[Shawna]

Hi Dorenda,

Took a few tries but I was able to log on.. Thanks Patty for the email heads up :)..

Vets often suggest low protein for renal disease when it really isn’t necessary. There are studies even that show dogs that have protein lowered to drastically too early in the disease have increased mortality. There’s some fantastic information on the topic on nutritionist Mary Straus’ website (see quote below). My dog has had kidney disease since birth and has been on high protein raw her whole life (45 to 54%) — she’ll be eight years old the end of June 2014.

“Based on research done in the last ten years (see s a Low Protein Diet Necessary or Desirable?), that the only time it is necessary to feed a low protein diet is when your dog is uremic, which generally means BUN is over 80 mg/dL (equivalent to 28.6 mmol/L), creatinine is over 4.0 mg/dL (equivalent to 354 µmol/L), and the dog is showing symptoms such as vomiting, nausea,inappetence, ulcers and lethargy, which are caused by the build-up of nitrogen in the blood. Even then, feeding low protein will not extend life, but it will help the dog feel better. Subcutaneous fluids can also help at this time (and before).” http://www.dogaware.com/health/kidneydiet.html

If your pup is uremic then consider K/D canned with added toppers to entice eating. Toppers like lightly cooked egg whites or canned green tripe are good options. Both are low in phosphorus but higher in protein. To counter the extra protein you can give probiotics and a certain type of prebiotic to induce “nitrogen trapping”. Nitrogen trapping utilizes the bacteria in the colon to help clean BUN from the blood. I use Garden of Life Primal Defense probiotic (human product) and Fiber 35 Sprinkle Fiber (also human product). If symptoms are bad enough that there is a need to keep protein really low try adding high quality fats — organic butter or ghee, coconut oil etc.

I would avoid kibble at ALL COST!!! Kibble of any kind including K/D.

Vet Dr. Royal created a raw kidney disease diet for Darwins. It can be found on their website – link below. The food is REALLY high in protein so again not an option if your pup is uremic. Here’s some info. The actual diet is on the site as well. Your vet will have to contact them to confirm your pup is a good candidate for the diet. http://www.darwinspet.com/kidney-health/

Mary Straus, link above, has diet recommendations on her site – she does include kibbles but kibbles are dehydrating and can cause issues. The protein in kibbles is also poorer quality than any other form and due to this creates more BUN then other diets with the same amount and kind of protein. Nutritionist Lew Olson also has some recipes on her website http://www.b-naturals.com/newsletter/kidney-diet/

Supplements that might be helpful — the one that I will NEVER run out of with my KD girl is Standard Process Canine Renal Support. Turmeric, food grade activated charcoal and burdock root are some to look at. I’d also recommend giving a digestive enzyme no matter what you feed. Mineral waters higher in calcium while being lower in sodium have demonstrated some benefit. They didn’t identify the brand in the research paper but I believe they may have used Evian. I’ve also read that feeding smaller meals multiple times per day is beneficial.

Hope something here is helpful!! Sure hope you can get your pup feeling better!!!

Shawna

[AT]

New here…We are bringing an 8 week old Labrador puppy home next Saturday and I am trying to narrow in on food options. I have spent the last few days reading every single post in this thread and it has been quite an education – thank you to all of you who spend time here to help educate others!
My questions:
1. Our puppy will be coming home on Purina Pro Plan Focus Puppy Large Breed Formula and I want to transition him to something better as soon as possible. Would a few days after he is home and settled in be too soon to start a transition, provided he is not showing any signs of GI distress?
2. If price/cost is not a constraint, what off the shelf product would you feed a lab puppy? I am not up to a homemade diet at this point (might consider this in the future, but don’t trust myself to get up to speed in one week and to get it right during this crucial growth period). Most of the discussions I’ve read here involve rotating quality dry foods (with added toppers/supplements). Would this be the best way to start since our puppy will be coming home on a dry food?
It has also been stated that raw, canned or reconstituted is even better. I can see the raw recommendations in the document linked to several times throughout this thread. What do you consider to be the best of these brands? Would transitioning directly to raw be ok for our puppy; or should we go first to canned, then to raw?
Can anyone offer recommendations for the “best of the best” of canned foods for a large breed puppy? I figure I can call companies to calculate exact calcium/kcal, but could anyone offer the best brands/formulas to start my efforts? The fives stars listed in the library are:
By Nature 95% Meat (Canned)
Castor and Pollux Natural Ultramix (Canned)
Dogswell Dog Food (Canned)
EVO Dog Food (Canned)
Fromm Gold Nutritionals (Canned)
Go! Fit and Free (Canned)
Great Life Essentials (Canned)
Kirkland Cuts in Gravy (Canned)
Life’s Abundance (Canned)
Merrick Dog Food (Canned)
Merrick Grain Free Dog Food (Canned)
Nature’s Variety Instinct (Canned)
Pet-Tao Dog Food (Canned)
Pure Balance Dog Food (Canned)
Tiki Dog Food (Canned)
Wellness Core Dog Food (Canned)
Wellness Stews (Canned)
Weruva Kobe (Canned)
Weruva Kurobuta (Canned)
ZiwiPeak Daily Dog Cuisine (Canned)

Thank you so much for any advice!
AT

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by AT.

[Mom2Cavs]

Well….you are not alone in this. There are many dogs that seem to “enjoy” doing this. I had a Cavalier (at the bridge now) that has been known to partake. What I did with her and it seemed to work was I added enzymes to her food. In her case I used a supplement called Solid Gold Seameal. I think sometimes it can be a behavior, attention getting problem. Sometimes it can be the food, I believe. In Stella’s case I’m not sure what it was because she was eating a high quality food, but the Seameal worked. A little while after I started adding it to her food she stopped doing it. I added a canned topper to her dry so put the Seameal in that. As for the Science Diet kibble being the cause, who knows….I do know that you could probably find a little higher quality food for her. I’m not a Science Diet fan, myself, sorry. But if you don’t want to change her food at least adding enzymes or a probiotic/enzyme supplement can’t hurt.

[Tambourineman]

I have a 14 year old lab with bad arthritis. An xray disclosed he also has a lesion on his vertebrae. So he has a lot of trouble getting up and around.

Due to his age we have not opted for surgery for his spine as we think it would be too much for him.

We give him EVO Senior which does have some calcium (2.10%). I regret to say he also gets a strip and a half of bacon which is used to hide the many meds he takes (Gabapentin, 3 tramadol, Rimadyl, and Amantadine) He now rejects pill pockets which he used to gulp like dog treats (we have tried peanut butter, cream cheese, bread, swedish meatballs, turkey hot dogs, a pill popper tool, etc., etc.) Bacon is the only thing that works and at his age not getting his meds would be worse than having some bacon.

Anyway, I am wondering if some more calcium would help with respect to building the bone in his vertebrae back up. As an experiment I ground up some Citrical and put it in his food and unlike when other meds are mixed with food he will eat it. (He no longer chews bones so he does not get any calcium that way.) I’ve read that some add ground up egg shells.

the dog food project says this about calcium: “. . . The correct ratio of calcium to phosphorus and magnesium is very important for a dog’s health and needs to be carefully balanced – this is not something you would want to do without doing your research on the topic!” . . .

“Excess intake of calcium results in growth retardation and severe bone and joint abnormalities. [Presumably this applies to puppies] When feeding a quality pet food, supplementation of calcium *** during growth *** is unnecessary, and potentially very dangerous.
Note: Excess calcium causes decreased phosphorus absorption (and vice versa!). Lack of magnesium in the diet renders calcium useless, because the body needs magnesium to properly absorb calcium. If adequate amounts of all 3 of these minerals are present int he diet, the body can regulate the balance according to its needs.”

Citrical includes 20% magnesium (80 mg) and also Vitamin D

Any thoughts?

[Mom2Cavs]

Pattyvaughn has some good suggestions. I also have Cavaliers and small dogs are notorious for having bad teeth (not just Cavs) so it can be a constant problem, even shortly after dentals. I have had dentals given to mine off and on and their teeth stay good for only awhile. I do brush their teeth, but admit it’s not as often as I should. They are not good chewers, either, which makes it doubly hard to keep teeth clean :(. As for the breath issue. I have found that when mine eat something they are intolerant to or get into something they shouldn’t their breath smells bad. When anal glands are acting up their breath smells bad. Giving probiotics and enzymes helps tremendously. Also, feeding a high quality food and treats (I’ve actually cut them out 99% of their diet) has helped mine. Currently, I’m feeding Fromm 4Star Salmon a la Veg. Now I do also top their kibble with quality canned food (tblsp.) and mix in their prob/enz. When one of my Cavs had a poop eating problem (enzymes solved this, too, for her) her breath was atrocious! So in a nut shell it could be from:

1. the food they eat.
2. anal gland problems (they’re full).
3. eating things they shouldn’t (like poop or bugs, etc).
4. having a cracked tooth or something wrong with gums, teeth, etc.
5. needing a dental (no lie, some dogs need dentals more often, especially small dogs).

