[Susan]

Hi Nicole,
maybe start with Freeze Dried Raw & see how he goes, but make sure its a limited ingredient freeze dried or Air Dried diet there’s “Ziwi Peak” look at the Venison or Rabbit formula, https://www.ziwipets.com/ the Ziwi Peak wet raw can food is really good but it’s expensive but its balanced & all ready to go, email Ziwi Peak & ask for samples..
at first slowly introduce the freeze dried or Air Dried with his kibble he’s doing OK on, add new freeze dried slowley over 2 week period & see how he goes, or I went thru a Animal Nutritionist with my boy who has IBD, you can still feed the kibble he’s eating now, just feed the kibble for breakfast then feed the raw meal for Dinner or the other way around but when I first started Patch on a raw diet he was hungry cause he was use to eating a dry kibble that was high in carbs that kept him feeling full longer, I had to feed him a small snack at lunch time to get him thru to Dinner…

Go on facebook & search for “The Australian Raw Feding Community” facebook group, or buy “Lew Olson” book her f/b group is called “K-9 Nutrition” or Dr Karen Becker has a book, both books are very easy to follow, I just went to the library & borrowed the books to make sure they were OK before I bought them…Dr Karen Becker is bringing out her latest new book it should be out by now, go on her f/b page “Karen Becker” & ask her is her lastest raw feeding book out yet?
or you can start feeding the Pre-Made raw but I was advise NOT to feed Patch any Pre-made raw dog diets you buy from pet shops, home made raw is more fresh & you know what your adding into your boy raw diet..
I had to start Patch on 1 meat protein-Kangaroo mince feed at breakfast with blended veggie/fruit mix & Chicken Breast cut up for dinner with blended green veggetables, broccolli, celery, parsley & 1 fruit-apple peeled. remove all seeds, cut up then put in a blender add 1-2 spoons of the veggies /fruit mix to 1 cup of meat, then I froze the remaining fruit & veggie mix in ice cube trays covered in cling wrap then you take out 1 cube = 1 spoon when you need it & I also added the Digestavite Plus powder to balance the diet cause Patches diet had no bone or organ meats yet cause of Patches IBD, we started him on an elimination raw diet in the beginning, this is why it might be best to see a Holistic vet or Animal Nutritionist to formulate a raw diet for a growing puppy who has IBS…
Here’s the Nutritionist I went thru she does Skpe, emails or rings you, here’s her “Maintenance raw diet” she gave me for Patch & I had to pick 2 meats, 2-3 vegatbles & 1-2 fruits to begin with, but we would email back & forth… http://www.naturalanimalsolutions.com.au/education.php

[Tyrionthebiscuit]

Anon, you have already posted your displeasure for raw feeding on this thread. The original poster expressed that they were not interested in your post and you weren’t giving relevant information. Please don’t push buttons that you know will lead to an argument.

[anonymous]

Excerpt from an article written by a veterinarian that specializes in nutrition. She is affiliated with one of the best veterinary medical centers in the country.
Hope it helps someone, if not the OP, maybe someone else reading this.

https://www.mspca.org/angell_services/choosing-the-right-diet-for-your-pet/

Raw diets are another popular option on the market today. Studies have shown that 20-35% of raw poultry and 80% of raw food dog diets tested contained Salmonella. This poses a health risk for your pet, but also for humans. This is especially true for children or immunocompromised adults, whether exposed to the raw food directly, or the feces of the pet eating the raw food. Additionally, there is increased risk of other bacterial infections and parasitic diseases when feeding raw diets. And the bottom line is there is no reason to believe raw food is healthier than cooked food.
The numerous dietary choices for your pet can be daunting but if you pick an AAFCO approved food made by a manufacturer with a long track record, odds are good that you will find a suitable food for your pet. Most of the large pet food companies employ full time veterinary nutritionists and have very high quality control standards. That is not to say that a small company cannot produce nutritious and high quality food, but you should check out their website if it’s a company that is not familiar to you. Take the time to research, and ask your veterinarian if you have specific questions or concerns.
Please understand that this article is meant to provide basic dietary guidelines for healthy pets. If your pet has specific health issues, then your veterinarian may make specific food recommendations, which may include special prescription diets.

[Susan]

