[theBCnut]

All of their formulas are pretty high in carbs, which is not ideal for yeast. You should look into Nature’s Variety Instinct’s LID formulas. Antibiotics make yeast worse too.

For my dog, I used 1/2 Brother’s Complete Turkey and 1/2 raw. I added ACV, coconut oil, spirulina, probiotics, and digestive enzymes.

[raylene5]

Thanks Patty. I’ve heard conflicting things about it. On the one hand, I’ve heard that puppies are very resilient so they should adjust to a new food very easily. And that the goat’s milk is great for transitioning because it helps strengthen their stomachs and protect it from bacteria. But then I’ve also heard that it’s better to gradually introduce the new food so as not to make too many changes in their lives too quickly.

I guess that for me, I was hoping to keep kibble out of the house. I’m not one to say kibble is the devil or anything like that 🙂 It’s just that I really want to make raw succeed and sort of like with breast-feeding, you might not even want to have formula in the house so as not to rely on it in case of difficulty. Does that make sense?

Thanks for your help! 🙂

[Shasta220]

Thanks for the help, guys! We have one super picky eater (like I say, the cats have always been on super cheap food)… He only eats Cat Chow so far, but it’s pretty much garbage. So far, a really affordable dry food (that’s also quality) is Chicken Soup for the Cat Lover’s Soul. I also wonder if I could find Diamond Naturals for cats (some people HATE the dog food for it, others love it. All of my dogs are on it and they’re doing great).

I’m planning on finding some quality canned food for my older kitty (I really want to try Evo 95% chicken and turkey). I’m not sure if the other one would eat it, he’s refused other organic canned foods, haha. I’m not worried about him though, because he nibbles on some of our cat’s raw food (just to clarify. We have 3. Maddy is a senior…she just eats the dry and maybe canned. Panda ONLY eats dry…then Millie is too sophisticated for cat food, she eats only raw…)

[Mom2Cavs]

Like you and Patty said, if you can trust a dog food company and the food is rated a good one, then their cat food should be pretty good, too. Most people feel that cats should never eat a dry food. They are also obligate carnivores and need high protein, i.e. meat. Now…I will say I do leave dry out all the time for my cat to nibble on and she does like to do that occasionally. She gets fed a wet/canned food morning and evening. I add in missing link well blend to her food. She has some allergy responses and this seems to help. She loves Instinct kibble (not all flavors/kinds, though) but hates their canned food. She also likes Orijen/Acana. Currently, she’s eating Fromm Gamebird kibble and loves it. It also is doing well with her allergies. She eats Mulligan Stew canned, Fromm Gold canned, Wellness canned and pouches. She likes Weruva ok. I’ve tried premade raw with her a few times but she eventually won’t eat it. I keep trying, though, lol. She’s in perfect weight, as well.

[theBCnut]

Leave the puppy on the food it came to you on for at least a week so it isn’t having to make too many adjustments immediately. If it doesn’t have any stomach upset from changing homes, then decide if you think switching cold turkey is a good idea. Personally, I think that going from all kibble to all goat milk to all raw sounds like a lot of abrupt changes instead of one easy one. Usually to switch to raw they say to fast the dog for 24 hours then just start feeding raw. I started feeding raw when I had a puppy and I didn’t want to fast a little puppy for 24 hours, so I started using raw like a topper on the kibble. It really worked great for us and it turns out I still use half kibble to appease the squeamish members of the family.

[raylene5]

Hi all,

Getting our puppy in a couple of weeks. He’s been on a “high quality” kibble (I know the breeder feeds a very good quality kibble but can’t remembe which one it is). We are switching to Primal Pronto once we get him.

Anyway, I was talking to the salesperson at the local natural pet store and she said that when she transitions her puppies, she just quits the kibble cold-turkey, feeds only Answers raw goat milk for two days and then starts the puppy on raw the second or third day. She said she also always adds goats milk to her dog’s raw food, at every meal. I’ve read this approach on other websites as well.

Opinions?

Thanks!

[Sue’s Zoo]

First, thank you so much HDM for taking time to respond and Patty for helping out. I guess I did realize the c:p ratio was still important but was hoping it might be somewhat automatic when feeding raw. And from your response it seems like that is the case IF I get the balance correct between organ, muscle/tissue, and bone. And there are several ways to accomplish that–grinds, RMBs, Tripe mixes, etc. I guess at this point I just want the simplest way to get started, which ideally would be someone saying: feed this, then this, etc. 🙂 while I read and re-read all your info and additional recommended resources to educate myself and become more confident in creating my own meals. I did see some of your info under raw feeding giving your dogs various diets over a period of time. I’m going to look at those more closely because I think it’s what I need to kickstart the program. I just wasn’t sure if those contained all the necessary nutrition for large breed PUPPIES (as well as adult dogs). So thanks again for your response.

