[somebodysme]

So most of you are buying your raw from My Pet Carnivore? Do I understand this correctly?

emchide, please watch all those treats because most don’t really have too great ingredients in them. I’ve been making little meatballs(teaspoon sized) out of ground turkey, I cook them in a skillet on a low temp covered then drain them on paper towels. They go straight in the freezer and when I need them I just get a few out. When they begin to thaw, I use a very sharp paring knife to slice them into four pieces. These make good training treats, healthy and good enough that she will actually pay attention. Of those 1/4 pieces, I usually tear those in half as a training treat. So she only gets a tiny piece. Then if it’s just a quick reward for being a “good girl” I keep her kibble in my fanny pack as the majority of training treats, they are no bigger than a pea. So I can treat treat treat but she doesn’t get much. You definitely do not want to use any sort of biscuit to treat, it’s not good quality food plus is way too much.

[emchide]

Hi everyone, and thanks for such an informative site with a lot of informative posts by those willing to share their hard-learned experiences. I’ve been poring over a lot of the discussions and digging in to the facts presented, and I’m trying hard not to duplicate questions already asked.

One manufacturer I came across seems not to have a presence on this website yet – it’s listed in the topic, GreenTripe.com. What particularly intrigues me are their various formulations using trachea, gullet, and pancreas, among others. What do you experienced raw food people think of this variation? At a glance, it looks like shipping costs might be somewhat prohibitive unless ordering in serious bulk.

I’m thinking my best bet to start is simply checking with the local grocers for various RMBs and organs on the cheap and using those as well as eggs, yogurt, and so on as a topper for grain-free kibble (currently rotating among Halo Puppy Salmon, Halo Surf and Turf, Nature’s Variety Instinct Duck, and Nature’s Variety Instinct Rabbit with canned toppings like Wellness Core and Solid Gold Green Cow Tripe). Ideally I would eventually transition to all home-prepared ingredients but I definitely need to read up more on vegetables and supplements for a while first.

Oh, and my dog is a four-month old boxer/pit mix – he’s growing like a weed and I’m slightly concerned we’ve been using a few too many treats for training in addition to his three meals a day as he’s gone from 13 lbs on June 12 when we adopted him to 32 currently, but he seems healthy as a horse and has great energy. The only issue seems to be some scratching and itching which has somewhat receded as his flea treatment has kicked in (I still find fleas on him but they seem unwell and are easy to catch and crush), but he came home on SD of course from the SPCA so I am hoping that dietary improvements might eliminate any potential skin issues if they exist.

I look forward to gleaning a lot more valuable knowledge from these discussions, and thanks again for expending the energy to inform more people – I really appreciate the love-driven data!

• This topic was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by emchide.
• This topic was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by emchide.

[EHubbman]

I should clarify a bit, haha! The things I was reading were more along the lines of 50% meat/bone/organ and 50% raw fruit and veg (or other ratios around those amounts), which is why I was wanting to stay away from those, because that kinda seems like an obnoxious amount of fruit/veg. I was finding these ratios on pages for the BARF diet, where prey model raw pages were more towards meat/bone/organs with supplements.

More what I mean by feeling more towards prey model is what I’m seeing more frequently here and among those I know that feed raw. The main majority of the meal is meat/bone/organ, but they do supplement with good stuff. (Am I calling it the wrong thing by saying prey model?)

Patty, that mix sounds like a good treat! I’m sure Dom would love it, he loves frozen treats.

HDM, Thanks! I’ll definitely be checking in on those books. A good friend just recommended “Raw and Natural Nutrition for Dogs: The Definitive Guide to Homemade Meals” by Lew Olson, so I’ve been trying to read that.

Random thought, since I’ve seen it a few times on forums: Garlic for dogs? I would think that since it’s a member of the allium family, wouldn’t it be bad for dogs? Yet I see people saying “add it to the food to make your dog eat it!”

