[sharon b]

Thanks Cheryl, I did hear back from the vet. He got a sample of the “snot” and tested positive for 3 bacteria, I am not sure which exactly. I am a pharmacist, so I know med’s, based on them, He has been on Augmentin and Metronidazole for a month now, they must have been some gram positive staph type, and possibly an anerobic maybe? He is being switched to cephalexin now, another broad spectrum. The infection is mostly in his nose/sinus’s, but he is congested in the throat too. Lungs are clear as of last exam and no sign’s of difficult breathing. Vet didn’t seem to think it was allergies, said he was too young, although my boyfriend thought that comment was in regards to me saying I was going to switch to a raw diet. Seems sometimes they need to be educated, especially when they don’t see a particular breed often. As far as the vomiting, it is hours later, and the other dog is outside much of the day (old habits). Curious on why no turkey necks? are they bigger? I am not sure if my freezer is going to be big enough for this, and my home is small and not enough room for an additional freezer unless I get the porch I am hoping for added on. I would just look for one on Craig’s list and put it on the deck put have heard the winter weather if on or off ruins them. Obviously if below freezing wouldn’t need to run it. I will do small batches of food for the time being.
My guy is pretty good with his paws, he eats bully sticks and hangs on to them, and we have given them both beef bones before, mostly rib from pet stores, not raw.

[M M]

We have been using V-Dog for 10 months with amazing results in our hyper-allergic English bulldog. Only after switching to V-dog did we learn through allergy testing that she is allergic to milk and every kind of meat (tho’ we suspected at least some meats were an issue as we tried ~6 types). To the person who has never heard of a dog being allergic to meat, you’re welcome to call our vet and discuss our dog’s case. It happens. A week after we adopted her, her previous owner commented that she has “allergies” but he didn’t specify details and we had never heard of meat allergies. I had to buy a cone collar to keep her from scratching herself raw.

The first vet we saw recommended a novel protein diet so we proceeded to try salmon then various rare protein and grain/potato-free options. I didn’t notice any changes in her intense whole-body itching, skin yeast and bacterial infections, and ear infections, so I figured we had not given it enough time to show benefit as I was told it takes 3 months after switching foods to notice a change.

We switched to the V-dog a week after our pup had a severe allergic reaction with facial and airway swelling, wheezing, and hives that failed to resolve with 2 steroid injections and oral prednisolone. She gobbled up the V-dog and begged for more, which was a huge change from me having to lace the other foods we’d tried with peanut butter or moist food (which she often would just lick off and leave the kibble behind).

Within a few days of switching to V-dog we noticed a dramatic reduction in the itchy-scratchies, yeasty body smell, yeasty ears, red face after eating, and watery eyes after eating. Her hives resolved and thanks to her improved smell I was able to wait 2+ weeks between baths (vs 3x/week with medicated shampoo as previously directed by our vet). Her hives totally resolved. The bald spots in her coat filled in and now her coat is thick and shiny.

A while after switching to V-dog, I tried giving her a fresh raw meat knuckle bone which she gnawed at for 2 minutes then promptly threw up and then refused to touch it. I thought maybe she didn’t like the raw aspect, so I cooked meat and made homemade broth from bones, at which point her allergies dramatically worsened. Stopped the meat, allergies gone.

The V-dog is expensive, but we happily pay for it as our dog is now healthy and happy. She was so miserable before. When we go to the vet for routine care she and her staff all say how nice it is to see a healthy bulldog. We also supplement with coarsely ground home-cooked beans and veggies (especially kale and broccoli), which she devours. We give her plain organic PB mixed with freshly ground flaxseed for treats. For training treats we just use the V-dog kibbles since she loves them so much. She also loves and begs for raw carrot sticks and fruits like thin apple slices, mashed cherries/berries, watermelon, and banana (tho’ we heavily limit fruit to small amounts due to high sugar content and also give watermelon from near the rind to limit sugar).

I would like to find a home-cooked food option in case there is a time when we can’t get the V-dog (and also it seems that baked kibble is not really an ideal food, despite how well she does with it compared to other kibble and moist foods), but for now I am very happy to support the company. The vet told us that we should stick with V-dog as it is working so well for us.

Of note, our dog also has environmental allergies, but as long as we vacuum to keep dust/pollen at a minimum she does fine. I do limit her time outdoors during the worst of the pollen season. But even if her allergies flare from pollen they are nothing like what they were before the V-dog switch.

[Cheryl F]

Hi Sharon,

You said for the 2nd day your Newf pup has thrown up. Is it immediately after he finishes eating, or some time later (say 1 hour post feeding). If it’s immediately – thats regurgitation and oftentimes dogs on RAW will do that and then re-eat the food. Nothing to be worried about unless its an every day occurrence for a ‘period’ of time. Hardest part is to keep the other dogs from “clean up on aisle 12” participation! You also mentioned a couple other things – but didn’t fully qualify them. He came back positive for 3 bacterias….what bacterias. What is the infection he was diagnosed with and what is he being treated with? Not that that has any bearing on the BARF diet, but I’m curious. I would advise you to call your local butchers/food stores and ask them what they have in the back that they haven’t put out yet, ground up etc…. If you get on their good side and ask them for help in the processing of your meat requests, they may do the chopping for you. i dont recommend feeding your dogs ground up food all the time. The chewing action is what they need to clean teeth, expend energy (in the case of your newf pup – chewing a good big knuckle bone for an hour or so will tire him out and give you a break). Plus it’s good for the dogs to learn how to ‘hold’ the bones properly in their paws so they can get at the good stuff. It’s quite amazing to watch them learn what they need to do. I wont forget the day that my one puppy learned how to use his paws as tools and then his raw meaty bone handling skills went over the top for him. 🙂 You can feed large dogs full chicken necks without worrying about having to cut them up. I only cut up now because I have ‘smaller’ dogs than i used to. NEVER feed a turkey neck without it being cut up. I have had to fish my hand into my Saints mouths in the past to retrieve a full neck that was getting stuck because i didn’t cut it up….so word of caution on that.