I think I may start with MPC as I look for less expensive routes for the future. Considering what I pay for just doing half Primal (chicken, beef, rabbit and venison) plus top end kibble/canned (rotating Wellness CORE Puppy/Earthborn Coastal Catch/Halo Surf n Turf, plus a daily can of FROMM Gold rotating proteins), with these pups, I can’t imagine it’s going to be much more…I hope. And I’m going to get a freezer (checking CL today)

And lastly, for now, you mentioned books. I have the Ancestral Diet book. I’ve noticed Dr. Becker’s is recommended in several places so I plan to get it. Are you familiar with Raw Dog Food by Carina Beth MacDonald? Any others you could recommend to help me jump in quickly?

So happy to have found this site. I’m sure I’ll have many more questions over the next few months. Learning so much from you and some others. And I’m a skeptic so I don’t trust everything I read on the internet. But just by reading your posts it’s obvious you’ve done the research and know what you’re talking about.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Sue’s Zoo –

Yes, the calcium to phosphorus ratio is still important when feeding a homemade raw diet. When feeding a “grind” such as those sold by My Pet Carnivore there’s really no way of knowing the “exact” C:P ratio although it is assumed that it’s balanced. However, as we know, the concern with large breed puppies is not only that the C:P ratio is balanced but also that it remains relatively low. My suggestion (and what I did with my pups) would be to mix in about 25% green tripe with any grind that you feed (MPC does have a great grind called “Ground Beef Tripe Supermix” which is 50% green tripe/40% muscle meat, bone, organ/10% trachea and gullet which would be a good choice). Green tripe has a balanced calcium to phosphorus ratio of 1:1 but the levels of each mineral are relatively low (only about 0.3%) this way you can “lower” the overall ratio without the risk of throwing it off balance.

It’s also perfectly fine to start young pups on RMBs (it’s easiest to start small – chicken necks, etc.) but I would recommend feeding some muscle meat at each RMB meal. RMBs do have a balanced C:P ratio but it is very high (usually close to that upper 2:1 limit) so I would say feed about half as much muscle meat as you do RMB. So, for example, if you feed 8 oz. of chicken necks also feed 4 oz. of muscle meat.

As far as ordering – you’re going to be going through A LOT of meat with two large dogs. I currently have two female bloodhounds and we go through about 150 lbs. of meat per month. When I had my large male (who unfortunately passed last summer) we were going through closer to 250 lbs. per month. My suggestion – especially if you’re on a budget – would be to try and locate a wholesaler. I get my meat delivered right to my house by a wholesaler that sells to grocery stores and restaurants. They butcher all their own meat so they do have items like chicken backs, gizzard, hearts, organ meat, etc. and will deliver to kennels that order at least 300 lbs. at a time. You will likely have to place a large order if you go this route but if you invest in some freezers it’s worth it in the long run – I pay <$1 per pound for everything I get. The only meat I order outside of my wholesaler is green tripe and I get this from Hare Today – with the shipping it’s the most expensive thing my dogs get. You can often find good deals on used freezers on craig’s list or in the free trader.

Do you know how to create a balanced diet from scratch? There are some great books out there and also some pre-mixes if you’re not sure about what you’re doing.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Currently feeding my 6 month old shiloh half raw (Primal) and getting ready to move the 3 month old to raw as well. I want to switch to full raw but cost is prohibitive with commercial foods so I’ve decided to order my MPC and do it myself.

My concerns are:

-Do I still need to consider kcal and calcium/phosphorus ratio? If so how on earth would I calculate it?

-If someone has experience with this do you think it will be completely overwhelming to keep everything ordered in proper quantities with two very fast-growing pups? The older is now 85 pounds and the younger is 40.

-Should I wait til younger pups adult teeth are in (raw meaty bones)?

I’ve done quite a bit of research and really want to do it but still feeling a bit overwhelmed. (Originally posted on Feeding Large Breed Puppies topic)

[Sue’s Zoo]

Currently feeding my 6 month old shiloh half raw (Primal) and getting ready to move the 3 month old to raw as well. I want to switch to full raw but cost is prohibitive with commercial foods so I’ve decided to order my MPC and do it myself.

My concerns are:

-Do I still need to consider kcal and calcium/phosphorus ratio? If so how on earth would I calculate it?

-If someone has experience with this do you think it will be completely overwhelming to keep everything ordered in proper quantities with two very fast-growing pups? The older is now 85 pounds and the younger is 40.

-Should I wait til younger pups adult teeth are in (raw meaty bones)?

I really want to do it but feeling a bit overwhelmed. (Maybe I need a topic for feeding non-commercial raw to large breed puppies!) Also posting under Raw Feeding topic.

[Sue’s Zoo]

I actually tried to go through a couple of the forums that are relevant for my situation and pull out the significant information into a document. FAIL! If I had endless time (which means not having two large breed pups and an adult GSD!) I’d love to do it.

Would be great if some of the major contributors in various areas would do an FAQ (raw feeding, Feeding Large Breed Puppies are my big interests-hint hint). Or even get a few together and do your own ebook and charge a fee for it. I know I’d pay as I’ve been so impressed with the knowledge and experience of several contributors.

