[Chip]

I have two dogs, both German Shorthair mixes… one is an older male (11 years old), the other a younger (5 years) female. I love them both very much, both were shelter/rescue dogs. When we adopted the younger dog, we switched from feeding her Hill’s Science Diet (which is what we were sent home with from the shelter) to some sort of Purina Dry Kibble, since she wouldn’t eat the Hill’s. Since then and after finding this website (my knowledge about dog food and their ingredients greatly increased), her menu evolved from the low quality kibble to a mixture of Honest Kitchens dehydrated raw food (a company that I love) mixed with Blue Buffalo Freedom. I consider both of these foods to have above average to excellent ingredients and I feel good when I buy it for my two dogs. The problem is is that they both have very sensitive stomachs… when we started with the HK and BB it seemed to FINALLY fix the problem with terrible diarrhea that they both were experiencing with all the foods we tried (Castor and Pollux, Nature’s Recipe, and so on). Their bowl movements (I feel strange talking about this) were FINALLY healthy… fluffy yet firm, regular, didn’t stink. It was a miracle. Unfortunately, after about two years of eating various styles/flavors of HK mixed with BB, the younger dog “Jessie” decided that she absolutely didn’t want to eat it anymore. I got tired of preparing it only to have to dump it out (it’s very expensive) and then wash her dish (as I did after every meal since it’s a part raw diet). So, we tried some different brands thinking that it would add a bit of diversity to what they were eating. We went with Wellness Complete Health kibble and canned but soon found out that the diarrhea had returned (we introduced these foods slowly). We tried going back to the old food but she couldn’t shake the diarrhea (the older fella was having some problems as well, but not nearly extreme). We finally took her into the vet, which I dread doing because I know exactly what’s coming… a fecal exam (which is always negative), a bill for $100, and a lecture about how the food I feed them isn’t quality/adequate because it wasn’t “formulated” by veterinarians and pet nutritionists (in their words) as Hill’s Science Diet is. I don’t have a problem with giving the HSD Prescription i/d gastrointestinal a try… my problem is that the ingredient list is full of low quality foods and chemicals, yet they charge more per can/bag than the food with (what I consider to be) high quality ingredients that I was feeding my dogs. I’m sick of being treated as though I’m being insolent because I actually question what it is specifically about Hill’s that is supposed to calm my dog’s stomach. Is it the corn? The iodized salt? The food coloring? I know it sounds as though I’m being snippy right now, but this has been an ongoing problem as I’ve brought the dogs to the same vet in the past few years every now and then with small bouts of stomach problems and am told the same thing every time and mad to feel as though I’m an ignorant and irresponsible pet owner for not switching to Hill’s and I’m sick of it. I don’t have any other options to switch to a different vet, so that won’t solve anything. It has been three days and there hasn’t been any improvement so far on the HSD and, sorry it has taken me so loooonnnnngggg to get to the point, here is my question: Does anyone have an alternative to HSD i/d that actually has quality ingredients? Or, does anyone have any useful advice about what our next course of action should be? I thought I read something in one of the comment sections a long time ago about how German Shorthair Pointers are sensitive to a certain ingredient that is fairly common in most dog foods… does anyone know anything about that subject? And, is it just me, or do veterinarians actually know anything about dog nutrition, or do they just espouse what they are told by the salespeople from Hill’s? I don’t doubt that Hill’s probably does make some important prescription foods that certain dogs need, but the i/d just looks like crap to me. Thank you for taking the time to read and respond.

[losul]

Hi Molzy,

About the chronic wasting disease- these tissues are known to harbor and concentrate the abnormal proteins-prions- brain, spinal cord, eyes, spleen, tonsils, lymph nodes in an infected animal, although I’ve also read they can be in other tissues, even in blood.

Even high temperature cooking/irradiation does not destroy them.

Its not likely your dog or even you would get anything from them, specific prions have difficulty jumping the species barrier, although it HAS been thought/known to happen. Dogs thus far, and as far as I know, havent been reported to get any prion diseases, but it doesnt neccesarily mean they dont, cant or wont. So far there are about 4 or 5 of these transmissible and fatal prion diseases known to occur in humans, 1 in cats, 1 in cattle (BSE or mad cow) 1 in sheep/goats (scrapie) 1 in mink.

I posted about it the other day as a precautionary measure. You might want to avoid eating or feeding any of the above tissues if you live in a an area where CWD is known to be prevalent in the wild, or any tissues at all from a deer, elk or moose that is behaving sickly or oddly.

Here is more info on Transmissible spongiform encephalopathys, see also chronic wasting disease.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transmissible_spongiform_encephalopathy

About MPC and their calorie fiasco. Thats something that recently appeared on their website. I agree there is absolutely no way those figures are correct. Also their protein and fat figures dont always jive. The bad thing is that the phone number that they provide is Paul’s cell phone number. I called Paul about two weeks ago when I saw these figures onsite. Paul also personally makes deliveries, which he was doing when I called. I told him that their was no way the calorie counts were right, take the chicken super mix for example-theres no way 1 pound could contain only 217 calories, and especially given the very high (supposedly) fat figures given. Even skinless, boneless chicken breast has way more calories than that. He told me that they had folks wanting to know the calorie counts so they obtained lab results showing those figures. I still insisted something was very wrong. He said that he could check back with the lab, but couldnt do much until he returned from his deliveries which would be a week or so. So I told him I would be calling back. Your post reminded me to call him, and I just got off the phone with him. He now agrees that something isnt right (probably has had lotso phone calls about), but that they still havent got it sorted out. When/if they get that sorted out I have more questions/concerns for him.

[neezerfan]

Hi Chuck, I’ve been where you are now and I agree it is overwhelming! You can take it step by step. I started by eliminating kibble altogether. The more I read about it, the more I felt it wasn’t a good food for my dog. I switched to 5 star canned foods, rotating brands and protein sources. I gave him a chicken neck or foot twice a week. Then I started rotating in commercially prepared raw starting with Primal and Nature’s Variety. Now his main food is Darwin’s but I still rotate in other brands and cans. I give him 2 homemade meals a week, he eats twice daily so that’s under the 20% rule.

I don’t feel confident at this point to self prepare all of his meals. My next move is to rotate in meals consisting of fresh meat with a premix added. He’s only 2 so we have time! Maybe I’ll get there eventually but for now I’m doing the best that I feel comfortable with.

Start your dog with a chicken neck and see how it goes. My dog will eat absolutely anything but it did take him a few minutes to get going on his first chicken neck. He just looked at it and circled it for a while before getting down to business. Now he eats all kinds of bones.

[Molzy]

Hello all,

I am considering switching my dogs to a raw diet. We have two 1.5-year-old Australian Cattle Dog Mixes. They are both rescue dogs. We adopted LoJack last October, and Quincy came home with us in July. Both of them came to us eating Science Diet, which we pretty much immediately threw out. I worked in a high-end pet store for years, and I am kind of a food snob when it comes to my pets. My cat, Ralph, has been on Nature’s Variety frozen chicken for over a year now, and does amazingly on it (for him, it has helped with his urinary tract infections). The dogs have eaten a variety of Nutrisource Grain-Free Salmon, Pure-Vita or Merrick dry kibble. My boyfriend and I are big on “Eat Local” and both of these companies seemed pretty good for commercial dog food. Now that we have graduated from grad school, we can start entertaining the idea of paying a little more to feed raw. When we just had LoJack he would also get raw meaty bones once in a while for his teeth, we haven’t tried giving Quincy those due to some digestive issues we’ve been struggling with.

Anyways, I am thinking of originally starting with a pre-made raw, and possibly slowly adding in some other stuff. My boyfriend hunts, so hopefully we will have some venison this year for them, and we also live in the country so there is the possibility of contacting local butchers for organ meats and stuff. We already own a hand grinder for the meat (though we may invest in an electric one if we end up going with raw!).

