If feeding a meat/organ/bone/tripe grind I would say you’d be fine to feed 50/50 kibble and grind. You could do one meal of kibble and one meal of the grind. If you were to be feeding just meat, you’d want to be sure to keep it to 20% or less of the meal.
Wow patty those are big turkey necks! The necks I get from my supplier are only 6 – 8 oz. each.
The turkey necks I get from my butcher are about 1-1 1/2lbs also, but they cut them in half when they get them in, which is perfect for me to feed Bailey. I feed Bailey a half of a turkey neck along with gizzards and heart and/or liver.
I have my butcher cut off about 3 inches for Angel and cut the rest in half. One of them is a full meal for all 3 of mine.
I know someone locally that does Deer hunting and they grind their own meat and make sausage but I want to ask them if they can do Venison for me but just the meat and no bone because they do not grind the bone into their meat. Do you think this would be ok? My husband works with them and they said they kill around 60 deer a year. My dogs are loving the Venison from Hare Today so is this worth asking if we can get some from his Employee?
Also it is cheaper to buy 5lb rolls from Hare Today so that is the route we go and I just thaw and refreeze in individual air tight bags.
I found that for me the price difference didn’t make up for having to buy bags or the hassle of defrosting, dividing, repackaging, and refreezing.
Yes, the deer meat would be worth it, very well worth it. Organic, free range, people pay arms and legs for that stuff. You will need to add back the calcium and all that, but boy am I envious. That might make getting a premix worthwhile. Can you get the organs too?
I could ask them if they would save the organs for my mixes but normally they gut all the insides but being my hubby is boss man maybe they will do it just for me LOL. Won’t hurt to ask and I will have my hubby do just that.
It’d be worth asking – I’m sure they would save things like heart and liver for you anyways. However, I’d be hard to find someone willing to save the real goodies (i.e. the tripe, pancreas, spleen, etc.). When my dad got a deer last fall he told me I could have it and I asked if he could get me all the organs, glands and tripe and he told me if I wanted the tripe I’d have to go out to the woods and gut it myself. So I went out to the woods and gutted the deer myself. It really wasn’t that bad but then again I deal with extremely nasty and smell things on a daily basis for my job so there’s not much that grosses me out lol!
HDM…I have a question about collecting the tripe. Our family has 4 elk permits and our granddaughter has an elk and deer permit. God willing we will all harvest and I would like to save all the good parts of the gut but I have no idea how to collect the tripe!! Do you just cut the stomach open? LOL…my hubby said, “good luck with that and don’t even ask me to do it!” I have a fairly weak gag reflex so I’m sure I will probably puke when I do it but I’m willing to try!!
I’m not HDM, but…
When the deer/elk is being gutted, you want to seperate the stomach from the intestines as cleanly as possible. That means it is better to lose part of the stomach to keep any contamination from the inestines out of it. After you have the intestines removed, seperate the esophagus, then you can cut open the stomach and lightly rinse the insides. You can feed the esophagus, the trachea, lungs, heart, liver, kidneys, spleen, basically everything that comes out of there except the intestines.
Cut it open and squeeze it out. Use gloves – you may also want a gas mask. 🙂 Then just be sure to freeze it for a few weeks prior to feeding.
If you happen to live in one of the areas where chronic wasting disease (a prion disease similar to BSE in cows or scrapie in sheep) is prevalent in wild deer/elk/moose populations, as a precaution, you might want to avoid feeding (or eating yourself) these tissues- brain, spinal cord, eyes, spleen, tonsils, lymph nodes, no matter raw or cooked.
Its now spread to parts of at least 21 states and 2 Canadian provinces.
A quick question. I add a fair amount of fresh meat as topper to their kibble. The two pups are almost 1 year old and I was thinking to switch to raw. I guess they would probably need about 3.5% to% of their body weight in meat. Does it matter what meat you feed? With that I mean the weight including a bone or so. Although I am a very good cook, I would prefer to keep it simple by just cutting up the meat for them. All meat has roughly the same calorie content and I was going to add maybe 20% of veggies to the food, like peas, cucumber, carrots or apples. Any thoughts?
