[kaylee1989]

Hi, I am now trying to stay away from bones that are commericalized for dogs from pet stores, since they seem to be worse for dogs. I am really interested in feeding raw bones. I gave my 1 year old dachshund (14 lbs) his first raw bone yesterday and he loved it. It was a femur bone (that is all the store had that I went to) I want to give bones just as a nice treat and something to keep him occupied. I am not planning on switching to a raw food diet. I currently give him Taste of The Wild dog kibble (1/4 cup) 2 times a day, I also give a couple treats or piece of meat and carrots daily. I was wondering if someone could tell me what bones are good just for fun treats and also how many times a week I should be giving them. Also, do I need to lessen up on the amount of food I give him the day I give him a bone or maybe just no treats that day? Honestly, he could probably stand to lose a couple pounds, so I definitely don’t want to add any more weight. (He seems to be obsessed with food and tries in every which way to get as much as he can with or without my permission) (and yes I have seen a vet about it, they said he is a fine weight but just shouldn’t gain any more) Anyways, any help would be great. I tried finding my own answers, but couldn’t seem to pinpoint exactly what to do. Thanks. 🙂

[Tucker]

Hi All,

First post. Great site! Can’t believe I have had labs my entire life and never found it. I replied under large breed nutrition and wasn’t sure if I should have started another topic so I put it in both. Not sure of the protocol here yet 🙂

Apologies for the length… I wanted to get it all in 🙂

We just lost both of our labs last year in a one two punch within 2 months. Killed me 🙁 Floyd (my 11 1/2) Chocolate to prostrate cancer and KC (my girl 15 1/2) yellow to lack of mobility. That girl was bolted together more times and just kept on trucking. Pretty amazing… I was blessed. She may have cost me a fortune, but she was worth every penny and more. As close to a human as a dog can be 🙂 For anyone who has an older dog that is having trouble getting around I HIGHLY recommend trying acupuncture. I got two extra years of love out of her. 🙂 Now to the new…

A few months ago we started a new chapter in life and brought Tucker home. (I would put up a pic but I can’t figure out how to do it.. lol. Gorgeous White Male Lab. Great breeder, all of her dogs looked so healthy, great referrals. Then the unthinkable happened. We brought him home a few days before 8 weeks and on day two we were all on the bed ( I know… don’t even say it. There is a crate on there for when we sleep… Still want him on Daddy’s bed) I was at the top and my fiancé was at the bottom.. Tucker in the middle and he did a scoot and rolled of the bed… and began limping 🙁 I almost died. You all can only imagine! He favored his should for a few minutes and he was fine. Then two weeks later my finance was holding him, put him down and he favored for a minute and was fine. I was thinking maybe a bone bruise. Two weeks later it happened again!!! That was it… x-ray time. Our regular vet said there was a slight deformity in the round of the shoulder bone where it goes in the socket but it would it probably just go away and to keep him calm for a month or so. That doesn’t work for me. I’ve paid the price for listening to first opinions in the past and not investigating issues. I brought him to my Ortho who bolted my girl back together so many times and he gave me the real scoop…

OCD… I knew when he said come in my office it wasn’t a bone bruise. I’ve taken that walk before. 🙁 He’s old school and said monitor and if it gets bad we will fix it. He wasn’t showing signs of distress on manipulation. He said if it’s bad they yelp. I’ve researched everywhere and my brain feels like it is full of Bingo Balls right now.

Our breeder said she has never had a dog with OCD. I know nutrition and heredity are two factors, but in this case I have to believe that this is trauma related OCD and not from the others. With that in mind, I know slow growth, low calcium. Some say no carbs so grain free, others say not too much protein is bad which is what you get with grain free…

Bingo Balls :-/

Our breeder did not believe in puppy food and fed Kirkland Signature Salmon and Sweet Potato. I have a problem with Costco dog food. We got home and the vet said Iams puppy large breed was good. I think that is worse. Can’t believe I went there… I just wanted to do it all right. So here we are now.

I need the best dry food I can get considering his OCD condition in his left shoulder. I really don’t care what I spend on my bag of kibble. I just want to fix my puppy!!!

We got a harness instead of a collar so there is no unnecessary tugging, There are ramps everywhere so there is minimal impact on up a downs, and we try to control him as much as anyone could control a 4 month old lab. When the zoomies come you just have to go with the flow…lol.

Now I need to know the best dry kibble to feed him. Whatever will help as much as possible for this to heal and his bones to grow big and strong. 🙂

Side note … The vet did start him on a glucosamine pill that seems good. And then we talked to the lady at the holistic dog food store who says it may be bad because he is young and you don’t want it to take the place of his own body making it… seriously!!! like I didn’t have enough to worry about with the kibble….