[theBCnut]

ebk

How old are your kids? The reason I ask is because from the time mine were old enough to understand that their hands were dirty I had them help me feed the dogs and then we went and washed our hands because dog food can make our hands dirty. If they found a stray piece of dog food on the floor, they knew that they had to go wash their hands after they gave it to the dogs. Same with dog treats. The oldest will be 18 in a couple days, the youngest is 13. They have never gotten anything from the animals and they have always had their own chores to do, but the lesson about washing stuck. We have a ton of animals.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi ebk –

To tell you the truth – I really like Natura’s beyond the bag website. I don’t have any issues with the fact they’ve been purchased by P&G. The recall also doesn’t deter me. These issues were likely going on before the recall and they are likely going on in with most other companies. The reason the recall was made is due to the FDA’s new zero tolerance policy on salmonella and Natura was likely one of the first brands targeted as they’re a larger company. I’ve used their treats in the past and will continue to do so.

What companies are you interested in manufacturing and ingredient sourcing information for? I can probably get the information for you if you want.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Training treats should be very high value – so something meaty. I wouldn’t do vegetables. As long as the treat is small it shouldn’t add a significant amount of calories. You could also do something like cook a boneless, skinless chicken breast into cubes.

[InkedMarie]

I like Buddy Biscuit itty bittys or teeny treats

[Duke The Boxer]

I was trying to looking for something that wasnt too many colories as I’m still training him to walk on a leash and to potty on the grass and not the outside tile; which isn’t a huge deal but I want him to know where is the place to poop. Haha. Back to the training treats I was reading maybe something like baby carrots? I took him to the vet today and he is 22 pounds at close to 16 weeks old. I got a fecal test done and nothing came up. He looks healthy, the ribs are barely visible but honestly I rather keep him a littler slimmer before he gets neutered so he will gain not as much weight. He is still getting the proper food portions and today I just started rotating in wellness core.

[theBCnut]

Thanks for the good thoughts and especially the prayers everyone.

My favorite treats and my dogs too are the freeze dried foods, lots of meat and not much else, very little processing.

[Hound Dog Mom]

My favorite training treats are ZiwiPeak food, Vital Essential’s freeze-dried nibblets and Nature’s Variety Instinct freeze-dried raw (in the nuggets). I like to use complete and balanced foods for treats whenever possible and the dogs seem to really like these foods.

[Sully’sMom]

These are good training treats: http://charleebear.com/

Pattyvaughn: good luck, I’ll hold good thoughts…

[Duke The Boxer]

Hey hdm I know this is off topic but can you recomend a good small treat for training my little one? 🙂 the treats I’m using now are only 1 1/2 calorie per soft kibble. Pet botanics is the name of the brand.

[EHubbman]

Ok! Back from the vet!

I was seriously not impressed with the care we got from the one I’d been bringing family pets to since I was six, so we went elsewhere. That seriously miffed me. They’d been great with all our other pets, but then I brought in my little guy at 14 weeks (!) and I think the vet just had it out for him because he’s seen as a bully breed. Vets shouldn’t be breedist, methinks, because they see good and bad examples of all breeds, big and small, bad rep or not. Off my soapbox, though. She wouldn’t believe me when I said he had tapeworms and even brought in a sample with the segment clearly sitting right on top, among other things. I talked to her about giardia and she’s like, no he doesn’t have it, without testing and seemed quite reluctant upon my insistence of it.

SO! New vet, recommended from a friend, who also happens to be a vet tech there, which was wonderful. They were going to run the EPI and fecal pathogen test, but the vet did a wellness check on him and his body condition, activity level, and personality were all awesome, so we’re starting first with a diet change. She said the funny color stools were because the last vet’s response to my saying “please help, diarrhea for a month now” was just to throw antibiotics at him that did nothing, so his gut is all sort of out of whack. The did a wellness check, fecal float, coccidia and giardia tests, and a few other things I don’t remember off the top of my head.