Sounds like you have done a ton of research on this topic and while the whole process of feeding raw is foreign to some and maybe a little scarey or cost prohibitive up front – it’s far better for them, costs less $ in the long run due to smaller portions, less vet bills, less $ for meds due to allergies, etc…

Id love to hear back from you on what the specific issues are with your newf pup by the way. Have a great day.

Cheryl

[InkedMarie]

Sharon,
I’m no positive but I don’t think your mixer would grind any bones but I could be wrong. I see people recommend a Wesson/Weston for grinding but beef bones can’t be ground in those either, I don’t think.

Hare Today, Darwins & Reel Raw have the “good” meat you mentioned. Pawfectly Raw NE is in New England, I don’t think she ships. It is restaurant quality, USDA meat. The beef is from farms in NY/VT. I’ll be honest. I want to feed raw but I am on a budget myself so I feed what I can afford.

[sharon b]

Thank you Cheryl and Vincent and Marie. I am on disability for neck and shoulder injury so cutting and chopping would not be good for me, but I do have and rarely have used a meat grinder on a kitchen aid mixer. Wonder if that would help?? I am a bit of an organic freak so doubt I would find chicken on specials that are hormone free? Was the chicken you found hormone free? Does anyone go to a local butcher and ask for chicken and turkey necks and various other bones they normally would be buying?? Just a thought, might also make it more affordable. I looked into Darwins, and getting into Perfectly Raw and checking also into shipping cost’s. Darwin’s I believe stated no hormones and sells grass fed meat.

[Cheryl F]

Hi Sharon,

I replied to you on the other thread about most reputable raw food supplier. One other thing to consider. Dont get yourself too worked up about mixing in kale, garlic, this that or the other. Easiest thing for you to do would be to source a good supplier for Salmon Oil, multivitamins and DE (diatomaceous earth). The raw food suppliers will have the ground mixes available for purchase. In my house we buy the grounds (such as ground up chicken with organ meat with vegetables mixed in, beef with organ mix, trachea/gullet mix as well as green tripe. the green tripe is a very excellent source for dogs as it can help them with kidney problems. When dogs are on a raw diet their BUN/Creatinine numbers will different than if they they were on a kibble diet. I dealt with a saint that had symptoms of renal failure when I had her on kibble – and when i had her on raw the green tripe helped to level out those numbers. We feed whole chicken necks, chicken paws, cut up pieces of chicken (back, thigh/leg, breast and gibblets) as well as turkey necks, duck necks, ground mixes and the three x/ week raw meaty bones such as marrow bones, knuckle bones, etc…

We give our dogs a good multivitamin that is tasty to them, salmon oil and DE mixed in with their food daily. My 14 yr old basset had horrible plaque build up on her teeth and now they are all sparkly white. My ‘western medicine’ vet is now finally convinced that the raw diet is so much better than the kibble could hope to be.

Hope this helps you.

[Marta W]

Marie,
do you know anything about those places that the meat is coming from? Mountaire, Farmers pride???
ALso i see they do not have meat/organ/bone type of grind what would you recommend to get to make sure my dog is getting proper proportions?
i am trying to figure out if its better to get meat/organ grind and throw her some bones( legs etc) or id=f i shouldget like back/organ grind and add additional meat chunks?

Any ideas?
Shes ~48lbs slightly overweight, medium activity 6 yo

[ed s]

Switching to raw food and raw bones in most beneficial for a dog, also you can cook the meat and give him but bones always raw. Also include organ meat any type you can get cooked or raw. I have been dealing with huge amount of sick dogs from store bought food one reason it that it is almost 40-60% fillers. While feeding raw always include raw bones. Also try to get raw pupmkin and sunflower seed not salted, and grind em up and do a 1- 3 tablespooons or more just not like a cup a day. By feeding raw you are building up immune in your puppy so you can look for altearnatives as hearthworm and tick prevention. A dog needs a balance fat and proteins since glucogen dogs get from fat ( we get from carbs very important for brain development) so feeding some raw green beans or a tablespoon of honey a day will be enough.

[Pitlove]

Hi Sharon- While I can’t give you a ton of advice on raw (others here can and Im sure will chim in) I do know that raw meaty bones help clean their teeth really well and are quite healthy for them.

I’ve also heard from a few people that they don’t feel that puppies in general should eat grain free however that is probably more towards dry food and not raw since raw is the ideal diet and contains no grains or carbs. Dr. Karen Becker interviewed a doctor who breeds Newfies and has all the pups on a raw diet. One of his Dam’s lived to 17 years old on raw.

