[Hound Dog Mom]

Aside from sardines once in a blue moon, I typically don’t feed raw fish for fear of parasites. When I give fish oil I use Carlson brand fish oil – capsules. Nordic Naturals is another good brand though. Fish oil is one of those things you don’t want to take the cheap route on. I also feed raw cage free eggs and tinned sardines for omega 3’s.

[theBCnut]

I’m afraid of feeding raw fish that may potentially harbor that parasite. I have heard that freezing for a couple weeks kills the parasite, but I haven’t researched it myself. There are several good salmon/fish oils, but the thing to keep in mind is how quickly they go bad. For that reason, I think that capsules are the way to go.

[Colorado huntress]

Nope, don’t have fish oil – I remember HKitchen recommended Nordic Naturals…..what do you suggest? Also, we catch rainbow trout in Utah (have them vacuum sealed in freezer), & plan on giving them fish on a weekly basis, but I was told that I should not give it to them raw because of a parasite that can kill dogs (salmincola) – looked it up & it sounds legit…..any thoughts?

[theBCnut]

Do you have anything for omega 3s, like fish oil? The capsules break open, I would give your lab 3/4 and your little guy 1/4.

[Bill Rogan]

Hello!!! Beagleowner? Hope you feel better than before because your dog is gradually progressed.

You should bring diversification in you dog food menu. You should ensure that the diet you feed meets your dog’s requirements. It’s important that the diet you feed your dog is “complete and balanced,” meaning it meets all of your dog’s nutritional needs. It is not important, however, that every meal would be completed and balanced, unless you feed the same meal every day with little or no variation.

Following are the guidelines for feeding a raw or cooked homemade diet to get a healthy dog. No single type of food, such as chicken, should ever make up more than half the diet.

You should keep the followings in your consideration while cooking your dog food. Proper balanced dog food includes:

Meat and other Animal Products:

Raw meaty bones (optional)
Boneless meat
Fish
Organs
Eggs
Dairy

Fruits and Vegetables:

Starchy vegetables
Leafy green and other non-starchy vegetables
Fruits
Grains

Supplements:

Calcium
Oils
Fish oil
Cod liver oil
Plant Oils

Other Vitamins and Minerals:

Vitamin E
Iodine
Green blends

Hopefully you be benefited. Best of luck of you with your beloved dog.

[Hound Dog Mom]

If he’s eating commercial kibble, canned and raw supplemented with fish oil and coconut oil he’s definitely getting plenty of fat. If he looks good and isn’t skinny why would you think he’s not getting enough calories or fat?

[beagleowner]

Hi Hound Dog Mom. Need some input. Still making Henry’s food. We switched to ground turkey and read that the ratio between protein and vegetables should be 2 to 1. We are mixing ground turkey, carrots, sweet potatoes, frozen peas, kale 3 eggs with shells, apples and spinach, baking it in a slow oven for 90 minutes. We make enough for 3 was and freeze weekly amounts. We do the 2 parts turkey to 1 part combined vegetables, feed 1capsule of Aller G-3 bought and suggested by our vet. It is 1000 mg fish oil, o.1moisture, 400 iu vitamin A, 100 iu vitamin D3, 4 iu Vitamin E. we feed 2 cups a day, estimating caloric intake of 750 to 800 cal/day. We also give him 2 Gkucosamine chewables a day which provides 500 mg Glucosamine, 200 mg Chondrotin Sulfate, 100 mg MSM, 50 mg Vitamin C, and 5 mg Manganese. It does have inactive ingredients Brewers dried yeast, diacalcium phosphate, glycerin,iron oxide, magnesium sterate, silicon dioxide and steric acid.

Henry has lost 3 lbs over the past 5 mos. we weigh him at the vet every month. he is now at 45 lb and the vet would like to see him close to 40.

Henry has one very large lipoma which I had mentioned in a previous post (about melon size) and another smaller (baseball) one. I discovered a site called Pawhealer out of California and their product Dissolve made with various herbs. They also on my next order created a Custom Dissolve. He got 3/4 tsp twice a day. The vet measured his lipomas when we started the herbs. When he measured them at our last visit they were slightly smaller and they are now a soft mass. The vet said that something was working, either the Dissolve, or the food, or a combination of both. He is not on Dissolve any longer because Pawhealer suggested discontinuing the Dissolve for now and suggested a kidney formula. My husband didn’t feel comfortable with this and so we did not order.

Bottom line. Henry is losing weight, and the lipomas are decreasing very gradually. But I am wondering if I should again begin the herbs. You are so very knowledgeable I wanted to get your thoughts and opinion. There are so many sites that address diet and lipomas it makes your head spin. Sorry for this looooong post but I wanted to give a full history so you could offer feedback. Thanks for all your knowledge.

[dogmom2]

HI everyone.

A quick question…

Hank is blowing his coat in a crazy way this month. I am noticing that his undercoat is basically gone , and his outer coat seems coarse in some areas.

He gets Darwins ( all the protiens), Brothers Allergy, merrick canned, sardines, quality fish oil, coconut oils etc. but I am wondering if he is getting enough fat? Or calories? He looks good, not skinny at all. He is 11 now, so we don’t really want to put weight on him.

