[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Marie –

She should probably be getting two capsules – that was my mistake. When I had recommended the product before I was going off the information on Swanson’s website which says the serving size is three capsules. In small print under the label it says that the three capsule serving is meant to be taken twice a day – so the total daily serving is six capsules. I’m not sure if this would make a difference, but it may. I’d say try doing a loading dose again (2 caps in the a.m. – 2 in the p.m.) for a week then reduce it down to a maintenance dose (1 cap in the a.m. and 1 cap in the p.m.). If this still doesn’t yield any results then definitely look into other supplements. Most joint supplements (like glucosamine, chondroitin, etc.) aren’t problematic when taken in excess, however because this supplement contains several herbal ingredients I would stick to basing the daily dosage on her weight and I would also take two days off per week after the initial loading period.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 6 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[theBCnut]

Is there anything in it that could be a problem if you gave too much? If not, I would try giving her 2 anyway. Many joint supplements have a “dosage may be doubled” statement.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi weimlove –

You’ll have to check to see the concentration of the vitamin e supplement you have – different liquid supplements have different concentrations. It should tell you how many IUs per drop. I’d say 100 IU per lb. would be fine.

As long as you’re feeding a fatty fish (like sardine or salmon) a few times a week you shouldn’t need to worry about Omega 3’s or Vitamin D. I would just suggest kelp and alfalfa (like I did with the raw) – or some other “superfoods” (wheat grass, spirulina, etc.). I would feed at least one egg per one. I would also suggest occasionally adding items like tinned oysters, nuts and seeds to provide important trace nutrients (this doesn’t need to be done daily, but once in awhile). As long as you’re balancing the c:p ratio, feeding a variety of protein sources, feeding 10% organ meat, adding vitamin e, omega 3’s (fatty fish, cage free eggs or fish oil) and adding a whole food supplement everything should balance over time. Variety is key.

Congrats on the new pup! I would certainly say it would be fine to start the new pup on homemade. I started Mabel right up on homemade raw when she came home.

[acs379]

Hound Dog Mom, thank you for being so thorough in your answer! It clears things up quite a bit; the article discussed briefly that the fat percentage should be at a lower level but did not go into specifics as for the health implications of excess fat. I just wanted to confirm that there was nothing about excess fat SPECIFICALLY that would cause health issues (i.e. like excess calcium). I’m thinking I can start with Nature’s Variety Instinct and Orijen, because they both have good nutritional stats, good ingredients from what I understand, and seem to be used with success by other owners who have posted. If you have any other suggestions for foods, please let me know! I was planning on supplementing with fresh food (i.e. hardboiled eggs, yogurt) and canned food (i.e. tripe) as well as digestive enzymes to help aid in the digestion of the dry food.

I do have a few follow-up questions. Here’s my situation: I’m getting a German Shepherd puppy in a few weeks (yay!). It’s coming from a well-known breeder, who made some nutritional suggestions based on years of experience with multiple vets. They suggest, “Puppies from 8 weeks to 1 year should be fed Science Diet Maintenance, fresh meat, yogurt, and boiled eggs.” However, Science Diet Maintenance has extremely LOW ratings on this site, as well as negative reviews from other posters on this site. This really concerns me, and I’m curious as to why they would make that particular suggestion.

In addition, they make suggestions for vitamins as well: 1,000 mg Vitamin C a day and a multi-vitamin and a B complex capsule once a day. In the research I did, the only supplements mentioned were calcium and Vitamin D. Do you see any issue with giving the suggested 3 vitamins?

Thanks so much for your help! You’ve provided so much valuable information and have also had to guide further research for me.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Marie –

Sorry to hear the supplements aren’t working for Gemma. I’ve heard very mixed things about Chinese herbs – they seem to be hit or miss. I’m surprised the Swanson Mobility Essenials isn’t helping at all though. To make sure – are you basing her daily serving on the human dose of 6 caps per day (feeding her a percentage of that)? On the bottle it says serving size 3 caps but then recommends it twice a day (total of 6 caps per day) so I just wanted to make sure you weren’t accidentally basing her serving off 3 caps per day.

In some cases it’s just trial and error – you need to try things until you find something that works. I just started Gus on an esterified fatty acid supplement (NOW Foods Celadrin + MSM) and I know Sandy has said she has some of her seniors on one as well (I forget which brand she said she uses). So something like that would be worth trying. Have you tried enzyme supplements like Wobezyme? Other supplements I’ve heard good things about that could be worth a shot: duralactin, phycox, reservatrol, liquid hylaluronic acid and SOD.

[InkedMarie]

You’re welcome! Also, HDM gave me a list of joint supplements with ingredients to help with inflammation; the one I chose was Joint Mobility plus from Swanson Vitamins.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi cinner00 –

You’re definitely not bugging me, I don’t mind questions. 🙂

1) If he’s not on a grain-free food I would definitely go that route as grains are inflammatory – something you really want to avoid with arthritic dogs.

2) It will be very important to keep his weight down – being a healthy weight is probably one of the most important things for arthritic dogs. Any extra pounds are just extra stress on the joints. So I would definitely focus on getting him to a healthy weight (on the thin side is best). Unfortunately, like people, there’s really no easy way to get the pounds off. It’s calories in and calories out – the dog needs to burn more calories than it’s eating in order to lose weight. A deficit of about 3,500 kcal. equates to one pound. If he’s inactive it will be important to get him moving – this will not only help him to burn calories but it will also help to lubricate the joints and make him feel better. Start small and keep the activity low impact (i.e. leashed walking, swimming, etc.). Frequent activities of short duration are better than longer activities. I’m not sure exactly how active he his but something like 3 short (10-15) minute walks per day would probably make a big difference.