Just my 2 cents.

[theBCnut]

Then that sounds excellent! And $25C doesn’t sound like you are out too much even if all you get out of it is a better understanding of the issues, so it sounds great. I agree, BTW, about how the bits and pieces here and there are hard to digest. I needed it all in one place too. I started feeding raw by using a premix, then read every website I could find, then got a couple books. At that point I was finally starting to get comfortable with the idea that I could follow a recipe and make my own raw foods Now, I still use some recipes as a baseline, but I modify them all over the place, or I get grinds and add stuff to complete them. I use a little commercial raw too Sometimes I need an easy meal.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Thanks Patty. I noticed they were offering special pricing of all 4 books for $25C so I just decided to do it. All the information on this site (DFA) is amazing but for me it’s difficult to digest because it’s in so many bits and pieces. I need it consolidated in one place, at least to get started. I’m sure I’ll be back here when I have specific questions.

So far the first several pages have been interesting and useful as they’re explaining why a raw diet is so beneficial. Very detailed info regarding digestion, anatomy, benefits of raw but written so a lay-person can understand.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by Sue's Zoo.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Posted this under Large Breed puppy feeding but didn’t get a response so thought I’d try here…

Is anyone familiar with the k9instinct website? Looks interesting but would like more info before investing in their resources. Looks like a good site to help with feeding raw without spending a fortune.
http://www.k9instinct.com/

[pugmomsandy]

Somebody sent me this link:

http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/zoo/WholePreyFinal02May29.pdf

Some whole prey numbers starting on page 9.

[LindaW]

If you are going to feed kibble, IMO, Nature’s Logic is the best one because it is the only one without synthetic vitamins/minerals. There’s one other out there, but it has RICE–also referred to as “arsenic”. I feed raw–when my pup will it eat. I’d like to feed Brothers Complete because she actually ate it, but am concerned about the synthetic vitamins and minerals which can cause long term problems, etc.

[LindaW]

If you feed canned tripe, Trippett is the only one with 99% tripe; the other ingredient is garlic and of course that stupid carra gum. Fresh raw green tripe from aplaceforpaws.com is awesome. Expensive though. I get mine from Top Quality Raw which is based in Maryland but makes a food run up the East Coast (I’m in NH) once monthly. Basically its a food club, I guess. But it is grass fed beef and bison and now sheep tripe.

[theBCnut]

You have to balance a raw diet. And giant breed dogs have special calcium requirements so their diet needs to be balanced extra carefully. But yes, they can get total nutrition from a good raw diet.

[kelster]

I have a 3 month old Giant Schnauzer, do puppies get total nutrition from feeding just raw?

[theBCnut]

They might catch an occasional bird, but when a pack hunts and catches larger game there would be more meat, less bone and they wouldn’t necessarily eat all of the heavier bones. I suppose that could balance out those birds.

[GizmoMom]

That’s an interesting question. I guess wild dogs don’t eat just birds. They would have more variety than that.

[pugmomsandy]

OK…so according to the website mentioned above, if whole birds are around 29-32% bone, where does the 80/10/10 come to play? Should I make raw grinds closer to 30% bone?? And what about dogs prone to struvites or ones that need decreased mineral content?

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by pugmomsandy.

[RukatheBlackfish]

I have a 6 month old lab/pointer mix. We can’t do all raw food so we are trying to do the next best thing with 4/5 star kibble on rotation, with a wet food topper, and raw food stuffers. We noticed that he had an incredible amount of gas. I did some research on here and started him on a probiotic/enzyme supplement. That helped a lot, like incredibly so with nearly instant results. However he still has gas. I don’t know how much is normal. Usually he has gas around the same time of day too, that’s what I find interesting. It’s around 5:30pm then again at night (I think 10pm). He eats usually between 11:30-12pm and again at 8:30-9pm. He gets the probiotic with each feeding but not the raw food. However he’ll be gassy whether he eats the raw food or not.
I was thinking it might be the wet food. I think I’m rotating it too fast. There’s definitely some wet foods that make him have horrible gas. It’s nearly all stews (chunks of meat) and Merrick. His gas isn’t as bad on the food that’s one solid blob like Wellness Core, Halo, and Nature’s Variety Instinct.
I guess I’m wondering how much gas is normal. And if his gas is unusual what I can do to help it. Should I keep him on the same wet food through the whole bag of kibble? Or should I rotate it more often. And like with dry food should there a transition between wet foods? Or this normal as he’s a young dog and his gut flora is still maturing. I don’t know, shooting in the dark.
I really appreciate any help!

[theBCnut]

Feeding both at the same time is just fine for the large majority of dogs. Kibble and canned are digested at different rates too, but no one ever says you shouldn’t put canned food in the kibble because they digest at different rates. A healthy dog can handle changing from raw to kibble to dehydrated to canned with no transition. The fact that most dogs can’t change without transition is because our feeding practices have made their gut unhealthy. Many of us feed our dogs something completely different at every meal.