We’re trying a royal canin RX GI food (ewewew, I cringe at the ingredient list!) for two weeks. So for two weeks, all he’s allowed to ingest is the GI food, and boiled chicken as training treats. She wants to keep him on the Fortiflora (because she’s used to it) just for now, but when I asked her about the 15 strain supplement you told me about, she was all for it. We went for the abrupt change because his gut is so messed up, and once he’s stable we’re going to slowly transition him to raw. I love that I found a vet that is all for raw and can’t wait to help me swap to it!!! She seems amazing, and I love her team. 🙂 If, though, the 2 week seriously limited diet does nothing, though, then he gets to go through a gauntlet of testing. She’s almost completely certain, though, that it’s dietary and not anything seriously wrong, which helps me breathe easier.

Although I’m not a fan of the GI food ingredients and fortiflora, I’m ok with it for now, just to get him sorted. I want to give this vet a chance to try what she knows before I just go “Ew, no.” and be the brat that asks for help but won’t accept what’s given as help. That and because she wants to start working him toward raw asap. Who knows. We’ll see where it goes.

Not sure I’m gonna be able to deal with the puppy eyes when he doesn’t get to have his dried trachea…or bully sticks… or duck feeties…. o.o Haha!

[pugmomsandy]

This is from their website:

“Performance Pet Products along with Canine Cattle Company, a respected name in dog treats for years are brands of the 4th largest meat processor in the U.S., American Foods Group. We are a company devoted to quality. Due to numerous pet food recalls lately, quality and safety have been concerns. We take these concerns very seriously-that’s why we have built a plant in Mitchell, South Dakota devoted to the production of human grade dog and cat food from the highest quality
ingredients available”

http://www.performancepet.net/index.asp?lid=1

[FreeholdHound]

HDM- same problem here.

[Hound Dog Mom]

My dogs love the grain-free buddy biscuits. I like them because they’re so big – I have a hard time finding treats that are big enough for my girls. Most are so small that they just swallow them.

[FreeholdHound]

Buddy Biscuits here! Just got 6- 4 lb bags (24lbs total) of the Peanut Butter flavor off of Amazon for $13.00. SCORE!!!

[pugmomsandy]

My giant toy dogs are 24 and 30 lbs! And still eat 2/3 cup total per day plus treats.

[theBCnut]

For people feeding grinds, they are a convinient way to get some fruit and veg in the diet. They have some good ingredients in them. I like the idea, but mostly I’m too cheap.

[Rudy_Chloe]

What are your pets experiences with Fruitables Dog Treats? I recently bought Pumpkin with Apple Flavor and my puppies love them as treats. And they have an overwhelming smell to them which they love as well. I looked online for reviews, but there weren’t too many. To the plus side, they are USA made so that’s awesome and they totally smell homemade. Any thoughts? Positive or Negative?

[somebodysme]

My dog loves to eat too but only gets her allotted amount of food and out of that I use kibble for training treats. If I put down 50 cups of food, she would eat it all, get sick and be looking for more I do believe. You have to be their guardians and control that for them because some dogs just will eat and eat. My dog is definitely a garbage disposal, she will eat anything she gets hold of!

[pugmomsandy]

When my pugs eat Instinct, they still only get 2/3 cup total per day. I like using Instinct Boost Bites and Vital Essentials freeze dried nibbletts for treats and they only get a treat when they come inside from pp break.

[PugsleyOtisMom]

I have switched the pugs food to Nature’s Variety Instinct. It is the Grain Free, Duck and Turkey Kibble. They have transitioned well and seem to really like it. I also got rid of their treats and switched them to the Nature’s Variety Treats as well. In the next couple of days I hope to take them completely off of their old food and see some real changes. Thank you for all of your comments and recommendations. Pugsley, my 5 year old fawn pug is just a big boned pug. When I got him from the breeder his father had the same body type so I knew what to expect. I just want the best for my pugs and I want them to by healthy and live long lives. If you have any other recommendations for treats or some homemade treats I can make for the pugs that would be great. The Natures Variety treats are a bit pricey.
I will keep you all updated on any changes that I see with the new food.

[alsmomma]

We need to find a way to contact the company if this is happening, especially to this extent, to other dogs. Regardless of whether or not they’re processed in China, if the product is toxic to dogs in some way it needs to be addressed and removed from the shelves. I stopped giving my beagle those treats and she’s a lot better. She hasn’t thrown up one time since then. I have found a couple of other brands of treats made in the USA and she loves them and hasn’t had any issues with them.