Dewey looks fine. Shiny and like he needs a few pounds off!!!

Any thoughts??

[dogmom2]

HI everyone.

A quick question…

Hank is blowing his coat in a crazy way this month. I am noticing that his undercoat is basically gone , and his outer coat seems coarse in some areas.

He gets Darwins ( all the protiens), Brothers Allergy, merrick canned, sardines, quality fish oil, coconut oils etc. but I am wondering if he is getting enough fat? Or calories? He looks good, not skinny at all. He is 11 now, so we don’t really want to put weight on him.

Dewey looks fine. Shiny and like he needs a few pounds off!!!

Any thoughts??

[gmcbogger38]

I actually bought the Soil Based Organisms from Swanson’s and took them myself and gave them to my dogs. I’ll just buy that again and get some more fish oil. Thanks for your advice. It really helps!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Nupro isn’t a bad supplement however I wouldn’t discontinue the fish oil. The omega 3’s in Nupro come from flaxseed. Plant-based omega 3’s (with the exception of algae and yeast derived omega 3’s) are in the form of alpha linolenic acid (ALA) which is a short-chain omega 3. In order to be utilized by the body the short-chain omega 3’s need to be converted into long chain omega 3’s – docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) and eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA). The conversion process from short-chain to long-chain is very inefficient – I’ve read some sources that state the conversion rate is less then 5%. Animal sources of omega 3’s (cage free eggs and fatty fish or fish oil) and omega 3’s derived from algae or yeast are already in the form of DHA and EPA and don’t need to be converted. Nupro also, unfortunately, only contains 1 strain of probiotic – lactobacillus acidophilus. I do the like inclusion of whole foods in Nupro though. Personally, I think you could do better and likely for cheaper. I would suggest picking either a high quality fish oil or feeding tinned sardines, a multi-strain probiotic (Swanson’s sells some very high quality, reasonably priced probiotic supplements check out https://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-probiotics-dr-stephen-langers-ultimate-15-strain-probiotic-fos-60-veg-caps or https://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-ultra-soil-based-organisms-90-caps) and mixing up a “super food” supplement. I purchase ingredients in 1 lb. bags from Swanson’s and mix them myself, I store them in giant jars in the fridge. Doing it this way is so much cheaper per pound than pre-blended supplements and it allows you to customize the ingredients. The current blend I’m using is 1 part spirulina, 1 part kelp, 1 part alfalfa, 1 part wheatgrass and 1 part bee pollen. I do switch up ingredients occasionally for variety.

[gmcbogger38]

I do give fish oil because I don’t feed much fish as far as raw goes. I was giving them a probiotic I read about on this forum actually. Do you think Nupro would be worth giving to them for the skin and coat and digestive benefit or not worth the money?

[pugmomsandy]

If you went back to kibble and still offered some raw for a couple meals that would still be better than no raw. As far a supplements go, kibbles are “complete and balanced” but I still give additional fish oil, super green foods, probiotics.

[SandyandMila]

Speaking of boneless meals, I wanted to ask a question. Would the meat (ground beef and turkey) be at the same ratio 2:1 with organs/tripe as it is with a RMB or is it more equal amount 1lb:1lb? I’ve only used ground beef with Preference so far and added tripe as an “extra” like with the cottage cheese and coconut/fish oils and wanted to maybe add some organ meat. Should I just add the organ meat as extra as well or add it ground and portion it out with the meat (2/3 cup)? Thanks 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

It looks like good protein variety. What were you planning on adding to it? If you want to make sure things are balanced but keep the processes as simple as possible I’d suggest just adding a multivitamin daily and mixing in some tinned sardines or fish oil a few times a week.

[weezerweeks]

What is a dose of super foods?He has elevated lipase so I’m using the digestive enzyme from mercola that u suggested weeks ago. I also use Nordic natural fish oil everyday.His crystals are gone since I switched to canned an I even add extra water. Water is the key to sturvites.

[theBCnut]

Are you seeing any problems? I would add a dose of superfoods, and fresh fish oils.

[weezerweeks]

I have a 5 yr. old yorkie. He’s on canned merrick dog food. My vet says he doesn’t need anything added to his food but I disagree(wish there was a holistic vet near me)I give him fish oil,digestive enzyme because of high lipase,probiotic. I have been reading about coconut oil. Would he benefit from this? What supplements in ur opinion should I give him and how often. I know his food has some supplements but don’t know if they have enough. My vet says when u add to his food it changes the nutritional value. Advice please. U people know more than my vet about nutrition.

[theBCnut]

Yes, probiotics about 3 times a week. HDM is the one that can tell you if there are enough omega 3s in the eggs, I can tell you that I use eggs every other day, but I cook them lightly every other time, so I don’t assume that they are enough omega 3s and I add fish or krill oil on the days that I don’t give raw eggs.

