[cochise]

I went with orijen. there are different combinations of meat, fish, fruits and vegetables. it’s very nutritious. it is expensive. I started feeding him the 6 fish blend. and saw know real change in his stool. but I thought about the amount I was feeding and decided I was feeding too much. his stools were fine for 90-95%, but the end of his movement, it was soft serve. after I cut the feeding by 25%, he is starting to do a lot better. he still bites and licks his pause and rubs his knows, but i’m not going to give him chemicals. I think it will take more time to affect his allergic reaction. it is also likely the shedding has diminished.

the price range for a bag just under 30lbs is between $70 and $90. 6 fish is$80. if you haven’t checked the website, there is some interesting reading.

[DogFoodie]

Hey Jan,

I’ve been wondering if you tried any of your Nature’s Logic, yet. If so, I’m curious to hear what sort of success you’ve had with it so far. I got a bag of the sardine recently and it’s a toss up which I’ll open next… that, Mulligan Stew or the new Orijen. ::shameless dog food junkie::

[Mom2Cavs]

I haven’t fed the NVI Raw Boost kibble to my dogs, but my cat eats it for her kibble, along with her canned and other moistened freeze dried foods, like Stella & Chewy’s and Primal. She loves this kibble way more than some others I’ve fed her….Orijen/Acana, Fromm, Nature’s Logic….so this is what she gets.

[Rllshamrock]

Hi, I’m new to this website, and I would greatly appreciate some advice. We have an almost 6 year old female, half black lab/half pit bull, she weighs between 50 and 60 pounds. We had been feeding her Taste of the Wild for years, and it seemed to agree quite well with her, and the price was within our budget. We took her off of it as a precaution after a bunch of it was recalled (I learned recently the recall was not in our area…). We had to put her on what we could then afford at the time, which was not great, and it seems to be giving her skin issues now (thankfully, she has no other major medical issues). She has only been on this particular food for a few months, thankfully, and I’d like to get her switched over to something actually good for her ASAP! I was just wondering if anyone could tell me their top recommendations for a grain-free dry dog food, and what I could expect the price to be. Would it be safe to put her back on Taste of the Wild? I have had someone recommend Innova or Orijen, but I think those might be a bit out of our affordability range. Thank you in advance for anything you can tell me!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi hassiman –

Your breeder could not be more incorrect. You can’t feed a dog “too much” protein – excess protein that is not used by the body is passively excreted though the urine causing no stress on the organs. Protein is very important for all dogs and especially growing puppies. I wouldn’t even feed a food with 21% protein to an adult dog, let alone a puppy. I always recommend picking a dry food with at least 30% protein and topping with high quality canned foods, raw foods or healthy “people” food (sardines, eggs, lean meat, etc.) to boost protein further. I have 3 bloodhounds – an 8 month old puppy, a 2 year old adult and a 7 year old senior – that all eat a raw diet with protein levels in the 45-55% range. It is now known that reducing protein levels does nothing to prevent renal failure and that protein levels should only be reduced in the late stages of renal failure. Orijen is a wonderful food (the best dry food available in my opinion) and I think you made a great choice that you should stick with regardless of your breeder’s (incorrect) beliefs. If you go to the “library” on Orijen’s website they have some wonderful articles about the importance of dietary protein and the myths surrounding high levels of dietary protein. I’d highly recommend you read these articles to ease your mind. The three I’d recommend you read are: “Myths of High Protein” which was written by Kenneth C. Bovee, DVM, MMedSc at Penn State’s veterinary school; “Effects of High Protein on Renal Function” by Delmar R. Finco, DVM, PhD for the Department of Physiology and Pharmacology at the University of Georgia’s school of veterinary medicine; “Pet Food Safety: Dietary Protein” by DP Laflamme, DVM, PhD, Dipl ACVN. To get to the articles from Orijen’s homepage click “FAQ” on the top menu, then click “Library” on the new top menu that appears. You may also want to refer your breeder to these articles before he/she provides any more unknowing puppy buyers with such misguided advice.

[hassiman]

My breeder thinks that 21% protein is about as high a level protein a Puppy should get. I am feeding white-meat chicken, pumpkin and Orijen Puppy kibble which is rated at 40% grain-free protein.

She says too much protein can damage a dog’s liver. kidneys etc. Says around 21-25% is better for the pooch. My dog is an 8 month old cocker.

Any food recomendations?

Any opinions out there?

[weimlove]

All of the brands you’ve been feeding are very low quality. The best diet for your dog is a raw diet. If you don’t want to go the raw route, try to find a kibble where atlesdt the first three ingredients are meat and that is grain free. Some quality brands are orijen, acana, taste of the wild, natures variety, and blue wilderness. Another great option is freeze dried food which all you do is add water and it re hydrates. A great one is the honest kitchen. When transitioning dry dog foods, gradually mix in the new food and then add more new food and less of your old brand over a one or two week period. If you are switching from a low quality to high quality, you may experience some loose stool at first, but you will be very happy because you don’t have to feed as much because there are more nutrients in higher quality foods. Hope that helps!

