[Susan]

Hi Heytsu,

Change vets ASAP sounds like you have a vet that doesn’t know what she is doing??, some vets are awful, same happened with me with my Boxer years ago, now I have a rescue Staffy named Patch who has IBD we had to see 3 vets before we found a really good vet that wasnt into just feeding these vet diets, vet diets don’t agree with some dogs…. Vet should of prescribe “Metronidazole” antibiotic for stomach & bowel taken twice a day every 12 hours with a meal… for 14-21 days

Alot of dogs who have IBS/IBD symptoms do very well on a grainfree dry food that has limited ingredients & have Sweet Potato & Potato & only has 1 meat protein, what country do you live?
I live Australia & we get the Royal Canine Sensitivity Control & so does Europe/UK
My Patch did really bad on all the Hills & Royal Canine vet diets, the only vet diet that worked was the Eukanuba Intestinal Low Residue dry kibble, take vet diet food back & get a refund & see another vet, go on a day your vet isnt there & say I do not want to see her again, thats what I did when Patches vet wouldnt listen & change him form the Royal Canine Hypoallergenic vet diet, it only has 1% fiber this could be the problem, something is wrong with your dog..
I did Endoscope & 2 x Biopsies you need to do biopsies so vet can see whats wrong, Ultra Scan is NO good, its a waste of money as it still doesn’t give vet any real answers, Ultra Scan is good if dog has a blockage, the biopsies are the best to do..

Do NOT give any boil any rice as boiled rice can irritates the bowel more sometimes, its very old school boiled rice, now vets recommend boiled potato or sweet potato its more gentle on their stomach & bowel, especially when the bowel is already inflammed, boil some peeled cut up potato & add a lean cooked white meat, like turkey breast, chicken breast or lean pork… feed 3-4 times a day…
Resting the bowel for 24 hours is good to do, Patch had to rest his stomach & bowel for 48hrs you must give electroytes in water every hour in a 20ml syringe if the dog isnt eating long for a long period of time, look for vet that specializes in IBD & is supportive & more into holistic ways & not into pushing vet diets as they can make things worse… rest stomach & bowel 24hrs then restart food some boiled potato or sweet potato & turkey breast 1/2 & 1/2, feed 4 small meals..no treats nothing just the boiled sweet potato or potato & a lean white meat..

Join this facebook group, “Dogs with Inflammatory Bowel Disease IBD – Raw Feeding & Holistic Support” You’ll get heaps of help..You dont have to fed raw diet to join group…
https://www.facebook.com/groups/292537937935806/

When you say Surgery, what type of surgery did your dog have & how old is he??

[joanne l]

I agree corn is much better than peas and legumes. Other grains are good as well. I forget to mention, when my dog was on a food than contain some corn gluten meal he had better muscle mass than on grain free, but that’s my dog don’t know about anybody else. Plus with all that fiber in grain free my dog had a lot more BM.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 7 months ago by joanne l.

[Susan]

Hi Jill,
I had a Boxer Angie she had Mast Cell Tumors diagnosed age 8yrs old, she wasnt her happy self, no more she was sleeping more, didn’t want to go on her daily walks or come in the car shopping, her poos became black, vomiting blood, so I took her to see the RSPCA vet where I adopted her from 6yrs before, the vet asked me has she eaten breakfast this morning, I said no Ang eats breakfast at 11am, the vet said I want to remove these lumps ASAP now they don’t look good, I said but I seen another vet where I live about 1 yr ago, the vet said not the vet on Darby st, please say no, I said yes, we always walk past to go to the beach & one day I seen her out the front with another vet who was visiting from America, I stopped & I showed them both her wierd looking lump on the back of her leg, they BOTH said its nothing, its just an old lady wort, its nothing to worry about, this RSPCA vet just shook her head & said if these lumps were removed 1 yr year ago the cancer wouldn’t be as this advanced….Angie had a few Mast Cell tumors 1 on back of her leg & other lumps & bumps all were removed she looked a Quit, full of patches everywhere, 1/2 of her nipples were removed, when I came to take her home that afternoon, the vet said we have removed more then we thought, she wasnt allowed to come home & had to stay the night the poor thing….
She had another operation as some of the Mast Cell Tumors came back within 3months of removing, my mum said, let her go Susan, I said but she looks good, the little bit of weight she had lost made her her perfect weight 30kg, then she was cancer free BUT she didn’t get better, so the RSPCA vet said you can do Endoscope to see if she has Ulcers from the Mast Cell Tumors as the Mast Cell sets off histimines that attacks the stomach..So I was reffered to another vet that had the Endoscope Camera, it became the vet practice where I go now & take my Staffy Patch who has IBD…
My Angie never got better it was all down hill, I wish I listened to the first vet from the RSPCA when he said, I can put her to sleep on the back seat of your car, I thought to myself, Im not putting my Angie to sleep on my back seat of my car… I was thinking what will I do without my Angie, I cant put her to sleep its all too quick, the same vet did say to me, you have to be strong Susan, Angie sounds like she has been there for you 6 years now? so its your turn now to help her…. I couldn’t put her to sleep, my daughter couldnt PTS either, so I wasted another few thousand dollars doing Endoscope, she had no ulcers & the stupid vet didnt do any biospies, so the Endoscope was pointless but I didnt know all this back then 2009 now I do….
Angie was put on ant acid meds Zantac & Carafate, other medications Valium, Pain meds that made her feel very sick, nausea, vomit, I dont think she could take the Prednisone she took something else similiar, I cant remember the name its started with S she was also put on Hills Z/D dry food in the end & this caused extream stomach pain & she refused to eat it, I told the new vet & he said, Oh she’s just spoilt she’ll eat it, I have found male vets are heartless when it comes to a sick dog, I prefer lady vets & lady vet nurses..
We had had another sleepless 1/2 of the night again up 12am-3am, Angie crying with her pain, so I ended up ringing a mobil vet 8.30am Saturday morning, the mobil vet came 9am & he said gee are you sure she is sick, she started running around all excited we had a visitor, the vet said, she’s in really good condition, then I showed him Angies vet folder, all her tests, her operations, all the meds we had tried & they didnt help etc then he gave her a valium injection, then I talked to Angie for 20mins told her we are going for a walk to the beach I’ll see you at the beach Ang & the vet put her to sleep, he said she’ll have green dreams now…Finally she was painfree… I couldnt fix my Angie, she never had a sick day in her life until she turned 8yrs old, she could eat anything, she was a beautiful dog, a real lady … 🙁

The Nature’s Logic canned rabbit food you’re feeding is 7%min fat, when you convert that to dry matter (Kibble) this is around 35-40%max fat, this would be too high in fat for Nilla, you’re better off cooking & making her a bland diet with lean white meats like Turkey breast, lean Pork, I know you said No pork but the Natures Logic wet can rabbit food has Pork liver in it, she’ll probably do really well on pork, alot of IBD dogs do very well eating sweet Potato, white Potato, Gluten Free Pasta, I know she needs to have some fat in her diet to gain some weight, but is Nilla still on Predisone & the ant acid blocker Losec? if not put her back on the Losec 20mg given every morning, also you cannot just stop the Prilosec once its been taken for 3-4 weeks it must be slowley reduced as all the hydrochloric acid come rushing back into stomach all at once until the stomach acid go back to normal..Taking an acid blocker might make her want to eat again or reduce the fat in her diet with cooked lean meals & see does she get her appetite back again?? My IBD boy takes Pantoprazole 20mg now its an ant acid blocker, he did take Losec for 2 years then it didn’t seem to work…..
If you still want to feed wet can food look at either a low fat vet diet Royal Canine HP or Royal Canine Intestinal Low Fat or Hills I/d Low Fat Stew can food, as these wet can foods are under 8% in fat so they’re 1.7%-2%max fat is written on the canof food, so when converted to Dry Mater (DM) they’re 7-8% in fat & wont cause as bad acid reflux…
No wet can foods or premade raw food, fat % protein % fiber % is converted yet…
or look at “Walk About”
http://walkaboutpetproducts.com/dog-food/
“Walk About” has Rabbit, Kangaroo, Boar, Quail, Duck, the fat is 2%min & isn’t converted, the moisture is 82% so when you convert the fat it will be higher, when you see 78% Moisture this is better, the fat will be a bit lower…. I converted the fat in the Walk About Rabbit formula & it’s around 11.11%min fat, same with the Walk About kangaroo formula, The Walk About wet can foods are heaps lower in fat then the Nature Logic Rabbit formula.. It’s best to email Walk About or other dog food companies who sell wet can foods you want to try & ask them can you have the fat convertion to dry matter please.
eg- when you see 5%min fat, 78% moisture on a wet can of dog food, this 5%min fat when converted will be around 20%min fat to 26% max fat…

Here’s a Dog Food Guaranteed Analysis Calculator link, save it…

Dog Food Calculators

If you can cook, cook & freeze small meals, I make rissoles balls, I buy 1kg = 2lbs of lean 5 star Beef or Pork mince low fat, I whisk 1 egg, add to the beef mince some freshly chopped parsley & add about 1 teaspoon parsley, then I chop a few small brocolli heads & grate 1 small peeled carrot, mix all together & make either 1/4 cup size rissole balls or 1/2 a cup size rissole balls & put on a foil lined baking tray & bake for 15mins take out drain any water/fat turn over the rissole balls then bake for another 15mins till ready do not over cook as you’ll have leather rissoles, you can eat these rissoles with some mashed potatoes, I also boil 1 peeled cut up sweet potato then boil then cool & freeze those sweet potato in a sandwich clip lock bags & make sure the sweet potato pieces aren’t touching each other if they do touch then when frozen just wack on kicthen bench while still in sandwich bag & they should separate, you can add 1/2 cup size rissole ball & about 1/3 cup boiled sweet potato then I put 1 rissole ball & the sweet potato pieces in a blender & blend your dog will really like the rissoles, you can make turkey breast mince into rissoles & add some boiled Sweet Potato, theyre really nice, also scrambled egg make Nilla 1 scambled egg, what ever your eating as long as its not hot chillie, curry etc she can eats some & feed about 4-5 small meals a day get her back into a rountine & ask vet about ant acid medication..I use Quick eze chews as well for my IBD boy he comes & tells me & looks at the draw that has his meds in it…
The Canine Nutritionist will help but be careful with omega oils as these can cause acid reflux & then Nilla may not want to eat again so be fully intune with Nilla so you know whats wrong, also with the Walk About wet can foods you can boil some potato & add 1/2 wet can food & 1/3 boiled Potato this the potato should firm up her poos..

I hope you find answers & fix Nilla up but if you look into Nilla eyes & they have lost their spark, put her to sleep…its the best thing you can do for Nilla…

[Susan]

Hi,

“I am thinking of changing his food, but I don’t want to upset his stomach”,

his intestinal tract is already upset, if he was doing really well on this Purina Pro Plan Sensitive stomach formula, his poos would be nice & firm, he wouldn’t be drinking & drinking water & he wouldnt be licking his bum…

DRINKING heaps of water- if his poos are soft/sloppy & not firm then he might be dehydrated, something in this formula might be dehydrating him like too many soluble fibers…your dog mighten have problems digesting his foods, your dog might be OK & can digest foods, he might digest his food too quickly like Patch does, so he doesnt need these type of ingredients that are high in soluble fibers that digest in teh small bowel, this could be the reason for drinking excess water??

Licking bum area or rubbing bum on ground/grass could be food sensitivities, something in this Pro Plan formula he’s sensitive too….
or his anal glands are full & need emptying, his poos mighten be firm enough & his anal glands are not naturally emptying now, this happens with Patch when he eats a grain kibble that’s higher in soluble fibers, maize/corn gluten meal, barley, oats, rice, & his poos aren’t firm enough to empty his anal glands…

Have you seen the Purina Poo chart??
https://www.proplanveterinarydiets.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/PPPVD-Fecal-Scoring-Chart-EN-FINAL.pdf

I really think alot of his Intestinal problems is to do with FIBER, Soluble fiber & Insoluble fiber & he cant handle too much soluble fiber ingredients as they digest too quickly in the small bowel & he might be like Patch & digests his food quickly anyway, so when they eat foods that are higher in soluble fibers this is when their poos are sloppy & are not firm.
He needs a dry food that has more insoluble fiber & less soluble fiber & alot of grain free formulas have more insoluble fiber ingredients & less soluble fiber ingredients..

Potatoes- Fiber from potatoes comes in both forms, soluble and insoluble, the “insoluble content is higher”. This is probably why dogs with IBS or IBD do really well when they eat a kibble that has potato in it…

He’d probably do better on a Large Breed grain free kibble that has potato?? or a grain kibble that has potato in it…

Make sure the next kibble you try has at least 2-3 meat protein meals as 1st & 2nd ingredients, so there’s less fiber in his diet & more meat but not too much meat 25%-34%, the Purina Pro plan Lamb & Oatmeal Sensitive Stomach doesnt have much meat protein in it, it has more plant proteins which = higher soluble fiber ingredients….

Have a look at Victor, a few people say their dogs are doing really well eating Victor dog food..
Look at the Victor Select formula’s, Victor uses the Montmorillonite clay.
Chicken Meal & Brown Rice with Lamb meal.
https://victorpetfood.com/products/chicken-meal-brown-rice-formula

or look at “Whole Earth Farms” Adult, it’s made by Purina if you like Purina but I really would look at a different brand for now.
https://www.feedgoodness.com/products/recipe?title=Adult-Recipe&id=6
or
“Whole Earth Farm” Grain Free Recipe with Pork, Beef & Lamb (Poultry-Free)
For All Breeds & Life Stages
https://www.feedgoodness.com/products/recipe?title=Whole-Earth-Farms-Grain-Free-Recipe-with-Pork%2C-Beef-&-Lamb-(Poultry-Free)&id=8

[Albert A]

I’ve been making chicken homemade jerky for my dogs for a few years, mostly very thin which only allows me to dehydrate about 10-15lbs at a time with my Nesco setup and they absolutely love it, which is great as they’re pretty old and picky about what they eat (also feed kibble and a variety of other foods).