3) Glucosamine is great to help slow deterioration of the joint cartilage. However if he’s already arthritic he may benefit from some anti-inflammatory supplements as well. Some good options are turmeric (or curcumin), yucca, boswellia, bromelain or tart cherry. High doses of omega 3’s (up to 300 mg. per 10 lbs. of body weight) have an anti-inflammatory affect as well. I’ve also heard great things about esterified fatty acids (such as cetyl myristoleate). I recently started my senior on NOW Foods Celadrin & MSM which contains an esterified fatty acid complex with added MSM (Methylsulfonylmethane is a natural source of biologically active sulfur that helps maintain the structure of connective tissue).

4) You may also want to check out what are called “PROM (Passive Range of Motion) Exercises.” There are some great videos on You Tube demonstrating how to do PROM exercises with dogs. They help to maintain flexibility in the joints.

Good luck!

[NectarMom]

I would react just like I did when my 2 got Pancreatitis and bad bacteria when on Darwin’s I immediately get them to the Vet. The food Company would not help after your pet gets sick….Honestly they do not care and feel like you are just blamming them and or their food so they blow you off. I can almost instantly read it in their voice. Yes I agree Customer service is important but it is certainly not there anymore these days from my experience. I am still trying to find the perfect Raw for my dogs that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg to ship. I can get Vital Essentials and Primal and Natures Instinct but my problem with the Primal and Natures Instinct is the veggies and fruits they put in them. My dogs are doing good on the Rabbit from Hare Today and My Pet Carnivore but the $45 shipping is killing me. What if I feed Raw low fat meats just from the grocery and add in Steve’s mix? I just don’t want to do all kibble since I have not seen a huge improvement on it. It seems like I am fighting a never ending battle with my dogs are their diet these days. I am beginning to think it has nothing to do with food but the way man has bred dogs for the last years, The DNA code has been terribly messed up. I know dogs to this day that are fed Pedigree and thrive and have no health issues…I won’t feed cheap/grain food to my dogs and try to feed the best I can but it seriously back fires on me. I am to the point of buying my own meat and cooking the snot out of it and adding in supplements and maybe then I won’t have problems. Sorry just venting. I honestly do not know which way to turn in the food direction.

[weimlove]

Hi everyone! Most of you know that I was feeding shadow a raw diet. After having a bout of pancreatitis, I have switched back to a high quality kibble because I got so freaked out. I don’t plan on going back to raw, but I am very interested in making a home cooked diet for him. I plan on this diet being grain free as well. I need some information about what supplements he would need. Especially calcium since he will not be consuming cooked bones. Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks!

[Saireah]

Starbright:

My Quinn (lab/vizsla) was diagnosed with hip dysplasia at 1 year old. I switched her food to grain-free after discovering that, along with a higher protein. She needed to build muscle as she was favoring one side. She has hip dysplasia in both hips.

In terms of supplements, I can tell you what we’ve done that has made a phenomenal difference. She just turned two and there’s no way in the world I’d have thought she would be at this point. We were pretty certain she was going to need surgery (her range of motion was OK — but we just thought surgery would be more immediate than in the distant future).

As HDM suggests, a great diet with anti-inflammatory supplements was suggested to us by Iowa State University. Since being recommended, we’ve had her on Nutramax Cosequin DS Double-Strength Chewable Tablets. According to Iowa State, this is the only brand to be clinically proven. You will give her two a day for a month and one a day from then on (directions are on the bottle). Coupled with this, we also immediately started her on one tablet of fish oil per day — 1,000MG (but you may have to feed less/more — consult vet).

The diet change and supplements helped, but targeted exercise has made the difference, as well. Take your dog swimming. If she doesn’t like to swim, teach her to love it by way of rewards/playing. Swimming is the best for joint issues. Other options provided to us were walking in tall grass (makes her lift her legs all the way as opposed to close together/hopping), walking on a blown up air mattress (good for winter exercise), and frequent walks (as opposed to a long walk — more frequent is better).

Also — obviously weight. She’s a slim 43 pounds at the moment, but she did get to 50 pounds in the winter and my vet noticed it. Slim is always, always better — and I’ve had people say she’s too thin (mostly because I don’t think most people are accustomed to seeing healthy dogs — harsh, but true… I think a lot of dogs are overweight).

If you have any questions, let me know. I really enjoy talking about this subject because I couldn’t find enough information when this happened to us. It’s our personal experience, but Quinn is now running full-speed and playing for hours and hours daily. A definite turnaround.

Good luck. 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

Definitely – a quality 4 or 5 star food with supplements would be the way to go. I’d personally go grain-free if possible as grains are inflammatory. I don’t really have any particular favorites – when I fed kibble I switched brands after every bag. Good luck!