Any help would be sooo greatly appreciated. I love my dogs more than people! I can’t change what happened and I have accepted that it was an accident, though preventable 🙁 Now I need to do everything I can to put things right!

Help me Doggie Food Forum… your my only hope! 🙂

Thank you everyone for all of your posts. They have been very helpful. This place is fabulous!

[Tucker]

Hi All,

First post. Great site! Can’t believe I have had labs my entire life and never found it.

Apologies for the length… I wanted to get it all in 🙂

We just lost both of our labs last year in a one two punch within 2 months. Killed me 🙁 Floyd (my 11 1/2) Chocolate to prostrate cancer and KC (my girl 15 1/2) yellow to lack of mobility. That girl was bolted together more times and just kept on trucking. Pretty amazing… I was blessed. She may have cost me a fortune, but she was worth every penny and more. As close to a human as a dog can be 🙂 For anyone who has an older dog that is having trouble getting around I HIGHLY recommend trying acupuncture. I got two extra years of love out of her. 🙂 Now to the new…

A few months ago we started a new chapter in life and brought Tucker home. (I would put up a pic but I can’t figure out how to do it.. lol. Gorgeous White Male Lab. Great breeder, all of her dogs looked so healthy, great referrals. Then the unthinkable happened. We brought him home a few days before 8 weeks and on day two we were all on the bed ( I know… don’t even say it. There is a crate on there for when we sleep… Still want him on Daddy’s bed) I was at the top and my fiancé was at the bottom.. Tucker in the middle and he did a scoot and rolled of the bed… and began limping 🙁 I almost died. You all can only imagine! He favored his should for a few minutes and he was fine. Then two weeks later my finance was holding him, put him down and he favored for a minute and was fine. I was thinking maybe a bone bruise. Two weeks later it happened again!!! That was it… x-ray time. Our regular vet said there was a slight deformity in the round of the shoulder bone where it goes in the socket but it would it probably just go away and to keep him calm for a month or so. That doesn’t work for me. I’ve paid the price for listening to first opinions in the past and not investigating issues. I brought him to my Ortho who bolted my girl back together so many times and he gave me the real scoop…

OCD… I knew when he said come in my office it wasn’t a bone bruise. I’ve taken that walk before. 🙁 He’s old school and said monitor and if it gets bad we will fix it. He wasn’t showing signs of distress on manipulation. He said if it’s bad they yelp. I’ve researched everywhere and my brain feels like it is full of Bingo Balls right now.

Our breeder said she has never had a dog with OCD. I know nutrition and heredity are two factors, but in this case I have to believe that this is trauma related OCD and not from the others. With that in mind, I know slow growth, low calcium. Some say no carbs so grain free, others say not too much protein is bad which is what you get with grain free…

Bingo Balls :-/

Our breeder did not believe in puppy food and fed Kirkland Signature Salmon and Sweet Potato. I have a problem with Costco dog food. We got home and the vet said Iams puppy large breed was good. I think that is worse. Can’t believe I went there… I just wanted to do it all right. So here we are now.

I need the best dry food I can get considering his OCD condition in his left shoulder. I really don’t care what I spend on my bag of kibble. I just want to fix my puppy!!!

We got a harness instead of a collar so there is no unnecessary tugging, There are ramps everywhere so there is minimal impact on up a downs, and we try to control him as much as anyone could control a 4 month old lab. When the zoomies come you just have to go with the flow…lol.

Now I need to know the best dry kibble to feed him. Whatever will help as much as possible for this to heal and his bones to grow big and strong. 🙂

Side note … The vet did start him on a glucosamine pill that seems good. And then we talked to the lady at the holistic dog food store who says it may be bad because he is young and you don’t want it to take the place of his own body making it… seriously!!! like I didn’t have enough to worry about with the kibble….

Any help would be sooo greatly appreciated. I love my dogs more than people! I can’t change what happened and I have accepted that it was an accident, though preventable 🙁 Now I need to do everything I can to put things right!

Help me Doggie Food Forum… your my only hope! 🙂

Thank you everyone for all of your posts. They have been very helpful. This place is fabulous!

[JASTECH]

Try ground raw lamb & chicken quarters. The bones from chickie raw she will chew up easily, this will add calcium helping the development of those little skeletons.

[Shasta220]

It more than likely is related to food, possibly environment. TotW is okay food, but I usually have found better quality food at the same price, if not, cheaper. Not always is grain-free food /the/ best, dogs often have intolerances to potatoes, other fruits/veggies, chicken, and occasionally even fish. I’d try some of the above suggestions for food, and maybe try adding plenty of fish oil to his diet (assuming he has no problems w fish…There are many vegetarian oils that work almost as well. Coconut and flax are two of my favorites for the dogs, they also get raw eggs regularly).

I wouldn’t recommend using the borax/peroxide, that might make him even worse, as Borax often causes “burning” to sensitive skin. If his problem is mange, and I doubt it is, the vet would sponge him down all over w medicine.