[Anonymous]

The chart format was muched up in posting. Here is a second go at it in the hopes that this incarnation will be more legible. (Note to website: a preview post option would be helpful.)
………………………………….Hill’s……………Merrick……………Orijen
Protein…………………………24.2…………..38………………….38
Fat……………………………..16.4……………17………………….17
Carbohydrate………………..51.5……………?……………………25
Sodium………………………..0.32……………?……………………0.4
Omega 3………………………0.67……………0.4…………………1.1
Omega 6………………………3.33……………4.8…………………3.0
Taurine…………………………yes……………..?……………………0.35
Carnitine……………………….?………………..?……………………?
B1 – Thiamine………………..yes……………..yes………………..0.9 mg/kg or 50 mg/kg?
B2 – Riboflavin……………….?…………………yes………………..45 mg/kg
B3 – Niacin……………………yes………………yes………………..450 mg/kg
B5 – Pantothenic Acid………?………………….yes……………….50 mg/kg
B6 – Pyridoxine………………?………………….yes……………….38 mg/kg
B7 – Biotin…………………….?………………….yes……………….1 mg/kg
B9 – Folic acid………………..yes……………….yes……………….5.2 mg/kg
B12 – Cobalamins…………..yes………………..yes………………50 mg/kg
Magnesium……………………0.999…………….?…………………0.1

[Anonymous]

I am by no means a canine nutritionist, merely someone who has put a bit of thought into what I feed mine. My knowledge is not specific to the medical condition and sensitivity of your dog. The guidelines that I found with a superficial online search for cardiac diet were:
– Provide your pet a high-quality natural meat-based diet with at least 25-30% protein (DM basis)
– Make sure your pet LIKES the food so that (s)he consumes enough calories to maintain BMI
– Mild to moderate sodium restriction (severe restriction in advanced cases)
– Supplements: omega 3 fatty acids, taurine, carnitine, B vitamins and Magnesium.
http://www.1800petmeds.com/education/diet-tips-pet-heart-disease-32.htm

I am going to assume that you are looking for a dry kibble based on your previous food choice. I feel that the top of the line dry kibble RIGHT NOW is Orijen. However, it does retail for $80/35lb. As I feed about 400 lb of dog, the budgetary compromise at my house is Merrick Grain Free at roughly $50/35lb.

Prior to Merrick Grain Free, I was feeding Taste of the Wild, but have decided that I prefer Merrick for not entirely nutrition-based reasons. While the protein content is slightly higher and the starch from sweet potato (rather than white), they are reasonably equivalent foods (in nutrition and price). However, Merrick uses all US-sourced ingredients (nothing from China). This is a political issue and safety concern of mine. The larger scale pet recall in 2007 due to melamine contamination was traced to Chinese product, and the more recent Petco recall of stainless steel bowls manufactured with radioactive Cobalt-60 scrap was most likely (while never publicly disclosed) of Chinese origin. Merrick also happens to be manufactured in Texas, where I live. Those variables may not factor into your decision at all, but are important to me.

I could not find a cardiac specific diet offered by Hill’s in their Science Diet or Prescription Diet lines and based my quick comparison on the Adult Advanced Fitness formula. The Advanced Mobility contained more Omega 3’s and Magnesium, but was lower in protein and higher in sodium. Orijen appears to be the best choice, but may not be an option for you dependent on your personal budget. Merrick Grain Free is my compromise, but is based on a few tertiary considerations that may not matter to you. I will be interested to hear what other posters have to contribute. (The following information was retrieved from those companies’ official website product pages and is as vague or detailed as they provided.) The summary comparison is this:

Hill’s Merrick Orijen
Protein 24.2 38 38
Fat 16.4 17 17
Carbohydrate 51.5 ? 25
Sodium 0.32 ? 0.4
Omega-3 Fatty Acids 0.67 0.4 1.1
Omega-6 Fatty Acids 3.33 4.8 3.0
Taurine (yes) ? 0.35
Carnitine ? ? ?
B Vitamins
B1 – Thiamine (yes) (yes) 0.9 mg/kg or 50 mg/kg?
B2 – Riboflavin ? (yes) 45 mg/kg
B3 – Niacin (yes) (yes) 450 mg/kg
B5 – Pantothenic Acid ? (yes) 50 mg/kg
B6 – Pyridoxine ? (yes) 38 mg/kg
B7 – Biotin ? (yes) 1 mg/kg
B9 – Folic Acid (yes) (yes) 5.2 mg/kg
B12 – Cobalamins (yes) (yes) 50 mg/kg
Magnesium 0.099 ? 0.1

Since the foods that I mentioned are simply those that I am familiar with and not anything that I originally researched with cardiac issues in mind, I would recommend that you use this as a springboard for your own research. Maybe there is a better option in Innova EVO, Artemis, etc. Finish out a chart similar to that above on each of the brands that this website lists as top-tier choices. Feel free to call companies like Merrick or Hill’s to ask about specific quantities of items on their ingredients list, but not in their analysis (like B vitamins).

You might also want to consult with a veterinarian that specializes in cardiac issues regarding dietary recommendations and possible supplements. Maybe it is more cost-effective or bioavailable to top-dress your pets dinner with certain vitamins (L-carnitine perhaps). As wonderful as your veterinarian my be, my experience is that the time constraints of their day-to-day rigamarole does not allow time for general practitioners to be current and thorough on more specific issues. Reading journal articles falls to the wayside. Specialist consultation and personal research are important any time you have a specific veterinary/medical diagnosis of concern. Your vet has to have a working knowledge of EVERYTHING. You can concentrate on the single issue that is of prominent importance for your pet.