Hi Tiffany,
I think you’re doing a pretty good job, you’ve had a little set back with Aria, if Aria didn’t catch the rabbit Aria would probably be doing really well now, just start all over again..
You may of panic a little bit but after reading all the bad stuff on the net who wouldn’t panic, I would of paniced aswell actually years ago when Patch was pooing blood diarrhea I paniced & rushed him & took some of his bloody poo to the vets & waited out the front till they opened up at 8am, the vet nurses & vet were so calm & I was a mess, stressing out, I had no sleep, I’ve never owned a dog that pooed just blood all night…. he blood wasn’t from a raw diet, afterward I went thru a animal Nutritionist to put him on a raw diet.
But you learn from these things & if there’s a next time you’ll do things different….
Patch has IBD his vet gives me repeat scripts of “Metronidazole” that I keep in the cupboard & when something happens like Aria vomiting undigested smelly brown vomit or blood vomit or bloody poos & I see Patch isnt getting better after 2 days then I start him on the Metronidazole for 7-14 days..
When Aria spewed the brown stuff it would have been digested food in its liquid form, then she couldn’t poo cause she probably didnt have nothing much to poo out after being fasted for 24 hrs then she spewed a meal, her bowel would have been emtpy & she was unwell with Gastritis she probably felt like she had to poo but didnt have to poo..
What did she eat the day she spewed the digested food??
Just keep an eye on Aria being a GSD she may have a sensitive stomach/bowel then her brother Ronan has….She might be more sensitive to certain ingredients?
I just re read your post maybe don’t feed Aria any beef if she gets bad gas after eating beef. also beef livers are more rich, I’d start a Elimination diet with Aria, I’d feed Ronan the same raw diet as you were feeding before the Rabbit incident & with Aria I’d start feeing just 1 meat probably Chicken, Turkey & Duck & feed from the same animal so the same organ meat & same muscle meat, so feed from the same chicken or Turkey or Duck if you can, you’ll have to buy the whole chicken or whole Turkey try & find a chicken, duck & turkey farms close by, best to feed free range raw, but its more expensive.
also maybe when she spewed she ate too much fat??
My vet tells me, sometimes its good when a dogs spews, its not always a bad Susan lol the Gastro vet said its very easy for a dog to bring things back up, they’re not like us when we vomit, it just stresses me out a bit, I stress when Patch spews, well I dont stress as much now after the Gastro vet has explained it all to me & told me not to worry, its better out then in, also dogs have a short digestive tract & can easily vomit when they have too,
Chicken, turkey & pork these meat are suppose to be easier to digest & the bone is supoose to be softest from the Chicken but the pork has more fat but you can control the fat amount you feed if your making your own raw diet also home made raw is HEAPS better then the Pre made raw you buy already made, when I bought Turkey BARF pre-made for my cat she wouldn’t touch it, then I took the Turkey back & they gave me samples of the Rabbit & Kangaroo Barf & they all smelt the same as the Turkey BARF, you’d think being different meats they would all smell different, well they should of all smelt different, the cat wouldn’t touch any of them, then I went to supermarket & bought fresh human grade chicken & kangaroo mince & it smelt like fresh meat should smell, totally different to the pre-made pet BARF raw formula’s, So your better off making your own raw meals, it probably heaps fresher.. find a butcher that sells cheaper off cuts..

Just make sure when they’re both eating raw meaty bones, you watch them & make sure they’re both crunching & munching their raw meaty bones & if you see a certain cut of meaty bone that they’re not really chewing properly & just swollowing, then don’t use that cut of meaty bone again… Invest in a meat cleaver & a good chopping block & go nuts & start hacking at all the meaty bones lol…
If you join a few facebook groups you might find someone thats selling or giving away their smaller grinder/mincer they might have bought a bigger grinder/mincer?
Dont worry about them eating bones, dogs teeth are made specially for eating raw meaty bones, animals etc, a really good Raw Canine group is called “The Australian raw feeding Community” f/b group…

Canine Dental Anatomy

Incisors — Dog
There are four types of teeth in small animals: incisor, canine, premolar, and molar. Nature designed each to serve a special function. Incisors are named first, second and third; or central, intermediate, and lateral, based on their location in the mouth. There should be six incisors in the maxilla (upper jaw) and six in the mandible (lower jaw). Incisor teeth are used for shearing and grooming.

Normally, the
lower canine
should intersect
the upper lateral
incisor and upper
canine
There are two large canine teeth located in the mandible and two in the maxilla. The canines are designed to grasp and tear with great pressure. Premolar teeth have sharp edges used for shearing. In the dog, there are four premolar teeth on either side of the upper and lower jaws. Dogs have four molars in the upper jaw and six in the lower. Molars have a flat surface used for grinding.
So you dont need a grinder your dogs teeth are one lol

[Barbara L B]

If the veterinarian treating your dog for gastroenteritis and hookworms used a big dose of antibiotic or you are dosing daily antibiotics for a week, I suggest you watch for a bladder infection at the end of the dose of antibiotics. With my dog the symptom of the bladder infection was that pup was suddenly stinky peeing all over the house on the seventh day after antibiotics treating the diagnosis of gastrointestinal infection. He developed bloody diarrhea but had no hook worms–it was caused by stress from travelling for too long and too far. Far be it from me to argue with the vet far from home, but he insisted it was due to my feeding raw food and prescribed a food that is not recommended here at Pet Advisor, as the food he feeds his three dogs. I fed the dog this food until the diarrhea was over and skipped right back to raw Instinct with no problems before then and since then, now, two months later.

• This reply was modified 7 years, 7 months ago by Barbara L B.

[pitlove]

I think there are meat grinders available that are still good quality but not extremely expensive. You could also check Goodwill like Anon said or even Craigslist for people selling used ones for cheap. Also The Raw Feeding Community has a facebook page. People may have suggestions for you on that page for a cheap but good grinder.

As far as cancer goes, I don’t think its as one dimentional of a disease process as some of the holistic minded doctors are making it out to be. I know Rodney Habib and Karen Becker shout loud about how its kibble that is the leading cause of cancer, but they are missing so much of the bigger picture. Cancer is caused from genetics or environment or both. Sometimes it is genetic. That being that case, the dog eating raw isn’t going to prevent the cancer. There are also dogs on raw that will develop cancer. There is also breed disposition. Golden Retrievers are a prime example, but there is a small group of ethical breeders working very hard to breed cancer out of the breed. Our pets are living so much longer now due to vaccines and proper vet care that we are getting to see them live to older ages and see cancer develop. People say our pets werent getting cancer as frequently decades ago. But the quality of care we are providing our pets has grown a lot since then. I think it has more to do with that than kibble.