[theBCnut]

It could be that they are high fat and the fat had gone rancid, who knows. Fat doesn’t freeze dry or dehydrate, since those things affect the water not the fat. I do wonder what kind of Guaranteed Analysis this stuff has.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I’d consider it a chew. I give them as treats occasionally, they keep the dogs busy for awhile.

[somebodysme]

Gosh there must be some bad a$$ stuff in there to make all the dogs so sick off just a tiny piece of one treat! I didn’t catch that part about it just being a sixth of a piece. That’s crazy! Again, I sure hope they recover! I tell ya, every time I open a new bag of dog food, I worry there’s something wrong with it!

[theBCnut]

I have no idea how much “one stick” is or if this is essentially a jerky or a ground up chicken product, but one stick split between six dogs, even if it is all fat and skin, still sounds like too small an amount to cause all of that. Of course, she may have four schnauzers, all prone to pancreatitis, for all I know. Chihuahuas certainly are tiny.

[somebodysme]

But what if they are loaded with fat and skin?

[theBCnut]

Plain chicken shouldn’t be “too rich” You should report to the FDA, just in case, and have your vet fill out a report too, if he agrees that it was the treats that caused this.

[somebodysme]

mkirsche, hopefully these were just too rich for them which gave them the screaming shi*s! HA! I hope they all get better!

[labgirl]

rawhides do “blow up” in the stomach and expand a lot.. my dog used to get very sick from them. ive not started using more natural treats like Bully sticks/bullwrinkles – they chew like a rawhide but are 100% digestible and cause no bloating like rawhides do. id use that instead of rawhides. more safe in my opinion

[mkirsche]

I have six dogs. I decided to try this because the bag says its human grade, made in the U.S. FOUR of my dogs are very sick, sh#tting all over the house. Extremely concerned, I checked bag for an 800 number to call and there is nothing on the bag!!! Unbelievable. Do not buy this. I have receipt and am returning it. I am going to call the FDA and report this. Two of my dogs are terminally ill and I’m not sure they’re going to survive. One is 17, diabetic and very frail and the other was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer but was doing very well till I fed him this treat!!! I am horrified this treat is a fraudulent toxic import from China. My God. My two sick dogs were doing great (I’ve spent thousands in vet bills) and this one treat may have cost them their lives!!! My god…even two young healthy chihuahuas are sick. Most alarming is that I only gave them one stick broken into six pieces. Very little.

[molliesmom]

My poor 10-yr-old female English Springer gets two to four UTI’s a year (for three years now). Vet puts her on heavy duty antibiotics and just recently suggested Craninadine which she’s been on for a few months now and yet another UTI!
She’s had crystals too, but not this time. Her urine is very diluted so I’ve been told to cut back on her water intake.
She is on thyroid meds and doing well with that (not so ravishingly hungry and weight back to normal)
AS FOR CAUSE: she’s been tested for other things – vet doesn’t see anything. She DOES lick herself often (you know, lady parts) and vet thinks she keeps transferring bacteria from her mouth to there and may be causing UTI. And her teeth and breath have gotten so bad because of that! I’ve asked about probiotics but no real enthusiasm from vet.
BEHAVIOR: Outdoors often (fence). Highly intelligent, stubborn and high-strung. Has more obsessive habits as she ages. Examples: more barking; she LOVES rabbit poop! YUK! Vet says that would not contribute to UTI problem, but I wonder, and try my best to keep her from it – we have so many rabbits in the yard! I also wonder if the licking is more behavioral.
I am with her all the time due to my disability, so she’s hardly ever left alone.
DIET: Here’s where I could use some advice. I’ve always suspected that it might be her food at least contributing to her problem and recently switched her to Blue Buffalo Senior. I’ve just found your wonderful site and realized that she DOES need more protein even though she’s older. DUH! So do I!! She’s not really a fan of it and she’s sick again, anyway. Vet gave me samples of Hills Adult t/d. Very large kibble to use as treats for tartar control. But now unsure of the quality!
Any tips would be greatly appreciated. I do live on a limited income so all fresh food may be hard to do, but some (like raw chicken wings?) may be possible.
I thank you in advance — Colleen

[CharlieBrown]

Thanks so much! Your information has been so helpful! I have spent all day researching and plan on buying his new food tomorrow. What is your opinion of Simply Nourish? and the Rachel Ray brand?
Also which treats would you recommend?

