized puppy guide on orijens bag. So for a 33 lbs dog it says 2 and 1/3 cup of food a day. Feeding guidelines will normally give u per day feedings not per meal. Some ppl only feed one meal a day so that wouldn’t help some ppl. So 2 and 1/3 cup is 266 g of food a day.
As for adult, let’s say he taps out at 20 kg or 44 lbs. for the original orijen you would feed him between 1 and 1/2 to 2 and 1/4 cups depending on his activity levels. Or somewhere between 171 g and 257g.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 7 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

I am not sure about the Oz conversion. I use calories and I actually used weruva chicken as an example for myself with adding up your dogs calories and what he’d need to eat last night haha. So yes the 14 Oz can of chicken weruva is a little over 200 cals. So you would give himone and a bit of another can of that a day. The 5.5 Oz cans contain 104 cals per can so you would feed three and a half to four of those a day to him.
so I guess around 20oz would be sorta right. Canned food is mostly water that’s why you have to feed so much. Maybe look at a pate food, they tend to be higher calorie per can than shredded foods like most of weruvas.
Canned food is a great way to loose weight. Kibble is typically nothing but carbs and will not help with keeping weight off dogs most of the time. Canned is also lesss processed than kibble so it’s all around more healthy in general.

[haleycookie]

I wouldn’t do it by ounce. Count his calories. A normal dog should have 25-30 cals per lbs. every food has a different calorie content and canned foods tend to be a lot lower cal than kibble because they contain so much water.
What cans are u finding that are 14oz? ?
Anyway look at the cans cal content and do the math that way. So since your dog is a little chubby maybe set him at 20 cals per pound at first. So just 400 cals a day and then go from there

[haleycookie]

I don’t understand how the vet industry is the single type of business where the company of the carried item gets free shelf space. Very odd. Not to mention most vets that are large enough likely buy whole sale in large quantities and receive it discounted that way and then resell them for higher margins(for example chewy offers scripts for a cheaper price than going into a clinic and buying). They are 100% receiving a profit in one way or another. They COULD offer things like blue prescription food or other vet approved and formula foods (that are more healthy options but they choose to only provide over priced “science” based foods that are just a bandaid for the real issue and filled with extremely cheap ingredients) Most prescription foods cost as much as a vet formulated fresh food diet would cost to make. But most ppl aren’t recommended that. They are pretty much scared into buying from the big three, so the vet can make profit of course. What would be the point of carrying them?

[haleycookie]

It’s nothing but grains and veggies. Dogs are mesocarnivores. Try to find a meat based food and add canned or fresh foods into his diet.

[haleycookie]

Yes vets 100% do receive kickbacks. At least the vet near me does. Free sd to feed their kenneled dogs, free sd to feed their own dogs (I actually discussed this with a vet tech that worked there whom said their shipment of sd was let so she was having to buy her own dogs food this week) and just like with any business who sells a product in a location other than their own the vets do get paid for having it in their offices. Why wouldn’t they? Is their shelf space free? Doubt it.

[haleycookie]

Alice, do you honestly believe a brand of food that has whole fresh caught ingredients from small family farms and local rivers and oceans would be the cause of your dogs cancer? Cancer is caused my a massive variety of things. Purina and the rest of the big three have been tested and have all contain carcinogens over the years. Including glyphosate which is now being linked to cancer. I highly doubt the food u fed was the main cause of your dogs cancer. The truth is you’ll probably never know what caused it but it likely wasn’t food related.

[haleycookie]

Royal Canin is expensive corn cereal for dogs. I would at least look into meat based brands like nature’s variety instinct, and merrick back country. Or even a refrigerated food like fresh pet. Despite what anon says I know for a fact what nutrition is taught at the vet school in my state. And it is an option elective class that covers most small animal pets. And the text books are written by vets in association with the big 3 which use biased budget based “science”. Dogs are mesocarnivores regardless of size or breed and a corn based diet is not ideal.

[haleycookie]

Ideally a raw fed dog will poop maybe once a day and it will be very small. I follow a working raw fed gsd on insta and he poops once a day and it’s about the size of a baseball maybe smaller. As opposed to kibble fed dogs who poop bulky poops twice sometimes three times or more a day. “Normal” poop for a dog should be small, dark in color, and segmented. The dog should have no issues passing it. If they are constipated and straining then bone content could be too high which in a raw diet could be corrected by adding more organ meat. Just as soft poos can be combated with more bone.
Bone is natural for a dog to eat. Obviously don’t feed weight bearing bones as they can crack teeth or split or shatter and cause obstructions. Bone ground up or whole bones like necks, backs, or non weight bearing bones are ideal.

