Need help starting out raw diet for small toy breeds

Dog Food Advisor Forums Raw Dog Food Need help starting out raw diet for small toy breeds

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  • #55598 Report Abuse
    Lillian N
    Member

    I’ve been really trying to do a lot of research on this raw feeding thing but as much information as I’ve been stockpiling the more uneasy I become when it comes to the supplements part of it. Most sample diets I’ve seen are for much larger dogs (40 lbs and up) and my chihuahuas are really small (5 and 7 lb respectively) I think I got most of the other parts down and I’m pretty comfortable feeding them on the raw meats/organs part (no bone, they are gulpers and don’t like to chew thoroughly) so I am feeding them a whole sardine once or twice a wk to help with calcium thought I am not sure if this is sufficient. If anyone else has a small breed can you please provide me with a sample diet of what you are feeding your dogs? I want to make a full switch to raw since they do so well on it and I would prefer not to use mixes or pre-made ones(too expensive..) I was going to simply add a multivitamin and calcium supplement as well as vitamin e to the 1 lb of ground meat and organs +veggie mix I was going to make and feed them for the whole month but I read on dogaware.com that human multivitamins aren’t suitable for small breeds. any help would be much appreciated!

    #55600 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    No, feeding sardines a couple times a week would not be adequate calcium except for those sardines. Each meal needs to have the amount of calcium that it needs and the calcium in sardines is only enough for sardines. Look into See Spot Live Longer Dinner Mix or Dr Harvey’s Veg to Bowl Fine Ground. They are premixes with all the vitamins and minerals in them for boneless meat. Depending on what else you feed, you may have to add oil too, but other than that they are easy and complete.

    #55621 Report Abuse
    Lillian N
    Member

    Thank you for giving me more information about the calcium. I will look into a way to rectify that. Also, seeing as how I stated above that I would prefer not to use premixes, any other suggestions? I can’t buy them locally and right now am not in a good position for having it shipped to me.

    #55622 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    I had the same problem as you, trying to translate large breed feeding into small dog portions. I ended up just sort of making up as I went. I have an 8 lb Jack Russell mix and I use See Spot Live Longer, and 5 oz of meat (whole, cut up roaster or fried chickens, beef heart, ground pork, chicken heart, gizzards– all cheap in my area), and about once a week I’ll give just a 5-6 oz portion of a chicken leg or thigh, with no pre mix (the extra calcium in the pre mix makes his poop too hard when he gets bones lol). I use just under a tablespoon of mix, since the directions are 2 tablespoons per pound of meat, and I give him 5 oz. I freeze each portion of meat in quart freezer bags, and thaw daily, serving at room temp (in fridge over night, and then taken out a few hours before serving).

    The pre mix is mixed into a little water (probably about a tablespoon or two), and the meat is served in large pieces, with the exception of hearts and gizzards, which are cubed into 1 inch squares, and obviously the ground meat. The mix is even so good that he licks the bowl completely clean– and he hates most veggies! Lol

    #55627 Report Abuse
    Lillian N
    Member

    thank you for your answer… I see it’s another suggestion for premix. Is it just not possible to do a raw diet without a premix for smaller dogs? That is really unfortunate.

    #55628 Report Abuse
    pugmomsandy
    Moderator

    You can use bone meal or ground egg shell for calcium. Dogaware also had some other suggestions.

    #55630 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    I think a premix is easiest for most people. Not everyone can afford (or has the knowledge to) properly balance a homemade raw diet. If you can do it, by all means go for it! You’d be doing better than most lol Lots of people just aren’t comfortable tackling something so serious. If done improperly, the consequences are very bad. I know I don’t have the means, finances, or knowledge on how to make a balanced raw diet! Lol

    Just curious, but what about shipping do you not want to do? SSLL comes in a box the size of a VHS tape, and fits in the mail box. No signing or anything needed, and it’s only $17. I’ve calulated it, and figured the 1 lb bag will last me about 5 months. It’s the cheapest way I’ve figured out– trust me, I’m a deal hunter 😉

    #55631 Report Abuse
    Lillian N
    Member

    right now I am in between addresses/moving and so do not want to ship any food until my address is stable. Also, been having some problems with lost mail lately… Since premixes look like the only safe option to go, what are your opinions on The Honest Kitchen Keen or Sojo original? I asked around and one of my friends said they think they saw those two at a pet store near them. It seems the general consensus around here is that The Honest Kitchen Preference is well, the preference but I saw that it was the only variety that isn’t “formulated to meet and exceed the AAFCO nutrient profile” also, can’t get it locally. If I could buy a premix for a reasonable price on something like Amazon, where they have a great customer service if I run into problems etc rather then a independent company that I have never dealt with I would be willing to try it

    #55633 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    The only issues I had with both of those mixes is how much they need to eat of it. Just seems like too much to me. However, I’d go with THK if you wanted to go with either of those. You won’t find anything as low priced as SSLL, anywhere. It’s just the nature of pre-mixes. There are some that are $80+ a bag! With only two small dogs to feed, price may not be a factor with you, though. Look around, and see if there’s anything you like. The best ones I’ve heard of are SSLL and Urban Wolf, but if you Google “dog raw diet pre-mix” or something to that effect, you may find something you like better. My goal for a pre-mix was low carb and small portions. Not everyone needs something so specific.

