[Marionne H]

Thanks Pugmomsandy. Isn’t feeding raw whole parts really messy?

[pugmomsandy]

I feed kibble with extras! The extras can be canned food, freeze dried pieces, tonight it’s a scrambled egg. They had raw duck necks three times this week.

[Kelly K]

if you’re on Facebook there is a raw feeding site devoted to it and they also have a Yahoo group. I can’t help with the Facebook link as I closed my account there but here is their Yahoo link

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/rawfeeding/info

If you can’t get the link to work because the group is private try this: http://www.rawlearning.com

I’ll warn you though that this raw feeding group is about feeding whole, raw food such as beef heart, pork shoulder, whole raw chicken, goat legs, nothing is ground. Their theory is that this is how dogs have eaten over evolution and that kibble is awful for them.

I did it for a while but I have a great dane and it became too much for me to manage. I can say that he loved the whole pork shoulder and every once in a while I will still give him whole chicken quarters. The bones help keep his teeth clean.

• This reply was modified 10 years ago by Kelly K.

[Marionne H]

I’m looking for recommendations for kibble for the small breed dog I recently adopted. She’s on Evo Small Bites Chicken and Turkey, but I have concerns about Evo’s quality record. I did a bunch of research and decided we’d try Acana…got a bag of Wild Prairie today and offered her a few kibbles. The kibbles are just a little too large for her, she has to pick each one up and break it and didn’t seem at all thrilled with the taste of it. So, back to the drawing board for me. Recent changes in the pet food market make it difficult to know what is safe. Looking for a high quality petite kibble from a reputable company.

[pugmomsandy]

I’ve used CarnivoRaw by Young Again Pet Food. It’s a powder. On my list to try out is Urban Wolf as well. The recipe book Real Foods for Healthy Dogs and Cats includes a vitamin mix recipe as well.

[Mr Jones [border collie]]

New to the raw scene but I love my border collie she’s 7 months old and I want her to live a long healthy life! So I’ve been checking into raw diets and I found the home style kitchen base mix but everyone’s got mixed reviews on it. Is there anything else out their like that? Thanks!

• This topic was modified 10 years ago by Mr Jones [border collie].
• This topic was modified 10 years ago by Mr Jones [border collie].

[Marionne H]

I would consult a vet. Your dog might have a medical issue or a dental problem. I had a dog with a stomach ulcer several years who could not eat kibble; it was too processed for him and apparently upset his stomach. We tried a number of kibbles then realized there was something more to it…every time he would excitedly eat the new kibble for a few days then stop eating it. He was always willing to try something new…but it still made him feel bad. 🙁 We ended up putting him on an acid reducer to help with his ulcer and I home cooked as he felt better but still could not eat the kibble consistently. If I had to do it again I would have tried a raw diet for him. I’d consult a vet to confirm whether there is anything physically wrong, then consider trying a raw diet (the prepared mixes are expensive but more convenient than making your own). Kibble might be too processed for him.

[C4D]

Hi Coonhound Mama,

I use dried tracheas for my dogs, but as an occaisonal after dinner chew. I have labs so they get the bigger trancheas. I have seen them in some pet stores cut up as “chips”. It is a good source of glucosamine.

I’m not sure, and still researching, if it applies to dried trachea, but you have to be careful when feeding fresh or raw trachea. Apparently the thyroid tissue is somethimes still attached to the raw tracheas and some trace amounts can be found within the entire trachea. If it’s fed in rotation or on a limited quantity, it appears to be ok. If fed too often there seems to be some research regarding hyperthyroidism resulting in dogs that have been fed gullet.

Here are a couple of links regarding the issue:

https://thesciencedog.wordpress.com/2015/10/29/got-gullet/

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2014/11/04/hyperthyroidism-dogs.aspx

I did look up the Hare today website and it seems the thyroid might still be attached. I’d love to hear others thoughts and experiences on this.

• This reply was modified 10 years ago by C4D.

[Aaron J]

Who has tried this company? What do you order? What are your thoughts?

Thanks for your help!

[pugmomsandy]

Real Food for Healthy Dogs and Cats has recipes that include bone meal if you are just going to grind meat without bones. It also has a vitamin recipe and veggie mash recipe. There are also a couple powder premixes like Urban Wolf and CarnivoRaw that you just add muscle meat and fish oil.

[InkedMarie]

Look at Hare Today, they have a good selection. There’s a flat rate shipping on non raw items. I believe Raw Feeding Miami does, too & pretty sure she has flat rate shipping.

[Dog Pack Mom]

I have tried multiple times to feed raw. My toy dogs do well on it but I just run out of steam on grinding or preparing it. Ordering premade raw foods seems very expensive even compared to higher priced kibbles like Orijen. I would be interested in an easy recipe as well.

