[Dave & Linda M]

Gee whiz, good to read this forum; we are new to dogadvisor and after reading up, we switched from a Purina One SmartBlend (which our 40 lb 3 yr old but wonderful mutt) didnt seem to like…to a Merrick Turkey/sweet potato dry food, supplemented with Evangers beef & bacon. Holy moly – big poops is right. A case of vomiting (one). Sounds familiar. Switched to cooked ground turkey with generous pumpkin added, and that seems to have stabilized things. Smaller (much!) poops, But now what? More than half a big bag of Merricks left. Try to introduce it again slowly …or try…what?

[anonymous]

I think prescription food/therapeutic diet would be best, as your vet has recommended.
Otherwise, ask your vet if this will meet your criteria?
https://www.k9ofmine.com/best-low-sodium-dog-food/ excerpt below
Purina Pro Plan Focus Sensitive Skin & Stomach Salmon & Rice Formula
About: Pro Plan Focus is a salmon-and-rice-based recipe that is designed for dogs with stomach sensitivities or food allergies. Salmon and rice are typically not allergens and most dogs are able to digest this food easily.
Price: $$
Features:
Salmon is the first listed ingredient.
Made with antioxidant-rich ingredients to help promote immune system function
Fortified with omega fatty acids to ensure joint, skin and coat health
Made without any artificial colors, artificial flavors, corn, wheat or soy
PROS: Purina Pro Plan Focus has the least sodium per calorie of any of the five foods recommended here. Most dogs appear to love the taste, and it may also provide some relief from food allergies.
CONS: Additionally, Pro Plan is made without any probiotics to help regulate intestinal function; however, it does include prebiotic ingredients, which can help support any beneficial bacteria already present in your dog’s digestive tract.
Ingredients:
Salmon, Canola Meal, Brewers Rice, Barley, Oat Meal, Fish Meal (Source of Glucosamine), Animal Fat Preserved with Mixed-Tocopherols, Salmon Meal, Dried Egg Product, Brewers Dried Yeast, Natural Flavor, Inulin, Fish Oil, Salt, Vitamin E Supplement, Potassium Chloride, Zinc Sulfate, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (Source of Vitamin C), Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Niacin, Vitamin A Supplement, Copper Sulfate, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Riboflavin Supplement, Calcium Iodate, Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (Source of Vitamin K Activity), Folic Acid, Biotin, Sodium Selenite. J-4449.
Sodium Content:
50 milligrams / 100 Calories

[Jenna]

i am sorry to hear about your pup. I don’t think you have enough information as this point. Generally speaking liver diets are reduced protein, but Beddlingtons are prone to copper storage issues, and often a reduction of copper helps. “In many cases, elevation of liver enzymes alone does not warrant a dietary change. In some instances, if the liver enzymes are consistently elevated, the pet may benefit from supplemental antioxidants. Liver cells may be partially protected from further damage when additional antioxidant precursors or antioxidants beyond those found in the diet are given. Some veterinary nutritionists and veterinarians recommend supplementation with Vitamin E, Vitamin C, Sadenosyl-
methionine (SAMe) and/or silymarin (Milk Thistle), but it is important to note that the
exact mechanism of action, dosing and efficacy of these supplements are still under
investigation.” http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/vmth/small_animal/nutrition/client_info_sheets/encephalopathy.cfm
This is really a conversation with your vet, based on the diagnosis.

[Cannoli]

I used to order from them but the ground bone caused major constipation issues for my dog. So I turned to powder calcium supplements. My dog is just one of those dogs who has issues digesting ground bones

[Tyrionthebiscuit]

I have several customers who swear by Under the Sun Whitefish for anal gland problems. My own dog did well on Canidae Pure before I switched him to raw, and he consistently had anal gland problems at the foster’s house while being fed Earthborn. I’ve also heard of good results with people using Super Snouts balance GI or NaturVet No Scoot as a supplement.

[HoundMusic]

“She is currently on Nature’s Recipe Grain Free kibble and since I switched her to grain-free a few months ago her mood dramatically increased and she has so much more energy so I want to keep grain free.”

Of course she has more energy! Amino acids are a main source of energy for the body. Grain free foods normally contain extreme amounts of protein that would not even be necessary for a working dog or brood bitch, so the dog is obviously going to have more energy to burn. That, however, does not necessarily equate to better health.

If I am not mistaken, struvite stones form in an acidic urine, so Vitamin C supplements and a high meat diet are the last things you want to give this dog, because both contribute to higher urine acidity; whereas grains and other complex carbs tend to lower the acidity. Another problem of grain free feeds is the high mineral content, which can contribute to kidney/urinary problems in susceptible dogs.

My advice would be to temporarily use one of the prescription diets. Forget the ingredients. It is the quality, bioavailability and nutritional content of a feed that truly matters. Then find something you are comfortable feeding that has around 24-26% protein, and that should give you a very equal balance of grains to meat. That alone will naturally lower the dog’s urine acidity and hopefully prevent recurrence.

[Rose C]

Marie, everything I’ve read from various vet websites, especially holistic vets, mention Lysimachia 3. My order comes this week. I also added probiotics and canned pumpkin to my dog’s diet. The most difficult thing is finding canned food with no sweet potatoes, carrots or spinach in them. I may just buy Core 95% chicken and broccoli and supplement with some frozen peas and other food items from the oxalate free foods list I have.

How did you figure out how much to Lysimachia to give your dog?
Rose

[Samantha W]

Hello,
I use Solid Gold Berry Balance. It is available in a powder or soft chew. I also recommend Canine Caviar which is Alkaline balanced. They have kibble and canned food and treats. Both Solid Gold and Canine Caviar are available on Chewy.com or from independent pet retailers. I see a holistic vet and she recommended the berry supplement.

• This reply was modified 8 years ago by Samantha W.
• This reply was modified 8 years ago by Samantha W.

[Susan]

Hi Margaret,
my boy just turned 9 a few weeks ago & about 5-6 months ago I started using a heat wheat pack you put in microwave for 1-2 mins, he has a weird spiral thin bone with nerve endings from his spine growing out of the top of his left back leg, the vets working that day said they have never seen anything like it before, we found it by accident when he had a xray for stones blockage, he doesnt seem to have any arthritis but after he wees & poos he kicks his back legs sometimes & then that’s only when he starts his limping & walks very slowly, I’ve been telling him “No Kick” after he poo’s & he’s been better…I see a Phsiotherapist fortnightly & he puts a heat pack on my lower back & neck/shoulders for about 20mins then I have a gentle massage & what a difference this makes also stretching excerises really help as well, so I started applying a heat pack to Patches left leg lower back side after he limps home, then I give him a very gentle massage & I do streching exicises to his back legs while he’s laying on his side, he’s been doing really well since I started doing Physiotherapy on him it’s made a big diffence & he’s been doing really well lately & he hasn’t been walking home slowly anymore…
Ask your vet if he knows someone that does “dog physio” also swimming is really good for stiff bones & sore joints can you take him to a doggy heated pool, my Patch was presribed Gabapentin for his IBD pain & this weird spiral bone when vet found it, the Gabapentin made him sleep I don’t like giving him any drugs or joint supplements he has IBD/stomach & reacts to alot of things plus I don’t know if the Gabapentin helped his lower back, I think the heat pack & massage helped more….I feed him a diet high in Omega 3 foods, he gets tin salmon in spring water drained with boiled potato for lunch + 2 Green Lipped Mussels they’re “K-9 Natural” freezed dried mussels + 3 Almonds a day as a treat, he acts & runs like a puppy, you’d never know he’s 9yrs old & has a few health problems when you met him…

[Rose C]

Hi Susan and Robyn,
What I don’t like about Hills or even Royal Canin SO is they have cheap filler ingredients and stuff that sound like food, but isn’t: CORN STARCH, Chicken Liver FLAVOR? And water as a 1st ingredient??? You can add water. This stuff is too expensive for what’s in it.
>>Water, Chicken, Pork Liver, Carrots, Rice, Green Peas, Corn Starch, Chicken Liver Flavor, Powdered Cellulose, Soybean Oil, Potassium Alginate, Wheat Gluten, Calcium Chloride, Guar Gum, Dicalcium Phosphate, Flaxseed, <<
My toy poddle has oxalate crystals in his bladder. I’m feeding him chicken and oatbran with some canned pumkin and powdered pre/probiotics. I want to buy some powdered calcium citrate and frozen peas. And basically supplement what I give him with foods on the low oxalate group. Dogaware.com lists much of what I’m saying. http://dogaware.com/articles/wdjcalciumoxalates.html

[anonymous]

https://www.pawdiet.com/reviews/royal-canin-veterinary-diet-canine-ultamino-dry-dog-food-dry-dog-food/ (Excerpt below)
This product is manufactured by Mars Petcare Inc..
According to our data, this Royal Canin recipe provides complete & balanced nutrition for the maintenance of adult dogs. In other words, this formula is AAFCO approved.
Unlike other AAFCO approved dog foods which rely in laboratory testing to substantiate nutritional adequacy, this recipe has undergone feeding trials. In the pet food industry, feeding trials are often considered to be the superior testing method.
Animal feeding tests using AAFCO procedures substantiate that Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Canine Ultamino provides complete and balanced nutrition for the maintenance of adult dogs.
Ingredient Review
We’ll begin this review of Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Canine Ultamino with a detailed discussion of the ingredients.
The first ingredient is corn starch. Corn starch is derived from the endosperm of the corn kernel. Typically, corn starch is used as a binder in kibble.
The second ingredient is hydrolyzed poultry by-products aggregate. Hydrolyzed poultry by-products aggregate is basically highly processed “feather meal.” The source is subjected to a process called hydrolysis. In this process, the protein source is broken down to the amino acid level. This is done to increase the digestibility of the protein.
The third ingredient is coconut oil. Coconut oil is an excellent source of medium chain fatty acids (MCFA) which are easier to digest and believed to promote skin and coat health.
The fourth ingredient is soybean oil. Soybean oil is an omega-6 fatty acid source. Unlike other oils (flax, canola, etc), soybean oil does not provide omega-3 fatty acids; However, the balancing omega-3 fatty acids are most likely supplied by another oil or fat source in the product.
The fifth ingredient is natural flavor. Unlike artificial flavoring, natural flavoring is produced using plants and/or animal parts.
Because ingredients are listed in order of pre-cooked weight, the remaining ingredients in Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Canine Ultamino are not as important as the first five ingredients.
However, collectively they still have a significant impact on the overall quality of the product. Therefore, we’ll continue discussing the remaining ingredients in this Royal Canin recipe.
Next we have potassium phosphate. Potassium phosphate is a common additive used in processed foods to control acidity and moisture.
The next ingredient is powdered cellulose. Powdered cellulose is produced from minuscule pieces of wood pulp and plant fibers. Other than its fiber content, powdered cellulose lacks any nutritional contribution.
Then we have calcium carbonate. Calcium carbonate is a naturally occurring mineral supplement. Although it’s often used as a dietary calcium supplement, it can also be used as a preservative or color retainer.
The remaining ingredients in this Royal Canin Veterinary Diet recipe are unlikely to affect the overall rating of the product.