I also buy commercial made chicken jerky, and the stuff I buy is thicker than the stuff I make, which I like the idea of because I could make a much larger quantity per batch if I cut it thicker. For my usual thin cut jerky, I just do some low sodium soy sauce and liquid smoke. For the thicker stuff, I’m considering adding some preservatives such as commonly used (and fed to my dogs) vegetable glycerin, potassium sorbate and vitamin e oil…but I have no idea what quantities to add. Assuming I’m good with the sourcing and quality of those ingredients, any ideas of what quantities to use per batch or pound of jerky?

I’m also interested in getting a jerky gun (any recommendations?) and doing a ground beef jerky mixed with brown rice and other vegetables/sources of fiber. Any recipes or general tips for that type of jerky?

• This topic was modified 5 years, 7 months ago by Albert A.

[Susan]

Hi Harry,

Listen to your brother, a raw diet is the best diet you can feed a dog or a cat..
Dogs & cats have a short digestive tract, it’s made to digest a raw diet, their intestinal tract was not made to digest a high carb, high fiber dry dog food…

Over time watch & you’ll see the difference in both your dogs as they age if your dog continues eating a dry diet, your brothers dog will have a shinner coat, more energy, less pooh, he’ll be leaner & not over weight & look healthier…

Your pup is a large breed dog, his bones are still growing till he’s 18-24months, might be better to feed him his balance “Large breed puppy” dry food until he’s 18months, still give him raw meaty bones as a treat, unless you contact a animal nutritionist who can formulate a raw diet for a growing pup…
Sky Car knows heaps about raw feeding, he can give some advice…

Are you on facebook join a few Canine Raw feeding groups,
also follow “Rodney Habib” & his “Planet Paws” page look at his Video’s https://www.facebook.com/pg/PlanetPaws.ca/videos/?ref=page_internal
Also Follow “Steve Brown” when you follow Rodney you will get to know everyone.

Have you seen all the Toxins Contaminates & Heavy Metals in dry pet foods?
Google Toxins in dogs foods, a site will come up they test the most popular dry wet treats

[Susan]

Hi Rose,
sorry about the long post i started it around 10am then kept adding to it then finally posted it 2pm lol
“Holistic Select” has change all their formula’s & have added lentils chickpeas, these Legumes up the protein % so the pet food companies add less meat proteins in their food, that’s why I always make sure there’s 2-3 meat proteins as 1st, 2nd & 3rd ingredient, so my boy is getting meat proteins & not a heap of plant proteins, Legumes also up the fiber % in a dry kibble, make sure if you feed a dry dog kibble there isn’t anymore then 20% in Legumes, No Lentils/Chickpeas in the first 5 ingredients..
These are the first 5 ingredients of Holistic Select® large & giant breed dry kibble..
Lamb Meal, Chicken Meal, Potatoes, Chickpeas, Lentils, Peas, Chicken Fat,
when Patch eats Lentils he gets instant diarrhea & chickpeas cause bad wind/farts for 1 week then he’s OK. He does best on Sweet Potatoes & Potatoes kibbles & chickpeas have to be 5-6 ingredient… The Wellness Core Large Puppy formula has Potatoes, it has Lentils as 6th ingredient, your boy might be OK with Lentils?
https://www.wellnesspetfood.com/natural-dog-food/product-catalog/core-puppy-large-breed-puppy
you could always try it then take it back to Pet Barn if he gets diarrhea they have a money back guarantee & say he won’t eat it now cause he had diarrhea & get the Wellness Complete Health Large breed Puppy formula, it’s Monday so Wellness is on special $109 at the moment till Wednesday midnight, you click on “Click & Collect” & pick up from a Pet Barn closest to you.
https://www.petbarn.com.au/dogs/dog-food-dry/wellness-core-large-breed-dog-food
Or Wellness Complete Health Large Breed Puppy Food – 13.6kg – $99.00
https://www.petbarn.com.au/dogs/dog-food-dry/wellness-large-breed-puppy-food-13-6kg,

I’ve been thinking of getting te Wellness Complete Health Adult formula next, it has 3 meat proteins as 1st 2nd & 3rd ingredient then Oatmeal then peas so there’s less then 20% in Legumes…Pet Barn also has offers, when you join their “Friends For Life” Loyalty program, I just got a $20 free voucher free & a free bath & a free nail clip.. so I got a 2.5kg bag of dry kibble for $2..

I just looked up Holistic Select Australia as some US pet brands ingredient list are changed to come into our country, so when you look up an American brand kibble look up their brand name & put Australia after the brand name, so your getting the Australian Ingredient list…. also when you look at pet foods online pet store some of their ingredients list are the old ingredient list & the new ingredients haven’t been updated yet…

The FDA in America has put out an warning as few large breed dogs in the US that were eating high legume dry kibble diet have ended up with DCM – heart disease..
https://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/FDAInBrief/ucm613355.htm

Some dogs have died, they were very young 1-2 yrs old, they have noticed the dry diets were high in Legumes, Legumes are blocking the Taurine & the dogs aren’t absorbing any Taurine, they still dont know 100% what has gone wrong, a healthy 30 month old Rotti just died 8th August, an 1-2yr GSH has died he was given 6-8months to live & that was 2015….Maybe your better off feeding healthy grain formula until the FDA works out what went wrong, or a grain free formula that doesn’t have no more then 20% Legumes (peas), dogs didnt have these heart problems when grain free diets first came out & had Sweet Potatoes, Potatoes & Peas……
You’ll have to do research & make your own decision….
We haven’t been warned about DCM in dogs in Australia. But then again we’ve had toxic pet foods dogs have died & we still dont have any recalls, so I dont know what to think anymore.. I’ve msg our Pet Food Review man on his f/b page & he doesnt seem to think there’s a problems until we get more info, my vet said the same thing….
Golden Retrievers & Labrodors are known to get DMC not rottweilers & German Shepherd & the other large breed who are on the list… there’s a f/b page called “Taurine-Deficient Dilated Cardiomyopathy” look in their “files” for “2018-09-07 Copy of Diet and Taurine.pdf” it has the list of foods & dogs that became sick & died….. The cases that are in a light Orange = DCM or CHF w/o low Taurine; diet related, dogs heart problems were diet related, where the cases in yellow aren’t diet related taht they know off??We dont have these brands dry formula’s in Australia that were involved.

Here’s the proper ingredient list to the “Eagle Pack” Giant/breed puppy formula, Phosphorus 1.00%min, Calcium 1.50%min,
http://www.eaglepack.com/product-orignal-dog.aspx?product=82#.W58JIPZuI5t

Here’s “Wellness Complete” Health Large Breed Puppy link,
Phosphorus is 0.90% so it’s under 100%, Calcium Not Less Than 1.30%min
https://www.wellnesspetfood.com/natural-dog-food/product-catalog/complete-health-large-breed-puppy

“Stay Loyal” Large Breed Puppy
Phosphorus is 0.70-0.90% Calcium 1.10-1.30%
https://stayloyal.com.au/large-breed-puppy-grain-free-dog-food.html

To meet the more rigid safety guidelines for large breed puppies, a dog food must contain

1.2 to 1.8% calcium

1.0 to 1.6% phosphorus

Calcium-to-phosphorus ratio 1:1 to 1.8:1

Here’s the DFA Link info above & a list of Large Breed Puppy Brands DFA recommend Eagle Pack, Wellness Core, Science Diet, Eukanuba, Iams & Holistic Select Giant breed formula but this list was written before the DMC scare.. Maybe the Holistic Select giant pup breed is OK or NOT OK cause the formula has been changed now, I dont know
/best-dog-foods/best-large-breed-puppy-food/

They recomend to feed a large growing puppy a balanced dry large/giant breed puppy kibble till he is fully grown 18-24mnths then if you want to feed raw then start him on a raw balanced diet but there must be people who fed their large/giant breed pups a raw balanced diet, I know most Australian either feed a raw diet or they feed both raw meat, raw meaty bones & a dry kibble..

Stay Loyal is Australian if you join they send out monthly emails, they recommend to fed raw meat + raw meaty bones with their dry kibble & to fast dog 1 day a week Sunday, as it re sets the immune system, Robert & David are up to speed raising healthy large breed pups, I’ve emailed Robert Belobrajdic about Patch & his IBD & Robert emailed me back within 12hrs, Robert breeds South African Boerboels, Boerboels are very large dogs. Im pretty saw they’re raw feed aswell as their Large Breed Puppy dry food……..

[Susan]

Hi,
you have a very smart dog, he knows what foods cause pain, nausea etc & now will not eat, my boxer was the same with dry kibbles & raw Kangaroo, if it smelt weird & caused any stomach/bowel problems she wouldnt eat it ever again, where Patch he keeps eating & eating foods that cause gas/farts, nausea, sloppy poos etc, I have to be a mind reader & work out what is causing his pain his acid reflux etc but when I first rescued him he didnt want any thing to do with dry kibble, when I offered it to him he’d just walk off, he liked cooked food, loaf rolls, raw meaty bones & wet can foods….

Slipery Elm has to be made into a slurry/paste, pull up into a syringe about 5ml =1 teaspoon & you give 20mins before a meal not with the meal…

Vitamin B12 (Cobalamin) Deficiency, has your dog B-12 been tested?
When Vitamin B12 is injected, the vitamin is readily absorbed by the blood and can get to work immediately. If your dog doesn’t have any problems with cobalamin malabsorption or there is no vitamin B12 deficiency, you can give oral supplements available in 100-, 250-, 500-, 1000-, and 5000-microgram tablets.
Ask your vet about him not having any apetite & can you do the weekly B-12 injection for 1 minth & see if there’s an improvement in his appetite a lot of ogs who have IBD EPI who have low appetites are givenB-12 weekly injections to make them want to eat….

Have you tried wet can foods or those good premium loaf rolls?? I know vet diets are expensive but next time you see vet get 1 can of Hills I/d Digestive Care Chicken & Vegetable stew. I have the I/d cans in the cupboard & the Royal Canine Intestinal Low Fat wet cans in the cupboard. https://www.hillspet.com/dog-food/pd-id-canine-chicken-and-vegetable-stew-canned
I rotate foods, I dont feed the same food for all of Patches 5 meals a day..
Are you feeding more then 2 meals a day? I know he isnt much of a eater but smaller meals of a few different foods thru the day he might want to eat them? a dry dog biscuit offered a few times a day, break biscuit in 1/2, we have a cat & as soon as Patch hear’s Indy getting something to eat he comes running to see if he can have some aswell & normaly he cant thats why the cat is getting the food cause Patch cant eat it.. she/cat is my garbage disposel bin..

I feed the Wellness Core Large Breed Adult dry for breakfast, Patch finally gained weight eating the Wellness Core & the cat keeps stealing Patches Wellness kibbles so they must taste good as she doesnt pinch any of Patches other dry kibbles, for lunch Patch use to get a small can of the Hills I/D chicken Rice & Vegetables wet food or 1/3 of the can of the Royal Canine Intestinal wet food but he kept getting his acid reflux on & off after eating the wet can vet diets & they’re low in fat so Id say its all the Omega oils, they are very high in Omega Oils so now Patch gets 2 big Dog Biscuits, My Boxer use to just look at food & gain weight she where Patch has problems keeping on his weight, I remember Angies vet asking me, what is she eating she’s over weight, she needed to lose 4kgs, she use to eat 1/2 of what Patch eats, she was bigger & he is smaller, I told vet she eats cooked meal, what we eat, & sometimes she eats some dry kibble but not much & she gets a dry dog biscuit maybe twice a day, the vet said do you know 1 of those dry dog biscuits is = to 1 Hamburger for a dog, I said what a Hamburger he said YES start halving her biscuit, so she is just getting 1 dog biscuit a day or completely stop these dru dog biscuits as they are high in fat, so now Im giving Patch 2 big dog biscuits for lunch everyday he loves them, I either feed the Purina Lucky Dog Biscuit Bones, Canidae dry Biscuits or you can get Hills Ideal balance Treats they’re smaller or Hills Vet Diet Hypoallergenic Biscuit treats.. https://www.hillspet.com/dog-food/ib-soft-baked-naturals-with-chicken-and-carrots-dog-treats..
If you dont want to feed a wet can vet diet then look at Hills “Ideal Balance” Chicken & Zucchini slow cooked wet can food.. https://www.hillspet.com/dog-food/ib-slow-cooked-chicken-and-zucchini-stew-adult-dog-food-canned#accordion-content-054167331-2
or look at Costcos Kirklands Signature Turkey & Pea Stew wet can food its very popular. Just make sure any wet can foods are 4% in fat not any higher, wet can foods fat protein fiber % havent been converted to dry matter yet so when you convert say 5% fat thats around 20%min to 26% max fat, so 4% min is around 12% fat min best to emal the pet food companies & ask them for max fat concerted to dry matter, they will give the exact max % you dont want to feed him foods that cause pain in stomach or wind pain in bowel then he will become more fussy….lean limited ingredient foods..
http://www.kirklandsignaturepetsupplies.com/natures-domain-brand

All Hills Science Diet wet & dry formula’s are very palatable if your dog refuses to eat then return to pet shop for a refund if you have bought a carton of wet can food, rotate, 1 day feed the Hills Ideal Balance for Dinner then the next day for Dinner he eats a different wet can food or try FreshPet Roll, Stew, Cooked Roasted meals?
https://freshpet.com/dog/freshpet-select

Still feed his Farmina dry food, Farmina is a good food, are you feeding him the LAMB DIGESTION N&D Quinoa Functional Canine formula & the N&D Quinoa Skin & Coat Venison formula
https://www.farmina.com/us/eshop/dog-food/n&d-quinoa-functional-canine/429-digestion-lamb.html
its isnt rich or too dense like the other Farmina formula’s, my Patch gets his stomach pain as soon as a dry food is over 370Kcals per cup he whinges & wants me to rub his stomach/pancreas area…

What vet diet did he eat? maybe put him back on the vet diet & feed the matching wet can food rotate in his diet so he gains some weight & feed 4-5 smaller meals a day & give a few dry dog biscuits thru the day aswell as treats or as a dry dog bisciut as a snack before bed, eating then going to sleep gains weight…

I always ask Patch “Which One (kibble) do you want to eat” & I show him 2 different dry kibble brands in their air tight containers with their lids off, he sniffs the containers then he licks the side of the container that he wants to eat or I get out 1 kibble from 1 container & another kibble from the other container, I have 1 kibble in one hand & the another kibble in my other hand & I let him sniff them & ask him “which One”& he takes teh kibble he wants to eat, thru the day he eats about 3 different brands of foods… If I just feed him the same dry kibble day in day out he starts to react & gets his IBD stomach pain & starts whinging & lifts his right paw & wants me to rub his stomach area I thought he had Pancreatitis when I first rescued him, he has all the symptoms but now 5 yrs later Patches vets says he has Stomach pain its cause of his IBD…

If you join the “Dogs with Inflammatory Bowel Disease IBD – Raw Feeding & Holistic Support” F/B group, go to their “Files” scroll down 11th pdf & click on “Digestive Sensitivity and Dog Size.pdf”
it’s research done on small breed dogs & large Breed dogs, what happens when these dogs eats the same dry kibble, how both breeds digest the same kibble different, now I know why Patch does heaps better with his IBD when he eats a Large Breed dry kibble the Large Breed kibbles have fibers formulated for large breed Intestinal tract so the dog doesn’t get bloat, the Large Breed dry formula’s seem to agree with Patch the best…..