[haleycookie]

It’s unlikely your pup will be large breed. Try to stick with meat based foods, some of my favorites are, merrick back country, canidae ancestral, orijen, instinct raw boost, and essence dog food. All of these foods are going to be made up of mostly meat. They all (to my knowledge) employ vet nutritionalist to formulate their foods as well.
I’d also recommend adding canned foods, dehydrated raw, frozen raw, and other topper type foods.
Fresh pet is actually pretty good quality. It is much more fresh and meat based than kibbled foods. Kibble should ideally be a base and other types of less processed foods should make up the rest.
Nature’s variety makes quality canned foods, frozen raw, and freeze dried toppers in a multitude of flavors, I would check those out, merrick has a wide variety of canned options for picky dogs. Tiki dog food also have very popular canned foods for picky dogs. Also the brand weruva has great canned foods too. You can add bone broths as well. Solid gold has a variety of those as well as other brands, you can also just boiling chicken (or bones) and use the broth off that. Cooked egg, plain kefir, and raw goats milk are nutritionally dense as well.
Consider rotational feeding, this helps prevent allergies, pickiness in dogs, and it also helps in case the food u feed is recalled or discontinued. Rotational feeding just helps expand their diet and if u ever have to change for an emergency you will be prepared to do so. If u do decide to try rotational feeding try to start slow. Get the pup on one food for awhile then slowly switch over the course of a couple weeks. Eventually u will have no issues switching with no transitional period at all.

[haleycookie]

The fda article states there is no need to change food as there is nothing to be concerned since it’s such a small issue that Is clearly multifaceted and goes beyond diet.
All of merrick foods are pretty quality. For a grain in its pretty good that’s why it’s still 5 stars.

[haleycookie]

What do you think corn gluten and wheat gluten are? They’re cheap protein upping ingredients the big companies use. Use meat based foods with the carb ingredient 3 or more ingredients down. Those are the companies that are spending buckets on quality meat sources in their foods. Purina is crap, blue is crap, Royal Canin are all cheaply made crap for insane prices. I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again. Dogs DO NOT need carbs. of any kind. Most dog food brands that have a kibble formula make their foods to be 40-50-60%+ carbs, you know why? Because they’re cheap. And dog owners are busy and want the cheapest food they can find so they can pour it in their dogs bowls and leave. If the big three actually used real non bias science they would recommend making a fresh lean meat diet low in carbs for your dogs NOT kibble. Kibble is over processed crap no matter what kind of “science” is behind it. There is no other argument against it and for some reason people have been so blindly guided by these companies that claim “science” it’s almost sickening to me. Feed your dog meat, not corn, not wheat, not peas, not potatoes, seems like a pretty easy answer to me.
The dcm “scare” has less and less meaning to me everyday as I read more and more people misinterpreting the fdas warning, and people who are buying into the big threes bias science so blindly. Its really a shame people don’t ask more questions before jumping to conclusions.

[haleycookie]

They say heart disease and red meat consumption is correlated. And lung cancer, heart disease, emphysema are caused by smoking. And yet ppl still over eat red meat and smoke everyday. It literally says on the fda article don’t switch foods. Cus there’s no reason to. Not sure how much clearer it can get.
Btw the fda allows bugs, rodents, and certain known cancer causing preservatives to be put in human foods. Not sure what to make of that. 🤔

• This reply was modified 5 years, 10 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

Get a flea comb from a pet store. Run it through the fur on his belly, base of his tail, and under the neck and face area. Fleas love all those areas. The comb will pull any adults out and that’ll tell u if she has fleas or not.

[haleycookie]

Insta*
That’s the stars idk why they’re blurred out.

[haleycookie]

Check out flynnaceky on Instagram. She is a vet tech who feeds her shepherds balanced homemade raw. She raised both of them from small pups on it. She also has a raw feeding page flynnandace.eats on Instagram. She isn’t great at responding sometimes but maybe she’ll respond if u comment or dm her.

[haleycookie]

@connie. I wouldn’t put him on a dry diet at all. For crystal you want to keep the dog as hydrated and his bladder flushed out as possible. That’s the key as well as making the diet less acidic. Maybe get with your vet and ask about a wet option or an over the counter recommendation. If he refuses or can’t give u further info find a vet nutritionalist for other high moisture diet options.
Ideally the Royal Canin will desolve the crystals within a couple of weeks and then a hydrating diet should follow after. Make sure your dogs bladder is staying flushed and he is urinating as often as possible. Every 2-4 hours.

[haleycookie]

Acana and orijen both break down amounts of meat vs protein. So does natures variety instinct. Says right on the back what’s from veggies and what’s from meat. You can also get the carb vs carb %s with just the info on the nutritional analysis.

[haleycookie]

@patricia. Some foods like dr elseys cat food and essence pet foods use things like agar agar or gelatin to bind the foods. Making it an optimal low low car dry food. However it’s incredibly expensive as well

However this particular food is loading up on carbs grains to hold the food together. It’s just a run of the mill lower quality grain food.