[Susan]

Hi Deborah M,
I really understand how you’re feeling & I know what you’re going thru, I took on this dog & I was just his foster carer, I had to take him to vet get him desexed vaccinated meds for all his sores that were around his neck & legs from being tied up then he has his photo put on the Rescue site & adopted out, his name was Patch & he just turned 4yr old in very bad condition, I’ve never seen a rescue dog this bad before I think he wasnt Put To Sleep cause he became the pound favorite, there’s always a few pound favorites, the people who work or volunteer at the pound do everything to get them a home or into rescue before their kill day so they called me (cause they know I love Staffys) to fix him all up & adopt him out but as the days went by he was weeing blood, so off to see the rescue vet, she said looks like he was being used for breeding, so he gets put on vet diet for 6 weeks to dissolve his crystals then he is diagnosed with IBD & Helicobacter-Pylori, Skin Allergies & Food Sensitivities, In the end I adopted him myself, I felt all the people that came out to meet & greet him weren’t listening to me when I said “but he’s sick, he has a few health problems” they’d all say, “Oh he seems fine he’s really happy, he doesnt look sick”, I couldnt handle not knowing whoever adopts him would they continue with his meds etc or would they just give up on him like his old owners did & surrender him back to a pound & he’ll continue to suffer, he just turned 9yrs old last week & it’s been a very hard 5 yrs & the money I’ve spent trying to fix Patch, I even stopped doing rescue for a few years when he was real bad & sick, I couldn’t leave him at home while I was out helping other dogs all day & worrying about him, he does not do well on ANY vet diets they give him bad acid reflux, make his skin itch & smell yeasty cause he has food sensitivities to some grains, gluten corm/maize & beet pulp, he can NOT have any Beet Pulp he gets bad acid reflux, all these things that are suppose to fix & help his stomach & bowel make Patch worse, then finally I started looking for other diets beside these vet diets & FINALLY after trying a few kibbles, I found “Taste Of The Wild” Sierra Mountain, Roasted Lamb dry kibble, people in the IBD & EPI face book groups were saying how well their dogs were doing on TOTW Sierra Mountain or TOTW Pacific Stream both are lower in fiber & TOTW uses Purified water, the Sierra Mountain formula just has 1 single meat protein Lamb, has Sweet Potatoes, Potatoes, that firm his poo’s up & his acid reflux stopped & his skin all cleared up, cause he wasn’t eating a diet that had ingredients he was sensitive too but he still get his seasonal environment allergies in Spring/Summer so I have to bathed him weekly in Spring/Summer in “Malaseb” medicated shampoo to wash off any allergens on his paws & skin, the Malaseb shampoo realives & stops his itchy skin…. I’ve never found a kibble that helped most of his health problems all at once, a few years ago I started rotating his kibbles between a few different brands kibbles he does well on, I was feeding the Lamb TOTW thru the winter months then a Salmon fish kibble thru the Spring/Summer months but then I seen 2 studies a company thet test dog foods for 130 metals toxins & contaminates alot of these fish kibbles were very high in toxins, so now I prefer to add a tin salmon to his diet instead, for breakfast he gets his TOTW, lunch time he either gets a small cooked meal with 1 spoon salmon or 1/3 cup of “Canidae Pure Meadow”or an Australian salmon kibble, then dinner time he gets his TOTW Lamb again then he gets another small meal 1/3 a cup 8pm so he doesnt wake up early hours of the morning with acid reflux, whenever I try something new if it says add 1 teaspoon then I only add 1/8th a teaspoon & slowley introduce to his diet, I’ve learnt I ned to slowly add any new supplements or kibbles to his diet or I’m up 12am, 3am 5am & poor Patch has diarrhea….

I found Homeopathy, natural healthy foods works the best for Patch & other sick rescue dogs I’ve helped over the years, you’ll be surprised how feeding a simple bland lean cooked meal like turkey, tin Salmon or chicken breast, lean beef, I feed lean pork mince or lean beef mince I make rissoles with boiled Sweet Potato or boiled potato can make a big difference & is heaps better then these dry kibbles, then I slowly start adding 1 teaspoon of tin Salmon in spring water to the cooked meal, just feed 1 small cooked meal & still feed his normal limited ingredient dry kibble for his other meals or if he’s eating a cooked meal already start buying tin Salmon in spring water then drain water put in air tight container & add teaspoon of salmon to the cooked meals, I also buy “K-9 Natural green lipped mussels freeze dried & Patch started with just 1 mussel as a treat around 11am daily now he gets 2 mussels as a treat daily, Mussels are very healthy & help balance their diet,
here’s a link on Mussels https://drsarahbrewer.com/supplements/green-lipped-mussels-health-benefits
are you following “Rodney Habib”on his face book page, he has really good info also follow “Judy Morgan DVM” https://www.facebook.com/JudyMorganDVM/ click on her Video link look for her “Pancreatitis Diet” & her “IBD IBS Diet” video’s, you can leave out the ingredients you dont want to feed & what I did was just start with 1 lean meat protein mince grounded meat & 1 carb then after I saw Patch was OK I started to add 1 new ingredient egg, then another new ingredient broccoli etc, I make 1/2 cup size rissole balls & bake in oven & boil sweet potatos & freeze in sections & take out the day before, Judy has a 16 yr old dog called Scout, he has a few health problems, she cooks for him & her other sick elderly dogs, Judy shows you how to balance the diet with healthy ingredients, I don’t bother balancing every single meal, I just make sure he’s getting his Omega 3 fatty acids for his skin & stomach, the Dinovite would be very high in Omega’s for the dogs skin my Patch can’t take fish oil or fish oil in kibbles he gets bad acid reflux, so I supplement his omega fatty acids thru foods instead, I add salmon, freeze dried mussels, roasted Almonds a treats I bite & eat 1/2 a almond & Patch gets the other 1/2 of the almond just start off slowly just give 1/2 a almond for 1 week see how he goes, they need 3 almonds a day, read the link I posted above, the health benefits from freeze dried mussels for skin, stomach, joints, brain etc

Have you tried “4Health” Special Care, Sensitive Skin, it has Hydrolyzed Salmon or
“4Health” Special Care, Sensitive Stomach it has just Potato & Egg as only ingredients 4health is sold at Tractor Supply shops only, it’s worth trying a small bag & ask is it money back guaranted if my dog wont eat it?? I always just say Patch wont eat a kibble when he gets his diarrhea & I need to take back the kibble its easier….
You know your dog best so do what you feel will works best for your boy… Good Luck

[GSDsForever]

Wow, lot of sharply divergent information, strong opinions, values, and emotions in this thread!

I really feel for you Deborah. I can tell 100% that you love your dog very much, have been through and still are going through a lot, want and try to to the right thing — and wish to be respectful of your vet and others here & elsewhere.

If I met you in person, I’d really love to sit down and just talk it through supportively.

There’s so much in this thread to comment on. I’m going to presume, benefit of the doubt, that even where we disagree, that all here intend to be respectful and are motivated by sincere belief that they are giving you the best advice for your dog to be well. I wish to do the same.

1)I don’t like/believe in/recommend Dynovite. I just don’t think it’s this amazing product or expenditure to accomplish what you/others want. I think it’s a gimmicky & an overhyped, overpriced product that is very trendy, convenient, readily available, & well-marketed to take advantage of people and their pets.

I would eliminate it and start from scratch with a quality food. Supplement as needed.

2)Royal Canin Ultamino — aka the hydrolyzed bird feathers food

I 100% hear you & support you, agree with not wanting to feed this food. That SHOULD be okay. Honestly. Why? Because there absolutely are alternatives to it and the science/feeding strategy behind it is NOT unique on the market.

Here’s the thing: a diet of hydrolyzed protein + very limited other ingredients, starch (no protein allergen), pure fats IS hypoallergenic, meaning LESS likely to trigger allergic food responses and/or food intolerance reactions. So that *type* of diet recommendation from a vet is a valid one.

That said, THERE IS NOTHING SPECIAL OR NECESSARY OR BENEFICIAL about feeding specifically bird feathers or “poultry byproducts aggregate” as the protein source. It’s the hydrolyzed aspect of the protein ingredient that is key to hypoallergenic status. If your vet did not explain it well to you, food allergens are proteins, and a hydrolyzed ingredient has the protein (the allergen) broken down into much smaller components that are less likely to trigger the body’s recognition of the ingredient and allergic response.

Other hydrolyzed diets, besides this one, may be fed. Other equally good options for feeding allergic dogs include limited protein, limited ingredient diets that exclude what your dog is allergic to if that is known or strongly suspected.

