[BryanV21]

It’s better to buy a good adult food and then add supplements to that. Most dry dog food makers add supplements to their food before cooking, and the food is cooked at such a high temperature that the supplements are all but gone.

Besides, wouldn’t you and/or your vet rather control the amount of supplements in a dog’s food, rather than having somebody else do it for you?

[DieselJunki]

I would supplement with a hip and joint supplement anyways. Especially since you said she was or is having issues.

Here are a few companies that I’ve looked into and I’ve heard of others using.
Welly Tails
Vet’s Best
K9 Joint Strong
Mercola

And also a link to a thread I had started that has good information from Hound Dog Mom on joint supplements.
/forums/topic/mercola-joint-supplement-vs-others/

As far as a food similar to Acana I’m not sure on that.

If it was me I would just find a good dog food high in protein, low in fat (since you said she was overweight) and add the hip and joint supplement instead of trying to find a food you think might have the appropriate levels to support healthy joints along with low fat and high protein. But I am certainly no expert so perhaps others will chime in.

[tarancara]

Actually, like humans dogs CAN thrive on the right vegan diet. Many people say that humans MUST eat meat- which is very untrue. But the supplements used for dog health are different than human health. I knew a vegan family that raised German shepherds and their dogs were on a highly researched vegan diet and were GORGEOUS healthy dogs who all lived long lives. Unfortunately I am not in contact with these folks anymore.. Vegan diets can be done well or dangerously bad for both humans and animals alike. Most people who say it can’t be done havent seen a good example of it.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Cate –

I agree, some supplements are harmful in excess. However, glucosamine, chondroitin and hyaluronic acid are very safe supplements. They can be consumed at many times the daily dose with no ill effects. The amounts in food are very low with most having only around 400 mg. glucosamine per kilogram of food – this equates to a mere 30 or so mg. per cup (just to give you an idea – a 50 lb. dog would have to eat over 30 cups of dog food a day just to get a maintenance dose of glucosamine). Dogs that are eating a natural diet rich in bones, cartilage and sinew would naturally be consuming these nutrients in very high levels (higher than anything in dry dog food). I’ve never heard of a dog “overdosing” on GAG’s.

[Anonymous]

Please be careful with supplements as some food and treats have glucosamine, chondroitin, hydraulic acid. Sometimes more is not better and overdoing could have a negative effect.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi DieselJunki –

Glycosaminoglycans (GAGs) are important constituents of cartilage and help to maintain joint function. GAG’s and GAG precursors would include glucosamine, chondroitin and hyaluronic acid. MSM, which is an organic form of the essential mineral sulfur, can be beneficial for joints as well due to the fact that connective tissues require sulfur for maintenance. Cetyl Myristoleate is a supplement that’s recently gained popularity as a joint supplement and has been shown to lubricate joints and maintain function. Whole food supplements that are rich in GAGs are sea cucumber, green lipped mussel, shark cartilage and eggshell membrane. Raw meaty bones are rich in GAGs as well – with trachea, poultry feet and gullet probably being the richest sources. I feel that large/giant breed dogs that are not fed a diet including raw meaty bones on a daily basis should be started on a joint maintenance supplement at a year old (until the dog is a senior or starts to exhibit joint issues the supplement can be given at half the recommended dose). When it comes to joint supplements if you buy supplements made for humans they will be MUCH cheaper per dose. The ingredients used in human supplements are the same as those used in dog supplements so there’s no reason human supplements can’t be used (they’re probably higher quality as well). For a young dog with no joint issues there’s no reason to supplement with every beneficial ingredient under the sun – a capsule of green lipped mussel, shark cartilage, sea cucumber or eggshell membrane or a basic glucosamine/chondroitin supplement will give enough maintenance support to a young dog free of joint issues. For older dogs or dogs that are exhibiting symptoms of arthritis natural anti-inflammatories such as white willow, yucca, boswellia, turmeric/curcumin, tart cherry and supplemental omega 3’s can be beneficial to give in addition to a joint maintenance supplement.

[Shihtzumom20]

Thank you Hound Dog Mom! I got all his supplements today and I get his food tomorrow, and then we are ready to go. I really appreciate you taking the time to look at the website and help me make sure it is balanced. And for your supplement blend, is that 1/2 a tsp each of everything or 1/2 a tsp of everything that has been all mixed together?

[Hound Dog Mom]

I love Swanson’s. I recently discovered them a few months ago when I was looking for some supplements for myself, I liked the stuff I got so much I just ordered over $200 of supplements for the dogs the day before yesterday. I don’t give the dogs supplemental probiotics or enzymes but when I ordered their stuff I got “Swanson Ultra Soil Based Organisms” supplement for myself – 5 digestive enzymes, 15 soil-based probiotics, barley/oat/wheat grass juice and a 15 vegetable concentrate. Sounds healthy, would be great for a dog too that needed enzymes and probiotics – only 11 cents per capsule!

[Mom2Cavs]

I agree with HDM….but, even though I sometimes use human supplements most of the time I use those made for dogs. Like HDM I also mix into their food for both meals. Lucy is taking a urinary supplement atm, though, that is a soft chew so I don’t have to mix that in. And definitely check all ingredients for dog safety. Another note, when I buy dog supplements I usually do so at a pet specialty store (generally big box stores don’t have the brands I want) or I order them online. http://www.onlynaturalpet.com is a good site for supplements. Most of the dog supplements I buy have the NASC seal on them but not all. Hope this helps some more. 🙂

[DieselJunki]

I know Moose is only 4 months right now BUT I’ve been doing some research about hips and large breed dogs. Doing some Googling I’ve read quite a few people recommend giving a joint supplement even if there are no joint problems in their dog, even starting as young as puppies. Now I have been on a Mercola supplement kick because they seem so well put together and are very well talked about here. They pretty much have me sold on the Hip Supplement but I just wanted to check in here and hear about other people’s experiences with hip and joint supplements.

Now correct me if I’m wrong but when looking for a joint supplement that maintains the hips you would be looking for things with: msm, glucosamine, chondroitin, hydraulic acid.

So far the one’s I have looked into are:
Welly Tails
Vet’s Best
K9 Joint Strong
Mercola

These all seemed to have those 4 things I mentioned up there. Some seemed more for arthritic dogs or dogs that already had painful joints and others seemed better at just being hip and joint maintenance.