Anyways, what are your recommendations for pre-made diets? At this point, we would like to stick with a grind because of Quincy’s issues with chunkier food (I want to make sure that raw works before trying chunks, then slowly add chunks in to make sure we don’t cause issues). I am considering doing Nature’s Variety since it is balanced for cats and dogs, which would be nice, but it is also a little expensive, so I figured I would see if anyone else has any suggestions. I would also consider a pre-mix with ground meat.

One last question – can they have venison bones? We saved a bunch from the deer we got last year and froze them, but I got worried about chronic wasting disease, so we have never tried them. They are thinner than the beef/bison bones we normally feed, so I worried about him swallowing chunks as well.

Thanks!
Molly, LoJack and Quincy (and Ralph the cat)

[mfulton7]

Yeah the couple were country folk and older so they probably didn’t know about the laws. Yes we do already have her not much I can change about that…..I do appreciate the concern though….I myself thought she was a little too young but hubby felt it was fine since the pup had been weaned and she checked out health wise with the breeders vet and with ours. I did call the vets office this afternoon to ask their opinion about the pooping they said it depends how she’s eating her food and how much. So they recommended purina pro plan, go figure ha!
My whole point in posting this was to find out if the fromm nutritionals are the same as the grain free version. Theres quite a bit of price difference there so I just wasnt sure. All the dog foods/reviews/opinions have me confused.

[losul]

PrincessPiper,

If you happen to live in one of the areas where chronic wasting disease (a prion disease similar to BSE in cows or scrapie in sheep) is prevalent in wild deer/elk/moose populations, as a precaution, you might want to avoid feeding (or eating yourself) these tissues- brain, spinal cord, eyes, spleen, tonsils, lymph nodes, no matter raw or cooked.

Its now spread to parts of at least 21 states and 2 Canadian provinces.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_wasting_disease

[HabanaJoe]

I agree with Patty as well. My caveat would be to try to avoid food with grains….corn, soy, wheat etc.
We experimented…slowly with various brands and settled on Blue Buffalo or Wellness..both canned and kibble. Of course, every time we buy, we do check ingredients as companies are known to change to something cheaper and keep the label looking the same.
I would suggest that you show your boyfriend what “meat by products” are and let him know that they can have adverse effects on a dog.
We also stay away from any glutens for protein enhancing agents and only buy food that is made from ingredients here or in Canada. (no chinese). Check any treats you buy as well, as a lot of companies are putting an American flag on the package to make you think it’s made here. When you read the fine print, it says “made in china”. (poisonous ingredients a few years ago related to gluten).

The little extra spent on a quality dog food will pay you back in the long run with fewer vet bills and fewer skin problems for your pup.
Good luck with your new family member!

[Sully’sMom]

I’ve been wondering about the whole Green Tripe thing in general. Did I read on one of these threads somewhere that it’s available in a can? And if that’s the case, would it be useful as a topper to kibble?

[beaglemom]

Hi Freehold… that website is definitely a bust. HDM posted that she placed an order and never received it, had to find their phone number through Paypal (since the one listed on the website is out of service), and got a similar BS line from them about how it would ship soon or some such thing. We dug deeper and found that this same creep of a woman (Suzanne) burned HDM once before with a different website but somehow she’s still putting up these sites and screwing people. Her former 2-3 businesses all have an F rating on the website of the Better Business Bureau. You can read our discussion here…
/best-dog-foods/raw-dog-food/ (suggested raw dog foods)
I wouldn’t wait to file the claim with Paypal – do it asap. They took care of HDM’s refund the same day.

[Molzy]

Hello! I’ll apologize in advance for the length of this post.

We adopted an Australian Cattle Dog (Quincy) at the end of July. He is a year-and-a-half old neutered male, and we were told he was given up due to not being housebroken. I am beginning to suspect that the real reason may have be what I can only describe as his gulping disorder.

For the first two weeks at home he was totally fine. We switched him from Science Diet to Merrick Lamb and Rice, which he gets twice a day. We did have to board him about two weeks after adopting him due to a family wedding, and it was after this that he started his first episode of gulping/swallowing. Usually at night, he will begin frantically swallowing and gulping. Quincy will frantically search the house for carpet fibers to pull up, and will eventually vomit and then re-eat his food if we don’t get to it in time. This went on for about a week the first time – we brought him to the vet, they said he looked fine, and that it was probably just all the changes in his life. I did give him a gas-x one night, because he was swallowing so much air I was concerned about bloat. He ate some carpet this first time, when I fell asleep with him out of his kennel (he normally sleeps in bed with us, but when he is having these bouts I have learned to kennel him so that he can’t get into anything). He threw the carpet up about 3 days after that.

At that point, we thought he just had a sensitive stomach. So, when we switched his food again (our other dog has an iron stomach, and had done well with us rotating food, so we already had a bag of grain-free salmon from Nutrisource), we weren’t all surprised when the symptoms started up again. This time I gave him a couple of doses of pepto-bismol to ease his tummy troubles, and about 6 days later he stopped vomiting. I should note – when he vomits, it seems associated with these bursts of gulping/swallowing/licking. I thought it was him having an upset stomach and panicking about it, but the vet thought it was odd that he is willing to eat his vomit right away, and that a nauseous dog wouldn’t do that? I am beginning to think that the actual issue is the gulping/swallowing, and the vomiting may be a side effect of that, rather than the other way around.

I switched him to rice and boiled chicken, and he seemed to get better. We put him back on Merrick (chicken and rice this time, because they were out of lamb and rice), and he did fine for about a week. Then last week, he threw up again (he had had a minor bout of swallowing, but nothing like he normally gets). We fasted him for 36 hours, and brought him to the vet. Again, his stool and activity is normal. The vet gave him an anti-nausea shot, and sent us home with some anti-nausea pills and canned science diet ID (for gastro-intestinal health). He was fine for about 3 days, and then last night had one of his worst bouts of swallowing/gulping yet. He didn’t throw up at all (that I know of, I did fall asleep for a little while), but did try to eat a rope toy. I kenneled him for the night, and this morning he ate grass like crazy.

His bouts tend to start at night when we’re going to bed, and he works himself up into a frenzy. Once it starts, it tends to last for multiple days, and kenneling him seems to work to calm him down a little. Our other dog (LoJack) has been totally fine through all of this. They are never outside without my supervision, and he doesn’t get human food (except for the two occasions he has stolen it off of the counter). I haven’t been feeding treats for a few weeks now, but tonight had to give him some zukes at training class. The only other thing would be that he did start HeartGuard and Frontline, but both of those started after his initial attacks. One last thing I should mention is that he plays a LOT with my other dog, and they usually wrestle and play tug of war every night before bed, but will often stop for >2 hours before going to bed. I haven’t felt like there was any correlation between them playing and one of these attacks. When we walk he is on a gentle leader or harness, but he is on his collar when on his tie-out in the yard. I remove the dog’s collars when they’re wrestling so that they don’t hurt each other.

Has anyone dealt with similar symptoms? What did you do? My Internet searches have found that others have this issue but I haven’t found anyone who has solved it. We will probably do blood work and an X-ray next to rule out anything normal, but I want opinions from others on possible nutritional changes that could help. I refuse to switch to science diet unless I absolutely must. I’m considering trying raw, but currently scared of anything that might upset him, since I’ve been cleaning vomit for the past month it seems! I do natures variety raw with my cat, and our other dog has been on grain free nutrisource or merrick for the past year.

Thanks for any advice, I appreciate it!

[GSDsForever]

yellowdaisy,

I think HK is an excellent company, with quality foods and high standards (including safety). The formulas are pretty gentle and I’ve never known dogs to have trouble with it, especially sensitive/touchy stomach dogs. I like the Zeal formula best (which many sensitive dogs do well on when they can’t on other foods), then the Embark. Zeal is HK’s highest protein and uses a very high quality source, though the fat is very, very low — which some dogs do best with and others need to add back.