Sometimes this is rather simple. In a dog that has eaten the same diet of chicken its whole life, for example, merely switching to a fish based food can work. When a variety of foods have been fed, with no relief/allergies continued, a novel protein limited ingredient diet is fed. “Novel” here simply means whatever YOUR dog has not had before, not anyone else’s. It is critical here that the diet you select has pristine quality control, takes rigorous steps in manufacturing or home preparation, to avoid cross-contaminating the diet with ingredients not listed on the label. Especially when it is not known what all your dog has been exposed to and may be allergic to, it may be best to to avoid the current known top allergens for dogs: chicken, beef, eggs, dairy, soy, wheat, corn — and now also fish, lamb (after these have become no longer “alternative” foods but commonplace to feed). For dogs that have been exposed to everything under the sun, a really unusual protein can be used (e.g. kangaroo, if elk/venison has been fed).

A word of caution regarding OTC kibbles, cans, dehydrated/etc. products: In an OTC product vs alternatives of vet prescription commercial diets or homemade, you need to do your homework — research the food and ask pointed questions of the manufacturer and consider the actual plant that makes the food. Most people don’t do this, aren’t aware of the problem (trust the label too much) and many OTC commercial foods, including so-called limited ingredient diets, fail such cross-contamination quality control and therefore fail to provide relief (because the allergen is still being fed but not listed on the label). For a severely and genuinely allergic dog, this can be a nightmare — as tiny amounts can trigger the allergic response.

I do find it odd — and perhaps I am missing something here — that your vet is proposing and insisting (as you say) upon this one food. That doesn’t make sense to me — not on any scientific, research & evidence, best practices basis — purely from what you’ve said here.

What if this food stopped being manufactured tomorrow? What if it were recalled and therefore could not be recommended (temporarily)? What if your dog hated it and refused to eat it?

Surely there are other foods you could purchase to accomplish the medical goals here. Surely you could also feed an appropriate homemade/home prepared diet. This leads me to my next part . . . .

3)Vet-Client Relationship and Recommendations

A good veterinarian-client relationship is one of mutual respect and two-way dialogue. That dialogue includes both sides considering and addressing what the other is saying. Both sides may raise valid points that are worthy of consideration, understanding, discussion.

This means mutually asking and answering questions as necessary and respectfully, patiently making decisions TOGETHER in the best interest of the dog. Basing decisions upon careful consideration of facts and evidence, where things are explained and understood, still involves two way discussion. Some respect for the *values* of the pet owner, should be accorded by one’s vet, not to mention any actual fact based knowledge that a pet owner may have.

As an example, I have expressed to my vet(s) that, aside from concerns about ingredient/formulation quality, I am not comfortable on ethical grounds (including documented animal cruelty discovered in feeding trials) in supporting a particular major dog food manufacturer. Both vets (over the years) I expressed this to were very respectful and open to alternatives selected together. One vet shared that she did not know about the issue and asked me further about it because it disturbed her too. (Vets are busy and, like all people, don’t hear about/read everything and miss things.)

Similarly, my vet and I *discussed*, *considered* Apoquel (which you said you use) and Atopica for severe, unrelenting allergies and I ultimately rejected both after researching them. He was fully respectful of that. He never was pushy about either or any other course of action proposed. Later, when Cytopoint was recommended, I did choose to use this (again based on my research and discussion with the vet/vet staff) and have had great results.

I appreciate that you like your vet otherwise, find her to be “nice.” But it sounds like more two-way discussion should be happening and alternatives considered.

Conversely, as with human doctors, I strongly believe it is important that people see a vet that they trust — and then proceed to trust in what they say. By this I mean not that clients simply blindly and without discussion automatically do every single thing that their vet suggests or recommends, but that they seriously consider and respectfully attend to their recommendations, ask questions, try to understand, and reach good decisions TOGETHER. It’s a better course of action to propose major changes to one’s vet first, consider what she has to say & discuss, then take action than the other way around.

If a client cannot trust her vet (or human doctor) or cannot have full, open discussion with them, then why would that client see that vet (or human doctor). And yet I know many people who do exactly this — and it is probably a frustrating experience for both sides.

I see this come up, with dog owners I talk to, with vaccination schedules, heartworm prevention, and diet (including especially raw or homemade diets). And yet all of those topics are important and ones I expect to be able to discuss openly with my vet in full — and I do. If I can do it, you can do it.

Without being there, since you like your vet, it sounds to me *possibly* that either more time needs to be spent with you on this topic or you might need to be more assertive, vocal yourself and ask questions — ask why just this food, what are alternatives, what about this or that food (why or why not), what about a trial on a different one, what about a homemade vet supervised diet (using a consult service w/veterinary nutritionist if necessary), and be just as persistent as she has been. Get the answers you need to make the best decision for your pet, based on multiple options and good information.

***IF*** you’re just going to your vet because she’s close by, out of habit/length of time seeing her with your pet and hesitant/uncomfortable leaving her for a new one, because she’s “nice” (even caring), but are NOT ultimately getting what you need from her medically — are not able to have a full & open discussion with her, have all your questions & concerns addressed, receive alternatives and options — then I would see a different vet.

4)If your dog has more food intolerances, GI reactions to overall formulations, like too rich, etc., a sensitive digestive system more so than actual allergies, then there are foods very good for that that I would explore. These differ somewhat from strict allergy diets. Was your dog diagnosed with allergies or just sensitive tummy/touchy digestive system or food intolerances? Was a specialist consulted by your vet?

Some foods appropriate to sensitive digestive systems are just bland and very moderate, conservative in overall nutrition profile/guaranteed analysis, and low residue (meaning highly digested and low poop).

I’ve known people to switch from diets marketed explicitly for this purpose, prescribed even, to Fromm’s (and Fromm is a great company, with an excellent longterm record of quality control) Whitefish formula and it’s been exceptionally well tolerated by their dogs. It’s bland, not rich, and has quality ingredients. That’s just one example. There are other choices. Wellness Simple and Nutrisource come to mind, also Go! Sensitivity and Shine.

5)Homemade diets

If this interests you, your vet should be helping you and supportive, as it can be done.

Your vet should be able to provide a free, published balanced diet appropriate to your dog’s needs/condition, minimally consult (sometimes this is free) with a specialist colleague, OR full blown consult (for a fee) or outright refer you to go see a specialist in nutrition who will design you a diet or multiple meals you can safely feed.

Similarly, regarding that itchy skin/allergies, your vet can consult and discuss a case — often for free — with a veterinary dermatologist (specialist) or outright refer you to see one. Has your vet done this? If not, why not? If you have reached the point that you are trying so many diets, things, experienced such a range of symptoms over time, dog taking Apoquel, your vet insisting upon RC Ultamino now, consulting/referral would conform to best practices.

If money is really tight and you don’t have dog insurance (or coverage), there are both free board certified veterinary nutritionist/other credentialed authored single diets available on the web as well as one entire book of therapeutic veterinary diets (from UC Davis) now freely available on the web.

Personally, if you want to go the route of an actual veterinary nutritionist helping your dog, I would recommend (for many reasons) a long distance consult with board certified veterinary nutritionist Susan Wynn (unless you are in Atlanta, in which case you can see her in person). It’s about $300. She will consult with generalist vets long distance, which not all veterinary nutritionists will do.

• This reply was modified 8 years ago by GSDsForever.

[Lori H]

Hi Deborah,

My dog Buddy has been through a lot, much like your dog. He just turned 10 and during his life he has had surgery on his spleen, surgery for bladder stones, been diagnosed with Diabetes and I was told by my vet that he was suffering from liver failure and was preparing me for the fact that Buddy was going to die. The liver failure diagnosis was 6 months ago and today, he is healthy, happy, looks amazing and has so much energy.

I now believe wholeheartedly that most vets know nothing about nutrition. They are told to carry a line of food in their offices by one of the large pharma/dog food companies because most of these companies go out and recruit at the vet universities across the United States when vets are in school and provide them with a kickback when the sell either Science Diet or Royal Canin in their clinics, up to 40%. Don’t get me wrong, I LOVE my vet, I just don’t believe he knows much of anything about nutrition. He has been great to me, my dog Buddy and my three cats. He is good at what he does, diagnose and perform much needed surgeries and procedures. He did Buddy’s bladder stone surgery which has complications.

I was at my wits end as well and thought that I was going to lose Buddy, but I was not willing to give up so I did a Google search and found an amazing person who brought Buddy back to the healthy dog he is.

Buddy is on a very special diet and he has made huge strides in the last 6+ months. He is a very healthy dog to what he was 6 months ago.

I worked with a man named Rick Scheyer. He has an amazing website http://www.doglivershunt.com He has helped many dogs with liver shunt, kidney disease, bladder stone problems and much, much more become healthy dogs again. I would suggest reaching out to him for a free consultation.

If you choose to go with his program, it is not cheap, but I believe that over time, I will save money by not taking Buddy to the vet time and time again because I don’t know what is wrong and having a battery of tests run and racking up bills in the thousands, I have been there!

He was slowly weened off of his processed food Science Diet U/D and placed on a diet of fresh veggies and meat based on a very slow transition to follow with Rick’s help.

Buddy’s diet is a balance of ¾ veggies to ¼ meats. Dogs with liver issues do not need as much protein as you would expect. He gets lots of yellow veggies (squash, tomatoes, peppers, cucumber, celery, carrots, Brussel sprouts, snap peas, etc.) along with hemp oil and nori blended with goat yogurt into almost a smoothie consistency. I then add meats, liver is great as it helps to detoxify the liver (funny that you feed liver to a dog with liver issuesJ) and then he gets a variety of supplements. He receives three gut supplements in the morning (Acidophilus, Bifudus and a Spectrabiotic) along with an Enzyme and something called Whole Body. In the evenings he gets the Enzyme, Whole Body and a Mushroom supplement. The process to make his food is not that time consuming and if you are at your wits end like I was, I was ready to do anything.