Some sites realize that feeding raw 100% is more than most people can do so promote feeding raw one meal, kibble the next, to get the benefits of raw. Darwin’s is one of them.

[Rabbinator]

I’ve read a lot about raw diets, kibble diets, wet diets, rotation diets, homemade and store-bought foods. I work in the pet industry and while nobody has actually asked me yet (raw is not really big in this area apparently), I have yet to find a definitive answer to my question.

Many things that I have read said not to, under any circumstances, rotate raw and kibble. Others say that it’s actually great to rotate raw and kibble, but not to feed both simultaneously (which makes sense re: digestion). I have found a lot of opinions, but no science to back any of it up (other than the simultaneous feeding). I understand protein rotation as well as wet/dry combination/rotation, but I’m at a loss for kibble/raw.

Does anyone have any evidence for/against a kibble/raw rotation?

And another fun question: If feeding raw and kibble simultaneously is unhealthy, why do I carry Nature’s Variety Instinct that is normal kibble with freeze-dried raw coating? Does the fact that it’s freeze-dried raw factor in at all, or is it a gimmick? (NV website about Raw Boost: http://www.naturesvariety.com/Instinct/RawBoost/dog/lamb )

[RescueDaneMom]

Hi Dean-

I love THK and have been using it for going on 6 years. You have too look at the food based on calories. THK Love has 514 cal per cup. NV LID Turkey has 444 cal per cup. You would not have to feed as much of the THK as you would the NV. A 10lb box of THK has 40 dry cups in it. To determine how long a box of Love will last you, figure out how many calories you will feed a day then convert that to cups per day. Divide 40 cups by the number of cups per day you’ll feed and that will give you how many days the box will last. I mix THK with raw at a 50/50 mix so I feed my Dane 1.5 cups THK per day. One 10lb box lasts me about 26 days. My Dane only eats about 1700 calories per day.

Overall, I’m sure THK will cost a bit more than feeding kibble but less than feeding all canned or commercial raw. You just have to decide if the extra cost is worth it to you to feed a superior food that’s made with whole foods and human-grade ingredients.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by RescueDaneMom.

[pugmomsandy]

You can try kibble, yogurt, a dehydrated food like The Honest Kitchen or other and layer them in the kong and freeze. But these won’t last all day once they start thawing.

[raylene5]

Hi all,

So we are about to get a puppy in a couple of weeks and I’m wanting to try Dr. Dunbar’s “Before and After Getting your Puppy” advice and pretty much feed all meals from the Kong. He believes that keeping the puppy entertained and exercised with the chew toys will help with sleep, separation issues and keep them from chewing up other things in the house.

He says to measure out your dog’s kibble for the day and just stuffing it all in the Kong and let the dog eat from that instead of the food bowl, until they have been found to be trustworthy in the house. It’s important to use their allotted amount of kibble rather than treats because the treats are full of more fat and calories (some treats are fine). My problem is that I’m going to raw feed the dog. So what would I stuff the Kong with that they can eat all day without gaining too much weight?

Thanks!

[Shawna]

Hi Dorenda,

Took a few tries but I was able to log on.. Thanks Patty for the email heads up :)..

Vets often suggest low protein for renal disease when it really isn’t necessary. There are studies even that show dogs that have protein lowered to drastically too early in the disease have increased mortality. There’s some fantastic information on the topic on nutritionist Mary Straus’ website (see quote below). My dog has had kidney disease since birth and has been on high protein raw her whole life (45 to 54%) — she’ll be eight years old the end of June 2014.

“Based on research done in the last ten years (see s a Low Protein Diet Necessary or Desirable?), that the only time it is necessary to feed a low protein diet is when your dog is uremic, which generally means BUN is over 80 mg/dL (equivalent to 28.6 mmol/L), creatinine is over 4.0 mg/dL (equivalent to 354 µmol/L), and the dog is showing symptoms such as vomiting, nausea,inappetence, ulcers and lethargy, which are caused by the build-up of nitrogen in the blood. Even then, feeding low protein will not extend life, but it will help the dog feel better. Subcutaneous fluids can also help at this time (and before).” http://www.dogaware.com/health/kidneydiet.html

If your pup is uremic then consider K/D canned with added toppers to entice eating. Toppers like lightly cooked egg whites or canned green tripe are good options. Both are low in phosphorus but higher in protein. To counter the extra protein you can give probiotics and a certain type of prebiotic to induce “nitrogen trapping”. Nitrogen trapping utilizes the bacteria in the colon to help clean BUN from the blood. I use Garden of Life Primal Defense probiotic (human product) and Fiber 35 Sprinkle Fiber (also human product). If symptoms are bad enough that there is a need to keep protein really low try adding high quality fats — organic butter or ghee, coconut oil etc.

