[Merry G]

I don’t understand how a dog’s BUN numbers can be elevated either by dehydration or a sign of kidney problems. You’d think that they wouldn’t even mention dehydration! He did tell me that she can live with it for quite some time before it worsens but didn’t say how quickly it can progress or what to watch for. She doesn’t really like the KD Science Diet and I found some dog food online that has low protein and I ordered a case hoping she’ll be happy eating it. I don’t mind making my own food for her. I’ve been boiling and crock potting chicken for her for more than a year because she decided regular dog food was beneath her “diva dignity.” I mix it with brown rice sometimes and she gets the broth and carrots too.
I like to squirt a bit of fish oil in her bowl but that dog can sniff it out and then she will not eat it!
I would have no problem cooking her whatever kind of food would be good for her I’m pretty much used to it now.

I read a paper written by a Vet about putting a dog on low protein food in the early stages of renal failure. His name is Kenneth Bovee, DVM, MmedSc, (Dept of Clinical Studies, School of Veterinary Medicine, University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, PA.) It reads kind of dry and technical but I did my best to understand it. It seems that there’s quite a controversy about if a low protein diet actually helps but Vets have been told it works so they’ve been recommending it for a long time.
I’ve read about herbal supplements that can help the kidneys function better, or “cure” renal failure but I don’t believe there’s a cure!

I appreciate all your feedback and I hope that I can help Sage live the rest of her time with us in a painless, quality way. I still marvel at what a dog can add to one’s life and how completely smitten we can become over them! I’ve had 4 boxers in my life and I’ve loved every one of them equally and my life was enriched by their love.

http://www.dogfoodscoop.com/support-files/bovee_protein_renal.pdf

[Amy H]

Thanks!
Bobby dog – from my initial research, I don’t necessarily need a low sodium diet so long as I keep his sodium intake consistent as it competes with the meds for absorption, so an increase in salt will lower the level of meds in his blood and a decrease in salt will increase his blood levels of the meds. But I will take a look at that list.
Susan – I will look for that book. Is your list of supplements from it?
BCnut (Patty Vaughn?) – his seizures started after eating the poison. He almost died. I don’t know what specific kind of poison. My vet has yet to see him or his chart, but in a pre-adoption phone conversation said that generally speaking, his concern with cutting back on KBr is that when you do that, if the seizures return they frequently no longer respond to the medication, so as long as he is free of side effects he would prefer to stick with what seems to be working. An article on canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels(dot)com advises waiting 1-2 years without seizures before phasing it out. But that might be geared toward idiopathic epilepsy, which of course we aren’t sure we are dealing with. I have 2 young 2-legged kids, and my daughter has asthma, so our house and yard are already pretty chemical-free.
This is a lot to take in. Hope I haven’t bit off too much!

[Susan]

Hi Amy, Im just reading Lew Olsons PhD, Raw & Natural Nutrition for dogs again, its a good book to have lying around, it has easy home cooked & raw recipes in the book she says this about Epilepsy: While the connection between grains & seizures is still being researched a number of studies suggest that feeding carbohydrates can increase the risks of seizure activity, either by making blood sugar level fluctuations more extreme or by causing allergic reactions due to gluten intolerance. The best defense is a fresh-food diet with low to mediun levels of fats, high levels of animal protein & few carbohydrates….

Supplements: Fish Oil, Vitamin E & digestive enzymes are all good supplements for dogs suffering from Epilepsy. Additionally adding a quality B complex vitamin has proven to fight seizures in both humans & animals. DMG made from a derivative of glycine has also shown promising results in slowing down or stopping seizure activity. For dogs the liquid form given by dropper in the gum line appears to work the best..
If you don’t mind making a few cooked meals she has 4 different Low-Fat Low Glycemic Diets for Epilepsy & what Supplements to add..

[Amy H]

I am adopting an epileptic lab mix rescue pup, 10 months old, and I am told about 60 lbs. I have looked over these forums and printed out a few articles from the Mercola site to bring to my first vet appt with him. Once he is settled in our home I will begin transitioning him to a higher protein, lower carb, grain free diet. The first bag I bought for that is EB Holistic Primitive Naturals. He is on KBr already, as he had multiple grand mal seizures after poison ingestion, but he has been seizure free for several months. I am looking for advice from others who have dealt with this – what worked for you, and what didn’t? I am not up to a raw diet, but herbals and supplements would be manageable within budgetary reason. I wonder whether a rotation diet is still advisable, since I need to worry about affecting his KBr blood levels with varying salt content in different foods. Most labels I’ve checked don’t list sodium content. I read through about 55 pages of the large & giant breed puppy food forum, and think he is old enough that I at least don’t need to worry about calcium content. Any words of wisdom would be greatly appreciated!

[Karen J]

Here is the question are there grain free pill pockets out there I could use?

Okay, Trixie (the girl with the crystals) seems to be doing a little better, no grain d-mannose and Vit C however I keep having to change her food, she is terminally picky and giving her the supplements has become more difficult by the minute. She threw up last night or this morning and I believe I covered the supplements with so much cheese and chicken plus her food and grain free kibble with Stella and Chewy on it….and on and on. I think it was too much of everything.

[Zach M]

Yeah, I have heard of those supplements. I might try them. Thanks guys!

[Zach M]

Thanks guys for all the input. Dogfoodie, I was about to order some VE beef treats, the beef and beef tripe and lung etc. treats. I think I will order them, and thanks for the other suggestions guys. BC, any good ideas for Super food supplements?