[Kazimber]

Thank you Pattyvaugn for your answer! My Dachshund Homer is actually eating rice, soya protein, hydrolized poultry liver…he seems to be doing really well on this, his skin is shiny and he is not licking, itching that much as before. But I would like to try a food rated higher than Royal Canin. Here is a copy paste of the ingredients in Royal Canin Hypoallergenic DR-21 Veterinarian formula:

COMPOSITION: rice, hydrolysed soya protein isolate, animal fats, minerals, hydrolysed poultry liver, beet pulp, soya oil, fructo-oligo-saccharides, fish oil, borage oil, marigold extract (source of lutein). ADDITIVES (per kg): Nutritional additives: Vitamin A: 24800 IU, Vitamin D3: 800 IU, E1 (Iron): 40 mg, E2 (Iodine): 3 mg, E4 (Copper): 11 mg, E5 (Manganese): 53 mg, E6 (Zinc): 202 mg – Preservatives – Antioxidants. ANALYTICAL CONSTITUENTS: Protein: 21% – Fat content: 19% – Crude ash: 8.4% – Crude fibres: 1% – Per kg: EPA/DHA: 3.4 g – Essential fatty acids: 47 g.

I have tried giving him the TOTW grain free Pacific Stream which is salmon and potato the past month and his skin got really bad, tons of shedding and itching and kind of little dry pimples all over. I had to put him back on Royal Canin. So definitely salmon is not for him. I think maybe chicken and rice would be ok with him. Any suggestions?

I also have my puppy Bulldog on TOTW Pacific Stream and he is doing good but also wanted a second choice since I’ve heard about their recalls and to have some also. Suggestions for him would be appreciated!

[SummerRainAussies]

Wow thanks for all the great information. I am going to be ordering carlsons fish oil off Amazon. Could anyone tell me how much you would give a 50lb dog? In milligrams.
Also i’ve been reading that people squeeze the fish oil out of the capsules. Is this needed or could i just give the whole capsule with the oil in it?

[dogmom2]

Well this year is turning out to be the year of the foot for Hank. I feel bad for him…we get him back up and running (so to speak) and then his foot flares up and won’t heal. Interdigital furuncles are not for the faint of heart I will tel you that.

So we went to see the vet for his adequan shot, and chiropractic adjustment today. His foot flared up big time a week or so ago and it looks terrible, so the vet took a look at it, cleaned it up and trimmed the hair around the opening…and she decided to try a new antibiotic. We are concerned that this years occurrence is so persistent. While we were there I was going to pick up a bottle of the probiotic and enzyme support I use, only to learn that the manufacturer is no longer making it. (Iflora pet probiotic and enzymes by Sedona Labs). We have been using it daily for a few years for both boys…Hanks skin and allergy and Dewey’s digestive issues both benefited from it.

I am very bummed and having a hard time finding anything comparable. I picked up the Honest Kitchen probiotic that just came out, but there is no digestive enzyme component. Also, it is not super cost effective for 2 big boys.

We are still feeding Darwin’s, with some honest kitchen preference and local pastured meats etc..
They get brothers kibble with Merrick canned for most dinners. We feed green tripe about once a week. They get coconut oil, fish oil, spirulina, kefir and curcumin pretty much daily.

So what are you all using for probiotic and enzymes???

In happier news…we have had a nice Summer overall. We bought a used canoe that the boys love to cruise around in…and the sun has been out around here this year! ( we live on the north coast of ca do it is often foggy ). Hank turned 11 a few weeks ago, and is doing really well aside from his feet. Dewey is approaching 8 and is still a youngster at heart. DH took him for a nice beach run this morning.

Thanks for listening, and for any ideas you may have..

Laur

• This topic was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by dogmom2.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Sandy –

I do occasionally use small amounts of plant-based oils in conjunction with a quality fish oil – while I like my dogs getting the majority of their EFAs from animal sources I do like to provide some variety through the occasionally use of plant oils, sprouted flax, sprouted chia or hemp seeds. If you’ve been doing krill for awhile you might want to try something new. At the moment my girls are taking (I’m taking this as well) Carlson’s salmon oil complete – it has astaxanthin like krill oil. If you want to experiment with some plant based EFAs that’s fine, but be sure to continue with a quality animal based EFA supplement as well for the DHA and EPA. And don’t worry about all the questions, I don’t mind. 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

I would only use flax if you’re feeding a lot of poultry – 1 tsp. oil or 1 tbs. ground flax (preferably sprouted) per pound of poultry fed. Poultry tends to be high in polyunsaturated fats (particularly linoleic acid) which red meats tend to be lower in, for this reason you want to avoid fat sources that are high in LA and, instead, add a fat source such as flax (or chia) which is lower in LA and higher in alpha-linolenic acid (ALA). I don’t agree with using “fish oil or coconut oil or flax oil” as flax oil and coconut oil are not a replacement for a quality fish oil. Fish oil supplies bioavailable omega 3’s in their long-chain forms – docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) and eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA). Flax oil (and some other plant-based oils) do supply omega 3’s but they’re in the short-chain alpha-linolenic acid (ALA) form. The body has to convert ALA to EPA and DHA and this process is very inefficient (I’ve read that in many cases less than 15% of the ALA is converted). Coconut oil, while a very healthy addition to the diet, does not contain omega 3’s – it contains saturated fat, predominantly in the form of medium chain triglycerides (MCTs). I would recommend for a dog Mila’s size (she weighs around 50 lbs, right?) adding 1 capsule of a high quality fish oil daily or 1 tin (3.75 oz.) of sardines packed in water per week, up to 2 1/2 tsp. coconut oil per day and 1 tsp. flax oil or 1 tbs. ground flax per pound of poultry if she’s eating a lot of poultry. Hope that helps!