If there’s any possibility, I’d try doing the BARF diet (bones and raw food) for a while, that way you would know /exactly/ what’s going into his system, and you could customize it to give him optimal results! It’s a bit tricky and overwhelming to start the BARF diet, but the raw diet forums on here would probably get you to a great head start.
The raw diet might not nessicarily work though – I know a sensitive pooch who would get all red and inflamed whenever he was on raw.

I’m really sorry you have to deal with these problems, I’ve gone through skin issues a few times (it was with my lab, Otitis is the name.), it is definitely one of my LEAST favorite health issues to deal with – hands down!

Hopefully you’ll figure out the problem and get him back in good shape soon!

[JASTECH]

+1 ^above post. My yard enjoys them. I use to have a deer steaming in front of porch during our cold winter being carved. I would give my Kangal an entire leg to chew, by morning it would be gone. I can’t hunt now disabled, but maybe trade for your extra deer bones?

[Susan]

It’s always about the money! Just started giving my little guys Zuke’s bones and they seemed to love them and I thought they were a better choice. I too will be closely watching the ingredients and will be sending an email to Zuke’s.

[Shasta220]

Oh that is such a bummer! I love Zuke’s Z-Ridge bones… So far they’re the only dental chews I’ll buy the dogs (other than raw bones and home made things, of course). I’ll have to just keep an eye on them to see if their formulas change for the worse… =/

[theBCnut]

I have Border Collies, so I totally understand the play til they die thing, they are known to do that quite literally. High energy dogs sometimes need to be forced to take a break. Can you put doors that can be shut on dog houses, so you can make them take a nap? Coconut oil is digested differently than many other oils, so more can be added without worry about the pancreas. Do they get bones to chew on? Mine will give themselves a timeout if they have a good bone to chew on.

[Scruffy312052]

I can’t address the type of food for large breed any more than I can for miniature breeds but I can tell you what I started doing about a year and a half ago.

I have 30 dogs. Most are American Eskimos and Long haired Dachshunds however, due to a couple of segregation errors on our part we also have several Cold Franks added to our mix. While the AKC refuses to recognize this cross as a specific breed we love them just as much as our Blue Bloods.

To address your query: I was a very strong proponent of Dry food. I’ve tried many and varied brands with a minimum rating of 3 stars. Over the years several of our pets had been plagued with a myriad of health problems: Bad Breath, loose stool, fur falling out, fleas, parasites etc… etc… before I researched K-9 Dietary needs. I started with consulting the three of our most trusted vets in our area as well as several trips to the University Of Georgia College Of Veterinary Medicine.

Oddly enough, their knowledge on the subject was nothing more than suggesting a variety of name brand foods and supplements. It was, quite frankly, a costly “hit or miss” solution with little or no improvement to the health of our pack.

I educated myself by reading hundreds of articles and forums such as this (Rudy’s). As a result, I concocted and changed their diet to a home remedy.

In less than four months there was a marked improvement. Coccidian protozoa; gone. Their breath was no longer foul smelling. No more signs of any type of worms wiggling in their stool. Their fur started growing back soft and fluffy and much to our relief, there are few if any fleas. As a bonus I cut our rather large K-9 pantry expense by 33%. I did, however, add an extra 30 minutes to my time while preparing their meal (mind you, I am feeding thirty).

NOTE: Should you consider my solution it is strongly advised that you consult your Vet First. Two of the ingredients I use may be challenged by some (but not all) authorities. *These two are: “Plug Chewing Tobacco and Garlic.”

Here is my Remedy: In a crock pot I cook 3 pounds of chicken backs and necks and one pound of chicken liver for a minimum of 8 hours on Auto. This causes the bones to break down to become malleable and easily digested. Thirty minutes before serving add 2.5 pounds of frozen or fresh mixed vegetables (make sure there is no or little corn) i.e. peas, lima beans, carrots, green beans and stir.

In a blender add two heaping tablespoons of minced garlic, 1/2 ounce of plug tobacco and one cup of broth from the crockpot. Blend on high for thirty to sixty seconds or until the tobacco is cut up into pieces that look almost granular. Add this to the crock pot and stir several times. Turn the crock pot off and let stand for thirty minutes.

Whatever type of dry food you are using reduce the serving amount by 60% and mix this on a 2 To 1 ratio of crock pot mix to dry food. Considering you have five dogs, freeze the rest of the crock pot mixture in pouches that serve five. Taking into account the size of my kennels, I obviously have no leftovers.

I have been feeding this mixture to my kennels for almost 1 ½ years and my pack has never looked or responded healthier.

* It is argued that tobacco will kill Coccidian protozoa and the Garlic will repel the fleas. I use these two ingredients only twice a month so you will need to reduce the amount to a proper ratio so as not to give your pets too much.