I don’t personally feed raw to my dogs, but I am not 100% against the idea of it. I understand the concept of feeding fresh foods to pets, just as humans try to eat fresh foods. I don’t however buy into the grain free, high protein etc etc kibble trend.

[Tiffany T]

Just makes me wonder what causes certain dogs to react like that, yet others are super healthy on a raw diet their entire lives. I feel like my Ronan would excel on a completely raw diet (his stomach is a machine), yet I don’t think Aria handles it nearly as well (she’s dainty and sensitive).

I hate that since the scare, they are both so disappointed to see their bowl full of kibble again. I want what’s best for them. I wasn’t doing raw because it’s a “fad” but because the percentage of dogs that develop cancer nowadays is really alarming to me (and a lot of vets link it back to what they eat… kibble). So going raw where I knew exactly what was in their bowls was great, and the dogs loved the variety and taste. I think Taste of the Wild is a great brand of kibble, but again. Boringgg. So I’m just stuck in this rut now.

It also sucks that I saw such a detox from both of them on raw (much less shedding, clean teeth, fresh breath, relaxed after chewing, to name a few). It’s now a journey to find a happy median for us.

[anonymous]

Bowel obstruction, shows up as calcified sludge on the x-ray, on 2 occasions.

Symptoms: constipation, straining, PAIN, in example: panting, crying, unable to relax, agitation. Dog would scream if you touched her abdominal area.
Chalky feces, bloody feces, diarrhea, gastrointestinal upset.
Comes on gradually.

Broken tooth, times 2, not a clean break, required extractions under general anesthesia, both times “Raw Meaty Bones” No thanks!

[anonymous]

“If only I could afford one of those $500 meat & bone grinders… lol”

Check your local Goodwill.

That’s where I sent mine, a fancy deluxe model, I had no use for it after raw food caused my dog expensive veterinary issues. Only used it for less than 6 months.

[Tiffany T]

I’m not insulted, I probably didn’t explain their diets very well in the first place. We do intend to continue feeding turkey necks on the weekends since that was a hit with them, and might make the slow transition back to raw… maybe Aria’s the type of dog who takes a year to transition. If she seriously does have ill affects against beef though, not sure what we will do (I can’t afford raw lamb every day – too expensive). I found a great local butcher that sells 5lb bags of fresh ground raw dog food for $11.99, so we might check that out. If only I could afford one of those $500 meat & bone grinders… lol

Anon, my vet advised that Aria just rest for a couple of days when she was sick and prescribed antibiotics for the upset that she thinks was caused by the wild rabbit. Aria is the only one who got sick – Ronan did not. My veterinarian did not have any ill words against feeding raw. My vet is a very well-educated lady who has always treated us and our dogs with respect. She did not tell us to change their diet.

No offense… but why are you advising people what they should do on a online forum if you don’t believe people should listen to the advice we get here? I’m not looking for anti-raw zealot answers.

[Tiffany T]

I understand the muscle meat/organ thing.

Our variety looked a bit like this:
Organs: Chicken livers, chicken kidneys, beef liver, and calf liver
Muscle meat: Beef heart, beef chunks, ground beef, pork loin, ground pork, ground turkey
RMB’s: Turkey necks, pork necks, de-skinned chicken thighs, and turkey thighs
Fish: Whole scad mackerel, fed once or twice a week
Eggs: Raw + shell
Additions: Snap peas, carrots, goat’s milk yogurt, raspberries, strawberries, blueberries, pureed pumpkin, pinch of turmeric

In the AM we did 1oz of organs and 7oz. of muscle meat, plus some additions. Typically no RMB in the AM.
In the PM I would throw them a RMB to gnaw on in the backyard, plus some additions (but sometimes no additions in the PM, depending on the size of the RMB)

We did whole scad Mackerel (about 5oz.) once or twice a week, accompanied by some muscle meat. Raw eggs with shell maybe 2-3 times a week.

[pitlove]

You would have to give me more detail on your meal prep for me to really be able to see what you were doing. From your statement above your dogs were getting organ meat and RMBs but fish only once a week. Muscle meat should be the 80%. Also certain organs are fed as muscle meat in the Prey Model diet. So you have to take that into consideration too.

I don’t really like premade raw like Primal, Stella and Chewy’s etc but there is a service called https://www.wefeedraw.com/ that has prepared Prey Model Raw. It is not going to be as cheap as most dry food though. You have larger dogs too which always makes everything more expensive.

[Tiffany T]

Thank you for responding.

In my opinion, I was following the 80/10/10 model. I had the kitchen scale out every day making sure if it. The veggies and fruits were a very small addition to their 9oz meals.

At this point we are back on Taste if the Wild. I had some raw beef leftover and gave them both a small hunk of it the other day, and then Aria had extremely bad gas the rest of the night. So I’m now also wondering if she can’t handle beef very well? Could that be a thing?

I am interested in buying premade raw but everywhere I turn it seems super pricey. We currently pay $60 for a 30lb bag of kibble – is there any premade raw food that can compete with that?

[pitlove]

Hi Nicole-

There are folks out there that do feed their puppies a raw diet, but if you are new to raw feeding I would not venture into that realm until he is an adult. Growth is an unforgiving lifestage and it is not easy to make sure a raw diet is being balanced correctly for puppies.

If you absolutely want to feed raw even when hes an adult following https://therawfeedingcommunity.com/ or http://mojoandfriends.blog/ would be a good place to start. The couple that runs Mojoandfriends blog just bought a Staffy Bull puppy and shes on a Prey Model Raw diet. Perhaps you could contact them and ask for advice.