[SandyandMila]

Congrats on going back to school, HDM!! We’re proud of you!! 🙂 Speaking of pre-mixes, Preference recommends using fish oil, coconut oil, or flax seed oil. What are your thought on flax seed oil, it’d the only one if the 3 I haven’t used?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Aussie Mom –

I would recommend “See Spot Live Longer Dinner Mix” – it’s a combination of whole foods and vitamins and minerals designed to balance a boneless raw meat diet. You add 2 – 4 tbs. per pound of meat and it supplies everything you need (in terms of vitamins, minerals, fiber and balancing the calcium to phosphorus ratio). I’m actually planning on utilizing this mix part time this fall when I go back to school to save me some time – as much as I love doing everything completely from scratch it can really take up a lot of time. You could use this while you’re researching how to do things completely from scratch. There are some other “pre-mixes” out there as well (Urban Wolf, Prefereance, Birkdale, Grandma Lucy’s, Sojo’s, Dr. Harvey’s, etc.). You will still need to add omega 3’s – either in the form of a quality fish oil, fatty fish, cage-free eggs or some combination of these.

If you’re concerned about a correlation between fish oil and prostate cancer I’d suggest reading this article by Dr. Mercola:

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/07/31/omega-3-fats.aspx#!

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[SummerRainAussies]

I was looking at the Carlson brand. I read an article that new studies are saying that fish oil can cause prostate cancer in men.. Do you think their would be any of the same risk in a in-tact male dog?

Also I was wondering if it was there is a pill/powder for all the needed vitamins and minerals that i could give that makes the calcium and phosphate levels correct and whatnot. At least until I have the portions of the meat down.
It feels less overwhelming if I could learn in it two phases. LOL

[Hound Dog Mom]

I actually use a thumbtack to puncture my fish oil capsules every few weeks so I can taste and smell them to make sure they’re fresh (my dogs and I take the same fish oil). What a lot of people don’t realize is that if it’s fresh there will be no smell and virtually no taste! I see a lot of people on the review section complain about how fish oil is smelly – shouldn’t be. I use Carlson brand and have never had any issues.

[losul]

LOL

I’ve sampled a couple of dog foods, but I definitely have my limits. I could never, ever become a kibble kruncher. I have however tasted most parrot pellets and nuts/seed though before we feed, and by experiences, I’m glad I do so.

On the supplements, human or not, as limited as we use them, and especially with having very loose regulations, to put it lightly, I personally rarely ever use any pill, tablet or capsule, preferring to rely on senses like taste, smell, and sight. Take fish oil for example. If you swallow gel caps of it, how would you know if it might be rancid until you begin to belch vile tastes and odors? And in the case of enteric coated caps you won’t even get any warning at all. It’s also really hard to determine the actual source, process, etc. used.

Anyone that is a regular sunflower seed eater, especially with the hull on, has probably had the opportunity to taste what complete rancidity/spoilage is like. One bad seed chewed can put out such a horrible taste, it can seem like hours to get the taste out, even with thorough rinsing and brushing.

Btw, I forgot. dulse sprinkled into chili just before serving is also especially tasty, IMO, you can still use cheddar cheese as a topping also 🙂 . Not me, but some people eat whole dried dulse like other folks would potato chips.

[pacer1978]

Thanks Hound Dog Mom….just to confirm one small detail. It was stated to give a dog 1/4 tsp per 10 lbs of the coconut oil. For easy measuring with an eye drop, I converted tsp to ml. 1 tsp = 1.23 ml.
My two bigger dogs are about 55-60lbs and my smaller one is about 35-40. So…
1.23 x 6 (per 10lbs) = 7.38 ml of coconut oil
1.23 x 4 (per 10lbs) = 4.92 ml of coconut oil

These seems a bit high to me. Is that accurate?

So, to reiterate…my dogs receive:
Mattie (12 yrs, 55-60 lbs, Weimaraner): Daily- 1 Dasuquin (for joint for older dog), 7.38 ml of coconut oil (for overall health), and will start on probiotic once received (for overall health/digestive support)
Mia (4 yrs, 55-60 lbs, Weimaraner): Daily- 2 fish oils (skin/coat/shedding/flaky skin/slight allergies), 7.38 ml of coconut oil, and will start on probiotic once received
Lucy (approx. 10yrs old??, 35-40 lbs, mix): Daily- 1 Dasuquin (joint for older dog), 2 fish oils (skin/coat/shedding/slight allergies), 4.92 ml of coconut oil, and probiotic once received

Is this too much or OK in your opinion? You seem to be knowledgeable and offer assistance to many on the forum. Are you a vet or what is your background?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Pacer –

Omega 3’s found in fish oil can be beneficial for joints due to their anti-inflammatory effects, however they wouldn’t be a substitute for a joint supplement.