First, I would have your vet inspect your dogs mouth to see if anything is stuck in there, or a cracked tooth, etc. Your vet will probably recommend another dental, which isn’t always feasible at the time. I personally do them either every year or every other year. I don’t like to put my oldies under the anesthesia that often.
Giving raw bones can help keep teeth scrubbed clean. Brushing their teeth can help a lot. Even trying some of the dental sprays and gels, like Mercola’s, or Tropiclean can’t hurt either. Good luck to you, I know the pains of owning small dogs with bad teeth. I hope this helps some.

[mellowmutt]

Well, the food’s already mixed… I’ve read this advice a lot, but the only links I’ve come across are to those marketing rotational feeding. Maybe one in ten dogs I’ve ever known had food allergies (mostly to “bad” grains); most of the rest lived long, happy lives on the same food day in and day out, mostly dry kibble of dubious quality by today’s standards. I have two very good, related reasons for mixing rather than rotating.

First, the different kibble sizes, and one kibble being “preferred” really slows down Amiga’s feeding rate. I don’t want her “inhaling” her food, which she does when all the kibbles are the same size/smell. Mixed, she’ll try picking out the Orijen kibbles! Of course she winds up eating most of the other kibbles along with, at which point I guess she figures she may as well finish the meal. But it does take her twice as long to eat, this way, and gives me control of what she’s eating with no fuss because…

Second, she’s one of those picky mals who drive their owners to despair with hunger strikes, this being a well-known feature-bug of many individuals of most arctic breeds — which evolved to be headstrong, independent, and require less food than other dogs of similar size. If I rotate the food, which I did try, she’ll just ignore the food dish until what she wants gets put in it — which turns into a battle of wills the human usually loses (I know I’m a sucker for those sad puppy-dog eyes with whimpering), best not let it start if I want her growth rate to be steady not spurty, though.

http://wildpaw.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=8333
http://wildpaw.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=4462
(list goes on)

I also think Amiga’s spoiled enough without letting her choose her own menu, but it’s a real challenge to get her to eat what I want her to eat, regardless of when she eats it. For instance, when she was protesting NVI Rabbit she got away from me, into a neighbor’s house, and chowed down a whole bowl of Kibbles ‘n’ Bits. Came when called, after a short delay, licking her chops and grinning while the neighbor shooed her out of her house… pinned her ears back and rolled over on her back at my feet in a typical-malamute show of faux-submissiveness (neither hind leg straight), then ignored her own food for two more days. Which turned into four when she figured out how to raid the cat food for a few seconds before I caught her at it, then ate the rest of my sandwich off the countertop while I relocated the cat dish. 🙂

This can also be an issue when using toppers, but I’ve figured out how to train around this. I’m redirecting Amiga’s prey drive into SAR training (informally, can’t train with other dog/handler teams until she’s more mature about working when other dogs are present, there’s a reason so many SAR dogs are Goldens). Aside from disliking all forms of transport (no rhyme or reason for it I can figure, which I also hope she matures out of), all the aptitude for SAR work is there, her kibble OCD really shines through in “re-find” work. Her name is well-chosen, especially where kids are concerned; if the scent she’s on is animal she pricks her ears forward, but pins ’em back submissively for any and all humans… excellent potential despite being a malamute, even on tracking work.

She knows the difference between “food” and “umm-umms” and has figured out what I mean when I say “umm-umms on your dinner-food” — a big reward delayed until dinnertime instead of little treats over the course of a long, physically-demanding training session (which she sees as playing hide-and-seek in the forest for a few hours, at this stage). She’s very treat-motivated. Oh, she’ll still skip a meal here and there, but that just lets me know she isn’t getting enough exercise — that and the zoomie circles around the yard. Both of which I’m currently chalking up to being in season, total psycho malamute puppy on my hands atm.

Some Amiga videos here, the one running next to the bike was taken a month ago while the ones playing with the neighbor Husky are from last week, and aren’t mally pups just adorable before they become terrors?

http://www.veoh.com/list/u/bikefat

What worries me is topping kibble with raw/freeze-dried due to the different rates of digestion. If I just feed the toppers as a meal, I’m worried she’ll lose the correlation with it as a treat, and hold out for it as a regular meal by again spurning her kibble — perhaps even the Orijen. With the mix, when she’s hungry she’s really quite excited about being fed, with none of the malamute games we played when I tried rotating five foods and she’d only eat one of ’em.

YMalMV. 😉

[mellowmutt]

I got Amiga at 8 weeks old, back on June 1st. Her breeder recommended Nutro LBP Lamb & Rice, so that’s what I fed her at first. I wasn’t happy with her gas or her stools, so I did some research and decided to mix Orijen LBP and NV Prairie LBP with the Nutro. Did some more research and discovered that I was feeding her way too much calcium. So I added two other foods to the mix in mid-July, NV Instinct Rabbit and CC Open Sky, had to set up a spreadsheet to keep CA, CA:K, calories & protein in order. I did the calculations based on the max-CA values, not averages or the tested values of a specific batch, to be on the safe side.

Ran out of this mix a month ago, at 8 months apparently she can regulate her CA herself, so I quit worrying about it. Now I have her on a mix of Orijen Regional Red, NV Instinct Rabbit, and NV Prairie Venison & Barley. It seems reasonable to me to feed her a red-meat diet in winter, and switch to a fish-and-fowl diet come summer (ancestral-wolf feeding pattern). In a few months the mix will be Orijen Six Fish, NV Instinct Rabbit LID, and NV Prairie Duck & Oatmeal. Both supplemented with the occasional topper of Orijen Tundra freeze-dried. LID Rabbit doesn’t have turkey, which is in the Duck & Oatmeal formula, so Turkey’s on the menu all year, too. Protein content of these blends is 33%.

The Prairie kibble’s mixed in to lower my cost from $3/lb to $2.75/lb, which adds up with a large breed. Rabbit is in the mix year-round, because I read some research (I’ll post the links if I find them again) about how wild/feral canines/felines primarily eat bunnies. The missing “meat group” in the prepared foods is rodent, so I’ll also occasionally feed raw beaver meat as a topper. I’d like to add a third brand into the mix instead of the Prairie, unfortunately I haven’t found anything that doesn’t have either the “wrong” grains or is loaded with potato (a no-no for malamutes as white potato is known to trigger bloat in this breed), or is too expensive to serve the purpose.

I set up another spreadsheet for amino acids and did yet more research; I believe she’s getting the full spectrum in sufficient quantities from all the different protein sources (also gets Orijen Tundra freeze-dried treats, used these to teach her to swim ‘cuz they float without getting soggy) such that she doesn’t need the glucosamine/chondroitin/taurine supplements typically found in large-breed-specific formulas — her body ought to be able to produce as much of these as she needs provided the proper building blocks (amino acids & cartilage). Her stools, on the “winter blend” anyway, are firm and dry, and not too voluminous or frequent and she seems to be thriving; my Vet is pleased with her physical condition and says her growth rate is right on target.

Many thanks to this site and all who contribute for helping me navigate the dog-food waters, it’s enough to make one’s head explode, but it’s also nice to have so many quality options in dry kibble. It’s been several years since I’ve had a dog (Amiga’s my 4th), Iams and even Purina just aren’t what they once were so I didn’t even consider those despite two of my dogs living to 15 (Keeshond on Eukanuba and Golden Retriever on Hi-Pro). My last malamute got Iams Lamb & Rice, but was shot (with cause) by a sheep rancher at 3 1/2 back in ’94 so I have no long-term report, there.

What got me to not trust dogfood manufacturers and do this research, leading me here, was how horrific the first month was feeding Amiga just the Nutro. Glossy, semi-soft, mucousy stools (if not diarrhea) and lotsa smelly farts — just like my friends’ dogs being fed Nutro. Enzymes, pre- and pro- biotics didn’t help, de-worming only cleared up the worms. No surprise given the ridiculously-high Zinc content in Nutro formulas, apparently since Mars bought them out — these are symptoms of Zinc toxicity, not poor digestive-tract health; no band-aid for that. Wish I’d figured that out sooner, and the calcium-level thing.

If I had the puppy-food phase to do over again, I wouldn’t touch Nutro with a 10-foot pole. These problems lessened when blended with the other kibbles, and disappeared entirely (OK, occasional fart still, probably the grains) this month after discontinuing the Nutro. I would do the four-kibble mix again, going with just the Rabbit and Duck would be lower calcium, but would also lack the glucosamine/chondroitin/taurine supplements the two LBP kibbles contain, as well as the cartilage and broad spectrum of amino acids which make these supplements unnecessary.