[DieselJunki]

I know of quite a few people that have spoken well about the Mercola Pro-Biotics and Digestive Enzymes. I would use both on my dog but they are currently out of stock on the Enzymes. I know I also feed my dog Trippet (green beef tripe), Answer’s Goats Milk, and Kefir. All of these have some form of Enzymes and such in them. Kefir is really good if you can find it. Hound Dog Mom suggests it a lot and can be beneficial to any dogs diet. I of course switch up between the Kefir and Goats Milk but always add the Enzymes and Pro-Biotics to my dogs food. I split the daily dosages for the supplements up for his feedings.

Now as for whether this would fix the case of your dogs intestinal sensitivities and bad gas I am not sure as I have never had a dog that has had those issues. But it never hurts to add Enzymes and Pro-Biotics to any dogs diet.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Supplements can come in capsules, tablets, softgels, liquids or powders. I personally prefer powders or powder filled capsules I can open up, I like to mix everything into the food. For most supplements it’s best to divide the recommended amount between breakfast and dinner. Some supplements have to be acquired through a veterinarian, others can be purchased from pet food stores. I personally get all of my dogs’ supplements from human supplement suppliers (Swanson, Puritan’s Pride, Drugstore.com, etc.). I feel that supplements sold for humans are higher quality and (oddly enough) they generally cost less per dose than supplements for pets. The dosage obviously needs to be scaled down (if you have a 25 lb. dog you’d give approx. 1/4 the recommended human dose, 1/2 for a 50 lb. dog, etc.) and for some supplements you’ll need to check all the ingredients to make sure they’re all safe for dogs.

[bluetry35722]

You have been so awesome with all of your help. I have a question though. I get confused when I hear the word ‘supplement.’ What form are the supplements in (i.e. pills, liquids, etc?) And are they administered once daily or with each meal, etc. Do you get your babies’ supplements from their vet or from stores like PetSmart?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Shihtzumom20 –

I just checked out Big Country Raw’s website – I’m jealous that you can get this food, the price is great! $2.50/lb. for pre-mixed food is very reasonable. I’m not too far from some of the retailers (I’m on the Canadian border) unfortunately I think a law was passed recently making it illegal to transport pet food across the border.

I can’t find a statement of nutritional adequacy on the website and it does appear there are a few things missing that you will need to supplement to make the food balanced. First of all, yes you will want to add omega 3’s as there aren’t any added to the food. Follow the dosage chart I posted previously. Second, after reading the ingredients for each of their foods I can tell you that there are inadequate levels of vitamin e and vitamin d. Vitamin e is difficult to supply in adequate quantities through food alone and therefore should be supplemented. It will be especially critical that you supplement with vitamin e once you start adding omega 3’s as consumption of omega 3’s increases the the fat soluble antioxidant requirement. As a general rule supplement about 50 I.U. vitamin e per 20 lbs. If you get capsules with a high dosage (most come in 200 IU or 400 IU) you can just give one whole capsule 2-3 times per week. For the vitamin d, there is some vitamin d in beef liver (about 50 IU per 4 oz.), but not all of the formulas contain beef liver and even for the formulas that do, I doubt that there is enough to fulfill vitamin d requirements. Vitamin d can be added in supplement form or (more preferably) in whole food form. Some foods that are rich in vitamin d: cod liver oil (~400 IU per tsp.), cage free eggs (~30-50 IU per egg), Kefir (~100 IU per cup), oily fish (amount of vitamin d present varies on the type of fish but sardines, mackerel and salmon are generally considered good sources), some varieties of plain yogurt and cottage cheese are supplemented with vitamin d (check the label). Your dog should be getting about 200 IU vitamin D per pound of food consumed. Also, rotate between all their protein sources – don’t rely on one – this will provide him with the greatest balance. You may also want to consider adding another whole food supplement, I see kelp is is added to a few of the varieties. Kelp is great and supplies a lot of trace nutrients but the more variety the better, especially when a dog is deriving all of their nutrition from whole foods and not relying on synthetically added vitamins and minerals. My dogs get kelp and they also get things like spirulina, alfalfa, wheat grass, bee pollen, chlorella, etc. I switch up their supplements frequently. It says they offer a vitamin/mineral supplement but it doesn’t list the ingredients, you could check that out.

Yes, RMB’s are a wonderful source of glucosamine and chondroitin. Because he’s young and he’s a small breed not prone to joint issues, RMB’s should provide all the joint support he needs for now. I wouldn’t worry about a joint supplement until he’s a senior.

[Mom2Cavs]

I have Cavaliers, who by nature of the breed, can have heart problems. One of mine has a murmur, last time assessed at a grade 2. As far as I know, atm, the other one is currently fine. My oldest was heart clear until about 10 years old and then I was told she had a grade 5 murmur and probably heart disease. She actually never really had any problems of note, though, with her heart. She just recently passed to the bridge at 12 years old, but it wasn’t her heart….she had a neurological disease (SM) that Cavs also are prone to and that caused her death. Actually, having a Cavalier reach double digits in age is great! Anyway, on to your question……while I don’t feed a “heart diet” I do try to feed as top of the line food as I can (which my holistic vet is fine with). I know that prey raw or homemade is probably the best, but either is not my choice. I have fed a variety of different kinds of food over the years. I’ve fed premade raw, freeze dried raw, dehydrated raw, canned and kibble. I’m currently feeding Acana Singles (Duck & Pear or Lamb & Apple) topped with either Primal or Stella & Chewy’s freeze dried raw or The Honest Kitchen Embark. Sometimes I top with canned foods like Instinct, Wellness Stews, Weruva, etc. I was using Merrick grain free kibble until I had an issue with a bag of the Pork grain free (strange looking and colored kibble pieces caused diarrhea). I’ve also used Merrick canned but have decided to go away from them, too, as they contain carageenan, and ingredient I’m not too comfortable with. I do know about BPA in cans, as well, and that’s why I like the freeze dried or THK. With each kind of food I have often supplemented with a heart targeted supplement (again at the advice of my holistic vet, who btw carries Nature’s Variety in his clinic). Some of my favorites are: Bio Cardio, Cardio Strength, Nature’s Farmacy heartwise and Standard Process Cardio Support. I’ve also given pre/probiotics and enzymes which I think can’t hurt. The heart supplements often contain things like COQ10, hawthorn, taurine, L-Carnitine and omega 3’s. You could also supplement these things individually. Please note that I’m not a vet, but a furmom with babies that more often than not have heart issues. I hope this helps some and gives you something to think about. 🙂

[Anonymous]

I am by no means a canine nutritionist, merely someone who has put a bit of thought into what I feed mine. My knowledge is not specific to the medical condition and sensitivity of your dog. The guidelines that I found with a superficial online search for cardiac diet were:
– Provide your pet a high-quality natural meat-based diet with at least 25-30% protein (DM basis)
– Make sure your pet LIKES the food so that (s)he consumes enough calories to maintain BMI
– Mild to moderate sodium restriction (severe restriction in advanced cases)
– Supplements: omega 3 fatty acids, taurine, carnitine, B vitamins and Magnesium.
http://www.1800petmeds.com/education/diet-tips-pet-heart-disease-32.htm

I am going to assume that you are looking for a dry kibble based on your previous food choice. I feel that the top of the line dry kibble RIGHT NOW is Orijen. However, it does retail for $80/35lb. As I feed about 400 lb of dog, the budgetary compromise at my house is Merrick Grain Free at roughly $50/35lb.