    I would also like to add that most people order their meats online that do their own homemade raw diets for their pets. You’d be hard pressed to find everything you need locally, and for a good price. However, I’m not sure what websites people like to use for that. I know of haretoday, and that’s it.

    #55636 Report Abuse
    Lillian N
    Member

    How about grandma lucy’s or dr. harvey’s veg to bowl? are those any better then sojos or THK keen?

    #55637 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    SoJo and Keen are not premixes, they are complete foods. The premixes do not meet AAFCO because they are not the whole meal, they are the vitamins, minerals, and other things that have to be added to raw meat.

    You can certainly balance homemade raw. Find a recipe you like and make sure you use ingredients that are cut to the size that you can portion them out into the amounts your dogs need. Freeze what you won’t use within a couple days. Then find another recipe, so you feed a variety and cover all your nutritional bases.

    Most people find it a bit overwhelming at first, so that’s why I recommended some premixes. Sorry it wasn’t the advice you wanted, but it did boost your post up where other will see it.

    #55644 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    Sojos does have a pre-mix, but I don’t know what it’s called. THKs pre-mix that I can remember the name of is Preference. They also have two new ones that should be out by now, as well. Didn’t catch the fact that you had actual recipes down in your previous post!

    Grandma Lucy’s is also extremely low in calories and has large portions. Some of these pre-mixes you’re looking at require that dogs about the size of ours (in the 10lb range) to eat something like 1 lb of food. I feed 5 oz to Bentley, and even that sometimes looks like a lot, but I couldn’t imagine giving him a whole pound. His belly already gets round after his 5 oz, he’d probably explode with much more lol Thats why I chose SSLL– its measured in tablespoons, not cups. If you decide to go the pre-mix route, just look at how much you’d be feeding, and judge it with canned food. That will already give a good idea of how much your be offering. If you think it may seem like too much, you may want to pick something else.

    I’ve never used Dr Harvey’s, nor could I find any directions online on how to make it when i was looking for a pre-mix, so can’t say anything on that. Some dogs may not like the chuncks of veggies (I think Sojo’s is similar? Can’t remember), so that’s more of a does-the-dog-like-it thing.

    Like I said, if you have everything available to do a all raw homemade diet, go for it! Pre-mixes are just an alternative for people who can’t find/afford all the organ meats and supliments, or who decide a completely raw diet is something they can’t manage to balance. The other day when I went shopping to buy some meat to replenish the freezer, I flipped out when I saw fresh kidney in the meat department. You just don’t usually see organs in most places, especially not in a grocery store. Now, if you had a good butcher locally, that might be something different, but I personally don’t.

    #55659 Report Abuse
    Lillian N
    Member

    the honest kitchen keen is not a premix, I apologize. It is a dog food. I got it mixed up with preference. I thought the different names (kindly, keen, preference, force etc) were just different flavors lol. The Sojos I was talking about said ‘original premix’ on it. The Grandma Lucy’s and sojo are using about 5 spoonfuls of the premix and you mix with about 5 oz of meat. That does seem like an awful lot but then again both lucy’s and sojo look like they are bulked up with oatmeal and stuff. I don’t really know how my dogs do on oatmeal. I saw I and Love and You premix at Sprouts today and it had oatmeal in it as well. Is Dr.Harvey’s just bulked up with dried fruits and veg? My dogs are pretty good about fruit/veg eating so I would just rather give it to them fresh. SSLL looks like it has just the minerals and vitamins, spinach and eggs. However, since I am not really able to buy SSLL at the moment and it’s not available anywhere but that site, I guess I will have to go back to my kibble for now. It’s too bad they don’t sell it on amazon.

    #55664 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    The Dr Harvey’s fine ground is chopped up veggies, about the size of peppercorns. My dogs digest it great but the course ground was bigger pieces and someone(I think HDM) said undigested pieces came out the other end. I haven’t used it in a while, but I think the Dr Harvey’s was 1/4 cup of it per pound of meat, might have been per pound of finished food instead.

    #104023 Report Abuse
    Erika C
    Member

    Hi! If you have time you don’t need to go with premix, I have 2 small dogs, and I started today to with the barf diet. I’ve researched a los about how should I balance their food, how much to give, etc… I saw you are worried about calcium that is something easy to fix, you just have to give them whole eggs (shells incluides since they are small you can give them 1 or 2 quail egg each day) you can give them calcium supplements too, mines take multivitamins and calcium supplements just in case, you can buy it in petco, I also going to start adding to their food bone meal is in powder form so you don’t have to worry giving bones, one of mines doesn’t even like to chew bones🙄 So supplements are good options, if you have a miller you can try milling chicken neck bones to just add it to their food

    #104810 Report Abuse
    poodaddy
    Member

    This thread is old (2014) then jumps to 2017. If anyone is tracking on this subject, and wants to collaborate in a specific “area” of this site, who can help understand how to manage a forum or subject, concerning the pursuit of and finishing of a raw dog food system that is complete from create the menu, crunch the numbers, determine the supplements (from the science of nutrition), let me know. I am into this in a big way, have been cataloging the personal journey from knowing nothing to gaining 100% control of the data, have the background in model development, and have the interest in using science to demystify it all. And it is all driven by my love for my two cockapoos and nothing else.

    I am on a quest to find a group (of one or more) who have this interest as I am at the 90% stage on completing the project.

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