The only negatives I encounter with HK are that some formulas are grain inclusive (when owners don’t want that), some dogs aren’t crazy about the soupy texture, and high cost . . . esp. grain free Zeal & Embark. I would like to see, at their higher price point, their base ingredients be organic (like Stella & Chewy’s) when it’s a known heavily pesticide contaminated ingredient or preference for less contaminated fruits/veggies/greens chosen when organic isn’t feasable/prohibitively expensive — kind of like how I shop at the grocery store. But they are still very clean, high quality foods and I would feed them + highly recommend the brand.

In Nutrisource/Pure Vita’s defense, I really don’t think that their food can be blamed for tumors. Something triggers cancer to start in the body and that can be many complex factors, usually involving toxins as insults to the body and the immune system + some genetics. From there, we do know from research that cancer feeds selectively off sugars/simple carbs and need an acidic environment to be active . . . but that’s after the cancer has taken hold. Certain breeds (and their mixes) currently have very high incidences of cancer, like Goldens or Bernese Mountain Dogs; or there is a breed specific cancer like hemangiosarcoma. Some stats show more than half of all dogs and cats now die of cancer.

Pure Vita does pretty clean sourcing, for example using more expensive wild caught fish exclusively (protecting against toxins like PCBs in farmed salmon) and imposes a good bit of safety testing and quality standards. Many dogs seem to do really well on the food, esp. those with allergies/sensitivities or needing a bland diet and limited ingredient diet.

At the same time, virtually all commercial pet foods have significant contamination with bacterial toxins (enterotoxins, endotoxins, cytotoxins, etc.), from the meat, processing and handling, sanitation issues, storage, heat or lack of heat processing, moisture spoilage (like aflatoxins, etc in grains), lack of freshness, rancidity of fats/oils, etc. (You can read more about this in texts like UC Davis Vet School’s/DVM Strombeck’s Home Prepared Dog & Cat Diets, chapter 3 on commercial pet foods/food safety & preparation.)

Nevertheless, I do think homemade diets (balanced) using a wide variety of fresh foods in rotation, cleanly sourced (wild fish, grass fed & free range, organic), are best. So I think you are on the right track. Good luck!

[Sara10010]

I’m new to the forum and am hoping I might be able to get some advice. My husband and I have a five and a half month old Cardigan Welsh Corgi who is showing signs of pano/elbow dysplasia. We had x-rays taken and there is significant space between his elbow joints (right side is worse). We aren’t sure if this is something he might grow out of or if it is, in fact, dysplasia (we are seeing a specialist this weekend). However, we’ve been feeding him Orijen puppy since we brought him home and I’m concerned the protein content might be too much for him and could be contributing to this. It’s undoubtedly a high quality food and he is growing fast on it. I don’t want the vet to put him on a prescription diet as I don’t believe they are nutritious. From reading this thread, it seems that Wellness Core Puppy might be a good option for us? I am also not sure if we should just switch him to an all life stages food at this point? I would love any recommendations that anyone might have – we want to do right by our little guy and I really thought I was giving him the best with Orijen.

Thanks!

[Cyndi]

Hey everyone, I have a question, possibly a stupid one, but I can’t figure it out…

When I was questioning about premixes at the beginning of this thread, HDM told me “Make sure not to use a pre-mix with a grind which contains bone.” Why is that? I have a few different premixes here that I’m using and I’m just curious to why I don’t want to use them with meat and bone.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 6 months ago by Cyndi.

[RescueDaneMom]

Hi All,

I have been lurking on DFA for a few months now. Originally I was trying to find the best dry food for my dog, then I started getting into dehydrated and freeze dried. Now I’m looking at frozen raw. For the past two months I have been doing 2/3 premium 5 star kibble with 1/3 frozen raw (complete formulas from Primal or Stella & Chewy’s). I didn’t know if my dog would go for it so that’s why I started this way. Now I want to move to full raw. I will admit to being lazy when it comes to this process. The easiest thing for me to get hold of right now is Primal grinds and complete formulas (Primal and S&C). A lady in the next town owner has become a retailer and sells it out of her house and adds very little markup.

I have a 7.5 year old Great Dane named Max that I got from a rescue. He is 155 pounds, is currently eating 1800-1900 calories per day, and is in perfect condition. I have fed him 3 meals per day since I got him because I could and it works for him. I want to do Primal grinds with additions for two of his meals and a complete formula for his third meal. I am most concerned with balancing his two meals of Primal grinds. From reading I have gathered that these grinds can be high in bone content as well as fat so it is important to add extra muscle meat (heart, boneless meats) and protein (eggs, cottage cheese, canned salmon, canned oysters, tripe?). I also plan on adding yogurt or kefir, sprouted seeds, fish oil, vitamin E, HDM’s superfood blend and veggie/fruit/herb puree, and 3 cloves of garlic 3x/week.

I have a few questions/ things I wanted to double check. He would need about 3200mg combined EPA/DHA, 300iu vitamin E, 200iu vitamin D/lb of food, 3 tsp of superfood blend daily, right? I couldn’t find what the appropriate amount of vitamin A was? If I use cod liver oil for the vitamin D, will that provide sufficient vitamin A? Also, would it be good to use a glandular supplement too? Lastly, assuming I have covered everything, a multivitamin/mineral isn’t needed correct?

Thank you in advance for your help. And special thanks to Hound Dog Mom for posting menus and such great, detailed information.

[Mom2Cavs]

As you all may remember, I’ve been battling things with Laverne. She would have anal gland issues and goopy eyes, she would lick her forearm and scratch her back sides. Sometimes she would lick her back knee?…I guess that would be what it’s called lol. She would scoot only sometimes. Her stool would be loose to full blown diarrhea at times, except when we tried NV LIDs…then she was too constipated (they all were) and the other symptoms were still there. Finally, one of her breeders told me that her brother and mother could never have poultry! So….I’ve been working on getting poultry out of the house. We have tried Zignature, still didn’t do the trick (maybe I didn’t give it long enough). We then went on Holistic Select grain free. Things were a little better. Now, I also top with canned food (and something tells me sometimes it may be the canned that’s causing the problem). I’ve narrowed the canned down to a few kinds whereas I was using quite a lot of different kinds before. Things were a little better, still not where I would like, though. In there as well I used some Natural Balance I had in the dog closet to see if it would be better than the Hol. Sel. I had the Lamb & Rice and the Swt. Pot. & Fish. Things were even a little better. I used to like N.B. but am leary of it now..bummer. When I finished with the N.B. I transitioned in a small bag of Acana Lamb (from the dog closet, of course!) This is what they are on now. We’re only on the first day with only Acana Lamb & Apple as the kibble, but so far so good. I’ve stopped treats for the time being, as well. I’ve been using the kibble, which they all readily take (even picky Lucy…don’t know how long this will last). Today I gave Acana topped with Wellness 95% Salmon for breakfast and only dry Acana for dinner. I think that’s my plan….kibble and can for breakfast and dry for dinner. They also get part of their dry right before bedtime as a snack. It’s really too soon to tell but today has been fine with this arrangement. I pray it keeps on working….I like Acana and maybe eventually I can use other flavors, like Ranchlands. I’ll keep y’all posted. Please keep us in your thoughts.

Oh, I wanted to mention that I did order some Big Dog Natural in beef. While the dogs all loved it very much, it really did a number on Laverne’s bowels!! Too, too much for her so…..we will not be using it in the future.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 6 months ago by Mom2Cavs.