The benefits: less trips to the vet, more active adults, fresher breath, no more de-wormer medicine to buy (which, by the way, is not a healthy substance for your pet) less, if any flea remedies and coats full of luster. If you like, you can also drop to a one star dry food considering it is primarily used as filler.

[Shasta220]

Hm, I imagine stuffing a kong with raw food might be a bit messier for sure. Maybe grinding the raw food up, cut into kibble-sized pieces, then freeze (or possibly even baking would work) to harden them. That might be a bit much as far as work goes.

If you don’t mind the mess and puppy is good at cleaning the kong out completely, just grind up his daily raw meat (leaving the bones out…) and stuffing it in there?

I’d recommend cleaning out the kong regularly, as raw residue could cause some icky build up I’m guessing.

Best wishes with you and your new fur baby!

[Shasta220]

I use peanut butter usually. It’s tasty, and it does stiffen up in the freezer, but won’t completely harden like I hope it would. I even added a little corn starch, hoping it might stiffen up a bit more, still didn’t work. I will try the kibble definitely, and look into yogurt.

Normally, i wouldn’t care what How messy Loki’s chews are, but he needs something to do when he comes inside. He’s quite mischievous (to say the least). Luckily, it’s not in a bad way LOL! He is good enough to stay out of the dry cat food, but he steals the other cat’s raw chicken bones… (It’s actually nice sometimes, because he finds the little remains that the cat dragged under the table or in a corner.) Then he tries to chew up my favorite stuffed animals -_- it’s so adorable though. He trots off, finds a stuffie, then brings it over to me and looks at me like “Mama, can I pleeeeease tear this one’s head off?” I’m so glad he asks before he destroys…

Sorry about the ramble 😉 like I say, this isn’t a /huge/ issue, but thanks for the helpful tips so far.

[Shasta220]

I really don’t want to have to spend tons of money on chews and stuff (unless it’s gonna really last…), but basically here’s what I want: a home made filling that will either dry or freeze COMPLETELY solid (without getting crumbly or melty…).

Loki is big on chewing. He doesn’t like plastic/rubber chews much. If I give him a kong, he takes out a tiny bit of the food and then drops the sticky toy in my lap (Kongs are his favorite fetch toy…). So far hooves are the only chews that I can fill without having him tear it up or bring it to me. (Luckily he’s not a fan of chewing on the hoof itself, he only licks out whatever filling I put in it)

I tried getting long-lasting edible chews, but the “even longer lasting” formula lasted Loki about 5 minutes, and got crumbs ALL OVER the carpet. Bones are okay, but he’s really not a big fan.

So again, about the only thing that strikes his interest are the stuffed hooves (or I’m sure he’d like to lick filling out of a hollow bone)… But are there any fillings that might last a bit longer without making a mess?

(If you can’t already tell, this is for his special indoor chews, LOL! When he’s in his outdoor kennel run, he’s content with sticks, elk bones, and our other dog’s tail!)

[Shasta220]

Gosh! That’s awful! I’ve honestly never bought any pre-filled treats before. I ALWAYS just stuff em with my own treats/peanut butter/etc… I’m especially unfond of red barn brand anyway since it’s full of corn syrup and other sugars. It’s hard enough to keep my dogs’ teeth clean even without sugar, LOL!

[theBCnut]

Hi Sue, the recipe’s HDM posted are from when her youngest was still a pup, so they are for puppies.

Hi Lablubber, the reason for watching calcium is because too much causes the joints to form too fast, also if the long bones grow too fast they but strain on the muscles which can alter the gait and cause more problems. You should always strive for slow steady growth in large breed dogs. Bigger is not better. Read the first page of this thread and look at the links HDM supplied.

[Lablubber]

I am a newby to all of this high tech dog food stuff but now that I am older and much wiser I read all I can about the well being of my pups…. I was the old way, dump milk or condensed milk into my puppy food to help them grow strong bones and prevent dysplasia then when they get older feed high pro to keep them muscled. but as I got older and wiser and had more time to read and started hearing more and more about canine cancer and the grain based feeds being considered as a culprit. I really started reading alot and looking for the best food available. I just bought a new puppy a yellow lab and only want the best for him but then just today I saw in an article on here that actually hinted or said that you can actually give a puppy too much calcium and I sure do not want to hurt this lab puppy in any way. but I thought I was doing what was best for him because of their size and higher than normal occurrance of dysplasia and so as always I have for the first year at least, added a scoop of milk replacer to my dog’s food bowl and along with it, I mixed it with warm water to make their food more appititizing and suppopsedly also helped build bones. So after reading these articles…. And also pleading stupidity with all of you for only wanting what is best for my dogs…. Is what I have been doing a bad thing for my dogs? Especially if it does not cause loose or runny stools? Because after reading articles on here, it seems like in these articles that they are saying that it actually causes more hip dysplasia and elbow displaslia? Is this correct? Because my vet has never caautioned against it and so believing the vet above my Holiday Inn Express Education in Veternarian Science, I sure would appreciate a good answer and explaination as to why, the extra calcium he gets by the milk replacer he gets in his food causes and even worst chance of dysplasia because I sure don’t want to hurt my puppy for anything? So if anyone can cite me or send me any articles on this or can tell me where to look. I would like to know. Also if anyone can tell me why I should not use Blue Wildness Lg. Breed Puppy Food for him or Blue Lg. Breed Puppy Chicken and Brown Rice Formula? Sorry to sound so stupid but as I said I was Puppy Chow, Hi Pro man all my life and thought I was doing good.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Currently feeding my 6 month old shiloh half raw (Primal) and getting ready to move the 3 month old to raw as well. I want to switch to full raw but cost is prohibitive with commercial foods so I’ve decided to order my MPC and do it myself.