[Nicole M]

Hello everyone!
I have a 6 month old beagle mix puppy named Finn, and since I’ve gotten him he hasn’t been doing so great on kibble. I’ve had him a few months now and his stool is always pretty soft. At first it was like diarrhea, but since I’ve switched him to a grain free lamb protein LID kibble it’s been a bit better. We’ve ruled out parasites. I’ve been starting to wonder if maybe raw feeding would be a better option for him, but I have absolutely no idea where to start with it.
I guess my main questions are:
What exactly would he need to be fed?
Where have you guys found it easiest to get the food from? (ie. can I get everything from my local Wegman’s or should I look for a smaller butcher?)
and honestly any other tips or recommendations you can give me would be much appreciated!
Thanks so much! 🐶

[Susan]

Hi Charles,

The only way you will know 100% what foods your dog is sensitive too is to do a food elimination diet, you start by feeding 1 novel protein, a protein source he hasn’t eaten before & add 1 carb….this takes a while to do but you get results, I picked ingredients for the elimination diet that were in kibbles he had eaten & ingredients in kibbles I wanted to feed him.
Raw was the easiest way to do the elimination food diet as you dont have to cook & Patch reacted within 20mins of eating raw chicken breast, his back paw went red, swollen & hot, he was licking & licking his back paw, I had to put an ice pack on his back paw, so I knew straight away “NO more chicken”, then I started cooking his elimination diet as I didnt want to give him raw grated potato, raw carrots etc cause he has IBD & I found cooked carrots made his ears itch & he’d shake his head & scratch his ears, if you dont want to cook or feed a raw diet for the elimination diet then ask your vet about Hypoallergenic vet diets, would be your next step, once your dog has been eating the vet diet for 6 weeks & dog is not scratching, no red paws etc then you start adding 1 new ingredient for 6 week peroid or as soon as you see the dog reacting you stop adding the new ingredient, it can take anywhere from 1 day to 6 weeks to see a reaction to an ingredient..

Alot of people will blame an ingredient in a kibble, there’s so many ingredients so they blame the potatoes, peas, chicken etc like I did, then when yrs later I did elimination food diet & I tested cooked potato then 1 month later I added cooked sweet potatoes, my dog he didnt react at all, no itching, no red paws, no gas, no sloppy poos, so for 2 years I had avoid buying any dog foods that had potato in them, also kibbles have too many ingredients in them so its very hard to know 100% what ingredient is causing the skin, ear or paw problems…. also normal pet shop & supermarket dry kibble become cross contaminated while being made or while being cut into the kibble shape from the cutting machine, so you’ll never really work out what ingredient your dog is reacting too in a dry kibble… Vet diets are suppose to not be cross contaminated…..

If you don’t like Hills, Royal Canine or Purina vet diets then there’s “Rayne Canada” vet diets they have Novel proteins Crocodile, Kangaroo & Rabbit formula’s..
It’s sooooo hard to really know 100% what your dois reacting too cause you also have the envrionment allergies aswell that he might be reacting too that day 🙁
But with my Patch he reacts to foods within 20mins of eating them he starts scratching & gets reditchy paws & start to lick them, & his gastro problems can take anywhere from 6-8hours to 1-2 days depends, Lentils he reacted within 6 hours of eating a kibble that had lentils in it…
I found it best to do your elimination food diet in the cooler months when environment allergens aren’t as active…..also as the dog ages their allergies become worse, Patch had the worst Summer last December & this January it was awful his immune system went into over drive & made his IBD flare up, I nilly put him to sleep, I couldn’t handle watching him suffer, he couldn’t swollow his food, everything he ate was coming back up into his mouth, his vet begged me to hang in there & wait 1-2 months for Summer to be over before you put him to sleep, I’m very lucky, well Patch is very lucky to have a really good vet, he wouldnt be here now…. Make sure your dogs diet is high in Omega 3 & give Probiotics daily, one thing about the Vet diets for skin problems they are very high in omega 3, so make sure if you’re not feeding a vet diet & doing an elimination diet or feeding normal dry kibble, start adding fish/salmon or Krill Oil capsules, Krill Oil capsules are suppose to not cause stomach problems & are better for dogs who suffer with Stomach problems…
Good-Luck
Here’s the Rayne Canada site.. http://www.raynecanada.ca/canine-diets/

[pitlove]

Hi Tiffany-

Couple things. The diet that you mentioned was not in fact properly balanced. It sounds like you were trying to do a Prey Model Raw diet, but not following the 80/10/10 rule consistantly everyday. If you want to see how to properly feed a Prey Model Raw diet follow “The Raw Feeding Community” and I also like http://mojoandfriends.blog/.

Onto the sickness issue. My guess would be this is directly related to the wild rabbit they were allowed to eat. As Tyrion said above, wild rabbits/animals can carry a wide variety of parasites, hookworms included. Hookworms can and will cause GI issues like what you experienced. DO NOT allow the dogs to catch and eat wild prey again. This is asking for trouble. If you need to, I would even recommend purchasing your raw meals from a service like wefeedraw.com.