[gsdmommy89]

Hi there everyone. I know this is a puppy thread, and I do have a GSD puppy ( with monstrous paws so I knew he’ll be large!), but I do have a question that maybe someone here could answer. Aside from my puppy, I also have his mom, a 3 yr old GSD. She’s been eating the Earthborn Coastal Catch, but I can’t seem to get her to put weight on. During gestation and nursing, I fed her Earthborn Puppy Vantage. She used to be around 68 lbs. I weighed her yesterday she’s down to 59 lbs. I spoke to my vet, which also monitored her during pregnancy, and she told me that maybe I need to try something with grains in it. She’s been fed a grain free diet pretty much all her life, except when I fed her the Puppy Vantage. The vet told me she’s probably just taking longer to recover from nursing, as she didn’t find anything abnormal. She also told me to try adding Missing Link, to add vitamins or something like that. My dog isn’t bony, but you can tell she is underweight. I was thinking of switching both my GSD’s to Fromm Large Breed puppy. Maybe the puppy formula has more calories and fat so she can gain her weight back? I don’t know. If anyone can give me some advice, I’d really appreciate it. Food? Supplements? Thanks a million!

[Anonymous]

Thanks for this wonderful thread, most of all Hound Dog Mom for her great knowledge, research, and unbiased advice.
I have brought home a puppy from the rescue, it looks to be a lab/greyhound mix, it might become large, it might turn out to be medium, but I opted for the safe bet and I am feeding it low calcium.
I have recently moved to America from the Netherlands, and fed my GSD raw, but over there I can go to the butchers and get cuts and special dog-food easily. Here I have to find out anew where to go and what to buy. But I am impressed with the many different brands of quality dog food.
And tripe in a can! Brilliant!

I have learnt so much on this thread! I have read everything and printed HDM’s list so I have no questions, just:
Thank you all very much! Especially Hound Dog Mum.

[cdubau]

Here is my situation

One large breed dog and one small breed dog. They are both around 7/8 years old and over weight. Recently we changed the older dogs food from Nutro to TOTW due to the interest in the grain free aspect and better quality food as well. We have restricted both food intake and started exercising them. With the food change Emma has stopped rubbing herself all over the house (shes always been itchy but checked out okay per the docs) and her ears are no longer red (they were red but had no infection per the docs). Since reading about all the Diamond food recalls I was hesitant about trying TOTW and still alittle leery about it.

While at the doc we brought up to that Emma, was drinking alot of water. Turns out she had a UTI. He mentioned she might have Cushings due to the protein in her urine and said we need to have her tested for that eventually. After doing some of my own research and reading articles on this site (theres a post about cushings) I am convinced I really need to cut her fat intake back and increase her protein as that is said to help with aspects of Cushings. While she hasn’t been diagnosed she really shows some key signs of it. We are hoping to test her in the next couple months. For any interest she is constantly drinking ALOT of water, constantly hungry (eats poop if we miss a clean up, as well as will tear into anything she can find), easily stressed or aggravated most the time, has a hard time getting up/down the stairs and doesn’t get on the couch as much, pants when the other dogs aren’t panting and the AC doesn’t go higher then 76, her extra weight seems to only be in her chest/abdomen and she has developed a heart murmur that is very LOUD.

I have looked on the suggested low fat list but most the listed dry kibble is NOT grain free, if they were they weren’t in my budget by any means. I couldn’t find anything that was below 13% Fat in a grain free formula on my own that was in my budget. After seeing such an improvement over the grain free I am having a hard time switching her to any of the “low fat list” foods that include grains. So I am looking to other people for their opinions and maybe experience with this. I just feel like I’m at a loss and I’ve spent days in front of the computer trying to figure this out.

Current Food
TOTW Pacific Stream dry dog food 15% Fat 25% Protein

Here is what I found that I can afford FROM the list – Not grain free:
AvoDerm Large Breed Chicken and Rice 11% Fat 29% Protein
Fromm Gold Reduced Activity Senior Dry Dog Food 12% Fat 26% Protein
Wellness Super5 Mix Large Breed Adult 12% Fat 28% Protein

Here is what I found on my own that IS grain free – NOT on the list

GO! Senior 14% Fat 32% Protein
Merrick G/F Texas Beef 15% Fat 38% Protein
Holistic Select 13% Fat 28% Protein

Thank you for any input!

[nailgirl]

hi, i hope someone here can help me out! my 21 yr old daughter brought home a stray kitten that she found near a dumpster behind her work. within the first week she (my daughter) contracted a ringworm spot on her leg. she has since been treated and she took the kitten to her vet and has been treating the kitten with zymox enzymatic shampoo and rinse plus a spray to the affected area with conzol 1% (miconazole nitrate topical anti fungal). well, of course, my schnauzer now has spots all over his head, muzzle area, and one spot on his behind! we are keeping them separated for now and i am taking the schnauzer to my vet tomorrow!! in the meantime, i thought would come on here and ask any of you if you’ve ever dealt with this before and if you had any tips for me! i’ve been reading on here for some months now and it seems like a friendly and helpful place, so thanks for anyone who can help out! i feel like i’m at my wits end!

[nailgirl]

hi, i hope someone here can help me out! my 21 yr old daughter brought home a stray kitten that she found near a dumpster behind her work. within the first week she (my daughter) contracted a ringworm spot on her leg. she has since been treated and she took the kitten to her vet and has been treating the kitten with zymox enzymatic shampoo and rinse plus a spray to the affected area with conzol 1% (miconazole nitrate topical anti fungal). well, of course, my schnauzer now has spots all over his head, muzzle area, and one spot on his behind! we are keeping them separated for now and i am taking the schnauzer to my vet tomorrow!! in the meantime, i thought would come on here and ask any of you if you’ve ever dealt with this before and if you had any tips for me! i’ve been reading on here for some months now and it seems like a friendly and helpful place, so thanks for anyone who can help out! i feel like i’m at my wits end!

[theBCnut]

I’m sorry if you’ve answered this elsewhere, but my brain is leaking out right now, I have so much going on. Do you suspect a yeast overgrowth in your dog? Or some other bacterial overgrowth? If You believe you have a bacterial overgrowth, I would possibly not feed that probiotic for a few days, if you were feeding it every day. For a yeast overgrowth, I would wait to use it until you are seeing definite improvements. Now here is the real issue. If you have done everything you can to cut the carbs out of your dogs diet, then I wouldn’t worry about it at all. Simple carbs are the first choice of food for those nasties, so by cutting carbs you are already putting the bad guys on notice. If you cut out all food sources too quickly then you will get a massive die off, which sounds good on paper, but it doesn’t look good on your floor or smell good in your house. Slow die off is preferable, and the FOS you are feeding is not that much or that often.

[apriliamille]

murphysmom,
i cant remember which forum i read it on but tim hunt (dr tim) had an interesting discussion about “meal” and why he used it and considering iditerod sled dogs use his stuff im sure its valid. i may be wrong in my understanding but pretty much i took it as take a deboned chicken and dehydrate it then prep it for kibble mix then compare it to chicken meal on a protein per weight amount then look at the cost and efforts to put a good protein kibble to market at a value. we use a kibble that has “deboned chicken” as the first ingredient and its definitely hitting the pocket book. (i assume since my dogs are getting a premium chicken breast in their kibble instead of a grocery store for human use)
i think there is quality to “meal” look at some of the ash contents of the kibbles using meal. there are some good numbers out there.
on a side note. i have been transitioning my pup onto meadowfeast to help with the pocket book while i do more research on her food i want to use when she hits 1 year old and i start pushing her physically. i have to feed her on a tray exclusively with the meadowfeast (not saying yours will need to) its a smaller kibble then she has ever had and she has reverted to her younger days of vacuum. also the earthborn UPC for Trees is a neat program they do.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 6 months ago by apriliamille.
• This reply was modified 12 years, 6 months ago by apriliamille. Reason: keep finding i dont make sense in my sentances

[Jagger2012]

I have my 14 month old lab “Jagger” and my 15 week old German Shepherd “Keesha”. Keesha was taken in a few days ago for her last set of shots and I was discussing with my vet that Keesha is a poop eater! Bad! She will not eat her poop but my labs. I have watched her out the window following him around and when he hunches up to poop she will stand right there and eat it as it hits the ground or catch it as it falls and eats it! I am not kidding! I know the whole dog eating cat poop thing but I have never had a dog eat anothers or their own. I try to be outside when they go out to potty but it does not always happen. I do pick up the poop several times a day. My vet suggested getting something “I can’t for the life of me remember the name” to feed them both so his poop is not so appetizing.
I feed them Earthborn Holistic Meadow Feast and Coastal catch. I did order some of the Darwins to try but I can’t afford to have them on that only. I would like to give them Darwins as a lunch and then the kibble for morning and night.