Good Luck

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi KC-Cajun –

If your dog is battling a yeast overgrowth the best thing to do is to eliminate (or limit as much as possible) grains (corn, rice, oats, etc.) and starches (white potato, tapioca, peas, etc.). Your best option – foodwise – would be to feed a home-prepared diet with no starchy ingredients, a canned food free of grains and starches, a freeze-dried food free of grains and starches or a dehydrated food free of grains and starches. Kibble is a bakery product so by nature it must contain starch in some form as a binder, kibble would therefore be your worst option. If you must feed kibble go with something high in protein (>35%) and white potato/grain-free – such as Orijen or Nature’s Variety Instinct. You may also want to go with a novel protein and avoid chicken (all Blue Wilderness formulas are primarily chicken-based), I’ve heard of this contributing to yeast in dogs that are sensitive to common proteins. I would also recommend supplementing your dog’s diet with a high quality multi-strain probiotic, yeast is a “bad” bacteria so feeding probiotics which are “good” bacteria can help get the yeast overgrowth under control. Some good options are: Swanson Ultra Soil Based Organisms (15 strains, plus enzymes and whole food nutrients), Garden of Life Primal Defense (12 strains plus whole food nutrients) or Mercola’s Probiotics (14 strains). Disinfect the ears with with witch hazel and cotton balls. Make sure all the debris is removed from the ears daily. Results won’t happen overnight, so once you get on a better food, start supplementing the diet and disinfecting the ears give it some time. It could take a month or two to get the yeast under control.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi fortunatecookie –

Lucky dogs – Orijen and NV Instinct are my two favorite kibbles. I feed raw now, but when I fed kibble my dog did far better on these two foods than on any others. Both are labeled for “All Life Stages.” The AAFCO recognizes two nutrient profiles: growth and maintenance. If a food meets the more stringent “growth” requirement the company can choose to label it as “All Life Stages” rather then “Puppy” or “Growth.” So a food labeled for all life stages is the same as a puppy food. Personally, I wouldn’t switch to one brand. Feeding one brand continuously is very unhealthy – dogs, like people, need variety, there is no “perfect” food. Both are wonderful foods so I would rotate both dogs between brands and maybe even pick out a third brand to rotate in occasionally.

[fortunatecookie]

I have a German shepherd that’s been on orijens for the last 3 years of his life.
He’s not finicky. He’ll literally eat anything. We were told by his breeder to give him this brand, which we’ve done for his entire life.
We recently adopted a Pomeranian puppy. 3 months old. We got him on Nature’s Variety, recommended by a store employee. It’s the same brand that makes the frozen versions.

Now I’m thinking I either switch them both on one brand. I don’t know what I was thinking. Orijens makes a puppy version meanwhile, Nature’s Variety is an all age type.
Suggestions???

[Melissaandcrew]

Hi CP-

Pick some foods that your rescue would be interested in and either email or call them. Explain that you are a rescue and are wondering if they have “kennel” discounts.Some do, some do not. You may find one that is willing to partner with your program the same as SD. As a kennel owner, I found that many of the companies gave me their distributors info and I was able to call and check out pricing-there are volume discounts out there, but other than SD(last I knew food was free, shelter paid for shipping) I really don’t know of any that do that-I would suggest trying Fromm, Nutrisource and Victor for decent foods in bulk.

momofmutts -Acana/orijen breeder program is buy 6 and get 1 free-but all 6 bags have to be purchased at the same time.

[InkedMarie]

Mike,
I think you’re the only one who can edit the list….can you add Orijen Regional Red Whole Prey to the list?

thanks!

[Hound Dog Mom]

DoggieDoc22 –

You obviously don’t know my feeding philosophy – I don’t let any company influence my decision on what to feed. I’m not fooled by Blue Buffalo and Wellness commercials or the Blue Buffalo or Orijen rep at my local pet food company. I’m not fooled by dry weight versus wet ingredients or ingredient splitting, nor do I think white potato is superior to grains. In fact I wouldn’t feed any of the foods you mentioned to my dogs (Blue, Wellness, Natural Balance, etc.). My dogs eat real food. Raw meat, bones, organs and whole food supplements the way nature intended – no marketing spin there, no ingredient splitting, no reps selling me food and no need to worry about which ingredients are going in dry and which are going in wet. You’re bashing people for buying into the marketing of certain pet food companies when you are just as blinded by the marketing tactics of the big name pet food companies as anyone else is by the small “holistic companies.”

[DoggieDoc22]

“There is also such a thing as consumers fooled by marketing tactics”

It’s funny that you mention that because that’s exactly the way to describe people like yourself, backyardwolf, and BryanV21. Who exactly is it that you ever hear bashing corn, wheat, soy, etc? Let me guess, Blue Buffalo commercials, Wellness commercials, etc. There is absolutely zero research out there that shows that any of the ingredients you list are harmful or of lower quality in any way than potatoes for instance (since that is the carb of choice in Natural Balance since that brand was mentioned in a prior post). The whole “grain-free”/anti-corn kick that has been going around lately is nothing but marketing spin by pet food manufacturers.

The reason is simple, humans, dogs, cats, gorillas, whatever animal you choose to speak of don’t need ingredients. They don’t consume food to fulfill a need for any particular food. They need nutrients. You could put together the most expensive pile of ingredients you could find, mix them all together and feed them to your dog. If they don’t meet your pets nutritional requirements then you just fed them a crap food.