[pugmomsandy]

Chicken feet is a staple at ethnic grocery stores. They usually have pig feet too. Getting a human supplement might be cheaper per dose for joint supplements. You can also buy bulk green lipped mussel. I get Jarrow True CMO from swansonvitamins(dot)com and also use Actiflex 4000. I get the horse version because I don’t like the beef flavor in the dog version and give a very small amount. This is from folks in my local raw feeding group:

Under 25 pounds:
½ tsp. daily loading dose for 5 days
¼ tsp. daily maintenance dose
>
25-50 pounds
1 tsp. daily loading dose for 5 days
½ tsp. daily maintenance dose
>
50-75 pounds:
1 ½ tsp. daily loading dose for 5 days
¾ tsp. daily maintenance dose
>
100 pounds
2 tsp. daily loading dose for 5 days
1 tsp. daily maintenance dose

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi starbright –

Unfortunately if your dog has hip dysplasia she has hip dysplasia. Hip dysplasia is a chronic degenerative condition and is not reversible. The condition will progress as she ages, although its difficult to predict the extend to which it will affect her as many factors are at play (degree of pain tolerance, size and weight of the dog, etc.). For some dogs hip dysplasia is crippling and for others it may never cause more than a mild stiffness with age. Anti-inflammatory supplements (tart cherry, omega 3’s, boswellia, turmeric, etc.) will certainly help manage pain and supplements such as glucosamine/chondroitin/MSM/hylaluronic acid (or whole foods containing these items) may help slow the joint deterioration to a certain degree – but they certainly won’t stop it. It will also be critical to keep her lean and active (low impact activities). Being that she’s over a year old calcium levels won’t affect anything at this point.

[Angie]

Hello,

I am looking for advice for my friend’s dog. He has a one and a half year old male German Sheppard name Ranger. Ranger was on Acana Large Puppy Breed when he was younger then moved on Acana Large Breed Adult. My friend noticed Rangers breath was really bad so when he went in for his yearly exam so the vet did a urine test. They found that Ranger has Triple phosphates and 10-50 HPF.

I am not sure what that means but they moved him to Canadia dog food with cranberry juice in his water. He has been on Canidae dog food for the past 10 days and there is no improvement on his breath. He went in to get a B12 test and he was advised to wait 30 days to do a test for Phosphate levels.

Any advice on supplements, food or course of action would be really appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

• This topic was modified 12 years, 6 months ago by Angie.

[gmcbogger38]

Here is my story: I currently feed ACANA and I rotate between the different varieties and all 3 of my dogs have done wonderfully on it. But after a rare bout with fleas my Saint Bernard has terrible yeasty skin with a horrid smell and my American Bulldog is starting to show signs of what I believe to be yeast issues, too. I have no idea if the fleas caused this or if it is just a coincidence, but I want to fix it soon. From my research I know raw is the way to go for the issues my dogs are facing and just plain better for them period. I am a full time college student with one more year of school, so feeding a homemade raw diet is not possible right now, but that is my goal one day. Anyway, I was thinking of feeding 50/50 raw and kibble. I wanted to feed Tucker’s Frozen Raw in the a.m. and kibble in the p.m.. I will probably switch my dogs to Orijen kibble because I know that white potato and sweet potato will feed yeast and Orijen does not contain those ingredients while ACANA does. I also will be feeding raw meaty bones once in a while. If I feed the 50/50 split will it still be beneficial to add a supplement like Nupro Silver? The people who owned my Saint before I got her did not feed her correctly as a growing pup (39 pounds underweight when I got her at 2 years old and was fed Iams), so since she has hip issues supplementing with glucosamine is something I really want to do and I figured the other natural ingredients in Nupro Silver wouldn’t hurt. If there are other supplements out there that are better please let me know. Just from my research the Nupro will be cheaper for me to give than the NuVet supplements I am giving currently. I also know that feeding duck feet is a natural source of glucosamine and I will be giving her some of those every now and then. I am just wondering if this plan sounds like a good idea or if it is stupid. I really don’t know a whole lot about raw, but I want to learn more. Any input would be greatly appreciated!

[theBCnut]

Chicken and turkey necks have a lot of cartilage in them and have helped my 11 year old JRT more than joint supplements did.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Amawil05 –

Going grain-free would be a smart idea – grains are inflammatory (something you really want to avoid when dealing with arthritic dogs). I’m assuming that by “Nature’s Instinct” you’re referring to Nature’s Variety Instinct. I would go with Nature’s Variety Instinct over Taste of the Wild. Nature’s Variety Instinct is manufactured by a reputable company, Taste of the Wild is manufactured by Diamond, a company known for producing low quality products and having frequent recalls. If you aren’t already giving joint support supplements, I would start a natural supplement regimen as well. Glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM and hyaluronic acid are all great for maintaining the joints; you can buy these supplements individually or in whole food form – some whole foods that contain some of these components and that are known for promoting joint health are green lipped mussel, sea cucumber, velvet antler, shark cartilage and eggshell membrane. There are also numerous natural supplements you can give that have anti-inflammatory properties – omega 3’s (up to 300 mg. per 10 lbs.), turmeric, boswellia, yucca, bromelain and tart cherry.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I used the USDA nutrient database and Self Nutrition Data – a few of the ingredients I couldn’t find on these databases (like some of the supplements) and had to do a bit of digging on the internet to find an analysis. Then I just converted everything to a dry matter basis and weighted all the nutrients based on the amount of the ingredient in the recipe. Very tedious and time consuming. If you can find any free software for analyzing recipes let me know!

[WrigleysMom]

Wrigley is a 6 month old yellow labrador and he is our baby!! After 6 months of taking the little guy to a “traditional” Vet for his stomach issues (we got him at 7 weeks old and he had coccidia from the breeder), we were tired of the constant prescription of steroids, antibiotics and pro-biotics. This little guy has been on some sort of medication since birth. I was fed up with this approach and took him to a holistic vet. She said that his internal terrain was compromised from all the meds, and recommended a RAW diet immediately (along with four supplements- two to aide with the transition). We did a cold turkey switch from his Canidae Grain Free Lamb and Bison to Natures Variety Beef RAW patties. Along with his supplements and a homemade “veggie mash” (spinach, goji berries, cucumbers, carrots and celery) Wrigley loved his new food for the first two days. Now at day three, he won’t eat anything and has been waking up at 4am vomiting a mucus-like bile. I’m reading online that dogs can experience detox symptoms when switching to raw food, especially dogs who have been on steroids or antibiotics (like Wrigley). But he’s never missed a meal and I’m worried about him. My husband wants to take him to the traditional vet, but we know he’ll just go back to antibiotics and want to put him back on dry kibble. After researching RAW diets, I really believe in the nutritional value and have already seen an improvement in my dogs bowls. Has anyone had any experience with “detox” symptoms like this? I’ve been up since 4am with our puppy and crying hysterically! Feeding him brown rice and chicken broth now, hoping he can keep that down.