[ShepherdMom]

Hi Pug Mom Sandy. Thank you for your reply.
The fish allergy test was for a mix – Catfish, Cod, Herring, Mackerel and White fish and it was considered significant (280 out of 400). We were told not to give him any Omega 3’s from fish oil.
The potato is white potato but as a significant allergen (291), the vet suggested avoiding sweet potato also.
Thanks Freehold Hound. I will check with the vet to see if sardines would be OK.

[pacer1978]

Hope you all don’t mind me asking one more question. If I give my dogs Nordic Naturals Omega Fish Oils and Organic Extra Virgin Coconut Oil, do I still need to give them Dasuquin/Cosuquin? Wouldn’t both oils help with joints or am I wrong? I just don’t want to be spending money where I don’t have to if there isn’t more of a benefit or “over-supplement”.

Also, is it OK to give all the dosages in the mornings? I sometimes get home late since I take evening classes and that means my husband has to feed the dogs. I know he won’t keep up on giving them the supplements adequately and giving it to them in the mornings is the only way I can ensure they are getting everything.
Thanks again!

[ILoveDogs]

My dog was just diagnosed with crystals in her urine. She does not have an infection but my vet suggested changing her to Royal Canin SO. I always try to feed my dogs the very best I can afford. Currently they’re on a grain free diet of a mix of Wellness CORE and Canadae Pure Elements kibble with a little grain free canned and fresh chicken mixed in. I hate the ingredients of the SO – corn, rice, etc. Plus Jada has allergies and the grain free diet seems to help with that, along with fish oil supplement and sometime a Benedryl. Any suggestions for a diet other than what she’s receiving and in place of the SO?

[little pea]

Hi bigjake and all. I did the full panel blood allergy test; environmental, mold, food, specialty foods. My breeder and vet recommended this over the scratch test. The problems for my dog were similar, it sounds, to yours itchy skin. I have done a few steroid shots, but I think we all agree this is not a path to take that effectively manages the problem though I do think environmental allergies season is a large contributor. My dog like yours will eat just about anything set down or just spit out the ite. We have no gas or stomach issues.
There is a lot of discussion on allergies and what test to conduct and the more deeply I looked into it the more confusing and controversial. My dog’s most reactive item was yeast on the food panel, but they do not do a break out the type…. beef and dairy, lamb, potato, rice, soy etc. etc. Molds allergy also reflected yeast and molds on food.
In following things up the aspect of yeast has fascinated me.
I have feed taste of the wild pacific salmon that contains potato and sweet potato…we have a lesser allergy to sweet potato. Salmon neutral
I have recently switched to Ziwi Peak venison but it is pricey for a large dog and I am looking actively looking at many things. The ziwi was helpful with less itching. I have also introduced goat milk yogurt. I believe I briefly saw a comment on another forum about rotating dog foods to keep the gut in a good working order, this and following what foods make things better or worse. I know eliminating bread and cheese was night and day with my girl.
My vet also said all of our bodies gradually become less tolerant to specific items we are allergic to…so with a four year old dog we believe we are seeing longer and more aggravated allergy reactions as certain intolerances develop in our bodies.
Also brushing and washing the dog with a medicated shampoo is helpful. Be glad you have a short hair! Try some Alaskan salmon oil. I was also told dogs are more reactive to white fish species.

[pacer1978]

Thank you for your responses. I wasn’t sure if the human supplements would still be beneficial for dogs. So…this is what I plan on doing. Can you let me know if this is recommended? I switch dog food every now and then (all 4-5 star brands). Currently, I have them on Solid Gold MMellenium. I give Mia (4-yr old Weim) and Lucy (guessing age to be around 10, not sure of breed, she is a mix) 2 Nordic Naturals fish capsules for dogs per day. I give Mattie (12-yr old Weim) and Lucy 1 Dasuquin per day. I will most likely start Mia on this soon as well. I plan on starting them on Coconut oil (heard there was a good brand through Costco or Cocotherapy was also good). Also considering probiotic..or prebiotic? Which is better? Any brands you would recommend for the pro/prebiotic?
They issues they experience:
For the most part, they are healthy with the occasional allergy bouts (chewing/licking paws). Lucy gets watery eyes..which has gotten a little better after getting her teeth cleaned (they pulled 4 teeth). Weims tend to get bad hips as they age, hence the Dasuquin. Mia sheds a lot for a Weim and Lucy does as well, Mattie not too bad. Mia also tends to have what appears to be flaky skin and usually a rash or irritation on her chest (most likely from the mat in her cage since I crate her during the day. She gets in trouble and tears papers up around the house when I don’t). I keep the mat clean, so I’m not really sure why this keeps happening. I’ve tried different types of mats thinking maybe she is allergic to the material, but that doesn’t help. I’m mainly just looking to improve their overall health and wasn’t sure if doing all this would be wasting money or actually helping. Thanks again!!