[Coonhound Mama]

Hello friends,

Just wanted to see if anyone could recommend some good whole prey style treats for raw fed large breed dogs. I currently feed dehydrated organs, meats and some dairy but would like to try something different that might take her a little longer to chew. I don’t want to add too many calories as these would just be quick treats. I’ve been looking into dehydrated rabbit’s feet and ears for starters as she is a 60 lb dog and these seem as though to be appropriate.
My apologies if this should have gone under the Raw Food forum, just figured it pertained to treats so I’d stick it here!

Thanks guys.

[Wild River P]

Have you tried giving your dog taw food? Science Diet is a mj is a misleading name the chemicals used in that food are is shocking. Perhaps start with whole food nutrition and make sure tour dog is getting good lean protein. I took both pets into a raw diet. No more itching no more bald patches no more throwing up. All symptoms gone. We now have a raw pet food company in Nebraska because of it! Wild River Pet Foods. Com If you live in Omaha we offer free delivery.
The bes of luck. Allergies are not fun for animals or humans.

[Erica P]

I might look at Dr. Tim’s and look into considering a grain inclusive food. I’m also thinking about mixing foods. I’m assuming that’s okay to do, with the only drawback being if they get sick you don’t know which food is the culprit?

Has anyone looked into the new Sport Dog Food coming out? I can’t wait for the formal review. It’s only slightly more affordable than Victor though.

[Mallary P]

Hi all:

My beloved (spayed) Shih Tzu will be 9 years old this year and I’ve recently [this month] switched her to the Fromm Surf and Turf Grain Free food, which she seems to enjoy. My dog has LOTS of food allergies and we spent about two years plus lots of trial/error to find her a good food. In the beginning the vet had her on Science Diet and steroids for about a week, but that was not a long term solution. She gets whelps (almost like acne) all over her and it’s very itchy. Poor baby. For a long time, she was on Nature’s Recipe limited Ingredient Chicken and Sweet Potato Food. She did well on it [no breakouts], but it wasn’t as great when I read the report on her. Given that she is moving into her senior years, I want to make sure she has the best quality everything because I love her and I want her around for a long time. She gets a decent amount of exercise for a Shih Tzu and is a good weight–according to the vet.

I see some of the forums on here suggesting that they given their dogs different high quality foods in rotation. She’s really enjoying Fromm, but I would like to give her another high quality food to give her some variety. Any recommendations? Acana, Orijen, etc?

She generally does better with Chicken, Salmon, and duck. Beef, Pork, and too much diary has proven to be no-nos in our house. She loves raw carrots as a treat and antler bones to chew. Sometimes I give her high quality canned food, so if I could get both kibble/ canned food recommendations that would be great!

[theBCnut]

I’ve only ever hear to stick to just chicken for a couple weeks until you know they have transitioned well to raw. My dogs have chicken allergies, so we started with low fat beef instead.

Too much bone leads to constipation and very hard stools, so while I think the over all amount of bone will be fine to start, I wouldn’t feed just a leg the first day. I would trim a little meat off the thigh and give the thigh, then the next meal give the extra meat with the leg. Also throw out the skin the first couple days, then slowly leave more and more of the skin. It’s the fattiest part and gives some dogs trouble at first.

[John P]

Thanks for the reply.

I don’t plan on doing just chicken forever.. But I’ve read that when you first switch to raw, it’s a good idea to stick with one type of meat for the first couple of months. Eventually, I’ll incorporate other meats into the diet as well.

As for the organ meat, I didn’t plan on feeding all of it on one day. I plan on incorporating it into her meals maybe every other day.

Do you think (at least until I incorporate other meats into the diet) that the meat to bone ratio is ok for this meal plan?

Thanks

[C4D]

Hi Jenn H,

Unfortunately, I think Pitlove has gone to the “Aimee” side. Everything she’s said sounds like comments Aimee has made in previous posts. I believe the foods were evaluated by Aimee. Unfortunately Aimee is also a blatant fan of Purina, including Dog Chow.

I do use and have used this brand for several years now. I also use Grandma Lucy’s and Sojos when I use dehydrated foods. I feed them in my rotation along with quality kibble, canned and raw. My dogs have had no problems with them in any way. I have also seen many comments from other posters who have had very good luck with the brand. Anyway, that’s my $.02 worth. 😉

[John P]

Hello all,

I recently switched my 2yo to a higher quality kibble, and she refuses to eat it. I’ve been looking into raw for about a year or so, and I’m finally making the decision to switch to an RMB diet based on all of the good things I’ve read. I’m an over analytical person, so I’m just making sure I’m on the right track.

From what I’ve read, a good raw diet should be:

80% Meat
10% Bone
10% Organ

My dog is just under 40lb, so at 2.5% of her bodyweight per day, she should be getting 16oz (or 1LB) every day.

Chicken leg quarters seem to be popular, and are widely available, so I did the math based on drumsticks having 70% meat (30% bone) and thighs having 85% meat (15% bone). If I alternate days (leg, thigh, leg, thigh, etc.) for 7 days, it puts me at 76% meat and 24% bone, which seems high on the bone content. If I added one day per week of something boneless (breast, thigh, etc.) I think it would bring it down to a pretty close ratio.. do you guys agree?