[Susan]

Hi Joanne,
this happened with Patch at all the local parks in our area, the council men would spray the grass & weeds at all the parks every 3 months & they only put up their weed spraying signs saying they are spraying & have the name of the weed killer poison that they were using at each end of the walk ways, then when they were finished they take down their weed poison signs & leave so if you came a few mins or hours later you wouldnt have a clue there’s poison every thru the park where the dogs walk on the grass & sniff & this poison gets absorbed thru their paws or they lick their paws 🙁

Did you end up trying a new dry food or you were going to re feed Pro Plan Lamb & Rice formula but you were worried to retry it again??
What dose was he taken when he took the Metronidazole? with Patch I have to do very low dose 200mg with a meal twice a day every 12hours then after 4-5 days I just give him 1 x 200mg Metronidazole tablet at night with his meal then he goes to sleep…

I’m looking thru Patches IBD note pad, I use to write things down when another dog in the IBD group had similar IBD problems like Patch had…
here’s other drugs that are used for dogs with IBD but the dog reacted to Metronidazole & dog can not take the Metronidazole.
Sulfasalazine
Olsalazine
Secnidazole or Tinidazole
Doxycycline,
but my vet told me there is NO drug the same as Metronidazole that has an anti inflammatory & antibiotic in it?

Holistic meds instead of using Metronidazole.
“Colloidal Silver” from health food store, Colloidal Silver is suppose to help anything bacterial, fungal or viral, upset stomach instead of giving the dog Metronidazole or there’s L-Glutamine, Licorice root but Ive never tried the Holistic meds, Lew Olson swears by L-Gutamine she has her “K-9 Nutrition” F/B group, I never tried the holistic meds cause Patches vet ended up talking to another vet & he said to re try a very low dose Metronidazole for a 17kg dog & said to give Patch 250mg Metronidazole twice a day every 12 hours with a meal, so now when needed I just give 1 x 200mg Metronidazole tablet twice a day when Patch first starts the Metro then I reduce in 3-5 days to just 1 x 200mg Metro tablet Patch poos dont go good straight away, his poos are yucky for 5-10 days then after I’ve stop the Metronidazole he starts to do 2 perfect poos again…
I found this really good information, research done on small & large breed dogs the other day in the files of my”Dogs With Inflammatory Bowel Disease” – Raw Feeding & Holistic Support ” F/B group..

when you have a quiet 15mins read thru all this
REVIEW ARTICLE
Digestive sensitivity varies according to size of dogs:
a review M. P. Weber, V. C. Biourge and P. G. Nguyen
Royal Canin Research Center, Aimargues, France..

After reading the review I now I understand why Patch who is only a medium size breed dog does really well on “Large Breed kibbles” they are made for a large breed dogs stomach & bowel, to prevent large breed dogs getting bloat & other intestinal problems…

Have you ever tried a Large Breed dry dog food that was grain free & had Potatoes, no Lentils or Chickpeas? the “Wellness Core” Large Breed Adult formula is really good or another dry food that has similiar ingredients & has high Protein, low/med Fat, Fiber & low Carb % low Kcals per cup, I was always scared to try over 30% for Protein but Patch seems to d better with less carbs…
I hope this link works it explains why small breed dogs & large breed dogs need different dry diets. here’s a bit of the Review.

For a large breed dog, the general goal is to limit any ingredient that could increase the level of fermentable undigested residues and, in fine, exacerbate colonic fermentation. Highly digestible sources of proteins and starches are therefore strongly recommended to maintain an optimal digestive tolerance…
Fermentable fibre sources (i.e. beet pulp and FOS) must also be used in limited quantity in their diet. Conversely, the incorporation of non-fermentable fibre (i.e. cellulose) appears useful to increase their stool quality. It’s a really good read, I hope this link works, it worked when I posted it on f/b for another lady whos dogs is pooing too many poos & is doing sloppy/jelly poos….
Patch didnt do well when Patch was only eating the Purina Pro Plan OptiDerma, I had to put him back on the Wellness Core Large Bred & the next day perfect poos..

https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/Digestive%20Sensitivity%20and%20Dog%20Size.pdf?token=AWxdS0LAtYflktKtk13bU2vfu6buTNCdW6HuK-ODXVMRA1UBaouyR1S_TfaVGEbXbIpp2p6fRZXdmszsoTwQZGhNeoDyb0W9R_0CvuF-OKim0TaYxFpqxeGUiMAul6fOw942a71TqDuB7PAfHWAjeqQEF40Ftp4UF-2VFrylY3uo-A

[Amelia Z]

No problem, Linda. Although, I am giving him meat, I still plan on supplementing with taurine. Not sure if any food would give him enough, but apparently the supplementation is helping and that I am no longer feeding him food with legumes. Has your dog been echoed? What’s his taurine level? Auggie’s was 125. I am having his taurine tested again next week, since it is 4 months since the last test.
FYI….
https://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2018/07/09/link-between-dog-food-taurine-deficiency-and-dcm.aspx

This is the kibble list:
https://www.earthbornholisticpetfood…k-meal-pumpkin
Also this one, but protein is high.
https://www.instinctpetfood.com/dogs…chicken-recipe
This one has limited grains and no legumes….
https://www.natureslogic.com/ingredi…ing-locations/
ALSO, First Mate https://firstmate.com/product/pacific-ocean-fish-meal-original-formula/& Sport Dog – https://sportdogfood.com/working-dog-grain-peas-free-turkey-formula/ (they were having manufacturing issues because of an increase in sales due this the legume free issue) so if you go with this better check with them about this.
Also, Famina ancestrial grains but they told me they are adding pea fiber to their new formula (are they crazy?), hopefully they will change their minds.

[Susan]

Hi Angela,
sometimes it’s hard to find that perfect dry food that firms poo, doesn’t cause stomach problems & doesn’t cause urinary problems…
Is your dog small & how were her poos when she ate the Royal Canine S/O vet diet?
maybe try a dry food that has healthy grains that has fiber at 3-4%

Have a look at

* “Wellness” Complete Health Small Breed Turkey & Oatmeal – has grains
“Wellness” Core – Small Breed grain free
“Wellness” Simple – grain free or grains

For Dogs

* “Canidae” Pure Wild – grain free
“Canidae” All Life Stages Platinum – grains
https://www.canidae.com/dog-food/products

* “Natural Balance” Potato & Duck Grain free the the fiber is 3% NO Legumes https://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/dog-formulas/special-category-limited-ingredient-diets

[joanne l]

Hi, Angela it seems that the foods you mentioned are grain free, try a grain in diet with less fiber. I don’t know what protein the dog is on, but there is holistic select you can try ask your vet about that one. Look on their web site and see the formulas it is for digestive health and you can also review it on chewy. For right now try adding some white rice to her diet. Oh and ask the vet about probiotics. There is one called Forti flora on chewy’s web site read about that. I am using that right now and it works. Hope it works out for you.

[Angela S]

i posted on here a couple of months ago about my dog. she often has soft poop that is difficult to pick up out of the grass. a reader on here suggested upping the fiber content. i did that; i am feeding her american journey salmon and rice with 6% fiber. it does not seemed to have helped. i want to change the food anyway, because it has peas and pea protein, and i want to get away from beans after the stories I’ve heard about the possible relationship with heart issues and beans in diets. Before this food, she was eating whole earth farms chicken and turkey grain free. her poop was still pretty soft on that. before that, she ate royal canin SO (crystals in urine causing blood in urine and sometimes issues with holding urine), which i took her off of after feeding it to her for 8 months. the vet said i could try her on the SO food for a while and take her off to see how she does. she’s been off of it since june 2017 and has not had issues with her bladder. any suggestions as to what could be causing the issue with the poop? we have a vet appointment in September, so i’m definitely talking to my vet about this, but wanted to get feedback from folks on here with their experiences/suggestions. thanks!

[sheltie sass]

This is anecdotal, but my mother’s old dog didn’t like the kibble she was feeding it. Instead of shopping around for something the dog DID like, or just letting her get hungry enough to eat the kibble, she started buying big bags of cat kibble. (She’s noticed that the dog would eat the cats’ food, given the chance.)

She thought she’d done something clever, since her dog finished the food and licked up every crumb. But after awhile, the dog started getting sick. The vet told her she was dangerously close to ruining the dog’s kidneys, and not to feed cat food any more.

I did find an article to back this up: http://www.vetstreet.com/our-pet-experts/why-does-my-dog-make-a-beeline-for-cat-food

“…long term it is not good for a dog to eat primarily cat food, Dr. Crowell-Davis says. It’s not properly balanced for them in terms of the fiber and protein and certain nutrients. Plus, it can be hard on their liver and their kidneys to have so much protein.”

It really sounds like cat food is formulated with too much protein for dogs, since cats are obligate carnivores, not omnivores. I would think that finding a quality cat food with the correct amount of protein for dogs would be difficult, if not impossible.

I suppose you could feed a percentage of cat food along with some rice or something of that nature, but if you’re doing all that, why not just feed raw?

[J S]

I’m not trying to cause any trouble I simply started this thread to find out exactly why cat food is bad for dogs.

ATM it seems:
To high protein levels
To high fat levels
To high fiber levels
Vitamins not the same
Kibble size

So yes that would eliminate a good amount of cat foods. But why would some cat foods that are equal or close to the same in everything not be ok? Is it just that we have heard not to so better safe than sorry? Is there a magic secret ingredient that is bad for Dogs that are not listed on the Analysis info in Cat food?

I’m looking for facts

[J S]

Thank you anon101 for that. I have read that myself and agree with it. The cat food in question is no higher in protein than other dog foods so that should not be a issue? Fiber and fat are also on line with premium dog food as well.

I get that most articles/people talk about Protein levels because some cat foods are REALLY high like 50’s+, but Fromms cat foods are 40 and lower thus why I even started this thread.

I would think that everyone would be excited about this? No

[anonymous]

Below is an excerpt from http://www.vetstreet.com/our-pet-experts/why-does-my-dog-make-a-beeline-for-cat-food click on link for full article

If you still have questions please consult a veterinary nutritionist (a veterinarian that specializes in nutrition) Otherwise you are just speculating and listening to opinions, you could potentially cause harm to your pet.

Quote “Even if your pup is one of those with an iron gut, long term it is not good for a dog to eat primarily cat food, Dr. Crowell-Davis says. It’s not properly balanced for them in terms of the fiber and protein and certain nutrients. Plus, it can be hard on their liver and their kidneys to have so much protein. Even more important, though, is the vice versa — make sure that your kitty is not fed a diet of dog food. “There are two essential ingredients in cat food that are not in dog food,” she says. “Taurine is an amino acid that dogs can manufacture in their own bodies but cats cannot, and also arachidonic acid, which is a fatty acid that cats need.”
“For the safety and health of your pet, limit the majority of your pet’s diet to food that has been produced specifically for his or her species”. Unquote

[Susan]

Hi Chloe,
Best to get her into a strict routine, eat same times, walk same times etc, dogs love routine & she’ll start to stress less & start to relax more, have you heard of “Rescue Remedy” drops? the human & the dog drops are the same, put 1-2 drops on her tongue morning & night, my Patch is a stress head & stresses himself out, he was diagnosed with Colitis when I first rescued him Nov 2012, age 4yrs old, he was pooing sloppy poos, jelly poos, poos with streaks of red blood thru the poo, he was put on vet diet Royal Canin, Hypoallergenic HP dry food, but it didn’t seem to help his stomach & bowel made his coat nice shiney, then after trying Hills I/d Digestive Care dry formula’s, we tried “Eukanuba Intestinal” Low Residue dry kibble, it firm up Patches poos, nice small poos, the Eukanuba is low in fiber but the Eukanuba Intestinal made him have itchy, smell yeasty skin problems….
Patches vet said Colitis can be from food sensitivities & all the vet diets we had tried had Chicken, Rice, Oats or Barley etc vet told me to look for a grain free limited ingredient food. I read on IBD f/b group alot of dogs were doing really well “Taste Of The Wild” Pacific Stream Smoked Salmon, this was before TOTW added the Chickpeas to their formula’s, Patches poos were beautiful & firm but he was vomiting up the TOTW Smoked Salmon once a week, back then I didnt know to stay away from fish dry pet foods as they are high in toxins & contaminates, so I started Patch on “TOTW Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb” formula & he did great on the TOTW Roasted Lamb formula still does great on the TOTW Roasted lamb formula…..I live Australia & we do not have all the Chickpeas & Lentils in our Salmon & Lamb TOTW formula’s, Legumes can cause Intestinal stress with some dogs who have IBS, IBD & EPI….