[aimee]

Hi Peter,

I haven’t looked at Farmina so I can’t comment on the company/food. In regard to Nature’s Logic, the concept is appealing but because the foods do not have supplements they fall far short of AAFCO requirements. For example AAFCO min Vit D is 500 IU/kg and NL reports 175 IU/kg, AAFCO Vit E 50 IU/kg and NL reports 21.34 IU/kg.

In actuality though the nutrient content in most of NL formulas is unknown as the owner has told me he only tested one diet, the chicken variety, and then posted the same numbers with some minor variation for all the diets. I find that extremely irresponsible! UGH!!! One of the diets has been through AAFCO feed testing and the others use the family rule to substantiate the AAFCO label.

When I last inquired the person formulating the diets was the owner Scott Feeman. His degree is in marketing. In talking to him I found that he doesn’t understand very basic nutritional concepts, for example that Vit D is a dietary requirement in the dog. He told me not to worry about his diets being low in Vit D… I just need to let my dog sit by a sunny window. Oiy Via!

I asked what type of testing he does on the ingredients used in his food and he said none and at the time I talked to him he didn’t seem certain as to what post production testing was done at the co packers he uses.

I think the company excels at what the owner’s degree is in: marketing. When it comes to nourishing a dog: shaky ground. On the positive side one of the diets has passed a feeding trial.

[crazy4cats]

Hi Julie-
It pains me to read your post as I have gone through basically the same scenario with my two pups, 3 year-old, 80 lb lab mixes. We battled both giardia and coccidia for about a year. I think they have permanent issues from that condition. I found a ton of helpful information on dogaware dot com. Check out this site’s digestive disorder tab. My dog’s stools are still loose after exercise or when they get real excited, unfortunately. But otherwise they have been pretty consistent. I feed mine mostly Victor grain free food. It contains a clay that is supposed to be helpful for dogs with different types of colitis. I also rotate between the Perfect Form, Gastriplex and Vetri Pro BD supplements that contain probiotics and enzymes along with some diarrhea remedies such as slippery elm that seem to help a lot too. As far as toppers go, it seems like when I add either raw nuggets or dehydrated to their kibble, they do better than when I add a little canned food. Of course, murphey’s law, they are much more expensive than canned. I hope you can find a combination that works for you. If you do start switching up, do it slowly and one at a time so you know if it is helping or not. Good luck!

[Lillian N]

I’ve been really trying to do a lot of research on this raw feeding thing but as much information as I’ve been stockpiling the more uneasy I become when it comes to the supplements part of it. Most sample diets I’ve seen are for much larger dogs (40 lbs and up) and my chihuahuas are really small (5 and 7 lb respectively) I think I got most of the other parts down and I’m pretty comfortable feeding them on the raw meats/organs part (no bone, they are gulpers and don’t like to chew thoroughly) so I am feeding them a whole sardine once or twice a wk to help with calcium thought I am not sure if this is sufficient. If anyone else has a small breed can you please provide me with a sample diet of what you are feeding your dogs? I want to make a full switch to raw since they do so well on it and I would prefer not to use mixes or pre-made ones(too expensive..) I was going to simply add a multivitamin and calcium supplement as well as vitamin e to the 1 lb of ground meat and organs +veggie mix I was going to make and feed them for the whole month but I read on dogaware.com that human multivitamins aren’t suitable for small breeds. any help would be much appreciated!

[theBCnut]

Just in case, give him a good thorough bath with Dawn. He may have gotten it to something poisonous that is affecting his neuro system and while you can’t get it out of him, you may be able to get some off him. It may be that he was born with a neuro condition. I wouldn’t wait to get him checked out, because the vet can give you an idea which it may be, and tell you what supplements may help most. I would want to give milk thistle for a few days just in case he got into something. It helps the liver, just in case, but if he didn’t get into anything it won’t hurt. Also, I would want to make sure he is getting a raw egg every other day with one meal, and adding lightly cooked egg to one meal on the other days wouldn’t hurt either. You want the white cooked but the yolk raw on those. That will supply some of the nutrients he needs to clear his system, if he can. Good luck and thanks for helping this big boy. Unfortunately, this issue may be why you found him where he was. Someone may not have wanted to deal with all of this. He may also have severe hip dysplasia and just can’t use his hind end right. A joint supplement may or may not help that. Osteo Bi-Flex for humans is a really good one. And that also won’t hurt anything if he doesn’t really need it, but I haven’t met the Dane yet who didn’t.

[FrenchieBourdeaux]

No he does good with the Fromm I just add it to his food every other day. My vet and the breeder said it helps with there digestion. But I have been reading and hearing a lot about goats milk and the great benefits for dogs and I was curious if I could use that or if it would be to much calcium right now. And I here good and bad on supplements so wasn’t sure what to do on them. And kind of off the topic question but how do you load a pic on your profile…..I feel like a idiot bc I cant figure it out.

Thanks

[aimee]

When adding supplements to a dog’s diet they shouldn’t make up more then 10% of the caloric intake. I use fresh foods whole foods as supplements: veggies, fruits ( no grapes raisins, currents, onions, garlic ) DHA,EPA ( fish oils).