Organs would maybe be once a week.

Now here are my biggest concerns. The most common complaints (at least online) of an RMB diet is that it’s expensive and inconvenient. I understand it’s not as easy as scooping kibble from a cup to a bowl… but it’s really not that hard unless maybe you’re mixing vegetables and stuff.

But, the biggest reason I think I’m doing something wrong… the cost. 10LB bags of chicken quarters are $5 at my local grocery store, so about 3 bags (30LB) should be what my pup consumes monthly. Thats $15. About 1/3 of what I’m paying for kibble right now.

Granted, I still have to buy organ meat, maybe some boneless stuff.. but the RMB seems to be cheaper.

Am I doing something wrong here? Any suggestions on improving the balance of the meal? I understand there are probably better diets out there, but I travel a lot for work, and I want it to be super easy for my wife to feed the dog while I’m gone.

Thanks for reading this long winded post.

[anonymously]

Helpful article below:
By Klaus Loft, DVM
Angell Dermatology Service

Anyone who suffers debilitating environmental allergies tied to changing seasons, pet dander or household dust mites knows first-hand the misery of a scratchy throat, itchy eyes or painful rashes.

Not everyone knows, however, that our pets can experience similar allergic reactions — and other very bothersome dermatological issues. But our pets need not suffer in silence. Modern veterinary science has evolved such that advanced, comprehensive treatments are now available to treat a range of skin conditions.

Top pet dermatological issues

Our four-legged friends suffer from some of the same skin issues as we do — and several that we do not. The most common conditions we see at Angell include:

•Parasites, such as mites, fleas and mange (scabies)
•Infectious diseases, such as Staphylococcal pyoderma (“Staph”) skin infections, yeast and fungal infections and skin fold infections
•Systemic diseases, such as autoimmune diseases
•Skin cancer, such as Squamous cell carcinoma, cutaneous lymphoma, Mast cell tumors
•Allergies, such as flea allergy dermatitis, adverse food reactions, environmental allergies, etc.

All of these conditions can become serious and, if untreated, dramatically reduce quality of life. But the tremendous strides made in veterinary innovation, however, is very good news for our pets. Specifically, the testing and treatments for allergies now rivals human healthcare in its sophistication, quality of care and long-term health outcomes.

Unlike humans, dogs and cats cannot tell us about their dermatological health issues. So we as pet owners must look for the signs. The most common indicators that a pet is suffering from some kind of allergy involve frequent episodes of ear infections, red raised or open sores on the skin, constant licking or biting of paws or groin — sometimes causing wounds that will not go away.

Allergies present a particular challenge because there can be hundreds (even thousands) of potential allergens that impact pet health, from foods to pollen from grasses, weeds, trees, dust mites and more. Today’s specialty veterinary hospitals have access to the very latest diagnostic tests to get to the bottom of what’s ailing our pet. Among these tests is the Intra Dermal Test (IDT).

IDT is generally considered the gold standard of testing for identifying allergens that cause pets to suffer from chronic skin and/or ear diseases. IDT involves injections of a series of concentrated allergens into the skin to determine which of them generate allergic reactions in a given animal. The use of fluorescein — a chemical that illuminates the inflammation caused by the injected allergens in order to visualize the strength of individual reactions — is key to accurately diagnosing pet allergies, and is just one of the many ways veterinarians use new technologies to improve care and diagnostics.

The results of IDT (as well as a review of the pet’s medical history) can then inform comprehensive immunotherapy treatments to relieve suffering. Veterinary dermatologists rely on IDT to build customized treatment plans for patients called Allergen Specific Immuno Therapy or “ASIT” for short.

ASIT involves a series of injections specifically created for the allergic animal’s skin. These injections, of diluted allergens, are designed to make a pet less sensitive to their allergens over time. In most cases these injections must be continued for life to reduce symptoms, but they are highly effective. Seventy to 90 percent of pets experience a reduction in symptoms as a result of ASIT treatment. These treatments can be delivered even more easily via droplets under the tongue, perfect for pet owners who are squeamish about giving injections to their pet.

This treatment is very new to the North American field of medicine (both human and veterinary) and underscores just how far innovation in veterinary medicine has come.

When it’s time to see the vet

Many pet owners are understandably concerned about taking their animals to the veterinarian because the cost (to say nothing of the fear some animals experience when going do the doctor) may outweigh any perceived reduction in suffering. To help pet owners know when it’s time to bring Fido to the doctor I’ve compiled my “Top Ten” list of dermatological symptoms that should never be ignored:

•Intense itching of the skin (head shaking, running the face into the carpet, furniture, etc.)
•Biting at the skin that creates red, raw crusting areas of the skin
•Multiple ear infections (head shaking, odor from ears, scratching at the ears with hind legs)
•Paw licking or chewing and frequent infections of the skin in the webbed skin of the paws
•Staining of the fur of the paws and nails on multiple feet
•Reoccurring skin infections in the groin, under the shoulders, perianal areas (on or under the tail)
•Greasy scaling skin and/or fur with odorous skin
•Hair loss, or thinning of the fur
•Dark pigmentation of the skin that is chronically infected
•Sudden depigmentation of skin

Allergies and other dermatological issues can be as frustrating for pet owners and their veterinarians as they can be for pets. I encourage any pet owner whose animal is experiencing any of these symptoms to consult with their veterinarian.