I would avoid kibble at ALL COST!!! Kibble of any kind including K/D.

Vet Dr. Royal created a raw kidney disease diet for Darwins. It can be found on their website – link below. The food is REALLY high in protein so again not an option if your pup is uremic. Here’s some info. The actual diet is on the site as well. Your vet will have to contact them to confirm your pup is a good candidate for the diet. http://www.darwinspet.com/kidney-health/

Mary Straus, link above, has diet recommendations on her site – she does include kibbles but kibbles are dehydrating and can cause issues. The protein in kibbles is also poorer quality than any other form and due to this creates more BUN then other diets with the same amount and kind of protein. Nutritionist Lew Olson also has some recipes on her website http://www.b-naturals.com/newsletter/kidney-diet/

Supplements that might be helpful — the one that I will NEVER run out of with my KD girl is Standard Process Canine Renal Support. Turmeric, food grade activated charcoal and burdock root are some to look at. I’d also recommend giving a digestive enzyme no matter what you feed. Mineral waters higher in calcium while being lower in sodium have demonstrated some benefit. They didn’t identify the brand in the research paper but I believe they may have used Evian. I’ve also read that feeding smaller meals multiple times per day is beneficial.

Hope something here is helpful!! Sure hope you can get your pup feeling better!!!

Shawna

[Mom2Cavs]

I will just tell you what I do. I do go to a holistic vet where they do titers as the norm. Every year my dogs go in for blood to be drawn. It is sent to a lab and takes about 2 weeks to get back. It will tell us if the dog is immune to the normal diseases they get shots for. I’ve been titering for 2 years now and so far each dog has been immune and not needed to be vaccinated. Now, my vet does not titer for Rabies (you can, but it’s much more expensive) and because it’s required by law to have the shot, we do get a rabies shot every 3 years where I live. Lucy, however, will never get anymore shots, though, because of her cancer. Also, my vet doesn’t titer for bordatella and leaves that up to the owner to decide if they want it. I do give the nasal bordatella to the Cavaliers because they do Therapy Dog work and are around quite a few different dogs when we have get togethers, parades, etc. So far it hasn’t been a problem, though I may discontinue giving it because my vet says it doesn’t cover all the strains anyway. I am so glad I switched to my holistic vet and started doing this! My old vet wanted dogs vaccinated yearly (with 3 yr. rabies) without question, even when Stella (rip dear one) had a reaction one year he wanted to continue giving all vaccines to her. I sadly admit to doing what he wanted. Never again! I love my vets I have now!

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by Mom2Cavs.

[Alsmom]

My dog is allergic to peas, wheat, barley, corn and soybean. Finally we have this knowledge and I am feeling a bit overwhelmed pawing thru the pages of all the dog foods ( raw, dry, and canned ). A long list of foods came along with Tristan’s allergy report. Addiction’s dry Le Lamb and canned venison stew seem to fit his needs. I think I know where to buy it too. Is this an overnite transition or a slow half new and half old? For some reason I feel anxious about picking the right food ( recall issues etc. )
If anyone out there has used the Addiction brand and types I plan to try…I would appreciate some feedback.
Tristan is 7, we have him for a bit more than a year. He’s been scratching chin and neck since we got him. The vet gave some shots, changed his food twice …no improvement. So now that we know what he’s allergic too I am optimistic and so happy to think how much more comfortable he will be. Thanks u! Alsmom

[theBCnut]

I would worry that with how they make canned foods, you wouldn’t ever be sure of consistant calcium levels, someone who knows more may prove me wrong, but that’s my worry with going completely canned.

I would leave him on the food he came on for several days or do a very slow transition, like 10% change instead of the 25% that is usually recommended. If you decide you want to go to raw, I would add it as a topper for a few days, then increase the amount.

Nature’s Variety Instinct, Annamaet, and Earthborn are some of my favorite kibbles on HDM’s list.

And yes, start rotation right from the beginning, before you use up one bag already have the next so you can transition. Keep an eye on the stool to know how fast you can transition and in no time your dog will be like ours and need no transition at all.

[AT]