I’m not sure what you mean by rotating boiled chicken and rice with Fromm. Boiled chicken and rice is missing many nutrients and as such is not a suitable to use as a meal on an ongoing basis. If using boiled chicken and rice it should not make up more than 10% of the calories fed that day unless you are balancing your homemade food.

[FrenchieBourdeaux]

Hey,

I was wondering what are good supplements for large breed puppies that are a must I have a 6 month old Dogue De Bordeaux Mastiff and wanted to make sure he gets all the supplements he is needed especially sense his grandfather was an impressive 210 pounds. And also is it okay to start adding goats milk to his food? I currently have him on the Fromm game bird and boiled rice and chicken rotation every other day.

Thanks for any help. Just want the best for my little guy.

[Kellye P]

It’s been a month since my first post so here’s an update. Duffy had his semi-annual bloodwork done. I don’t have copies of the results yet but my vet said:
Heartworm – negative
Thyroid – normal
Fructosamine – good control
CBC – no abnormal results
She sent his blood to the lab instead of using her own equipment. She wanted to make sure they tested for everything and using the lab allowed her to ask the various specialists questions. She explained that the concern is his weight.
(Sidenote: Duffy is her only underweight client!)
The specialist suggested we test for Cushing’s. I did not want to do that. We have tested him many times before and he always tests normal. However, the specialist said cortisol could play a role in his inability to gain weight. I thought too much cortisol caused weight gain, but I gave in and took him back for the test.
Result: normal
We did a urine culture which was negative. Nothing grew. My vet said that never happens. As I said before, Duffy is the healthiest “deathly ill” dog in the world.

Back when he was at UT Knoxville vet school for an exam, he was put on melatonin and flax lignin. He was not super skinny at that time. I asked my vet if I should go back to giving him those supplements. The idea at the time was to control non-Cushing’s cortisol, even though we could never prove that he had any problems in that area.
I don’t know if it ever worked but he was two pounds heavier.
So we’re back on melatonin and flax lignin.

I have the special enzymes too. I have not used them much since he doesn’t like wet food or kibble soaked in liquid.
Which leads me to my final update — I found a dry food that he loves. It’s made in Ohio so not far from us and it’s delivered fresh to Lexington. The company is called Pet Wants.

Duffy had gained 5 oz in the past ten days. I am beyond thrilled. My goal is 8 lbs and he is now at 6 lbs 7 oz.
Fingers crossed!!!!

[Dori]

I am one of the regulars that feeds a rotational diet. The more quality foods that you can incorporate in your dogs diet the better they will be for it. None of us would eat the same food day in day out ourselves, not a healthy diet. Canines, like us, need variety. I feed many different brands and many different proteins within each brand. I rotate brands and proteins with each meal my three girls eat. I feed twice a day. I also rotate supplements and treats. The treats I feed for the most part are organic fresh fruits and veggies. No store bought treats. Too many recalls for my liking.

[Hildie V]

Hi Susan they do sound alike 🙂

She does best on food I make myself. Also, NRG raw dehydrated, but unfortunately she’s developed a wheat allergy in these wheat germ in NRG so I can’t use anymore.

I’m going to try a ground turkey, beef liver, beef heart, broccoli, zucchini, carrots, and potato next. I supplement with eggshell calcium because I don’t feed her bones. I also give Simon oil, vitamin E, digestive enzymes, probiotic, and a multivitamin and mineral specifically designed for dogs by a holistic vet.

I would suppose just as in humans certain things trigger acid reflux but it can be different in every person and also in every dog. I suppose there’s also an underlying reason why acid reflex is there to start with which is what I really want to get to the bottom of. That is, assuming she actually does have acid reflux and this isn’t something to do with something else because no one seems to know 🙂

I think finding foods that work for the dog is specific to each dog and it’s trial and error. Kibble can be a lot harder for them to break down than fresh food. Fresh food is highly digestible, and usually easier to digest. I would not touch a vet prescribed food with a 10 foot pole… But that’s not saying it doesn’t work for some people and their dogs, is just disgusting to me 🙂

If you want to make your own homemade food but are scared that you might not do it right you can buy a cookbook called Hillary’s Complete and Balanced and you can buy her supplements to go with it and then follow her recipes for homemade food. Her cookbook is only available through veterinarian offices in Canada and off her website in the USA. My girl did great on her venison and potato limited ingredient diet for five months until I couldn’t find the venison anymore at an affordable price :-). That is when I switched her to NRG…

Nothing I have done is a fix for sure, my dog is still having problems, and I like reading about what other people do to try and help myself as well 🙂

[Dog_Obsessed]

I saw some “calorie boost” supplements at the pet store today, maybe those would help?

[Karen J]

Great information, I’m calming down. I’ll still stay grain free, and filtered water- supplements like cranberry and Vit C and be given hidden in a treat separately.

Last year I lost a dog (a senior) but he was so sick and went through so much I just want to be cautious.

Thank you.

[Karen J]

I’m hearing vitamin C and Cranberry. What safe delivery device for Vit C – 500mg? Cheese, cottage cheese or? I used boiled chicken today.

I saw these on Amazon: Cranberry Comfort Soft Chews, are they good?

Also I saw on Amazon strips to measure ph balance of her urine…she hasn’t developed an infection or stones as yet and I’d like to prevent it.

I’ve been getting overwhelming advice to stay away from fish but eHow recommends it – I think I’ll stay away from it.