I think a lot of you would benefit greatly from listening to someone other than the Blue Buffalo or Orijen rep at your local pet store and look at the science. Some companies actually spend money researching what is best for your pet and conducting feeding trials to make sure the animals they are intending to feed thrive on their diets. Believe it or not, you can find some actual research based information on the internet, rather than the usual baseless spin put out there by manufacturers. For your own benefit, here is a good place to start: http://www.tufts.edu/vet/nutrition/faq/general_pet_nutrition.html

You might find this section in particular quite enlightening:

“Is the ingredient list a good way to determine the quality of a pet food?

Although ingredient lists are commonly used by lay people to determine the quality of pet foods, this approach has many pitfalls and is very subjective to intentional manipulation by the food manufacturers. Ingredients are listed on labels in order of weight, including water, so ingredients with high water content (like fresh meats and vegetables) are going to be listed higher than similar amounts of dry ingredients even though they may contribute fewer nutrients to the overall diet. Additionally, ingredients from the same source (such as chicken meat, chicken fat, chicken by-product meal) can be split into component parts, further complicating assessment.

Pets require nutrients, not ingredients; a diet full of great sounding ingredients can be less nutritious than a diet containing less appealing (to people) ingredients.”

[Hound Dog Mom]

Well, Nature’s Logic contains millet which is technically a “pseudo-grain.” As far as grains go – millet doesn’t concern me too much. I have an awful time finding foods for my cats – well one of my cats. My males can and will eat anything, but my female is very picky and has had an extremely sensitive stomach since she was a kitten (as a kitten she was very sick so I almost wonder if this had something to do with it?). Anyways, the vet can’t find anything medically wrong with her and of course the vet’s only suggestion is prescription food. The hardest part about her food sensitivities is that there doesn’t seem to be any rhyme or reason to which foods work and which don’t. I’ve tried many foods and can’t seem to find any correlation between grain-inclusive vs. grain-free, protein source, protein levels, fat levels, etc. I had her on Blue for awhile and she ate it and it agreed with her, but after getting some moldy food decided it was time for a switch. I tried several new foods and all the foods I wanted to work, like Orijen and NV Instinct, she either wouldn’t eat or ate and then puked up (go figure…). I finally decided to try NL and she loves it and doesn’t puke it up! I’m even able to rotate between all three formulas without any issues.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi sheeklouch –

Orijen is a wonderful food (it’s actually the best dry food out there – imo), however (unfortunately) none of their formulas are appropriate for large breed puppies – they are all much too high in calcium. For this reason, I’ve never fed Orijen to any of my pups but I have fed it to my adult with great success.

Gertie my now two year old female ate The Honest Kitchen (Zeal, Love, Thrive) and Tripett until she was 8 months old. Mabel, my newest addition, who just turned 7 months old has been on a controlled calcium homemade raw diet since she came to me at 8 weeks (my other two dogs eat raw now as well).

I think that most dogs do well on high protein foods (Gertie and Mabel both ate >40% protein on average) – if your dog is having loose stools with high protein foods I’d suggest trying a spoonful of plain canned pumpkin, a multi-strain probiotic and digestive enzymes at each meal.

Assuming you want to stick with a dry food, here is a list of recommended foods. Sometimes it’s trial and error and you may need to try a few foods before you find on that works for your dog. Some dogs are just more sensitive than others.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwApI_dhlbnFY183Q0NVRXlidWc/edit

[sheeklouch]

Dear Hound Dog Mom,

I have a 13 week old pure bread Bullmastiff and I was wondering what you would recommend feeding him. The breeder recommended that we feed him Orijen Large Puppy Breed and the reviews all seemed positive so we gave it a try. After a few weeks, he is having trouble digesting it and having very soft stools almost diarrhea like. The vet told us that sometimes the high amount of protein in Orijen is hard for young puppies to digest and we should try switching over to a different type of food with a protein level around 30%. What would you recommend we switch too? Thanks!

[soho]

Hi Krist

A lot of dogs seem to be on only one type of insulin and it is usually a medium acting insulin which has a slope like a long in distance, short in height hill. This type of insulin makes it pretty impossible to control diabetes well. A dog must eat at the same times each day and the same amount of food at each meal.

In humans the best control of blood sugars is achieved using a very long acting insulin like lantus combined with a short acting insulin like humulin R. The short acting insulin is taken about 30 to 45 minutes before meals and the long acting insulin is taken once or twice daily to cover the glucose that is constantly being produced by the liver.

This type of insulin regimen requires more daily injections but it allows for several things that are not possible with a more simple insulin regimen:

1)Meals can be eaten at any time of day or night.
2)Meals don’t always have to be the same size and contain the exact same amount of carbs.
3)If your dog is sick or not eating you don’t have to freak out because you are worried that your dog will have low blood sugar because they didn’t eat.
4) You can adjust one of the insulins without also increasing or decreasing the size and content of meals.
5) Your dog will have much better control of his/her diabetes.

With the more intense insulin regimen meals and liver metabolism are handled separately allowing for a more effective control of blood glucose.

FOODS

I believe that carbs are the enemy of anything (human, dog or otherwise) that has diabetes. I don’t agree with the Glycemic Research Institute that dry foods such as Nutrisca and Orijen are optimal for a dog with diabetes. Nutrisca has an estimated 36% carbs on a dry matter basis. Orijen has 25% carbs as estimated using the NFE (nitrogen free extract) method (this is extremely reliable). I think either % of carbs is waaay too much for a diabetic dog. If there were several foods with let’s say a carb content below 15% then I would look for the one with the lowest glycemic load. But if one food has 35% carbs and another food has 15% carbs it wouldn’t matter to me what the glycemic load of the first food was, I would choose the food with only 15% carbs!!!!