[Ionela B]

She was only 3 and half year old. She was eating 80% freeze dried Stella and Chewy and 20% organic ground raw meat and bones from the butcher – with veggies. In the past year she had mostly the lamb Stella and Chewy, as the poultry varieties were banned in Canada.
I feel guilty thinking that the food may contributed to her disease. The Stella and Chewy lamb variety is very high in fat. And I read articles saying that the freeze dried process is not healthy, as is altering the meat protein’s structure.

What do you think?

[Susan]

Hi Sarah, if you feeding boiled rice why don’t you add a meat instead of feeding the kibble…. kibbles are why tooo hard for a dog with food sensitivities not to have a reactions…. I have just started “Taste Of The Wild” Pacific Stream Smoked Salmon, its just Salmon, Ocean Fish Meal, Sweet Potatoes, Potatoes, Canolia Oil, Salmon Meal, Smoked Salmon, Potato Fiber etc no other food ingredients, TOTW is the only kibble with least ingredients, I can get in Australia without Beet Pulp, garbanzo beans & peas… Patches acid reflux went away, he was doing really well stomach wise, 2 weeks down the track, every time after eating TOTW about 30min-60mins his back paw is going red & he started licking them, AAAaaaaaaaararrrrrrrrrrrrrrhhhhhhhhhhhhh….it does your head in… I also feed chicken breast & sweet potato put thru a blender for dinner, but my boy regurgitates raw & cook foods sometimes & does better holding down kibble…. If he stopped regurgitating the raw i’d be feeding a raw diet, no kibble….. I use the Sudocrem for his bum & the white part about his eye & his paws when its raining…. have you tried “Monetasone Furoate 0.1% Ointment, it works better then then the Hydrocortisone 1% cream cause its an ointment, stays on the skin/fur longer & fixes any red rashes & stops the itch, so if you find the Sudocrem isn’t helping some areas you can buy the Monetasone Furoate 0.1% ointment over the counter at chemist…also what you thought your dog was allergic or sensitive too after about 1 year when he’s doing real well re introduce 1 of those food slowly that you thought he was sensitive too, you’ll be surprised he may have no reaction this time….

[Sarah B]

I also have a blue nose Pitt bull we are also going through some crazy irritations, allergies, ear infections, scratching constantly. I have been for the past four months solid trying new things researching nightly constantly trying to help my best friend! I have found my pittty is ellergic to fluoride in the water, so I boil his water daily refrigerate it I do not bath him in tap water! He is also allergic to wheats, grains, by-products the works! I’m telling u my poor baby boy he can’t even eat or dink out of plastic! OK so I have figured out to help sooth the itchy irritating skin I am using ready for this?? Sudocream diaper rash cream for babies! Works instant! Ingredients: purified water, liquid paraffin wax, paraffin wax, lanolin, beeswax, benzyl benzoate, sodiumbenzoate, and so on! Then treats: raw carrots , apples NOT the seeds!!! Clean his ears as often as u wash ur own. Do not use q-tip use a cotton swab and a gentle formula douce ear cleaner. I use Wahl pet ear cleaner it’s specially formulated with baking soda and mild cleanser compounds to clean away wax build up and debris. If the skin is so bad I like to put pure coconut oil on his skin it helps with the dry skin and also if your dog licks it off well even better 😉 ….dog food: I mix his daily portion with one cup WHITE RICE and two cups his perferd dog food. Ol Roy NO NO NO!! IAMS! NOPE! I won’t lie I’m still working on that! But he did have an almost full recovery on natural nutrition grain free but then I tried ol Roy n with in half a bowl were back to square one N with in half a day. It’s extremelyexhusting but if he is healthier happier it’s all worth it! Hope this helps u? Good luck IL be checking in to see if u reply with good news. I truly hope I am of some helpful ideas.

[pugmomsandy]

BTW, have you looked up raw fed dog poops? They tend to be solid, round, like nuggets, turn ashy. I’m sure there are plenty of pictures if you google it! I’m sure I’ve posted some too, LOL.

[pugmomsandy]

I use the recipe book “Real Food for Healthy Dogs and Cats” and I also like Tuckers Raw because it comes in individually wrapped 8 oz servings.