[pitlove]

Hi Chris-

A raw diet is actually one of the most innappropriate diets for a growing large breed puppy. Calcium and phosphorus ratios are difficult to balance in a homemade raw diet which can most certainly lead to developmental orthopedic disorders. If you intend on feeding a raw diet to a large breed puppy it would be best to wait until he/she is fully grown or if you have a breeder that feeds raw and can prove that they have successfully transitioned their pups onto a raw food diet and had them grow optimally with no developmental issues, get that exact recipe from them and follow it to a T. Otherwise, it’s best to use a commercial dry food from a larger company that staffs nutritionists who formulate foods specifically for large breed puppies.

[Chris F]

Ah, this is great topic of conversation and quite a good bit of debate surrounding the issue.

The various studies that have been done imply that nutrition is an important aspect to a growing large breed puppy and can have signifcant impact the quality of his health later on.

The evidence (http://ivcjournal.com/feeding-large-breed-puppies/) suggests that we should not restrict protein from their diet since this play a huge role in lowering the risk of developing joint and arthritis including hip dysplasia later on in their life.

The second suggestion (http://ipupster.com/best-puppy-food-reviews/) as also purported by DFA is that excess calcium can now be linked to skeletal disease.

So the key-takeaway is to find commercial dog foods that are low in calories, are low in fats and have limited calcium.

With that mind, I think the best way to control these is to choose a raw food diet for our large breed puppies.

Dr. Becker at Mercola Pets has a great and detailed video (https://youtu.be/u9gbxLiKaJU) I also found helpful. A tad long but well worth the watch!

[Tyrionthebiscuit]

It sounds like it was caused from the rabbit. Wild rabbits in certain areas are known for worm issues. Ive never allowed my raw fed guys to catch rabbits for this issue. Sometimes it happens too quickly to notice

[anonymous]

Consider what happened a wake-up call. You were lucky that the situation was not worse.

http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=raw

I feed a quality kibble as the base, about 2/3rds of the diet, I add a little chopped boiled chicken, plain chicken broth or water, sometimes scrambled egg or a little tuna or something.

My chicken broth recipe /forums/topic/grain-free-2/#post-109751

[Tiffany T]

I have a 55lb. amstaff/cattle dog male (Ronan), and a 47lb. GSD mix girl (Aria).

Over the past two months we had been making the switch from Taste of the Wild kibble to a completely raw diet. It started out as a meal here and there, then for several weeks they had kibble for breakfast and raw for dinner. They seemed to be doing great, and I love how much they acted like they loved their food, and how long it took them to eat it (especially their favorite RMB, turkey necks!).

Since it had been two months, I figured it was time to see if they were ready to have a full week of raw. I was doing great at balancing their food I thought (had been doing research through the roof). They were having 1oz. of liver every day, fish once a week, 1 RMB a day (chicken thighs, turkey necks, pork necks, and the like), and other things like goat milk, carrots, snap peas, raspberries, blueberries, pumpkin, etc.

Well, that Monday they caught themselves a rabbit out in the backyard. And I foolishly let them eat it, not thinking about parasites, disease, etc… they ate the WHOLE thing. Aria got all the guts (including the intestines) and Ronan ate the top half. Later that day, Aria threw up EVERYWHERE. Probably the entirety of the rabbit she had eaten. So I fasted both of them for 24hrs.

4 days pass, and suddenly Aria gets ill. She threw up a very foul-smelling brown sludge all over my kitchen and dining room. I didn’t know what to feed them since she was sick, so I backed up and give them both kibble. And while were were outside that morning, she was unable to poop (straining, but nothing coming out). Immediately I was thrown into a panic thinking she had an intestinal blockage from the pork necks I had given them the day before. We rushed to the vet who did x-rays, but they came back fine, other than she had an abundance of gas (but she’s always been a gassy dog).

So we went back home with instructions to just take it easy. We went outside and she was able to poop a very small amount, but it was also a brown sludge of diarrhea with some blood in it. And then a couple hours later, she threw up her kibble breakfast. So we went back to the vet for another x-ray and the stool sample.

Our diagnoses that day was gastroenteritis and hookworms. We were given antibiotics, and here we are 4 days later, and I finally have my normal Aria back.

I am just shook by this entire experience, because I don’t know what caused her to become ill. Was is the rabbit she had eaten 4 days before her sick episode? Did I get her something that completely threw her off? I had given her anything she hadn’t eaten before…

It is unfortunate to say that we are now back on kibble with the occasional supplement of goat milk yogurt, cooked chicken, and rice. I do not know where to go from here, because I don’t want to pay another $300 vet bill if she gets sick again. Perhaps I am too close to the situation. I just have no idea what I should be feeding them at this point, and even though she did not have an intestinal blockage, I scared myself so badly with the thought that day that I am now worried about it.

If you’ve read this far, thank you… sorry to be so long winded. Any advice is appreciated.

TLDR: Dogs were making a transition to raw. They caught and ate their own wild rabbit. Aria got extremely ill 4 days later, vet diagnoses was gastroenteritis and hookworms. I am now scared to feed raw because of my fear that it may not have been the rabbit that made her ill but I have no idea… and I am also extremely worried about intestinal blockages.

Thanks,
Tiffany

[jennifer m]

Well, she has been on the Nutrisource Lamb Meal and Rice for a few weeks. I bought a small bag. Still having at least 6-8 poops a day. She literally will go about 3 times before she even eats her first bowl of food for the day. I can also tell she does not really like the food.

I tried 2 days of Pure Vida and had less poops so I thought I could possibly transition over, plus she liked the food. Bought a bag, and day 3 was a blow out.

So back on the nutrisource for the time being. At least we are solid on it, but obviously just have not found the right thing.