Prior to Merrick Grain Free, I was feeding Taste of the Wild, but have decided that I prefer Merrick for not entirely nutrition-based reasons. While the protein content is slightly higher and the starch from sweet potato (rather than white), they are reasonably equivalent foods (in nutrition and price). However, Merrick uses all US-sourced ingredients (nothing from China). This is a political issue and safety concern of mine. The larger scale pet recall in 2007 due to melamine contamination was traced to Chinese product, and the more recent Petco recall of stainless steel bowls manufactured with radioactive Cobalt-60 scrap was most likely (while never publicly disclosed) of Chinese origin. Merrick also happens to be manufactured in Texas, where I live. Those variables may not factor into your decision at all, but are important to me.

I could not find a cardiac specific diet offered by Hill’s in their Science Diet or Prescription Diet lines and based my quick comparison on the Adult Advanced Fitness formula. The Advanced Mobility contained more Omega 3’s and Magnesium, but was lower in protein and higher in sodium. Orijen appears to be the best choice, but may not be an option for you dependent on your personal budget. Merrick Grain Free is my compromise, but is based on a few tertiary considerations that may not matter to you. I will be interested to hear what other posters have to contribute. (The following information was retrieved from those companies’ official website product pages and is as vague or detailed as they provided.) The summary comparison is this:

Hill’s Merrick Orijen
Protein 24.2 38 38
Fat 16.4 17 17
Carbohydrate 51.5 ? 25
Sodium 0.32 ? 0.4
Omega-3 Fatty Acids 0.67 0.4 1.1
Omega-6 Fatty Acids 3.33 4.8 3.0
Taurine (yes) ? 0.35
Carnitine ? ? ?
B Vitamins
B1 – Thiamine (yes) (yes) 0.9 mg/kg or 50 mg/kg?
B2 – Riboflavin ? (yes) 45 mg/kg
B3 – Niacin (yes) (yes) 450 mg/kg
B5 – Pantothenic Acid ? (yes) 50 mg/kg
B6 – Pyridoxine ? (yes) 38 mg/kg
B7 – Biotin ? (yes) 1 mg/kg
B9 – Folic Acid (yes) (yes) 5.2 mg/kg
B12 – Cobalamins (yes) (yes) 50 mg/kg
Magnesium 0.099 ? 0.1

Since the foods that I mentioned are simply those that I am familiar with and not anything that I originally researched with cardiac issues in mind, I would recommend that you use this as a springboard for your own research. Maybe there is a better option in Innova EVO, Artemis, etc. Finish out a chart similar to that above on each of the brands that this website lists as top-tier choices. Feel free to call companies like Merrick or Hill’s to ask about specific quantities of items on their ingredients list, but not in their analysis (like B vitamins).

You might also want to consult with a veterinarian that specializes in cardiac issues regarding dietary recommendations and possible supplements. Maybe it is more cost-effective or bioavailable to top-dress your pets dinner with certain vitamins (L-carnitine perhaps). As wonderful as your veterinarian my be, my experience is that the time constraints of their day-to-day rigamarole does not allow time for general practitioners to be current and thorough on more specific issues. Reading journal articles falls to the wayside. Specialist consultation and personal research are important any time you have a specific veterinary/medical diagnosis of concern. Your vet has to have a working knowledge of EVERYTHING. You can concentrate on the single issue that is of prominent importance for your pet.

Good Luck

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,
Thanks so much for your reply! After doing some more research I decided to still go with a premade raw, it is a small company and all the ingredients are human grade, and from southern Ontario. It is called Big Country Raw. I have been looking at supplements and have been thinking of adding Krill oil to his raw. Would this be recommended? They do have a fish dinner, but it has salmon and tuna in it, so I think I would like to avoid that. Should I start supplementing him with Krill Oil? I like the benefits, then I read on another forum here that too many Omega 3’s can be bad too. So I was wondering what you guys think of that? And also do you guys use a joint supplement for your dogs? I have been trying to research on the internet but having been having much luck in whether to supplement or not. He is only a year and a bit, so I don’t know if I should wait to start a joint supplement or if it is beneficial to start him on it young. Also if someone could direct me to the vaccinating thread that would be greatly appreciated(if there is one)! He is coming up to his 1 year shots and I am not sure whether to get them or not, any advice on supplementing and vaccinating are greatly appreciated, thanks so much guys!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi kmarron –

Vitamin D exists in two forms – cholecalciferol (D3, occurs in animals) and ergocalciferol (D2, found predominantly in plants). Most animals are capable of fulfilling a portion of their vitamin D requirements by producing cholecalciferol in their skin when exposed to sunlight – dogs can do this but they aren’t quite as efficient at it as people so this is why it’s important that they receive supplemental vitamin D in the diet. D2 and D3 are generally considered equally potent for most species, however I believe D3 is the more natural choice. My dogs get their vitamin D in whole food form only – I believe that whole foods are better assimilated by the body and less likely to result in toxicity so I avoid all vitamin supplements. My dogs get their daily dose of vitamin D3 from cod liver oil which has 400 IU naturally occurring vitamin D3 per teaspoon, cage free eggs with have about 50 IU vitamin D3 per egg, Kefir which has 100 IU per cup and beef liver which has about 50 IU vitamin D per 4 oz. Oily fish such as sardines, salmon and mackerel are rich in vitamin D as well. If you prepare a properly balanced raw diet there should be no need to add synthetic supplements.