He also gets to have as much goat yogurt as he wants with coconut oil. He also gets sweet potato chews and coconut slices.

He is also allowed to eat fruits, not during his morning and evening meals since they digest differently than veggies, but he has not yet warmed up to them yet. I don’t know if he ever will.

He is doing great! He has so much energy and the numbers don’t lie! I got a glucose meter and I am going to start checking his levels daily. I would really like to get him off the insulin if I can. I believe the medicine is what causes the blindness, not the actual diabetes, my vet believes otherwise.

My vet has not said much of anything. I explained I was taking him off the prescription food and putting him on this program and he never responded. When I took him in the last time for blood work, I think he was surprised Buddy was doing so well, but did not ask me further about what I was doing. He is a pretty straight and narrow vet and I don’t think he looks outside the box. If Buddy’s glucose numbers continue to decline, I will take him back and back off on the number of units he is given. Now it is just maintenance and keeping a spreadsheet and monitoring how he is doing.

I suggest reaching out. I think Rick saved Buddy’s life. I took him to the vet in October to have blood work done and he is perfectly healthy!

Let me know if I can be of anymore help.

Good luck on your search and reach out if you have further questions or concerns. It was hard to take the jump and trust someone other than my vet with my dogs nutritional health, but I am so glad that I did.

Lori

[Susan]

Hi ac,
Isn’t that the shell the creamy/white bit on the outside & the mussel is inside the shell? I thought it was the shell?? I just googled a picture of a mussel, so that’s just the mussel lol I thought it was the whole mussel & shell & after being freeze dried thats what the shell looked liked all shriveled up cause they’re still crunchy but soft….
These are the “K-9 Natural Freeze Dried Mussels” I buy,
https://www.petcircle.com.au/product/k9-natural-green-mussel-bites

If you can buy cheaper freezed dried mussels from a grocery store then buy them, we also have other brands for dogs that are cheaper but I found they’re smaller & not as big as the K-9 Natural freeze dried mussels, so you need to give more of the cheaper mussels so the packet doesn’t last as long…..You can buy frozen mussels at the supermarket, read the link below, heat may destroy some of their anti-inflammatory benefits when you cook the mussel, you can even get mussels in a can/tin but will need to be lightly cook….
Freeze Dried Mussels would have the most health benefits being freeze dried, someone else might know more about Mussels?
Here’s a link, about the Health benefits of Freeze Dried Mussels…..Green-lipped mussels contain rare, furan fatty acids that act as powerful antioxidants. This combination of omega-3 fatty acids is not found in any other known marine oils.

Green Lipped Mussels Health Benefits

I knew your dogs would love them, just make sure you wash your hands after touching them mussels…

[anonymous]

Your dog is old and sick.
For the best results, I would stop looking for advice on the internet, forums, and the like.
A lot of misinformation out there. Not to mention the homeopathic miracle cures and such, example: dynovite. These things may add to his pain and discomfort.

Instead I would do exactly as the vet that is treating the dog instructs you to do.
Diet, medication, etc. No supplements. Just the prescription food with water added.

The food recommended for your dog is good. Prescription food is formulated for specific conditions. He may need to stay on it the rest of his life.

“Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Ultamino dry is a complete dietetic feed for dogs formulated to reduce ingredient and nutrient intolerances. Royal Canin Ultamino is guaranteed by strict safety and food control processes to avoid risk of potential protein contamination. This food requires a veterinary prescription.”
Science based veterinary medicine here http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2016/07/more-nonsense-from-holistic-vets-about-commercial-therapeutic-diets/

[GSDsForever]

I feed Zignature and agree w/both anon & haley, see the same recommended range amount for a 30 lb dog on my bag.

I would also encourage you to feed for ideal body condition scoring (and, if still a puppy, slow, controlled growth) in your individual dog, considering all the calories you provide (treats, supplements included). If you are not practiced in evaluating this (9 pt or 5 pt scale), ask your vet to assess/score your dog.

Don’t just go by food manufacturer general recommendations on a bag.

[GSDsForever]

“Vet says he’s too young for allergy.”

I have had multiple dogs with allergies, food and otherwise, been advised by specialists and excellent experienced general practice vets, as well as done my own judicious research and I have NEVER heard that from any source. I would question that.

While my current dog has had the most challenging to figure out and overcome allergies I have personally encountered, she is now doing exceptionally well. We (my vet & I) have used a multi-pronged approach for this dog that has both food and environmental allergies.

I agree w/anon — see a different vet, get a second opinion and get an accurate diagnosis based on good, solid veterinary knowledge and experience, a specialist as needed. Ask for a referral to the specialist if necessary. A good generalist vet should be happy to refer.

Pitlove also makes a good point. Fleas aren’t a big challenge where I live, but I do know that flea bite allergies (even from a single flea when you don’t see fleas, flea dirt) are a major cause of allergies/itching for many dogs.

This is the protocol for my dog, some or all of which may be helpful to your dog if you haven’t tried something (or the combined approach):

1)DIET
Novel Protein (10-12 weeks to see results) Limited Ingredient Diet — homemade or from a company with very strict allergen/cross-contamination AND NOT ONE DEMONSTRATED IN VET JOURNALS TO BE CROSS-CONTAMINATED ALREADY (Royal Canin, Natural Balance, Nature’s Variety/Instinct, et. al.)

— and ABSOLUTELY NO treats, supplements, “real”/”people” food, medicines (i.e. heartworm preventatives), or even chew/dental toys (i.e. Nylabone) that contain the established top food ingredient allergens for dogs (beef, chicken, fish, eggs, dairy, wheat, soy, corn). I treat w/her actual food or low allergen potential real food (i.e. blueberries, green beans, watermelon)

***Because I feed kangaroo — having needed a more unusual, rare protein source — I feed Zignature Kangaroo LID (GF) dry & canned food.

I also supplement, per vet prescription, Omega 3 EPA & DHA at a high, therapeutic/condition treating dose daily for anti-inflammatory effects, plus skin, coat, brain benefits — and I use Grizzly’s Wild Alaskan Salmon Oil in pump bottle.

2)ENVIRONMENT:

a)Frequent thorough bathing w/very hypoallergenic and gentle shampoo & skin soothing, skin repairing/barrier protective, etc. ingredients

b)frequent washing of dog’s bedding, etc. in hypoallergenic laundry detergent

c)frequent vaccuuming (pollen, dust/particulates, etc.)

d)hypoallergenic wet wipes wipe down of whole dog, especially paws (or dunking/rinsing paws off), after all walks & trips outside (pollen, dust/particulates, etc.)

Finally — consider & don’t overlook your own personal care/cleaning products that may cause allergic responses in your dog.

3)Cytopoint (aka CADI) injections, every 4-8 weeks as needed, seasonally or otherwise

I researched, considered, and rejected two other rx allergy/itch meds, Apoquel and Atopica.

I also researched and considered trials of 4 (recommended #) OTC antihistamines (e.g. benadryl, zyrtec/cetirizine).

I tried the above all in that order, before adding the next step.

We also tried once, but didn’t receive good relief and diagnostic results from a steroid injection — to see if she had seasonal environmental only allergies vs. food/combination.

[Dexter P]

So for 7 months now we have fed our two dogs a raw food diet of about anything you can think of, raw chicken wings, hamburger, fruit, eggs, pork, turkey…….you name it they have eaten it. We also supplement a small amount of kibble with this. These two dogs have the most iron clad guts you could imagine, one is 14 and the other 1 year of age. We came across this Mossy Oak supposed Super Food and thought we would try it. Day one is the only day they ate all of it, and both had bloody loose stools in 1 1/2 days. By Day 2 there was diarrhea everywhere……and they would not touch their food at all. They literally would identify the Mossy Oak food, and walk away from it and their other food. I understand the transition thing, but these two get kibble switched up all the time since its so little they get, and there have never been problems…..heck we didn’t have a problem when they devoured raw catfish we had caught fishing. There is something not right about this food it seems……..especially when you hop on here like I did, just Googling it, and you have all these horror stories. I’m just saying………be advised.

[anonymous]

“He had acute kidney failure 2 years ago, and has since been doing well but often has episodes where he is not hungry and throws up.”

@ organic n
The above is what I responded to. I stand by my recommendation of a therapeutic diet (prescription food) medication and treatments as prescribed by your vet.
These things are not considered to be aggressive treatment and will help keep your dog comfortable and possibly improve the quality of his life for the time he has left.
You may want to take your dog in for an exam, review of symptoms and have your vet explain the lab values in more detail and what they mean.
The other suggestion would be to contact a veterinary nutritionist (as pl mentioned) to formulate a special diet.
Best of luck

PS: I would not trust your internet research. A lot of misinformation out there and supplements are not always benign. Your dog (from what you have said) needs to be on a specific diet with restrictions. Sometimes less is more.

[organic n]

Thanks for the advice. My vet never said anything about him actually having kidney disease (despite him constantly having elevated levels, but the way I feel he views things is that since my dog is old its kind of “expected” which okay… possible.. but I feel like he should be giving me some help but he hasn’t so I’ve figured most of his diet out myself with the help of the internet and research), so I dont know if he actually does or if his kidneys are just slowly weakening and will eventually lead to kidney disease. But I was just wondering about some supplements to give him, but thank you for your concern and advice

[pugmomsandy]

BalanceIt.com sells a supplement to go with homecooked food.