Perhaps check out Darwins Pet Foods, they do raw and its already complete and balanced. Hare Today is grinds so you have to add your own vitamins etc. I’m sure others who do feed raw can give you some other sites or suppliers to look into. If your Newfie pup is still under 8 months you will need to make sure he’s getting proper calcium and phosphorus levels and make sure hes not being overfed. That will also aid in preventing skeletal disorders and overgrowth.

[Anonymous]

“Dwarfism is defined as underdevelopment of the body, or the state of being short in stature. Most dwarf dogs have a condition called “osteochondrodysplasia,” which refers to an abnormality in the growth and development of bone, cartilage, or both. Dwarfism almost always affects the long bones of all four of a dog’s legs. Some breeds, like Dachshunds and Corgis, have been selectively bred to be genetic dwarfs; they have skeletal defects in their legs, and sometimes in their skulls and spines, but these abnormal conformational traits are considered desirable” excerpt from:
http://www.petwave.com/Dogs/Health/Dwarfism.aspx

Corgi’s tend to put weight on easily, they need a decent amount of daily exercise, they are really more like big dogs with short legs.
People tend to think of them as small/medium dogs. I didn’t find this to be the case, the one I had, had a German Shepherd personality.
She was a beautiful dog, but the most challenging to train, and she did not like other dogs.

[Jennifer H]

I keep some high quality frozen kibble in the freezer in case of emergency, if the power goes out just thaw it out and I’m good. I also have a flock of free range chickens, so my dog would be supplemented with a daily fresh egg. Also if the power went out the food would still be edible for the dog for a few days if kept in a cooler with ice. I also keep a few cans of dog food on hand in case of emergency.

I feed my dog a raw diet and I love it. I’ve been formulating my own recipes somewhat based off of HoundDogMom’s (check out her stickied thread.) but with more ‘parts’ aka a lot of variety in bones and meats. It’s been kind of getting to be a pain in the butt lately though, so I think I’m going to fully switch to her model with a few minor tweaks to suit my small dog. Instead of grinding my own meat I’m just going to be preground meat from Hare Today (probably going to use the whole rabbit and the goat instead of chicken/beef, and then use chicken necks and feet as his evening rmbs, because chicken bones are the only ones he can safely eat.)

Be careful feeding kibble and raw in the same meal. Some dogs can get digestive upset from this, although some dogs tolerate it fine.

[Cheryl F]

I’m in search of another raw dog food supplier in the northeastern section of the country. Hare todays quality is very good, but the prices are quite high comparing to some others.

I started another investigation this morning looking for some suppliers where I can get actual food, not a blend, freeze dried or combo. Looking for RMB’s of chicken/duck/turkey necks, chicken paws, stuff like that.

Many of the companies that supply raw dog food that is recommended by this forum are all blended foods or freeze dried combos.

What am i missing? Why dont people want to feed their dogs actual bones instead?

[theBCnut]

Especially with large breeds, neutering early, before the growth plates close, can cause joint issues. Neutering slows down the closure of growth plates and depending on the age you neuter, some growth plates will already be close, as is natural, but others will stay open abnormally long, causing those bones to grow to a longer length than they were supposed to, which puts stress on the joints.

Citing a decrease in testicular cancer from neutering before a certain age strikes me as funny, since neutering at any age, as long as it is before the dog gets testicular cancer (which isn’t all that common anyway), completely removes the risk of testicular cancer, since the testicles are completely removed.

I have read a lot of research recently reporting that neutering may actually cause more behavior problems than it prevents, other than the desire to breed and those related behaviors. Neutered males are often cited as the aggressors in dog fights. Neutering seems to remove some caution as well as removing body parts.

If you are prepared to be a responsible owner, then neutering may be unnecessary. However, if you doubt your ability to keep your dog at home, under control, then neutering is better done early, before the dog gets to breeding age, regardless of other issues.

[Miss Koa]

Thank you Red for the PDF. I hadn’t searched it. It has very interesting info. I appreciate that! I like that I can refer to it on my tablet because I have it with me all the time. 🙂

Hi, crazy4cats! Thank you for sharing your experience with me. I know, the thought of raw meat kind of gives me the heebie jeebies. 😀 Where can I find this “commercial premix” stuff? Is it expensive? Is it sold in regular stores or do I have to order it online? Right now I’m doing a raw chicken in the morning and kibble in the evening…at least until I can figure stuff out. 🙂 At least my husband isn’t complaining….yet. 🙂

Hi Kristin C! Thank you for your reply! What is “homemade raw”? Do you grind the muscle meat, organs and supplements together? Also, do you feed it at the same time with the raw meaty bones or are they separate meals? I’m glad to hear that you haven’t had any contamination issues. That’s my main concern. I am very diligent about keeping my kitchen and work area very clean. ( I’m a bit of a germaphobe…lol! ) I was concerned more like if my dog ate her chicken, then she walked around the house, would it get on my socks…then if I went to lie down, will it transfer from my socks to the bed….that kind of thing. 🙂 Maybe I’m over thinking this too much.

I agree. It is a process and I can’t say for SURE that this is the best diet…still researching…but I also feel that I like the idea of feeding my dog food that I know is not filled with unnecessary chemicals and fillers.