[Cavalierluvr]

Hi,

A friend of mine has a 10 year old Golden Retriever. Recently it had a seizure and was taken to the Vet. It was determined that he has High Liver Function and the vet recommended supplements and a prescription dog food…Hills Science Diet Prescription LD Hipatic Health. First few ingredients are Brewers Rice, Pork Fat, Dried Egg, Soy Bean Meal. She has to pay $60 for a 17lb bag. The vet said he realizes it is expensive and said if she could not afford it, he highly recommended feeding the food over the supplements. Now we all know this is a horrible food. From her own research (not the vet) she said with High Liver Function problems, low protein is advised. Does anyone have an idea about what food she could try. Her dog was previously on Nutro Max, but seemed to be having allergy problems so she switched him about 6 months ago to Nutrisca to avoid potato. She said he seemed to be doing really well on it until this happened.

[Shawna]

Betsy wrote
“Can you tell me the difference between brewer’s yeast and yeast culture; and how they differ from the type of yeast that that makes up a yeast overgrowth?”

Brewers yeast and nutritional yeast are made from the same strain of yeast, Saccharomyces cerevisiae, but are grown on different mediums. Brewers yeast is a by-product from the brewing industry and is said to have a bitter or “yeasty” taste. Nutritional yeast is often grown on molasses and is described to have a nutty or cheesy taste. Depending on what they are grown on will vary the nutritional content of the final product to a degree. The yeast in these products are deactivate (killed) so they can not colonize the system.

It is my understanding that it is the deactivation process that frees the amino acids and creates the MSG like issues in these supplements. Fermentation, which is what the yeast does to the sugar mediums they are grown on, also creates some freed glutamic and aspartic acids. I think the amounts are relatively small but because freed glutamic and aspartic acids bioaccumulate, when added to other sources it definitely could be enough to cause illness. For those that are sensitive to MSG or aspartame, I would avoid nutritional and brewers yeasts.

There are also a few types of yeast that are considered probiotics Saccromyces boulardi is one and can be found in some probiotic products. Saccromyces is a “non-colonizing” yeast.

Candida yeast is the type that are normal to the colon and can grow out of proportion when the good bacteria are not in correct proportion.

There is another type of yeast, Malassezia, that grows on a dogs skin when the immune system is not up to par. I beleive Malassezia can infect the ears as well.

[Mom2Cavs]

Yes, thank goodness. Let us know if they are normal now. All 3 of mine had normal stool today, Yay! Knock on wood, lol, it stays that way. I’m feeding mainly the Duck & Pear (5 lb. bag) with a couple of sample bags of the Lamb mixed in with it. The dogs love the taste. I’ve been topping with a pattie of S&C’s, Fresh Digest, and adding water. Today, tho’, Lucy (Mixed Breed who has been known to be picky) wouldn’t eat! I was hoping it wasn’t the Acana….I dumped out the food and put some Wellness Stew canned in her bowl with some Acana and the Fresh Digest instead of using the S&C’s patty and water. She ate just fine. I think maybe she didn’t want to patty for some reason…? You never know with her hahaha. She is turning 12 this year and has a mass of some kind on her bladder. We know this and she does get supplements for urinary. We aren’t doing anything else, atm, because she isn’t acting sick at all (praise God!). But, when she gets picky like that…I will try to cater to her a little bit :).

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Roobee –

If she’s that picky and won’t eat the food once you add anything to the meat I’d recommend See Spot Liver Longer Dinner Mixes, U-Stew or or Wysong’s Call of the Wild. All three are powder supplements designed to balance an all meat diet. There are instructions on the package for how much supplement to add to the meat. With these supplements you can feed just meat and your dog will be getting all the nutrients she needs. You can certainly try different extras – yogurt, veggies, fruits, eggs, etc. but if she won’t eat the other stuff you won’t have to be concerned that her nutritional needs aren’t being met.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Wysong sells krill oil capsules on their human supplements page. I use their supplements for both myself and my dogs frequently, they’re very high quality. NOW Foods and Health from the Sun sell krill oil capsules that can be found online and at health food stores – I have used products from both these brands for myself and my dogs as well.

[Hound Dog Mom]

DoggieDoc22 –

You obviously don’t know my feeding philosophy – I don’t let any company influence my decision on what to feed. I’m not fooled by Blue Buffalo and Wellness commercials or the Blue Buffalo or Orijen rep at my local pet food company. I’m not fooled by dry weight versus wet ingredients or ingredient splitting, nor do I think white potato is superior to grains. In fact I wouldn’t feed any of the foods you mentioned to my dogs (Blue, Wellness, Natural Balance, etc.). My dogs eat real food. Raw meat, bones, organs and whole food supplements the way nature intended – no marketing spin there, no ingredient splitting, no reps selling me food and no need to worry about which ingredients are going in dry and which are going in wet. You’re bashing people for buying into the marketing of certain pet food companies when you are just as blinded by the marketing tactics of the big name pet food companies as anyone else is by the small “holistic companies.”

[Hound Dog Mom]

I use a lot of Wysong’s human supplements for both myself and my dogs – they have a dosing chart on their website for using human supplements for animals and the general guidelines are: dogs >60 lbs. get the human dose, dogs 36-60 lbs. get 3/4 the human dose, dogs 10-36 lbs. get 1/2 the human dose and dogs under 10 lbs. get 1/4 the human dose. With something like a probiotic which isn’t toxic in large doses, you don’t have to stress about getting the dose exactly right either. For dogs the size of yours you could give each 1/2 capsule per day or 1 whole capsule every other day.

[Hound Dog Mom]

On the topic of probiotics. Was just looking through some supplements and came across this: http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-probiotics-dr-stephen-langers-ultimate-15-strain-probiotic-fos-60-veg-caps . It’s a 15-strain probiotic with pre-biotics marketed for humans. I know Mercola’s probiotic is considered by many to be the gold standard – this has one more strain and is a whole lot cheaper. $0.12 per dose for a large dog versus $0.90 per dose for a large dog of the Mercola. I personally haven’t tried it out (yet, I might) but it would be worth a try for those that are more budget conscious.

[weimlove]

Ok thanks so much guys. Right now shadow is eating chicken necks and backs, leg quarters and some ground chicken plus veggies and supplements. I’m getting ready to try a new protein source which will probably be beef. For fish week I plan on using sardines, and maybe some canned salmon and mackerel. What bone in beef and turkey is safe for his teeth?

[InkedMarie]

I use K9 Liquid Health glucosamine.