So to my questions: My thought is that she is lacking something as to why she is eating his poop? I was reading on the supplements. Should I try doing some kind of supplementing? And if so what? I have no clue on a lot of this so am needing pointed in the right direction.

Please ask any questions you may have to help me out! 🙂
Tammy

[terriers4life]

OK. I’ve lurked on this forum for quite a while. I now feel the need to speak up. Dinovite for dogs, which is a product I have used for many, many years for many, many dogs is a high quality whole food supplement. Read the ingredients folks. Good source of vitamins, omega fatty acids, probiotics, enzymes. There’s nothing in it that will cause a dog to have blood in their urine or to get sick, unless there’s something the dog is allergic to. And how the heck would you (or they-Dinovite) know this? It’s sort of like saying “Don’t feed organic, natural peanut butter to your kid, because mine had an allergic reaction to it.”

Seriously, “check with your vet”? Yeah, the one who advises you to buy his dog food (which is garbage, even according to this website) and who would rather you give your dog steroids for life? Give me a break. When was the last time your vet gave you advice about feeding your dog…that was good for him? Vets are not trained in nutrition…well, barely. How long does your dog have to be on steroids for you to realize they are destroying his internal organs? And if steroids or allergy shots were the answer, then WHY DOES THE DOG STILL ITCH or HAVE BALD PATCHES???

Find a 5 star rated food (a Dinovite rep actually pointed me to this site to help me choose a better dog food) and add Dinovite. Get your dog off the darn steroids.

Even the absolute best commercial dog food is heat processed. So enzymes, probiotics and so many vitamins are destroyed. So your dog is walking around with these deficiencies. And you can’t fix that with steroids, creams, sprays, ear cleaners, antibiotics. Use common sense people.

I was a huge skeptic. But in 2009, I had 4 dogs who had some pretty messed up skin and ears. I was feeding a good food (rated 5 stars here) and still so much $$$$ at the vet (and listen folks, not once did a vet offer any money back for crap that didn’t work. In fact, I just kept coming back and spending more. Try this…no, try this…maybe try this…and spending so much money.) So I got enough Dinovite for my worst case. And I used it for a few months. It took about 3 or 4 months but slowly, I began to see a difference. It was really apparent as my other dogs were still just awful.

After a few months, I took my dog in the car, and no stinky smell…no shedding. No bald patches. No butt scooting.

The rest of my dogs have been on this now since then too. I left the country for 4 weeks and had a friend stay at my house. She never added it to my dog’s food. I came home to one of my dogs kinda stinky and the shedding was back. Never again. My dogs won’t go without. Ever. Period.

I have even used this on every foster dog I have had come through my house. And they have all benefitted from it. I send some with each dog when they leave here. I’ve seen some pretty bad skin problems and yeast problems get under control using Dinovite (and I use the fish oil or the other omega supplement too).

And, I actually tried one of their newer products (a different vitamin in a tube). It was supposed to be the same as the one in the box but in a thick like paste. My dogs didn’t really like it much so I went back to the powder. And I sent back a bunch of the tubes. Two were actually empty and 4 were unopened. I got my money back no problem. With a smile.

[somebodysme]

Anyone know why a holistic vet would say that you should not feed a probiotic with FOS? I cannot find the article I read anymore but I specifically remember that it was about treating candida in a dog and the author said to use a probiotic but do not use one containing FOS. I have seen the probiotic recommended over and over and over here that is from Swanson’s and contains FOS. Why would you avoid FOS?

I am currently giving PB8 to my dog and it is absolutely keeping the yeast at bay. I am giving her two pills a day for a 50 lb dog. She is on a potato based kibble right now due to allergies and even at that, the yeast is not causing her issues.

[somebodysme]

I could have sworn that in this conversation she mentioned that her dog was tested and basically allergic to everything. Without going back and reading it all…

I was lucky enough to discover that my dog is allergic to peas. Once I started feeding her a “healthy” grain free diet is when it all went to heck. I finally listened to my vet and fed the food that he suggested (he did NOT sell it to me) and that is when the rash went away. Once I had a food that I knew she could eat, I then went through every ingredient and found the only same ingredient of all the grain free foods she had eaten and that gave her a rash, was the peas. The new food has potatoes and no peas. I kept trying new meats to find a cause of a terrible rash she had.

Had I LISTENED to my vet, I could have saved my dog a few months of misery. But NOOOO, I thought I knew more than my vet! We are not giving our vets enough credit for all the experience they have with working with thousands of animals for many years. So maybe they aren’t trained a lot in nutrition in college…so what, can’t a vet do reading and research on their own just like we can. And to generalize and say “vets know nothing about dog nutrition” is just wrong to say! There are way too many self proclaimed experts on the Internet these days! I’m not saying to just not do your own research but when a dog is so sick they have almost died, it is time to listen to our vet’s advice! Time to stop self diagnosing!

[scottNY]

To SadieGirlsMom, I am so sorry to hear Sadie is suffering. She is very lucky to have you, though.

I have a 7-month old pit mix rescue and although he doesn’t have those issues, he is a very picky eater and I have been told that is somewhat typical of pits. I regularly add shredded cheese, green bell peppers or carrots to his food just to get him to pay attention to it. It hasn’t mattered what brand or flavors I have given him – he just seems to be picky. I will say, though, he is more likely to eat after a walk then before. [Make sure you don’t feed her right after strenuous exercise, though!]

There are quite a few other pits at the dog park we go to regularly and we always swap stories. A few things we all seem to agree on are that pits do better with a good, grain-free food. [Since at 7-months my puppy is already at 60 lbs, I just switched to one of HoundDogMom’s 5-start large breed recommended foods.] At the first sign of any stomach issues, we also mix in varying amounts of cooked, plain white rice, depending on how severe the issue. If it is really bad, we just use rice, some shredded, boiled, unseasoned chicken breast and some no-sodium chicken broth added for flavor and smell. I also have been giving my puppy a probiotic daily since he was 2-months old. He also gets a good, canine multivitamin. At the advice of others on this forum I intend to add enzymes and likely green food supplements.

Once you get the right food and the probiotic in her, hopefully the problems will begin to fade. I also found the grain-free food helped the stools and the gas tremendously.

Good luck and please keep us posted.

[lilyh]

Thank you so much for this thread.

We pick up an Field Bred English Setter Puppy next week. The breeder feeds her (and all their dogs) Purina Large Breed Puppy Chow. Think I have finally convinced my husband to switch her off that once the dog settles into our new home (his argument: If it’s good enough for the breeder, why should we switch?). I can just anticipate the resistance when I try to suggest grain-free.

Are there articles about why a grain-free diet is suggested for dogs? Are there any All Stages or Puppy Foods that are not grain-free that people would recommend?

The puppy will be 8 weeks old when we pick her up.

Brands that I am leaning toward are:

Merrick
Fromm
Dr. Tim (not available near me, but can special order)
Wellness
Earthborn
Kirkland Signature

Appreciate feedback and open to other suggestions.

LilyH

[scottNY]

Thanks, Patty. A few follow-up questions for you and/or others:

1 – Can you recommend any good, not too expensive Omega-3 products? I know human supplements are often cheaper, but not necessarily okay for a dog.
2 – I just ordered a coconut oil I use on my skin in the winter time. It is edible, so I assume that will be fine to give my puppy a little here and there.
3 – Again, can you recommend any good, not too expensive “green food” products?
4 – Same as above. I would appreciate suggestions.
5 – As I said in my post, I ordered the Dr. Stephen Langer’s Ultimate 15 Strain Probiotic I read about here and he starts it tomorrow. Can I open it and give it every other day? Is every day too much?