My concerns are:

-Do I still need to consider kcal and calcium/phosphorus ratio? If so how on earth would I calculate it?

-If someone has experience with this do you think it will be completely overwhelming to keep everything ordered in proper quantities with two very fast-growing pups? The older is now 85 pounds and the younger is 40.

-Should I wait til younger pups adult teeth are in (raw meaty bones)?

I’ve done quite a bit of research and really want to do it but still feeling a bit overwhelmed. (Originally posted on Feeding Large Breed Puppies topic)

[Sue’s Zoo]

Currently feeding my 6 month old shiloh half raw (Primal) and getting ready to move the 3 month old to raw as well. I want to switch to full raw but cost is prohibitive with commercial foods so I’ve decided to order my MPC and do it myself.

My concerns are:

-Do I still need to consider kcal and calcium/phosphorus ratio? If so how on earth would I calculate it?

-If someone has experience with this do you think it will be completely overwhelming to keep everything ordered in proper quantities with two very fast-growing pups? The older is now 85 pounds and the younger is 40.

-Should I wait til younger pups adult teeth are in (raw meaty bones)?

I really want to do it but feeling a bit overwhelmed. (Maybe I need a topic for feeding non-commercial raw to large breed puppies!) Also posting under Raw Feeding topic.

[theBCnut]

If the deer doesn’t have that wasting disease that is going around, it should be OK. My dogs get venison, but I do freeze it for a couple weeks first.

[springerjumper]

we let our dogs chew on our deer carcasses after we cut off all of the meat. should we stop this? none of our dogs have had any problems but my uppity neighbor says that venison can cause problems for canines is this true? anyone have any experience with dogs eating wild game?

[theBCnut]

They might catch an occasional bird, but when a pack hunts and catches larger game there would be more meat, less bone and they wouldn’t necessarily eat all of the heavier bones. I suppose that could balance out those birds.

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Everyone!
I have been working on a new menu for Dawson, trying to get more bones and more balance into his diet. So here it goes!
Am- 1 ounce Ziwipeak air dried lamb cuisine

Pm- Monday, Wednesday, Saturday Nights
– 2 oz pork ribs.
– .5 oz tripe patty. I have had no luck finding tripe here… so it may be canned 🙁 But I may be able to get some soon as the calves are getting butchered this month.

Pm- Thursday Night
-He would get 2 oz boneless meat patty (beef, pork, poultry whatever is on sale, could also be meat chunks,preferably organic.)
-Sardine, quarter of a tin.
-a cage free egg, no shell

Pm- Tuesday, Friday, Sunday Nights
– 2.5 oz boneless meat patty.
Note: 1.75 oz of liver and other organ blended into all patties for the week.

Supplements:
• 1/8 tsp pre/probiotics, daily
• 400 IU vitamin e capsule, weekly
• Sprouted Chia/Flax meal for manganese may use oysters occasionally, Thursday pm meal
• ¼ tsp cod liver oil once during the week, ½ cup organic keifir (mixed in with patties), and one cage free egg per pound of meat for vitamin D requirements, sardines will finish his vitamin D requirements
• ½ tsp coconut oil, daily
• Raw Glandular supplement, every other day
• ½ tsp homemade green super food supplement, daily

In the patties I would add pureed veggies and fruit but I didnt really count it on my calculations, it would be about a tsp per day… All kinds of veggies and fruit nothing particular, or toxic, lol!

My only question is, is the bone balancing the calcium in the boneless meat, or do I have to supplement additional calcium. And anything too little, too excessive, I gauged this at a weight of about 15 lbs.

I also have another with two meals of pork ribs and also two meals of chicken thighs. But it`s kinda is the same.