[anonymous]

I lost a dog to kidney disease many years ago. This is a very serious condition. You should be working closely with a veterinarian.
My dog needed sub-q fluids almost every day the last 2 years, prescription dog food (canned) and plenty of water, nothing else. No supplements! Just prescription meds. Discuss with your vet.
He doesn’t want to eat because he is probably nauseous, in pain, hence the vomiting. I would not try to force him to eat.
The next thing that will occur after kidney failure, if it hasn’t already, is uremia. The dog smells like urine 24/7. It emanates from his pores.
Difficult decisions ahead
Your dog needs the expertise of a veterinarian, not the internet.
Good luck

[organic n]

Hi all, I’ve been researching a lot about what to do with my dog with kidney problems. He had acute kidney failure 2 years ago, and has since been doing well but often has episodes where he is not hungry and throws up. Usually clears itself up within the day, however. He also gets pancreatic problems when exposed to things high in fat (learned that the hard way).

I don’t have his bloodwork levels with me (I was actually going to see if i could get a copy from his vet in the next few days for my own records) but I do remember his BUN being higher than normal but the vet never said anything about it in terms of lowering it, but I feel like my vet doesn’t really see it as a problem despite him having high values.

Anyway, he is a few months shy of being 16 years old, and he is a 6-7lbs dog. We stopped feeding him dry kibble for many many reasons (around a year ago), and now we make his food at home. I don’t do raw meat (I don’t feel like trying out the raw meat thing at his age and conditions is worth it), his meals consist of:

Lean ground turkey cooked with white rice, carrots, peas, and green beans. I use a vitamin supplement (Only Natural Pet® Senior Ultimate Daily Vitamin Powder). After reading however, I will make some changes to his food by swapping out the peas (heard they are high in phosphorous) for some other veggies. And maybe switching out the turkey for ground beef 10% fat. He does get treats too – and if he is willing fruit as well particularly apples.

Also, I would like to start my dog on some more supplements – particularly green food supplements (have heard kelp is high in sodium though and the ones i’ve looked at contain many types of kelp..hmm), switching out the vitamin powder to VetriScience Renal Essentials Kidney Health Support Dog, adding salmon oil, and adding pre/probiotics to my dog’s diet.

Is the salmon oil necessary if I use the VetriScience kidney support tabs?

Can someone who is knowledgeable with kidney disease in dogs advise on the supplements I would like to add to my dog’s diet? I know the best thing is to consult my vet, but perhaps someone on here who has gone something similar can advise.

[Sue H]

My vet suggested: Purina Fortiflora Canine Nutritional Supplement Box, 30gm/30 Count, which I can buy on Amazon.com for Crystal’s GI issues. I also use a teaspoon or so of canned pumpkin (not the pie mix). Both helped Crystal with diarrhea. Hope things work out well for your dog!

[Melissa O]

I’ve been getting a ground turkey meal delivered to my house for my goldendoodle, Koda, for almost a year now. Unfortunately, something changed with the company’s recipe and Koda has refused to eat the meal (it actually doesn’t look like ground turkey anymore but more like a mushy mix consistency). I’m going to start cooking for Koda again (ground turkey and beef with veggies) and need a topper to mix in which is good quality, not chicken based, great vitamins and does not have the consistency of mush.

Any recommendations?

Thank you,
Melissa

[Susan]

Hi Robyn.
I like his name Toto, ask vet can you try Hills Urinary Care, C/d Multicare wet tin Chicken & Vegetable stew, its not rubbery, it’s a nice stew meal & has better ingredients then the S/d original wet canned formula, Hills have brought out a few new stews for dogs that stay on these type of diets & the fussy eaters, google, Hills Verterinary Prescription Diet site if you want to read up on the C/d Urinary Care Chicken & Vegetable Stew you can also email Hills & a Veterinary Nutritionist will call or email you back they know more about their vet diets then the vets do, the Chicken Veggie Stew might help with his constipation having a few veggies or add 1 spoon boiled pumkin…
Hills C/d Multicare wet
INGREDIENTS LIST

Water, Chicken, Pork Liver, Carrots, Rice, Green Peas, Corn Starch, Chicken Liver Flavor, Powdered Cellulose, Soybean Oil, Potassium Alginate, Wheat Gluten, Calcium Chloride, Guar Gum, Dicalcium Phosphate, Flaxseed, Potassium Citrate, Fish Oil, Calcium Lactate, Calcium Gluconate, vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Niacin Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Biotin, Riboflavin Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Folic Acid), Sodium Tripolyphosphate, Choline Chloride, Taurine, minerals (Zinc Oxide, Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Calcium Iodate), L-Carnitine, Beta-Carotene.

[Anita L]

Kind of interesting that anon101 dismisses “homeopathic” (actually holistic, not homeopathic) sources of information and their own source happens to be quite biased too. The availability of vets who are aware of kibble-alternative diets may depend very much on where you live. Where I live, there are many holistically trained vets do not use only traditional veterinary knowledge, as helpful as that can be for many people.

A well-researched post about transitioning from a brick & mortar organization specializing in raw pet foods: https://sfraw.wordpress.com/2017/02/09/transitioning-to-raw-sfraw-recommends/ Hope it’s useful!

You can get the meats & bones at any butcher you would go to for your own meats. Bones are really inexpensive – just get small bones such as chicken necks, feet, to begin with, and avoid weight-bearing bones.

Personally, we give our 15 lb dog at least 2-3 meals of meaty chicken bones a week. We just approximate her usual 1/2 cup serving size from how big the bone looks. This is as a supplement to high-quality kibble and homemade (cooked) food, using Dr. Richard Pilcairn’s recipe. You may find his book helpful if you wish to learn more about alternative diets.

We have also fed prepackaged foods such as Primal brand, which comes in frozen patties. If you are open to freeze-dried, Stella and Chewy’s is also great. Ziwipeak is air-dried and an amazing food for the money (considering you can use it as a treat since it comes in little squares and is apparently delicious). All are more expensive than feeding raw sourced from grocery stores but those are premium brands for minimally processed food.

[anonymous]

Also, if the dog is overweight, get the extra weight off, increase walks/exercise/activity.
Work closely with your vet, when the dog has been stable 6 months to 1 year then you can talk about diet changes.
“Dogs that get urinary tract infections and bladder stones tend to have a genetic predisposition, combine that with not enough water intake, not enough opportunities to urinate and you have a problem”.
“Whatever you decide to feed, add water to the kibble or canned food, even presoak and add water. Take out to urinate at least every 4 hours (every 2 hours is ideal) stagnant conditions in the bladder are conducive to bladder stone formation”.
“Always have fresh water available for the dog 24/7”.
“Supplements are crap, don’t waste your money unless your vet recommends something specific for your dog”.
Ps: You think the prescription food is expensive. Try emergency surgery for a blocked urethra.
Been there, done that.
Per the search engine: /forums/search/urinary+tract+infections/
Regarding cranberry: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=cranberry
Also there are prescription meds for stubborn cases, talk to your vet.
Was an ultrasound done? Dogs can have more than one type of stone, such as calcium oxalate and struvite…that was the case with my dog that had reoccurring UTIs.
This is not veterinary advice; consult your veterinarian.

PS: Note recent question on struvite in comments: http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2016/09/science-based-veterinary-nutrition-success-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-121266
Good luck

[Robin B]

I just spent 4 hours and $800 at an after hours emergency veterinary clinic with my rescue mutt. He was unable to pee, straining with leg up for ages, repeat. Then he started leaking in dribbles. This appeared to come on suddenly. Examination, urinalysis, X-ray, ultrasound: struvite crystals in urethra, stones in bladder. He had a catheter flush & sent home with prescription canned Hill’s S/D. It looks disgusting but he will eat it. We’ll see our vet at our regular clinic next week to check for progress on dissolution of crystals & stones.
He had been eating quality kibble ( no grain, limited ingredients etc.) enhanced with Wellness canned food (beef, turkey, chicken, lamb in rotation. Who doesn’t like a little variety?) Good news: we might be closer to guessing his breed combo (a little schnauzer in there, they tend toward this problem) and he started peeing the morning after his procedure & the prescription diet is temporary. Unlike me, he’s not a big drinker and he seems to have a bladder that will hold forever, likely one source of the problem.
So, I think I have deduced the cause: not enough water & infrequent elimination breaks both easily remedied although he only likes to pee on his walks.
My plan is to resume his regular diet when I get the “all clear” from the vet, add water to his kibble/canned meal combo. Introduce vitamin C & cranberry supplement. Offer homemade broth in addition to water to keep him hydrated. (I’m cheating and already making & giving the broth).
My question: do I wait until he is crystal clear before adding supplements & broth to his prescription food?
Your question: I’m new to the journey but hope I’m on the right track, commercial food with quality locally sourced ingredients, combo wet & dry (quality wet alone is too rich for my budget), water or bone broth added to food, lots of water available & broth if pup won’t drink water, frequent opportunity to pee (I think that was our downfall).
Good luck & advice is welcome.

[poodaddy]

For anyone interested, KevinB included, made some time to do some modifications, for”other than raw food”, to the Canine Nutrition application (in development) and the below is the output. Note that since I have still been unable to get a response from the manufacturer of Prosense Vitamins (Dale) (see above), I have not included any contribution to the diet of KevinB’s menu. Here is the output. What is not included below is a comparison of the menu to a standard, such as FEDIAF Nutrient Guidelines Canines or AAFCO Nutrient Requirements for Dogs as such, the below stops short of “analysis”. Copying data from Excel into this web page is problematic. Perhaps someone can instrucvt me on how to do it so the data stays aligned and tabular. Each of you can assess the menu now based on the nutrition science data for the food groups listed. All data was taken from nutritiondata.com which uses the USDA tables as the foundation. I have not yet found an instance where nutritiondata.com foods did not align with the USDA testing/data. I have QA-checked about a hundred (80%) and so far 100% checks with USDA databases.