Thanks Patty!

[Juana]

Thank you!!!! Yes, I like to know the list of animal products and by-products suppliers for that particular brand. The vet prescribed it and after reading many posts here I like to know more about it or, even better, find an alternative among the 5 stars brands. I have two dogs with cancer, one with a very sensitive digestive system and two overweight, recently adopted.

[scottNY]

Hi All,

I posted this elsewhere yesterday, but I think it makes sense here, too. I have read so much good information here that my head is spinning. I am trying to find a reasonable balance between time, effort and cost while maximizing my puppy’s health. I suspect I am not the only one.

HDM, when you have time, would you please summarize what is “necessary” other than a good quality food to raise a healthy puppy? I live in a New York city apartment with a tiny kitchen and my income is limited. I don’t want to cheap out on my puppy, but I find it is too easy to go overboard, too. I put necessary in quotes because I understand it is an opinion, but you clearly know what you are talking about and I am hoping you can help me find an optimal balance.

I have tentatively limited the options to just a few. They can be found in my original post, for which I put the link instead of cutting and pasting. I don’t want to be thought of as a spammer. My comment is post #24191.

I look forward to feedback and hope this is helpful to others!

/forums/topic/prebiotics-probiotics-and-enzymes-oh-my/page/5/

[scottNY]

Hi all and thanks for all the info. I am a little overwhelmed, but hopefully my “summary” question will help others.

I am the proud parent of a 7 month, 60 lb pit mix puppy who came from a rescue. After following this thread, I have just switched his food from TOTW grain-free puppy to the 5-star Nature’s Variety Instinct Rabbit. Thanks, HDM, for the Recommended Large Breed Puppy Foods spreadsheet. It was a wonderful tool!

Now here is where I am confused. I am trying to not go overboard on supplements [limited income] but want to make sure my puppy grows in to a very happy and healthy dog. Now that he is eating five star food, what else does he need? He already takes the Vetri-Science Laboratories Chicken Canine Plus Supplement for Pets, which he loves. He will also be taking the Vetri-Science Glyco-Flex for joints since when he plays and jumps very rough, he sometimes limps a little for a few hours – better safe than sorry. I want to make sure his joints have what they need as he grows.

Also, since following this thread [or a similar one here] I ordered the Dr. Stephen Langer’s Ultimate 15 Strain Probiotic, which amazon.com will deliver today and he will begin it today. So here are my questions, although comments on what I wrote previously are more than welcome, too!

1. With the Stephen Langer’s Ultimate 15 Strain Probiotic, does he get one capsule daily? Open and sprinkled on food or closed?

2. How important is coconut oil? If I give it to him, how often and how much per day?

3. My puppy now eats the recommended grain-free Nature’s Variety Instinct Rabbit, along with occasional pieces of allowed fruits and vegetables twice daily.
A. Does he need an enzyme?
B. I see several people commenting on the Swanson enzyme for humans. I certainly like the cost and I know it is a quality product. Should I get him that, too?
C. If so, again, how much and how often? Is it fine to take out of the capsule if he won’t swallow the capsule?

Thanks in advance HDM and others. I am trying to find that elusive middle ground and I appreciate all your help!

[DogFoodie]

Hi Marie,

Sorry Boone is still having problems. : (

I can hear my vet at my recent visit for Sam’s yeasty ears, telling me to feed him Darwin’s full time. Is that an option? It’s not for me.

You said Boone is eating potato right now, right? I think I’d eliminate that for sure and either try Zeal full-time to see if it resolves like you mentioned or maybe try something completely different. I tell you, I was shocked and what great luck I had feeding Sam Horizon Legacy. He seems to be doing really well on Earthborn’s Great Plains Feast right now, also. He still does the occasional flap of the ears, which always gets my attention, but when I peek inside, they seem to be clear. He doesn’t show that he’s bored (though he may well be), but getting him clear and stabilized is my priority.

I believe I exacerbated Sam’s ear this most recent time with the Zymox. I used the Zymox with Bio-Active Enzymes. I used it once at night and the next day when I went to use it again, his ear was very red inside. I didn’t use it again and the vet actually said that Sam’s ear infection was limited to the outer ear canal (she said it looked like the Zymox burned his ear). I did recently pick up a bottle of Halo ~ it seems like a lot of others have mentioned that they use it [for cleaning] with good results.

I’m also hoping that the Curcu-VET he’s been taking will help resolve some of his yeast issues as well. I know you were interested in it, but I don’t recall if it was for Boone or Ginger. Here’s a link to Thorne’s product page: http://veterinary.thorne.com/articles/introducing-curcuvet.jsp

Also, what about a visit to a vet who practices TCVM, unless you already are and one of these folks happens to be your vet: http://search.tcvm.com/vetFinding.asp?qtype=state

[sfranklin]

I am trying to figure out where to start with the whole homemade food idea. My dogs itch non-stop and I really believe it is from their commercial dog food. Any suggestions on supplements to make sure I have a balanced diet? I saw on Amazon something called Wizpet dog food supplement, I haven’t been able to find anything about it. If anyone could point me in the right direction as to where I can find out more information on supplements that would be wonderful. I am leaning towards the cooked dog food, my dogs now love all raw veggies and fruit (the ones they are allowed to have) so that I don’t have a problem with, I just don’t know if I can do the raw food personally, I may be a little squeamish. Could I do cooked (rare) protein and then raw everything else? I have been reading so much on here I think I am in information overload and am lost as to where to start. Thanks for your time!

[Anonymous]

Ha ha… I have been to a concert at the end of Lake Winnapausakee… can’t remember the place but right where the bikers convene.
I just cooked some fish and potatoes as per Dr Dodds recipe. I am reading a book by M Goldstein called The Nature of Animal Healing… very good read and makes me feel much better… a holistic and conventional Dr. A great chapter now ‘the spiritual realm’… I do believe such things and he has gotten me in a better place now… and so will Lily be! Got to stay positive, which I usually am but my dogs ill health is testing me. It occurs to me now the vet visit and Xrays seemed to have made her sicker… sighs…
Thanks for the note and mentioning to email Dr Dodds… I feel I have things under control but may do that anyway. I did email Dr Goldstein but have not heard back as of yet… was just yesterday…

[Hound Dog Mom]

I can only speak from my personal experiences. Last summer I ordered a bag of BB biscuits from Pet Food Direct and when I opened the bag there were bugs (the product wasn’t expired and there were no holes in the bag that I could see). A month or so later I purchase a bag of their cat food at a local feed store and when I opened it there was white mold all over the food (wasn’t expired and I couldn’t see where it had gotten wet). That same summer my friend got a new golden retriever puppy and tried to transition her to BB – the dog got really bad diarrhea and it cleared up as soon as she took the dog off BB. I then started reading on the negative reviews on this site and other sites and haven’t touched a BB product since. It’s too bad because they used to make really great stuff – I fed my cats BB for years. The company has really gone downhill though – imo.