I did rush her to the vet after-hours back in September for bloat, but I didn’t alter her diet because of it. Sometimes she eats stuff that isn’t “on the menu” so to speak, mostly I blame my kitties because they love hunting and killing — just not eating their kills, which they leave for the alley cats. And for Amiga, sometimes she finds these before I do and accounts for occasional fur/feathers in her stools (Amiga’s also killed a mourning dove, robin, grackle, and a magpie). At least they’ve learned not to bring them in the house! I’m following all the best-practice guidelines for avoiding bloat, so hopefully this was a one-time thing, scary for both of us…

[A.Sandy]

Hello,
I have a great dane and I get that question all the time if my dog eats the whole house? LOL etc. So anyway just because a dog is big it does not mean they should eat so much IF they are getting fed correctly and a high quality food it does not have to be grain free exactly but just a very good quality. I feed 5 cups a day divided into 2 meals and add toppers every now and then like beef lung, canned Merrick, or Spring Naturals. I feed VICTOR high performance with glucosamine and chondroitin. But everything depends on your pups energy level of course my dog is highly active and is very fit lean but very muscular kind of like a racing dog but that’s me. And I go through one bag a month. since yours are a bit older than mine you should try to feed according to energy level of each. A proper weight is when a dog has a defined tuck (underbelly) and palpable ribs still slightly visible with a layer of fat that covers ribs and visually from the top of the dog it should be like an hour glass but more like a thin sausage with a defined waist. And for the puppies that is completely different, they get larger portions because they are still growing. So get a food that is for all life stages that isn’t too expensive and it should last longer if fed properly for each dog. Try adding canned pumpkin to help them get full as well has a lot of good benefits (fiber, beta- carotene, vitamin A and a lot more).

-Ana
Pet nutrition expert/advisor
pupcatnutrition.com
@pupcatfacts

[A.Sandy]

Hi,
Just make sure to monitor the amount of cod liver fed or don’t feed for long periods of time to prevent liver toxicity. And also keep an eye for any changes your pup might have with all these supplements because if you are feeding a complete balanced meal you don’t need to give so many because it actually counter acts(causes deficiencies).

-Ana
pet nutrition expert/advisor
pupcatnutrtion.com
@pupcatfacts

[A.Sandy]

Ms. patty,
Of course hamburger meat has protein fat, omegas sodium etc but what I was trying to imply is that I have met a lot of customers that feed this kind of meat and ASSUME it’s enough to support a dog’s caloric and nutrient needs. And also, carbs are not a necessity in a dog’s food but it has a lot of benefits(energy, skin and coat, vitamins, omegas etc.) But quality of ingredients are key. This is my field of study and have worked with Reps of some of the highest quality pet foods, and everybody is free to give their opinion of things to learn from each other, so stop bashing me like that because I have no quarrel with you or anybody on this site, so please.

Thanks
Ana

[dwil801]

Thanks!!

[pugmomsandy]

You can mix and match.

[dwil801]

Thanks Patty!! Is it okay to mix the beef with the poultry grinds or should I add a poultry grind with no bone?

[theBCnut]

I would mix the no bone ones half and half with the high bone ones. They shouldn’t be counting heart as an organ at all, for organ purposes only secreting organs count. Heart is an excellent meat to include, but counting it as an organ means these are even lower in organs than they want it to appear. I think the Nature’s Logic will help with that.

I wouldn’t mind using this with other commercial raw foods, but I don’t think I would feed it alone for a long period of time.

[dwil801]

Can anyone out there help me? I realize this post may seem to be advertisement for TQDF especially since this is my first and only post, but I have no affiliation with the company. I guess I shouldn’t have included their name as the title. But if anyone could help me it would be greatly appreciated.

[FreeholdHound]

This was posted a a Greyhound forum in regards to BDN (not my post)

My inquiry:
“Thank you. I found the product analysis, but need the nutrient profile, ie how much protein, calcium, phosphorous, magnesium, sodium, potassium, zinc, niacin, folic acid, iodine, pantothenic acid, iodine, riboflavin, thiamine, vitamin A, D & E, etc, etc, etc………………..you get the idea. It’s usually broken down into three different groups: “As Received”, “Dry Matter Basis” “As Served (Hydrated)”.
This analysis is crucial for dogs with kidney or liver disease as an example. I have a dog with kidney disease and it is vital to know the calcium/phosphorous ratio.”

Their reply:
“According to our latest analysis, the ca/ph ratio of the beef is 1.1:1. The Tripe Supreme has a ca/ph ratio of 1.78:1.
The ratio of the chicken is 1.56:1. All the calcium in our products is from natural origin. You can’t compare this with the studies out there based on products where calcium is added as a supplement.
We have our analysis split up in “As received” and “Dry matter”. I really don’t understand the “As Served” part. This all depends how much water is added by the customer. Some dogs like it a bit dryer, some a bit more moist.

We are looking for the highest bio-availability possible. Most artificial supplements that you see used in all kind of different dog foods simply don’t do the job. They are not readily available. This is also the reason we ferment the vegetables. The fermented vegetables make the calcium, vitamins, and the ingredients in general, highly bio-available.
We hear excellent testimonials from our customers on a daily basis. Older dogs that start playing again, dogs that get better muscle tone, long time ear infections that disappear, etc… the list is endless. Dogs that went from one vet to another for years, and get better after being on Big Dog Natural. This keeps us going and tells us that we’re doing the correct thing.

I know what your saying but I raised and owned Mastiffs for over 30 years. We have an old school approach of dog food. Use high quality ingredients and you’re good. I never raised my kids by over analyzing their foods but they were fed well and healthy. I really don’t believe there is a need for deep analysis when the ingredients are top quality. You only need supplements and additives when crap is used. We use the analysis as a guideline to formulate the product, not as a marketing tool. We just want a healthy dog food for healthier dogs.

Hope this help

Carl Van Bael
The Big Dog Natural Team”

[Samoan81]

Hi guys,

First and foremost would like to thank everyone for their input on previous topics I have really learned a lot about canine nutrition.

I currently have Four English Mastiffs. One male age 7 One Female age 4 and Two pups ages 11 mths Male and Female.

Im currently feeding Earthborn holistic Coastal catch.

The problem im having is that im going through the food really fast. I realize big dogs= big appetites

Right now pups are eating about 10-15 cups a day (depends if their showing or not)
and they are very lean. I don’t wont obese dogs but don’t want them to be hungry. I try adding greens beans and carrots but they sometimes look at me like REALLYYY?!?!?

Im currently going through about 4-5 bags of food a month. The bill is starting to add up if you know what I mean.

My questions are as follows?

What can I add to hold their appetite?

Should I switch foods?
(I don’t want to lose the current quality to save a couple bucks
Ive fed bags of food in the $60-70 price range before)

Is this because the food is grain free?

[dwil801]

I have been lurking around this site for a while and I think I am ready to feed my 15 lb Yorkie raw full time. First of all THANKS for all of the valuable infomation that I have gained from this site. I am still a little confused but I am going to give this a shot.
I will be supplementing his diet with Iceland Pure Sardine/Anchovy Oil, Vitamin E, Nature’s Logic Whole Food Supplement, Cod Liver Oil. I will also add eggs, sardines and yogurt occasionally.
I just rec’d an order from http://www.topqualitydogfood.com (local = no shipping $). I ordered:
1. BEEF Healthy Variety Mix: No Bone
HVM: 7% Veggie/Fruit mix, 10% Beef Heart, Liver and Kidney, Organic whole eggs
2. DUCK HVM: Bone content 30%
HVM: 7% organ meat and 7% veggie/fruit mix
3. Chicken HVM Bone content 26%
HVM: 7% Veggie/Fruit Mix, 10% Chicken Livers and Heart
4. Lamb HVM: Bone content 35%
HVM: 7% organ meat and 7% veggie/fruit mix
5. Icelandic Lamb: No organs Bone content roughly 20%
6. 80/20 ground Beef with 20% green tripe and 10% Beef heart and Liver, No Bone
5. Green Tripe
Some of these grinds seem to have high bone content and low in organs. Any idea how to balance the C&P ratios? Should I add any additional supplements?

[OhBichonPlease]

It’s very expensive, but Weruva canned foods worked wonders to get my finicky girl eating again after a recent week-long hunger strike. [I was worried about her nutrition in addition to the fact that nothing going in means nothing coming out.] It looks and smells [and probably tastes] like human-grade baby food and you are obviously paying for quality product. It comes in a variety of flavors – I had good luck with the Steak Frites and the cat variety of Paw-Lickin Ckicken. She ate it straight out of the can, but really goes nuts over leftovers frozen in ice cube trays. Frozen cubes of nutrient-dense dog foods and toppers/additions [like yogurt, pumpkin, tripe, salmon] has become my go-to strategy for getting food in regardless. She will eat frozen what is refused otherwise, which is great since she also habitually licks her toppers off kibble without actually eating any.

I would also recommend changing the dog’s dish in the meantime – sometimes people plates make kibble more enticing. Or the shape might help – try a deep bowl or a pie pan. And maybe relocating the dish might help as well.
Our girl needs to be heartily encouraged to eat each mouthful of kibble, so we moved her food [but not water] into our bedroom so she eats her dinner while we watch movies before bed.

[Wildcat_1]

Hi all
I
have been reading this topic and the dogfoodadvisor reviews with great interest as I am about to welcome home a new GSD pup. I want to start on a higher quality food than I used in past (Blue Buffalo) and this current pup supposedly is on Eukanuba large breed puppy.