[pugmomsandy]

“I have heard varying opinions in the forums about adding probiotics and enzymes. Someone said there are natural probiotics and enzymes without having to add and pay for supplements.”

There are naturally occurring probiotics in foods like kefir and yogurt and raw goat milk and tripe (which tripe also has enzymes). It really depends on how healthy or unhealthy your dog’s gut is. Has he eaten a variety of foods so that he produces a variety of natural gut flora? Or has he only eaten a few foods for a long period of time? Also yogurt usually only has a few strains of acidophilus. Some store bought probiotics have over 10 strains which I think is ideal. I have both Mercola and Dr Langers probiotics.

“How/when do I do this with a raw diet? How do I do this on his current diet while I’m transitioning to a raw diet? How do I transition to a raw diet?”

You can give probiotics and/or digestive enzymes with meals as you are transitioning and even when he is completely on a raw diet. I still feed kibble and raw so I still use these products. You can transition him to a raw diet in various ways. You can slowly introduce raw (like frozen raw medallions or raw bites like Instinct brand has) a couple times a day as treats to see how he does or you can feed one meal of old food and the next meal of raw food. Or every 3rd meal of raw food. Depends on how his stools are! Also raw foods generally have more fat so you must take that into consideration.

“Are there specific recipes for smaller breeds versus larger breeds, older versus younger dogs, etc.? Is it okay to feed him nothing but raw? Can I freeze/store what I’ve made if I’ll be on vacation?”

A homemade raw diet is good for all breeds and ages (except maybe for breeds prone to pancreatitis) and he can be fed nothing but raw. You can freeze in small batches and pull out what you need for 2 to 3 days worth. For vacation, if you’re taking your dog you might be interested in freeze dried raw as it is shelf stable. Some examples are Stella and Chewy’s, Nature’s Variety Instinct and Vital Essentials, Nutrisca and Primal. I wouldn’t give him marrow bones in the beginning as they are just fat.

Yes, he is an inactive dog. After you start feeding, be sure to weigh and/or monitor “body condition score” so that he is an ideal “shape”. My dogs are heavy but are still of good body condition for their breed. There a several “body condition score” photos you can see online.

[mah4angel]

SO. Thanks to HDM, it has come to my attention that making my own raw food for my Louie (10-pound Silky terrier) is actually more cost-effective than buying a high-quality kibble and is obviously much more healthy for my baby.
There are a lot of threads here, obviously, devoted to raw food recipes and diets. Currently my boy is on Earthborn Hollistic Primitive Natural. He’s not doing well on it. I had been feeding him a combination of that and the Earthborn Hollistic tubs (the lamb-based ones), but took those out to see if they were the cause of his upset. I think not. The tubs are expensive and I just have come to the conclusion that I’d rather he be on a raw diet. But, just like everything else, this task of changing his diet (yet again) is so daunting and I am so terrified and essentially stupid and ignorant and I really need you DFA Gods’ help!
I have heard varying opinions in the forums about adding probiotics and enzymes. Someone said there are natural probiotics and enzymes without having to add and pay for supplements. How/when do I do this with a raw diet? How do I do this on his current diet while I’m transitioning to a raw diet? How do I transition to a raw diet? Are there specific recipes for smaller breeds versus larger breeds, older versus younger dogs, etc.? Is it okay to feed him nothing but raw? Can I freeze/store what I’ve made if I’ll be on vacation?
My boy is essentially inactive. We go on walks every day and he gets very excited and runs around the house whether we’re coming home for work or from taking the trash out, but then he calms down and takes a nap. I heard 2% of his body weight for an inactive dog is what I should be feeding him. Is this correct? Does he fit the description of an inactive dog? What is the definition of an inactive dog?
There is so much misinformation out there! So many threads to read through, so much confusion! He’s my first dog and I want to do right by him, he deserves the best.
I always do these posts and I’m always very anxious about finding out how best to serve my canine baby because I know how important diet is, and I want him to have those perfect, firm stools and not feel lousy.
I guess I’m just being somewhat lazy to ask for a guide as to how to do this perfectly. I know it’s going to take some time and a lot of effort!

[supercoop]

Marty keep in mind that diet should also be based on caloric needs. I have an eight yr. old 145 lb.
Anatolian Shep. who at this point in his life thinks rolling over is a lotta effort as compared to a 11
month old rare breed Tornjak that likes to run anywhere from a mile or two once or twice a day.
I feed the lazy old big guy a lot differently than my baby girl. Oh, oh yeah….the old guy eats alot less
than she does and I vary their diets brand wise alot. Ie : tonite he’s getting fed Horizon Pulsar with
Assorted fresh veggies and she’s getting fed human grade canned sardines, vitamin supplements fresh
veggies and venison tripe. Maybe tomorrow we’ll do Wellness Grain Free mixed with some Orijen and
Jasmine Rice. They’re stools are consistently the way they should be and both of them are in great health. Like people they need dietary diversity and with so much great stuff out there to choose from
along with free delivery, you can’t do wrong

[Hound Dog Mom]

Response #2:

Hi marty0203 –

Calcium and phosphorus levels really only affect the joint health of large and giant breed dogs during the growth phase. By the time a large or giant breed dog reaches two years of age it is either dysplastic or not dysplastic. For all dogs, calcium and phosphorus levels should be in balance with one another (between a 1:1 and 2:1 ratio of C:P) but this is really only a concern for those making homemade food, balanced commercial foods will have a proper ratio of calcium to phosphorus.