Have you tried a limited ingredient dry kibbles that just have 1 meat protein with Sweet Potatoes or Potato?. Potato & Sweet Potatoes seem to firm up poo’s
Have a look at
* “Natural Balance” Potato & Duck LID” it is lower in Fiber -3% has NO peas, No Pea Protein, no chickpeas, no lentils, or there’s “NB Sweet Potato & Bison LID” it is 4%-Fiber & just has Pea Protein or “NB Sweet Potato & Venison LID” it has 5% fiber & has the Pea Protein cause Venison & Bison are both expensive meats, so they add either pea protein, or lentils or chickpeas to up the Protein %, its better feed lean white meats like Turkey Chicken or Pork for dry pet foods & white fish if you’re cooking but no fish in a pet food…..Chicken isnt expensive like other proteins Kangaroo, Venison, Bison, Goat, you’re getting more meat protein & not more plant proteins in your dog food, or “NB Lamb Meal & Brown Rice Small Bites LID” 4%-Fiber, has no peas or pea protein but it has Rice Bran, out of all the NB LID formula’s the Potato & Duck formula seem best, then the Sweet Potato & Bison or Venison formula’s, You wont know until you try one of teh formula’stry & find a Pet Shop who sells the NB or Wellness Simple formula’s, so you can take it back & return, exchange for another LID if she has sloppy poo/diarrhea, I just say to pet staff, Patch is havinngbad gas then diarrhea & now he won’t eat it no more & as long as the kibble bag isn’t empty, pet shops have a Palability money back guarantee…

There’s also the Natural balance LID wet can food, the NB Chicken LID formula has the lowest fat at 3.5%min, you will have to email N/B & ask can you have the max fat % after it’s converted to dry matter, it should be around 10%min-14%max fat, just becareful with wet can foods that aren’t low fat vet diets as the pet shop wet can foods haven’t been converted, so when you see 4% min fat or 5%min fat, when you convert the 5%min fat that’s around 17%min to 26% max fat %…
https://www.chewy.com/natural-balance-lid-limited/dp/33199
Here’s the Natural Balance dry formula’s & ingredients..
alot of dogs who have IBS, IBD do very well on the Natural Balance formula’s the fat & protein isn’t high & N/B has LID…
https://www.chewy.com/s?query=Natural+Balance+LID&nav-submit-button=

My boy does well on this ” Wellness Core” Large Breed Adult formula.
& this “Wellness Simple” Turkey Meal & Potatoes
https://www.chewy.com/s?query=Wellness+Simple++dry+dog+food&nav-submit-button=

She mighten have been feed a dry food, she may have been feed cooked food what her owner ate?? have you tried lightly boiling Chicken or turkey breast & some boiled Sweet potato or potato & some boiled pumkin? feed 1 cooked meal for 1 of her meals & a dry LID food for her other meals also feed her 3-4 smaller meals thru the day….
Is she in good condition or does she look like she is in bad condition for a 10yr old dog? is her coat nice & shiney, does she have all her fur, no bold patches, does she still have all her teeth, are her teeth still nice & white?

[Susan]

Hi Joanne,
What type of dog do you have & how old??
It sounds like your dogs Intestinal bacteria has become unbalanced, he has too much bad bacteria now, I’s say the Purina Chicken & Rice formula has off set his gut bacteria first causing gas/farts, then diarrhea & then vomiting…. if your boy has been eating beef & rice for 2 days & is still unwell, I’d follow up & see vet again & ask for a course of Metronidazole 14-21 days, its better to get 21 days tablets, this way you give for 14 days tablets & you have 7 day tablets left if you see this happening again…You can ask your vet can he/she give about 28 Metronidazole tablets so if this does happen again, you start seeing sloppy poos then diarrhea you start tablets straight away before it gets worse…
Metronidazole must be given with a meal every 12 hours then I reduce the dose after 7-10 days to 1 Metronidazole tablet a day with Dinner meal for another 7 days…
Patches vet writes Patch a repeat scripts of Metronidazole (Flagyl) 200mg/21 tablets in packet… to have in the cupboard at home & if Patch starts doing sloppy poos more then 2 days, then has Diarrhea by the 3rd day I start him on the Metronidazole for 14 days…

I’d boil potato or sweet potato instead of the rice if he is still doing diarrhea after 2 days, as boiled rice can irriate the bowel if the bowel is inflammed, Patch can eat grounded rice in dry kibbles but can’t eat cooked boiled rice when he is having diarrhea & has an inflammed bowel…also did the vet say to rest the stomach & bowel for 12 – 24hours “No Food” just fluids with Electrolytes, then start a bland diet small meals about 3-4 a day….

One thing I did notice when I was looking up Purina Pro Plan USA the other day..
* The Chicken & Rice Savor formula say’s
“Guaranteed “Live Probiotics” to support digestive health, as well as prebiotic fiber for an added boost to the digestive system”
* The Focus Lamb & Oat Meal Sensitive Stomach/skin formula says
“Rich in antioxidants to help promote a healthy immune system”
* The Focus Small Breed chicken say’s “Natural prebiotic fiber, sourced from wheat bran, helps promote digestive health”
The Lamb formula’s don’t seem to say anything about “Pro” biotic boosts..

I dont know which Purina Plan Plan formula, you are feeding?? what I could see, the Savor & Focus formula’s both have very similar ingredients but some formula’s ingredients are higher in Prebiotics or higher in Probiotics, I think this is what has set off his gut bacteria & unbalanced your boy digestive tract.. The only thing I have found that fixes this is a course the Metronidazole…

Later when he is 100% after 3months look for a single protein dry formula, that has rice, oats, sweet potato etc not many ingredients… If you want to stay with Purina then ask the Purina Vet Nutritionist what does the Pro Plan Chicken & Rice formula you tried have more Prebiotics or more Probiotics?? then ask Nutritionist what ingredients are they using for these Pro & Prebiotics??… then avoid these ingredients..

Have you ever fed a grain free dry kibble that has limited ingredients?? I dont think your dog has a problem with chicken, it could be a certain grain or Probiotic or Prebiotics ingredients…
I hope he gets better very soon..

[Susan]

Hi Ruth,
She needs an Endoscope + Biopsies ASAP, I bet you she has Helicobacter Spiral bacteria, this is why she is eating sticks etc .they get BAD acid reflux & pain across stomach.
My boy has IBD & was eating cat poo, plants etc, I asked his vet to do Endoscope + you need the “Biospies” some vets dont do Biospsies, then she needs to be put on Triple Therapy meds for 3 weeks, Metronidazole, Amoxicillin, Omeprazole taken every 12 hours with a meal, then when meds are finished you continue with 1 x 20mg Omeprazole in morning.. I just gave 1 x Omeprazole wile on the triple therapy meds feed a low fiber, high protein, low/med fat low carb food best Gluten free..

Have a look at “Wellness Core” Large Breed dry food it has Probiotics easy to digest… instead on the R/C Gastrointestinal formula.

I have to go bed, (Australia) I’ll post more in morning if not busy… are you on face book join this group “Dogs with IBD Holistic group” I’ll see you there hopefully, really good help.. https://www.facebook.com/groups/292537937935806/

[Susan]

Hi Nate,

Yes Annamaet Lean kibble is VERY high in legumes, high carb diet..

People recommend to feed a low-protein diet for a dog with pancreatitis. However this is not correct. By decreasing protein in diet then the carbohydrate content increases which is the greatest aggravating factor of pancreatitis in dogs in the first place, or increase the fat, which is no good considering the illness..
I was feeding Patch a low protein around 25%, low fat diet then realised the carbs were so high & my dog always had his stomach/pancreas pain, whinging crying, wanting me to rub his pancreas area, at least once a week but since he’s been eating “Wellness Core” Large Breed formula, that is high protein around 34%, low/med fat-13% Carbs-30% he’s been doing really well & he has not had 1 whinging episode in 7 months where he wants me to rub his pancreas, then he has to be put on Metronidazole when Pancreas/stomach pain doesn’t go away after 2 days….He can’t take Predisone/steriods..

Here’s
**Wellness Core Raw Rev Turkey Dehydrated its low in fat 10%
https://www.wellnesspetfood.com/natural-dog-food/product-catalog/core-rawrev-healthy-weight-100-raw-turkey

** Wellness Core 100% Turkey- 10% fat
https://www.wellnesspetfood.com/natural-dog-food/product-catalog/core-100-freeze-dried-turkey
Here’s the Whole Wellness Core range… click on the Chicken & Turkey formula’s they’re lowest in fat..
You could fed 1 of their meal the Hills I/d formula & for dinner they have a meal thats higher protein, lower fat & lower carbs, take baby steps & see how your dogs do eating the Higher protein meal, meat protein is easier to digest then a bowl of carbs…

The Honest Kitchen has a few new formula’s
HOPE –
% Protein-25.0
% Fat-7.2
% Fiber-6.0
% Moisture-8.0
*Per dry cup.
THK- Kindley – Grain Free Fat is 10% Fiber is 8.5%
THK- Preference – Grain Free fat-10.5% Fiber -8%
THK- Verve – Organic Beef- Fat-8.5% Fiber-5.8%
THK- Zeal – Grain Free- Fat-8.5 fiber 5.8%
the fiber % is higher in some of the Honest Kitchen formula’s over 6%….

Here’s The Honest Kitchen range- https://www.thehonestkitchen.com/dog-food/meals

Are you on Face Book here’s the “Canine Pancreatitis Support group” link
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1435920120029740/
Join group then post a post asking what are people feeding their dogs, I know there’s a few people who feed low fat, premade raw diets, so they may know of a freeze dried/Dehydrated brands you can feed that are low in fat.
also look in the “files”
there’s “A recipe for home-cooked food”
there’s “Pancreas Low Fat dog foods.pdf”

[Susan]

Hi Sharlene,
Gee you have your hands full with Luey…
I rescued an English Staffordshire Terrier who has IBD, he too is a nugget all muscle & very strong, he’s been a handful these last 5yrs but I wouldn’t have it any other way, this is our path in life & now you just need a vet who takes an interest in Luey & helps him & you..

How come the vets you saw did NOT put him on a vet diet?? either the Hills W/d that’s high in fiber-16% fiber or the Hills I/d Digestive Care that’s lower in fiber 1.7% & try & work out if the higher or lower fiber helps firm the poo more or less?

Look up “Veterinary Medicine Universities” here’s one in Florida https://www.vetmed.ufl.edu/

Homepage

then they can refer you to somewhere closer to home if the Florida Vet University is too far….
It’s a shame you didnt go thru a rescue group when you got Luey, they normally have contacts & all his medical bills + food would have been paid for & more money raised for Lueys health care, He’d be a good looking pup & people that have French Bull Dogs would probably want to help aswell…

It does sound neurological & the brain isn’t sending Luey the massage that he has to poo & it just happens. When vet did Xray did his bowel look normal & he had a small bowel & a large bowel?

[anonymous]

http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2018/08/grain-free-diets-and-heart-disease-in-dogs/ excerpt below, click on link for full article and comments:

Dr. Jennifer Larsen, a nutritionist at UC Davis, has written an excellent summary of the nuances of this issue, and she has agreed to let me share some of it here:
Taurine is not required to be present in dog foods. Taurine is an amino acid that is not nutritionally essential for dogs; however, there are dietary factors (such as protein source, fiber type and concentration, and cooking or processing methods) and individual dog characteristics (such as breed and calorie needs) that impact how efficiently taurine may be made and used by the body. The sulfur amino acid content and bioavailability in food is important though. The problem with dietary deficiency-related cardiac disease is multifactorial and is not just seen in goldens.
1- in many grain free diets, legumes are used to provide the carb (starch) but also protein and fiber – you cannot tell which ingredients are providing various proportions of nutrients from an ingredient list
2- legume protein is low in sulfur amino acids (methionine and cystine- the precursors for taurine synthesis)
3- some fiber types/concentrations increase fecal taurine content and promotes bacterial degradation of taurine (dogs and cats must use taurine to conjugate bile acids) so taurine recycling is not as efficient and more is lost
4- dogs need an adequate supply of precursors and to be able to make taurine fast enough to replace obligatory as well as excessive losses. When Newfoundlands and beagles were compared (during the Investigation into the lamb and rice issue with DCM in the 90s), it was found that Newfoundlands made taurine more slowly, so there are differences among breeds and probably individuals
5- dogs with lower than predicted calorie needs (“easy keepers”) also might not eat enough food and therefore enough protein to supply adequate precursors
6- some grain free diets (and other types of diets), are not high in protein (and therefore sulfur amino acids) since they use more expensive exotic or uncommon sources.
Any of these or a combination may impact taurine status in the dog.
There have been recent cases seen in our hospital and elsewhere of dilated cardiomyopathy secondary to taurine deficiency in dogs that have been associated with commercial diets containing certain ingredients (such as legumes – beans, lentils, and peas – and root vegetables – white and sweet potatoes). Data collection and interpretation is ongoing for these recent cases.
In the past we have also seen cases of dilated cardiomyopathy and taurine deficiency in dogs eating home-prepared diets (with either cooked and raw ingredients and those with and without meat), and other commercial diets with various ingredients and nutritional profiles. Some of those cases and investigations have been published (others can be found on PubMed):

• This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by anonymous.