[Sky B]

My dog loves her raw food cold. Sometimes if I forget to thaw sooner, she’ll eat it halfway frozen 🙂 All dogs are different thats for sure. I know its best to avoid the microwave though. If you haven’t had any problems so far, maybe its fine 🙂

[Sky B]

I will just say that feeding your dog raw is SO awesome! I’ve done this for 2 years and has healed my dog of many ailments. I will say that in the end after lots of turmoil I have switched over to a commercial raw diet, that is balanced in its nutrients. I constantly felt like I wasn’t doing it right before. My dog’s bowels would be rock hard like yours or liquid…and usually that stems from having too much calcium of not enough and finding a balance is hard. If you ever have any trouble with this Honest Kitchen makes a wonderful supplement called perfect form. It’s essentially a probiotic and at our house we call it the Perfect Poop Medicine 🙂 Best of luck!

[Susan]

Hi Kevin, I’d start with home cooking first while your boy stomach & bowel heal, when their immune system is low & they have stomach/bowel problems, its not a good idea to start raw feeding also I wouldn’t mix kibble, feed kibble for 1 meal & the cooked meal for the other meal also if you feed raw don’t add the kibble, just feed the raw & the kibble for the next meal… go to Dr Judy Morgan F/B page
https://www.facebook.com/JudyMorganDVM/
you can watch her or her partner make easy simple meals, Judy also sells supplements …… Judy cooking- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bB3bd84gwmA
“Balance It” has recipes & supplements http://secure.balanceit.com/ there’s F/B group called “Cooking For Dogs” also…

[Em R]

Thanks for the feedback everyone 🙂

I’ve changed his diet to raw food with some raw kangaroo mince and he’s loving it so far… It may not make a difference, but I feel better in myself making more of an effort with his food. I will also make an effort to increase our walking time together.

He’s also heading back to the Vets where I assume they’ll put him on medication.

Thanks again! 🙂

[C4D]

Until you get a balanced raw diet, I would probably use a commercial kibble, mixed with canned food. If you’re dog can’t tolerate it, a bland diet of boiled chicken and rice is good to calm the digestive system down for a day or so. That’s what my vet, and I believe, most vets would recommend. Good Luck with your pup!

[anonymously]

I would call the vet, they must have a 24/7 emergency veterinary clinic near you. They have payment plans and they take credit cards.
A veterinarian that has examined your dog should be the one to advise you.

Stop the raw and all bones. Bland diet for a few days, is probably what they will say.
Make sure he is drinking water, maybe add a little to his soft cooked food.

PS: When he recovers, look into a high quality kibble, my dogs like Nutrisca, but I hear good things about Fromm and Orijen.

[C4D]

Hi Kevin K,

Are you feeding a balanced commercial raw diet? If not, unless you are very knowledgable on feeding a balanced raw diet and are following a recipe that has been put together by a vet nutritionist, or at the very least, by a qualified professional, you need to rethink feeding raw. Too much liver, which is very rich and nutrient dense, can cause loose stools. Too much bone, which is very high in calcium, and lack of correct fiber can cause a very small dry stool.

Raw food can be fed to a healthy animal, as long as there has been the proper adjustment period and that the diet is correctly formulated and nutritionally balanced. I do feed raw in my rotation of foods, but I use commercial raw food that’s complete and balanced. When feeding fresh cooked food, I use a commercial premix added to the meat. I have no problems with stools or any health issues with my dogs.

You might want to either put him back on a traditional diet to see if that corrects the issues and transition to the correct raw diet gradually. If the sypmtoms persist or worsen, you do need to see a vet soon.

• This reply was modified 10 years ago by C4D.

[anonymously]

Sounds like he might have a GI upset/blockage, my 9 pound poodle mix had to go to the emergency vet x2 for issues related to “raw meaty bones”. The bone, even when it is ground up into fine particles can turn into cement in the stomach and colon. It is painful and can be quite serious.
I would take him to the vet (today), he’ll probably need an x-ray and then they will discuss treatment. Raw food has risks, especially for delicate small breeds (in my experience)
http://skeptvet.com/Blog/category/nutrition/

/forums/topic/rectal-issues/

[kevin k]

I recently weaned off my dog off his dog food and now I feed him raw chicken with bone maybe once a week but every day I either feed him raw beef or chicken breast. I give him chicken liver too.

My dog is 11 pounds maltese. 2 weeks into his raw food regimen

I see no symptoms of distress or anything abnormal besides his feces. He keeps straining to poo and when he does succeed it is either small rock shape or firm but liquid. This has been going on this past week.

I gave him half a table spoon of 100% canned pumpkin yesterday after every meal (2 meals per day) but today, his poop came out to be small rock shape

What to do now? Getting worried. Also I did not feed him yet.. Was planning to give him just a half tablespoon of pumpkin.

• This topic was modified 10 years ago by kevin k.
• This topic was modified 10 years ago by kevin k.

[Rose F]

I have went to the Tender and True for my dog. She is 14 years old and becomes incontinent if I give her anything with chemicals. I am pleased with it . She eats it good so I do not worry about a shelf life. A long shelf life means more preservatives and additives that animals do not need and are bothersome to sensitive organs, systems, guts, etc….. I have found out that leaving it in its raw and natural state, it lasts longer than with preservatives. And it is much better and healthier for people and animals.
The Tender and True site is up and they do have ingredients and analysis on it. You can call them, email them, etc…….
I would recommend to anyone wanting an organic dogfood.