I strongly feel that a diet high in protein, moderate in fat and low in carbohydrates is best for most dogs. My three bloodhounds eat between 45% and 55% protein, 30% and 40% fat and <20% carbohydrates at each meal. If feeding a dry food I would search for one with no less than 30% protein.

I feel it’s important to feed a variety of foods. I no longer feed dry dog food, but when I did I switched to a new brand at the end of each bag and added a variety of canned and/or fresh food toppers daily. I would recommend finding at least 3 quality foods (preferable different brands with different protein sources) and switching every so often. If you can mix in canned or fresh food occasionally this is great too and canned and fresh foods are much more species-appropriate than dry food. Patty had a wonderful suggestion with recommending you check out online retailers. I live in a small area with a limited selection of quality pet products as well and, for this reason, do the majority of my shopping online. In addition to the sites she suggested, some others you may want to check out are wag.com, doggiefood.com and naturalk9supplies.com.

Some supplements that promote joint health are glucosmaine, chondroitin, MSM, esterified fatty acids (such as cetyl myristoleate) and hyaluronic acid. Some who foods supplements that promote joint health are sea cucumber, green lipped mussel, eggshell membrane, shark cartilage and velvet antler. Raw meaty bones (especially those high in cartilage such as trachea, gullet and chicken feet) and naturally rich in joint health promoting compounds such as chondroitin. Turmeric, tart cherry, boswellia, yucca, white willow, bromelian and high doses of omega 3 fatty acids (up to 300 mg. per 10 lbs.) all help to manage pain and inflammation. If your dogs don’t have any orthopedic issues, a basic glucosamine/chondroitin supplement would be fine for maintenance. If your dogs have any symptoms of pain and inflammation you may want to consider a combination of some of the joint health supplements listed in addition to one of the natural anti-inflammatories.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Marty –

Calcium and phosphorus levels are really only a concern for joint health during the growth phase. Once large/giant breed dogs reach two years of age their joints are fully developed and at this point they’re either dysplastic or not dysplastic. Calcium and phosphorus levels obviously need to be in balance with each other (between a 1:1 and 2:1 ratio of C:P) but this is true for all dogs, not just large/giant breeds, and isn’t a concern as long as you’re feeding a balanced commercial food (where balancing C:P ratios come into play are with homemade diets). I personally feel that a diet high in protein, moderate in fat and low in carbohydrates is healthiest and most species-appropriate for healthy dogs. My three bloodhounds eat between 45% and 55% protein, 30% and 40% fat and <15% carbohydrates at each meal. If feeding a dry food, I would search for one with no less than 30% protein. I also would not limit yourself to only one brand – variety is important. I no longer feed dry dog food, but when I did I switched brands and protein sources at the end of every bag and I added different canned and/or fresh food toppers daily. I would recommend finding a minimum of three foods your dogs can eat (preferably different brands with different protein sources). Patty had a wonderful suggestion with online ordering if selection is limited where you live – some other sites that have a big selection and offer free shipping in addition to the two she posted are Wag.com, Doggiefood.com and NaturalK9Supplies.com. There are several supplements you can give your dogs that help to promote joint health and/or have anti-inflammatory properties. If your dogs don’t have any orthopedic conditions or arthritis a basic glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM supplement would be fine to start off with. Some other supplements good for joint maintenance are hyaluronic acid and esterfied fatty acids (like cetyl myristoleate). Some whole food supplements that are beneficial for the joints are eggshell membrane, velvet elk antler, sea cucumber, green lipped mussel and shark cartilage. Raw meaty bones (especially those high in cartilage such as trachea, chicken feet and gullets) are very rich in naturally occurring chondroitin. For dogs experiencing pain/arthritis some natural anti-inflammatories include high doses of omega 3 fatty acids (up to 300 mg. per 10 lbs.), turmeric, boswellia, tart cherry, yucca, bromelian and white willow. Generally human supplements are cheaper and higher quality than supplements marketed to dogs, adjust the dosage accordingly (a good rule of thumb is a 25 lb. dog would get about 1/4 of the recommended human dose, 1/2 the human dose for a 50 lb. dog, 3/4 the human dose for a 75 lb. dog and full human dose for dogs >100 lbs.). Also – as you may already know – the most important factor to maintaining healthy joints and staving off arthritis in large and giant breed dogs is maintaining a healthy body weight, it’s very important that large/giant breeds don’t become overweight as this adds a lot of stress to the joints.

[pugmomsandy]

You can feed raw trachea or chicken feet and perna (green lipped mussel) for natural joint support. I believe omega 3’s are given in a higher dose for joint support. You can also try products like Actiflex 4000 (I give the horse product, 1/4 teaspoon to my small dogs), Wysong’s (human products) Joint Complex and Arthegic. I do like products with eggshell membrane and cetyl-myristoleate (esterified fatty acid).

[munkey12345]

oh yeah…reason for curiosity is mostly our lab ..horrible ear infections and itching constantly as much as we stay on top of it. i think part of the severity now is he is eating poop (gross) when he can and mayeb even the farms near us being sprayed with chemicals. we went through years with the vets doing every food imaginable with him at a fortune and it never helped. since i began cooking it has significantly improved but he still goes through bad spells… i currently feed him oatmeal with is breakfast and rice or pasta for din (with all their veg , meat and supplements) ..wondering if this needs to be eliminated maybe??