FOOD GROUP Weight g %
ORGAN-MARROW 226.7960 3.89%
MUSCLE MEAT 3095.5520 53.16%
VEGITABLE/FRUIT 2501.1560 42.95%
OIL (Supplement) 0.0000 0.00%
MACROMINERALS (Supplement) 0.0000 0.00%
MACRONUTRIENTS g per day % per day
Prot 73.3489 53.40%
Carb 41.8999 30.51%
Fat 22.1016 16.09%
kcal (449 calc) 650.3830
kcal (ref calc) 670.3673
MACROMINERALS mg per day % per day
Calcium 220.2701 3.78%
*Phosphorous 490.8865 8.43%
Magnesium 114.1447 1.96%
Potassium 536.6109 9.21%
Sodium 152.5461 2.62%
Chloride 0.0000 0.00%
MICROMINERALS mg per day % per day
*Zinc 17.9585 0.31%
*Copper 0.6985 0.01%
*Iron 7.6319 0.13%
*Selenium 0.0901 0.00%
Iodine 0.0000 0.00%
Manganese 1.8323 0.03%
Chromium 0.0000 0.00%
Cobalt 0.0000 0.00%
Fluorine 0.0014 0.00%
Molybdenum 0.0000 0.00%
Silicon 0.0000 0.00%
Sulfur 0.0000 0.00%
VITAMINS mg per day % per day
Vitamin A 1.4918 0.03%
Vitamin B1 (Thiamin) 0.2384 0.00%
Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin) 0.6905 0.01%
Vitamin B3 (Niacin) 6.6424 0.11%
Vitamin B5 (Pantothenic Acid) 2.8011 0.05%
Vitamin B6 (piridoxine) 0.7010 0.01%
Vitamin B7 (Biotin) 0.0000 0.00%
Vitamin B9 (Folic Acid) 0.0328 0.00%
Vitamin B12 (Cobalamin) 0.0014 0.00%
Vitamin C 1.9644 0.03%
Vitamin D 0.0003 0.00%
Vitamin E 1.8694 0.03%
Vitamin K 0.0220 0.00%
Choline 243.2345 4.18%
FATS & FATTY ACIDS mg per day % per day
Polyunsaturated Fat (Omega-3) 439.6228 7.55%
Polyunsaturated Fat (Omega-6) 5010.4205 86.04%
Saturated Fat (g) 6.8897 0.12%
Monounsaturated Fat (g) 5.7914 0.10%
Polyunsaturated Fat (g) 6.1491 0.11%
Cholesterol 425.9580 7.31%
DATA & METRICS
Dog weight units lb
Dog weight 27.5
MERF 1.4
RER (kcal/day/dog) 464.5593
MER (kcal/day/dog) 650.3830
kcal/batch 8130.6591
Days/dog/batch 12.5013
Weight Batch g (no bone) 5823.5040
Weight Bone g 0.0000
Batch g per day per dog 465.8303
Ca:P 0.4487
Fat:Prot 0.3013

[Susan]

Hi a c,
thank-you, yes Australia is a beautiful clean country, I haven’t been to NZ yet but my sister & my daughter have been to NZ & said it’s beautiful but smells a bit when the sulphur smell comes up out of the ground, people often say us Australian & Kiwi’s are very friendly layed back people…The other day a lady stopped Patch & I while on our walk, I live in town & near the beach, so we get a few tourist who come & stay or work & she asked me, can I please pat our dog she’s here on holidays from the UK & misses her Staffy, she said aussies are such friendly people then she said even our dogs are sooo friendly, I said, yes Patch is very friendly & has to stops & say’s hello to everyone he passes, he loves getting a pat…

Yes that’s why I like giving Patch the freeze Dried Green Lipped Mussels cause of his IBD & he also gets Pancreas & stomach pain after eating certain foods, so far he’s been OK with his freeze dried Mussels, they haven’t cause any problems, the fat is low & the fats in mussels are healthy fats, omega oils & the mussels are all natural & freezed dried in their original natural state, I prefer to feed healthy foods then give supplements especially when they have stomach, pancreas or bowel problems. I hope the mussels work for your 2 Schnauzers you will see an improvement & you have a 6month old Schnauzer puppy as well, that’s what I’m thinking of getting another dog that’s around 18-24 months old, a rescue pound dog that hasn’t been desexed yet then when she goes thru rescue she’ll get desexed & hopefully be an adult.

[Susan]

HI
PLEASE see a vet, when a dog is being picky with food this is a sign the dog may have digestive problems…. Yorki’s are prone to Pancreatitis & need a lower fat diet, feeding a higher protein, higher Kcals diet nornally has higher fat as well & may cause more problems.. I’d be seeing a vet to do blood test to see why your dog is losing weight……Have you tried cooking some chickem Breast & Sweet Potato & freeze small meals? “Dr Judy Morgan” has some really good easy recipes you can make & freeze…

Have a look at “Canidae” Pure Meadow Senior, it has supplements for aging dogs, Glucosamine, Chondroitin, Omega 3 & its low in fat-10.80%, Protein is 28% & the Kcals are 409, she will gain weight on this formula, if she doesnt have any health problems & she wont be getting the higher fat in her diet another really good dry food “Annamaet” Lean dogs do really well on but if she is fussy I’d be joining this group on face Book “Canine Pancreatitis Support Group” then look in the “Files” click on 2nd link “Low Fat Food” scroll down a bit & look at all the wet tin foods & the fat has been converted to Dry Matter (DM) heaps of good low-normal fat wet foods…..

[crazy4cats]

Hi weezerweeks-
I’m sorry your pup is having such a hard time. I know it is stressful. Have you told your vet that he has diarrhea now that he is on the new meds?

My cat was put on an antibiotic a few years ago when he had a high fever and not doing well. He started having diarrhea and the vet thought it could very well been from the antibiotic and switched meds for him. The diarrhea stopped and he eventually got better.

I’m not sure it was clavamox or not. But, just to let you know that certain meds can actually have some bad side effects and should be switched to something else.

I’d keep his meals very simple right now and discontinue any of the supplements until he gets better. Good luck. I hope he gets better soon.

[weezerweeks]

Anon he’s under a vets care. Susan thank u so much for your suggestions. Bailey is a 7 lb 9 year old rescued yorkie. I’ve had him for 7 years. I give him preference pre mix by THK and veg to bowl premix by Dr. Harvey. I rotate these 2 and I add the protein. I change the protein every week. Turkey, chicken, ground round, version, salmon, tuna etc. for treats he gets freeze dried tripe, the honest kitchen treats. One of these a day.I rotate them. I also add yogurt to his meal at night and a teaspoon of kefir at night. I add a joint supplement because he has luxating pettalar(not bad a 1) I was also giving him foriflora probiotic when he got sick. I also rotate them springtime, mercolas. He also gets Nordic natural fish oil and 3 times a week coconut oil.I also give him a digestive enzyme(prozyme) This is the first time he’s had direahea. He usually has nausea. My vet at this time does not want to do a scope but if needed he will send me to UGA vet school.He also walks a mile every morning with my husband and at night I walk around the block with him. He loves to walk and sniff. I know that he’s 9 1/2 now but that’s not old for a yorkie. Thanks for ur input. I will ask Dr. Mac about the losec and Zantac.

[anonymous]

The food supplements (not regulated by the FDA) mentioned are not medication. Read the fine print on the bottlle.
https://www.vetsecure.com/veterinarymedicalclinic.com/articles/136

[Brenda F]

My 14 year old golden retriever Amber has been on 120 mg of Galliprant daily for past two months.The 100 mg’s are not available, the company continues to say they are out of stock which makes this med. even more expensive now. Amber just started having daily very loose stool and I suspect from this new med. She has been on Metacam in past and I am thinking of returning to it again. It seems like as more people review Galliprant that stool problems are being observed. I thought this was the solution as Galliprant is supposed to be gentle on the organs…but it certainly does not appear gentle on the gastro area. She is on many natural supplements but still needs an nsaid unfortunately due to hip dysplasia and severe arthritis.

[poodaddy]

Hi Virginia D and others. Here is our story on this specific issue of dog gas. I hope it reveals some aspects of the nutrition side. First, the advice about exercise can be 50%+ of a solution with any dog since all dogs are to some degree “athletes” that NEED exercise; exercise is not just cardiovascular but also depending on the breed can resolve many other issues that do not “seem” to be related, such as anal gland functionality. Now, I am neither a vet, nor a certified anything, but I have been a field dog handler and student of canine performance for a very long time, now using some skills to start my understanding of canine nutrition science.

Before my current two cockapoos, I had a yellow lab raised from birth as a field dog (and household pet). He lived a long healthy life and I want to share with you and others on this posting, the experimenting I did with my yellow lab AND recently (less than a year ago) with my two cockapoos. I decided to figure out in both cases (my yellow lab diet) and the two poos diets, what would happen to their digestive tract, specifically in the generation of gas, if I kept all other factors as constant as possible. What I did was figure out what percentage of their diet was protein from their kibble and then I moved them into a kibble/raw diet and stabilized the protein at 50% for a while. We raised the protein percentage in about 5% increments starting at 50% until noticeable gas started, then we leveled off to ensure it was constant. Then I increased it more until just shy of 80% and the gas creation (making sure all other things were held constant) was amazing (from a biological view). I had some old notes from my yellow lab days that I needed to convince myself of with the two poos and the results compared favorably. The nutritionist readers will have LOTS of variables that contribute to this and I would probably agree with them all, such as some combinations of foods work together to control the chemical processing in a digestive tract. For this little experiment we did, we simply wanted to know how did our dogs’ digestive tracts react to protein percentage (period) nothing more sophisticated. And we found that percentage for our specific cases that correlated for one yellow lab and two cockapoos. That result was when we reached 80% protein % from raw meat where raw boneless chicken was 60% and raw red meat was 30%+ (the remainder of protein was from other non-meat ingredients), the gas production increased rapidly.