In dry foods (kibbles) the lowest carb content I have found is EVO which ranges from 12 to 18% carbs depending on the variety and Epigen (Thank you Hound Dog Mom) which has only 11% carbs in either of the 2 formulas.

In wet foods maybe you could just add some fresh meat which is in the same family (red, poultry or fish) that you are feeding at any particular meal. You are guaranteed a much higher quality topper if you add your own rather than a canned food.

Good Luck!!!

[jnite]

Hi all, I would just like your opinions. I own a pet store and am bringing in some new foods. Currently I carry Acana, Orijen and Lifetime. I am most probably bringing in a few Blue Buffalo skus as well. I am probably going to bring in 1 or 2 more lines. I am leaning towards taste of the wild for one. For the other I am really not sure, I would like a food that is 4-5 stars, but hopefully around the 40-50 dollar range. Soooo with that info what do you think would be a good choice?

[sisu]

I have a 7 year old who is a spinal walking paraplegic. He has no feeling from the waist down. He can walk due to muscle memory which 10-15% of dogs maintain. There is limited bladder and bowel control. Although the conditions are different our goals in waste management may be the same.

Grain inclusive foods result in big fluffy poop. Grain free with the highest meat content and lowest carbs give the best results when feeding kibble. With a balanced raw diet there is barely any waste. Therefore, the poop is very small, ring finger to little finger size. If Prey Model Raw (PMR) is not an option consider premade raw with the highest meat content. After 5 years of trial and error I have found that EVO Herring and Salmon kibble works very well. As almost a contradiction to my high meat, low carb, low fiber rule Blue Buffalo Wilderness Salmon also results in small size poop. I suspect it may be due to the digestibility of the menhaden fish meal. Of the two brands EVO poop is smaller. Some companies will send free samples. Use the contact link on their websites to make the request.

I feed as close to 6 am and 6 pm as possible. There are very few treats given. Rewards are enthusiastic chin scratches and lots of happy, verbal praise. By restricting the frequency of food going in I can predict that poop will happen an hour to and hour and a half after each meal. Exercise will cause him to poop sooner rather than later. Anal stimulation either by lightly touching around the outside of the anus or using a KY jelly lubricated thermometer inserted into the rectum with some slight movement will cause him to poop a couple of hours sooner than expected. Although I have rarely used either of these methods they are useful for getting things back on schedule. If used frequently poop on demand becomes the schedule rather than allowing his natural digestion to establish a schedule.

Below is a list of meat protein in various brands of kibble that I have collected from the ‘net. I have not fed these brands. Although I trust the sources of the information I cannot guarantee it.

Dr. Tim’s Momentum 35/25, 96%
Native Level 4, 35/25, 93%
Diamond Extreme Athlete, 93%
Inukshuk 32/32, 95%
Annamet should be 90+%. Specific amt. is not known.
Orijen 82%
Horizon Legacy 80%
Instinct 70%.
Merrick grain free 70%

I am unsure if the constant leg movement your boy has are muscle spasms. If so, daily muscle massage of the legs and along the spine similar to Tellington Touch, gentle repetitive bicycle movement, and flexing the leg joints and toes may help. All is done slowly. Stop if there is a spasm. Resume when the muscles relax. After 2 years of daily massage/flexing therapy Connor has no spasms.

If your dog is being treated by a general vet I would suggest a visit to a veterinary neurologist or neurosurgeon. Not for surgery but to evaluate and treat the current condition. For example, there is medication that can help with muscle spasms. Also, if it is in the budget, professional physical therapy can help with lingering issues. If the carts were not professionally fitted a neurologist or physical therapist may be able to resolve the current problems.

If interested in raw feeding:
http://preymodelraw.com/how-to-get-started/
http://puppybutt.weebly.com/uploads/7/6/9/2/7692088/beginners_guide_to_prey_model_raw_rv.4.1.pdf

The Paralysis: Neurological and IVDD forum is very helpful and informative.
http://www.handicappedpet.net/helppets/

I hope some of this helps.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi gypsygirl –

A good place for this post would be the Diet and Health issues thread. The difference between grain-free and hypoallergenic is that hypoallergenic foods just avoid common allergens, grain-free is just grain-free. Hypoallergenic foods are often grain free, but they generally use a novel protein as well. Was your dog itching on Orijen? If she wasn’t I’d go back to that, it’s a great food. Dandelion in the food shouldn’t bother her because of pollen allergies. Another food you might want to check out is Nature’s Variety Instinct – they have a Limited Ingredient line that uses novel proteins and it’s grain free and white potato free.