Are you saying you want to switch them to a boneless meat & veggie diet? Because meat & veggies is not a good diet for long term use. If you do just want to feed meat and veggies, then I would suggest the recipe book “Real Food for Healthy Dogs and Cats” by Karen Becker/Beth Taylor. It has boneless recipes (meats and organs) and gives you the amount of calcium supplement or bone meal to use along with a vitamin mix recipe. Your dog needs a source of calcium if you’re not feeding bones. Another option is to use a premix where you just have to add boneless meat and some oil like Urban Wolf, See Spot Live Longer, The Honest Kitchen, Grandma Lucy’s.
I have already written on different topics, but basically right now, what I really want to do is get started. I have read almost non-stop on this subject, ordered a couple books, but need to start a beginning program. Right now I have a 3 year old Sheltie who is on a Hills I/d diet (dry and wet) and will be getting my new Sheltie Pup next week who is being fed ProPlan Focus Puppy Chicken/rice, with Pedigree Wet chicken/beef. I want to get both of these dogs switched over to a much better diet, preferably raw or combination/mixture of that.
How can I get this started? Just by adding a little raw meat/organ meat/meaty bones a little at a time, with their current kibble? The puppy will be easier, I think, but the older one is on the Hills diet for a reason; must have as low fat as possible…..also has issues with sensitive stomach.
Please advise ASAP.
P.S. I ALREADY HAVE ABOUT A HALF BAG OF PRIMAL FROZEN NUGGETS (sardine and turkey formula) to finish using up so I thought I might just start back in mixing some in with the kibble for awhile. I had started this once, but then I had to go out of town for a bit, and decided to start back again later. It’s later, so I’m ready to begin again.
Nancy, if you buy the book “Unlocking the Canine Ancestral Diet,” there are some recipes in there for a high protein, balance low fat diet and also recipes to feed to a puppy. I would make them and then start adding a little bit each day to their current diet. My little one transitioned very quickly but I think that was because she is so picky and absolutely loves raw. Good luck!
Hi, I have a 12 year old Labrador who has a very sensitive stomach. Right now I feed him on commercial wet food and biscuit with some fresh vegetables. I have been wondering if he could take a raw food diet to enhance his latter years or would this be too much of a change at his age. He has never eaten raw meat and bones although he has had fresh raw vegetables.
I’m sure some of the “raw” regulars could answer your question better, but here is my experience. I started my older lab mix on raw when he was about 11. He didn’t really have any issues(a bit of loose stool at first) with it but since he had spent so many years eating “cooked” food he didn’t really like the raw unless I warmed it to a medium rare temperature. If your Lab is in good health, you could try it very slowly. If he has any immune compromised issues, I would probably not do raw. Another option is using a premix raw (The Honest Kitchen, Grandma Lucy’s, Sojos, etc) and adding fresh cooked meat to it. This might be an easier transition for him. I do this on a regular basis for my dogs in addition to rotating it with raw, and a canned/kibble mix.
Please please help…. I started my two German shorthaired pointers on raw on Friday. One can’t get enough of it, the other who has always eaten fine is totally upset with it. He went from Thursday until Saturday night not touching it (mince) with me putting it down for 30 and taking it back up until that meal he ate a little with a lot of coaxing… Sunday he ate a bit for breakfast and a tiny bit this evening with coaxing. He is very underweight so we need him to have proper nutrition hence switching him to raw from Orijen. Any cheaper food makes him Ill with allergies, orijen made him loose 5kg he didn’t have but allergies healed.
I’m so worried that
A he won’t start eating a full meal again
B he will loose more weight
C he won’t accept it ever
D he will get really ill
Please can you help?
I’ve read pages and pages of questions and answers. I’ve taken lots of notes but I still have a few questions.
I feed 2x daily — Earthborn Holistic. I want to switch to raw for the morning feeding. Giving that I need to feed 2.5-3% of body weight a day, I will be cutting that in half. Should I just give a chicken leg and a few hearts to equal the amount needed? My dogs all under 25 pounds so no matter what, the actual quantity won’t be much. Does anyone know the calorie count for chicken legs or thighs? What about turkey? I want bone in for their teeth.