I am concerned about a raw diet. The holistic vet in the community is known to suggest Honest Kitchen Raw food. She is currently on maternity leave so I may see her when she gets back.

I am beginning to think it may be peas. The foods I have tried have varied by proteins, but the two she has had the most success with contact no peas. It’s been hard to find a good quality food that doesn’t have peas in it.

[pitlove]

I’m not sure. I haven’t looked that hard, but I’ve heard a lot of good things about that company. It used to be called ReelRaw.

[Vishakha G]

Hi Pitlove-
Thank you for your input, I have been looking for decent sized bags and have been unsuccessful, glad to know it just does not exist, so I can stop looking.

Is wefeedraw.com the most cost-effective of its kind?

[pitlove]

Hi puppypiles-

Yes Corgis are technically suppose to be a fed a large breed puppy formula because they are often plagued with the same growth disorders large breeds get.

For puppies the best thing to do is use a commercially available dry food that is suited for the growth of large breed puppies and then once he/she is an adult switch to a raw diet. You also can talk to the breeder or multiple breeders and see what they recommend. Make sure you are talking to breeders that know what they are doing though.

[pitlove]

Hi Vishakha-

I have yet to find a brand of raw that makes bags large enough to last a month for larger sized dogs. I guess they feel it would be so expensive that it would discourage people from buying it. Not really sure.

There are services out there like https://www.wefeedraw.com/ where they ship you pre-packaged raw food enough for either 2 weeks or 4 weeks. This is a prey model raw diet however.

[Vishakha G]

Hello,
I am looking for a commercial raw dog food. Something thats convenient yet decently priced and available in bags big enough to last me a month. I have 2 dogs one 20 pounds and one 40 pounds.
My oldest one ( even though she is ageless, 9 but acts like she is 2) has trouble on even the best kibble ( yeasty ears and itchy paws) and she used to eat Ziwipeak but they discontinued the big bags. My younger does well on anything, but I wont feed just ONE of them raw.

I used to feed her the honest kitchen but she dislikes it and won’t eat it unless I top it off with an egg or something. Plus I am looking for kibble like convenience.
I tried REAL MEAT – Dog food, but their poop was horrible on it. ( Any information regarding this?)
I also briefly tried raw feeding them the regular way, buying meat and organs in bulk but I couldn’t manage to do it in the long term, time commitment etc.

Any recommendations are welcome !

[puppypiles]

We’re interested in adding a Cardigan Welsh Corgi to our family in the near future and have questions about their nutrition. I’ve been reading corgis need large breed food as to control their growth. I’m also interested in feeding raw, but again have concerns about controlling growth. Any advice would be appreciated!

[aimee]

I think rawhide can be an appropriate chew but needs to be matched to the dog. This product though may be purchased by an owner who wouldn’t purchase a rawhide based chew of the same form. Also the danger with this product is that it is a mish mash of pieces inside of a cover sheet. Very easy for a dog to disassemble and swallow one of the inside pieces whole.

Through Freedom of Information Act Test ran was inconclusive. Hopefully FDA will run a more definitive test soon.

[Susan]

Hi Ellies Parents,
why dont you feed them home made raw diet when you get to Canada? go & buy the same ingreients in Canada if you can.
Go onto “Rodney Habib” facebook page he lives in Canada & has a Dog Shop, ask him, Dr Karen Becker or people that follow Rodney might be from Canada aswell & they’ll point you in the right direction, but if you make home made raw now then make the same raw diets while you’re in Canada & make enough for the amount of time you’ll be there & freeze small meals, that’s if your staying with friends….
Try & stick with the same diet your feeding now especially if you have a dog with Stomach poblems, the stress of traveling might upset the dogs, so try & keep their routine the same if possible…

[InkedMarie]

Very sad. Back in the early 90’s, before i knew better, I bought rawhide chews weekly for my dogs.

[pitlove]

Hi Jessica-

Since you have a dog with food sensitivities, the issue is not so much the lower of the amount of meat in the food, but whether or not they have added any other proteins to the diet. I also wouldn’t stress over whether or not it will remain a 5 star food. The rating DFA gives the food has no correllation to why your Frenchie has done well on it.

However, if your concern IS the fact that they have added more fruits/veggies and you are trying to stay with more of a meat based diet, you could consider a Prey Model Raw diet like the ones provided from https://www.wefeedraw.com/

[Susan]

Hi Patrica,

*Canidae has new formula’s “Canidae Pure Petite” Small Breed freeze dried raw coated.
https://www.canidae.com/dog-food/products just scroll down a little look to your right & click on page 4 & all the Pure Petite formula’s will come up.
* Ziwi Peak Air Dried Raw
https://www.ziwipets.com/

When dog foods were tested for toxins & contaminates these brands & formula’s below got 5 stars…..
* “Buckley Liberty” Grain Free Freeze Dried – the Beef, Lamb & Chicken formula’s
* “Canisource Grand CRU” ALS dehydrated raw – the Turkey, Pork & Lamb & Reat Meat Formula’s
* “Natures Variety” Instant Raw Market Meals Blend & Chicken Recipes with Sweet Potatoes, Peas & Blueberries
* “The Honest Kitchen” Grain Free Proper Toppers Chicken Recipe

[Ellies Parents]

My dogs love Ollie and PetPlate (I feed them both because they like the variation in recipes). I also feed them raw when I have time.