Thank you everyone for your opinions and input. I appreciate all the help I get! 🙂

[Kristin C]

Hi Miss Koa-I feed both my dogs raw, mostly homemade and raw meaty bones, no more than 2-3 kibble meals per week. The ratio between homemade raw and commercial raw I feed depends upon the time of year. Right now, I will buy more commercial raw since the summer gets busy and it’s also easier to feed RMBs. I also buy raw nuggets from Steve’s Real Food For Dogs. It’s not HPP treated though, which I prefer. I also order grinds and RMBs from Reel Raw in Maine, and occasionally get turkey necks from a grocery store. When I make homemade food it’s a combo of muscle meat and organs plus a supplement. When I feed RMBs I make sure I add matching organs in proportion (this is cheaper I am finding). I also add some fish oil and vit E a few time per week (or sardines) plus a raw egg and cottage once or twice per week.

I have not found feeding raw to have any contamination issues. When I make the food I take the same precautions as if I was making food for me and my husband. Children,and the ill, I would watch out for though as others have mentioned. I only feed raw grinds inside, I feed in small mason jars. RMBs I feed outside, but my dogs don’t use their paws.

The final thing I can add about feeding raw is that I think it’s great IF it works for your dog. It is definitely a process. I have changed how I feed my dogs several times in the last year, keep reading and form your own opinions on what works for your dog and household.

[Pitlove]

My cat is funny she loves the coco oil by itself but didnt eat half her food last night when i put it in it, however my once picky pit will now eat his food regardless of whats in it lol. I guess ill just be letting her lick a spoonful of it every once in a while.

Im not sure if she needs to gain a little weight. She has no hanging belly and seems very lean but I get worried because I can feel her hip bones easily. I’ve always had overweight cats so Im not really sure what is considered too skinny for a cat. any insight?

[chris]

Wow, thanks Bobby. That site is great for showing what is toxic and non toxic. I was surprised how much of a list it actually has. I agree some they have listed are questionable, but that is just something that common sense should think about.

For instance they have no raw meat bones, but everyone on here would probably disagree to that lol

[jakes mom]

Oh, he loves them, and his teeth look better. He’s had the chicken drums, and backs. Turkey necks, pork neck bones, and some ribs. He was so confused when I gave him the first one, and I was a little nervous, but after the first couple we’re both doing well with them. I still always keep an eye on him, tho, just in case. He was funny, wasn’t sure what to do with it, but was sure he didn’t want me to take it back! 🙂

[jakes mom]

Thanks guys for all your help. No worries, Bobbydog, I knew what Pitlove meant. So here’s my new plan. Darwin’s site says the food can be fed raw or cooked, as some animals just don’t like or can’t tolerate raw. So that’s what I did tonite, lightly cooked a pack of the chicken. Didn’t cook very much, just sautéed a few minutes. Not enough to cook bones, was still partly raw. It went over very well, everybody seemed to eat a bit of it, even the 2 who turned up their noses at the raw. I’ll cook for a few days as well as get some kind of probiotics, and hopefully slowly work back to full raw. I did weigh my old guy, no weight loss so that makes me feel better. I really want this raw thing to work! Besides the better nutrition, one of my girls has a yeasty ear issue which I hope raw feeding will help.

[pugmomsandy]

I just keep the protein at a minimum amount. I can use a 3-4 star kibble (with few red ingredients) but top it with a 5 star wet food to keep the final protein amount where I like it. Or if I use a high protein kibble, I use less wet food on top. For me, I keep the protein over 30%. But also as part of my rotation, I vary that amount. Sometimes they might eat 30% protein, sometimes they eat 100% meat/bones.

[Gem M]

Okay so here is his history

We obtained him at 8 weeks he was skin and bones. The vets told us to prepare for the worse. He didn’t even weigh a pound! He had blood in his stools but was very playful and alert. They said it was parvovirus, I argued that it was worms. After worming him regularly each week he started to grow and the weight came on. Food was an issue he’d go three months the get sore skin and anal glands. Some food he would have very loose stools.

The vets would give us steroids but overall we just kept moving through different kibbles moving to anything grain free. He never had an ounce of fat on him and had an absolute love of life but never got to an ideal weight for a pointer for more than a month. We managed his environmental exposures to help his paws and kept switching foods every 3 – 6 months unless there was an immediate problem.

In January I researched food until I was blue in the face, by this time I was working at a vets myself. I decided on Orijen… The vets disagreed that he needed so much protein and as he was loosing weight I felt despite him looking fab fur wise, anal gland wise and pads I should listen to one particular vet and give him a carb based diet. He gained nothing and I spoke to a nutritionist who said no way is this the right food for him. So I decided enough is enough we are going raw. I spoke with another nutritionist and she explained meats, percentages etc etc. I’m also adding in some sweet potato and butternut squash to his veggies. The plan is lamb as a main base, little fish each day and small amounts of goats yogurt and veg. Egg each day.. Then move to more meat but all of this slowly slowly..

So my boy is pretty much the dream of my vets, he is very active, yet calm, and they think I’m making too much fuss as he is in their minds healthy!! I have spoken to 7 different vets with all different backgrounds and they all say yes he is underweight but he is fine. But I can see every rib, his hip bones, even his back bones. He shivers in the winter. He needs some fat. We’ve gone from walking him 2.5 hours a day off lead to 1 hour every other day off lead. But we can see that what other dogs do in a week he does in an hour. That’s no exaggeration we once did a 26 mile hike and he was STILL running on the 25th mile! He is just a beautiful dog with a lust for life. He is fast playful and great fun. He plays fetch, plays with my other dog, loves his walks and is active around the house for about 8 hours a day… But very obedient.