I know this post is old, but my heart goes out to Cyndi and others like her who are looking for instructions on how to feed raw to their dogs. I have a FB group that teaches how to calculate 80/10/5/5 which is how much meat, bone, liver and secreting organs should be fed to each particular dog. People need more than general information. https://www.facebook.com/groups/LearningRawWithRoxane/
Hello, I’m new to feeding raw. I have a 12 week old German Shepherd. 27 lbs. Recently just switched from kibble to ground raw (60%-80% meat, 30% veg/organ, 10% bone). Should probably start raw meaty bones to increase his calcium & phosphorus intake. I’m quite nervous about it – worried about choking if he doesn’t chew it up thoroughly. Worried that it may get lodged in his intestines etc.. Can anyone suggest a few safest raw meaty bones he can try? I’m considering chicken back, chicken feet/wings, lamb ribs. Should my puppy swallow both the meat & bone? Any advice is much appreciated.
Some information here you may find helpful http://skeptvet.com/Blog/category/nutrition/
I have to speak up, as I ended up at the emergency vet with more than 1 dog, 2-3 times for issues related to “raw meaty bones” . GI blockages….even the finely ground up bone can turn into cement in their gut.
Your GSD is a large breed and you need to be extremely careful about how much calcium he is getting in his diet. Too much and he is at high risk for developmental orthopedic disorders. Not to mention if he is an AKC GSD I would be even more careful since they are now being bred to have a sloped roach back.
Raw diets are very difficult to balance without the help of a board certified veterinary nutritionist. I would highly recommend seeking out the help of one before continueing this diet.
You don’t need a certified veterinary nutritionist to feed a GSD. You just need to balance the dog’s food for the week or even for a month at the least not every meal needs to be balanced and complete. There are plenty of tools on the web that can help you.
Just look at our military dogs. Many GSD during rigorous puppy training and during deployment are fed table scraps to prepare them for the yeas ahead fighting overseas. Many turn out fine
You are correct in that many are bred for sloach back which I find to be in humane but I am hoping Julia has gotten her GSD from a breeder who cares about GSDs and gotten herself a working proper GSD with no excessive sloped roach back
- This reply was modified 3 years, 7 months ago by Cannoli.
Julia J you do not need a nutritionist to feed your GSD. Please join my Facebook group Learning Raw With Roxane. It’s free and you will learn how to properly feed raw. I have an 8.5 year old GSD and members with GSD’s including one with a GSD puppy who is growing fine feeding raw. We have MANY members with large breed puppies. I teach Prey Model Raw Diet 80/10/5/5. Come learn HOW to feed raw and what raw meaty bones are safe. You can learn about weight bearing bones, their risks and so much more helpful information. Here is the link to my closed group. Request to join….it’s free. https://www.facebook.com/groups/LearningRawWithRoxane/
Over 200 raw and home cooked recipes found over the Internet were tested for nutritional adequacy and only about 8 or 9 were not nutritionally deficient. Those 8 or 9 were all recipes made by boarded veterinary nutritionists. I personally would not take a chance on my dogs health by following the recipes on a Facebook page written by someone who may or may not have a background in canine nutrition, but that’s just me.
Pitlove: Can you show proof to support what you’ve posted or are you posting hearsay? Who tested these diets? The AAFCO? The AAFCO likes to see food fortified before they give their stamp of approval and if they don’t see it fortified, they say it is deficient. And what dog food do you feed? Kibble? Kibble is worthless nutrition and that is why it needs added vitamins and minerals. If you want to do research, google what is in dry dog food or how dry dog food is made. That will be a real eye opener for you. Kibble is not species appropriate and is not healthy for dogs. I have been feeding my 8.5 year old GSD Prey Model Raw Diet for years and he is healthy 100%. Thousands of people are feeding complete and balanced raw diets to their pets. There might be some people who do not feed raw correctly, but that is because they lack knowledge and support. Personally, I don’t think kibble feeders are feeding their dog’s correctly. I teach how to feed raw properly. PMRD 80/10/5/5 guidelines are balanced and complete. BARF and PMRD are live foods with all their natural nutrients. Nothing is better for dogs. Raw dogs are beautiful and very healthy. You are taking a chance on your dog’s health if you are feeding kibble or anything other than raw.