[joanne l]

Thanks, for the info. I just bought a bag of pro plan chicken and rice just to see if it is the chicken before I switch brands. I figured if I bought a different brand with chicken I really won’t know if it is the chicken or the brand if it didn’t work out. I hope I am going the right way to find out. because chicken has been eliminated in his dry food for a while now, so we’ll see what happens when I interduce it, I will do it slowly. About the fiber you mentioned, some dogs do well with more and some don’t. If your dogs do good with it then I would think it is okay. But some may poop more which probably is not good b/c they loose nutrients. Well I guess we will have to wait for awhile with this FDA outcome and see what’s what. Hopefully some of these grain free companies will lay off on putting too many peas in their recipe, that will be better for the dogs. So it is a good thing that the FDA steps in on these things. These companies are out for the buck, and peas are cheap protein boosters and it is not fair that people spend a lot of money and get too many cheap ingredients.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by joanne l.
• This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by joanne l.

[crazy4cats]

Hi Joanne-
I have fed a lot of grain free WEF, Victor and TOTW along with some Purina, Fromm, Eagle Pack, Iams and Authority with grains. I’ve never thought grain free was necessarily better, but my dogs seem to do better poop wise with a little higher fiber. They had a rough start with parasites when they were pups and tend to have loose stools ever since.

Fromm Gold weight control is not grain free, but is fairly high in fiber and now am wondering if that is an issue now too. I am planning on switching to their reduced activity recipe instead which is a little lower in fiber.

It’s hard to know if there truly is a grain free concern since there is such a small sample of dogs so far. But having two lab/golden mix dogs, I’m going to play it safe. Both breeds are mentioned often in the different reports I’ve read.

I feed my cats about half Royal Canin kibble and half various canned food. RC is a little too expensive for our pet budget for two large dogs, however.

It doesn’t sound like your dog is sensitive to chicken. It’s so hard to tell with kibble because there are so many ingredients. Also, if your dog is anything like mine, they get into things they shouldn’t. Also, environmental allergies can also be an issue. The only way to know for sure is to do a true elimination diet with a hypoallergenic Rx dog food.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

[Mark C]

Just curious. I noticed in the latest clarification from the FDA that they are looking into potatoes. That includes the sweet potatoes potato protein, etc. Here’s my dilemma: my vet told me to cut back on my dogs food and one way to do it was to feed them sweet potato! In light of the FDA’s revelation would you continue feeding your dog sweet potatoes? I’d love to ask my vet but I hate to spend $100 just for an office visit. Also; does anybody have any ideas of other high fiber foods that would fill up a dog that I could give them when I cut back on their kibble? I also gave them vegetables broccoli Collie flower carrots but it seemed the sweet potato fill them up a lot more so now I’m trying to figure out what to do.

[Susan]

Hi Ryan,
is your boy on any medications for Arthritis pain, as these can cause stomach problems, ulcers etc?
You have to be careful you do “not” want to confuse your vet….
When a dog has a seizure they don’t respond while having a seizure, their body/muscles are all tense & tight, there’s no mouth licking or gulping they do not respond….
This is awful to watch but this is a dog having a seizure
the dog does not lick or swollow like when a dog has bad acid that has come up into the dogs mouth…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzZ-IgD7HXs

Yes, all vet diets are very high in omega oils, the Hills Z/D & Royal Canine Hypoallergenic skin wet & dry vet diet formula’s are VERY high in Omega oils for skin & can upset their stomach, Patch can NOT eat any vet diets or normal premium kibbles for his skin problems, most of the vet diets give him bad acid reflux especially when he eats a fish kibble, even the Intestinal Health vet diets wet & dry give him bad acid reflux 🙁 ….
After trying nilly all the vet diets, I finally worked it out, his acid reflux was from all the omega oils & I saw Dr Judy Morgan “Pacreactitis Again” video, Judy talks about her 16-17yr old dog who suffers with Pancreatitis & other health problems, she worked out her dog can NOT have any fish oils, the same thing happens acid reflux or a Pancreas flare…
I stick with dry foods that have Canola oil, Sunflower/vegetable oil or Flaxseed, Patch ends up licking & swollowing like you said around 1hr after eating these high omega oil foods & high carb foods, especially when you see a fish oil, flaxseed, corn oil, within the first 5 ingredients….
I feed tin pink salmon in spring water drain water add 1/2 boiled sweet potatoes, salmon isn’t as oily like Sardines are..your dog would like that as a small meal, see how he goes…

When I see Patch starting to do his swolling, licking mouth, or doing his weird mouth thing, this is when I give him 1/2 a ant acid quick eze berry chew & tell him chew chew & he chews the quick eze chew, then 20mins later he seems heaps better, they’re not that expensive at supermarket you can get the plain white quick eze lollie, there’s another ant acid chew/lollie a few people in the Pancreatis support f/b group use for their dogs when they’re having a licking swolling attack from bad acid reflux, they use Rennie tabs, I’d give one of these a try next time you see him starting to have an attack, probably will work better then the Sucarafate, the Sucarafate didn’t really help Patch, he wanted to eat grass after I gave him his Sucarafate slurry…
Something better then the Sucarafate tablets is Slippery Elm Powder, it stops nausea, acid reflux helps with stomach problems..
Get 1 teaspoon of the Slipery elm powder put in cup, boil the jug & slowley add boiling water to the slipery elm powder in a cup & stir till you have a thick slurry, put 1 teaspoon of the Slippery Elm Slurry on a plate to cool then see if your dog will lick it up, Patch licked it up once then didn’t again, so I had to get a 20ml syringe & pull up 5ml & give 20mins before he eats, then cover the cup with foil & put in fridge, it turns into a jelly slurry & need to be heated, takeout about 1 spoon put in the microwave or I just add some boiling water to about 1 spoon that you’ve taken out of the cup then when its can be pulled up into a syringe just use 5mls…

You still have to make sure what they’re eating isn’t too high in fat or omega oils & ingredients agree with your dog… Have you looked at the Rice dry formula’s?
It has taken me 5yrs to work out Patch..

His Sphincter flap from stomach to esophagus mighten be closing properly & the acid is washing back up into throat & mouth, you’ll need something stronger to settle this, if the Sucarafate isnt helping him… so he doesn’t end up with a sore throat & burnt wind pipe like Patch ended up with, he may have an Ulcer?? Ulcers happen cause of too much acid, you need ant acid blocker meds to stop the acid burning the ulcer & it can heal…

Sometimes no matter what Patch eats he just has a few bad days, sometimes it all starts again when I feed a wet can/sachet or the low fat vet diet for lunch, so I avoid the wet foods for a 3-5 days & just feed 4-5 small kibble meals…

With a dry food look for 10%-15%max-fat, sometimes a food will be 14.5% fat, that why I say 15% max fat, the lower the fat & protein & the higher the carbs, so you have to find a dry kibble that works for your dog..
Wet foods arent low enough that are sold at Pet Shops, you ned under 3%max fat in a wet foods, best to email the pet food companies ask what the fat when converted to dry matter fat & the MAX fat % you’ll have shock, some wet foods are high…

I have found the Large Breed formula’s work best for Patch, as they arent too high in carbs or fat, the protein is over 26% & seems to help reduce his acid reflux…. I stay around-13%-fat & 34%-protein.

Have you tried any of the Purina One formula’s a few people say their dog does well on Purina One formula’s here’s, but I looked & some are 16%, 17%, 18 % in fat, so way too high in fat for your boy, this Purina One formula large breed formula looks good, the fat is 13%, protein-26%, fiber is 4.5% the fiber is not too high & the carbs are about 40% carbs-
these ingredients are like the Intestinal Health vet diets minus the high Omega Oils….
https://www.purinaone.com/dogs/products/dry-dog-food/smartblend-large-breed-adult
or if you find a good brand you like just have a look at their large breed formula ingredients & fat protein %..

Most small breed dog foods are higher in fat & higher in Kcals per cup, so avoid all small dog foods.. Have you looked at Senior foods? they normally are lower in fat around 10-12% fat & higher protein…
With his skin, I know Patches skin would itch with some of those ingredients in Purina One BUT Patches vet always tells me, we fix his stomach problems first then we’ll deal with his skin problems, in the mean time continue his weekly baths to relieve his itch & use baby creams to relieve any itchy red skin….

Have you looked at the Nulo Grain Free Style Weight management formula.
MedalSeries High-Protein Kibble weight management chicken & sweet potato recipe
Just becareful with fish dog foods the Nulo Cod & Lentil formula didn’t do well & came back High in Metals & Process Contaminates in this last testings…
Most of the Nulo fish formula’s the Puppy & Small breed also came back high in metals & contaminates but they have good ingredient quality….just got a bad fish supplier 🙁

This will not go away over night, it takes time to find the right dry food, the right ant acid meds, the right routine & feed more smaller meals a day instead of just the 2 bigger meals a day..
I know your head is probably spinning with all the info, but there might be something I do for Patch that might also help your boy, all the things that have helped Patch & alot of other dogs…
By the way what is his name??

[Ryan K]

Thank you everyone! Such great information and HOPE for my dog and his future! It’s nice to know there is support and motivation to get him through his ups and downs from people as nice as you all are! 🙂

I’ll be looking into a new vet next week. I had a good day with him today. No incidents so that was nice. He did hack a couple times which is kind of common for him. He has been hacking for years. I truly do think he has a collapsing trachea. I would put money on it. But, even my vet said that is a rough surgery to fix and wouldn’t really recommend it unless he was in serious need of it. So, there is nothing much to do for that aside from cough suppressants which again..they wouldn’t prescribe to him unless he had a confirmed diagnosis through MRI and x-rays. Ugh! Frustrating! I truly need to find a vet that will let me try meds on him without all the expensive testing! That’s my first step now.

Also…side question…I noticed they put him on the hills I/D and I assumed it was the low fat kibble because they sell it in baggies they put together themselves but I realized it’s the regular I/D formula which has 20% protein and 10% fat. Is that fat content too high? Should I be looking into a lower fat for his acid or is it mainly the oil content (omegas) that cause that? He seemed to be doing so great on Nulo Turkey and Sweet Potato for a little bit there. He is such a picky eater that it was almost miraculous to find a kibble he enjoyed. I also dislike the idea of him being on this hills ID because of the fillers in it. It doesn’t have great ingredients. Would I be able to put him on ANY low fat kibble or is there something I have to really look for that I should be avoiding? I was thinking of going for the Nulo Trim Cod & Sweet Potato since he likes their food. This is the analysis for the recipe…

Crude Protein 30.0% min
Crude Fat 7.0% min
Crude Fat 9.0% max
Crude Fiber 6.0% max
Moisture 10.0% max
Calcium 1.0% min
Phosphorus 0.9% min
Vitamin E 300 IU/kg min
Omega-6 Fatty Acids 3.35% min
Omega-3 Fatty Acids 0.35% min
Ascorbic Acid 65 mg/kg min
Bacillus Coagulants 80,000,000 CFU/lb min

Would the amount of omegas be too high and cause acid? It seems like finding a low fat food is tricky with such a picky eater that ALSO has health issues. 🙁 Thoughts on that?

[Susan]

Hi Joanne,
Im not against grain pet foods, I believe you should rotate with 1 good grain free dry kibble then rotate with a grain kibble or I like the dry kibbles that will have a few good grains instead of Legumes & have sweet potatoes, veggies & fruits a variety….

Whenever Patch eats a grain kibble that has Barley, Oats & Brown Rice he does big smelly sloppy yellow poos, but when he eats a grain kibble that has White Rice & Sorghum he does nice firm poo’s so he must be sensitive to Barley, Oats & the Brown rice is probably too high in fiber put them all together & we have bad poo’s, so it may not be 1 ingredient it might be when they are all together?…. alot of these grain formula’s have replaced their corn with peas & barley. I prefered corn instead of the peas & barley, corn firms up poos, most intestinal health vet diets use corn in their vet diets for this reason..

Chicken: I don’t think your dog is sensitive to chicken, it could have another ingredient or it may have been the Fish or the Duck but read what were the common ingredients besides meat proteins?
My Patch does excellent on Chicken with his IBD, BUT when he eats cooked or raw chicken his paws go red within 20mins of eating the cooked or raw chicken when I did a elimination diet BUT when he eats a kibble that has chicken in it he doesnt get his red paws sometimes or not as bad?? so I’d say its cause the chicken in a kibble gets broken down while being cooked at such high temperatures & Patch isnt reactionthe the chicken as bad aswhen he eats fresh raw or cooked chicken?..
I asked a Hills Vet Nutritionist, why does Hill’s wet & dry formula’s all have chicken in them?, she said, it’s cause chicken is the easiest meat to digest, this is probably why Patch does well with his IBD…

Have a look at “Farmina” grain formula’s.. they look very good for a dry kibble..
https://www.farmina.com/us/eshop-dog/dog-food/11-n&d-ancestral-grain-canine.html

Be careful the Purina Pro Plan Salmon & Rice formula was tested again & did really bad again, it keeps coming back high in Heavy Metals, By-Product Contamines – Poor & Ingredient Quality – Poor…
If your dog does well Purina, the last test were just done, the testing gets done every 3 months…But certain Brands formula’s are staying on the bad heavy metals & contaminates list & are not moving when they are re tested, so these pet food companies are still using the same bad suppliers.
These Purina Formula’s did really well got 5 stars
Purina Pro Plan Bright Mind Adult Turkey & Rice Formula Dry Dog Food
Purina One Smart Blend, Lamb & Rice, Healthy Weight, True Instinct Turkey and Venison, Chicken and Rice & Small Bites Beef & Rice Formula’s are cleaner kibbles also Purina Beyond Superfood Blend Salmon, Egg and Pumpkin Recipe Dry Dog Food, Purina Beyond Simply 9 White Meat Chicken and Whole Barley Recipe Dry Dog Food…

[joanne l]

Hi Jessica, the foods you mentioned that you tried are maybe too rich for him. First Blue Buffalo has a lot of issues. Pure Vita has too much fiber I think, and Merrick is a little rich for some dogs. I know you might not want to feed this, but I think you should try Purina pro plan. Just give it a shot. A lot of dogs do well on it. Just my opinion.