[Pitlove]

Hi laconrad-

I’m interested in if you can explain how your dogs were able to choose a vegan diet for themselves, instead of one that contained meat as well. Were they offered several diets side by side, some of which contained a meat source, and chose the food without meat?

I have offered my dogs fruits and veggies and they turn their nose up to them. They definitely both prefer to have some meat in their diet. I don’t feed raw however.

Thanks in advance for any insight you can provide.

[laconrad]

Somehow the notion that dogs are pure carnivores has permeated through internet chat forums, among some non-medically trained people working in the pet industry (groomers, trainers, etc.), and those that take their information seriously. This notion is based by in large on the multiply erroneous notion that dogs are essentially wolves, and since wolves are pure carnivores, then dogs necessarily should be fed as wolves would eat.

I stated multiply erroneous notion because the true fact is that EVEN WOLVES ARE NOT PURE CARNIVORES! While it is true that wolves generally require and eat a high level of protein in comparison to dogs, they also consume a significant amount of vegetable matters instinctively, as doing so is necessary for optimal physiological balance and gastrointestinal health in the species. Wolves consume vegetation from routine grazing on grasses and by tearing open the stomachs of their herbivorous prey and eating the contents.

The other true fact is that dogs are not wolves, but differ from the wolf in DNA structure by about 0.8 %. That may not seem like much, but only a 1.2% difference in DNA separates us from the chimpanzee. Few would suggest that we should model our diet around that of a chimpanzee.

Thousands of generations and selective breeding that made domestic dogs more adaptable to life with humans was responsible for the evolution that today differentiates dogs from their ancient ancestor. Among the most prevalent difference between dogs and wolves that resulted is gastrointestinal physiology and how it impacts overall gastrointestinal and other organ health. In the process of canine domestication, humans essentially their early more wolf-like canine companions what they ate, and over successive generations, the species adapted to a more omnivorous diet.

Dog owners jumping on board with feeding their dogs nothing but meat, essentially a pure protein diet, is fraught with potentially serious health consequences. All one has to do is understand protein metabolism to see the problem.

Before protein can be absorbed into body’s cells and tissues for metabolic and physiological purposes, it must first be broken down into small chains of proteins called peptides, and in some cases broken down to the individual molecular protein building blocks, amino acids. Once absorbed by the gut, amino acids and peptides are then repackaged and utilized by the body.

It all sounds lovely, but protein metabolism does not come without a price, as it generates a toxic waste product called ammonia. In fact, many common meat protein sources are as low as 78% utilized by the body with the rest represented as waste. Luckily, like us, canines have a liver that converts ammonia into a less harmful molecule called urea, which is then excreted by the kidneys in urine.

However, the liver and kidneys over time become overwhelmed with a diet heavily laden with protein, because these organs are constantly burdened with detoxification. Over time, if excessively taxed in this manner through diet, these organs become compromised, leading to degenerative disease, chronic renal failure in the case of the kidneys, and cirrhosis in the case of the liver.

Physiologically, dietary protein for the average adult canine should not exceed 25% of the total daily nutrient intake. In high performance dogs, such as those that participate in in field or agility competition, that requirement may be increased to 27%. Beyond this level of protein the dog suffers deficiencies in other key nutrients, such as soluble and insoluble fiber and anti-oxidants to name a few, while unnecessarily taxing his liver and kidneys with excessive protein metabolic waste.

Canine owners that feed raw are the biggest offenders with regard to overloading their dogs with protein, many feeding nothing but a raw meat diet. For these pet owners that are committed to raw feeding, if they are feeding their dogs nothing but meat, I would urge them to integrate fresh or cooked vegetables to represent at least 50% of total dietary intake. Green beans, carrots, broccoli, celery, and spinach are all healthy vegetable sources for dogs. It is also a good idea to integrate complex carbohydrate sources, such as brown rice and sweet potato, as well as some canine safe fruits like cantaloupe, apples, and pears.

What is most troublesome to me is that some commercial pet food companies are taking advantage of the canine pure carnivore hype and creating diets that are heavily laden with protein, even going further to validate this false notion in their promotional tactics. I was actually inspired to write this post after having seen a TV commercial two nights ago from a large, well known pet food company touting its newest diet as having one of the highest protein percentages in the industry.

I caution all canine owners to not buy into the hype, not listen to non-medically trained people that recommend a dietary regimen without understanding that over time it does damage to the liver and kidneys while denying the canine other essential nutrients; and reject pet food companies touting false claims, who clearly value sales far more than the well-being of their canine consumers. If in doubt, talk to your veterinarian to help you sift through what is best to feed your dog.