Thanks Cannoli and Rox B. Will keep researching and learning and adjusting.
Hope this helps, it appears that the poster that asked the most recent question regarding raw diets has their mind made up already, but maybe someone else will appreciate this science-based veterinary blog, I find the comments very informative too.
I was listening to the homeopathic vets for a while, but I can no longer believe them, for the most part.
The latest SkeptVet blog, I’m listening to the podcast now!
Indeed raw foods do contain bacteria, but luckily our dogs are carnivores which is why they can eat bacteria laden foods and thrive. We humans just need to wash up afterwards just like we do when we prepare our own meat meals for dinner. The article is written by Vets that do not support raw feeding, so what they say is biased and untrue. There is evidence to support that raw is better than cooked and kibble. I know thousands of raw feeders that will attest to it.
Hi Rox B-
The independent study was done by 4 veterinarians at UC Davis, School of Veterinary Medicine.
Here is a link to a discussion of the study: https://www.ucdavis.edu/news/homemade-dog-food-recipes-can-be-risky-business-study-finds
Thank you pitlove: I have fed raw long enough to tell you that conventional vets do not approve of raw feeding. Veterinary schools like UC Davis have nutrition classes taught and sponsored by Hills dog food the makers of Science Diet and many other unhealthy kibbles. Vets receive kickbacks and incentives from kibble companies, mainly Hills. This is why you see these kibbles sold in most vet offices. I interact with thousands of raw feeders. Too bad these 4 vets didn’t research and report on our success feeding raw.
Hi Rox B-
I’ve heard that same song many times before. I am well aware of the way that raw feeders look down upon allopathic vet’s. I however, intern at a vet’s office and see quite a different picture than what you see. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
Pitlove: I had and intern from a vet’s office join my raw group. She was looking to learn raw since her dog was experiencing Cushings symptoms from taking steroids for 4 years as a treatment for allergies. I don’t know anyone feeding raw whose dog takes steroids for allergies. Thousands of people are getting great results from feeding raw. An article by 4 vets is not going to change that.
“She was looking to learn raw since her dog was experiencing Cushings symptoms from taking steroids for 4 years as a treatment for allergies”.
That is why it is best to consult a specialist/dermatologist if the allergy symptoms have been going on for more than 1 year/4 seasons without any significant periods of relief despite treatments from the regular veterinarian.
Prednisone is usually ordered to stop the suffering caused by excessive scratching/pruritus. It is a temporary fix. Most likely the allergies are environmental and have nothing to do with the diet, that was my experience.
A lot of folks refuse to consider going to a specialist because of the cost……therefore the regular vet has no choice but to continue to treat the symptoms.
My dog enjoys seeing her dermatologist, since she is stable we only go once a year.
PS: She can eat a variety of foods, chicken included, cooked of course!
My senior dog gets constipated if he doesn’t have water soaked kibble (Nutrisca) everyday.
- This reply was modified 3 years, 7 months ago by anonymously.
Thanks anonymously variety is the key to life. Some people believe that dogs should only be fed kibble or raw. But both camps are wrong. Variety is the key to a healthy and happy dog
I feed crush ground eggs shells or calcium seaweed. I like to rotate my calcium source and not just bones. When I feed bones I groundd them up
Hi all- cyndi I have learned so much from the questions you have asked and the answers these kind people have given you. I too need a step by step guideline to follow.
I have 2 Danes one in which is extremely hard to keep weight on I feed Victor and grain free mixed but am wanting to switch to raw for various reasons poop, health, weight gain and life span. Although I love both my dogs my male the younger of the two has imprinted with me sort of speak. We are inseparable if I cough or laugh he is up and sniffing my face to make sure I’m ok. It’s unreal the bond we have and I want him for as long as humanly possible. My girl is stout healthy and highly energetic doesn’t keep still long enough to love on her except for bedtime lol
Anyways thanks for all of your input it has answered lots of questions I’ve taken notes googles a wholesale place to order.
Will be starting soon want to research just. Tad more
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