Anyway last night I gave him some frozen meat in a bowl and he absolutely woofed it down… So I think it’s a texture issue! I’m sure giving frozen is not good but I’d rather that than no food. He ate some frozen lamb, pumpkin, two eggs and two frozen sprats in the end!!!

• This reply was modified 10 years, 6 months ago by Gem M.

[Pitlove]

Hi Terry-

Dogs aren’t born with allergies, they develop them over time through overexposure to the same food. Even though you were feeding an excellent quality dehydrated raw diet, you didnt vary the proteins she got, hence the sudden onset of the allergy.

As for the myth about the wet food making the teeth worse, its just that, a myth. Every dog needs their teeth brushed regularly just like a human in order to avoid dental problems. Raw meaty bones are also probably the best thing to clean the teeth like Rhonda suggested. And if you were rehydrating the raw as you should its no different than the wet food getting on her teeth.

I would suggest keeping her on the dehyrated raw diet but changing the protein source and even brand, obviously now avoiding whatever protein she is allergic to.

[zcRiley]

I haven’t heard that. Your dog is lucky to have different food types per day. Can you imagine eating the same food for years and years? I feed raw dehydrated for breakfast, a 5 star kibble for lunch and another 5 star brand for dinner. As a side (not mixed in), I rotate a canned food daily. The stools are medium sized firm and I make sure the total daily amount matches their activity level for the day (lots of swimming as summer approaches!). Dasuquin Advanced as treats and deer shank bones in between. Vet visits are a thing of the past. Just watch for any allergic reactions when introducing a new food.

[Naturella]

For my Bruno – a 14.5lb Rat Terrier-Jack Russell mix, we gave him antlers since we adopted him at 4-5 months of age. We also gave stuffed Kongs, bully sticks, fish skins, Nylabones, Himalayan dog chews, etc. He is a moderate chewer nowadays so he still gets the same things, plus stuffed and frozen hooves.

For a heavy chewer, stuffed and frozen Kongs would be your best bet, I believe. I never had a problem with hooves or antlers, even when Bruno used to be a heavy chewer in his puppyhood, but just make sure you always monitor your dog when chewing on toys to prevent any disasters. Bruno used to try to swallow 2-3 inches of fish skins whole, so we started putting vice grips on them, and now he chews them up all the way properly.

[Jen W]

My dogs all enjoy Nylabones, they’re a bull terrier x basenji cross and two pit bull type dogs. They are between 44 and 79lbs, respectively. They all can chew for hours and get a variety of goodies.

I have nylabones for all of them and they all use them frequently, you can sandpaper them down a little bit to get them smoothed out and not so horrible to step on.

We also use bully sticks, bully slices, pig ears, cow ears, and like – my little one doesn’t always care for them, but the two larger ones love the flavorful real treats. They also all get knuckle bones and such once in a while as well and if a small piece is broken off they’re tossed.

My little one, Kay has an antler and she enjoys that sometimes, but it isn’t her favorite treat. she is very selective, one day she loves it the next she could care less.

If antlers, and something strong is what you are after, I would steer clear of the deer and go for a larger animal. My friend’s lab mix annihilated one of Kay’s antlers within twenty minutes. It was a split shed, you could see the spongy inside and they just tore it to bits.

Acadia Antlers has moose antlers, natural sheds and they come in flavors and have other projects. for the items it really isn’t a too bad deal. I’ve had it on my mind to order from them just haven’t but their reviews seem to be great. Just have to worry about power chewers who will do it at any and all costs and will break a tooth.

[Ellen D]

That’s a great price! I have two co-ops that have delivery drop offs near me in SE Michigan. One of them only does bulk (cases of 40 pounds), and the other one will do individual tubs/containers. I don’t have a chest freezer yet so I have only ordered from the second one. I haven’t done a ton of shopping around yet – only started raw feeding about 6 weeks ago. Between what I ordered and finding a special on whole chickens for $.40/lb, I think I’ve probably spent about $120 for that 6 weeks for my one 35 lb puppy. Granted, I got a little eager and ordered some fancy proteins – llama, beaver, and emu which inflated that price a bit but I got so excited about them lol.

Once I get my chest freezer, which will be free as a gift from a friend who is upgrading hers, I can order from the better priced co-op, and I think it will work out to be about $80/month if I want to really rotate in a variety of proteins (venison, duck, quail, rabbit), or I could get as low as about $60/month if I stuck to just beef, chicken, and turkey. This is just calculating pure pre-ground raw (which are whole animals with meat, bones, organs, some I have to add organs). The 40 cents a pound chickens seem to be a common deal around here, so if I stock up on those when I find them I could cut that even lower. I broke down the chickens and feed them as whole bony pieces, so no cost for a meat grinder. I have a local middle eastern/halal market that sells me goat liver and kidney at 29 cents a pound, and that’s such a minor cost that I haven’t counted that in the totals. They also throw in free duck and chicken feet for me whenever I go in there.