[Mavis]

Hi! This was requested by some people I was chatting with so here goes nothing! 🙂 So if you have not been in on the chat on the review of the Grain Free Merrick Dog Food here is the link I am of course Mavis: /dog-food-reviews/before-grain-dog-food-dry/
Any way here is some info on my dog Hogan. He is a male German Shephard/ Labrador mix. He weighs around 90-95 lbs. meaning he is around 15- 20 lbs overweight. He is almost 8 years old. This started when I was looking to buy him a better food. I had originally fed him Pedigree. After reading the ingredients and how bad they were I am now on the hunt for a better food. So I need you pet owners to help me come up with a couple weight loss methods and I’ll be very happy to try them out. Just to let you know try and be creative and please no walks/ bike riding, my dog has anxiety and refuses to go too far from the house. Lastly any suggestions on ways to ease his anxiety and help him go a little farther from the house, with him he will not walk if he can’t see the house anymore. Thank you so much!!!
-Mavis

[cdubau]

Hello everyone! My name is Carla and I’m the mom of three pups. Emma and Kelsey are my older girls. They are both about 7 and my new pup, Bode, is about 4 months now. We have had him about three weeks now. On our first vet visit the doc explained how too much calcium was a bad thing for large breeds and while I had looked to this site 5/6 years ago I decided to check it out again! Anywho we don’t really know what breed Bode is but he looks like possibly a Dobi, Black and Tan hound or rotti mix. Basically he will be big and he’s Black and Tan lol.

I have read the literature provided and done hours of research as to what brands are available with prices in my area. I dont feel I have many affordable options. I’m left with a couple questions probably due to confusion. We have fed our dogs Nutro in past since it was what we could afford but recently switched our older dogs to taste of the wild. Looking at the information of their website it lists their Nutro MAX large breed puppy as having a Min 1.00 and a Max of 1.5 for Calcium and caloric energy is 3580kcal/kg and 347 kcal/cup. **which number am I supposed to compare the calcium to when doing my own research? And the phosphorus should be half of that or double that? I don’t want to feed him nutro it’s just a brand I am familiar with.

My petsmart is fairly small. It only stocks Blue (and petsmarts Simply Nourish brand), Caster and Pollux, and Wellness as higher end brands. It also carries Royal Canin. There are a couple local pet stores that carry Taste of the Wild, Premiun Edge, Chicken Soup FTDLS, Holistic, Innova, Victor and Blackgold–in very limited selections. Driving an hour away adds Halo, Natures Variety, Nutricsource and By Nature (only ocean fish). Some of those brands are really out of my price range such as Halo, Wellness and Royal Canin. Also Newmans Own. I’m very leery of buying online to several fraud issues I’ve had in the last couple years causing me to change entire account numbers.

I want to feel my new pup the best that I can afford but times are tight.

Thank you in advance for any help.

Carla.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by cdubau. Reason: Adding

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Kobe’s Dad –

Yellow mucousy indicates that the stool is moving quickly through the intestines and it could be caused by a few different things. It could definitely indicate giardia, it could also be insufficient pancreatic enzymes, increased bilirubin (a breakdown product formed in the liver) or a food intolerace/allergy. “Greasy” stool usually is associated with malabsorption. There’s really no way for anyone here to tell you for sure what the issue is – this really is something that should be discussed with your vet. Your vet didn’t have anything to offer concerning these problems aside from having him tested for giardia?

No one can tell you exactly how much your dog should eat, however 3 cups per day for a 5 1/2 month old dog that’s already 80 pounds doesn’t sound like nearly enough. I start with what the bag recommends and adjust from there based on his body condition.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[kobe]

TO HOUND DOG MOM AND PATTY,

I need your educated opinions on 2 issues

first, my bernese puppy-5 and 1/2 months old came to me from California Memorial Day weekend-diagnosed with giardia 3 days later he has been treated 2 times with the combination of metronidazole and panacur—the second treatment occurred in the setting of a negative stool test BUT the specimen submitted was several hours old before brought in to the vets office –i treated him because his diarrhea the second time was exactly the same as the first time—yellow and greasy–he got better but 2 weeks later-on monday 8/26–he again developed yellow ,greasy diarrhea–the stool specimen at 4am obtained was brought to the ANIMAL Medical Center in nyc 3 hours later–the specimen results 2 days later was negative–in the 2 days waiting ,he was started back on the same combination-metronidazole and panacur with a significant improvement in 3 days—this most recent episode ,he vomited twice during the night as well–12 hrs a fter his last meal-dinner– and afterleaving the Medical Center he had yellowish diarrhea with undigested rice seen in it—-that i put in his kibble 12 hrs prior–this was brown rice from a local chinese restaurant—previously, i only gave white rice but i was told brown rice was more binding——
to give you a little more information,icalled a human lab-QUEST-and was told a stool specimen would not be accepted unless placed in a container of theirs prepared with their preservatives so to speak———therefore the pup diarrhea clinically seems like giardia is the cause but the stool is negative—-do you guys think that the time delay before processing has led to a false negative result?
other possibilities are inflammatory bowel disease or pancreatic insufficiency which i cant believe—i am an adult cardiologist in nyc and all people with the above conditions are skinny and unhealthy looking !!–my pup is already 80 lbs at 5 and 1/2 months–hardly the appearance of an animal not absorbing nutrients from a chronic illness?
in summary, do you think that yellow greasy diarrhea could be caused by anything other than giardia?

my second issue is nutrition–Kobe is back on Hills i and d kibble-actually since i stopped NATURES VARIETY LARGE BREED PUPPY KIBBLE 2 weeks ago due to diarrhea-he has been on this I AND D—how long should i wait before transitioning him to better kibble given this weeks illness–antibiotics will be completed on september 5th?AND i have decide to use ZIGNATURE kibble–here is the problem: my breeders handout reads to use 1 cup of kibble 3x/day until 6 months of age then use 2 cups 2x/day after 6 months of age—the zignature company has recommended to give my pup 5 CUPS OF THEIR KIBBLE PER DAY!!
I am not an expert in nutrition-can you advise me how much i shoud give my pup of this kibble before 6 months of age but more importantly after 6 months—i dont know if their is a reason based on calories why 5 cups/day is recommended–i dont want to harm Kobe if i feed him only 3 cups/day
I APPRECIATE ANY AND ALL ADVICE-unfortunately, i know much about human hearts BUT very little about yellow,greasy diarrhea nor about how much of this ZIGNATURE TO FEED

THANKS SO MUCH,
KOBE’S DAD

[Anonymous]

Thanks, Patty! I apprecite your quick response. He has been getting about 3 tablespoons of pure pumpkin twice a day in his Kongs with diced apple or, more usually, kibble mixed in. Why add probiotics when the higher quality kibble is already coated with it? Are there not sufficient amounts on the food, or do you want different strains? I think I saw another forum on probiotics – I’ll have to go take a look. I didn’t mean to imply my vet was totally guessing in her diagnosis, just that she was basing it on my report and not on anything she saw herself. I did think my description was pretty textbook (though they didn’t look flat to me), and I do have a lot of faith in her, but it’s nice when the pros can see it themselves. I will take a closer look at the Earthborn. I originally ruled it out because it was at the high end of allowable calcium for a LBP, but I guess under 3.5 is under 3.5… I would also like to find a good canned food to use in Kongs as a break from pumpkin, but it doesn’t look like Earthborn makes one, and I should probably get the kibble issue sorted out before I add anything else new.

[Anonymous]

Hi everyone. I’m looking for suggestions for my 11-week-old Golden Retriever. He weighs 20 pounds, and is a healthy weight- can feel ribs and see a waist. Our vet says that he looks great, and if we weren’t reporting problems she would think him completely healthy. He came from the breeder at 8 weeks with Iams puppy food for small/toy breeds (!) and we immediately started switching him to Fromm Large Breed Puppy. His stools immediately got soft, with frequent diarrhea and a few incidences of bloody diarrhea. Our vet thought it was stress and treated with metronidazole, which showed temporary improvement but never really got his stool firm. A couple days ago I saw what I thought looked like worms in 2 bowel movements: rice-like, segmented, pale yellow, and profuse! Unfortunately, I didn’t think of saving a sample for the vet until after I’d disposed of it, and the later samples I took in tested negative. Based on my description, and the fact that he has already had Heartgard, they are assuming tapeworm, though at 11 weeks old I’m not sure where he would have gotten them. We visited him weekly from 8 days old, and his mom and litter mates never had fleas, and he’s never been off-leash to eat a rodent! So as of yesterday we are back on metronidazole, plus panacur dewormer, and he’s eating Purina prescription diet EN, which is almost entirely rice and corn, with just 23% protein and 10% fat. Only 18 hours after the switch, his stools are completely firmed up. Obviously we can’t keep him on this long-term, though. The vet said after 5 days we should start to transition back to regular food, and suggested perhaps something with fewer protein sources since the Fromm’s has duck, chicken, fish and lamb. So, in your much-respected opinions, should I give the Fromm’s a second chance, or go to another new thing? I want to stick with one of Hound Dog Mom’s recommended kibbles, but am of rather limited means. The breeder had recommended TOTW, but I would really prefer to avoid anything from Diamond. If environment might suggest another problem, we are in upstate New York. Thanks so much!