Dr. Roger Welton is the President of Maybeck Animal Hospital and CEO/Chief Editor of the veterinary information and blog online community, Web-DVM.

[Cannoli]

I agree with anonymously. I don’t trust supplement companies that state their supplements are miracle wonder pills that can prevent a plethora of ailments.

These are the questions I ask myself when I rarely use supplements, hence I would ask the same questions to companies who make supplements for my dog.

1) Has the product triggered any health warnings or sanctions
Searching for a product or its maker on the FDA’s website will unearth any safety advisories or sanctions issued against them. The agency also maintains a list of all recent recalls and market withdrawals. I know this is tough but if this company makes human supplements it might be good to know if they ever had any human supplements recalled.

2) Has the product been tested by independent labs?

A reputable supplement company must have DNA testing to prove that all of there ingredients actually are what they state it has.

3)Is the product too good to be true?

For example they write “Nuvet contains those ingredients and can help strengthen the immune system to help prevent the development of allergies.” There is no supplement that can help this.

or this “Nuvet plus contains those ingredients and can help strengthen the immune system to help keep the body in balance, and less likely to develop the medical conditions that can lead to seizures.” more none sense.

4) Do I really need supplements? If so, am I taking the right amount?

a supplement may have considerably higher quantities of a vitamin or mineral than it says on the bottle. Because certain vitamins degrade over time, manufacturers often provide more than the labeled quantities, to ensure there is still the labeled amount at the expiration date

You should really be careful with giving your dog supplements. There are too many snake oil salesmen in this unregulated industry

[anonymously]

Idiopathic seizures……sometimes there is no explanation. Keep the diet simple, avoid chemicals and junk. See what the vet recommends. I’d go with a quality kibble as a base. I’d skip the bones, been to the emergency place 2-3 times over the years, twice for GI blockage and another time for a broken tooth. All caused by feeding “raw meaty bones”.

Don’t free feed if you want him to lose weight, feed measured amounts twice a day, pick up the food after 10 minutes if he doesn’t eat and store in the fridg, offer at the next mealtime.
Have fresh water available, add a splash to his food if he’s not a drinker.
Walk him for an hour a day, it may help decrease the frequency of seizures and aid with weight loss.
Don’t be afraid of the medication, I had a peke who lived a long time on a low dose of phenobarbital. They can still have an occasional breakthrough seizure, but it is usually mild.
http://skeptvet.com/Blog/category/nutrition/

[Em R]

Hi all!

My much loved 3 year old mini schnauzer had a bad seizure about 2 months ago. Blood tests etc came back normal, but he has since had two more seizures within the past 2 weeks.

Of course we will look to get him on the medication recommended for epilepsy, but we also want to improve his diet dramatically, as it seems very coincidental that his seizures started within a week or two of putting him on Royal Canin dry food.

Transitioning to a raw diet seems very overwhelming, and I don’t want to accidentally deprive him of any ingredients or overfeed him either (he is maybe a kilo or two overweight). I see petstock have the vets all natural complete mix which is to be mixed with cooked/raw meat… Does anyone know what this is like? I was thinking this with maybe one or two raw bones per week.

Sorry about the long post!

[Pitlove]

If Blue Wilderness would count, I suppose I would nominate Orijen since the raw feeders would never use the term “Biologically Appropriate Dog Food” for kibble.

Kibbles N’ Bits would get a nomination as well.

[Hailey L]

Hi, about a week and a half ago I adopted a one-year-old chihuahua pomeranian mix. For the first few days, he wouldn’t eat and I figured it was separation anxiety from his previous owner and the other dog she had. I didn’t want to feed him the food his previous owner fed him (Pedigree Small Breed) because I didn’t want him to have anything with byproducts in it or anything like that, so I bought him a healthier food (Perfomatrin Ultra grain-free for small dogs, recommended to me when I brought him into PetValu with me). At first, I had to mix in a little bit of freeze-dried chicken breast treats to get him to try it but he ate it and he seemed to like it and two days ago I managed to get him to eat two bowls of it but now he won’t even eat that. I tried feeding him the Pedigree and he won’t even eat that, nor will he eat any wet food and if I mix treats in with his food, he just picks out the treats and eats those. He’s still drinking regularly and not vomiting or anything, going to the bathroom at regular times, etc. and he doesn’t seem sick, still has lots of energy and everything, but he hasn’t eaten for almost two days now and I’m getting worried about him. I brought him back into PetValu yesterday and was given a sample of RAW dog food (it’s basically all-natural ground-up chicken, beef, lamb, etc. and looks like ground beef and is supposed to simulate people-food so that picky dogs will eat it to get their appetite going) but he won’t eat that either, even with treats mixed in. Any suggestions?

[Bushman]

Hello
I have never purchased them, but I did take a look at their website when I saw your post.

Seems like they are trying to imply that their chews are simply dried meat.