Karen for Trixie

[Dog_Obsessed]

Just found this thread, and I just wanted to say THANK YOU for taking in a senior pup! I have volunteered with a local senior dog rescue, and I just love the oldies. There is also a great Facebook page called Susie’s Senior Dogs, that posts senior dogs up for adoption along with success stories and resources: https://www.facebook.com/susiesseniordogs

One question for Dori about the glucosamine supplements, I give the stage 1 version to Lily for mild luxuriating patella. I did not know that it was good not to give it with food, is that only for advanced care? Thanks!

[Kristin C]

Hi Kari-I feed both my dogs raw and have found making my own food to be the most economical, although I estimate it’s still almost twice the cost of high end kibble. Buying commercial raw or freeze dried raw is probably 3-4 times more than the kibble. My husband and I agree we’d rather spend the money on real food for them versus vet bills and potential illness. Sounds like you have a lot going on as it is, but you can probably start by making small changes. The book See Spot Live Longer the ABC Way might be a good start. I’ve started using the SSLL Dinner Mix to ensure my homemade meals are AAFCO compliant. There are other supplements and base mixes you can use as well and just add meat. Hope that helps some.

[Kari L]

Hi, I am considering doing a raw food diet with my two dogs. They are old and have no real health problems but do have big lumps forming on their skin for the past 1-2 years. Fatty tumors I am guessing. I haven’t taken them to a vet in a very long time.
My daughter has autism and is obviously my priority. We eat 90% organic diet as a family and spend most of our money doing so among many of her supplements.
I am kind of sick of buying crappy dog food for them. I buy them a grain free dry dog food now which is mostly meat then followed by sweet potato which I know they don’t need.
I am not so worried about these two ( I love them but realize they are on there way out of this world and the damage of their teeth wont be repaired) but when they go would like to ditch the crappy dog food for sure.
So sorry for the long introduction but my question is how much does this all cost and how much preparation is involved? I have been buying what I thought was raw dog food at Whole Foods lately but realized it was lightly pasteurized. It was lamb and many lamb organs with many synthetic vitamins/minerals.
Do most people use synthetic vitamins/minerals on this diet? Again total newbie but do love nutrition.
BTW my dogs now are 11 and are 10 and 15 pounds. My next dog I plan will be bigger like a golden retriever.
Thank you much!

[Bobby dog]

Thanks so much for taking the time to write your experience with these products. The beets caught my eye a few months back. I have a healthy pup at this time, but was checking it out for his skin and coat. A year ago his skin and coat was a mess. I have since resolved his issues with diet changes and other supplements, but I am always on the lookout for any natural supplement.

What a time you have had with your guys! Nice to read you had the patience and knowledge to find a diet that works for your IBS dog, that’s half the battle. Your Sr. fellow sounds like he has benefitted from your care as well! 🙂

[Jude s]

Hey! I was going to make a thread on this topic, but I saw this one….I hope it’s ok if I can ask my question on here 🙂
My 2 month old puppy has really soft stool, foul smelling, some mucus, and always seems to push kind of hard. He doesn’t whimper, he still eats and plays just fine.
I checked for worms, or any white specs, but he’s clear. I’m thinking he’s just having some irritation. I was thinking on putting him on some digestive enzyme supplements, I saw the suggested ones above, but not sure if those are ok for my puppy. I also saw the honest kitchen had supplements as well (Perfect Form & Pro Bloom).
Also if this helps he is a pitbull/chihuahua mix and about 7.5 lbs. He is eating Wellness puppy kibble, but I will be introducing raw foods sometime this month.

[pugmomsandy]

Kathleen,

Have you tried giving some probiotic/digestive enzyme supplement with meals? My pup used to have such baaaaaad gas but after giving the supplements for a while, the gas is gone no matter what kind of food they eat. I used to give it everyday, but now just a couple times a week.

[Jude s]

Wow, Thanks everyone! I’m going to try SSLL dinner mix 🙂 I’ll experiment with different meats, and the sardines little by little. Also I was thinking of adding enzyme pro-biotic supplements , one of my pups is having really soft stool, and a lot of it. I’m going to be taking them both to the vet, but I’m hoping the supplements will work.

[theBCnut]

As growing puppies, large and giant breeds have very specific calcium requirements, which most large breed puppy foods don’t even meet, but once they are grown, you can feed them whatever. Just concentrate on feeding a correct amount of good quality food so that they don’t become overweight and more prone to joint issues. You may also want to add a joint supplement to help ward off damage to joints.

Some large breed formulas have joint supplements added in, but they are never actually at a therapeutic dose unless you over feed by quite a lot. Some restrict one nutrient or another based on old outdated research.

[Kristin C]

USA-what supplements do you use?

[USA]

Hi cindy q,

I feed my guys a homemade diet of fresh pasture-raised meats, free-range poultry and wild-caught fish. I do not feed them any foods that contain ground bone because I lightly cook everything. Their diet is about 80% meats and 20% vegetables. They occasionally get organs and fruits. I lightly cook everything and I use supplements to make sure their diet is balanced and complete.

[Dori]

I have never seen any bone or bone pieces in the food. I agree with cindy q on the issue of bones.

USA and anyone else interested. I just spoke to someone at Big Dog Natural. They air dry their food at 80 – 100 degrees Fahrenheit for 24 hours.