[Hound Dog Mom]

DoggieDoc22 –

“One last thing, don’t buy into the marketing machine and get all hung up on ingredients. Your dog needs nutrients, not ingredients. Its protein, fat, and carbohydrate levels that are important, not corn, soy, potato, etc.”

Question, if a new meal replacement bar came onto the market for humans that contained all the essential vitamins, minerals and amino acids (synthetically added) a human needs plus adequate levels of protein, fat and carbohydrates and the main ingredients were refined grains, high fructose corn syrup and partially-hydrogenated oil would you quit eating real food and eat this for every meal? I mean it contains the necessary “nutrients”, right? Hopefully that analogy makes you understand how ridiculous your statement is.

Ingredients matter. As I told you on another thread – you can’t put ground chuck into recipe and get filet mignon in the end. Garbage is garbage. Yes, all living things need nutrients but these nutrients (or at least the majority of these nutrients) should be derived from fresh, whole, species-appropriate foods. I’ll give you some food (no pun intended) for thought.

1) Many health organizations (including the U.S. Cancer Institute and the United Kingdom Health Department) advise humans to get their nutrients from whole foods and not synthetic supplements (shouldn’t our pets do the same?). When dealing with synthetic nutrients, the chance for overdose is much higher – chance of overdose is minimal when consuming whole foods. Errors in compounding synthetic concoctions happen and pets die – for example the excess vitamin d recall. You don’t have to worry about there “accidentally” being too much vitamin d when the vitamin d source is real, whole foods.

2) You say that the inclusion of ingredients such as “corn, soy and potato” are inconsequential – what matters it the “guaranteed analysis” of the end result. So a mixture of corn, soy and potato is perfectly fine as long as the protein, fat and carbohydrate levels are where they need to be and the food is pumped up with artificial nutrients to account for the lack of nutrients in the ingredients themselves, right? Well let’s examine these ingredients that you say are fine to feed:

-Soy: contains anti-nutrients which hinder the ability of digestive enzymes needed for proper digestion; contains phytates which limit the body’s ability to absorb key nutrients such as zinc, magnesium and calcium; loaded with isoflavones that disrupt endocrine function and have been linked to infertility and breast cancer (in humans); contains goitrogens which block the synthesis of thyroid hormones; most soy is genetically modified (studies in animals have linked consumption of GMO ingredients to negative hepatic, pancreatic, renal and reproductive side effects that may alter the hematological, biochemical and immunologic parameters).
-Corn: contains lectins, has a high glycemic index, one of the most genetically modified crops (see above), highly susceptible to aflatoxin contamination.
-Potatoes: also commonly genetically modified (see above), high glycemic index, contain lectins, can contain the toxin solanine.

3) Most of the low-grade foods that contain corn, soy and the like also contain animal by-products. Are animal by-products inherently bad? No – my dogs love fresh organ meat, chicken feet, beef tracheas, etc. (from animals slaughtered for human consumption) and I love allowing them to eat fresh, quality by-products. However fresh quality by-products are not what is in pet food. Many grocery store quality brands of dog food have tested positive for pentobarbital – this means that the by-products contain euthanized animals (potentially even dogs and cats). Pento is recognized as a serious danger to wildlife. Wildlife that feed on disposed euthanized animals often die of pento poisoning – so is this a safe ingredient to be feeding to our beloved pets? I think not. Also – most by-product meals, while undoubtedly high in protein, contain very low quality protein derived from feathers, beaks and the like. This protein is poorly digested and puts a strain on the animals kidneys over time (unlike high quality, digestible protein derived from fresh meat).

Your view of pet food ingredients is simplistic, to say the least. It’s necessary to look at the bigger picture, food isn’t as simple as “fat, protein and carbohydrates.”

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi DieselJunki –

Nature’s Logic is a great product and I have a lot of trust in the company. My cats eat Nature’s Logic kibble and when my oldest dog used to eat kibble I used the Nature’s Logic canned food as a topper quite frequently. I’m also a big fan of their whole food supplement and occasionally use it in my rotation (although I’ve mostly gone to formulating my own supplements lately..).

Unfortunately, all of the Nature’s Logic foods are MUCH too high in calcium for a large breed puppy (I’d wait until your pup is at least 6 months old and through his rapid growth phase before trying this food). Generally, in order to get the actual calcium level you have to call or email the company because most companies only list the minimum calcium percentage on their packaging and website and often the actual calcium percentage is much higher than the stated minimum. Nature’s Logic, however, is one of the few companies that discloses actual nutrient levels on their website – the reason I know they’re actual is because at the top of the analysis for each food it say “Actual Analysis Units Dry Matter Basis” and there’s no “min” before the calcium percentage. All of their dry foods are 2.123% calcium and well over 5.5 g. ca. per 1,000 kcal.

When I compiled my calcium list I called or emailed every company with a grain-free food rated 4 or 5 stars on DFA. Some companies never responded to my emails, didn’t pick up the phone or wouldn’t disclose the actual calcium level so it’s possible that some 4 or 5 star grain-free foods are appropriate and not on the list, however I think I’ve covered the majority. If you do call a company to get the calcium levels be sure to ask for the actual level and make it clear this is what you’re looking for (otherwise they may give you the minimum). If they don’t have an actual level from a lab analysis ask for the maximum and calculate values based off this.

[PennyLanesMom]

Thank you Melissaandcrew for your information.
We are currently using Royal Canin Intestinal Low Fat 20
We really like how our dog is doing on it. She has completely recovered from pancreatitis once again. I’m never putting her on anything else. She loves the food and it keeps her healthy –
I’m glad to hear your dogs are doing well.
I was curious to find out if anyone used any supplements or probiotics for their dogs with pancreatitis.

[sharyorkie]

Does anyone use supplements? Such as salmon oil,probotics,digestive enzymes?? Would love to hear your suggestions
Thanks

[DieselJunki]

(Apparently I can’t post in the Supplements section as I’ve tried twice now and it won’t show up)

Do you feed one or both?

http://probiotics.mercola.com/probiotics-for-pets.html
The probiotic I’ve been looking at.

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/digestive-enzymes-for-pet.aspx
The digestive enzymes I’ve been looking at.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Oh, it’s fine – I just wanted to clarify about the hip dysplasia in case you didn’t understand. Some people actually think it’s something old dogs get.

All healthy dogs should be on a high protein diet, even the less active ones. I’d look for a grain-free food with at least 30% protein – supplementing with high quality canned food and/or healthy leftover and/or fresh raw is a great way to improve the quality of kibble as well.