[pwndbypoms]

Long time lurker-first time poster….

I have 2 pomeranians. My 4 yr old just had to have knee surgery due to a luxating patella and subsequent injury. His other patella also luxates but we’re trying to save it from surgery. My vet said she would normaly recommend the Hill’s Science Diet J/D formula food ( I know… but this is the best vet I’ve found in my rural area) but she knew I used “more natural” foods and to go by the J/D’s numbers for omega 3’s and 6’s to chose something I felt comfortable with.
I quickly gave up on using the J/D info for anything but the more research I do the more confused I get trying to do the math to get the ratios right.

My pom normally eats Honest Kitchen Zeal rotated with dried Ziwipeak and various brands of 5 star canned food. But he does best with a main diet of the lower fat Zeal. Before I knew about his patellas I used to add a squirt of Grizzly brand Salmon oil–but then I tried to do the math for the ratio of 3’s to 6’s and it seemed that the Salmon oil was made for food that had a surplus of omega 6 in it (which if I’ve looked at the numbers right Zeal does not). Since his surgery (about a week ago) I switched to the Missing Link joint formula for small dogs but was just wondering if anyone had any other suggestions.
Am I over thinking this? Nutrition science is not my strong point 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Alexandra –

Glad to hear your boys like the food 🙂

Freezing won’t have a significant effect on the quality of most of the ingredients – although you may want to wait on adding any vitamin e or fish oil until just prior to feeding (to ensure maximum potency and decrease the risk of oxidation). Also keep in mind that if you use yogurt or kefir some of the probiotics will be killed off during freezing so if you want the maximum benefit from either of these ingredients you may want to wait on these as well. But you could definitely mix up all the meat, whole food supplements and other “extras” ahead of time and freeze.

[Mom2Cavs]

I have never fed their diet, but I have fed their supplements and the breeders I got my Cavaliers from also use them frequently. I think they’re quality supplements. I would consider making their diet, if I did homemade.

[Anonymous]

Hello, Has anyone ever tried the Nature’s Farmacy diet? Where their food is prepared at home and then you add all the supplements & vitamins they need depending on their health needs. (Sold from Nature’s Farmacy.) I have heard good things from friends. My Vet has never heard of them though. I hope someone here has some honest news please? Thanks for any help you can offer in advance…

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hey DieselJunki –

There are many other ways to add fiber other than pumpkin. Most human fiber supplements are fine (psyllium, flax, acacia, pectin, bran, coconut fiber, etc.). If you do go the pumpkin route, Fruitables makes a product for dogs (they have a sweet potato variety as well) which blends pumpkin, apple pomace, tomato pomace, spinach and flax to get the ideal ratio of soluble to in soluble fiber. I’ve used it as kong stuffing for my dogs before. For pumpkin I’d add a couple tablespoons to each feeding for a large dog.

I’ve experienced the same thing with Honest Kitchen. My dogs have very large stools when they’re eating it and go to the bathroom about 4 times a day (versus one or two on raw). I’ve also noticed undigested bits in the stool on occasion.

I agree with Cyndi on the DE it’s GREAT stuff. I buy it 10 lbs. at a time and mix it into my dogs’ food regularly – they’ve never had a fecal test positive for parasites.

[Cyndi]

Well, I ended up buying Earthbath Meditteranean Shampoo from Chewy.com when I ordered Bailey’s supplements. I gave her a bath about an hour ago & I LOVE that shampoo! (Thanks Sandy!) I took Bailey outside after her bath to sit on the deck to dry in the sun & holy crap does her coat shine! I am amazed! Not that it was that dull, but man, what a shine! & she is so soft & smells amazing! So, she’s been eating a raw diet for a month now, got a bath with all natural shampoo & she looks awesome! She’s got a soft, shiny coat, bright eyes, whiter than white teeth & a very happy mommy! 🙂 Thank you everyone for all your help, suggestions & opinions! I couldn’t have done it without you! I hope everyone’s having a great weekend!

[harpersmom]

Thanks HDM! Boy, you’re a font of wisdom. Anyone tell you lately that you help the world by posting answers to people’s queries? You’re a good person. Be proud.

I used to be a HUGE fan of those dried liver treats. Sometime ago, i stopped`, probably the cost or the time it takes to get to the store that carries them… I’ll see if i can order online for a reasonable amount. I can also make her my mom’s chicken liver recipe! This whole thing: Surgery, staying home, supplements- costing a fortune! She’s worth it, but i’m definitely needing to watch my budget, big time! 😉 Thanks again, HDM

[pugmomsandy]

Yes probiotics (preferably a multi-strain probiotic) will help with gas. Also digestive enzymes. I give both to my kibble feeders couple times a week. I don’t believe Nutrisource has had recalls. You can find this in stores and online. It’s mid-priced. $50 for 30 lbs and is mid-protein range. I feed the grain free recipes to my foster dogs. They don’t have gas issues with this food even though some of them don’t get supplements. For probiotcs I have mercola brand and Dr Langers by Swansonvitamins. I also give kefir sometimes instead. It’s in the milk section at the grocery store. Some people make their own kefir too.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi harpersmom –

I found this concerning CoQ10 and recovery after surgery:

“CoQ10 is found in virtually all cells of the human body as a molecular compound in the mitochondria; a long, oval-shaped part of cells that convert nutrients into energy, including in the heart, liver and skeletal muscles. CoQ10 promotes energy after surgery by functioning as a carrier to transfer electrons across the membrane of mitochondria, which are the energy generators in the body’s cells.”
[nsc24.com/surgery]

Supplementing with CoQ10 definitely wouldn’t hurt anything, although concerning TPLO surgery I’m sure some of the other supplements mentioned would provide more benefit. Oily fish (like sardines), ruminant organ meat (heart, liver and kidneys) and eggs are all rich in CoQ10.