I decided that instead of guessing, I would just pick up the phone and call. My call was returned within 20 minutes. I have never once been given the run around with any question I have asked. They have been nothing but forthcoming with me. I choose to have the food in rotation with my three dogs everyone else can make up their own minds. As I have said often in the past…..these issues that are being questioned back and forth may very well not sit well with some if this is the ONLY food you are going to feed your dogs. Most of us on DFA rotate foods, supplements, within the brands and different brands. Anyway, my dogs love the food and they have absolutely no issues with the food. No diarrhea, gas, no constipation, no itchiness, no bad breath, no tear stains, no gurgling stomachs, their poops are exactly the way they should be for dogs that eat raw-small well formed not too hard don’t stick to the ground no smell whatsoever.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by Dori.

[Liz S]

Been using Dinovite on and off for almost 10 years. Did wonders on my pug. And chihuahuas. The only treats our dogs get is their freeze dried beef treats. Have been getting the treats for many years but when certain health problems arose we did find the supplements helpful.

[theBCnut]

From my understanding, there is no harm, but you can just give them a couple time a week. Some probiotics come with a prebiotic in with them. If you need to stick with one food, I would add the prebiotics too, just in case the food is not supporting them well enough. Fiber supplements that contain inulin are a good cheap prebiotic and a little goes a long way.

[DogFoodie]

Hi SunnyD,

Looks like the NVI raw duck bites are a good choice with sodium at .27%.

The product also includes heart, which is excellent glandular therapy.

Here’s a couple of threads you might also be interested in:
/forums/topic/food-and-supplements-for-my-cavi-with-heart-murmur/; /forums/topic/dry-dog-food-with-low-salt-and-low-fat/

[SunnyD]

I have 2 yorkies that are 11 years old. Last fall my female yorkie was diagnosed with a heart murmur and Congestive Heart Failure. At the time both dogs were eating Nature’s Variety Raw duck bites. The vet had me switch her to a low sodium diet of prescription HD wet food. I hate the corn and other fillers in the prescription food. Currently, she is on enalapril, furosemide and vetmedin. I have to give her her pills twice per day (all in one Allergy formula Pill Pocket). She gobbles it right up. I try to give her as little of the pill pocket as possible because I have no idea how much sodium they have. I would love to switch her back to the Nature’s Variety Raw duck bites. Is that a safe low sodium diet for CHF? Any supplements she should be taking? Or other recommendations? Thanks.

[theBCnut]

WHOA!!!!! EVERYONE!!!!!

A dog that has been starved will have its system completely overwhelmed just by getting regular food. PLEASE!!! Slow down!!

Start with something bland like chicken and rice and only feed about half of what you think she should be getting, for about 3 days. Feel free to add probiotics and digestive enzymes at this time and keep feeding them until all her issues are worked out. After a few days, increase her food to about 3/4 of what she should be getting and then a few days after that increase it to the full amount. Then after a few more days, start adding in some quality dog food, just 1/4 of a meal or less at first. Slowly transition her to full dog food. After that, if you find she still needs different supplements then add them in one at a time every few days.

Your poor girl cannot physically handle all the good things you are trying to do for her. Her body has to have time to adjust to just getting regular meals.

[Bobby dog]

The supplements the Vet suggested should help with her anemia, poor thing.

I have a healthy, younger pup and supplement with MSM daily, kefir for probiotics, garlic 3x/wk, fish oil capsules 3x/wk when I don’t feed sardines, coconut oil 3x/wk, and vit E 1x/wk. For fresh foods I feed some vegies, fruit, lightly cooked fresh meats (he does not have a taste for raw), and a 1 minute poached egg 1-2x/week which helps keep his skin and coat beautiful. I know their are some wonderful commercial supplements out there that would help with healing her immune system, but I don’t have any suggestions for a dog with her health issues. I do recommend looking into digestive enzymes and probiotics for starters. Some probiotics recommended by regular posters are Dr. Stephen Langer’s Ultimate 15 Strain Probiotic, Swanson Ultra Soil Based Organisms (I believe this might also contain digestive enzymes, not sure), and Mercola complete. Here is a link to Dogaware for a starting point that might help you find info on supplements for her and some other topics as well.
http://dogaware.com/diet/supplements.html

Info on kefir and coco oil:
http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/05/foods-rich-in-probiotics-beneficial-for.html

http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/02/coconut-oil-is-good-for-your-dogs.html

I will throw this out to you which may or may not interest/help you to improve her kibble diet if that is what you are going to continue to feed her. I follow Steve Brown’s “ABC Diet.” It is an easy menu plan that helps you improve any quality of kibble following a simple menu and according to the dog’s weight with fresh foods (raw or lightly cooked meat) you can buy at the grocery store.
http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html

[Robyn H]

My bad, the vet did blood work and Dr says’ she’s anemic and wants to put her on an iron supplement and a fatty acid supplement as well. I’m going to put her on a green tripe diet for the time being and see how that works. Any suggestions on the supplements?

[Bobby dog]

Hi Victoria W:
I understand your budget constraints and hopefully I can offer some more suggestions in addition to the ones you have received. You are very kind to give your relative’s dogs the extra attention they need!

It is surprising they would continue to pay for office visits and medication without trying a new diet as well. However, it sounds like she has an infection and needs antibiotics at this time.

Buying a 50 lbs. bag of food is convenient for large dog owners. Throw in a price of about 45 cents/lb. and it’s hard to talk someone out of buying it. In the future, if you are able to convince them to try another food they should expect to pay at least $1/lb. for a food with more meat protein; about $10 – $15 more per bag. If they would agree to this price point you could find some decent kibbles for them in 40-50 lbs bags.