For the testing period, and menu stablization, we used these macro goals: Protein 60%, Carbohydrate 20%, Fat 20% and then increased the protein using boneless chicken until gas started and then continued increasing it to see if there was more production and there was a correlation. By the way, body builders and most human athletes have a similar issue with protein in their diets.

So, the other comments made about overeating are on solid ground if feeding a yellow lab from kibble where the lab will eat whatever amount is placed in front of them. My reading suggests that some canines will eat low protein foods until they get the protein they need which some authors suggest that this contributes to canine obesity. The point is, some of the comments above are right on in that there may be a correlation with your lab and the amount of bulk he/she is intaking compared to feeding times and exercise.

For this post though, I wanted to share with you that for one small item in a controlled environment, we proved that changing one item (protein % using raw chicken as the variable in an otherwise balanced diet), caused the onset of gas and continued to increase as the protein % increased. Here is the makeup of the most recent raw diet our two dogs are on. These ingredients are part of an integrated nutrition model that is in development. This the first time I have shared this data but it is nearing time to engage the nutritionist forum posters. I am providing this data primarily so you know the above is not some quacked out post. This was a real experiment and perhaps the results and posts will help you (and others) where gas is an issue. All numbers are in grams weight.

Raw Chicken heart 1252
Raw Chicken liver 765
Raw Chicken gizzard 2106
Raw Chicken Marrow 315
Organ 10.8% by weight

Raw Eye Round Roast 6000
Raw Whole chicken”fryer”/deskin/grd bone 16200
Whole XL eggs 2232
Raw Bottom Round 2000
Muscle meat 64.3% by weight

Shredded Carrot 500
Raw Zucchini 484
Boiled Sweet Potato 3500
Raw NAPA Cabbage 953
Boiled Raw Edamame 800
Boiled Green Beans 1000
Raw Butternut squash 459
Raw Whole Apple 921
Raw Baby Spinach 400
Kelp Powder 100
Yellow Squash 423
Vegitable/Fruit 23.2% by weight

Coconut Oil 600
Oil Supplement 1.5% by weight

Sea Calcium 65
Macromineral Supplement 0.16% by weight

Notes:
1. The Sea Calcium is used to force the CA:P ratio to 1.2 in this menu.
2. This made 60 days of food each for two dogs, one at 13.5 LBs and one at 15.5 LBs.
3. The menu planned cost for food was $0.94 per day per dog.
4. The final results after shopping with same %s design was $1.10 per day per dog.
5. Energy analysis resulted in 306 g per day and 339 g per day for each dog.
6. Custom MER factor used as 1.4 (based on iterations over 6 months of menus).
7. 1,260 g contribution by weight due to bone.
8. 2.5% contribution on the organ side due to chicken marrow, based on my own experiments.
9. Energy required per day: 381 Cal for 13.5 LBs and 423 Cal for the 15.5 LBs poos.

Results of this menu are outstanding in all measured areas. Am in the process of peeling back “supplements and vitamins” for what they really are or aren’t. Hope this detail helps you or others. More to come from our quest for canine nutrition knowledge and practical applications.

[Randy D]

Look at the Hero formula. A little lower fat, higher protein, grain free with joint supplements. Another suggestion is Performance. It’s 26/18 protein and fat, has some grain, and also has joint supplements.

[poodaddy]

Does anyone have more complete /consistent data for the Prosense Vitamin for dogs? It seems a bit strange to me that a portion of the nutrients are listed in a % and others listed in mg.

Here is the manufacturer’s link for nutrition data: http://www.prosensepet.com/solutions/vitamin-solutions-for-dogs.aspx. What I need is the following:

(1) What is the standard that the %s listed below are applied to? I need to derive or get the mg Protein 16%, Carborhydrate (not listed) and Fat 0.3% … and mg associated with the percents shown for Calcium 6%, Phosphorous 5%, Magnesium 0.1% , and Potassium 0.3%?

=== Prosense Vitamin Data per tablet ===
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
PER TABLET (MINIMUM VALUES UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED)
Crude Protein……………………………………………………….…16.0%
Crude Fat…………………………………………………………………0.3%
Moisture (max.)……………………………………………………….10.0%
Linoleic Acid……………………………………………………………..0.005 %
Calcium…………………………………………………………………….6.0%
Phosphorous……………………………………………………………..4.5%
Potassium………………………………………………………………….0.3%
Magnesium………………………………………………………………0.1%
Iron………………………………………………………….…………….1.5 mg
Copper……………………………………………………….…………0.03 mg
Manganese………………………………………………….………….0.07 mg
Zinc………………………………………………………………………..0.8 mg
Iodine…………………………………………………………………..0.05 mg
Vitamin A……………………………………………………………….1200 IU
Vitamin D3………………………………………………………………150 IU
Vitamin E…………………………………………………….……….…….6 IU
Thiamine (Vitamin B1)……………………………………..………0.8 mg
Riboflavin (Vitamin B2)…………………………………………….1.5 mg
Niacinamide (Vitamin B3)…………………………………..…….9.5 mg
Pyridoxine (Vitamin B6)…………………………………..……..0.06 mg
Vitamin B12…………………………………………………….…….2.0 mcg
Cobalt*…………………………………………………………………0.01 mg
Ascorbic Acid* (source of Vitamin C) ………………………….25 mg

*Not recognized as an essential nutrient by the AAFCO Dog Food Nutrient Profiles

Calorie Content (calculated)
2,550 ME kcal/kg  (6.9 ME kcal/tablet)
This product is intended for intermittent or supplemental feeding only.

DIRECTIONS AND DOSAGE

<10 lbs……………….½ Tablet Daily
10-50 lbs………………1 Tablet Daily
>50 lbs……………….2 Tablets Daily

[Saireah]

Hi there!

I have two dogs — Riggs (5 year old mastiff/shepard mix — 90 lbs) and Quinn (6 year old vizsla/lab mix — 43 lbs). Quinn has hip dysplasia and gets a Cosequinn pill each morning and both receive a fish oil supplement. I’ve had them on Dr. Tim’s Pursuit for quite some time, which is a 30/20 food. I wanted to give Victor a try, just because it’s a reputable brand and also comes in larger bags (40lb vs. Dr. Tim’s 44lb). If it doesn’t work out well, I’ll probably go back to Dr. Tim’s, but I wanted to see if Victor would help with their shedding a bit.

My question is — is the Hi-Pro Plus plan the best formula for me to pick? My dogs are fairly active, but I’d consider them a normal active level vs. high-performance. They’re in excellent health and weight. They’ve done great on Dr. Tim’s, so I assume that changing them over to a similar high-protein formula would be all right? Any concerns to go down to a 26% protein formula given that they’re getting a bit older?

Just wanted to get some guidance. 🙂 Thanks!

[Justin A]

Hi Michael, I’d sure be keen to chat. Been searching for a guide to help design a diet that doesn’t require a proprietary supplement. I’m no nutritionist but let me know if i can help out if n any way.

[poodaddy]

Ahhh, it is the weekend again and time to post good stuff. A lot of the above sounds soooo familiar with our situation for our both dogs, plus we had many other simultaneous symptoms occurring with our dogs, inconsistent stools, anal gland flare-ups, tooth/gum issues, we had been “fighting” the symptoms for so long it seemed we were destined for either living with it or changing the outcome. We were at the 4-year mark with our two cockapoos and I had enough of the personal ignorance and following everyone’s prescriptions including our Vet’s. So,… the long road on research and learning began (and it still continues), discussions with our Vet at a far more informed level (or at least the level I could study to), lots of webinars listened to given by licensed Vets with pet nutrition specializations, and reading reading reading. Talking to senior GOV nutritionists including the USDA, talking with pet consultant business owners, etc – you get the idea now that this was a lot of figuring out stuff that I could find in one condensed place. The secret we eventually (over an intense investigation period of months) came to was that we needed to take charge of the food data and get it done (science-based input = good results/output). The bottom-line in our case is that until we went to a complete raw food diet (this means really knowing first-hand what we were doing), we were destined on a course of mediocrity or worse and chasing symptoms which I (we) had enough of. The addition of ground bones and connective tissue with the raw diet addressed many issues (but that is just the beginning of the solutions). The experience, learning, demystification of misinformation, disinformation, and anecdotal information that is “out there” is staggering. This whole experience of ours is one that is very enriching and I am on a quest to tell everyone I can about the lessons learned, the solutions put into practice, the observations and iterations to make tweeks to the raw diet, etc needed to take control. On the money side, we have avoided thousands of dollars and or lots of worrisome situations with our two dogs. Because cost comes up regularly, our food cost ranges from an average of $1.00-$1.25 per dog per day (13.5 lb and 15.5 lb) not including time to plan, design, iterate, shop, prepare, manufacture, bag, clean up. And our Vet just smiles at us when we go in for the check-ups and tells us congratulations, you have broken some barriers of ignorance and have the data to back up your “program”. So, we are on the quest to get this project done and share the nutrition model (and all that goes into it) with those who want or need to start where we are and not have to recreate it. The model is in the final phase of designing the menu analysis section for supplements needed (or not needed) but it is based on nutrition data. Disclaimer: the model does not address any aspect of diet for treating diagnosed disease(s). The model is about proper diet and maximizing probability of prevention of problems that can be avoided by applying nutrition science.

[anonymous]

Regarding cranberry supplements. http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=cranberry. (excerpt below)
Bottom Line
Despite some promising laboratory studies suggesting cranberry supplements might help prevent or treat urinary tract infections, the evidence of studies in clinical patients has been disappointing. Conflicting studies in humans suggest, on balance, that there is probably no significant benefit. And now a high-quality clinical trial in dogs has failed to find any effect, even in the the of infections the pre-clinical research most strongly suggested there should be one.

While the risks of cranberry supplements are probably negligible, pet owners should understand, and veterinarians should make in clear to their clients, that there is no good reason to believe they have any real value in preventing or treating urinary tract infections.