Hound Dog Mom did some great work and without her spreadsheet this would seem like an even more impossible task 🙂 I also read with interest the threads about calcium levels and was about to pull the trigger on Orijen Large Breed Puppy until I saw the potential issues there with calcium. So, with that said I narrowed it down to Annamaet as the one I want to try, specifically Salcha.

Once i looked into local availability I found a company producing something with the same nutritionalist as Annamaet and thought I might give that a try.

This particular company has a couple of products one of which is a grain inclusive puppy specific (28% protein min, 17% fat min, 3.5% fiber, 1.16% calcium dry) specific, the next is an all stages grain free (turkey, chicken, catfish) which is 29% protein, 14% fat 3.5% fiber 1.49% calcium or they have a grain free duck and bison which is 30% protein, 16% fat, 4% fiber.

The questions I have are:

1) Grain free or grain inclusive for puppies ?

2) If grain free as puppy I assume there are still grain free solutions for when they get older (needing leaner food etc) ?

3) Better to go with puppy or all stage food in general ?

Thanks so much all

WC

[theBCnut]

Yes, have the vet do geriatric blood work, but you may be seeing the first signs of canine dementia. A change in food wouldn’t hurt, not necessarily senior food, a lot of them are rubbish and marketing and totally ignore what a senior dog’s actuall needs are. Seniors often digest proteins less efficiently and can need up to 50% more high quality protein. One way to meet this need is to start topping his food with canned food or protein rich fresh food toppers like eggs, sardines, kefir, lean meat table scraps, etc. If you have been feeding once a day, you might want to go back to feeding twice a day, so he doesn’t have an empty belly.

If he is starting to get dementia, the first thing to go is inhibition, so they start doing thing that they formerly wouldn’t do because they knew you didn’t like it. Which can mean that they also revert to puppy chewing on inappropriate things, so watch for that sort of behavior and if you start seeing him reverting, he may need to be crated while you are gone, to keep him safe.

[Akari_32]

The only reason it’s in the garage is because it’s cooler out right now. It’s usually in the pantry, but it’s full of human food ATM (for once LOL). Since I buy small bags, it’s usually fits right in the cabinet over top the human food.

Hey, another FL person! That’s good you guys get a discount! I wish we got one at Publix lol I would go with Core over BB, personally. But as I said earlier in the thread, Core is my favorite grain free food. But I like to switch it up, so I do try most everything. I’ve not used the dry BB, but I’ve used some of the cans. The dogs seem to like Pro Plan cans best, plus I get them free, so that’s what they mainly get for canned mixers, but I like to have fun with my dry food purchases.

Seems we’ve got a similar line up of pets! I’ve got the three dogs, a Mali Uromastyx, three leopard geckos, about two dozen goldfish (I have a goldfish problem… I have a 150+ gallon tank in the works for my 6 indoor fancies LOL), and several tropicals. Between the fish, I have almost 400 gallon of water worth of ponds and aquariums.

What kind of Uro do you have? Did you get yours at PetSmart or a show? We got Rex about 4 years ago at our local PetSmart. My Leos all came from breeders at various Repticon conventions :p Are you near the Pinellas County type area? I buy all my feeder inscects at White Hot Dragons, in (what I call, but may not actually be) St Pete. They are super cheap, and have better quality bugs, as well as a variety 🙂

Use those coupons, girl! Save some money! 😉 I bought $25 worth of etcetera for $8 today at PetSmart Lol

[theBCnut]

Just remember that dog food should be stored in an air tight cool dry dark place, because environmental factors affect the quality of the food. Heat, fresh air, and light in particular break down the fats in dog foods. So the best way to store it is under air conditioning/indoors in it’s original bag with the top rolled down and all the air squeezed out. In the Winter heat is not so much a factor, but over the Summer, the garage is not a good place to store dog food, and here in FL that’s 3/4 of the year.

[OhBichonPlease]

I definitely think you should switch to higher-quality foods… for the picky eater especially – what little he will take down needs to be properly nutritious and high quality since he isn’t eating enough/well. I would transition slowly to minimize upset or selective eating of familiar kibbles and try fasting for a day with no treats or extras [I know it’s hard] before introducing small amounts of a new kibble. You can even try providing 2-4 different kibbles at a time – maybe something in the mix will appeal to your dog especially. You may want to look for a kibble that has a slightly higher fat content or salt as both of those are appealing and will encourage eating and may help get your picky eater to a better state of health. The different ingredients can help your dog adjust to new foods better and will only help/improve nutrient absorption and gut health provided there are no allergies/intolerances. Many local pet shops can provide free samples so you can try adding small amounts of new kibbles without spending much money. Adding some wet food or high quality meat toppers might also entice and encourage better eating habits. You may have to experiment, but tuna, salmon, plain cooked shredded meats, yogurt, canned pumpkin and other pantry items may help establish better habits and digestive health. Warmed peanut butter can also be drizzled over kibble instead of mixing and clumping it up in the bowl. Sometimes piles of food can be intimidating and food may need to be spread out more. Or your dog might not like her food bowl for some reason – try switching to a cereal bowl or a pie tie and see if that helps. Some dogs like to be sneaky eaters so hiding food in several places or the putting the dog bowl in unexpected places or outside might help. Feed your dogs separately [and maybe even at different times of the day], feed well [high quality kibbles and nutritious toppers/extras/treats] and congratulate, encourage and reward with enthusiastic praise every single time your picky eater takes a mouthful of food and actually swallows it.
You may also try making your own dog treats out of the above ingredients or buying canned food and instead of serving it at room temperature or warmed, try freezing it in ice cube trays giving those to your dog on a towel or an easily cleaned floor. Laying down a special mat or picking a quiet corner and acting like a mealtime is very special may also help her your picky dog more excited about dinner. Some dogs really like munching on frozen foods even when they won’t touch them at other temperatures.
When my picky eater isn’t eating I give her a little pepcid [we suspect semi-regular heartburn] and then act really excited about opening a can of high quality wet dog [or occasionally cat or puppy – vet’s recommendation for getting food in when nothing else works.] The smellier the better [canned green tripe works wonders but is best fed outside. I also had amazing luck with small cans of Weruva – it looks/smells like human-grade baby food and is expensive, but the quality is obvious and the food was eagerly consumed both wet and frozen].] I give her a little straight out of the can right off the spoon so she feels like it is human food and a nice treat and then drop some in a dish with kibble. I won’t mix it in anymore because too often she has shunned to food once she discovers the hidden kibbles and I don’t like throwing food out [the neighborhood cats have gotten very friendly since her leftovers get tossed on the pavement for them – I am sure it’s better than whatever they are fishing out of the trash, small birds, squirrels, etc]. But sometimes she will eat up the wet food in one section and then start eating mouthfuls of kibble afterward – progress!
When our girl is especially reticent about eating kibble we move her food into the room where we eat dinner and hang out in the evenings and sometimes have to pretend to eat kibble, hand feed her or toss pieces onto that evening’s dinner plate to get her to start eating. Once she realizes she is indeed hungry she usually goes back to her bowl and only needs encouragement to keep eating [Good girl! What a good dog you are for eating kibble! Good dogs eat their food!] every other bite. She still looks at us for encouragement while eating and I sometimes have to tap to bowl or shake it to remind her there is still food to be had.] I give her a half cup of food at a time and she never eats more than half at night and usually doesn’t empty her bowl entirely until the next afternoon. [She is slightly less than 15lbs and eats approx 300-400 calories a day in food and treats, as far as I can figure.]
I had never met a dog previously who didn’t like and look forward to dinner time, but our rescued Bichon needs to be coaxed and encouraged to eat almost every bite, every day.

Good luck, keep experimenting with higher-quality foods and ingredients and don’t give up!