New here…We are bringing an 8 week old Labrador puppy home next Saturday and I am trying to narrow in on food options. I have spent the last few days reading every single post in this thread and it has been quite an education – thank you to all of you who spend time here to help educate others!
My questions:
1. Our puppy will be coming home on Purina Pro Plan Focus Puppy Large Breed Formula and I want to transition him to something better as soon as possible. Would a few days after he is home and settled in be too soon to start a transition, provided he is not showing any signs of GI distress?
2. If price/cost is not a constraint, what off the shelf product would you feed a lab puppy? I am not up to a homemade diet at this point (might consider this in the future, but don’t trust myself to get up to speed in one week and to get it right during this crucial growth period). Most of the discussions I’ve read here involve rotating quality dry foods (with added toppers/supplements). Would this be the best way to start since our puppy will be coming home on a dry food?
It has also been stated that raw, canned or reconstituted is even better. I can see the raw recommendations in the document linked to several times throughout this thread. What do you consider to be the best of these brands? Would transitioning directly to raw be ok for our puppy; or should we go first to canned, then to raw?
Can anyone offer recommendations for the “best of the best” of canned foods for a large breed puppy? I figure I can call companies to calculate exact calcium/kcal, but could anyone offer the best brands/formulas to start my efforts? The fives stars listed in the library are:
By Nature 95% Meat (Canned)
Castor and Pollux Natural Ultramix (Canned)
Dogswell Dog Food (Canned)
EVO Dog Food (Canned)
Fromm Gold Nutritionals (Canned)
Go! Fit and Free (Canned)
Great Life Essentials (Canned)
Kirkland Cuts in Gravy (Canned)
Life’s Abundance (Canned)
Merrick Dog Food (Canned)
Merrick Grain Free Dog Food (Canned)
Nature’s Variety Instinct (Canned)
Pet-Tao Dog Food (Canned)
Pure Balance Dog Food (Canned)
Tiki Dog Food (Canned)
Wellness Core Dog Food (Canned)
Wellness Stews (Canned)
Weruva Kobe (Canned)
Weruva Kurobuta (Canned)
ZiwiPeak Daily Dog Cuisine (Canned)

Thank you so much for any advice!
AT

• This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by AT.

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi ScottsMomma! Thanks for rescuing a dog, he will be thanking you to! Seeing as you mentioned raw I would say that would be a great way to go! Raw should really help with any allergies and you can really customize the meal plan, anything that doesnt seem to sit well with him, you can simply move on to another protein. My shih tzu loves raw, its amazing how he took to it, and I am sure your terrier will love it too. While you are researching how to balance, Hound Dog Mom is the best for explaining that!, you can start with a pre-made raw or do a pre-mix in which you add your own meat to it. There is a great section for pre-made raw dog food here to help you choose the best, but I think a lot of people use Primal and Stella & Chewys I would to if I could get it! I have used Nature`s Variety and think its ok, Dawson loves it and he does well on it, but I like making my own then you know exactly what you put into it. But when I get busy I still use it.
For pre-mixes I know of a few, Urban Wolf, Honest Kitchen The Preference, Grandma Lucys makes one, Sojos I believe makes one, and one I think its called Steves Real Food, or something like that. I havent used them as Dawson doesnt really do so well on high potatoes, and urban wolf is the only one I can find here.
Check out the raw dog food forum, lots and lots of great help and questions that have already been answered. Here is a link /forums/forum/raw-dog-food-forum/
Oh and for the skin and dandruff, You can use coconut oil and a fish oil, I like to use krill oil, Here is an article from the whole dog journal on dosage:
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_9/features/Fish-Oil-Supplements-For-Dogs_20600-1.html
But now I five Dawson sardines instead of the krill oil, its cheaper and a whole food source he loves sardines!
And then coconut oil is half a teaspoon per ten pounds. I give Dawson his sardine requirements once weekly, so thursday, and then coconut oil every day, but you can do it however works best. I believe some people do every other day.
I hope this helps some! It is overwhelming when you first start, but its so much better for your dog than any kibble or canned food. I know more people with more knowledge than me will chime in!

[Harpers Mom]

We are planning to get stuff to do the yard and flea bomb the house on Monday, I will try the virbac! Pattyvaugh, how much vinegar and garlic do you add to the food? Harper is about 60lbs. I would love to feed raw, but the therapy dog organization that Harper is through does not allow feeding raw to the active volunteers. So we use Merrick and earth born holistics and rotate canned toppers.

[theBCnut]

Nice find!

[GizmoMom]

This page has a list of approximate bone content in each cut of meat.
http://preymodelraw.com/page/articles.html/_/raw-chat/common-cuts-a-photographic-guide-to-raw-meaty-r15

[theBCnut]

I’m not good at guessing bone content on something that is meat and bone. HDM once told me to give the meaty bone plus half again its weight in boneless meat. So, if your pork rib with meat on it is 2 oz, it would be enough calcium for another ounce of meat, but ribs have more bone than, say, a chicken thigh, so… It’s supposed to be 10-15% bone in the diet, I think you would have to be the one to eyeball that.

[theBCnut]

I live in FL too. And I remember a couple years ago when we had a damp fall, the fleas were really bad heading into winter. I did everything I could think of every 2 weeks for about six weeks before I finally caught a break. Find me some wood to knock on because I’m about to say something stupid. I haven’t had a flea problem at all this year. I don’t know if it is the raw food, the vinegar, the garlic, the whatever, but I have not had fleas much at all this whole year.

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Everyone!
I have been working on a new menu for Dawson, trying to get more bones and more balance into his diet. So here it goes!
Am- 1 ounce Ziwipeak air dried lamb cuisine

Pm- Monday, Wednesday, Saturday Nights
– 2 oz pork ribs.
– .5 oz tripe patty. I have had no luck finding tripe here… so it may be canned 🙁 But I may be able to get some soon as the calves are getting butchered this month.