[Puppygirlsmom]

First of all thanks for the replies and suggestions. When I said in my first e-mail that Ellie is a picky eater, I meant an extremely picky eater. We have tried adding eggs, liver, and other things to her food. She will not eat the eggs. She will not eat any fish, such as sardines. She will eat liver. I boil chicken livers and after they are cooked and cooled, I wrap each one in plastic wrap and then drop them into a freezer bag. That way I can thaw out one at a time for her. I slightly warm them and then chop them and mix with her food. She will eat those, but so far they have not put any weight on her. She does have an unusually small mouth and teeth. She is also very small boned. So the Vet said that if it takes her a long time to eat her kibble, it is most likely too large for her and therefore, she may not be getting enough of it. Yes, Taste of the Wild is not tiny kibble like Blue Buffalo. So I think due to that, I need to switch her to a smaller kibble that is for tiny dogs and puppies. I am looking into that. Does anyone know of a Grain Free Puppy Kibble that is also a very small kibble, around the size of a pea or smaller? The TOTW is around the size of a dime, so a big large for her. It does take her a long time to eat just one piece. She works and works at it. So this may be one of her problems.

[BlackAndTan]

hi puppygirlsmom,

Orijen is considered, by most accounts, to be a very high quality dog food. My guy’s neurologist seconded this. We switched off it mainly because of his gas, and because I was happy to find a lower protein grain free option (his regular vet suggested lowering protein).

How about using a high quality dog food and then add fish oils/omegas? IF I am correct yorkies are also prone to some skin irritation, so the oils would be good for that too!

[theBCnut]

Chicken hearts have micronutrients in them that they don’t add back to dog food that would definitely be beneficial to her. Feeding them raw is best, but lightly cooking is OK. If you can handle raw, just spread them out on a cookie sheet and freeze so they are frozen seperately, then throw them in a bag in the freezer and give her one a day. If you really need to cook them, boil water and lower them in in a collander or something that you can fish them out quick with, and cook just until the surface changes color then remove. Freeze seperately on a cookie sheet.

[theBCnut]

When feeding all commercial dog food, I would still give digestive enzymes, probiotics, fish oil, and some kind of superfood supplement.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi beagleowner –

Is what you listed above all your dog gets? Are any supplements added aside from te glucosamine and fish oil? I’m asking because what you listed is extremely unbalanced and could result in some major issues if fed long term.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi shilohsue –

I’m familiar with Missing Link. Looking at their puppy supplement (assuming that’s what you’d be using) there’s nothing in it that should pose a problem however I’m personally not impressed with their line of supplements – there are much better supplements out there. The biggest issue that I have with their supplements is that they all contain molasses – in other words sugar, it also only has on strain of probiotics which isn’t going to be of much benefit. Some supplements I’d recommend:

WellyTails Puppy Smart Start (I used this for one of my dogs until she was 6 months old) it contains colostrum, marine algae and microencapsulated fish oil which provide DHA and EPA, 6 strains of probiotics, 7 digestive enzymes, antioxidants and whole foods.

Nature’s Logic All-Food Fortifier which is completely whole food based and contains 5 strains of probiotics and 4 enzymes.

Dr. Harvey’s Formative Years for Puppies and Young Dogs which is an herb and whole food based supplement.

Frozen foods would be a better choice than freeze-dried foods because they’re less processed and they’re much cheaper to feed.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Vitamin A can be harmful in excess because it’s a fat soluble vitamin – however you need to feed too much of it in order for it to build up. A capsule of cod liver oil per day would not come anywhere near toxic vitamin a doses. One capsule of Carlson Super Cod Liver Oil provides 2,000 IU vitamin a – the toxic dose (which needs to be given daily for months to create toxicity) is 113,600 IU per pound of food consumed on a dry matter basis. So assuming your dog eats one pound of food per day (dry matter) the dog would have to eat 50+ capsules of cod liver oil per day to result in vitamin a toxicity. I’ve ran a full nutrient analysis on my raw menus and they are well below the AAFCO’s safe upper limit for vitamin a levels. One of my menus I analyzed came out to 52,412 IU/kg and the other to 78,326 IU/kg – the AAFCO’s upper limit is 250,000 IU/kg. The problems arise when people substitute cod liver oil for fish body oil and use it to meet their dog’s omega 3 needs. Cod liver oil should not be used as an omega 3 supplement – it should be used in small doses as a whole food source of vitamin d. One of the reasons I use Carlson, in addition to the fact that their products are stringently tested for contaminants and contain high levels of vitamin e to preserve the fats, is that their cod liver oil is lower in vitamin a than many other brands.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 8 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[EHubbman]

I’ll have to see if I can find the specific links, but the basic jist was that it had too high of Vitamin A which can build up and cause some sort of damage. Some mentioned using fish or fish body oil instead.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi EHubbman –

It’s all pretty confusing when you start out isn’t it?

I would like to start out by saying I strongly disagree with those that say supplements aren’t necessary for a raw diet. The thing is, if a dog was eating whole wild prey daily this may be true but that’s not practical in real life. It would be next to impossible to feed an actual prey model diet so people approximate it by feeding ratios of muscle meat, organ meat and bone (80:10:10) that mimic the ratios found in a whole prey animal. While this is a good estimate of the dog’s natural diet, it’s not going to provide all the nutrients a dog needs for various reasons: 1) Your dog isn’t getting the whole animal. When a dog eats prey in the wild it eats everything – all the organs, the glands, the brain, eyeballs, fur, feathers, sinew, some intestines and intestinal content, it even picks up some dirt of the ground where it’s eating. 2) Commercially raised meat such as what is available to us in the supermarket is not as mineral dense as wild prey. 3) Domestic dogs are bombarded with toxins on a daily basis that their wild relatives aren’t – i.e.) flea treatments, heart worm treatments, vaccines, exhaust fumes, cleaning chemicals, etc. etc. – and for this reason benefit from additional antioxidants in their diet that are provides through fruits, vegetables and whole super foods.