[OhBichonPlease]

Our rescued Bichon went from going once usually, sometimes twice a day [sizable pile, lighter brown and a bit floppy sometimes] on a low-quality corn based kibble to pooping 2-3 times a day [mostly dark brown, harder/more solid, slimmer and well-formed] on Wellness Core. We spoiled her a bit at first and she gained three pounds during her first month or two with us. She lost that weight easily when we switched to a high quality grain free kibble and nicer dog treats crumbled into tiny pieces. As far as bowel movements during the transition and continuing now, most of the time it is easy out, but sometimes she squat-walks for a minute or two until she feels like everything has passed. She recently went on a hunger strike [and lost a half pound in about a week] and didn’t eat kibble for a week straight and hardly touched treats, human food or stinky, delicious wet food until after giving her some Pepcids. [I created a topic about doggie heartburn in another section on this forum and am curious about other people’s experiences with food refusal due to heartburn or indigestion.] Things are back to normal and settling down digestion-wise, but we are interested in rotating her food and trying different brands and are starting on Dr Tim’s grain free. I am curious to see what this does to her stool volume [never a sentiment I thought I would have]. I too though stool volume would decrease due to her grain-free kibble, but put down her increased regularity to finally getting proper nutrition with quality fiber sources. During her week of not eating, I started making ice cube treats [out of necessity to preserve what was being laid down, but not consumed] made with Wellness 95% salmon and organic canned pumpkin – she loves these frozen goodies [gets 1-2 cubes most days] and I will probably continue to provide them for her for the benefits to skin & coat and digestion. I may even add a bit of yogurt as I understand that freezing doesn’t affect probiotics and I want her to have as wide a variety of helpful gut flora as possible. [As a note, she was pooping more before we started adding pumpkin to her diet. Since she has been getting her ‘salmon pops’ and eating kibble again more regularly – but never yet enthusiastically – she has continued with going 2-3 times a day and never in the morning anymore, curiously.]
Don’t get me wrong – I am happy to see stuff moving through regardless or quantity or frequency, but I read lots of posts where people discussed decreased stool volume and that has not been my personal experience either, so far.
You might also try adding canned pumpkin or frozen or fresh green beans to your dog’s food – that will provide fiber helping pull stuff through and also contributing to a feeling a fullness. It may make your dog poop even more though.
Dog treats can be a major culprit in weight gain, so you may want to switch to treating with toys/playing, smaller treats with healthier ingredients, carrot slices, bones for chewing or something like the Lickety Stik – a great liquid treat [in multiple flavors] with a roller ball dispenser [perfect for training and keeping pockets clean and smell-free]. There are hundreds of licks per bottle and it is super-low calorie – they claim only 1 calorie every 10 licks so you can still indulge your dog without extra/empty calories.

[OhBichonPlease]

I recently adopted an older female Bichon Frise from the local shelter. She has been doing great and made the switch to a higher-quality kibble with no major issues. I recently finished her first bag of Wellness Core and now we are trying Dr Tim’s grain free. She has been getting Cloud Star’s sweet potato Buddy Biscuits crumbled for treats. We had an issue lately that prompted a trip to the vet… For a Halloween treat, I gave my girl a dehydrated rabbit foot from a local pet store. Their products come from a reputable company that sources and processes all of its ingredients in the US. After eating this rabbit foot [complete with fur], my girl stopped eating [and subsequently pooping] for a week straight. There was one incidence of some stuff moving through after the first night, but not really anything else. She wasn’t struggling and didn’t seem in pain. For the first few days she was a bit lethargic and wasn’t interested in toys, but after day 3 or so she seemed like her energy was back and she was drinking normally. I tried everything to get her to eat – moistened dry food, peanut butter, yogurt, warmed wet food, pumpkin, baby food, pedialyte, tuna, etc and she was barely even eating her favorite treats and would sometimes refuse her favorite human morsels outright. We were worried, so we went to the vet. Nothing obviously wrong during the physical and we didn’t want to spring for an xray because I doubted a blockage [and the vet seemed to want to see the rabbit’s foot even though I told him she chomped it up well]… So the vet recommended famotidine, the main ingredient in Pepcid. We were told to give a quarter every 12 hours for a week. Within an hour of her first dose she was eating kibble again [and she is not an enthusiastic eater, especially not for kibble]. We were so relieved – it appears our dog just has a problem with indigestion and/or heartburn. Her diet, eating habits and relieving are all back to normal now… but I find myself giving her a quarter of the acid controller [we bought the store brand] in the evening when she hasn’t eaten. It is pretty obvious that it works because she will start eating soon after that.
I am wondering if anyone else has this issue? Is it safe to give my dog the occasional Pepcid on a semi-regular basis? The acid controller we have at the moment includes the antacids calcium carbonate and magnesium hydroxide – are we over-supplementing her? Are those safe enough for dogs to have several times a month?
Are there some triggers or dietary changes that I may be able to implement to prevent my girl from developing heartburn in the future? Is her physiology responsible or perhaps the way she eats?
If anyone has any experience with doggie heartburn or some comments or suggestions, please respond. I’m so curious about this!

[RVPets]

We have a 7 year old German Shepherd and we have been struggling to control a systemic yeast infection for the past 9 months. Our old vet (I do mean old now) kept putting him on antibiotics, saying it was not yeast, but never doing a skin scrap. Our new vet checked first and immediately told us it was yeast. He wants him on a no carbohydrate/lo. starch diet and has suggested a more holistic approach to controling the problem. We are very pleased with the results so far. He’s grown back most of his hair and his odor has diminshed considerably.

We add Bragg’s Apple Cider Vinegar (with the “Mother”) to his drinking water and we wipe him down with a vinegar and water mixture (50/50) and we are cleaning his ears with the same solution daily. We have hi on a partial raw diet that we have been adding a high quality dog food too (about half raw half dog food).

My problem is that we are having a hard time finding a food that he can eat due to food allergies. Has anyone tried Canidae Grain-Free Pure Elements for dogs? It does not have anything on his “don’t eat” list, but I’m not too sure about having sweet potatoes in the top 5 list of ingredients.

Has anyone else tried this with a “yeasty dog”? Did it help or make it worse? We are trying very hard to find a solution, but we simply cannot feed an all raw diet right now.

This is a list of ingrediants:
Lamb, turkey meal, chicken meal, sweet potatoes, chickpeas, peas, chicken fat, menhaden fish meal, potatoes, suncured alfalfa, natural flavor, minerals (iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite), vitamins (vitamin E supplement, thiamine mononitrate, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D3 supplement, folic acid), choline chloride, dried enterococcus faecium fermentation product, dried lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried lactobacillus casei fermentation product, dried lactobacillus plantarum fermentation product, dried trichoderma longibrachiatum fermentation extract, mixed tocopherols (a natural source of
vitamin E)

[gmcbogger38]

I have a question, but a quick history, first. I had my two dogs, American Bulldog and Rat Terrier, on Nutro Ultra for about 2 years and never had any issues. When I got my Saint Bernard I switched them to Nutro Natural Choice and fed them that for awhile and, once again, never had any issues. I started research on foods and found that there are better foods than Nutro, so I switched my dogs to ACANA and ever since then I have fed them high quality, grain free kibbles and even fed raw for a little bit. They are now on grain free/potato free kibble, but ever since I switched to ACANA my Saint Bernard starting having, what I believe, is a yeast issue. Could it be the potato that ultimately caused the yeast because she never had it before. Anyway, that is when I switched to a grain and potato free kibble and fed raw. Her issues never stopped and now my American Bulldog is having some skin issues. The only things I have changed was their food. Now, I am thinking I need to go back to Nutro and see if it really is the food causing their new issues. Has anybody else experienced this? Is it out of the ordinary that they would do better on a grain inclusive kibble?

[KatB]

Hello!

My kids seem to really love the Castor & Pollax Ultramix, and at first it also seemed to be helping with the itching of my yellow. As time has gone by, he has returned to his itchy self. although mostly in the mornings and he doesn’t seem too uncomfortable or stressed by it.

Some friends have an adopted golden who started itching a few months back. They changed food a couple of times, and then their vet recommended something called atopica. It seemed to work ok, certainly not miraculous but the itching was somewhat lessened, but then some side effects started. In doing research about this drug, turns out it is very controversial and not something I would put my guys on. Bottom line, they went back to the vet, who agreed, and she is now on a prescription diet food that is made by Royal Canin. It’s quite expensive, but will be interesting to see how she does on it and if that takes care of the problem.

I’m not quite ready to go that route yet, as I hate to keep switching their food, and especially since they love it so much. Yet another friend lives in Hawaii (I am in a mountain state so it’s quite dry) with a tropical climate, and still has an itchy dog. They are feeding natural, local dog food and supplementing with flaxseed oil. They also use noni oil specifically made for pets and mix it with coconut oil which they rub on his tummy every so often….it seems to help. I may give that a try……

I also had to take my female, the black lab, off of the pro-biotics and enzymes, as she suddenly started vomiting every time I gave it to her. This started a month or so after I started them on it. But her stools are nice and solid now, and she seems to be fine without the additions. Itchy boy I still have on them plus Omega fish oil, but a small amount. His stools can get runny with too much oil. My female still eats grass and is sometimes a little gassy, but it’s minimal.

I’ll be interested on any updates on what might be working, and I’ll let you know how my friends’ dog does on the Royal Canin.