[harpersmom]

Can anyone suggest great supplements for a 4.5 year old, Otherwise Very Healthy ,Female Akita who just had TPLO surgery, and will go back in in 8 weeks for the other leg? She’s no dummy, naturally cutting back her own calories when free feeding kibble- due to the reduction in energies spent. I feed Wellness kibble along with a Multitude of Fresh proteins & whole foods. I rotate, advocating variety: chicken, buffalo, salmon, mackerel, fresh caught river trout , a bit of seaweed for iodine, raw farm fresh eggs, some cooked whole grains (everything from barley to quinoa to oatmeal, i rotate), some greens, some fruit & veggies (avocado yesterday). I give a Fish Sourced Omega Oil supplement w/dha (extra now, for inflammation), glucosamine/chondroitin MSM, I’m making fresh chicken broth to give her collagen, and mixing the broth with gelatin for chicken blox treats. Extra protein right now for healing skin, ligaments, muscle. Normal supplements include daily and rotated treats, too: brewer’s yeast, marrow bones, cultured dairy (she LOVES my homemade creme fraiche and yoghurt), probiotics (daily, especially since she’s on antibiotics right now…wellness kibble has prebiotics in it, too), seasonally: fresh raw local honey w/pollen for allergies. Perhaps i’m leaving some basic vit/min supplements off this list, but are there any supplements that will specifically aid in healing, recover, address inflammation, or help reduce pain that i’m missing? The vet has her on Rimadyl, antibiotics, tramadol. Thank you… And if you’ve personally gone through a TPLO with a Big, Young, Active dog, i’d LOVE to ask you some very specific questions, if anyone has the time… I appreciate your help.

[Alexandra]

Thanks HDM,

So do you prepare food for a week in advance? I see that you recipie is one meal, so by that, I would get two days from a batch then.

I am nervous about this, but the benefits of 100% raw are to great to ignore. Since kibble teeth don’t look as nice, larger stool volume…great coats though. :). The new Orijen does work well for them.

Thanks for the info on the supplements, I have been doing a little shopping. 🙂

[Alexandra]

Hi HDM,

Question on the mineral supplements. What do you do to store it? How long does the mixture last?

[LckyNmbr12]

Do either of you happen to know of any resources to use when trying to determine the appropriate dosage for a dog when using human supplements?

[LckyNmbr12]

Hello, I recently rescued an american bullador pup (american bulldog/lab mix) who has demodectic mange. He is currently taking ivermectin (I know this can be dangerous but he doesn’t appear to be having any issues or reactions from it), and because he is young, my vet doesn’t think he will have any issues overcoming it with the medication and itch-relief shampoo. However, I want to ensure he gets better as soon as possible, and I hope to prevent further immune system issues. Has anyone had experience with this? Can anyone recommend any supplements or home remedies that will help get him and keep him healthy? I’ve seen there are various multivitamins aimed at immune-boosting, as well as other supplements such as colostrum. I’ve also seen that fish oil, specifically salmon oil, can be extremely helpful in mending and maintaining his skin and coat. Any advice? Thanks!!

[Cyndi]

Oh, ok. Thanks HDM! I’ll just get one of the herbal stool supplements you suggested, for now. But, let’s hope she does NOT still have loose stools come Friday!

Hi Sandy, Yes, there was a time when she had normal stools. This week starts her 4th full week on raw. She had a problem with runny stools and threw up once right at the beginning, but that only lasted for like a day and a half, 2 days at most. Then she went 11 days with perfect hard, small poops. The only thing that was different in her diet this time she got diarrehea (sorry, I just can not spell that word) was I added a small piece of chicken gizzard to her food. I can see her possibly getting runny stools from that, but not for 4 days, right? I am going to, more or less, start over. I’ll stop introducing new foods and just keep her on chicken thighs and leg quarters and the chicken grind for a bit longer.

So, I gave her breakfast about 45 minutes ago and nothing yet. She didn’t poop first thing this morning, of course, because I fasted her last night, so we’ll see. I’ll keep you guys posted….

Thanks you guys! Happy Memorial Day!!

[Anonymous]

At Bffpuppy.com, Dog lovers can get dog health care products and dog nutritional supplements at very competitive prices. We are offering a full range of dog health products and accessories.

[Anonymous]

Always keep your dog healthy with dog vitamins & supplements products from BFFPuppy.com. We offers a huge varieties of dog vitamins and supplements.

[Hound Dog Mom]

The Dr. Harvey’s herbal supplements are like whole food multi-vitamin/minerals – I don’t believe they’re for loose stools so you could give it in combination with one of the herbal stool supplements I suggested. Good luck!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Marie –

If you aren’t balancing the Hare Today grinds out with the appropriate supplements and nutrient-dense whole foods, then I think Darwin’s would be the better option. If you’re adding the appropriate vegetables, whole food supplements, efas etc. to the Hare Today grinds, then I think the Hare Today grinds would be the better option. I think that both the Hare Today grinds and the Darwin’s formulas likely have similar bone content (probably ~10%). Darwin’s would definitely be more convenient if you didn’t want to put the work into balancing the Hare Today grinds.