If you decide to add a new food or supplement be sure to add slowly and in small portions building up to the desired amounts.

If your relatives will only shop at Wal-Mart for dog food and are adamant about feeding Ol’ Roy, maybe you could suggest they try adding other brands to their dogs’ diet along with Ol’ Roy. Here‘s a thread with kibble & canned foods available at Wal-Mart with decent ratings:
/forums/search/Wal-Mart/

There is a PDF download from Steve Brown, “See Spot Live Longer the ABC Way.” It will help you improve any quality of kibble with the addition of fresh foods (eggs, tinned fish, fresh meat, vegetables) you can get at the grocery store. There is a menu that walks you through the amounts of each food to add according to the quality of kibble being fed and the size of the dog. I feed anything from a 3 to 5 star kibble and this download helps me to improve my dog’s diet very easily and affordably. I add the fresh food over several meals rather than feeding it in one day.
http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html

I don’t always have sardines on hand for my dog and when I don’t I supplement his diet with CVS drug store 1000 mg fish oil capsules 3x/week. I also supplement vitamin E once a week regardless if I feed sardines or CVS fish oil. Here’s a link to more info on supplements, it’s also a great site with lots of other info:
http://dogaware.com/diet/supplements.html

As far as mercury or chemical contamination, smaller fish are not usually high in contaminates due to their short life span and the depth of water they live in. Herring, menhaden, and sardines are some smaller species. Here’s a site with some more info on contamination in fish and a link to a wallet card with a list of fish and the degree of contamination they may have:
http://www.nrdc.org/health/effects/mercury/

I think adding some probiotics to her diet would really help with her skin issues; it helped tremendously with healing my cat’s skin. This would also help keep the antibiotics from destroying the friendly bacteria in her digestive system. An affordable way to do this is to feed unflavored kefir; most grocery stores sell kefir and it has a very long shelf life. I add it to my cat and dog’s food daily. Here’s some info:
http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/05/foods-rich-in-probiotics-beneficial-for.html

Other probiotics recommended by regular posters are Dr. Stephen Langer’s Ultimate 15 Strain Probiotic, Swanson Ultra Soil Based Organisms, and Mercola complete.

Coconut oil would be another food that would help with her skin. I add it to my dog’s food 3x/week, more if he has skin issues. I also apply it directly to his skin when it’s irritated. Unfortunately, he loves it so much I have to be sure I have time to supervise him so he doesn’t lick it off before it’s absorbed. Only use unrefined organic. The best price I have found for it was at BJ’s or Costco; Wal-Mart also has a good price just in a smaller jar. Here’s some info on the benefits and dosage:
http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/02/coconut-oil-is-good-for-your-dogs.html

After a bad experience with my cat and steroids when my dog developed a skin infection I was more than willing to put in the work I needed to help him heal. Bathing with medicated shampoo and applying antibiotic cream regularly was integral in healing his infection. The active ingredients in Malasab shampoo is 2% Miconazole Nitrate and 2% Chlorhexidine Gluconate. There are some generic alternatives that might be more budget friendly. Look for my post on page 3 from June 9, 2014 at 6:40 pm for info on some alternatives and for some ingredients to look for in medicated shampoos.
/forums/topic/maybe-its-time-for-a-diet-change/page/3/

I don’t have any experience with a dog that has hip dysplasia, but I think you are on the right track with a glucosamine supplement. Here are two threads that might be helpful:
/forums/topic/joint-health/
/forums/topic/budget-friendly-supplements-for-14-year-old-dachshund/

And here’s a coupon thread that might help with your pet food budget. The first page is an intro and the last page has the most current info posted.
Page 1:
/forums/topic/coupons/
Current page:
/forums/topic/coupons/page/15/

[Bobby dog]

Very nice update! So glad you got her in for an exam and to care for her teeth. You really should give brushing her teeth a try. Sometimes it’s easier than you think it would be. I used to brush this grumpy old Chi mix’s teeth for a friend of mine because she was afraid of being bitten. You would imagine she would bite your hand off as grumpy as she was, but it was just the opposite she would just try her best to taste every bit of the paste.

When my JRT reached her senior years I just gave her some of my horses joint supplement. Joint supplements are expensive and it’s cheaper that way when you have a zoo. I use mostly Uckele and the Natural Vet products, some Vita-Flex and Select the Best also. My favorite supplement for my entire zoo is MSM. Pure MSM is very cheap to buy at tack shops or feed stores. I would look for a supplement with glucosamine, MSM, chondroitin, and hyaluronic acid (HA). Devils claw and yucca is good too.
http://equine.uckele.com/Canine/joint

Here’s a brief article on herbs for animal arthritis:
http://www.animalwellnessmagazine.com/articles/top-5-herbs-for-arthritis/

[Akari_32]

Just giving you guys a little update.