Kat

[Mom2Cavs]

I’ve gone through this kind of thing with Laverne, one of my Cavaliers. She had diarrhea/loose stools and rumbling stomach and inappetance, along with anal gland problems, tearing, licking forearms and scratching her sides. What helped was definitely adding probiotics/enzymes to her meals and also taking her off all poultry. She is much better now. I also went through various foods to find one that did the “trick”. It took awhile. I know the food I’m currently feeding is not recommended by people on this site due to it being a Diamond food, but it has seriously worked for Laverne, and the other dogs are doing great on it, too. I’ve been using TOTW Pacific Stream and I’m also now mixing in their Sierra Mountain flavor. I do add canned food as a topper (a couple tblsp.) with each meal, plus probiotics/enzymes. The cans I use most are TOTW (poultry free) and Wellness stews/Simple line (poultry free). I’ve also started adding some coconut oil…no real reason, except I had some on hand and just wanted to use it up….and it can’t hurt. The dogs poop twice a day and there is no licking, itching, coats are good and soft, no anal gland problems, tear staining, etc. Their energy is fine and they love the kibble, even eat it as treats. I will keep feeding this food as long as it works. I am aware of Diamond and will be vigilant. Sorry, I went on too long, lol! Anyway, the point is that you should probably try a different food, preferably one without at least chicken, start adding probiotics/enzymes and go from there. While I love Fromm, and I used to feed it quite a lot, I think it has too many ingredients, at least for my dogs. They never did all that great on it, come to think about it…..stool quality was never the way it should’ve been. They also liked it but never loved it. Great company, though! Another thing I would like to mention….when my dog started having a rumbling stomach in the morning it helped to give a snack right before bedtime. I used to use a biscuit treat of some kind, but now I just give about a tblsp. of their kibble. I don’t think I need to do this anymore, but they are used to getting it and no harm done, lol.

[RescueDaneMom]

I rescued my Dane when he was 2 as well. He was only slightly underweight. He was 140 and now weighs 160 at 7 years old. Max is my first Dane and I followed the advice of The Great Dane Lady at first. I like the supplements that she recommends. I use the “Filling in the Wholes” and Nzymes granular supplements which can be purchased from firstchoicenaturals.com. You can also get probiotics and digestive enzymes from them. My mom’s rottweiler that is undergoing chemo treatment is on the 4 in 1 probiotics.

When I first got Max, I put him on a diet of high quality kibble (one of Great Dane Lady’s suggested) and used The Honest Kitchen as a topper. He loved it. It was also a great improvement over the Diamond food he was being fed. I have to agree that she suggests too many kibbles with grain that have high carbs. I would also agree that the licking and chewing at his butt and hips could be a food intolerance. Chicken is the most widely fed protein so it might be worth it to try a different protein. My Dane loves turkey and duck. Earthborn Holistic has affordable priced grain-free foods.

I wish you the very best of luck with Bauer. Great Danes are awesome, quirky dogs with so much personality. I think you will really fall in love with the breed. Keep us updated on his progress!

[rogerharris]

I think Blue Buffalo is best brand as it contains Omega 6 fatty acids and glucosamine for joint health and its annual revenue is around $400 million which shows this brand has increases their sales on the basis of quality ingredients.

http://www.compundiapharmacy.com/

[Akari_32]

If I didn’t have such a mixed lot of dogs, I wouldn’t see a problem with it, but since I do, I’d like to ask and see what you all think. Prepare for super long post of stuff!

We have three dogs, one my moms, and two are mine. Mom has an 8 pound, 1 year old, Jack Russell/Maltese. He’s got a super high metabolism. Eats a whole cup of food, yet remains slightly (by less than a half pound) under weight, by my best guess, seeing as he was only supposed to weigh 4 pounds to begin with. It’s hard to keep any meat on him because he’s such an active nut. On top of regular food, he gets a couple treats a day (Zuke’s Hip and Joint and Denta Sticks), and every month or so, all three dogs get a raw meal replacement (turkey neck/back, pork hock, etc).

My dogs, 9.5 year old 130 pound Rottweiler/Austrailian shepherd, and 10.5 year old lab/retriever mix, are outside dogs, much to my dislike. I sneak them in a few days a week when moms working out of town. As soon as money starts looking better, I’ll be getting my own place, where they will be indoors, always. Haley, the lab mix, does have trouble keepig weight on when fed according to the bag these days, but is otherwise healthy. I’ve been feeding her about 5 cups, as aposed to the 2.5-3 she used to get, and that’s doing the trick. Dweezle, the rott mix, also eats 5 cups, for perspective. Neither of these two are very active, but I have recently taken to taking Haley and Bentley (the puppy) on nightly walks, because that dog can drive just about anyone up a wall! He drives poor old Haley nuts LOL Dweezle, do to his dog aggression, can’t be taken out often. He absolutely hates the neighbors dog (in his defence, no body in our neighborhood likes that dog), and has gotten in some trouble with them (thankfully they didn’t press charges…). Can’t risk running into them on a walk.

Because money is currently tight, I do coupon for my dog food. I try to keep the bulk of it Wellness Core (Original), but recently got a great deal on Racheal Ray Zero, so that’s what most of their food is right now. I also got paid to coupon for Purina One Smart Blend (both chicken and lamb for something different), so I have tons of that, as well. Because I do not want the Purina to make up the bulk of the diet, and I’m running low on the Racheal Ray, I need to buy either some more Wellness or more Racheal Ray. I have great coupons for both, so I just need to do some math and decide which is cheaper at the moment.

I have been trained over my research of dog foods to avoid reduced fat type foods because they are typically lower quality (those in my price and couponing range, anyways). Curiosity got the best of me, and i checked out the Reduced Fat Core on this site as well as a few others, and was surprised at how good it actually was, better, IMO, than the other Wellness foods. My concerns, though, are that with two outdoor dogs, and Florida’s “winter” creeping in on us, as well as a feisty littler terrier puppy, would the reduced fat formula be a suitable staple for my dogs?

As far how feeding time goes, I mix all three dogs food in a large bowl with a large can of Pro Plan (coupons for one free can, so I’ve got tons!) and an egg. Haley has some problems digesting large quantities of dry food, and Bentley has trouble eating lager kibbles when they aren’t a little wet (when he doesn’t get fed at the same time as the other two, he gets his food wetted with water). Their dry food is currently 6x 6 pound bags of RR Zero, 2x 6 pound bags of RR Just 6, and 3x 3.5 pound bags of Purina One (and 4 more bags of RR and about 30 more bags of the Purina stored). Their diet can also include, but is not limited to, Blue, all other kinds of Wellness, Hills (SD and Ideal Balance– neither ever in bulk), and anything else that gets store coupons to mix with manufacturer coupons (not usually much else, though).

Any thoughts on the reduced fat Core would be great. If you don’t think it’d be a good choice for my case, please feel free to suggest something else! I’m open to anything. Shoot all your ideas my way!

[beaglemom]

Hey Freehold, do you know that these guys deliver to various points along the NJ turnpike?

http://www.topqualitydogfood.com

Not sure if that’s a driveable distance for you? Their menu is more extensive than Raaw Energy and the prices are equally good if not better.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi jimmianne –

There’s no such thing as a single “best” food. The less processed the better – so raw would be the best option, followed by fresh cooked, then dehydrated or freeze-dried, then canned, with dry food being the worst option. With whatever you feed, variety is key – don’t stick with the same food. Rotating foods helps to strengthen your dog’s gut by fostering a diverse population of microflora, gives your dog a variety of nutrients and give you options in the event of a recall. If you’re going to feed a dry food as the bulk of your pup’s diet I would add a quality “topper” – such as raw, dehydrated, freeze-dried, canned or healthy fresh foods (i.e. eggs, lean meat, plain yogurt or kefir, cottage cheese, tinned sardines, etc.). Canidae looks good on paper but I personally wouldn’t risk feeding – the majority of Canidae’s products are manufactured by Diamond who has very poor quality control and numerous recalls. Unless you live in the same state as Canidae’s plant or in a neighboring state you’re probably getting product manufactured by Diamond.

As far as supplements, some good supplements to consider would be probiotics, digestive enzymes, quality fish oil and whole food supplements (with “super foods” like kelp, spirulina, bee pollen, etc.).

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi sippmanjr –

I personally prefer raw (my dogs eat a homemade raw diet) and in terms of the best – I believe raw is as good as it gets. I would also give preference to dehydrated, canned and freeze-dried foods over kibble. However assuming you’re looking for a kibble, if I had to choose my “top 5” they would probably be (in no particular order): Annamaet (Aqualuk, Salcha or Ultra), Dr. Tim’s Kinesis, Nature’s Variety Instinct (LID Turkey or Rabbit), Wellness CORE Puppy or Earthborn (Coastal Catch or Meadow Feast). I love Orijen foods and their new large breed puppy formula is an improvement over the previous formula (the old formula was way too high in calcium) but it’s still slightly high in calcium for me to recommend. Don’t feel that you need to pick one food and stick with it, rotating is healthier and it’s good to get puppies accustomed to a rotational diet as soon as possible. If you feed kibble, I’d also recommend topping the kibble with a quality raw, canned or dehydrated food or healthy fresh foods (like eggs, tinned sardines, lean meats, or plain yogurt or kefir) as often as possible.