[Jens]

Due to having a life besides my dogs, but having the desire to feed them a healthy raw diet, I was wondering what is a simply reciept to feed them daily the same food home made mix. I have two old Malamute/Retriever mixes and two young 3 months old puppies. All are currently on Orijen (large breed and adult) dry food, which they like and do well on. Also, how do you grind your meat, especially the bones and does anybody have a recommendation for a meat grinder.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Mike P –

You’re right – potato has a high glycemic index. However what you want to look at is glycemic load – glycemic load measures how the food will impact blood sugar based on the amount of the food eaten. Meaning, just because a food contains an ingredient that is high glycemic doesn’t necessarily mean the food as a whole is high glycemic. For example, Orijen contains white potato (a high glycemic ingredient) however, because they use such a small amount of white potato and such a large volume of meat, the food as a whole is low glycemic (certified low glycemic by the glycemic research institute). Looking at EVO’s protein content (without calling the company) I would assume the food is likely low glycemic. Also, not all of EVO’s formulas contain white potato – the weight management formula (which looks like a wonderful option for dogs with diabetes) is white potato free and has 52% protein and 15% fat, the fish formula is white potato free as well. Now on the flip side, you could use a binder with a lower glycemic index than white potato but if the food is a lot lower in protein/contains much less meat and higher in carbs/contains more binder – that food could actually have a greater impact on blood sugar then a food that contains a large volume of meat and a small amount of a high glycemic binder. White potato and tapioca are both high glycemic but if used in a high quality food with a large volume of meat and only minimum amounts of binders, they shouldn’t affect blood sugar significantly. That’s my understanding (James feel free to correct me if I’m wrong).

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi James –

I think I take a slightly different approach to evaluating kibbles than some others. I feel that all binders have their pro’s and con’s and I don’t believe that any (grains, potatoes, tapioca, legumes) are species-appropriate for dogs. I’d rather pick a food based on overall meat/protein content rather than ruling out a food based on the binder used – because ideally there should only be a very small amount of the binder (not enough to significantly affect glycemic load) and different foods with different binders should be fed rotationally in order to mitigate the negative aspects of any one food. You need to remember that the amount of the binder used is most important. Just because a food contains a high glycemic ingredient (like tapioca or white potato) doesn’t necessarily mean the food itself is high-glycemic. For example, Orijen contains white potato but it is a a certified low glycemic food by the glycemic research institute because the amount of white potato included in the food is so small that it doesn’t have a significant affect on the overall glycemic load of the food. When I fed kibble I rotated through tapioca-based foods, potato based foods, legume-based foods and would even occasionally use a grain-inclusive food if the grains used weren’t too offensive (I don’t mind millet or quinoa on occasion) and the protein levels were high. Luckily now I make my own food and don’t have to add any binders.

[Safe4pups]

Make sure your dogs aren’t using smoked or cooked bones – raw is what you want. 🙂
As for your budget, I have found that I can buy premium food online at MUCH better prices – including free shipping and NO tax! I have 3 dogs and 2 cats – 2 dogs on Nutrisca and the cats and 1 dog on Orijen and I pay about 23% less online.

[Toxed2loss]

Hi Tay,
Looks like you’ve been working hard to get to the bottom of this. 🙂 Let me toss a few things out. Have you tried a potato & grain free, high protein food? I noticed Orijen had both potato & sweet potato. That’s a lot of starch. Starch is converted to glucose, which triggers insulin, which opens the ‘gate’ that says “make fat.” Were you aware that potatoes have toxins? They’re from the deadly nightshade family. If your pup is having immune system problems (too many toxins – dietary & environmental) she may be putting on fat, as a secondary defense mechanism. I’m toxically injured. When my primary detox metabolism failed, my body started creating fat out of my own body tissue, encasing the toxins and storing them in adipose tissue… So even when I was barely eating, I was putting on weight. Its very common with the Toxically Injured (TI), and pets have the same response. So, we can take a look at what your environment looks like, what you’re pup’s vaccine and worming schedule is and boost her immune system.

Personally, I like Brother’s Complete, as the best kibble. It has a unique encapsulated probiotic, that feeds the entire digestive system. The gut is the foundation of the immune system. It also doesn’t have the toxins that I see in a lot of other foods, even some of the “high end” ones. I also feed raw. You might want to look at that, to reduce the carbs. Dogs don’t have a dietary need for carbs. So reducing them won’t do him any harm. Steve Brown recommends 5-6% carbs, but more in the line of dark green leafies, or high antioxidants. I also like to give astaxanthin from Mercola(dot)com.

Any way, its a waste of money & your dog’s health to not clean up her environment, in addition to her diet, so read the “detoxing” and “vaccinating” threads, under “diet & health,” and then let me know if you need any more help. 🙂

[husky3]

Hello,
I have a 4yo spayed Siberian husky that is about 8-10 lbs overweight.
She has been on a low calorie diet, for almost a year with no results. We’ve tried all different kinds of food trying to find one that will help her loose weight to no avail. We have tried high protein diets like Orijen, (taking into great consideration the amount of calories she gets a day) and are now on Wellness healthy weight recipe as our vet recommended. (I’d like to get her on the Acana light & fit, but it is not available in the U.S.) All blood results came back normal, except the high cholesterol, due to her being overweight. Her excercise consists of a 2.5 – 4.5 mile run daily, or 1 – 2 hours at the dog park running and playing.

We have 3 huskies, and the other two are in great shape, and get just as much exercise, and more food (Orijen.)

The only thing I have not definitively ruled out is Cushings, however, the vet said it was unlikely she had Cushings.

Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can do to help her lose weight? I am concerned that the amount of food she gets is not sufficient for the amount of excercise she gets. She just won’t lose weight!

I am at a loss, thoughts and suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
Tay

• This topic was modified 13 years, 3 months ago by husky3.

[Shawna]

Hi poochie1059 — I agree with everything Hound Dog Mom wrote. Many better quality foods are appropriate for puppy, adult and senior dogs.