Pattyvaughn, I dont know where they were made because the package was missing the top part that would have that info.

[CharlieBrown]

Hi All,
I am a new Yorkshire Terrier owner. He just turned one on June 26th. We received him from my sis in law who for a variety of reasons couldn’t keep him any longer 🙁 With him I received a bag of Purina and a bag of Kibbles and Bits dry food. Also some cans of Mighty Dog canned food. Ive never been a dog owner but after finding this site I see that those foods are not good at all. Can you please recommend a good food for him? I am on a budget but want to feed him good food.

Also she told me she mixes half a can of the wet food with some kibble twice a day. Is this a good feeding schedule with good amounts of food? Should I always mix the wet and dry foods or keep them separate?

And finally, she also sent a small beefhide bone that he seems to love and spends alot of time gnawing on. It actually came in a pack of four and he he has 3 left. Are these any good?

Thank you in advance!! I will love your suggestions on good budget friendly foods and treats. Also any suggestions from veteran Yorkie owners on any topic about them not just food!!

[ZeeAndPalmer]

Enjoy your new little doxie! I have two rescued doxies, ages about 6 and 7 years, and every time we go to the vet they comment on how great their weights are. I am careful about the amount of food they get, but it’s the treats that add up! Mine LOVE carrots, fresh or canned UNSALTED green beans, and ooooo blueberries! I went to a dachshund race event a few weeks back and was stunned at the number of grossly overweight, unhealthy dogs I saw there, and these people purportedly knew how to care for dachshunds! Now I understand why my vet loves me so much 🙂
I have fed Wellness Super5Mix Small Breed for most of their lives; the smaller one is now on PUrina JM (joint mobility) food (I am not a Purina fan but the vet visited the company and recommends it highly – she IS less creaky in the hips since we switched) – I am considering a switch/addition to either Taste of the Wild or Innova EVO – it’s been suggested that a slightly higher protein level with different protein and carb sources would be beneficial. Still studying!

[pugmomsandy]

Hmmmm…I will say that a pug’s weight is not everything as mine are overweight but have good body condition. Pugs are a bit squatty! And they do tend to get overweight quickly. If you haven’t yet looked up a “body condition score” chart, please do. For me their body condition is more important than their weight.

Take a look at these two – one with poor body condition and the other could probably gain a pound.

http://i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u651/pugmomsandy/pictures%20for%20posting/IMG_28831024x768_zps49daa9d5.jpg

This is my overweight pug at 23 lbs:

http://i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u651/pugmomsandy/pictures%20for%20posting/IMG_2697640x479_zpsbe52d943.jpg

but he definitely doesn’t need to lose weight. He has a 22 inch chest and 17 inch waist.

Also I wanted to mention that anal glands shouldn’t be expressed unless needed. Mine only had them done once because I didn’t know that groomers do it automatically!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA9SeHAEyQ4

A better diet should help with all their issues. If you can feed them a 5 star grain free kibble and wet food without white potatoes (food coloring and sugar), it should help with their ears/itching/yeast problems and hopefully anal glands. The anal glands might be damaged though from frequent expression. And normally the pugs only need 1 cup max per day of a good kibble. Mine eat 2/3 cup a day and that leaves room for treats (grain free also). And they also eat raw foods which gives them solid stool.

My pugs have been a good diet for a couple years now and they don’t have any issues and haven’t taken any kind of medication in years either nor do I take them to the groomers. They only get a bath about twice a year, maybe three times.

I would highly recommend changing their diet. It would save them so much misery and save you so much money on vet visits and medications.

pugvillage.com is another site for pug lovers too.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by pugmomsandy.
• This reply was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by pugmomsandy.