[PiaOnomato]

Hi,
I’m new here and couldn’t find a Forum Search so if this topic has been covered, I’m sorry!
I am looking for a good quality dry kibble that is more protein/carb balanced than a grain-free for our active, fit, small dog.
Here are the details if you care to read on! I have a 4.5 year old Rescue named Pico. Pico weighs 8.8# and is most likely a Chi/Italian Greyhound mix. He is very active and gets daily 3 mile walks and competes in Agility.
I had Pico and our other rescue (24# ACD/BC mix Gilda) on Wellness CORE. Pico was having some elevated BUN labs so I switched him to Wellness Super5 mix Small Breed.
When Wellness was bought by P&G, I got worried about possible formula changes and recalls so I came back to DogFoodAdvisor and started researching again. This time (I know this won’t make sense), I switched both dogs to Orijen 6 Fish. They both look great and have fantastic energy but Pico has starting having dark, strong smelling urine. Usually when he gets a UTI, he is ill. Now, however he seems fine (I did take a sample in today) and I think it’s from the high protein food.
I am sorry for the long post. Thanks for any and all opinions!
Dee

[SuZee]

Would you please rate this food? It is available at Fleet Farm stores. After cycling through several of the four- and five- star dog foods found on this website, I was getting pretty frustrated. I didn’t like spending so much money on a food that was supposed to be really good for my puppy, only to find myself “topping” it with grated cheese (more $$!). While shopping at Fleet Farm for her expensive food, I watched several people come into the department and pick up the Sprout brand. So I looked at the label, was impressed by what I saw, and picked up a 5# bag of the Lamb & Rice Formula to see if my 7 month old Golden Doodle would like it. She devoured it. Licked the bowl clean. And the poop was wonderful – like a soft tootsie roll. (We had many issues there for weeks on the expensive foods.) It has been five weeks now, she has just finished her second 40# bag. Today I brought the Chicken & Rice home (again, the 5# bag to see if she likes it) and once again she devoured it. Happily! She has abundant energy (of course, she’s a pup!) her coat is soft and doesn’t shed, her poo is easy to pick up…. all in all, it is a great fit for us. If you analyzed it here, and it is as good as I think it is, it would be very helpful to others who are determined to feed their dogs high-quality food on a budget. Thanks for your consideration!

[Anonymous]

I don’t have volume numbers, but the companies with the mass-produced brands are the ones with the largest annual revenues by far. Blue Buffalo’s annual revenue (these are 2011 numbers) was about $352 million. P&G Pet Care (Iams & Eukanuba) – $1.8 billion. Nestle Purina – $10.4 billion. Mars Petcare (Pedigree, etc) – $16.2 billion.

BUT Blue Buffalo and other brands that are appealing to a desire for higher quality ingredients are seeing huge increases in sales as people are becoming more aware of what is in their petfoods. More and more brands are showing up and having success, so it seems to be a great trend in the right direction.

[cdubau]

Here is my situation

One large breed dog and one small breed dog. They are both around 7/8 years old and over weight. Recently we changed the older dogs food from Nutro to TOTW due to the interest in the grain free aspect and better quality food as well. We have restricted both food intake and started exercising them. With the food change Emma has stopped rubbing herself all over the house (shes always been itchy but checked out okay per the docs) and her ears are no longer red (they were red but had no infection per the docs). Since reading about all the Diamond food recalls I was hesitant about trying TOTW and still alittle leery about it.

While at the doc we brought up to that Emma, was drinking alot of water. Turns out she had a UTI. He mentioned she might have Cushings due to the protein in her urine and said we need to have her tested for that eventually. After doing some of my own research and reading articles on this site (theres a post about cushings) I am convinced I really need to cut her fat intake back and increase her protein as that is said to help with aspects of Cushings. While she hasn’t been diagnosed she really shows some key signs of it. We are hoping to test her in the next couple months. For any interest she is constantly drinking ALOT of water, constantly hungry (eats poop if we miss a clean up, as well as will tear into anything she can find), easily stressed or aggravated most the time, has a hard time getting up/down the stairs and doesn’t get on the couch as much, pants when the other dogs aren’t panting and the AC doesn’t go higher then 76, her extra weight seems to only be in her chest/abdomen and she has developed a heart murmur that is very LOUD.

I have looked on the suggested low fat list but most the listed dry kibble is NOT grain free, if they were they weren’t in my budget by any means. I couldn’t find anything that was below 13% Fat in a grain free formula on my own that was in my budget. After seeing such an improvement over the grain free I am having a hard time switching her to any of the “low fat list” foods that include grains. So I am looking to other people for their opinions and maybe experience with this. I just feel like I’m at a loss and I’ve spent days in front of the computer trying to figure this out.

Current Food
TOTW Pacific Stream dry dog food 15% Fat 25% Protein

Here is what I found that I can afford FROM the list – Not grain free:
AvoDerm Large Breed Chicken and Rice 11% Fat 29% Protein
Fromm Gold Reduced Activity Senior Dry Dog Food 12% Fat 26% Protein
Wellness Super5 Mix Large Breed Adult 12% Fat 28% Protein

Here is what I found on my own that IS grain free – NOT on the list

GO! Senior 14% Fat 32% Protein
Merrick G/F Texas Beef 15% Fat 38% Protein
Holistic Select 13% Fat 28% Protein

Thank you for any input!

[mdbd]

So we have adopted a wonderful senior (12-year old) mini poodle. (I’ve always been allergic to cats but had a dog years’ ago). She was in a kill shelter for about a week then with a large dog rescue facility for 2 months. She had been on a generic kibble (apparently) with her original home. and the rescue. Our first day yesterday was absolutely fine, but today she had her first hair-cut and I noticed just what dry, flakey skin she has and her hair is quite dry. She has many flakes coming off and, of course, with all the flakes coming off – I’m now sneezing and my eyes are watering like crazy – as are my son’s. Other than the skin and coat, she is in wonderful health.

I am absolutely NOT going to give up on this old lady so I really need some helpful suggestions for foods and supplements as they have come a long way since I last had a pet.

a) What is the best dry dog food for a senior (does this equate to grain free or something else)? Cost is way less important than quality.
b) Are there any particular ingredients that are really bad for senior poodles and/or any that are really beneficial?
c) Should she stay on kibble given she has always had it or would you suggest wet?
d) Is there any dog food or supplement that will alleviate her dry skin and prevent the flaking? If so, liquid or tablet form?
e) This may sound crazy – but is there any food or supplement that helps decrease allergens in a pet to assist an owner who is reacting badly to the pet?
f) Is there anything (food or supplement) to assist in helping the dog become less smelly?
g) Is there any topical cream or bath wash that would assist her?

We’re an allergen-free house generally because of my allergies so wood floors, no drapes, etc.

Any help/advice would REALLY be welcome! Thanks!

[Hound Dog Mom]

What is your budget? Unfortunately – while healthier, as Patty pointed out – most dry food alternatives (dehydrated, freeze-dried, canned and raw) are much more expensive than dry dog food. If it’s not possible to feed an entirely raw, dehydrated, freeze-dried or canned diet you can “top” the kibble with these foods or alternate (i.e. raw for breakfast and dry for dinner). Healthy leftovers like lean meat, steamed veggies, eggs or plain yogurt are also a cheap way to dress up kibble and boost the species-appropriateness – just keep the addition of unbalanced toppers to 20% or less of the meal. Unfortunately dehydrated, freeze-dried and commercial raw foods would probably be off the table for someone on a budget but there are some quality budget friendly canned foods. Walmart sells a food called Pure Balance which is rated 5 stars and costs $1 per can, Tractor Supply sells a food called 4Health which is rated 4.5 stars and costs $0.99 per can and Costco sells a canned food called Kirkland Cuts & Gravy which costs $0.79 per can. Home cooked and homemade raw can be done fairly cheaply – but homemade diets do take some research. I agree with Patty about the lack of dental benefits with dry food as well – it’s just a myth that dry food cleans the teeth. The only way to assure dental health is to brush your dog’s teeth regularly or have regular dental cleanings at your vet. Raw bones can aid in dental health to a certain degree, but they’re no substitution for teeth brushing.

[shadowfire76]

Just got a new puppy with what we believe to be a pitbull mix a couple days ago. Someone dropped him on a friend of mine and she was going to take him to the shelter but I brought him home with me instead. The vet said he’s about 10weeks old and he already weighs about 20 lbs. The vet said based upon his body frame and the size of his paws that he is likely to be a large dog pushing close to 100 lbs when he gets fully grown. So I am looking for a quality puppy food to feed him. I have been feeding him 4Health Performance Adult food (which I feed my other dog) while I researched what kind of puppy food would be best suited for him. I know it doesn’t have all that he needs but figure it is definitely a higher quality than standard Purina Puppy Chow. A lot of the top dog foods aren’t available in my area but I know that I can get Wellness, Merrick, Taste of the Wild, and Blue Buffalo locally. I see that Wellness puppy is on your list but is that the standard Wellness puppy or the large breed formula? Any advice is greatly appreciated. 🙂

[Melissaandcrew]

Hi there. I have quite a few seniors and none of them get senior food on a regular basis. the one exception isOrijen as its a lower fat level and I can feed it solo if I wish. Other than that, they get a solid quality all life stage food. My crew gets probiotics on occasion and fish oil added, but nothing else(other than various toppers) I personally think the senior formulas as Marie, sandy and Patty said are too low in protein for older dogs. I stick with approx. 30-33 percent in the kibble

[somebodysme]

It’s not really about “scores” on DFA. It’s about what your dog is allergic to! Do you mean he had worse trouble with the other food or do you mean it had a worse score? Like I said, score don’t matter when you are dealing with a health issue. Score be darned is what I’m thinking these days with trying to deal with my little girl’s allergies. If she’d stop chewing her paws, I’d feed a one star at this point. That’s how frustrated I am. She’s on a five star and is worse off now then she was on Purina Pro Plan! GAH!