[DogFoodie]

I’m ready for cool weather, too. It’s been hot and humid here and the weeds are growing like crazy. They look so pretty along the roadside, covered in white, blue and yellow flowers, but are wreaking havoc on me. I have seasonal allergies and a couple of nights ago, totally out of nowhere, they’re horrible.

So, my first guess for your pup would be seasonal allergies. Wonder if a more holistic remedy, such as local honey or bee pollen might help. Too bad you can’t use a Neti Pot on a pup. : ) Unfortunately, Benadryl help mine the most and I can only take it once a day, at bedtime, or I’m wired for days on end; and the only thing that really helps is moving through the seasons.

[somebodysme]

I wouldn’t feed sweet potatoes to an allergy dog…after reading Plechner’s articles about dog allergies. It can make things worse. I would get the food you were feeding before and feed that and take him off the NB that is causing so much issues. He will have to have antibiotics if it gets too bad! Those rashes get infected.

If the food you were feeding is not a good quality food, try and find a better quality ingredients but that is similar to your old food. That’s what I would do. There’s nothing worse than allergies in a dog to deal with…it’s very frustrating! But main thing, get him off that NB NOW!

[theBCnut]

I’ve read all his stuff and there is nothing I can point to that says he doesn’t know what he is talking about. I did notice a couple very small things that I chalked up to typo/not proofing. I could easily apply what he said to my dog with issues, except I don’t know how it all ties in when you can get everything back in order without ever knowing your dog has that problem. But if his issues ever go whacko again when I know I’m doing everything right, I’ll have him tested, because at that point I would be ready to believe anything. So, I can’t say he is right, but I definitely can’t say he is wrong.

[JLezinsky]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,

We have been wanting to switch our pup to a raw food diet for a while now. We have been doing tons of reading on this forum and research and decided to start with a pre-made raw mix while we figured out how to add more from scratch.

Last weekend at our local pet store the owners of Sirius Raw Dog Food (a small company from Ruby, NY) were out front talking about their product. I was wondering if anyone has heard or more importantly used their food? We decided to give it a try and start or 8 month old Catahoula (40 lbs) on it. We switched her cold turkey without any problem, in fact she went crazy for it. However, the more I read on this form the more excited I get about making good food for her, but at the same time the more overwhelming this starts to seem. Our biggest concern right now is that she is getting the proper nutrition and the correct amounts of food. Sirius told us that she will be good with 2% her body weight, about 1lb a day. And that everything she needs is in the food. We started giving her ½ lb twice a day. It has only been a few days and it is hard to tell if she’s hungry or just wants more because it is so good. Yesterday we increased her feeding to ¾ lb twice a day. Since she is only 8 months should she be giving her more than 2-3%? Sirius told us that she was considered an adolescent. I just want to get your opinion.

Also, should we be using any additional supplements while we stay on the Sirius pre-made mix? Should we be concerned about the calcium while on this?

I figured this was the best place to get answers. I appreciate any help you can give us.

Thanks,
Jon

There is not a lot of information on their site so I attached the nutritional info. that they had emailed to me. They have a few blends, a chicken, a beef, a turkey.

beef blend….Ingredients: Beef, Chicken Bones, Beef Heart, Beef Liver, Sweet Potato, Carrots, Zucchini, Romaine Lettuce, Spinach, Cilantro, Parsley, Ginger Root, Garlic
Guaranteed analysis: crude protein, min 16.00%; crude fat, min 14.00%, crude fiber, max 00.30%; moisture, max 64.00%

http://www.siriusrawdogfood.com

[somebodysme]

Just something you may want to think about, What about rosemary extract? I just read about this being an issue for some dogs and it seems like they are putting it in so many foods. May want to investigate that possibility and see if there is any relationship to that ingredient and stomach issues. Some dogs can become violently ill from something like tomatoes.

[somebodysme]

I only recently read an article by Dr. Plechner who appears to be the pioneer of creating dog food for allergies and tests for allergies etc. Is anyone familiar with Dr. Plechner and his work and is this man truly a dog allergy expert as it would seem.

One thing that stands out is that he is saying that dogs with allergies should not be given sweet potatoes and you should try regular potatoes. Sweet potatoes contain estrogen which causes more allergies. He explains but I have ZERO medical training so it doesn’t really make sense to me. I mean it makes sense but I don’t understand the clinical part of it. He says that dog food manufacturers have put sweet potatoes to appeal to the humans that are buying the food and is not the best thing for dog food allergies and they can actually make things much worse.

He also talks of an issue in today’s dogs called “Plechner’s syndrone” which is a hormone imbalance which he claims is responsible for much of the dog food allergies we are seeing today. It has been brought on my breeding practices as best I can make out, according to him. He says that we should have our allergy dogs tested for this first thing if they are having lots of allergies. It can be treated, apparently with hormone therapy.

Here is a link to one article which is on Dr. Plechner’s website:
http://drplechner.com/learn/allergies/dog-food-allergies/

It is rather eye opening if he really does know what he’s talking about. Anyone know of his work and how valid it really is?

[InkedMarie]

bkagel: If you go to the front page of this thread, on the top, I have a stickie with grain & potato free foods. A few things I want to point out: shopping at Pet Co isn’t always the best place to find foods. They don’t carry the best selection when you’re looking for something specific, such as grain/potato free foods. I know nothing about Pet People and can’t help you there.

Shopping online is sometimes your best place to find alot of foods that you can’t find locally. I suggest looking at wag.com, PetFlow.com, Chewy.com, for starters, for places to order from. These three offer free shipping if you spend a certain nominal amount. If you look at the stickie and find some foods you think may work, check those sites. Their websites have store locators and probably have a list of internet places that sell their products as well.

Regarding looking for samples: I don’t suggest that. It can take anywhere from 2-4 weeks to know if a food will work for your dog. Unless you have a dog that you know can go from one food to another without problems (yours does not sound like that), you should transition from one food to another over a 5-7 day period. Then, it can be the 2-4 weeks after that to know. Samples won’t be enough food to know, even the smallest bags (4-5 pounders) aren’t even enough, even with a Papillion.

Hopefully others can chime in on possible IBS. If it’s a yeast overload, dogs can go through a detox period where they seem to get worse, then better.

[apriliamille]

yay for doberpuppies
the thread pattyvaughn mentions is a good read. also when you click on the google docs pdf link around page 15 make sure and book mark it so you can reference it later. i dont want to violate any rights of hound dog mom and re paste the link with out her permission

imo feeding from a recall company is a crap shoot and the lottery. the odds of it happening are probably slim, but if the odds show up i hope im not the one and i definitely would regret it for a long time (thus why i skip the dog food aisle at Costco) if i am the one

i would look at the doc and then open up petflow.com (their website has a price per pound display) and chewy.com and do some price and ingredient comparisons then check their analysis on this site and not stress about local purchase. there are quite a few good foods at various price points on the list. most of the online shops will free ship above 50 dollar purchases. find a couple that interest you and maybe try a sample or two as we all have our favorite brands and im sure they pretty much wont all zero in the exact same 1-5 brand and types. also maybe search on dobermantalk website in the feeding section for some more ideas

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by apriliamille. Reason: content
• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by apriliamille.