I wanted to add, MANY of us here on DFA, including Dr. Mike, believe in rotational feeding. We switch our dogs food regularly. Some switch daily, some with each new bag of kibble, some every other month and so on. If you start when the dog is a puppy and feed the same quality of foods you can switch between foods without having to “transition”. Dogs should be able to eat whatever (that is appropriate) you put in front of them. By only feeding one food we actually create sensitive tummies.

I rotate with every new bag of food and buy the smaller 5 and 6lb bags. I rotate proteins as well as brands. I use a variety of 5 star “all life stage” foods for all the dogs in my home including the foster puppies the adults and the seniors (I have 8 dogs and foster for Boston and Papillon rescue). The foods I use include Acana, Orijen, Brothers Complete, Merrick, Earthborn, Nature’s Variety, Nature’s Logic etc.

Additionally, many of us put “toppers” on our dogs’ foods. The topper can include canned foods, dehydrated, commercial raw, sardines, raw or lightly cooked egg etc. All these add extra nutrition and variety — sardines as an example are a great source of extra protein and omega 3 fatty acids.

Good luck with and best of health to your puppy!!!

[Safe4pups]

Hi Sophia – both of my allergy prone dogs use Nutrisca which is grain and potato free. They both have environmental allergies and one has a potato sensitivity, and one has pancreatitis. Grains and potatoes both aggravate allergies and feed yeast. I have used both the Salmon and Chicken varieties. I also use Orijen for another dog but it may be too rich for your pup – unless it’s the senior formula. Honestly, my girl is 10 and has suffered since she was a puppy and she has done measureably better on Nutrisca – and I have spared no expense trying to find the right food for her – including a home cooked diet.
~Tracey

[charliedog]

Science Diet and Royal Canin, in my opinion, are both crap. You need to feed a grain free food like Natures Variety or Orijen. Natures Variety has a food that is stripped down to the basics just for dogs with severe allergies.

[Hound Dog Mom]

mcaponigro –

I agree. I think some are led to believe a grain-free or grain-free/white potato free food is automatically superior or “species appropriate”, which isn’t the case. There are some wonderful grain-free and white potato free foods, but many more that are low protein, high carb and in no way species-appropriate. Whether the binder is grain, potato, tapioca or legumes – one must keep in mind that none are appropriate foods for a dog (carnivore) to be eating. The most important thing when feeding dry food is – in my opinion – focus more on maximizing meat content and protein content rather than picking a food based on which binder it uses. It’s also important to remember that just because a food contains an ingredient that is high glycemic doesn’t necessarily mean that the food is high glycemic – for an example, Orijen – which contains white potato – is one of the few foods certified low glycemic by the glycemic research institute. I think the only way one can truly avoid these high carb fillers is to go with an all meat or all meat and non-starchy vegetable canned food or feed a homemade diet free from grains and other starches.

[InkedMarie]

Avoderm-their revolving menu only
Back to Basics-all grainfree’s
Brothers Complete-all
California Natural grain free-salmon & peas, kangaroo & lentils, chicken
Canidae Grain Free Pure Land
Canine Caviar-all grainfree’s
DNA-all
Earthborn-Meadow Feast and Great Plains
Evangers grainfree-both
Evo herring & salmon
Evo weight management
Freehand-Energize only
Grandma Lucy’s Pureformance-all
Grandma Mae’s Country Natural-grainfree only
Great Life Pioneer Naturals grain free-all
Great Life-all
Hi-Tek Naturals GF Chicken and Sweet Potato
Horizon Amicus-all
Horizon Legacy-all
Horizon Pulsar-both
I and Love and You Nude Food
Innova Prime-all
LiveFree (by Dogswell)
Nature’s Select grain free-all
Nature’s Variety Instinct-all including raw boost
NRG-Maxim
Nutripe-all
Nutrisca-all grainfree’s
NutriSource grainfree-all except the large breed chicken & large breed lamb
Pet Botanics-Healthy Omega only
Precise grain free-both
Red Moon-high protein chicken, moderate protein chicken only
Sojos grainfree-all
Spring Meadows-all
The Honest Kitchen-Zeal only
Victor grainfree-all
Wellness Core Wild Game
Wysong Epigen-fish formula
Zignature-all
Ziwi Peak-all of the air dried
Orijen
Halo Spot’s Choice (canned)

• This topic was modified 12 years, 2 months ago by Mike Sagman. Reason: Added 4 new foods submitted by PugMomSandy
• This topic was modified 12 years, 2 months ago by Mike Sagman. Reason: Added 2 more candidates submitted by PugMomSandy

[feathers83]

Mydogisme, I just went through this with my boy over the last 5 months- tests, medications, etc. I basically fed him whatever he wanted and he seemed to do really well on the Orijen red meat. It was the only food I found that he actually looked excited to get and it was high enough calorie to help him gain some weight back. He also varied between the deli fresh rolls, Weruva canned, and baby food (without garlic or onions). Our vet also did therapeutic laser treatment to help him regenerate blood cells, which made him feel better for a few months. We never did find a cause and he wasn’t vaccinated this year. Best of luck to your Dixie, it’s a horrible disease.

[Shawna]

Hi Rainisdog ~~ no, high fiber is not as good.. Actually higher fiber does make the pup feel better but it also causes nutrient loss. Fiber prevents certain minerals from being absorbed. Like Sandy, I’ve had the best luck (with my foster dogs) feeding above average protein, moderate fat and low carbs. I even add high protein canned food as a topper to up the protein even more. My Papillon lost 15 pounds on a diet like this.