All I know is you need to immediately get your dog off the NB, not because it’s not a five star food but because YOUR DOG is allergic to it! I can’t tell you what to try from there but right now I have my dog on Natural Balance potato and rabbit….keeping fingers crossed. Poor thing just can’t shake the irritated paws and I can’t figure out what her issues are. She’s has only just started NB a couple days ago.

It really and truly is completely different…one dog to the next. Start out as you have with a LID food and if that doesn’t work, try a different recipe. If your dog had no itching problems on his old food but it’s not a low quality food and you want better, let’s say it was chicken based…well you can guess from that that your dog doesn’t have an issue with chicken and you can try a higher quality chicken based food. Chicken gives you lots and lots of choices!

[dog34747]

So I tried NutriSource grain free and the soft stuff turned to liquid and never stopped, even with added Geneflora at each meal.

Then I tried another limited ingredient Chicken/Potato Grain Free and I chose it because any forms of potato were well down the list of ingredients, behind peas and pea starch and several other things. They should have just called it Chicken and Pea. Anyway… it also contained beet pulp and only 21% protein. Things solidified within two days! Yay! However, he then proceeded to poop about 6-8 times a day. That seems like a lot for a dog that typically has 3, even when it’s bad quality it’s usually only 3, and in the past when he’s had no digestion related food issues it’s only been 3 times a day. Six to 8 is too much right?

I’m increasingly more convinced on the beet pulp theory. So far the only foods that eliminated the terrible gas/gurgling and soft/liquid stool have contained beet pulp along with <25% protein. I just can’t find any other commonality between foods that work and the foods that do not. Nutro has a Venison and Potato around 21% protein plus beet pulp. Hills also has two that are similar with either Chicken or Salmon.

I’m really hesitant to put him back on the grain food that seemed to work so well for his stomach before because the itching, hacking, licking and yeast ear infections were so severe… by severe I mean that over the course of the past year he lost his ability to walk in a straight line, balance, chew food, walk up stairs and hear out of one ear and all the while his ear was not exhibiting any outward signs of infection other than a small amount of wax buildup and he was not indicating he had any pain or specific problem with his ear like head shaking or pawing at it and so, despite the fact that I continually asked about the discharge, three different Vets said it was nothing and mis-diagnosed the infection for a combination of brain tumor and a stroke, for which they prescribed him Prozac for “anxiety related to the pressure in his brain” and told me to put him down. A fourth Vet finally actually looked inside his ear when I asked and realized the severity and took action, within just a few days of proper meds he was like a brand new dog. I don’t want to feed him any food that causes that kind of allergy/yeast issue again.

Thoughts? Are any of the grain AND potato free foods out there recommended for food intolerance and digestion issues?

What is the main benefit of the enzymes vs. probiotics? The Geneflora seems to do little to nothing to help him.

[theBCnut]

Shawna is having trouble logging on here so I’m passing on her response.

The diet should be geared specifically to the stage of the disease (aka the BUN and Creatinine values). Protein only needs to be restricted in the later stages of the disease. Restricting too early can cause more harm than good. Nutritionist Mary Straus gives values of protein and phosphorus for each of the stages of the disease on her website as well as some canned foods that would be appropriate. She also gives some dehydrated options which would be a good choice, in my opinion, for your pup. http://www.dogaware.com/health&#8230;

I wasn’t really impressed with Azodyl. I use a high quality probiotic and a prebiotic called Fiber 35 Sprinkle Fiber for nitrogen trapping. Works REALLY well for Audrey.

I mentioned some other supplements and foods I use for Audrey in this link if interested 🙂 /… Hope the link works. If not, it’s on the “Off topic” page.

My thoughts and prayers are with you and your fur baby!!!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Kobe’s Dad –

The calcium percentages listed on the website/package are lower than what I stated because websites an packaging typically (as is the case with Earthborn) state the guanteed minimum level of calcium (this is why it says “min”) – not the actual level of calcium or maximum which is what is important. The actual level is often quite a bit higher than the minimum. For all the foods on my list I contacted the companies directly to obtain the actual amount of calcium (from lab analysis).

It’s not necessary for a canned (or dry food) to be labeled for large breed puppies – it just needs to have appropriate calcium levels and be approved for growth/als. If you’re just using the canned food as a topper (20% or less of the diet) I wouldn’t worry about calcium levels.

Weruva is a great, high quality food. I believe their dog formulas are approved for adult maintenance only – this is fine if you’re just using the canned as a topper but it wouldn’t be appropriate as a sole diet for a puppy.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi soccermom7 –

Do not add Preference to a balanced kibble. Preference is designed for the addition of boneless meat. Meat is high in phosphorus but has negligible amounts of calcium (dogs need calcium and phosphorus in between a 1:1 and 2:1 ratio) therefore pre-mixes such as Preference are very high in calcium to compensation for the addition of meat, kibble already has a balanced C:P ratio so adding Preference would potentially throw it off. Additionally, if anything you should be adding more meat to kibble not fruits and vegetables – kibble is too high in plant matter as it is.

As far as a kibble replacement for THK – there is not kibble replacement. The Honest Kitchen is a minimally processed food and about as close to a raw natural or home cooked diet as you can get with feeding commercial food. THK even has some enzymes still intact. Kibble is highly processed. I can understand wanting to cut costs because THK is pricey (I used to feed it) but, unfortunately, going to kibble is going to be a huge decrease in quality.

My recommendations would be to consider a homemade diet (raw or cooked, whatever you’re more comfortable with). There are many books available with balanced recipes. Homemade diets can be done very cheaply. When I was feeding two of my bloodhounds THK I was spending over $500 per month. I’m now feeding them a homemade raw diet, which is even healthier than THK, and spending just under $200 per month. You may want to check out Grandma Lucy’s – it’s another dehydrated type food similar to THK and is a bit more reasonably priced. Another option would be to feed kibble for one meal and THK for the other or to “top” the kibble with some rehydrated THK. You could also look into canned foods – many canned foods are expensive however there are some really reasonably priced quality canned foods available. Pure Balance (available at Walmart) it is rated 5 stars and costs between $1 and $1.25 per can. Costco sells Kirkland Cuts in Gravy which is rated 5 stars for $0.79 per can. 4Health which is rated 4.5 stars is available at Tractor Supply for $0.99 per can. If you added an enzyme supplement to one of these foods it would be nearly as good as THK and much better than kibble. If you do find that you need to go with an entirely kibble diet, I’d pick a 5 star kibble, rotate brands often for variety and add some fresh foods whenever possible (leftover meat, eggs, yogurt, tinned sardines, etc.).

[Anonymous]

I have just had similar experiences as that on page 2 of the thread where Swissy Mix talks about her Bernese/Greater Swiss mix throwing up on Taste of the Wild puppy food. I have an almost 8 month old Bernese male who is right around 80 lbs. We got him at 8 weeks old and started him on Blue Buffalo and then as I researched how to feed larger breed dogs, I decided to switch him to TOTW. They have puppy formulas now that are 1.4% calcium / 1.0% phosphorus, which I thought was in line with what he needed. I’ve been alternating between the 2 varieties now for around 4 or 5 months without any issues.

As of the last 3 days though, Walter has also thrown up his food 3 separate times right after eating. I tend to think it is because the kibble is too small for him and he’s not chewing like he needs to. The end result of his vomiting makes it clear that he doesn’t need to bother chewing his food. I tried feeding him in a larger, more shallow bowl so he can’t inhale and we have stopped feeding him right after he comes in the house and is all hot. I thought the problem might be a combination of being too hot, eating too fast, not chewing enough. However, this morning right after he woke up he did it, so I guess it is either just the not chewing issue or the food itself. I don’t think it is a puppy issue, because he seems perfectly fine otherwise.

So my questions are as follows:

1. Does anyone know of a good food that has larger bites and still stays in the recommended ranges of cal/phosphorus? I guess it may have to be an all life stage or adult formula. I hate to be a stickler on price, but I feel like I’m already spending a lot on what he is on to make sure his food is higher quality, so I’d like to stay in line with TOTW, which is about $50 / 30 lb. bag.

2. How do you tell proper weight of a dog as hairy as a BMD? His weight is right in line with what he’s always averaged (about 10 lbs. / month), but he has such long, wavy hair, it struggle to tell if I’m feeding him enough or too much. I’ve been staying within the guidelines recommended on the bag, but it’s kind of hard to tell for sure. Any tips?

3. Any suggestions for getting him to slow down on his eating? He doesn’t have to compete with any other dogs, so there’s really no need for him to eat like he does.