[HuskyMom9710]

I was feeding 4 health from tractor supply for 2years but I just switched to blue buffalo because my other dog was not doing great on the 4 health. I was and still am thinking about switching them to a grain free food, I have been going threw a lot of reviews on different brands but it is just making me more confused on what one to go for. They are pretty lazy dogs so would that high of a protein level be good for them?

Okay thank you I will look up some of those supplements. And I am sorry I originally worded it wrong, I knew that they just don’t all of a sudden develop hip dysplasia. I did contact her breeder when she was a year old and she informed me that her parents where not OFA certified. which I feel like they should have told me that while purchasing her.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi HuskyMom9710 –

First of all, if your dog is 4 years old she can’t develop hip dysplasia. Hip dysplasia is a developmental orthopedic disease that happens during puppyhood. If a dog is going to have hip dysplasia it will have it by the time it’s full grown – however, if the hip dysplasia is mild the dog may not show symptoms until later in life. There’s no foolproof way of preventing dysplasia but responsible breeding (only breeding dogs that have ofa or penn hip clearances), controlling calcium levels during growth, keeping the pup lean while it’s growing and not over exercising the dog while it’s growing can drastically decrease the odds that the dog will develop hip dysplasia.

What are you feeding your dog? A high-quality species-appropriate diet is the foundation of good health. Grains are inflammatory – so if your dog isn’t on a high protein, grain free diet currently I’d look into switching to one.

Supplementing with Omega 3’s (fish oil) can help with inflammation. Some other natural anti-inflammatories are turmeric, boswellia, yucca, bromelian and tart cherry. Digestive enzymes given on an empty stomach can help inflammation (like medizym). Glucosamine, chondroitin, msm and hydraulic acid can help to maintain and regrow deteriorating joint tissue and fluid.

Some supplements I’d recommend:
1) Wysong Arthegic for inflammation (sea cucumber, turmeric, boswellia, devil’s claw, yucca, ginger, red pepper, cetyl myristoleate) with Wysong’s Joint Complex for joint maintenance (contains collagen and msm).
2) Welly Tails Hip and Joint Rx (omega 3’s, tart cherry, glucosamine, chondroitin, msm, hydraulic acid, green lipped mussel).
3) Vet’s Best Advanced Hip and Joint for maintenance (glucosamine, chondroitin, msm, hydraulic acid) with Vet’s Best Muscle and Joint for inflammation (bromelian, boswellia, turmeric, yucca).
4) K9 Joint Strong (glucosamine, chondroitin, msm, turmeric, cetyl myristoleate) – also have a version with white willow for pain relief.

[HuskyMom9710]

Hi, I have a 4 year old husky who seems to be already developing some slight hip issues. She gets really stiff in the back end a lot of the time. also when we are petting her and if she is standing up her back legs tend to give out and she falls down.. (that part may just be from my wood floors, or maybe because she gets excited?). I am wondering what type of supplement would be best to try??? I have had this talk with my vet and she did not seem too concerned. I am just so scared of her developing hip dysplasia, (I know there is no way of preventing it.)

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi bella5255 –

If your dog is in the early stages of renal failure he shouldn’t need a reduced-protein diet. You don’t want to reduce the protein levels until the final stages of renal failure (when your dog is uremic – BUN is over 80 mg/dL, creatinine is over 4 mg/dL and the dogs is starting to show clinical symptoms of nitrogen buildup). The high quality protein provided by a homemade diet will not be hard on the kidneys in the way that low quality rendered proteins in most kibbles would be and is fine for dogs that have not yet become uremic – reducing the protein levels during the early stages of kidney failure will do more harm than good. I would just feed a standard balanced homemade diet and use very lean meats. Fish oil has has shown to help with kidney disease – because your dog has pancreatitis though, don’t give too much. Glandular supplements can help – Standard Process makes a great supplement called “Canine Renal Support.” Another supplement that I see recommended frequently for dogs with renal failure is “Vetri-Science Renal Essentials” – it contains vitamins, minerals, amino acids and herbs shown to be beneficial for dogs with renal failure. Here’s a link with some good info: http://dogaware.com/health/kidney.html (there’s even some sample homemade diets for dogs with kidney failure here).

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi dave and AngieH –

The difficult thing with colitis is that it can have many different causes and it can be acute or chronic. Dietary changes often can help ease the symptoms of colitis. Most dogs with colitis respond well to increased levels of dietary fiber and/or a hypoallergenic diet. Many dogs with colitis also seem to better tolerate foods that are lower in fat. When trying a new food make sure that you don’t feed anything else to your dog during the trial period (no treats!) and give the diet three to six weeks to see if there is improvement (remember, the improvement won’t be immediate and in some cases your dog’s diarrhea can even worsen in the initial stages of the switch as the dog is becoming accustomed to the new food).

For increasing the fiber level, rather then looking specifically for a high-fiber food, I would recommend just adding some canned pumpkin or psyllium to a high quality food. Both are high in fiber and will increase the overall fiber content of the food being fed.

For choosing a hypoallergenic diet you want to pick a food that has a protein source and carbohydrate source (if applicable) that your dog has never been exposed to. Making a homemade food is a great option here.

Two supplements I would definitely start immediately
1. Probiotics – these will help replenish the good bacteria in the dog’s digestive tract and keep pathenogenic bacteria in check.
2. Digestive Enzymes – These will give the dog a boost in digesting their food so the dog’s already stressed digestive system doesn’t have to work as hard at producing its own enzymes.

Some other supplements you may want to try that have proved successful for some dogs suffering from colitis:
1. L-glutamine – An amino acid that helps to repair the mucosal lining of the digestive tract.
2. Slippery Elm – An herb that helps to sooth the digestive tract and relieve inflammation.

I think in the case of colitis, that a high quality home-prepared diet would be best and most easily customizable to the dog’s individual needs. However, here are some commercial foods that are hypo-allergenic and lower in fat that may be worth considering:
1. The Honest Kitchen’s Zeal – Dehydrated, fish-based food, 9% fat on a dry-matter basis.
2. Grandma Lucy’s Pureformance Rabbit – Freeze-dried food, 15% fat on a dry-matter basis.
3. Nature’s Variety Instinct – Limited Ingredient dry foods are all under 20% fat on a dry-matter basis and include a turkey, duck and lamb variety.
4. Addiction’s Dry Foods – salmon-based, venison-based and lamb-based options, all around 13% fat on a dry-matter basis.
5. Addiction Dehydrated Foods – brush-tail, kangaroo, venison, lamb offerings, all around 9% fat on a dry-matter basis.
6. Addiction Canned Foods – brushtail, venison and salmon are only 10% fat on a dry-matter basis.
7. Great Life – Dry foods Buffalo Rx and Duck Rx are both 13% fat on a dry-matter basis.
8. Tiki Dog – canned food with some low fat hypoallergenic options.
9. California Natural Grain-Free – kangaroo, salmon, lamb and venison options, all 13% fat or less on a dry-matter basis.