You do not need to supplement with enzymes when feeding a raw diet. Raw food contains enzymes. These enzymes are destroyed when the food is cooked and this is why kibble and canned foods should be supplemented with enzymes. Probiotic supplements are also a waste of money unless you have a dog with serious digestive issues. Feeding green tripe and/or plain yogurt and/or kefir at least a few times a week will maintain a healthy population of gut flora in a healthy dog.

You will need to add supplemental omega 3’s. You can do this by adding a quality fish body oil, cage free eggs or feeding a fatty fish such as sardines. If you want to feed sardines the recommend servings are (based on 3.75 oz. tin): 5 lbs. 1/4 tin, 15 lbs. 1/2 tin, 25 lbs. 5/8 tin, 50 lbs. 1 tin, 100 lbs. 1 3/4 tin – per week. If giving fish oil you want to add enough to provide about 100 mg. combined EPA and DHA per 10 lbs. of body weight. While the majority of a dog’s omega 3’s should come from animal sources, some plant based omega 3’s can be beneficial as well. If you’re feeding predominantly poultry, flax should be given to balance the fats and if you’re feeding predominantly red meat hemp seed should be given to balance the fats. My dogs get a cage free egg 3 days per week, Carlson brand salmon oil complete (with astaxanthin) daily and I also give small amounts of sprouted flax, sprouted chia, etc. If not supplementing with vitamin d, you should give cod liver oil as well. Carlson makes the highest quality cod liver oil – my girls each get 1 capsule of Carlson Super Cod Liver Oil daily which provides 250 IU vitamin d. If giving fish oil it’s very important not to skimp on quality – fish oil is one supplement you don’t want to find a bargain on. The cheaper brands are often rancid at purchase and don’t contain enough antioxidants to prevent oxidation. Coconut oil, as Patty pointed out, is comprised of MCT’s. Coconut oil can be given in addition to (but not instead of) omega 3’s. Coconut oil has antibacterial and antifungal properties. You can give up to 1/2 tsp. per 10 lbs. of body weight daily. My girls get coconut oil daily, I find it’s a healthy way to increase the fat level of their meals.

As Sandy pointed out, vitamin e is also necessary to add – this is especially important when supplementing with omega 3’s as vitamin e prevents the delicate fats from oxidizing in the body. For dogs <25 add 50 – 100 IU per day, 25 – 50 lbs. 100 – 200 IU per day, 50 – 75 lbs. 200 – 300 IU per day, 75 – 100 lbs. 300 – 400 IU per day, >100 lbs. 400 IU per day. I use NOW Foods Gamma E Complex – it has all 8 tocopherols and tocotrienols.

Other supplements my dogs get:

-A homemade super food mix. I generally use 1 part kelp, 1 part alfalfa, 1 part spirulina, 1 part wheat grass and 1 part bee pollen although I’ll sometimes sub in a different ingredient for variety. I buy most of my ingredients from Swanson or Starwest Botanicals in 1 lb. bags. This provides vital trace nutrients to the diet. I’d recommend about 1 tsp per 25 – 30 lbs. (roughly) for a supplement such as this.

-I give my dogs colostrum 3 days per week. Colostrum is high in immunoglobulins which helps strengthen the immune system.

-They get a glandular 3 days per week (opposite the colostrum). I use Natural Sources Raw Multiple.

If you read through the raw menu section I have my dog’s full menus (with supplements) posted.

I prefer to balance my dog’s diets using whole foods versus adding synthetic supplements. The nutrients from whole foods are more efficiently assimilated by the body and contain all the necessary co-factors for optimal absorption and utilization. There’s also a much lower chance of overdosing on nutrients when using whole foods.

If you have any more questions don’t be afraid to ask. 🙂

• This reply was modified 12 years, 8 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Sussieque]

Dear ORENC26,

RE: Diarrhea in Puppies

I also recently got a Cavalier King Charles puppy. She had the same problem with diarrhea (really bad). When I first got her @ 9 weeks old, the previous owner was feeding her Purina Special Blend (i think).

Anyways, we had rain here for over a week straight. Poor baby had to do her business in the rain and walk on the wet grass. I took her to the vet for her second vaccination and was told that she had a Yeast infection (in her ears which also gets in their digestive system) The vet gave me an anti-fungal med., an ear med. (Zymox is better) and a stool hardener. You can use Imodium Advance. ONLY 1/4 tablet daily and for just a 2 days!!! (go by weight of dog) Brandi was 5 lbs. then.

She (Brandi) got a little better but still had some diarrhea problems. I researched the internet and spoke with the vet & a local breeder.