I’m going to Canada for vacation and I can’t bring raw into Canada, and I can only bring some Ollie / PetPlate. Does anyone know what the best pet food in Canada is?

My dogs have done absolutely amazing on Ollie and PetPlate with some raw. One used to have so many stomach issues and the other is so picky. Both eat and are much healthier now. I’m worried that when I go to Canada and run out of Ollie my dogs will starve themselves… Everything I am finding online is canned and I don’t want them to get sick in Canada from eating canned food with all those chemicals and preservatives

[Susan]

Hi Brianne,
My boy has IBD, he gets bad acid reflux & gets Pancreas/stomach pain lifts his right paw up whinges & wants me to rub around his stomach & Pancreas area, we have done the blood test & Ultra scan for Pancreatitis & everything comes back OK his Gastro vet says its his IBD, its his stomach….
If your dog isnt really interested in his Blue Bufflo kibble change it & find a kibble or low fat wet can or Freeze Dried raw kibble to feed him, I have found I need to rotate between a few foods that agree with him, they must be low/medium fat around 10%min to 14% max in fat, Protein over 25% & Carbs under 30% & fiber under 4%..
A dogs digestive tract is short & ment to digest a raw meaty diet not these processed dry kibbles, this is why I think so many dogs are having stomach & bowel problems……

My boy loves the Hills I/d Chicken & Vegetable Stew wet can food & the Royal Canine Intestinal Low Fat wet can food I just get a paper towel & pat down & dry all the oil from the Royal Canin low fat wet food, Why I buy teh Vet Diet Wet can foods cause the fat is low where pet shop went can foods are higher in fat…
Patch gets his acid when a food has fish/salmon oils, he does well on Canola & sunflower oils…
Have you tried an ant acid reducer like Pepcid or Zantac ? you give 30mins before 2 of his main meals a day, my boy is on an ant acid blocker now he started off on Omeprazole (Prilosec) took it for 2 yrs then around December last year I moved & Patch went down hill really bad, I asked his vet can he do another Endoscope + Biopsies you must ask for the Biopsies so the vet knows what is really happening in stomach, my Patches Sphincter flap isn’t closing & the acid is coming up his esophagus into his mouth & went back down into his wind pipe this probably why he became so unwell the beginning of the year, I nilly put him to sleep he just gave up it was awful to watch, also his Helicobacter-Pylori were come back & he had Gastritis stomach…so he was put on 21 day triple therapy meds Metronidazole Amoxcillin & Prilosec given every 12 hours with a full meal, then after the 21 days I continued giving just 1 x 20 Prilosec tablet of a morning for his acid reflux & to keep his Helicotor away, it lives in their stomach walks & loves sugary carbs (kibble)
In the end I had to stop any wet foods cause they kept coming up into hois mouth causing bad acid reflux, I found Wellness Core Large Breed dry kibble & he’s doing really well now, he’s acting like a puppy, he isnt a large breed dog he’s an English Staffordshire Terrier, the Wellness Core Large Breed formula is low/med Fat-13%, Protein-35%, Carbs-31% low in Kcals per cup -345Kcals per cup & is high in Omega 3 & has Glusomine & Chondroitin helping his joints & bones he’s 9ys old & it has no chickpeas or lentils…

I’d change his diet, if you can cook 1-2 of his meals a lean white meat with boiled sweet potatoes, sweet potato freezes really well & feed his other 2 meals the Wellness Core large Breed formula, try & feed 3-4 smaller meals a day, I feed him at 7am, 9am-1/2 cup kibble both times 12pm-wet can food or cooked food or his freeze dried raw food & 5pm -1/2 cup kibble & 8pm-1/3 kibble, & try an ant acid reducer first either the Pepcid (Famotidine) or Zantac (Ranitidine) 30 mins before 2 of his main meals, if they dont really help him then ask vet about trying Omeprazole (Prilosec) 20mg best given first thing of the morning just wait about 20mins then feed him but you dont really dont have to wait before feeding him as Prilosec is a Protein Pump Inhibitor (PPI) sends a msg to the brain not to make as much Hydrochloric acid in the stomach, where the Zantac & Pepcid works differently & I found didnt really help Patch… You will see results within 2-3 days after using the Omeprazole..
Sometimes I also give Patch either 5ml liquid Mylanta or 1/2 a Quick-eze chew when he has vomited up acid these line his throat & eosphagus & make him feel better…

[Patricia A]

I’m still hanging in there trying to find a freeze dried topper my picky eater likes and my 8 year old Chihuahua that tends towards easy weight gain. Anyone have good things to say about Bixbi Freeze dried? It rates as average Fat low carbs vs Stella’s and Primal with above average fat as a whole for all recipes. I just recently saw this in the Pet Supply store I go to.

[jessica n]

Hi Raw Food Experts –
I have been feeding my dog Nature’s Instinct Variety Raw (Beef + Lamb) his entire life. He is a French Bulldog, and with all their allergies and health issues, he does extremely well on this diet, so we’re careful that he only gets this food.

Nature’s Variety has changed this food and I am very concerned. The primary change I can see if that it went from 95% meat to 85%, and the fruits went from 5% to 15%. It is clear that they did this to lower price.

They’ve also introduced a new frozen raw food line, now their “Signature” frozen raw line that maintains the 95% meat, and is only sold at independent retailers.

What do you guys think about the change to 85% meat and the new recipe? Will this still be a 5 star frozen raw food? Or, should we consider moving to their new Signature recipe (if we can find it!)?