[Hound Dog Mom]

My local pet food store recently started carrying this too – I didn’t look too much into it because for some reason I was think it was HPP…but I don’t see anything about this on their website. Judging by their website it appears that it’s made with very high quality ingredients and that the company has a great system of quality control protocols in place. The two things that would prevent me from feeding this brand exclusively is that every formula contains pork – I don’t like continuous exposure to the same protein source, I think it increases the odds that the dog will develop a sensitivity to that particular protein source. The other thing I don’t like is that it relies heavily on synthetic vitamins and minerals to supply necessary nutrients. All it contains is meat, bone and pumpkin so they have to add a vitamin/mineral pre-mix to balance it. If they were to include organ meat and other nutrient-dense whole foods (i.e. a great variety of fruits and vegetables, eggs, “superfoods” like kelp, alfalfa, etc.) they could rely less on synthetic supplements and, if they were really careful about their formulation, eliminate the need for synthetic supplements all together. Ultimately, it looks fine to use in a rotational feeding plan with other brands but I wouldn’t recommend feeding it exclusively.

[Hound Dog Mom]

As long as the homemade portion is 20% or less of the meal you don’t need to worry about balancing it. If you plan on feeding more than 20% of his diet as homemade food you’ll need to balance the recipe. Add a variety of fresh cooked and pureed vegetables , pureed fruit (don’t go overboard, fruit is high in carbohydrates) and fresh minced herbs (parsley, cilantro, etc.). To balance the fats in the turkey add 1 tsp. flax or chia oil or 1 tbs. ground flax or chia seeds (provides essential fatty acids without contributing to the level of linoleic acid which is already high in poultry) per pound of turkey. For dogs with cancer the recommended dosage of fish oil is the amount that provides 300 mg. combined EPA and DHA per 10 lbs. of body weight – so for your dog you’d be aiming for around 1,200 mg. combined EPA and DHA daily (most fish oil capsules have around 300 mg. combined EPA and DHA). If you’re feeding predominantly homemade, I would recommend making one of the capsules a vitamin a and d rich quality cod liver oil (I like Carlson’s brand). I would definitely feed eggs once or twice a week – cage free are best as they’re higher in omega 3’s and vitamins such as d and e. I would supplement with around 100 IU vitamin e daily (could give a higher dosage 2 – 3 times a week). You want to add 1 ground eggshell per pound of meat to balance the calcium to phosphorus ratio. I’d also add a whole food supplement comprised of nutrient rich “superfoods” – you can buy pre-made supplement’s (such as Nature’s Logic All-Food Fortifier, Dr. Harvey’s E-mune Boost, Wysong’s Wild Things, etc.) or make your own. I make my own, I buy bulk ingredients from human supplement stores – the current blend I’m feeding is 1 part kelp, 1 part spirulina, 1 part alfalfa, 1 part wheatgrass and 1 part bee pollen. Whole food supplements will help supply vital trace nutrients. Lastly, I would recommend switching up protein sources often. Is there a reason you’re looking at feeding only turkey? If your dog doesn’t have any sensitivities it’s best to feed a variety of poultry and red meats (if you’re feeding red meat use hemp seeds/oil instead of flax or chia).

[GSDsForever]

Sorry to be the party pooper & naysayer, BUT . . .

I just do NOT think this product is worth spending the money on. I think the ingredients are very generic & see nothing special about it to make it some wonder product or justify its prices. It’s apparently all over the radio & TV right now, and I’ve had several people ask me about it.

I think there are much better supplements out there (and cleaner/purer) at lower cost. There are some ingredients that even strike me as wholly unnecessary and not beneficial in any way. And I think other ingredients in its various versions should and can easily come from a good food.

If it works for you, great, good luck. But I think it’s a waste of money and not a very well designed product with highest quality of ingredients.

This product seems about as magical as all those PetSmart/Petco supplement aisle products that claim to get rid of shedding, and then contain very basic cheap cooking oils and bargain basement vitamin mix.

[GSDsForever]

In case this helps someone else giving pills or supplements . . .

I use the whipped version of cream cheese (Trader Joe’s) and it works like a charm!

The thing that concerns me with peanut butter, once you even find an all natural one (not loaded up with sugar/corn syrup and weird additives), is the aflatoxin risk. A potent carcinogen. And then there was the peanut butter recalls over salmonella — good grief, it’s been many months and stores like Costco are just now returning the natural versions to the shelf. Trader Joe’s popular Valencia one is still gone.

[satobrinn]

Hi wantthebest4myk9:

I wanted to post this last night but I became too busy…..this is a nice starting point for a dog’s home cooked diet that can be tweaked to a dog’s specific needs. I wouldn’t hesitate to consult with either a vet or dog nutritionist if you have concerns about deficiencies or too much protein. I’m not as familiar with the dietary requirements of a toy dog other than the reality of having to feed them more often to make sure they get an adequate amount of food for proper nutrition. Carbs in general aren’t considered necessary for a healthy canine diet, but again, each dog’s needs are different. Hopefully this can be a helpful starting point and you can feel good about what you feed your dog (other supplements are optional and best discussed with your vet):

Sample daily cooked diet:
8 to 12 ounces lean muscle meat/heart/fish/leftovers
1 to 2 ounces liver or kidney (daily or every other day)
1 to 2 eggs (daily or every other day)
1 to 4 ounces yogurt, kefir or cottage cheese
2 to 8 ounces cooked grains, pasta, or starchy veggies (no more than half the diet, max)
Any amount of green or other non-starchy vegetables
1000 mg calcium (for example, 1/2 tsp ground eggshell, or 1 tsp Animal Essentials Natural Calcium, or 1 tsp bone meal that has 1000 mg calcium per teaspoon)