I set my budget at $100/month when I first got my puppy 9-10 weeks ago, and I was definitely spending that and then some in the first few weeks when I was feeding kibble and cans.

[Gloria K]

I’m curious to know what kind of dog you have that could possibly demolish a Nyla bone in minutes LOL. My Mickey, a 13 pound terrier mix, is one of the most aggressive chewers I’ve ever seen with extremely strong teeth and his Nyla bones will last him for months. Have you talk to your vet? He could probably advise you as to what this aggressive chewer could safely gnaw on.

[Randy K]

Thanks Belinda! I’d love to switch Totem to to fresh raw foods but I’m a bit overwhelmed by all the info. We do have a small local company that sources grass fed and organic meats and organs and bones so I may still try to do it. She did really well eating her first raw turkey neck chewing every last bit really well. She loves the Primal stuff and sings when I mix it up but I’m also going to give her the Fromms LBP food in rotation so I don’t miss anything important in her diet.

[DANNY K]

Ok, I have read and read and read, and have yet to find the “safest” chew treat available. Seems like everyone has had issues whether e coli, salmonella, chard, or choking. My pup is a very aggressive chewer/eater. So we gave him Nylabones the breeder provided, I think they were gone in minutes. I am afraid of bullysticks or anything as he will demolish them and probably choke. I want no nylon, plastic or artificial crap. Then I hear the hard stuff can mess up there teeth.

Is there any solution?

[Anonymous]

I give them the occasional raw frozen beef marrow bone because I know they enjoy it.
I don’t think food, bones/chews, sprays or additives work any miracles on their teeth, though.

I brush their teeth with Petrodex and a medium sized adult toothbrush (hardest I can find), I count to 100 (for each section) and really scrub the sides and the back where the tartar builds up, this takes about 5 minutes for each dog per day.

Some dogs just have lousy teeth, sometimes it’s genetic, and will need one or two professional cleanings in their lifetime no matter what you do. But the brushing does make a big difference.

[Naturella]

LM, thanks for the info! Yeah, Bruno is on a roundworm preventive pill, and I will monitor his stool even when one day we have a yard, but I would feed him raw on the grass. But good to know!

Also, he digests bones well, but it essential for every pet owner to monitor their pet while chewing on chew toys, natural or artificial, or consuming an RMB. So yes, if the dog is having issues, then they should be given something else, but it is a good thing to try as it has many benefits for their health.

Chris, as for the venison, I would be just fine giving it raw. Also, you can even feed grocery store (human grade) meat. Organic and grass-fed is best for humans and dogs, but the “regular” grocery store one is OK too. So I would be pretty comfortable with the farm-fresh meat from your butcher, but that’s me. Just watch your dog, his stool, and go from there.

[Pitlove]

L M thanks for the info about the roundworms. was not aware of that. im always extra careful with bones as my dog is a power chewer and tends to be one of those dogs who wants to eat everything. the only thing that seems to work for him and i’ve never had any intestional problems with are elk/deer antlers

[Anonymous]

“if I fed my RMBs in a yard, I would not be worried one bit about grass and/or soil getting on them unless I’m using some chemical or toxic pesticides. If you are not, i think grass and dirt are ok. Maybe someone else can confirm or refute that though”

Ingesting dirt can lead to roundworms. It happens.
And not all dogs digest bones well, my small breed had to go to the emergency vet, x-ray showed calcified material (ground up bone) in her stomach and colon that was causing her a significant amount of pain. Luckily it passed on it’s own, however, if I give her a bone, I have to monitor and take it away before she gets down to the nitty-gritty.

[pugmomsandy]

I also use the larger plate (chili meat plate). I can fit my pinkie finger through the holes. It has bigger holes so the meat/bones doesn’t get backed up trying to be crushed to fit through the smaller plate.

[Pitlove]

chris + naturella–
thanks! i usually either get “thats weird and gross” or “thats cool!” lol never really an inbetween reaction to my profession choice. i’ve worked in customer service for so many years i need a break from living people lol! and ive always been interested in forensics as well.

chris- if you can get fresh meats as a topper for the kibble i think that would be a great way to get some raw into Sparkys diet. And as long as the kibble is the vast majority of the meal you are safe from it being unbalanced.

I’ve tried raw meaty bones for my dog and he just licked at it and really didnt understand how to chew it lol. i might need to try again with a larger one as hes a big dog and i got him a dinky little bone just to try it out.

Naturella- with RMB’s is it safe to feed them outside even if you dont have like a porch for them to eat it on? im afraid of dirt and stuff getting into it.

[Naturella]

If you can get some Raw Meaty Bones, like beef ribs, and some meat, fresh from the farm and at a good price, I’d go for it, yes. RMBs are really good for dental health and raw is really good period. Balanced raw, that is. But as an addition, it would not hurt if it is under the 10% of total meals.

[simmy]

So after reading many topics and review I bought bought the Weston #32 grinder for $700 to grind turkey necks without an issue. After around 60lb of meat and only around 10 lb. turkey neck it stopped working. I returned it back to the manufacturer and hoping that the warranty will cover it.

Bones got stuck several times in the machine. Even though I already seperated them to small pieces with a cleaver. I see some people claim they even put a whole turkey neck and the machine grinded it without an issue.

Need some advice from the weston owners. What am I doing wrong?