They all suggested to feed her Boiled Chicken (white meat to start) with cooked white rice, mixed with some 100% Pumpkin. I fed this to her for 2 weeks. (note: adding a good vitamin may help but check the ingredients carefully!). After feeding Brandi the Chicken-rice combo for 2-3 weeks I wanted to get her back on a dry (kibble) puppy food. I chose “Orijen” Brand 80/20 Puppy dry food. Available at most Pet Stores and online.

I mixed it 50/50 with the Orijen and Purina One Beyond (White Meat Chicken & Whole Barley flavor) and 1 heaping Tablespoon of 100% Pumpkin. (NOT the pumpkin pie filling!!!) I introduced this mixture over 10 days (see the internet on how to do this). On the 10th. day she was eating just the dry kibble food with the pumpkin. At this point I added a Probiotic (you can pick up at pet stores – capsule form and read how much to add per day – goes by weight). Come to find out that the Orijen 80/20 puppy dry food has natural Pre & Pro Biotics (for GOOD bacteria for their digestive system) in their puppy food.

DIARRHEA IS COMPLETELY GONE!!!!! Thank God!

I still give her the Orijen and the Purina One Beyond with pumpkin (she is 3.5 months old now) Still NO diarrhea. : ) HAPPY MOMMY HERE.

I think I will switch to Acana Brand – Wild Prairie dry kibble soon because it is a bit less expensive and made by the same company. Plus it has less of a high protein content. Below are their websites:

Orijen: http://www.orijen.ca/
Acana: http://www.acana.com/products/regionals/wild-prairie/

These pet foods are made in Canada with only natural products (Grain Free). They have their own Processing Plant and process ONLY their dog and cat foods. BTW – My cats love their 6 Fish Dry Cat Food.

These foods are a bit more than your cheaper store-bought brands but worth getting rid of the diarrhea for good. Plus knowing she is healthy, happy and growing as she should be.

Hope this helps and good luck with your new baby cavalier. Precious, aren’t they? ; )
Sussieque

[theBCnut]

WOW!! That is a lot of questions. Some of them HDM is the best source for answers, but I can tackle a few.

Probiotics are the good micro-organisms in the gut and they are a huge part of the immune system, because they compete with bad micro-organisms and thereby keep their numbers small. They are naturally occurring in tripe.

Prebiotics are food for probiotics, they are fibers that the probiotics love, they aren’t all created equal though, some prebiotics feed the bad stuff just as well as the good.

Enzymes carry nutrients where they need to go in the body and aid in digestion. There are already enzymes in raw meat, but in processing for kibble they are destroyed. Dogs make enzymes, but some do not make enough, because they were made to get them out of their food. And the body adjusts enzyme production to match the diet, so if a dog was getting a high carb, low protein diet for a long time, it may take a while for its body to get used to the different need for enzymes when the diet is changed. Digestive enzymes are the ones that are specific to digestion.

Spirulina is a blue green algae that is chockful of micronutrients, which are all the little things that a body probably needs, but science hasn’t determined how much of what or what for, so dog food companies don’t have to add them back into the food.

Fish oil, fish body oil are sources of omega 3s and need to be fresh so putting it in a bag of kibble may not be a good thing. Krill are little shrimp, otherwise the same applies to fish oil. Krill oil is supposed to be better. It has some of those micronutritents in it and a higher level of quality omega 3s.

As for why some say use them, don’t use them etc. There are what I consider raw food purists, that don’t feed anything except whole carcass raw prey. Period. They believe that since that is how wolves evolved, that is what you should feed dogs. Then there are those that recognize that we don’t live in that world anymore. That the world we do live in has pollution and food animals that were not raised as prefectly as we could want and therefore are lacking some of those things that if we lived in a perfect world they would have. They feed antioxidant rich foods to help rid the body of toxins and other foods to help make up for the perceived lack in the prey animals. And then there is every shade in between.

My fingers hurt, someone else will have to provide more. Or I will later.

[EHubbman]

Complete newbie here! Reading the forums, I see so many things on prebiotics, probiotics, enzymes, digestive enzymes, fish oil, krill oil, emu(?) oil, cod liver oil, fish body oil, coconut oils, etc, the list goes on and on! (What the heck is spirulina?)

What are these things, and what do they do? What are the pros/cons of giving them? Where do they come from (supplements v. naturally occurring, such as in a specific part of a raw diet)? When is it appropriate to give them, and how much per day per weight of dog?

Sorry for all the questions! Like I said, complete newbie, and looking in to starting a raw diet with my little guy. Some people say “yes, supplement!” While others say “Yes, but only THESE supplements,” while still others say “no, don’t supplement! If you feed raw right, you don’t have to!”

There’s so much info out there and this fourm has been such a wonderful help on other issues, I thought I’d throw this one out there.

Thank you for the help!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Sharfie –

I base the dosage on the assumption that a person is 100 lbs. So a 25 lb. dog should get 1/4 the recommended human dose, a 50 lb. dog should get 1/2 the recommend human dose, a 75 lb. dog should get 3/4 the recommended human dose and dogs 100 lbs. + should get the full human dose. With most supplements (such as probiotics) there’s no real danger of overdose so it’s not critical that you get the dosage exactly right. A good rule of thumb for fish oil is to give enough to provide about 100 mg. combined EPA and DHA per 10 lbs. of body weight.

[sharfie]

Or fish oil