[Susan]

@ Joanne,

click on the link Crazy4cats has posted above, read thru & scroll down to-

“Dogs And Taurine”
Studies are showing that there are likely dietary factors associated with the taurine deficiency in dogs such as dogs that eat rice, lamb, high-fiber, and/or very low meat protein diets. This can point back to the preparation and/or processing methods used, or that many dog foods include meat byproducts, rice, legumes, and soy which are not sources of good meat proteins or any meat protein at all, which means they are not good sources of taurine.

“Why is Taurine Missing”?
In addition, meat byproducts, rice, and plant-based proteins are not good sources of taurine. If your pet food has high quantities of these types of items, it likely means your dog is not getting the taurine it needs to be healthy.
With so many foods going grain free, manufacturers are substituting the grain with things like lentils, soy protein, and chickpeas. These types of foods do not provide taurine to sustain good health.

“Taurine Naturally in Foods”
Muscle meats contain higher levels taurine; the more work the muscles do, the higher the taurine level. Dark meat of chicken and turkey are naturally high in taurine.
Shellfish, white fish, and cold water fish such as salmon or sardines are also very high in natural taurine.
Taurine is not found in fruits, vegetables, rice, corn, oatmeal, rye, wheat, or barley

* You have to remember a dog has a short digestive tract made to digest meat, not heap of grains & legumes…

Patches IBD Vet Specialist told me this.
A dog has a short digestive tract, made to digest meat & when a dog eats any off meat it’s quickly passed thru the stomach into small bowel then large bowel so no bacteria can start to breed……. On 1 of our visits to see Patches IBD vet, Patch had vomited a few times in 1 week, I was worried but Patches IBD vet told me,
When a dog vomits it’s not a bad thing Susan, it’s very common with wild dogs they regurgitate their food, it’s very easy for a dog to have a vomit, due to the short digestive tract, especially if he is feeling unwell in the stomach also when the dog eats something thats bad & doesnt agree with the dog then the dog can bring it back up himself…

Meat Protein is easier for a dog to digest then any grains….DFA post this in the Food Review section…
Raw meat is easier for a dog or cat to digest, then cooked meat, when you cook meat you kill the digestive enzymes, cooking kills lots of good things..

[joanne l]

I never liked grain free foods. I can see why chickpeas, peas and lentils is a problem:
number 1, they are high in protein, and this protein does not contain taurine. These companies are taking grain free to their advantage, which means they can up the protein level with these ingredients with using less meat which equals less taurine! Now a bag may read meat as the first couple ingredients, however it follows a lot of peas. Furthermore, these peas and lentils contain a lot of fiber which in turn can cause more stools or loose stools. Also making it hard for the dog to absorb the nutrients! They may even have it listed 3 times. NO GOOD! Grains are much better. The old school is better than the new school. Most dogs don’t have a problem with grains it is usually the protein. I hope to see more grain in diets please!!!

[Linda K]

I feed my 11-month-old dog Zignature Zssentials. He has a history of off-and-on, come-and-go vomiting about twice a week after eating when he was younger. The breeder was feeding him (gasp!) Iams puppy! The vet said he had “a sensitive belly,” advised me to try Hills I/D for 30 days, and then slowly wean him onto another limited ingredient food. I chose Zssentials, and he has not vomited a single time in three months. The listed ingredients are turkey, turkey meal, salmon, duck meal, chickpea flour, peas, chickpeas, alfalfa meal, flaxseed, sunflower oil, salmon oil, and then a bunch of other stuff. THe protein is 32%, fat 16%, fiber 5.5%, moisture 10%, calcium 1.2%, phosphorus 1.0%, omega 6 fatty acids 4.5%, omega 3 fatty acids 2.0%. The omega 6 and 3 are not recognized as an essential nutrient by the AAFCO Dog Food Nutrient profiles. I don’t know if the quantity of chickpeas and peas is particularly high since they are not first on the list of ingredients. Dog Food Advisor rates Zssentials, catfish, and pork formulas 5 stars.

I do know the FDA has come out with a statment indicating they are investigating a potential connection between diet and cases of canine heart disease (DCM), and they implicate as suspect diets frequently listing potatoes or multiple legumes such as peas and lentils early in their ingredient lists. As I read the alert, the low taurine levels caused by grain-free diets is the target of their finger-pointing. However, more research must be done.

[Susan]

Hi Gabrielle,
You wrote, I have a German shepherd mix of some kind that was “rescued off the streets”. When you rescued her what condition did she come in & was she wormed then wormed again 2-3 weeks later?? she may of had the hook worm when you rescued her?

I rescued a English Staffordshire Bull Terrier in very poor condition, weeing blood then pooing blood, he had Stomach & bowel problems but I didnt know about his intestinal problems till he ate certain foods & was doing sloppy, jelly poos with blood streaked thru his poo & then he’d have like your girl had Diarrhea he couldn’t control from Food Sensitivities… Lentils & boiled Rice, boiled rice irritates his bowel, he does best eating Sweet potatoes & Potatoes as main carb in dry kibbles…also Boiled sweet Potato with his pork rissoles I make or I buy a dog food in pet fridge section that is Lamb, Coconut & veggies balls & it has sweet potato….he eats these foods for lunch..

I put my cat food up on a scratching post/tree now, the scratching post thing has ground level, a middle level & a top section where there’s a big shelf, I have put a big ceramic tile there & I feed Indy all her foods on her scratching post shelf this way Patch can not get tempted & eat any of her food & then have one of his IBD flares.

Has your vet put her on Metronidazole for 21-28 days? Metronidazole is excellent for inflammation of stomach & bowel & bad bacteria over growth, I think she needs more then the probiotic to help heal her intestinal tract. My vet writes Patch repeat scripts of Metronidazole to keep at home so when I see he’s becoming unwell again I start him on Metronidazole x 200mg tablet every 12 hours with a meal for 21 days…

I would change her diet & would start her on a dry food that has just 1 novel protein & 1 carb, has medium protein % around 28-34% & is medium in fat around 12 to 15% fat & low in carbs 32% less or start her on a Hypoallergenic vet diet & do a food elimination food diet to work out what foods she might be too?? the vet diet she is eating at the moment could be making her Intestinal tract more inflammed if she is sensitive too certain ingredient in the vet diet she is eating, ask your vet can put her on a 21 day course of Metronidazole & can you change her vet diet? not all vet diets suit all dogs health problems, my boy tried all the Hills & Royal Canine Intestinal vet diets, none of them helped him till we tried Eukanuba/Iams Intestinal Low Residue dry kibble, this helped his IBD, then after 9 months when his bowel had healed I started introducing a grain free dry kibble that had Lamb only protein & Sweet Potatoes, Potatoes, Egg & Peas & he did really well with his skin & intestinal tract…..
Are you feeding 3 smaller meals a day, divide how much she should eat a day & split into 3 meals, so stomach/bowel works less digesting smaller meals, I feed 4 smaller meals a day 7am- under 1 cup dry kibble, 12pm-at lunch time Patch gets a small wet meal about 1/2 a cup, 5pm – under 1 cup dry & 8pm-1/3 a cup dry…..

Patch is doing well eating “Wellness Core” Large Breed Adult formula, it is low in Kcals-345per cup, this is what you need to look at, how high are the Kcals per cup & stay under 360 Kcals per cup, the higher the Kcals the more dense the dry kibble is, so more work on stomach & bowel to digest…also the lower the fat% & lower protein % is, the higher the carbs will be….
I asked Patches vet to do an Endoscope + Biopsies on Patch December 2013, you need the Biopsies so vet knows what is wrong & treat with medications if she still isnt better after 1 yr…. the first Endoscope & Biopsies Patch had 1 yr after I rescued him, Biopsies show he had moderate chronic lymphocytic gastritis with a lymphocytic nodule present in the deeper mucosa of one section, variable numbers of spiral bacteria present, (Helicobacter-Spiral bacteria) Some gastric pits are mildy dilated. He was always hungry & had dirrahea on & off..
Then Patch had another Endoscope & Biopsies done January 2018 this year when he went down hill real quickly after we moved, he stopped eating his favorite kibble & the whole time I’ve owned Patch he never refuses any food, only when he has his rumbling, grumbling loud bowel noises early hours of the morning, then he doesn’t want to eat, which isnt a bad thing, dogs are smart & they know when to rest their stomach & bowel… this time his poos were firm, then the next day sloppy, then diarrhea & he was eating the same dry food, he kept swolling & swolling wierd noises, he had bad acid reflux, crying with pain & wasn’t his happy go lucky self, he had a sore throat, I thought he had bowel or stomach cancer this time, biopsies showed he had mild lymphoplasmacytic and eosinophilic gastritis with spiral bacteria again…
but in the “Comment” section the Veterinary Pathologist wrote,
Sections of the small intestine could not be fully assessed because of inadequate sampling..

Patches vet said the flap between the stomach & Esophagus isnt closing properly so his stomach acids are washing back up into his throat & his wind pipe was badly inflammed & there’s nothing he can do to fix the flap, Patch was put on 21 day course of triple therapy meds… & I kept trying all different dry foods that wouldnt make him swollow as much, the Nutro grounded rice & lamb kibble work best but the kibbles that had grains were causing “big” sloppy poos or diarrhea, he needed to eat a grainfree diet without Lentils & Chickpeas which is very hard to find a grainfree dry kibble that are Legume free, finally in Australia we are getting new dry Kibbles that are Legume free which will be good for Patch but some are high in fat around 16-18% fat, this causes bad acid reflux.. 🙁

Once you find foods/ ingredients she can eat then she will get better, she needs ingredients that will not irritate her stomach & bowel more, sounds like her bowel is inflammed & she needs medication to help heal, a good diet that’s easy to digest so everything can heal…
Think back what was she eating & was doing really well on?? try that again or something similiar & feed 3 smaller meals a day, see does she settle down, also keep a diary just incase over the years she developes IBD & keeps having flares….
also becareful with weight loss/weight management dry kibbles as they are higher in fiber & carbs…around 12-14% fat isnt that high for a dog, when they eat raw diet its normally around 30-50% in fat… look at Freeze dried diets they’re heaps better then dry processed kibbles..

[Susan]

Hi Reese,
Have a look at “Earthborn Holistic Venture” formula’s? look at Alaska Pollock Meal & Pumkin formula the only problem with Venture formula’s they’re “very”high in fiber this fish formula is-13% fiber..
I do not feed any fish dry foods as they have been found to be higher in toxins & contaminates, so make sure you rotate with another brand that isn’t fish…
What I like about Earthborn Venture formula’s is Earthborn writes the plant protein % of all their carbs, so you can see how much pea protein %, the Pumkin protein %, Butter squash protein in all the Venture dry formula’s..
https://www.earthbornholisticpetfood.com/dog-food-formulas/venture/alaska-pollock-meal-pumpkin
When you look at Earthborn Venture Pork Meal & Butter Squash formula you’ll see it has 35% Pea protein, so this shows us when there’s just 1 meat protein meal as 1st ingredient then a carb as 2nd ingredient, then peas-3rd ingredient, the pea% (Legumes) becomes VERY high over 20%..
Ingredients – Pork Meal, Butternut Squash, Peas, Pea Protein, Flaxseed, Sunflower Oil
https://www.earthbornholisticpetfood.com/dog-food-formulas/venture/pork-meal-
butternut-squash

If a dry kibble has any Legumes just stay under 20% in Legumes & rotate with another brand….
Like my boy as soon as he eats any kibbles with grains he becomes real itchy 20mins after eating the grain food also he has IBD & his poo’s becomes very sloppy you can’t pick up his poo’s, he does really well on Sweet Potato & Potato kibbles & Im staying with the “Wellness Core” Large Breed Adult formula, he’s doing well on it for his IBD, it has 3 meat proteins as 1st, 2nd & 3rd ingredient then it has Potatoes 4th, then peas are 5th ingredient….
I make sure there’s at least 2-4 meat proteins as 1st, 2nd, 3rd ingredients, this way there’s less carbs, so less legumes (peas).

*Here’s Farmina Pet Foods. They look very good so they’re probably expensive.
https://www.farmina.com/us/dog-food/54-n&d-quinoa-functional-canine.html

*Here’s Farmina Grain free formula’s.
https://www.farmina.com/us/eshop-dog/dog-food/10-natural-&-delicious-grain-free-canine.html

[Angela S]

thanks for your input c4c. i appreciate your sharing this information. i guess i’ll just monitor my dog’s health and hope for the best. she seems healthy. only issue i’ve had with her recently is soft poop (hard to pick up and sticking to the grass), which is why i changed foods to up her fiber to see if that would help. currently, i’m feeding my dog american journey salmon and rice. before that was grain free whole earth farms turkey and chicken.

how would we know what grade corn is in the food?

[crazy4cats]

Hi Angela S-
That’s a great question! I’m trying to figure that out. LOL! Right now I am feeding Fromm Gold Weight Management. It is a little high in fiber so I may switch to their Reduced Activity Formula. I have also fed a lot of kibble that contains peas and potatoes. But, I am not worried. They are not showing any signs of DCM. However, they just got over a bad case of kennel cough. The coughing scared me at first with it being a symptom of DCM. But, it’s all gone now. They even had the Bordatella vaccine! I guess it is very bad in our area right now and their can be different strains, just like the flu.