[jakes mom]

I know, patience is key, lol! I’ve been bribing with a bit of cooked chicken on top, and pushed into the raw with a fork. Julie is pulling the chicken out, so at least she’s getting a taste of the raw, might decide she likes it. She likes plain raw chicken, eats chicken liver, hearts and gizzards so I have hope for her. This is different tho, “richer” I’d guess, with the meat, bones, liver, heart, neck, etc all ground together. At least I was already done with the first step. They’re already eating canned not dry, and fed twice a day, so I don’t have the “free feeding” hurdle to get over. BTW, I was figuring out the amounts I need to feed every day if I ever get that far, lol. I don’t know how much your girl weighs, but just to give you an idea …at feeding 2% of cat’s body weight (you might want to feed a kitten 3%) a 7# cat would get about 2.2 ounces per day.

[Chloe K]

Hi there! I have a 12 week old German Shepherd boy and we just started a week ago on raw – We are currently feeding him a premade diet which is costing me a fortune so I would like to look into creating my own meal for him.

So far I’ve learned:

“2.5% of Bears weight (40kg) 1kg

45% Raw Meaty Bones – 450g
45% Muscle Meat – 450g
5% Organ Meat – – 50g

Your goal is to have no more than 20-25% actual bone in the diet.
25% of 450g is 112g”

This is what I have written down, I would like to feed him 2 meals a day when he is older, so that is 25g of offal per meal? Is that right? That seems like such a low amount?

Can I feed raw chicken and raw beef in the same meal?

Can I feed him say 125g of Turkey and 125g of Chicken for one meal, with 25g of beef liver? Is this okay? Should I do this?
How often should I really feed him fish? Twice a week? I think I would like to feed him a whole fish? Gilapia or Whiting Fillets are these a good choice? If not, what are some good choices? I’m trying my hardest to find Green Tripe in Australia but it’s proving difficult, I would like to add some veggies in his diet, which are the BEST? How often should I add them? I know I have to juice/blend them or else he won’t get the full benefit.

I am from Australia so I weigh things in grams and kgs
Is Kangaroo a good source of meat also? What about Kangaroo heart and liver?

Bear is going to puppy school today! I can say he will be the most handsome there

Here is a picture of my little guy 🙂

[Lilli]

Hi, I have a 12 year old Labrador who has a very sensitive stomach. Right now I feed him on commercial wet food and biscuit with some fresh vegetables. I have been wondering if he could take a raw food diet to enhance his latter years or would this be too much of a change at his age. He has never eaten raw meat and bones although he has had fresh raw vegetables.

[Ellen D]

Any raw feeders in the Detroit area or general southeast Michigan? Are you willing to share tips on where you get your meat? I have an order of exotic meats in from My Pet Carnivore, and I know we also have local delivery of Carnivore Carry-Out, but I don’t have the freezer space to buy cases of things yet – working on it (anyone want to go halfsies on cases??).

Does anyone have a good local butcher or market with decent prices where you can get things like goat, rabbit, lamb, etc. and offal and bones? I do shop Kroger for manager’s special meats, and I have found a local butcher who can get me beef and chicken parts. I’ve found an Asian market where I get duck feet and liver and pork kidneys. And there’s a halal market around the corner that sells goat liver. But I’d like to find some more variety and better prices.

Has anyone surfed Eastern Market or Gratiot Central Market? Any particular vendors to look for?

Thanks!

[Dori]

My three do best with a mix of some meals inclusive of bones and some not. As you know I rotate with every feeding.

[zcRiley]

A gluten-free diet is a diet that excludes gluten, a protein composite found in wheat and related grains, including barley and rye. ZiwiPeak doesn’t contain those. Only meat/organs/bones/mussels.

Their website, http://www.ziwipeak.com/, is very informative. Customer service is great, I’ve emailed with the founder of the family owned company.

I now feed my two pups on it and all chronic or sudden allergy symptoms disappeared in 3 days. If I didn’t see it, I swear, I wouldn’t have believed it.

[Ellen D]

Hi all –

I made 2 huge batches of dog food this weekend, and I wanted to consult with the experienced folk to be sure everything is balanced and I’m adding the right things.

First recipe:
-Meat mix – 50% chicken 50% beef. I bought whole chickens and cut them up. I ground the breasts without bones and then half of the wings, legs and necks bones and all, and I saved the backs and the rest of the wings and legs for RMBs which I feed 2-3 times a week. The beef was lean stew meat and some freezer burned steaks.
-Organ mix – Goat liver and kidneys. I couldn’t find any other organ meats aside from liver and kidney, so I’ll have to order some for the next batch.
-I did some maths and made sure I was using 10% bone, 5% liver, 5% kidney.
-Fruit/veg (makes up about 15-20% of the entire recipe) – banana, blueberry, pumpkin, carrots, zucchini, mango, and a handful of collard greens – all steamed and pureed.
-Herbs – turmeric, fennel, parsley, and mint.

The second recipe was exactly the same as the first except in place of the chicken and beef I used fish – whiting and mackeral with 2 cans of pink salmon with bones. I also added spinach to this one because I was making some for myself 🙂

Daily supplements – At breakfast, I mix in Dr. Harvey’s Formative Years supplement and a bit of coconut oil and at dinner I do the Grizzly salmon oil and Healthy Dogma Flee Flea Flee.