I was also thinking of getting this cookbook, especially if this recipe isnt balanced, lol!
http://www.completeandbalanced.com/
Its available in Canada at Dawsons vet, Here is a sample recipe:
http://www.completeandbalanced.com/samplerecipepage.html
Some recipes can be fed raw. Any thoughts, or concerns.

[DogFoodie]

I remember that was a suggestion that was made to me last Christmas after Sam ate a glass ball ornament off of the tree.

[newmom]

I’ll give him a couple of bits tonight …. thanks

[theBCnut]

My vet always suggested feeding bits of bread to help bones pass.

[newmom]

I hope that this bone did not splinter and will cause Charlie problems. I’ll watch him very closely for a while until they pass. Thanks so much for the input. I will not give him any bones that have been cooked in any way. He really did enjoy that bone, course he loves to eat—period. He’s a trip !

[theBCnut]

I give my dogs raw bones all the time, chicken, turkey, duck, goat, sheep, pig, beef, you name it, but I won’t give any cooked bones because the cooking changes how they break. Cooked bones can splinter and perforate the intestines.

[newmom]

Thank you, Patty and CSollers…..the bone is gone and I will not give him any more cooked bones. Is this true for chicken leg bones and all bones? No cooked bones? Live and learn. That was one huge bone to eat! I’ll watch him closely for a few days to be sure there are no adverse effects. Thanks again..many times over!

[CSollers]

It is my understanding that cooked boned are more prone to splintering as they’re chewed. I’d take the ham bone away from him.

[theBCnut]

Cooked bones are not OK, raw bones are OK.

[rose]

I tried my schnauzer on Rachel Rays dry dog food and dog bones, and had to take both back to Smiths store where I purchased both. As my dog started vomiting and made her horribly sick, I thought she was dying. I will never buy her brand again. Just thought I would comment on her brand. I would be very careful .

[newmom]

I just gave Charlie a ham bone from a sprial ham. All the excess gloppy fat was trimmed off leaving a bit of the ham stuck to the bone. I watched him as he eats it and he seems to be devouring it. When I try to get close to him he picks it up and goes somewhere else (outside). Is a ham bone okay, not a danger if he eats it all? He is careful as he eats but I can tell that this is heaven on earth to hime. I had no idea that he would devour this bone as he loves to just gnaw on the marrow bones, and slowly chewing the rims. I hope that I haven’t given him a harmful treat. Thanks for the help. Bev aka Charlies Mom

[crazy4cats]

My boys each had a turkey neck last night. But, unfortunately they only lasted about 5 minutes. They are crazy chewers! At least they don’t gulp (swallow) as bad anymore. The only thing that lasts longer than that are bully sticks or marrow bones. I think the bully sticks last a whole 10 minutes!

[Tambourineman]

I have a 14 year old lab with bad arthritis. An xray disclosed he also has a lesion on his vertebrae. So he has a lot of trouble getting up and around.

Due to his age we have not opted for surgery for his spine as we think it would be too much for him.

We give him EVO Senior which does have some calcium (2.10%). I regret to say he also gets a strip and a half of bacon which is used to hide the many meds he takes (Gabapentin, 3 tramadol, Rimadyl, and Amantadine) He now rejects pill pockets which he used to gulp like dog treats (we have tried peanut butter, cream cheese, bread, swedish meatballs, turkey hot dogs, a pill popper tool, etc., etc.) Bacon is the only thing that works and at his age not getting his meds would be worse than having some bacon.

Anyway, I am wondering if some more calcium would help with respect to building the bone in his vertebrae back up. As an experiment I ground up some Citrical and put it in his food and unlike when other meds are mixed with food he will eat it. (He no longer chews bones so he does not get any calcium that way.) I’ve read that some add ground up egg shells.

the dog food project says this about calcium: “. . . The correct ratio of calcium to phosphorus and magnesium is very important for a dog’s health and needs to be carefully balanced – this is not something you would want to do without doing your research on the topic!” . . .

“Excess intake of calcium results in growth retardation and severe bone and joint abnormalities. [Presumably this applies to puppies] When feeding a quality pet food, supplementation of calcium *** during growth *** is unnecessary, and potentially very dangerous.
Note: Excess calcium causes decreased phosphorus absorption (and vice versa!). Lack of magnesium in the diet renders calcium useless, because the body needs magnesium to properly absorb calcium. If adequate amounts of all 3 of these minerals are present int he diet, the body can regulate the balance according to its needs.”

Citrical includes 20% magnesium (80 mg) and also Vitamin D

Any thoughts?

[DogFoodie]

A couple things I was thinking…

Has your pup had a checkup with blood work recently? Bad breath could also be indicative of some medical issues.

Also, I once recall Sandy mentioning that she used this product with success: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0047VWPNI/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_9?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

Mine eat a variety of foods including raw and raw meaty bones and fortunately, neither has bad breath.