So, I have done a 180 since I started on this site. I don’t believe the big companies are evil and I will probably stick with them in addition to Fromm. I really don’t think corn is bad as long as you are feeding a reputable brand that uses high quality corn, grade 1 or 2. I have fed Iams and they are on my list to feed again. In fact, I think corn makes the dogs coat soft and shiny.

Here are a few interesting links about corn:

Can Dogs Eat Corn?

http://www.askavetquestion.com/nutrition/corn/

I also have Purina One, Purina Pro Plan, Authority, Eagle Pack (Made by WellPet) and Iams on my list to feed. Iams is made by Mars who also makes Royal Canin. I feed my cats RC kibble and mostly Purina canned. RC is too expensive to feed my two 85 pound lab/retriever mix pups though.

Even though my dogs do well on kibble with potatoes and peas, I will not be feeding them if they are the only carbs in the kibble anymore. At least until more information comes out. I also add a little canned to their meals, hopefully adding a little more meat protein to their diets.

Good luck. This is a scary and frustrating time.

[Angela S]

someone on this forum told me to try upping fiber in my dog’s diet. my dog was having the same issue-she wasn’t having diarrhea. Her poop had shape to it, but it was too soft, would stick to the grass and it was difficult to pick up. i switched to a food with 6% fiber. she has been eating american journey salmon and brown rice. she’s only been on it for a month or less. her poop seems to be firm now most of the time. of course, now i’m wondering if i chose the right thing, because one of the main ingredients is peas, and i’m worried about what peas can do, as I’ve been reading there is a possible connection between peas in the diet and heart issue. i’m upset that there are so many controversial ingredients and no one can agree on what a good food is. it makes you wonder what is really good for our dogs??

[Susan]

Hi Lindsay,

Sometimes diarrhea may not be food related, “Food Sensititivies”
the diet you were feeding probably has caused an imbalance in his intestinal tract, causing too much bad bacteria over growth….
I have a dog with IBD, Environment Allergies & Food Sensitivities, my boy does excellent eating Sweet Potatoes, Potatoes but doesn’t do well eating Lentils or Chickpeas he gets bad diarrhea from lentils & chickpeas cause bad gas & sloppy poos…

Dr Greg Aldrich PhD, Research Associate Professor at Kansas State University, Pet Food & Ingredient Technology,
found Legume Seeds carry significant quantities of FERMENTABLE OLIGSACCHARIDES, In small amounts these may be beneficicial to the animal BUT large concentrations of Legumes can become an issue & have significant impact on level of fermentable fiber in the colon, limit legume seeds, no more then 20% in a dogs diet…
I’d say this is what has happened with your boy & is still happening & diarrhea isnt clearing up, his diet has caused floral imbalance & has affected the balance between beneficial bacteria vs.harmful bacteria in his intestinal tract.
this is why your vet has put him on Purina Fortiflora, but your dog needs something stronger?

…Make sure fiber % is under 5%, his diet is not too high in fiber, a dogs digestive tract is short & they don’t need all this fiber in their diet, alot of these newer grain free dry kibbles are higher in fiber cause of all the Legumes….
…My boy will eat the same kibble & have NO problems with his IBD then all of a sudden he starts racting doing very sloppy, smelly poos or gets bad diarrhea & has bad gas (farts), its either from his environment allergies are so bad & puts his immune system into over drive his vet said causing a bad IBD flare, it always happens late March, the end of Summer (I live Australia).
My vet said she see’s us every March & showed me her computer screen & we visit her around the same date every March these last 5yrs needing medications, this is when she said to keep a diary, then over the years you’ll start to see a pattern with his Environment allergies, but sometimes when Patch has sloppy poos or has diarrhea the vet says he has too much bad bacteria… I think she knows when she asks what colour is his sloppy poos, too much bad bacteria, normally dog does yellow smelly poos its Small Intestinal Bowel Overgrowth, (S.I.B.O)…Big Dark cow paddy poos are normally a large bowel problem..
Patch gets put him on Metronidazole 200mg for 3 weeks, 1 x 200mg tablet twice a day, every 12 hours with a meal for 2 weeks, then the next week he just takes 1 x 200mg tablet with his Dinner for 7 days.
Metronidazole kills the bad bacteria in stomach & bowel, I change & rotate his diet but when he’s doing diarrhea from Environment allergies & his immune system has gone off the rails & is over reacting, I just feed him what he’s been eating cause his diarrhea isn’t caused by too much bad bacteria in gut…

You would have seen on the news lately about Legumes, I wouldn’t be feeding my dog a high Legume diet & Zignature is very high in Legumes, till FDA works out why Legumes are blocking Taurine in dogs diet…..

How did you work out he can’t eat Chicken, Sweet Potatoes & Potatoes?? I thought the same 4-5 yrs ago when I first rescued Patch, I thought Patch couldn’t eat Potatoes & for 1 yr I didnt know what to feed Patch, it was a nightmare until 1 lady that worked at Pet Shop told me to start adding 2 tablespoons of boiled potato to his meals or give 2 tablespoons of boiled potato for lunch as a treat daily & see does he get diarrhea?? & she was right he was not sensitive to potatoes or sweet potatoes, they firmed up his poo’s lol.. I look back now & I think it was the fish in the Eukanuba FP- Potato & Fish vet diet I started to introduce, something was off making Patch very unwell with bad diarrhea, I bought Eukanuba FP for his skin allergies, poor Patch had bad diarrhea for 1 week straight, we couldnt clear up his diarrhea, so he couldnt eat no food for 48hours, only given an electrolyte drinks, then take Metodinazole twice a day & then was put onto Royal Canine Low Fat Intestinal wet can food only, its pork, corn & rice, then when course of Metonidazole tablets were finished, he was put on Protexin Probiotic powder for 6months…

Have you done a proper elimination food diet? this can take up to 6 months or you can use a Hypoallergic vet diet, then when dog is doing well, you start adding 1 new ingredient with the vet diet & he cant eat any treats nothing just the Hypoallergenic vet diet & then introduce 1 new food every 6 weeks…

I’d see your vet again & tell him his diarrhea isnt clearing up, ask can you try a 21-28 day course of “Metronidazole” to kill the bad bacteria, then when the Metronidazole course is finished start giving the Purina Pro Plan Fortifora again give without any food, best to give probiotics inbetween meals or first thing of the morning when stomach acids are low, not high, when you’re digesting your food your stomach acids are higher & kill the live probiotics…I was mixing 1 teaspoon probiotic powder with 10-15ml water, swirling water & dissolving powder in bowl & then Patch would drink it, mid morning inbeween meals he thought he was getting a treat….

What meat protein does he do well on?

I’d look for a Freeze dried or Air dried food like “Ziwi Peak” – https://www.ziwipets.com/catalog/ziwi-peak-dog-nutrition

or look for a limited ingredient kibble that has just 1 single meat protein you know he does well on & make sure omega 3 & 6 is balanced properly, Omega 3% should be around 1/2 of what the Omega 6% is, this is why vet diets are good as they’re properly balanced.

I normally suggest Sweet Potatoes & Potates for diarrhea as dogs normally do firmer poos on potatoes, even vet diets have potatoes for the Skin & Stomach health, Royal Canine has their Select Protein formula’s & Hills has their D/D formula’s, but he cant eat potatoes, is this cause he’s sensitive to them & gets yeasty ears & skin or does he get diarrhea??
a dog only gets yeasty skin paws & ears when he is sensitive to an ingredient & then he reacts causing stomach or skin problems or Environment allergies can cause yeasty skin ears & paws…

Maybe ask your vet for a Intestinal Health vet diet or a Hypoallergenic vet diet to help balance gut flora for healthy gut & take the Metronidazole then after he’s doing really well after 4-6months then I’d look for a limited ingredient kibble that has healthy grains, if he cant eat sweet potatoes & potatoes…
then once you find a few different brands he does well on the start rotating between different brands, so he isnt eating the same dog food 24/7 & if something is wrong with one brand he’s eating your rotating his food every 2-3 months & not causing any health problems….Rotating foods strengthen immune system/gut aswell..

* “Wellness Simple” LID Lamb & Oats or Duck & Oats -https://www.wellnesspetfood.com/natural-dog-food/simple-dogs

* “Wellness Core”

Core Dog Products

* “Farmina” has LID or Farmina Vet Life – https://www.farmina.com/us/d-dog-food.html

* “Natural Balance” LID Lamb & Rice

[Susan]

Hi
I think people are confusing these health problems caused by Legumes with Potatoes aswell…
Earlier this month, the Food and Drug Administration announced that it is investigating a link between these newer Exotic protein, high Legume Grain Free diets with a common type of canine heart disease, DCM.
FDA also mentioned Potatoes awell but I think Potatoes were only mentioned cause these newer grain free kibbles have Peas, Chickpeas & Potatoes, or they’ll have Peas, Green Lentils, Red lentils & Sweet Potatoes….
So Potatoes were mentioned on the FDA report??…
“Guilit by association”
I have seen NO proof that it’s potatoes blocking taurine & causing heart problems in dogs?
If anyone has any proof that potatoes are blocking taurine causing deficiency of Amino Acid Taurine in Dogs.
Please post this proof..

When G/F kibbles first came out years ago they all had Potatoes & Sweet Potatoes & there were NO health problems in dogs..
There’s kibbles that have healthy grains & potatoes, these kibbles have caused no health problems, these health problems happened since these newer G/F kibbles were very high in Legumes…
Types of Legumes
Chickpeas.
Beans.
Peas.
Lentils.
Lupins.

Royal Canine & Hills make vet formula’s that contain Potatoes but they do not have any vet diets containing Legumes..???

Potatoes are not related to Legumes.
Legumes are the fruit or pod of the botanical family Leguminosae. The potato tuber (Solanaceae family) is actually the greatly enlarged tip of the underground stem of the potato.
Potatoes are a Tublr plant with notable tuberous roots include sweet potato, cassava….

If you’re looking for a new kibble look for kibbles that have Sweet potatoes, Rice, Oats, Potatoes, Blueberries, Butternut Squash, Pumkin, healthy grains etc as long as your dog doesn’t have any food sensitivitives to certain grains & ingredients…
Make sure there’s no more then 20% legumes (peas) in the dry kibble, if the kibble has peas just make sure the peas are further down the ingredient list, 5th 6th 7th ingredient & peas are NOT 1st 2nd 3rd or 4th ingredient…

Here’s a kibble ingredient list that I’d avoid, this formula is very high in Legumes….

“Kangaroo, Kangaroo Meal, Peas, Chickpeas, Pea Flour, Sunflower Oil (preserved with Citric Acid), Flaxseed, Red Lentils, Green Lentils, Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Pea Protein, Natural Flavors, Salt,”

*There’s Red Lentils, Green Lentils, Chickpeas & Peas, all these Legume ingredients make the protein % higher with Plant Proteins, Kangaroo is expensive so there’s more plant proteins, then meat proteins also look at ingredient spliting with peas? peas are 3rd ingredients, then again Pea Flour is 5th ingredient, then pea protein is 11th ingredient, if they didn’t split the peas up then the peas would probably have been 1st or 2nd ingredient…

also rotate your kibbles with different brands, so your dog has variety in his diet, if 1 brand of kibble does have something wrong with it, your dog isnt eating this brand long enough to cause any health problems cause your rotating his diet….

Look at Freeze Dried raw aswell, there’s some good freeze dried dog foods, the freeze dried ingredients are not cooked at very high temperatures like kibble is made so the nutrients stays in the ingredients….

“Ingredient spliting” is a trick these Pet Food Companies do, they split the peas up, in the ingredient list, pea flour, pea protein, pea fiber, when you see these ingredient avoid these dog foods as they are full of peas, the peas are really the 1st ingredient but cause they have split the peas into pea flour, pea protein, pea fiber, then the peas move further down the ingredient list but really the peas are 1st ingredient & your meat protein is probably 3rd ingredient….
Ingredient list are written when ingredients are raw, not cooked, these pet food companies know all the tricks & cons so we buy their foods, we just have to be smarter then them & learn how to read an ingredient list..

Please post kibble brands & their formula’s that are legume free or 20% or less in legumes, to help people that dont know what to feed till we get more answers..
Please no nasty posts…

[crazy4cats]

You’re right, Stacy, the first article is very interesting! A couple of posters, BobbyDog and Aimee brought up some of those very questions on whether or not the diets just are not appropriately balanced and/or maybe the amount fiber or source of fiber may have an impact on taurine absorption. I’ve never heard of wagglydogs. Interesting site. Thanks!

And, I believe they are correct on the enormous impact that FDA statement may make on the dog food industry!

[Kelley H]

Hi, my name is Kelley and I am new to the forum. I work for CountryPet Naturals, and this post was recently brought to my attention by one of our customers. I would like to clarify some of the points mentioned above as they are not an accurate representation of our pasteurized frozen dog and cat food rolls. I see the original post has three main concerns, so I will address each of them below.

1. Our website and product packaging accurately list all ingredients that go into the food as required by the FDA. Our food contains muscle meat (including heart), offals (organs such as lung, liver and kidney), small amounts of ingredients to bind the meat together (such as pea fiber, tapioca starch, vegetable oil), and vitamins & minerals which are required by the AAFCO to ensure a complete and balanced food for dogs and cats of all life stages. The minimum meat content in any of these recipes is 92%.