Pm- Thursday Night
-He would get 2 oz boneless meat patty (beef, pork, poultry whatever is on sale, could also be meat chunks,preferably organic.)
-Sardine, quarter of a tin.
-a cage free egg, no shell

Pm- Tuesday, Friday, Sunday Nights
– 2.5 oz boneless meat patty.
Note: 1.75 oz of liver and other organ blended into all patties for the week.

Supplements:
• 1/8 tsp pre/probiotics, daily
• 400 IU vitamin e capsule, weekly
• Sprouted Chia/Flax meal for manganese may use oysters occasionally, Thursday pm meal
• ¼ tsp cod liver oil once during the week, ½ cup organic keifir (mixed in with patties), and one cage free egg per pound of meat for vitamin D requirements, sardines will finish his vitamin D requirements
• ½ tsp coconut oil, daily
• Raw Glandular supplement, every other day
• ½ tsp homemade green super food supplement, daily

In the patties I would add pureed veggies and fruit but I didnt really count it on my calculations, it would be about a tsp per day… All kinds of veggies and fruit nothing particular, or toxic, lol!

My only question is, is the bone balancing the calcium in the boneless meat, or do I have to supplement additional calcium. And anything too little, too excessive, I gauged this at a weight of about 15 lbs.

I also have another with two meals of pork ribs and also two meals of chicken thighs. But it`s kinda is the same.

I was also thinking of getting this cookbook, especially if this recipe isnt balanced, lol!
http://www.completeandbalanced.com/
Its available in Canada at Dawsons vet, Here is a sample recipe:
http://www.completeandbalanced.com/samplerecipepage.html
Some recipes can be fed raw. Any thoughts, or concerns.

[anotheremily]

Well…I have been at the same thing as Molzy for the past almost 2 yrs…

I have a jack russell beagle mix. He is 5.5 yrs old. He was over weight , not anymore considering the circumstances….He went from 17 lbs when we got him to 27.5 lbs at highest and last yr this time was at 17, today he is at 21. Gulping has been going on so long I can’t remember when it started. He has had blood tests, xrays, barium xray, several meds for worming, He had an upper endoscopy…all leads us to nothing. So he was put on prilosec last Spetember (’13) and metoclopromide 3 xs a day. Ok…so he was being examined for all of these…worms, mega esophagus, pyloric stenosis, reverse sneezing, bloat, acid reflux, collapsed trachea…post nasal drip, and all the stuff everyone else has said here…He has none of that. He used to eat kibble, Canadae. Our other dogs eat that. We switched everyone last spring, summer to Taste of the Wild. Mind you all along I am continuing treating for all the other ailments…so his kibble would get crushed by me and wetted into a paste and a kong goes in his bowl to slow him down. He was on Purina EN for some time and that was when he lost weight. I made rice and fish and carrots and sweet potatoes and rice and veggies and dog food from our local butcher shop that is all hormone antibiotic free…then since he was doing so good we eased into taste of the wild…well that gets expensive with 4 dogs and feeding everyone seperate isn’t an option. So we went back to Canadae maybe a month or two ago…we are on our 3rd bag of it I think…And January 8th and January 10th my husband and I got NO sleep what so ever. Last night he gulped and filled with gas so bad I thought I was going to have to rush him to the pet er…No, he threw up, just like he did on the 8th right around 5 am. Last night it was barf at 4 then back to bed to sleep and he was all gurgly and snoring and I just wanted 1 hour of sleep…I moved him. Shouldn’t have done that, it sparked another episode. This is all so in such a small nutshell what I am writing, but today I took him to another local regualr vet office for just a 3rd pair of eyes to see what she thought. She thinks it’s digestive, perhaps a food allergy, something similar to celiac…Told me whe would show my video to the other vets in the practice and get back to me. Suggested I take him to Cornell, the Veterinary School. He could see more specialists there than at the local office with 1 specialist since she felt what was wrong with my dog is so rare. Rare until you research it and find all these people having the same problem…WHY is it only at night? He has little spats in the day sometimes but most of the action is at night. Why do none of have any REAL answers? What is in the kibble that we feed our dogs? I did some research a while back and I could go find the link and post them if you are interested but you have probably already seen them, about kibble and how people had this issue during the major dogfood recalls….a few years back…That spawned a TON of gulping and posts everywhere. I do not think this is partial seizures…The more i read and the more I talk to vets, I think it’s the food. I cannot feed him a raw diet, I can feed him partially cooked and plain food like I have in the past, I think the limited ingredient food is good for a short time. In the mean time I am going to have to come up with a fund raising campaign to take him to Cornell, because I have spent over $2000 as of the end of 2013 on this issue. I LOVE him dearly but I cannot spend anymore or charge anymore. I am getting nowhere, and I am so tired, literally. I don’t know what else to do…He is getting a new probiotic tonight and for food we are doing quinoa and salmon for a while. He will get NO chicken for a long time. Back to the butcher shop food after the salmon. So…I also got him some tramidole so he can sleep tonight and so can we…I will hang around here, it seems like a good place to bump ideas off of each other…I am interested in hearing more about the chinese medicine and will go back and read that posting more in depth tonight. It’s good to know we are not alone I guess. I am wondering is anyone has had ultrasounds or had their dog eat under fluoroscopy…those were suggested to me today along with a nutritionist and all these are available at the Vet College, for more than I can pay I am sure…lol