*Some of the foods I recommended are a little low in protein for my taste, unfortunately when feeding a commercial food most of the foods that are lower in fat and that contain a novel protein also contain less overall meat and thus less protein – this is why I think homemade is the best option. If you are feeding one of the lower protein dehydrated or kibbled foods I’d highly recommend adding one of the recommended canned foods to boost the overall protein content. Also, this is not an exhaustive list – check out the foods Dr. Mike has reviewed on DFA and you’ll likely be able to find more – these are just some brands that first came to mind.

Good luck!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Dr. Mike –

This is a great question and I think it will make for a great discussion as everyone’s criteria are so different.

First off, in answering it for myself, I’m going to assume we’re looking for dry dog foods – otherwise I, obviously, would give preference to raw foods.

1) The first thing I look at it protein content. I won’t typically consider a food with under 35% protein – however if the food fell between 30% and 34% but had several other exemplary qualities I may make an exception (I would never go under 30% though).

2) I then look at fat content. I typically like dry foods with at least 15% fat (I feed much higher fat levels with raw, but dry foods are generally fairly low in fat).

3) I then look at ingredients. I always want a meat ingredient first – no exceptions. I prefer a fresh meat followed by at least one meat meal – but I would not rule out an otherwise good food if it only contains meat meals. Although there are some exceptions, I typically won’t feed a food that contains by-products. I never feed a food that contains any unnamed animal ingredients – such as animal fat, animal digest or animal by-products. I won’t feed foods with grains and look, instead, for foods that use potato, tapioca, legumes or pseudo-grains (or some combination of these) as a binder. Other ingredients that I look for and would not feed to my animals are: chemical preservative (such as BHA), menadione, artificial colorings, propylene glycol or any sort of sugar (sugar, molasses, honey, etc.). I also prefer to see a short list of added vitamins, minerals and amino acids – this tells me that much of the nutrition is derived from the ingredients in the food itself and there’s less reliance on synthetic supplements.

4) I then look at the company. I won’t rule out a company if it’s had recalls, but I do take into consideration how many recalls the company has had, how far apart they were and how the company handled the recalls. I like a company that is open about where they source their ingredients and that doesn’t source from China. I typically call or email the company’s customer service before feeding a food and if either a) I don’t get a response b) the customer service rep seems knowledgeable c) customer service is rude or d) I get the impression the company is giving me the run around when I ask a question – I will not feed the food.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Marie –

Welly Tails has some good supplements you might want to check out. They have a powdered joint supplement which I have used on my dogs in the past and liked – it has glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM, green lipped mussel, hydraulic acid, tart cherry and omega 3’s. They also have another supplement (haven’t used this one) called senior dog vitality which has glucosamine, msm, hydraulic acid, green lipped mussel, omega 3’s, digestive enzymes and 6 strains of probiotics. I’m also a big fan of Wysong’s joint supplements – they’re sold for people but can be used for dogs too and come in powder filled capsules, you can just open it up and sprinkle it on the food. They have one called Arthegic that helps inflammation, it has boswellia, sea cucumber, turmeric, ginger, devil’s claw, yucca, red pepper and cetyl myristoleate. Their other supplement is called Joint Complex and supports the joints, cartilage and connective tissue, it contains proteoglycans, glycosaminoglycans and MSM. I think for a dog with severe arthritis the Arthegic and Joint Complex would be very effective if used together.

[InkedMarie]

As some of you know, we adopted a 9yr old sheltie on Saturday. She has no teeth and has been eating Grandma Lucy’s PureFormance chicken since she got here. She loves it, thankfully! Since day one, I have been giving her Mercola’s probiotics and digestive enzymes. She was on amoxicillin but got the last one yesterday morning.
These are the other supplements my other two get, in addition to the Mercola products:

apple cider vinegar
salmon oil (I use one by Vital Choice)
coconut oil (one of them gets this)
Bug Off Garlic

Her coat is disgustingly dry: the dandruff just flakes off & rains down to the floor. She is scheduled for a bath on Monday February 4th (or whatever that Monday is). What is best to use, internally, for her coat? Both the salmon and coconut oil? If yes, both daily?
Her poops are pretty soft, which I assume is from the dehydrated food. Should I add some pumpkin to her meals? With every meal? I don’t know if I should attempt to add in a dry food or not, with her having no teeth.
I think she has some hip problems. She’ll be ten in June so can use some type of a joint supplement. Any suggestions for one that is powder or liquid? No teeth, don’t want her to attempt to chew something.
She does have an appt at the holistic vets in three weeks. She has a little hair loss on her eyelids, that and the icky coat have me wondering if she has a thyroid issue but she seems to be at a good weight.
Also, when should I start adding more stuff in? I started putting the Mercola stuff in on Sunday morning.
thanks all!

[Mom2Cavs]

First, let me say that I’m not a vet. But, I would suggest a visit to your vet to determine the type of crystals and to see if there is an infection present. There are different types of crystals and treatments vary. Struvite crystals seem to form if there is an infection, but Oxalate crystals are a different matter. There are also other types. One thing is certain, though, and that a dog that is prone to uti’s or crytals needs lots of moisture in the diet. Moisture is actually good in any animal’s diet, imho. If I were you, after speaking to my vet, I would check into 4-5 star, high quality foods. Whether you feed all canned, regular raw or freeze dried raw that’s been rehydrated, or kibble topped with wet food of sime kind (either of the above mentioned or wholesome people food) moisture is necessary to help flush out the kidneys. If you feed only kibble, then I would still add water or no-sodium/low-sodium broth to it. There are also supplements that might help with urinary issues like cranberry, vit. C, omega 3’s etc. Again, I would ask your vet for recommendations. There are also regular posters here that have had dogs with kidney issues from birth that may post with some great suggestions. Good luck to you and I hope this helps!