[haleycookie]

@joanne l orijen is a meat based food. Far more meat than anything Hill’s, purina, or rc will ever offer. They are some of the lowest carb dog foods around. So not sure where you all are getting your into it’s mostly peas. Acana is more but still under 40% of the food is vegetables and fruit.
They’ve been doing feed trials the past year on labs and beagles and have found no instances of heart problems so far. Not to mention most of those on this forum were incorrect on them not working with vets to formulate their foods. They seem to actually fit most of wsava guidelines, which I find comical.
If anyone would actually read the FDA’s article they’ll notice how they recommend to not change foods yet as this is still not a common issue at all. Not only that, the testing they’ve done on the foods have shown nothing conclusive and all foods are showing up balanced and appropriate. I suppose after they start testing the dogs and how the different breeds synthesize taurine in foods with peas we’ll know more, but is suspect it will be a genetic breed issue more than anything else. But til then it’s not a wide spread issue that I’m concerned about. Nor should anyone else be, this mass hysteria going on in this forum is almost comical. To think feeding a carnivore a mostly carb diet is healthy. hahahah. Whatever floats ur boat. I’m done arguing about it. I’ll just be reminding folk whom are concerned that it is a very small unproven issue at this moment and to not feed into the hysteria some of you push so hard.

[haleycookie]

Just as you have your opinion I have mine. Purina, Hill’s, and Royal Canin are all over priced garbage. Have been for a long long time. Champion has nutritionalist (and has for awhile it seems unlike what a lot of you all thought) formulating their foods. They’ve ran trials before and after dcm issues occurred and have found no correlation to dcm and their foods. Kinda like how purina Hill’s and Royal Canin find that their foods are great and healthy ;). To each their own. Dogs aren’t meant to be carb loaded. But oh well. As I’ve said before money talks for the big three and will continue to do so while people remain convinced they’re the best for some odd reason.

[haleycookie]

https://www.championpetfoods.com/faqs/dcmfaqs/
Champion has this nifty non biased explanation on their stance on dcm. Not only have they apparently been doing feed trails before they’ve actually done two lengthy ones recently on two “prone” breeds of dogs and found nothing to be worried about while they were eating champion foods. They also mentioned that they do work with vet nutritionalists and have done extensive studies on amino acid profiles, etc. the fda still has no clear answer as to what’s causing it. This article also breaks down how few dogs are actually affected by this. Less than .1% of all dogs in the US are suspected to have diet related dcm. And even then none of those are actually proven. It’s all still speculation and beagles and labs fed champion foods long term showed no symptoms of any kind. I find it all interesting tbh.

Edit: read some more I guess purina, Royal Canin, and Hill’s all are now on the list of cases reported and what their dogs were eating. More grain in foods are included as well.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 10 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

The fda has suggested to not change diet as little is still understood about what is causing dcm. I would feed what ever they like and has been working for them. If you are concerned you can have an echo done as well as taurine testing. That’s the best way to go in my opinion.

[haleycookie]

What is she doing???

[haleycookie]

The protein is hard on their kidneys is a myth. Unless they have kidney problems already due to some other type of disease high protein will not hurt their kidneys. Dogs are carnivore’s that don’t require carbs in their diet. So their diet could be mostly protein and fat.
Why are u looking to go grain? Carb loading your dogs isn’t healthy for them. Most kibble is mostly carb though. Some lower carb foods include merrick backcountry, natures variety instinct, essence dog food, and canidae pure ancestral. All are American made and sourced to my knowledge. You could def email the companies and see though. Add toppers, raw boost bits, wet food, bone broths. All for hose things will ad variety into the diet and introduce less processed foods into their diet. If you’re worried about dcm just know taurine is not found in carbs, grains, or highly processed meats. It’s found solely in fresh meat and organs. So that is the route to go if you want a healthy heart.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

I’ve seen this before. Looks decent but you could prob spend less and do a homemade raw diet yourself a lot more easily. But if u feel like forking out insane amounts of money for someone else to do it for u go for it.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by haleycookie.

[haleycookie]

Just an FYI, no over the counter food has enough glucosamine in it to make any difference. It’s just a marketing thing but when u break down the amounts per serving size they usually contain almost no glucosamine and chondroitin. I would recommend cosaquin for those issues. Or if it is severe a prescription supplement from the vet. Beyer also has a new joint line that are prescription strength that u can get over the counter.
I would look at canidae senior formulas. They have two varieties that are excellent. They also have a vet on staff formulating their foods.
Fromm is good as well, just keep in mind “Senior” is just a nice way of saying less meat, more carbs. Which for a dog that is getting older and having muscle wasting is not ideal. So I would recommend maybe finding a high meat all life stage food. Or look at natures variety raw boost senior. Merrick also has a great senior meat based formula.
Higher meat foods will require less feedings so will be similar amount of money spent at the end of the day.

[haleycookie]

You can put it in a bag and beat it. Or a food processor or blender would be easier.

[haleycookie]

Just wanted to mention that both Hill’s and purina are coming out with quiet a bit of grain free foods. Another reason to completely take away their credibility on the issue. The hills foods is almost nothing but peas and potatoes. Wonder how much “science” went behind that. Same with the proplan varieties. Mostly made up of pea and potatoe.

Thought I would post this here as well. These companies clearly aren’t too concerned about dcm.

[haleycookie]

Just wanted to mention that both Hill’s and purina are coming out with quiet a bit of grain free foods. Another reason to completely take away their credibility on the issue. The hills foods is almost nothing but peas and potatoes. Wonder how much “science” went behind that. Same with the proplan varieties. Mostly made up of pea and potatoe.

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