Looking forward to staying in touch!
PS my dog’s name is Doug…(love that boy)

[LindaW]

Hi, all. I’ve just recently learned through initially “Dogs Naturally” magazine and then numerous other sources about the dangers and shortcomings of synthetic vitamins and minerals in almost all commercially prepared dog food whether dry or canned. The stuff is derived from toxic materials and since it is so much less expensive than whole food sources, they use them.
There is only one commercial food, Nature’s Logic, that I know of. I had wanted to try Brothers Complete, but they have synthetic also (sodium selenite, etc.). Sometimes my very discerning golden ret. pup doesn’t want her raw or home cooked fare and she will eat a little kibble or canned. Very difficult puppy to feed. So, let’s help spread the word about the synthetics. It is just as important as not feeding Beneful or Ol Roy. Even human vitamins has it unless it is “whole food” supplements. The articles state that quite a few problems that dogs have can be linked back to these artifical supps.

[RescueDaneMom]

To give you an idea, I feed my 150lb almost 8 year old male Great Dane about 1700 calories/day and my mom’s 6 year old, 75lb male pit bull about 900 calories/day. Both dogs are very inactive. They lay around the house most of the day and go on a couple short walks. My sister has a 55lb very active, senior, female boxer mix that needs 1000-1100 calories/day. The more active the dog the more calories they’ll need.

[theBCnut]

Over on the review side there is a dog food calculator. Keep in mind that it is only a guestimate and not a hard fast number.

[sharfie]

Thanks. Any recommendations on how to figure out how many calories they need?

[RescueDaneMom]

Calories definitely do count. You are correct that there can be a big difference between different proteins and the different brands. I would check the calorie counts on everything you feed and feed the amount by a calorie basis. Ex: 1 large patty of S&C Duck Duck Goose has 285 cal while the Surf & Turf has 470 cal. Your dogs could be getting way more calories than they need which could explain the weight gain. I would try to determine how many calories you need to feed them per day to maintain the right weight and feed that. You’ll end up feeding more of one food and less of another.

[sharfie]

I have switched my 2 Golden Retrievers to a raw diet. I am rotating between protein sources and brands of frozen raw. I use Primal, Stella and Chewy’s, and Stewarts. I have used the calculators on the web sites as a guide for the amount of food to feed. However, I am not getting it right because both dogs have gained weight. Do calories count? I notice there can be a big difference in the calories per ounce between brand and proteins. Both dogs are within the normal range of activity. They are both currently getting a little less than a pound of food a day (about 14 ounces). So, I guess the question is, do I watch calories or amount?

[raylene5]

Thanks so much for the help ladies!

[wishiwere2]

Is there an application that we can use on our phones when shopping for dogfood? I have a new ‘rescue’ pup, actually and older gentle giant (8y/o) and the previous owners had him on a costco Kirkland for older boys. Problem is, there is NO costco nearby.

I bought a Purina (for lite or some such) and he has turned to playing and perhaps eating his doo-doos. I did not see this happeneing before the switch. He’s also started getting into the trash, which leaves to me to believe that he is not getting satisfaction from the food. The feces also appears to have straw (fiber) in abundance in it and he’s producing way more in the amount of feces than he was on kirkland.

So, again, my qustion is, is there an application that would assist me when I go to the store to purchase and other items for him?

Thanks if anyone can help~

[ScottsMomma]

We recently adopted a terrier mix from our local Humane Society. He is my first dog-knew nothing about food so we just picked up the standard Kibbles & Bits for him which he ate just fine. Noticed on his second day with us, how much he was scratching; neck area, face, biting along his legs & paws. Took him in for a visit, was told he had dry skin, to try fish oil, also started reading up on dog food and picked up Earth’s Pride Grain free Duck & Vegetable. He is eating that just fine, no issues with messy stool (does have some gas) not bringing anything up. Took him back today since he has also been shaking his head along with the scratching, doc looked in his ears, said they were clear-just looked irritated. Said it is most likely allergies-which is what I suspect-but allergies to what? We live in Maryland so pollen is not an issue right now-possibly dust? Or food-how do you tell? His fur is nice & soft, but skin is dry and he has some dandruff. No major sneezing or coughing. I’m at a loss as to what to do. Doc gave me a med. called Prednistabs and a drop for his ears. I don’t know weather to try a different food with less ingredients, try Raw (does a raw diet help with both food & inhalant allergies)