I rotate as well so my Pap was getting a variety of foods — Orijen, Brothers, Acana, Nature’s Variety Instinct etc. Even now, at 14 pounds she only gets 1/4 cup per meal with a teaspoon of canned. Any more than that and she gains weight. I only give treats when I leave the house and then only give a treat about the size of a dime or less.

Mimi, my once obese Pap, was 6 when she came to us and started her diet.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Shinigamigirl428 –

I have three bloodhounds myself.

My first question is, is the dog underweight? If the dog is not underweight ignore this behavior. This is typical for a bloodhound and your family member shouldn’t feel bad or like the dog is being deprived. Bloodhounds are chowhounds and their number one focus in life is food – their entire day revolves around mealtime and when their next meal will be. They have no appetite regulation and will eat until they burst. They’re also noted for eating anything and everything, especially when puppies. They can be a danger to themselves when not supervised, they can get into poisonous things or items that will cause intestinal obstruction. My older female (now 2) ate an ENTIRE 5 pound bag of birdseed when she was a puppy – it was left out and she ripped into it. She was pooping out sunflower seeds all day. This is the type of thing you deal with when you own a bloodhound.

Earthborn isn’t a bad food by any means. I do feel Orijen is slightly better, but if Earthborn is what your family member can afford there’s no reason to feel bad about feeding it. It’s a quality food. I feed my three homemade raw and they do seem to be a little more satisfied on this than when they weren’t fed raw. You can try adding in some pumpkin or other veggies to the food to make her feel more satisfied but I can almost assure you that it won’t stop the behavior. This is normal behavior for a bloodhound and nothing to be alarmed about.

[shinigamigirl428]

I am trying to get some info for a family member who has a 5 yr. old, 90lb female bloodhound that is eating 4+ cups of food a day. She’s reasonably active, and according to the food calculator on here should eat between 4.09 to 4.65 cups per day(split into 2 feedings) for the food she is on ( Earthborn: Coastal Catch, switched from pedigree about 4 months ago). She is constantly howling and barking that she wants food, and has recently been chewing things around the house.

I suggested: A higher protein food (such as Orijen), but was told it’s too expensive.
adding veggies to food. She just spits them out onto the floor.

I am at my wit’s end trying to figure out what to give this dog. Any suggestions would be extremely helpful!

Thank you!

[BryanV21]

Normally my response to questions regarding weight loss mention lowering carbohydrates, and feeding a food with more meat/animal-based proteins, based on the fact that a dog’s system is designed for digesting animal-based proteins moreso than carbs.

However, you’re feeding a food that I’d normally think was good. So perhaps we need to take another step and look at the calorie content of the food, along with possibly adding a supplement. What you can do is try the Pacifica from Acana, which is the sister brand of Orijen, as both are made by Champion Pet Foods out of Canada. The Pacifica is 421 kcal/cup, where as 6 Fish is 480 kcal/cup.

You can also try adding pumpkin or green beans, and cut back on the food a bit. The pumpkin and green beans should add minimal calories, without any added, but will “bulk up” the feeding. Now, you don’t want to cut back on too much food, as you still want to give your pup enough of the vitamins and minerals that a full diet provides.

[pugmomsandy]

I would just focus on the lower carb part and stick with above-average protein and average/above average fat. Low fat is not absolutely necessary for weight loss. What size are the jerky treats? Maybe you can cut down on those too or you need to reduce the food by the amount of jerky she gets. You can also just reduce the amount your serving of Orijen and you can feed Orijen to the puppy. My 23-24 lb pugs get 2/3 cup of kibble a day. Maybe she’s just eating too much. And at 7 yrs, that’s not old!!

[rainisdog]

Hey!
I have a 7yr old chihuahua daschund mix who is about 15 pounds. I am currently feeding her Orijen Fish 1/3 cup twice a day with about 5 chicken jerky treats a week. I can tell the extra weight on her is slowing her down and she looks uncomfortable. For awhile she was doing great going on walks but lately she doesn’t want to go far. While I am going to continue walking with her, I want to give her the best food or combinations of foods possible to help her loose weight. I don’t think raw is an option but I have been looking into dehydrated/ dried foods, I am just unsure of what to look for. I think high fiber and protein with low fat and carbs? If that is correct (and using this website as a guide) what % are high/low? Should I focus more on high protein or fiber or low fat? I would really appreciate any help or suggestions!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Marie,

My dogs generally get 1-2 grain-free biscuits or freeze-dried raw treats per day. Right now I have Nature’s Variety Instinct biscuits, I also frequently use Darford Zero-G and the grain-free Cloudstar Buddy Biscuits (I’ve ordered the Sojo’s grain-free biscuits before but they’re way too small for my dogs). For freeze-dried I have the Wysong Dream treats right now, I also use the Nature’s Variety Instinct and Stella & Chewy’s freeze-dried raw medallions.

After their evening walk every day they get a “kongsicle” – they each have a large kong that I layer with a 4 or 5 star grain-free kibble and the canned Fruitables Pumpkin or Sweet Potato supplement and freeze it. I use whatever kibbles I can get samples of or buy trial-sized bags of. Right now I’m using Orijen and Petcurean. It keeps them out of my hair while I make dinner lol

For training treats I use ZiwiPeak food (I buy the 8 oz. trial sized packages).

Every night before bed they get a dried trachea, bully stick or pig ear.

The only day they don’t get treats is Sunday (they fast on Sundays).