[marmaduke]

Ok, did some research and I do beleive that the lack of digestive enzymes is probably the main cause of the gas and stool munching. 😛 I have seen some undigested “slop” in their stools as well, which leads me to beleive that they are not processing their food completely.

I have sourced some green tripe from a local butcher who kills beef…I can purchase 20lbs for $10…I cannot find how much to give them per feeding though…the only thing I have been able to find is an approximation of 5-10% of their protein weight per serving. Any thoughts or suggestion on how much green tripe to feed them? Also, is there any trick to preparing the tripe?

There are a couple of products on the market that I have found that are enzyme supplements…Dr. Mercola Digestive Enzymes and another is Prozyme All Natural Enzyme Suupplement. The 1st seems like it is more animal based (Betaine HCl, Ox Bile Extract, Bromelain (pineapple), Papain (papaya), Pancreatin which includes Protease, Mylase and Lipase) and the 2nd is plant based looking at the ingredients (Lactose, Aspergillus oryzae fermentation product dehydrated, Aspergillus niger fermentation product, dehydrated, pineapples (stem,fruit).

We do include Pineapple in their “slop” mixture, but I guess it does not fully constitute the lack of digestive enzymes that they need.

Thoughts?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi astroweeks –

I know that for a dog with SBS you want to make the digestion process as efficient as possible so adding a high quality digestive enzyme supplement and multi-strain probiotic supplement would be a good idea. I would also add some unfiltered apple cider vinegar – vinegar is an acid and will help the food to breakdown easier in the stomach. I’ve also read that fiber can help SBS dogs by slowing down the digestion process – so maybe some canned pumpkin would help. I’m not sure if you’re giving him any nutritional supplements, but depending on how bad his digestion is you may want to talk to your vet about adding additional vitamins, minerals and essential fatty acids to ensure he’s not becoming malnourished. If possible, I would also look into getting him on a higher quality food that’s higher in fat and more calorie-dense to help him put on some weight. I haven’t read a whole lot about SBS so, unfortunately, that’s about all the help I can give you. Maybe someone else will chime in with some more suggestions.

[twinrescuemom]

Hi all,
I need some help. My 8ish year old miniature pinscher’s skin is an absolute mess. On the recommendations of many, many people, I decided to switch her over to a grain free diet back in November. I chose Castor & Pollux’s grain free because it came in small bites and also rated 5 stars. After about a week or two of eating this food, I noticed that she was starting to have some hair loss on her legs and also seemed to be developing dandruff. It progressed to hair loss on her ears, between her eyes, and now her belly. Not significant hair loss, mind you, but definitely thinner. The dandruff is horrendous and she actually has scabs on her ears and legs. At first I thought it was an allergy to something in the food, so I switched her over to Taste of the Wild, which my other 3 large dogs eat. It didn’t seem to help. I took her to the vet two weeks ago for the skin issue (and for antibiotics for a bite from my other dog, but that’s another story). The vet didn’t think it was allergy related. Naturally he wanted to do upwards of $200 worth of testing to determine what it was. I’m sorry, but I just don’t have that kind of money. I love my dogs, but I also have children to feed and clothe! I agreed to a skin scraping, but that yielded no results. As the vet put it, “there were no mites found.” Which apparently does not mean it’s not sarcoptic mange. He wanted to treat her anyway, because frankly I just don’t have the money to do half a dozen other tests. I decided to hold off on mange treatment for several reasons: 1)none of my other dogs have any signs 2)my children and I don’t have any signs and 3)it’s not gotten worse, it’s unchanged in the last several weeks and I’ve seen sarcoptic mange before, I know that would get worse. I did have another dog with an unknown skin issue back in October. My long hair greyhound mix had random spots of what looked almost like bug bites and also had random patches of dandruff. After a week and a half of antibiotics, her skin completely cleared up. This is another reason why I don’t think my min pin has mange. My vet also suggested ringworm (an $85 test!) but I’m on the same page as the mange. There are no other symptoms on any of the living beings in my house. I still feel firmly that it’s either an allergy to something in her food or it’s some sort of deficiency in her diet. She’s been on Clavamox for 10 days now and while her skin hasn’t gotten any better, it also hasn’t gotten worse. I’m very leery of just loading her up with meds and hoping they work (like the vet wants to do with the ivermectin). She’s never had a very good digestive system and I really don’t want to make her sick from medications. If anyone has any thoughts, ideas, suggestions, I would greatly appreciate it! I’ve started researching supplements, I really think that’s going to be what I try next. What are the best supplements for skin? Thank you all for your help in advance!

[InkedMarie]

I will give you some advice as it pertains to one of my dogs. I did not do allergy testing but an online friend gave me a list of ingredients to avoid: chicken, corn, wheat, soy, rice and flax. I have since found that Boone does fine with flax but cannot have yeast. He has done the best with a grain and potato free foods. Beef can be a common allergen, I have read. On this forum, go to the dog food ingredients board and the stickie at the top has the list of those foods.
Boone does best with fish and turkey foods. He eats a pre made raw in the morning and some of that is beef and he has no issue with it. His pre made is also turkey and duck. He eats Brothers Allergy, which has chicken liver & chicken at but is doing great on this food.
Something to keep in mind. You have to be mindful of every morsel your dog eats. That means treats as well. If you feed him a grain free food, feed him grainfree treats. Scour that ingredients list. Also, you wouldn’t think about it but supplements as well. Mixed tocopherols can be soy so the salmon oil I give him is just that, salmon oil (it’s a liquid). I once gave him a salmon oil capsule that had soy as a secondary ingredient. We use Bug Off Garlic for the insects and we cannot use the chewables because there is yeast in it.
I advise trying a few different foods, by different makers. I like doing that because you never know if a food will become unavailable or you see a sale on another one he can have. Hope I’ve been of help!

[pugmomsandy]

jnite,

Natures Variety Instinct Raw Boost is a convenient freeze-dried powder supplement you can add to food and it has 8% fiber.

http://www.instinctpetfood.com/instinct-raw-boost-healthy-supplements-pets

[Hound Dog Mom]

That’s the same way I feel and why I personally choose to make everything from scratch. I’m picky about what my dogs eat and every food or supplement out there there’s either something in it that I don’t want there or something that I wish was there that isn’t. By making my own food and supplements I can completely customize everything.

[shelties mom]

HDM,
Thank you for sharing your recipe. This is what I’ve been looking for and will order the supplements from the site you posted. I’m excited to do it on my own as I believe I will have a better control of the quality of ingredients I put in the food.