[Noelle M]

This is a hot topic for me lol
I have a dog with struvite stones and chronic utis.
Of course when we were given this diagnosis we were recommended a prescription diet from our vet. I immediately cringed at the ingredient list that was majority corn. There was no way I was going to feed my dog what was essentially corn meal with chicken fat half way down the list for the rest of his life. So I began my very long, very draining journey into finding a decent food that wouldn’t cause a flare up.
First I had to figure out WHY the prescription diets worked. Right on the Hill’s website they explain that the food contains controlled levels of calcium, phosphorus and magnesium to manage the development of stones.
So I took the calcium, phosphorus and magnesium levels from the prescription food and started comparing them to other foods. SO many foods. Many of which I had to email the company directly because they didn’t have those levels available online.
Essentially I looked for food with calcium and phosphorus levels below 1%, the lower the better. There are actually quite a few to choose from!
My boy has been on Performatrin Ultra Grain Free Senior for the past number of months, his meals are floated in water and I add a cranberry supplement. His condition has been kept 100% under control and he is doing wonderfully overall on this food.
Generally I have found that senior or large breed formulas are more likely to have sub 1% calcium and phosphorus.

Some of the brands I have found that could work are:
Performatrin Ultra Grain Free Senior
Nutram Sound Senior and Large Breed
Diamond Naturals Grain Free Chicken and Sweet Potato

I give bonus points to foods that contain cranberry already, though I continue to supplement it.

Bottom line is the prescription foods WILL work to treat a specific condition, but I personally could not bring myself to feed it long term based on the ingredient lists. There ARE decent quality foods out there that match or come close to matching the analysis of the prescription diets that should manage the dog’s symptoms and are generally much healthier overall. Look for subzero levels of calcium and phosphorus, float the food in water and consider a cranberry supplement.

Obviously I cannot gaurentee that any of these foods will work, but it is definitely worth a shot imo and has worked beautifully for my dog who had pretty severe and chronic symptoms.

Good luck!

[Cherie G]

I’d like to thank “crazy4cats” and “anon101″ for the information and websites you have suggested I look into.
This has taken me to a better understanding about
Struvite stones and dog food ingredients and diets. I, like many others just accept what my vet had said as far as what to feed her. She has now been on Royal Canin SO for over a year. She was a rescue so the sample of the stone wasn’t analyzed to see if it was Struvite or Oxylate. I do intend to do this since I have it. She doesn’t appear to have urinary track infections, and goes pee 3-5 times a day. The stone was 2” and oval like an egg in a little 19# Bischon mix. After reading the ingredients in RC…..Brewers rice, corn, chicken by products, chicken fat etc…….I’m thinking she may not be having enough protein? RC=crude protein 14.0%, crude fat 145.0% crude fiber 4.% moisture 10%. I do supplement her with cooked chicken and sometimes other meats, however, not every day. After reading about chicken by products……..I’m not sure if I want her to have that! ANY COMMENTS???? I also always give her water in her kibble.
I am looking for a new dog food……that is about the same price or less. I’ve been dealing with Chewy so far. THANKS AGAIN SO MUCH!!!!! Cherie

[Susan]

Hi Debbera,
Please be careful feeding fish dog foods, the brands & formula’s you have mentioned have tested 10 times higher the recommend dose for toxins & contaminate’s when these fish formula’s were tested both times the is yeay April & August both fish formula’s have come back very high in toxins & contaminates…..google “Toxins in pet foods” & the **** links will come up…
brands like Trudog, Great Life, “Canidae”, Dogswell, I & love & you, Pet Pride Kroger, Buckly Liberty all rated very well in both pet food testings…. it was their chicken, lamb & Beef formula’s…. The Fish formula’s seems to be very very high in toxins, no good for a dog with IBD, IBS or any health problems…

This happened with my IBD boy, his vet & I couldn’t work out why Patch was doing really then after I being introduced to American fish formula’s then around 3 months while eating these fish formula’s he would go down hill with all 3 different American fish brands he was eating, they didn’t have any ingredients he was sensitive too so it wasnt food intolerances cause I had done an food elimination diet the 12 months before & knew what ingredients he was sensitive too & avoided these ingredients, so we couldn’t work out what was wrong, then this year I read about some fish pet food being very high in toxins & seen these 3 brands/formula’s in the worse top 10 formula’s first & second testing list, they were 10 times higher the recommended amount for toxins & contaminates, I felt so bad I was poisoning my boy slowly……..now the only fish Patch gets is human grade Australian caught or NZ fish that I eat & his “K-9 Natural” freeze dried green lipped Mussels from New Zealand, he’s been doing heaps better with his IBD now & hasnt had another IBD flare since I’ve stopped feeding American fish kibbles……

When a dog is having mucus bloody soft poos normally means she is sensitive/intolerant to an ingredient in the formula she’s eating, Patch was doing condom poos I called them, looked like a condom was wrapped around his poos, or jelly poo’s, no vet diets worked for him, alot vet diets are higher in insoluble fiber & very low soluble fiber making poos slop cow pattie poo’s, later I worked out this is why some of these vet diet formula’s were not working & helping Patches IBD, vets don’t really know whats in these vet diets, I knew more then all of Patches vet knew about the vet diets they were recommending, then finally I read TOTW Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb & TOTW Pacific Stream Smoked Salmon formula’s were working for a lot of IBD & EPI dogs, these formula’s both are lower in fiber at 3%max but the TOTW Salmon formula kept making Patch vomit straight after he ate the salmon kibble then he was eating it again, I didnt know this cause I wouldn’t be home some times but I kept seeing a wet patch on the carpet then the cat dob him in one day she was burying nothing on the carpet that’s when I clicked, vomit was there & Patch was quickly eating the un digested kibbles back up leaving a wet spot on carpet, his poos were excellent within 2 days nice firm solid poos, then this year I seen this fish brand foods that made him vomit was on the highest toxins 2nd list testing & finally worked out why Patch was going down hill when he ate fish kibbles..

If you keep having problems with your girl then a cooked diet is probably best to feed even if 1 meal is cooked & 1 other meals are kibble, a few of the IBD/EPI groups the dogs are doing really well the “4health” Sensitive Care, Sensitive Stomach formula it has just Egg & Potato so very easy to break down & digest or the 4Health Sensitive Skin formula it has pea flour & hydrolzed Salmon, so the hydrolyzed salmon has been broken down for the dog, so very easy to digest good for diogs with IBD, in both formula’s the fat & protein isn’t really high, alot of dogs with IBD need lower fiber & protein diets & 4Health has all this… worth a try if your girl still not well, also the “Canidae” Pure Meadow Senior is really good for senior dogs & has all the supplements needed for aging dogs.

• This reply was modified 8 years, 2 months ago by pugmomsandy.

[anonymous]

@ Charles B
Please do not apply anything to the skin or give over the counter meds intended for humans or give supplements unless instructed to do so by a veterinarian that has examined the dog.
You could make things much worse and increase the risk of infection.

[Susan H]

Does anyone here own a Norfolk Terrier? I got a 10 week old last Saturday and want advice on what puppy food works well for their systems. The breeder was using blue buffalo puppy food but said she was probably going to switch back to Fromm. She stopped because chewy stopped carrying it.

I know as in other small breeds there is a risk for obesity and for heart issues (I plan scrupulous dental care).

I lost my nearly 17 year old miniature schnauzer a month ago and want to give this new pup the best life I can.

Any suggestions for food, supplements would be appreciated.
Thanks.

[anonymous]

Vitamin C strikes (out) again

http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2016/07/things-holistic-vets-say-about-cancer-that-should-make-pet-owners-run-the-other-way/ (excerpts out of context below, click on link for full article and comments) Nothing is being sold. Science-based veterinary medicine.

Things Holistic Vets Say About Cancer that Should Make Pet Owners Run the Other Way
Posted on July 5, 2016 by skeptvet
Cancer is a common and frightening disease, and many pet owners will have to face making decisions about cancer care for their pets at some point. While there are many therapies that can improve quality of life for a veterinary cancer patient, extend life, and even cure cancer in some cases, the painful reality is that there is much we don’t know about cancer. Often, cancer will be life limiting despite the best care possible.
This unpleasant reality leads many to seek alternative therapies for their pets with cancer. Unfortunately, those alternatives are almost never proven to be safe or effective, and many, such as homeopathy, are unquestionably nonsense. Yet despite the lack of evidence to support many alternative cancer treatments, and the evidence that shows some such treatments can cause real harm, some vets will try to frighten and mislead pet owners into avoiding scientific medical therapies and grasping at the various straws they offer, from homeopathy to acupuncture, from supplements and magical diets to outright magic such as so-called “energy medicine.”

“In the face of the ubiquitous unreliable information from holistic vets such as these, it can be hard to sort out which information is truly useful. Here are some resources that are a good bit more trustworthy”.
Veterinary Cancer Society (This group also has a tool for finding a board-certified veterinary cancer specialist.) Here are some of the links the VCS recommends:
ACVIM Foundation
American Animal Hospital Association Healthy Pets
American Association of Feline Practitioners
American College of Veterinary Radiology
Animal Cancer Center at CSU
Animal Cancer Foundation
Animal Clinical Investigation, LLC
Boo Radley Foundation
Brazilian Society of Veterinary Oncology
C3O: Center of Clinical Comparative Oncology
Canine Health Foundation
Cornell’s College of Veterinary Medicine “Consultant”
ESVONC (European Society of Veterinary Oncology)
Magic Bullet Fund
Perseus Foundation
PubMed
QuitDay.org
Morris Animal Foundation
The National Cancer Institute
UC Davis Comparative Cancer Center
University of Pennsylvania’s “Oncolink”
Vaccine Associated Feline Sarcoma Task Force
Veterinary Center for Clinical Trials at the University of California-Davis
Veterinary Society of Surgical Oncology
The Veterinary Cancer Center