[theBCnut]

You can feed up to 20% of your dogs meals unbalanced without worrying about nutrient deficiencies. What this means is feed 4 meals of balanced commercial raw then one meal of meaty bones. You can use chicken or turkey necks, ribs from smaller animals, a chicken leg or wing, basically anything that has smaller whole bones so the dog has to crunch up the bones. Make sure the first few times you do this that they eat in front of you so if somebody tries to swallow something too large whole, you can intervene.

[Mom2Cavs]

I currently don’t feed commercial raw, but I have and will again I’m sure. First off, dry kibble does not help keep dogs teeth clean. In fact, if they chew it at all (most tend to swallow it whole) it merely sticks to their teeth, much like when we eat crackers or cookies…way more than canned or raw. Actually, the commercial raw would do a better job at keeping teeth clean because it has a more natural component and more readily available enzymes. I would definitely add raw, meaty bones as a component of your dog’s diet. I’m sure others who feed this way will be more able to direct you in how to do this. You’re on the right track with your pup, congratulations with the new addition!

[Mom2Cavs]

Pattyvaughn has some good suggestions. I also have Cavaliers and small dogs are notorious for having bad teeth (not just Cavs) so it can be a constant problem, even shortly after dentals. I have had dentals given to mine off and on and their teeth stay good for only awhile. I do brush their teeth, but admit it’s not as often as I should. They are not good chewers, either, which makes it doubly hard to keep teeth clean :(. As for the breath issue. I have found that when mine eat something they are intolerant to or get into something they shouldn’t their breath smells bad. When anal glands are acting up their breath smells bad. Giving probiotics and enzymes helps tremendously. Also, feeding a high quality food and treats (I’ve actually cut them out 99% of their diet) has helped mine. Currently, I’m feeding Fromm 4Star Salmon a la Veg. Now I do also top their kibble with quality canned food (tblsp.) and mix in their prob/enz. When one of my Cavs had a poop eating problem (enzymes solved this, too, for her) her breath was atrocious! So in a nut shell it could be from:

1. the food they eat.
2. anal gland problems (they’re full).
3. eating things they shouldn’t (like poop or bugs, etc).
4. having a cracked tooth or something wrong with gums, teeth, etc.
5. needing a dental (no lie, some dogs need dentals more often, especially small dogs).

First, I would have your vet inspect your dogs mouth to see if anything is stuck in there, or a cracked tooth, etc. Your vet will probably recommend another dental, which isn’t always feasible at the time. I personally do them either every year or every other year. I don’t like to put my oldies under the anesthesia that often.
Giving raw bones can help keep teeth scrubbed clean. Brushing their teeth can help a lot. Even trying some of the dental sprays and gels, like Mercola’s, or Tropiclean can’t hurt either. Good luck to you, I know the pains of owning small dogs with bad teeth. I hope this helps some.

[raylene5]

We will be getting a Miniature Schnauzer puppy next month and I had a question about how to incorporate heartier texture into a commercial raw diet. I’m pretty certain I will be feeding Primal Pronto nuggets…what can I do to ensure good dental health with a diet full of such soft food?

Do I give him raw meaty bones instead of one of the daily meals or do I just give a recreational bone once a week? What size and what kind for a puppy?

Thanks so much for the help! (Just to be clear, I’ve done a lot of research into the various raw diets and I will definitely not be preparing my own raw or feeding prey model 🙂 )

[theBCnut]

Some dogs have issues with how their breath smells because they have different enzymes and/or acidity in their mouth. You can try letting her chew a raw bone for a while every day. If you get her a marrow bone you should scoop out some of the marrow and throw it away so she doesn’t get too much fat. I prefer knuckle bones, but I can’t always get them.

[DogFoodie]

Hi everyone!

This afternoon, Sam devoured a big lovely beef trachea. MPC packages an entire trachea cut into two pieces. He ate one piece while laying in the backyard in a foot of snow. He was so cute and that snuggly warm coat of his does an amazing job of keeping him warm in our cold snowy weather, which he loves to be outside in.

I was wondering if anyone might have a guess as to how many calories there might be in a piece of trachea that is approximately eight inches in length; and a chicken foot too for that matter.

Not knowing the GA of recreational bones (etc.) is the hardest part of feeding them. I don’t want to ooverfeed him, but I also know he’ll be expecting something for dinner when Bella gets hers.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by DogFoodie.

[theBCnut]

Remember that those are higher calorie foods so he should need less of them than he did of Pedigree. If he is eating around 3 cups a day don’t worry. It’s good to let a large breed pup grow up thin so they don’t have extra stress on their hips. Large breed pups have special needs when it comes to food. Too much calcium can make their bones grow too fast so their joints don’t form properly. Here is a list of foods that Hound Dog Mom put together that have the right amount of calcium for large breed pups.
https://docs.google.com/viewer?srcid=0BwApI_dhlbnFTXhUdi1KazFzSUk&pid=explorer&efh=false&a=v
There is also a thread discussing large breed puppy nutrition issues under Diet and Health Issues.