I took Ginger to the vet with me this morning and we did a urinalysis on her, and the vet did an over all general exam. Despite her nasty teeth, and the good 10 or so fatty tumors, she’s in good health. We did what we could through a make-sift muzzle with her teeth (we used a bit of gauze tied around her mouth as a muzzle so we could get at her teeth with out her biting, and “cracked” off what tartar build up we could), and her pee came out looking good. The tech said one day, when I’m rich and famous, I should get her teeth done for real, but we both know thats pretty unlikely lol

I was concerned with a kidney problem because she had pee’d just straight water last week on the floor, and I can’t ever see how it looks in the grass obviously, but the tech didn’t find anything suspicious in there today, and I’m not going to pay for blood work if we don’t need to do it. If it persists, then I’ll worry about it, but she seems fine, and going off what I’ve told them, they don’t seem worried about it either.

When we were doing her teeth, she started on one of her canines, and said it was too loose for her to feel comfortable with doing much to, and that it would likely fall out some time soon. And poor Ginger just cried and cried when we were done with her teeth. Hopefully getting some of that junk off her teeth will make her mouth feel better, though. I’ll give her all canned food tonight so she doesn’t have to crunch on the kibbles.

Anyways, she’s as healthy as she’s going to get at the moment, which is good. I’m looking into some joint supplements, and hopefully that’ll help with her biting when getting picked up, once those start to kick in, and help relieve some of that pain, as well. The vet sent me home with a script for chewable amoxicillin to help with her mouth situation, and gave me two refills for when its starts getting bad again. Free antibiotics is the best I can do for her teeth and mouth at the moment and he knows it. If we were to do anything beyond that, it’d be knocking her and pulling all her teeth (or at least a good majority of them), which I can’t afford, and would like to avoid if possible, anyways lol At this point, he’s just happy to see her in a home thats caring for her, and I’m sure Ginger feels the same way.

[Mom2Cavs]

Hi, Cav lover! I have 3 and all 3 of mine have murmurs. Hazel has a grade 2 that was early onset and hasn’t changed in 5 years. She’s 7 now. She is on no meds at this time. Laverne is 9 and was diagnosed with a grade 3/4 about a year ago. She is on no meds at this time. Rupert is 7 and was just diagnosed this past April with a grade 5 and MVD. 🙁 He is doing fine, atm, and is on enalapril. I do give supplements like coq10 and fish oil. I have used others in the past, in supplements like Bio-Cardio by Thorne and Cardio Strength from Vetri Science. My vet likes to use Standard Process glandular supps. and I’ve used the Cardiac care one. I do know that homecooked or raw would probably be best but I do as good as I can for them. I am feeding a rotation of base kibbles, Wellness Simple Small Breed, Fromm Salmon Tunalini. I add canned foods like Fromm 4Star, Wellness 95% or Stews, Simply Nourish and also Fresh Pet Vital. They are great eaters! You can also find tons of info. at this site: cavalierhealth.org. Good luck with your pup, they are a special kind of breed!

One more thing…..I do know that Wellness makes a Small Breed Senior (only comes in 4lb. bags, though) that is lower, controlled sodium but it’s not grain free (if that’s a concern, may not be). Actually, pretty much all of Wellness Small Breed formulas have decent salt percentages (not outlandish).

• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by Mom2Cavs.

[theBCnut]

I use horse supplements on the dogs. I really like Cortaflex, but I add MSM separately. I order from Jefferspet dot com. They have a supplement in their dog section that I have used before and liked, but I like Cortaflex better.

[Wendy E]

Hi all,
I’m new here, so hello! Lots of good reading here! I have a 5YO Cavalier female named Willow, who was just diagnosed with a grade 3 heart murmur, which seems to have developed very quickly (our regular vet did not hear it just 6 short months ago, but the cardiologist found it this past saturday at a heart clinic). I’m trying to research what the best food and supplements are for this condition. I really prefer feeding her a dry/kibble food. The vet recommended a low-sodium food (have no idea what I should choose – nothing seems to be marketed specifically as low-sodum), and supplementation with CoQ10 and Vit E. My head is swimming with everything I’ve found in just a short amount of time researching. Are these the only supplements you’d recommend? I’ve also read quite a bit about glandular therapy for heart health and am wondering what everyone here thinks about that and what a good supplement for that would be.

I found this website when searching for glandulars. http://www.pethealthandnutritioncenter.com/natural-heart-cardiovascular-remedy-treatment-dogs-cats-pets.html wondering about the Heart Tonic product and the Daily Multi Complete (which has glandulars in it). Anyone have experience with this supplier or these products?

I’m also wondering (and these might be ultra-basic knowledge to most, but I can’t find anything that will tell me): If I do a Fish Oil like this one http://www.pethealthandnutritioncenter.com/nordic-naturals-fish-oil-supplement-for-pets.html do I also still supplement with Vit E and CoQ10?

I hate researching this stuff because there always seems to be such conflicting information out there. Any help anyone could give me would be SO appreciated! TIA!

Wendy
mom to Willow

[Akari_32]

Thanks Patty, I’ll look for something like that. Any brands you know of that would be a good starting point for my search?

Melissa, that is exactly why I brought her home in the first place. The previous owner literally came into the vets office I’m interning at and said she’s biting, and to put her down. She was obviously extremely stressed about something and in poor health, which right away caught my (relatively slight, but ever increasing) knowledge of animal behavior. She had been in about two weeks before for a bladder infection, and was given liquid amoxicillin. The owner was, and I quote, putting her in a head lock and shoving it down her throat. And guess when all this biting started? Right after the antibiotics started. Imagine that. Doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out a simple change in administering the medication would have solved all your problems, lady! I just wunna smack that chick… lol

So now, I’m working with her on not flinching away from contact (she used to expect every touch to hurt, but now she’s pretty good about not being so stressed about it, and loves butt scratches and ear rubs), and I’m working with her on at least accepting being picked up, because lets face it– a small dog has to be picked up at some point or another. There are places they just can’t (or won’t and need to be) get to themselves. I think once she’s on something that is helping relieve some of that pain, we will get further with getting her more comfortable with certain things. I think she may need to be on something like Previcox for the rest her life for actual pain relief, though. But before I do that, I want to see how she does on joint supplements, as it is safer in the long run for her, and easier on my budget.