He also gets a can of sardines here and there and RMBs alternate between chicken backs, turkey necks when I can find them, goat chops sometimes. Just a couple times a week for chewing/teeth. I’d love to do more RMBs, but I don’t often have the time to give him completely undivided attention.

Am I missing anything?

[Lori M]

My 3 year old Husky had her first seizure last monday….my heart wouldn’t stop racing for 3 days…it was terrifying. After she had time to come out of it and rest for a couple of hours i took her to the vet. My vet did tell me that the first thing they tell people is to immediately stop the heartworm medications related to seizures and he listed (3), Iverheart, and either Trifexus or Comfortus and one other…i don’t remember which. Yancy was on Heartguard and he said that one was OK. I remember the Iverheart clearly because i had her on it for about a year, the year prior. I had tried it because of the price, it was quiet a bit cheeper. I’ve gone to a grain free, high protein dog food and started making my own puppy jerky in my dehydrator, in order to better manage what toxins make it in her body, but i’m still conflicked about bones…Any suggestions? I’m like a sponge now, this all very new and scary for me, so any and all comments are appreciated.

[Kandi S]

I did a search about prenatal vitamins and if men can take one as a daily multivitamin or not. I was surprised to read what types of vitamins a male vs a female human should and shouldn’t take, the differences in their amounts as well as their bad side affects according to gender and the importance of where our vitamins, minerals, etc… are derived from according to our gender. Then it struck me what about a male dog vs a female dog or any pet and should they be given a different intake of vitamins according to their gender? In male humans for example; some levels of vitamins and minerals as well as where they are derived from can cause everything from a higher risk of getting prostrate cancer to heart disease. The same for females that can suffer from weak bones to fetal birth defects if they don’t get enough Calcium or Foliate Acid. I was just wondering if anyone has considered this when reading their pet food labels and if they purchase different foods according to the sexes of their dog’s and other pets? Below is just an example of one of the articles I read about that states when choosing Omega 3’s in a human male diet to make sure it’s derived from fish oil and not flax seed oil because it has been shown to increase the risk of prostate cancer in men. So, if you own a male dog vs a female dog you might want to consider these facts even though this articles facts are according to human diets. Thanks!

Increased Risk of Prostate Cancer:
While most prenatal vitamins include only vitamins and essential minerals, some include omega supplements as well. Omega 3 is derived from flax oil and has been shown to increase the risk of prostate cancer in men. Omega 3 derived from fish oil, on the other hand, has been shown to inhibit prostate cancer, so it is important to determine what type of Omega 3 (if any) is in prenatal vitamins before taking them.
Read more : http://www.ehow.com/about_5042316_prenatal-vitamins-effects-men.html

[Ellen D]

InkedMarie – thanks for the suggestion. I have done some investigating into the company, and while I have good friends who feed BRB products to the dogs they breed (and are very pleased with the product), I am still on the fence about it. I was really just using it as an example. I am most likely going to order from My Pet Carnivore, since I can literally see one of their dropoff locations from my living room window. Very convenient. I’m just asking about how much I have to worry about the calcium/phosphorus if I’m using meat ground with bones and organs all together. I don’t want to ruin his joints.

[Ellen D]

I’m hoping there is a simple answer to this question. I have a very picky 15 week old labradoodle puppy. Right now, the only foods he will eat are Darwin’s raw beef recipe and my homemade food (following the Ottowa Valley Dog Whisperer recipe).

I’d like to get into 100% homemade, but I don’t have a meat grinder currently and would like to be sure of everything before I invest in one. I also don’t always have the time to sit and watch him eat his bones, so I’d like to have ground options for times when he doesn’t have my 100% undivided attention.

So, if I order chubs of pre-ground meats (such as Blue Ridge Beef, etc.) that has the correct ratio of meat to bone to organs, and mix that with my own fruit/vegetable and supplement blend (assuming I offer the correct supplements at correct dosages and add no additional calcium), then the inclusion of the ground bone should provide for the appropriate levels of calcium and phosphorus in the correct ratios, yes?

Last question – does any one have experience with Allprovide premade raw food? It looks to me like the puppy mix ha the appropriate ca:phosphorus ratio and has quality ingredients. It has 2.33g of calcium and 2.09g of phosphorus per 1,000kcal.

[pugmomsandy]

What do you feed them regularly? Kibble? Homemade? If you’re currently feeding them a balanced diet, then you can give raw meaty bones (RMB) or other unbalanced food for no more than 20% of their diet and not have to worry about balancing the diet out. If you feed twice a day then you can give 2.8 meals as unbalanced such as the chicken legs and thighs. Of course that depends on the size of your dog whether or not a drumstick or thigh is enough for one meal. I do feed raw bones thawed though.

[Anonymous]

Sometimes I buy the beef marrow bones. You can boil one bone for 3-4 hours and have about a gallon of beef broth, just skim the fat off of it the next day after it’s been in the fridg overnight. Then freeze it in smaller containers. I add the fatty cooked marrow to their food….it’s high in calories, but it’s an occasional treat.

I still let them chew on a frozen raw beef marrow bone about once a week, they love it, but be careful. They can break a tooth, and my poodle mix had stomach upset, had trouble digesting the ground up bone. They have to be supervised.