[somebodysme]

She does have a nylabone and that’s about all she can have now, she does have an antler that’s cut in half/split, she loves that thing.

Since I posted this, I’ve come to figure out that is wasn’t the rawhide that is causing the rash but it was causing her to scratch and her hair to fall out. She has not had any rawhide since and I will never give her another. There must be some chemical they use to process the hide that she is allergic to. Her scratching is gone but the rash on her back is still there. I can’t help but think it’s the Demodex that came back even though the vet said he didn’t find any evidence of it when he did a scraping. It just all adds up to Demodex, plus it doesn’t itch on the back. I’ve seen google images of Demodex that look exactly like what is on her. All of her other itching has totally gone away with a new dog food and no treats…everything BUT that stupid RASH! ARGH!!!!!!! 🙁

[theBCnut]

I’ll second the Vital Essentials!! My dogs are crazy about them.

[NOSH]

Thanks Sandy… I love these treats you have suggested. It’s even better when I can get them through Amazon.com’s Subscribe & Save program or use their Prime membership so I can get them within 2 days. I have added the Stella & Chewy’s to my list also. I just read an article today about Stella & Chewy’s…..

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2013/08/02/pet-food-safety-plan.aspx?e_cid=20130724_PetsNL_artTest_HP4SetB&utm_source=petnl&utm_medium=email&utm_content=artTest_HP4SetB&utm_campaign=20130724

NOSH

[mah4angel]

I UNDERSTAND ABOUT LIVING WITH YOUR MOTHER-IN-LAW OMG. Mine says that my dog is too skinny when he’s THE PERFECT WEIGHT AH. When we went to Vegas for four days two weeks ago I gave her very specific instructions about his diet and she let my nieces feed him AN ENTIRE PACKAGE OF HIS FAVORITE, MOST EXPENSIVE, IMPOSSIBLE TO FIND dog treats because he’s “too skinny” UGH. She also keeps buying him snacks and treats (like Beggin’ Strips omg) and once bought him Cesar’s food (which is such bad food oh my goodness) -_____-
I would say to give it time! I was lucky in that my baby has LOVEDDD every bit of raw food that I’ve given him. I gave him some green tripe today and oh my goodness it was like the gates of Heaven opening up for him he just gobbled it up!
Let us all know how it goes ^_^

[pugmomsandy]

Stella & chewy’s, Bravo, Fresh Is Best have meat treats and I also like using Vital Essentials freeze dried nibbletts as treats and Instinct freeze dried for treats.

An easy homemade treat is pumpkin dog treats:

http://www.all-natural-dog-treat.com/pumpkindogtreatrecipes.html (grain free)

http://www.all-natural-dog-treat.com/dogtreatrecipe.html

[NOSH]

Thanks so much…I will order some today. I do occasionally use the ZiwiPeak lamb as treats, but mostly for puppy training class. But hey, they are so expensive !

Thanks for the good advice…and suggestions !

NOSH

[theBCnut]

Can I suggest that you take any meat, thinly sliced, and dry it on a low temp in your oven and use that for treats?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Some biscuits I’ve used that don’t contain guar gum or carrageenan are: Cloudstar’s Buddy Biscuits, Sojo’s Grain-Free Biscuits, Darford Zero-G Biscuits and Max & Ruffy’s Grain-Free Treats.

[Brewski]

Sorry to hear that. That is one downside to our biscuits, but haven’t had many issues as of yet selling to dog owners. We are thinking of creating a biscuits with all the other great ingredients without the brewer grain. The upside is that spent grain is broken down and is easily digestible. Thank you for your feedback.

[NOSH]

Can anyone recommend dog treats without guar gum or carrageenan ? I’ve been using the Nature’s Variety treats the past month, but realized they have guar gum in them and I want to change to a treat without these two ingredients.

Thanks.

NOSH

[InkedMarie]

Unfortunately, I have a dog who can’t have grains so these are out.

[Brewski]

Our web address is http://www.brewskibiscuits.com