One big thing I’ve noticed, after we take a decent walk, and she’s all exhausted and in a good, happy mood, and she’s too tired to care, I can pick her right up and she’s happy to let me. You can see a relief and acceptance in her eyes at being picked up when she’s in that state. So a good deal of it is certainly mental from whatever rough treatment she was subjected to before, but I have no doubt that over all, she is in some degree of pain, and it does need to be dealt with. I can only imagine how uncomfortable it is for her to be hurting all the time.

[theBCnut]

Look for a supplement that has HA in the name or hyaluronic acid in the ingredients. I also like MSM in joint supplements. It helps as a carrier for glucosamine and has biologically available sulfur, which joints need.

[Akari_32]

As you guys may know, I recently took in an old Dachshund with several health and behavioral problems, all due to lack of proper care and rough treatment.

One of her biggest problems is she’s always limping and when she hurts too much, she lashes out at almost any handling (mainly when being picked up). I know they are prone to back problems, and from what I’ve seen of her extremely limited vet records, she’s had no such problems. She does have problems with her shoulders and hips, though. Typical old dog stuff, really, but she’s learned from experience in her previous home that lashing out and biting when she’s in pain will get her left alone. I need to get her on some sort of good, but relatively cheap, joint/etc supplement (glucosamine is the first thing that comes to mind) that will help with any pain she’s having, and help prevent or slow down any further joint or bone damage and help with the arthritis I’m sure she has. I also need some tips on getting her to understand that biting is not the answer, if anyone has any.

She loves to be active, and I want to keep her that way. She does limp more after walks, but she doesn’t seem to notice, and loves the stimulation. It’s like she loves to just be so tired she doesn’t want to do anything. She just looks so happy after long walks, and you can tell that she is over all calmer and less high strung (she paces all day with no good walks) . Obviously, I want to keep her happy and active, but I don’t want to cause any more damage to her joints, so we need to get her on something good before she gets much worse.

I’ve tried Pro Sense glucosamine chewables from Walmart on my other dogs, and they really didn’t do anything that I noticed. Granted, they don’t really have any problems in that department, despite being large and freakishly huge, and 10 11 years old, so there is that. I shop mostly at Pet Supermarket and PetSmart, but can also go to PetCo and look at stuff online, and I work at Publix (only one dog joint supplement there, but it’s like $20, so I’m good on that, but people supplements are always an option, too).

And she is already on fish oil and coconut oil, rotated daily, so that’s already covered. So, anything you guys have, go for it! I’d like to only spend about $10 a month, if possible, but take that loosely when giving me suggestions.

Thanks guys!

[Victoria W]

Hello All,
This is a desperate attempt to help a dog who is currently very very miserable. I am living with relatives for a short duration, and ever since I have been here with them their beautiful chocolate lab has had severe allergies. She is 4 years old this fall and suffers from seasonal allergies. She is so itchy, her fur is being chewed off on her abdomen and legs, and every few weeks she gets a horrible irritation under her neck that looks so infected! I don’t trust the vet my relatives are using, she seems more than happy to keep pushing very strong antibiotics and prednisone off on this dog. The dog will get better after about a week, but by better I mean the rash and oozing sores start to lessen, at the expense of her vibrance (when on the prescribed regimine of meds she just lays around and sleeps). They feed all 4 of their big dogs Ol’ Roy dog food, one of if not the worst dog foods out there. They wont listen to me about needing to change them over and currently I can push no more. ( I will continue to try though) Until they see reason what natural supplements can I give her on top of her food to help her out. Also, I’ve been giving their golden retriever who has hip dysplasia glucosimine tablets any suggestions there also.

[CMZ]

Crazy4cats
Sorry for the misunderstanding, he was diagnosed with hip dysplasia as a pup. 4 months old.
I agree when the first ingredient is corn!! I do keep his weight down. He is only 94-95 lbs.
They are so stoic, I can never really tell if he is having trouble. When we took him in to the vets in August, they thought he was a bit stiff, so we started him on the injectable adequin
Again, so hard to tell if its helping. I just took him off the rimadyl a couple days ago, I don’t really notice any difference. So I guess thats a good thing.
As far as the food JD is suppose to have a good amount of glucosamine for his joints. But for now I think I will keep him on his current foods and just the supplements. I don’t like the corn as the first ingredient. thanks

[pugmomsandy]

I wouldn’t feed BDN as a sole diet without supplements long term without receiving a full nutrient analysis (I’m sure those tests are expensive too). Even the recipes in “Real Food for Healthy Dogs and Cats” comes with a vitamin mix recipe and a nutrient analysis for the different recipes. There are some folks (maybe hardcore BARFers) that only feed whole prey and nothing else. Depends on which school of thought you go with and your comfort level. Back in the day dogs grew up on table scraps. Sometimes we make it more difficult than it is.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 2 months ago by pugmomsandy.