I have a dehydrator and make beef jerky, as I make it, there are various pieces that don’t come out the way I want them too, a fat strip left behind, or inconsistent cut that makes it dehydrate unevenly, or whatever. I dehydrate them completely and give them to my dog for treats or training snacks. I have done chicken as well, the larger pieces of tough chewy meat will keep him entertained for a while. Not as long as rawhide (which I do not buy) but they last about as as long as the smoked pig ears that I buy from the local butcher.

[Naturella]

Kim M., welcome to the forum, you will find tons of useful information here! 🙂

And you are welcome, anytime! Happy to help if I can. Actually, my list has expanded as I have done more research, but just know, these are MOSTLY poultry-free (if not, it is notated), but I was not looking for potato-free options necessarily. Some do happen to be potato-free, but you would have to look into it separately. Here is my updated list:

Orijen
Six Fish
Regional Red
Tundra (duck – MAYBE)

Acana
Wild Atlantic
Appalachian Ranch
Grasslands (duck, eggs – MAYBE)
Freshwater Fish
Heritage Meats
Wild Mackerel
Lamb and Apple
Pork and Squash

EVO
Herring and Salmon Formula
Red Meat Small Bites

Nature’s Variety Instinct
Salmon
Rabbit
Raw Boost Lamb

Castor and Pollux
Ultramix Salmon
Ultramix Red Meat with Raw Bites

Merrick
Backcountry Raw Infused Pacific Catch Recipe
Backcountry Raw Infused Great Plains Red Meat
Grain Free Salmon and Sweet Potato
Grain Free Real Texas Beef and Sweet Potato
Grain Free Lamb and Sweet Potato

ZiwiPeak (air-dried, not kibble)
Venison and Fish
Venison
Beef
Lamb

Annamaet
Aqualuk
Manitok

TimberWolf Organics
Ocean Blue
Wilderness Elk and Salmon
Black Forest Venison and Lamb
Lamb with Potatoes and Apples

Wellness Core
Ocean

Victor
Yukon Salmon and Sweet Potato

Horizon Legacy
Adult Fish

Fromm Gold
Salmon Tunalini
Beef Frittata Veg
Lamb and Lentil

I and Love and You
Simply Sea
Red Meat Medley

Holistic Select
Grain Free Salmon, Anchovy, and Sardine Meal

Only Natural Pet
Just Fish Feast
Red Meat Feast
Lamb and Cod Air Dried
Beef Air Dried
Lamb and Sweet Potato Easy Raw
Beef and Sweet Potato Easy Raw

Wysong
Epigen Fish
Epigen Venison
Anergen 2 – Rabbit

Canine Caviar
Wild Ocean
Wilderness
Open Range
Open Meadow

Earthborn Holistic
Coastal Catch
Great Plains Feast

Zignature
Whitefish
Trout and Salmon
Kangaroo
Lamb
Zssential (turkey, duck – MAYBE)

Canidae Pure
Sea
Land

AvoDerm
Trout and Pea
Lamb and Sweet Potato

NutriSource
Seafood Select

Pure Vita
Salmon and Peas
Bison and Pea
Venison and Red Lentils (fat product – MAYBE)

Farmina (eggs – MAYBE)
N&D Grain Free Fish and Orange
N&D Grain Free Lamb and Blueberry

Weruva (eggs – MAYBE)
Venison and Salmon Meal Dinner with Pumpkin
Lamb Dinner with Lentils

Taste of the Wild
Pacific Stream Puppy
Appalachian Valley (egg, duck – MAYBE)
Pine Forest (egg – MAYBE)
Southwest Canyon (egg – MAYBE)
Sierra Mountain (egg – MAYBE)

Dogswell LiveFree (egg – MAYBE)
Salmon
Lamb

Nutrisca (egg – MAYBE)
Salmon and Chickpea

[anonymously]

No, but when I was feeding raw bones my dog experienced GI upset and blockage caused by the finely ground up bone particles, they solidify in the gut and become cement like. It happens…
I no longer feed bones of any type or in any form. I don’t enjoy going to the emergency vet.

[Gloria K]

I’ve been giving my dog chicken livers, hearts and gizzards chopped up as toppings for his regular food which I make. I only do this about twice a week and freeze the rest. Not sure about raw liver but I cook his food.

[Anna S]

Is it okay to give raw chicken liver as a treat for dogs? I’m thinking no more than three times a week. I have three Shetland Sheepdogs and one Chihuahua who are on Blue Buffalo LPF. Also, I know this website is for dogs, but if anyone knows if this is a good treat for cats, too, that’d be helpful.

[Cannoli]

“Salmon need to be frozen at low temps for about 3 weeks before being fed to kill the parasites, then you can feed it raw.’ = this is the exact definition of the process that makes “sushi grade” fish for human consumption. Thanks BCnut I should have clarified that

• This reply was modified 10 years ago by Cannoli.

[C L]

You can do a blood test. FYI: There will be some too highs and too lows (slightly) to some values, because it’s normal for a raw fed dogs. I just don’t recall which ones will be effected by raw feeding, but not to be alarmed by them.