[theBCnut]

It would take a whole book to explain the benefits of feeding raw, but I’ll try to hit on a few highlights and let someone else add some more.

Dogs were not designed to eat dried food pellets, they were made to eat a diet that is 75-80% water. Raw and canned food fit that need.
Dogs in the wild get some of their digestive enzymes from the food they eat, but heat destroys these enzymes. Many dogs have trouble producing the enzymes they need to deal with their food. Raw foods have these enzymes.
Dogs were not designed to eat high carbohydrate foods, but kibble is a bakery product and has to have a certain level of starch to act as a binder to hold the kibble together. Many dogs have problems just because their bodies can’t deal with the level of carbs in the diet.
Raw provides the nutrients dogs need in a natural form that dogs are designed to use.
Raw provides plenty of protein for tissue growth, regeneration, and repair.
Raw provides the body with what it needs to make its own antioxidants.
With raw, you can be in complete control of the ingredients and the quality of the ingredients.
Raw fed dogs produce small hard stools that are easy to clean up and have little to no smell.
Raw fed dogs have loads of energy and vibrant health.
All the raw fed dogs I know are lean and muscular.
Chewing on raw bones cleans teeth naturally. Raw contributes much, much less to plaque and tartar build up on the teeth.

Someone else’s turn now.

[theBCnut]

Gee, thanks Marie. What are you trying to say. I’m trying to post nice too.

Hi Heather, that is completely false on every level. Grocery store meat has the highest cleanliness standards, except for maybe, and only maybe, restaurants. Dog and cats can handle bacteria so in dog food manufacturing places, if something gets dropped on the floor, they just throw it back in with the good stuff, for people it must be thrown out. And that’s not even mentioning that they use all the parts that people find inedible. Many dogs do better with fruits and veggies but they don’t have to have them. And dogs are completely capable of crushing up their own bones to eat them.

Did I miss anything, Marie?

[villa_heather]

You should not buy meat for your animals at grocery stores because the meat at the grocery store is meant for humans. It is meant to be cooked so it will have higher bacteria and parasite amounts in it . Make sure you get meat that is targeted for pets. Cats need just meat without any vegetables but dogs need meat and vegetables. For both dogs and cats the meat should also contain organs and bones. It is easier to feed it if you get it all ground up together.

[theBCnut]

I’d go ahead and finish out the mix, just a lower portion of it like you are planning anyways. I think that’s a good idea. Be really careful to not give any cooked chicken bones. They can splinter when chomped down on and perforate the intestines. If the meat is cooked, it needs to be pulled off the bones.

[PetClubEmployee]

I searched for a similar article and couldn’t locate one.
I assume it is a common problem
My puppy does not chew, food, treats, bones, etc.
he does not scarf his food. He eats slow enough. His stomach doesn’t suck in either.
I’ve tried large kibble, small kibble, flat kibble, wet food, etc
He just doesn’t chew.
The worst part is jerky treats he tried to swallow them whole I’ve used gobble stoppers in his bowl but it’s really not a solution as he doesn’t eat fast.
Hoping someone can help

[A.Sandy]

Are you feeding raw? Did you know that there is also a wrong way to feed raw? I’ve met people that feed raw hamburger meat and assume that it is a full balanced meal the answer is… wrong! The only 2 nutrients they are getting from raw hamburger are protein and fat. Your pets may seem well fed but dogs and cats require so much more than that. It may be cheap to feed that kind of meat but it will have it’s consequences such as essential nutrient deficiencies such as a zinc deficiency for example that causes retarded growth, coat discolorations and harshness or other things such as food intolerances or even hair loss. Our pets require a complete balanced meal that includes bones or bone meal, fruits and veggies, vitamins and minerals and of course protein and fat all in balanced proportion( this is where the science of nutrition comes into play) Another concern is hamburger meat is mostly meant to be cooked not fed raw because now a days they add hormones, steroids, and fillers, gmos, etc. so there are pet food companies that sell well balanced raw foods that are safe and ready to feed so you don’t have to worry that they are missing out on anything.

-Ana
Pet nutrition expert/advisor
pupcatnutrition.com
@pupcatfacts

[Angeldogs]

Thanks, Patty. I didn’t realize that. He is getting a couple of tablespoons mixed in for taste/smell. I think that maybe the enzyme supplement has a sour taste. He only ate a partial meal without the addition of the canned food. It’s working and packing meat on his bones really fast.

[theBCnut]

You need to be adding calcium to this. Chewing on femur bones will not get enough calcium into their diets to make up for what this lacks. You also shouldn’t add the fish oil until you are ready to serve it. Fish oil will go bad pretty quickly. Sounds very yummy!