Details here:
https://www.instinctpetfood.com/newraw

[Zeke S]

Hi Patty! Is there some other place in your home that you could do the meal prep? Mine is usually done in the garage, where we keep a second fridge dedicated to raw diet foods.

[Zeke S]

Yep, raw carrots are great! I’m surprised that dogs like them, but carrots are good for them, so I’m glad!

[Sloane K]

@Jessica M, I’m glad you chose not to listen to anon101. There’s plenty of anecdotal evidence to support the legitimacy of feeding a raw diet.

[Sloane K]

@anon101, let me refer to this point in that article:
“APN was also associated with feeding raw chicken. 96% of APN dogs were fed raw chicken while only 26% of control dogs were. Only 1 APN case was not fed raw chicken, and this dog had daily contact with live poultry.”

Where in this information does it state that APN was associated with raw chicken? Those numbers don’t make sense. Further, dogs with APN being fed raw chicken does not conclude a causal relationship.

[Sloane K]

I don’t recommend basing your information on studies done on humans. Our systems are not the same as our canine friends. I’m not familiar with commercial raw diets but I think you should wait until you’ve spoken to your vet before making that switch.

[Sloane K]

Very helpful info! I feed my yellow lab rescue a homemade raw diet but have been thinking of switching to a name brand. Might give this one a try.

[Sloane K]

Very helpful info! I feed my yellow lab rescue a homemade raw diet but have been thinking of switching to a name brand. Might give Top Quality a try.

[Jackie K]

I’ve been making my own raw dog food, using a grinding technique, according to Dr. Becker‘s book, about four years now. It’s specific recipes, including vegetables, fruits, etc. I do my own butchering, and I am interested in obtaining professional analysis. Can anyone recommend facilities and/or specific test to order? I live in Oklahoma, if that makes any difference.

[Kalii16]

I have my daughters beautiful 10 year old Pit Bull girl Kalii. Recently took her to the vet for her checkup/shots & the vet said she’s 12lbs over weight. She should weigh 55lbs and weighs 67lbs. When we play in the yard, she does come back in limping. She definitely has arthritis and the extra weight is not helping! My daughter had her on Taste of The Wild – smoked salmon. Recently I was told to put her on Zignature Catfish Formula. She’s been eating that for two days now (mixed with her Taste of the Wild). In the past, we have had issues with her skin. So we assumed she had allergies & took her off grains and chicken etc… and her skin cleared up. I guess my question is, is this Zignature food the best choice for her and will it help her lose weight? I give her two scoops a day. Also, what should I be giving her for the arthritis? Should I consider a raw diet and if yes, how do I go about that? I know zero about any of this! I just want her to be healthy and to live as long as possible pain free and happy. Thank you to anyone who can help me. Appreciate it very much!
Jean & Kalii

[haleycookie]

You’ve fed other dogs raw before right? It’s the same deal but twice the amount per body weight until a year/year and a half. What type of dog is it? With large breed puppies it can be more difficult as you have to make sure you’re giving them the correct calcium phosphorus ratios until atleast 2 years old.

[ThreeDoodles]

I have fed raw in the past to my older dogs but I have a new 10 week old puppy. He is not doing well on kibble and I know he will do just great on raw. With kibble he has had nothing but mushy poop. Tests all come back normal. My question is, how much to feed him. Is there a chart? I want to feed him a raw ground mix. Thanks for your help.

• This topic was modified 7 years, 7 months ago by ThreeDoodles.

[Susan]

Hi Jennifer,
I have a Staffy with Food Sensitivities Environment Allergies & IBD, I would be making her your own raw diet with human grade meats, no pre-made raw dog food, I went thru animal nutritionist in Australia & we started PAtch on a raw elimination diet to work out what ingredients he is sensitive too…
Dogs have a short digestive tract, their intestinal tract is make to digest a raw diet quickly so if the meat they have eaten is spoiled etc it quickly moves thru their stomach then onto their small bowel onto the large bowel then a small poo, kibbles are high in fiber & some grainfree kibbles are even higher in fiber especially if it has peas, lentils, chickpeas, I have found kibbles that have sweet potatos & potato work the best for Patch, if you do go back to a dry kibble look at “Natural Balance” LTD Sweet Potato & Bison or Natural Balance Potato & Duck formula or look at “Wellness Simple” Turkey & Potato formula..

If you can afford it look for a Holistic Vet in your area.. My boy went down hill last December & now I’m feeding my boy “Frontier Pets” Freeze Dried dehydrated raw thats free range grain free raw diet human ingredients, I started to slowly introduce & give to him at Lunch time only they’re small balls & you add warm water, straight away he started to get better I saw good results like you have seen he also eats “Wellness Core Large Breed dry kibble he isnt large breed dog but this Wellness Core large breed formula is high protein-36%, low/med in fat-13% low in carbs-31% low in Kcals-345Kcals Per cup… & has no lentils or chickpeas…You need to work out what agrees with your dog…or even join a few Raw feeding groups on facebook someone will help you get your dog onto a balanced raw diet with homemade ingredients not a pre-made raw….
Start with 1 meat protein she hasnt eaten before & you blend some green veggies & fruit,I used peeled apple, take out any seeds, broccolli, celery & parsley blended then put in ice cube tray cover with cling wrap & freeze, you add 1-2 spoons of the Veggie/fruit mix 1-2 frozen veggie/fruit ice cubes to 1 cup of meat…I balanced diet with Natural Animal Solution Digestavite Plus powder….