The protein and fat contents vary slightly depending on the recipe, but we are required to publish the minimum levels of protein and fat that may be found in our food. As a small family-owned company, we are conservative with our minimum values, with lab testing consistently showing levels higher than we publish. If we look at the dry-matter basis of our Lamb Recipe Dog Food, for example, the protein comes out to a minimum of 38%, fat is a minimum of 34%, fiber a maximum of 3%, and ash a maximum of 16%. The remainder is known as Nitrogen Free Extract (or carbohydrates), which comes out approximately 9%. In reality, the protein and fat content is higher than what we state on the packaging, and the ash and carbohydrates are lower, but we always stay on the conservative side and have never in our history had to recall a product from the market.

2. To the best of my knowledge, our food has never contained Menadione and is certainly not an ingredient included in any of our recipes. All ingredients are posted on our website and printed on the product packaging.

3. None of our foods are raw, and we do not advertise the product as raw. However, some of our customers mistake the product for raw due to the high meat content and texture. Instead of offering a completely raw diet, our Naturally New Zealand line is pasteurized to help keep our customers’ pets and family safe. Raw meat can carry dangerous bacteria such as Salmonella and E. coli, which cause food-borne illness. Again, we choose to do this to avoid recalls, the likes of which have plagued companies that do offer raw diets.

Overall, the ingredients that go into our pet food are 92%-plus sourced from human-grade animal products, and those animals are pasture-raised in New Zealand and free of hormones, antibiotics and grain diets. Our goal is to provide a safe, high-quality product that we can be proud of, and I strongly believe we have accomplished that goal with this dog and cat food. Here’s a link to product reviews posted to our website by happy pet parents.

Please let me know if there are any questions and I’ll be happy to provide answers.

Thank you,
Kelley

• This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by Kelley H.

[Amelia Z]

They are adding it to the ancestral grain formula. The grain free already has:
fiber vegetable of peas. Although I prefer grain free, I was getting desperate so I was going to try the ancestral grains and they said they are coming out with a new formula that will have pea fiber. I looked into sport dog that has no peas but thought it might be too rich since it is for sporting dogs. Although my goldens are a sporting breed, they are not SPORTING. But they are out of stock because of the issue of taurine and peas. So now that’s out. The more I read about kibble it really is the worse food we can give them. I am continuing to give them honest kitchen and wean them off the Acana. They seem to like it. I may give them that one meal and Grandma Lucy’s artisan Chicken for the other. This will definitely cost alot more but if it is better for them, I will do it. It certainly is worth my sanity. I can’t research any more. This is been going on for months and I am at my wits end!
Here’s some interesting info:
https://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2015/11/08/best-to-worst-pet-food-types.aspx
https://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/dog-food-ten-scary-truths/

[Nadine H]

Sorry about another post, this is the third now, 🙂 The grain free has had pea fiber but not the low grain. I’ll be emailing the co. to ask if they are adding pea fiber to the one I feed. We went though so many foods until we found Farmina, really don’t know what I’ll do if they are going to add the pea fiber. I don’t know if just one pea ingredient is also a bad thing. Some of the no grain brands are loaded with peas, chickpeas, lentils, pinto beans etc. and that isn’t good. I’ve read that that a dog lacks the necessary enzyme to efficiently absorb plant based foods.

[Susan]

Hi,
I would look for a limited ingredient single protein dry kibble, this Victor Active has 4 meats, excellent for a dog who has a healthy Intestinal tract..
My boy has IBD I had to start with a vet diet, then once we found a vet diet that agreed with him & firmed his poos & was doing 2 small firm poos a day “Eukanuba Intestinal” Low Residue formula he had to stay on Eukanuba Intestinal vet diet for 6-12months to strengthen his immune system (Gut), then after 9months, I started trying a new dry kibble but it had to have 1 single meat, limited ingredient kibble & he finally did well on Taste Of The Wild Pacific Stream, Smoked Salmon but in Australia our some of our TOTW formula’s do NOT have any Peas, Lentils Chickpeas like the America TOTW, we still get the old TOTW formula’s.. he did really well on the peas free TOTW Pacific Stream Salmon formula except he started vomiting back up the dry kibble, now I’ve learnt to stay away from any fish kibbles as they are higher in Contaminates & Toxins, I changed him over to the TOTW Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb formula it just has Lamb as meat protein & he did really well, no skin problems & firm poo’s, then I started introducing other foods in his diet so he’d get use to different ingredients, I even went thru a Animal Nutritionist & put him on a raw elimination diet, Kangarro & blended veggies, his poos were beautiful BUT he kept regurgitating back up water & some digested raw, then he was getting bad acid reflux & after regurgitating the raw the acid burnt esophagus so I put him back on dry food & started to cook the raw diet & feed it for Lunch & feed 4 smaller meals thru the day..

I would take baby steps, you will know once she has stopped taken all her meds…
Why does your 4-5 month old pup have UTI’s, she is so young?? also the pancreas test, you’d know if she had Pancreas problems, she’d be vomiting sometimes, eating grass & having pancreas pain & maybe sloppy poo’s, but her Pancreas would young & healthy??
I really think she is too young to be having problems with her Pancreas??..
What colour are her poos?? if her poos are yellow, smelly & sloppy look into Small Intestinal Bowel Overgrowth, S.I.B.O……while she was taking Metronidazole (Flagyl) were her poos better? sometimes they need to take the Metronidazole for 21-28 days to kill any bad bacteria in stomach/small bowel.. this is what Patch ended up having SIBO & Helicobacter-Pylori, it took a few years to get everything healthy aagain, now I can feed him any foods as long as he’s not sensitive to those ingredients, he does well on Chicken for stomach & bowel BUT not for his skin, he gets red yeasty paws & red skin around his mouth after he eats Chicken, Barley, Oats, Tapioca, Corn & cooked Carrots make his ears itchy…

If you can afford a vet diet that’s where I’d start, as Intestinal Vet diets have FOS, MOS, Inulin, Vitamin B, Beet Pulp, everything to help make the Intestinal Tract healthy, then once she is stable on a vet diet for at least 6 months then start her on a premium dog food that only has 1 meat protein & a few carbs..but slowly start introducing over 2 week period if you see her poos going sloppy while introducing new food, then stop new food & go back a few steps & stay on what she was doing firm poos on & keep a diary write everything down, food, ingredients, flea med, worm meds etc just in case you needs to remember certain things….I wouldnt give her any of those Flea chews yet, just use the spot on flea repellents for now till you work out her stomach bowel problem, just in case she has a very sensitive stomach/bowel, I just read a post on a Staffy f/b group, the lady gave her dog a Bravecto chew will the vet gave her dog the Bravecto chew & he’s been in vet hospital on a drip now for 1 week, dont ever vaccinate, worm & give flea chews all at the same time some vets do this on vet visits I know teh rescue vets do this & some dog can not cope always leave 1-2 weeks inbetween meds vaccination & flea repellents etc
How much does the bag of kibble say to feed her for the weight of your pup? maybe feed 3 smaller meals a day, thats what your suppose to feed a puppy 3 meals a day then they go to the 2 larger meals as they are older.. also have you tried boiled chicken or turkey breast & some boiled potato or try boil rice & see are her poos firm?? maybe for lunch over weekend try a small cooked meal, or a wet can vet diet the Royal Canine Intestinal low fiber is really good, some vet diets are formulated for growning pups your vet will know which ones Im pretty sure the Hills I/D Digestive Care wet & dry is formulataed for growing pups this way you”ll see does she do firm poos over a 2 week period? or try the single meat limited carbs next & see if poos are sloppy then try a vet diet.. Keep us informed with what happens with Zanya’s health….

[RottieMom]

Here is the run down of the food I have her on.

Victor Active Dog & Puppy Formula Grain-Free Dry Dog Food is formulated using multiple proteins including USA-sourced beef, chicken and pork meals, along with nutritious peas and sweet potatoes in place of grains. This premium-quality food also contains scientifically advanced ingredients that support your pup’s digestive and immune system health. Victor Active Dog & Puppy is an excellent food for dogs that may have allergies to grains or glutens, and can be fed to dogs of all ages.

Key Benefits
Super premium 33% protein grain-free dog food made with high quality protein sources for well balanced nutrition designed specially for active dogs & puppies
75% of protein in this recipe comes from a combination of USA sourced beef, chicken, pork & fish
Recipe features antioxidant-rich sweet potatoes that are high in dietary fiber and great for digestive health
Menhaden fish meal contains DHA, an essential nutrient for growing puppies
Grain-free and gluten free recipe for easy digestion

Nutritional Info
Ingredients
Beef Meal, Sweet Potato, Chicken Meal, Peas, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols), Pork Meal, Menhaden Fish Meal (source of DHA-Docosahexaenoic Acid), Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Dried Egg Product, Flax Seed (source of Omega 3 Fatty Acid), Yeast Culture, Natural Chicken Flavor, Potassium Chloride, Dried Kelp, Salt, Montmorillonite, Tomato Pomace (source of Lycopene), Dried Carrot, Choline Chloride, Hydrolyzed Yeast, Dried Chicory Root, Taurine, Zinc Amino Acid Complex, Hydrolyzed Yeast, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Amino Acid Complex, Manganese Amino Acid Complex, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Selenium Yeast, L-Carnitine, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D Supplement, Copper Sulfate, Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Niacin Supplement, D-Calcium Pantothenate, Thiamine Mononitrate, Biotin, Magnesium Amino Acid Chelate, Riboflavin Supplement, Calcium Iodate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Lecithin, Fructooligosaccharide, Folic Acid, Yeast Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium Fermentation Product, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Niger Fermentation Product, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Product, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Citric Acid, Rosemary Extract.
Caloric Content
3,640 kcal/kg, 397 kcal/cup
Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein 33.0% min
Crude Fat 16.0% min
Crude Fiber 3.8% max
Moisture 9.0% max
Omega-6 Fatty Acids 2.8% min
Zinc 150 mg/kg min
Selenium 0.4 mg/kg min
Vitamin E 150 IU/kg min
Omega-3 Fatty Acids 0.4% min
L-Carnitine 50 mg/kg min
DHA 0.1% min

[InkedMarie]

The amount and “quality” of poop is individual to the dog. One of mine needs a low fiber food. BTW, vegan foods are not recommended. Do some research.

[Susan]

Hi
I learnt on here “DFA” to Rotate my dog diet, also Hills say on their Vet Diet formula’s when you feed your dog the same diet year after year your dog can start reacting to certain ingredients causing food sensitivities…
Rotating a dog diet strenghten their immune system, stops food sensitivities also if the food/brand your feeding your dog isn’t balanced properly or is high in contaminates & toxins, then when you rotate your dog diet he isn’t eating the same food 24/7 causing health problems….
You will see a big difference in your dog coat, skin & over all health, my boy has IBD, if I stay on the same dry food for more then 3 months my boy starts reacting, he goes down hill, starts doing his smelly sloppy poos, so around 3 months I start to introduce a new dry food, I look for a new kibble/freeze dried raw that’s “around” the same Kcals per cup, fat% & protein %, the fiber doesn’t seem to matter withPatch as long as it’s NOT higher then 6%… He does get 2 Freeze dried Green Lipped mussels daily & something different for lunch everyday thats not a dry kibble…

Patch will be 10yrs old in November & he still acts like a puppy, running, jumping, playing ball etc people think he’s a young pup… He doesnt suffer with Arthritis, I keep him lean & all muscle, he isnt over weight to put any pressure on his joints, he gets walked twice a day & has a very active life for a dog, I think this also plays a big part in a dogs life…

Have a look at “Canidae Ancestral raw freeze dried coated formula’s..
https://www.canidae.com/dogs/canidae-grain-free-pure-ancestral-raw-coated-dry-red-meat-formula-with-lamb-goat-wild-boar/

[RollTide10]

Hi everyone,

I’d like to hear what everyone’s thoughts are on rotational diet. My dog, Fury, is a 2-year old Lab Mix who weighs about 60lbs currently. Vet said this is a good weight to keep him on. Since I adopted him I finally found a food that he does well on and is now wondering if I should start him on a rotational diet.

He’s currently having:
Nutrish Peak Northern Woodlands (Turkey, Duck, Quail)
Protein (DMB) 33.33%
Fat (DMB) 16.67%
Fiber (DMB) 5.56%
Omega-3 0.50%
Omega-6 2.20%
Calcium 1.2% Phosphorus 1% (Ca : P – 1.2 : 1)

Rotational Diet, to my understanding, is where you rotate dog’s food every quarter or so.
So something like…

Jan – April – Brand A Turkey
May – Aug. – Brand B Beef
Sept. – Dec. – Brand C Salmon

Thanks for everyone’s thoughts/input! 🙂

[Susan]

Hi Angel,
What formula’s have you tried? have you tried a dry kibble that is just Lamb meal & Rice?? a kibble with grains she might have been fed a cheaper dry food bought from supermarket or she might have been feed a raw or cooked diet??
My rescue was the same he had to be put on Metronidazole 21days & a vet diet for 9 months to get his gut healthy again…
Have you tried adding a probiotic or kefir to her diet??

Look for a new limited ingredient kibble that is chicken free, there could be 1 or 2 ingredients in the kibble she has been eating that she is sensitive too??…

“Artemis OSO Pure” is simliar to Zignature, my boy doesnt do well on a heavy Legume diet,
It’s best to find a pet shop close by & try pet foods from the Pet Shop so they can be taken back if she gets diarrhea or wont eat it, most pet foods have a palability guarantee money back..

If you live near a Tractor Supply store look at “4Health” formula’s or “4 Health Special Care” Sensitive Stomach formula, the fiber is 3% but it mighten have anything to do with fiber %, it might be an ingredient she is sensitive too….
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/4health-special-care-sensitive-stomach-formula-for-adult-dogs-8-lb-bag?cm_vc=-10008

4Health UnTamed has simliar ingredients to Zignature & cheaper…

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/brand/4health%20Untamed/dog?cm_re=4health-_-Untamed+Page-_-Shop+Dog

Keep a diary & start writing down ingredient list & fiber % etc