[Bralic H]

Ok, another one asking for food advice… I have a Lab/Great Dane/St Bernard mix puppy, almost 6 months old and weighs ~60lbs… I have tried quite a few different foods, but his digestion hasn’t really liked many. I tried the Chicken Soup for the Puppy Lover’s Soul, but the kibble was tiny, so that wasn’t working. Just before that was Costco’s Kirkland Signature puppy, which he liked, but he had soft-ish stools and gas… before that was Nutro Max Large Breed Puppy, because I didn’t know better and bought from our local co-op.

I currently am feeding him Merrick’s Whole Earth Farms Puppy recipe, and he LOVES it, but he still has soft stools and I worry because its not a “Large Breed” food. I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions from a website, like petflow.com, which is where I ordered the Merrick’s from. I am trying to keep the cost down, as we just bought a house and are 2 months away from having a little baby girl, so I have been comparing brands on DFA that petflow.com sells. So far I am stuck between “NutriSource
Large Breed Puppy Chicken and Rice Dry Dog Food” and “Horizon Complete Large Breed Puppy Formula Dry Dog Food”, which are 1.53$ and 156$ a lb respectively.

So should I be switching his food from the Merricks, which is only 1.33$ a lb? Or choose one of these other 2. I am willing to even pay a little more, but was hoping to stay under like 1.90$ per lb. Thanks!!

P.S. Oh and also, i was reading this website by a “Great Dane Lady”. She recommends not going grain-free until adult, is there any truth to this? Has anyone else glanced at her website? Is it too old to be useful? (copyright on bottom is 2002-2003)

• This reply was modified 11 years, 4 months ago by Bralic H.

[Heather D]

Hi, sorry me again. I have been onto the shop’s website and come across this food and wonder if this would be better than the Eukanuba. I have done the translation,

BREEDERS high end food for Large Breed Puppies.

Our breeders think is the only one with 100% ingredients fit for human consumption. It is a complete food for dogs 0-12 months old.

Most products are manufactured feed waste, what remains once have separated parts fit for human consumption. These ingredients have a lower quality.

Some feed ingredients, incorporate suitable for people, but Breeders is the only manufactured in Spain than it does on 100% of its composition. 100% premium ingredients . No features or use GM products.

“Breeders” is a brand sold exclusively at TiendAnimal, which offers a high-end feed at a very affordable price (up to half that of conventional brands). See for yourself our quality and you will be convinced.

Puppy food super premium quality at a super low price. This is because the direct sales allows us to avoid marketing costs, marketing and advertising that make up a large percentage of the feed costs of early brand names.

BREEDERS Cubs is a complete dry feed, in the form of extruded, balanced and very tasty dry kibble, made ​​from selected raw materials of high quality. Breeders is a food like no other approaches to what the animal would eat in your state natural.

It satisfies the needs of large breed puppies thanks to the extra size of your kibble as well as pregnant females or nursing. They think that a dog is puppy until it meets its first year of life , although in large breeds this time can be extended up to 6 months, even up to 2 years in giant breeds.

Key Benefits

Selected natural ingredients, origin certificate
High digestibility and energy efficient
Adequate protein and fat
Optimum calcium-phosphorus
High in DHA
Health skin and hair, thanks to the perfect balance of Omega 6 and Omega 3.
Promotes optimal growth, thanks to Natural chondroprotective

High digestibility. During the growth phase, the puppy’s digestive system is less developed than the adult dog. It is therefore important that the feed is especially easy to digest.

High in protein and fat. cub experiences a very rapid growth, stabilizing circa life. At that time multiplied 40 to 50 times their birth weight. To achieve this feat, you need a very rich in protein and easy energy to metabolize food.

DHA
DHA: docosahexaenoic acid
Optimal calcium-phosphorus ratio. Indispensable to form a healthy skeleton able to sustain the growing weight of the puppy.

High content of DHA. docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) is important in the formation of the nervous system, particularly the brain. The brain content of DHA is related to learning ability and intelligence level of newborns and infants. It has been suggested the need to supplement with DHA the mother during the gestational period, and even before this, to ensure the supply to the normal development of the fetal brain. Evidence related to the greater learning ability of offspring from mothers previously supplemented with DHA.

High in Omega 3. Adequate ratio of Omega 3 and 6 helps maintain a healthy coat, reduces skin irritation and enhances the development of immune function.

Breeders not stored in silos , but goes directly by packaging as production. Thus contamination by mites (causing many food allergies) and quality loss are avoided.

BREEDERS is an exclusive brand of Tiendanimal.

I Breeders Cubs 2

Features

Ingredients : Dehydrated chicken meat (35%), rice, chicken fat, corn, concentradp vegetable protein, hydrolyzed and dehydrated meat chicken, apple pulp, salmon oil, dried yeast, yucca extract, potassium chloride, chloride sodium.

Additives

Vitamin A 16,000 IU / KG
Vitamin D3 1600 IU / KG
Vitamin E (alpha tocopherol) 200mg/kg
Cu (copper sulfate pentahydrate) 23 mg / kg
Trace elements:

Fe (iron sulfate heptahydrate): 200 mg / Kg, I (potassium iodide): 1.5 mg / kg, Co (cobalt sulfate pentahydrate): 1 mg / kg, Mn (manganese sulfate monohydrate) 70 mg / kg, Zn (oxide Zinc): 225 mg / kg, Se (sodium selenite): 0.4 mg / kg

Preserved with EC additives (potassium sorbate). With natural antioxidants (citric acid, rosemary extract and natural tocopherols (source of vitamin E).

Guaranteed Analysis

Crude protein 30%
Crude fat 14%
Crude fiber 2.5%
Crude ash 9%
Calcium 1.2%
Phosphorus 0.8%
Moisture 10%
Glucosamine 600 mg / kg
Approx kibble: 1.5 cm x 1.5 cm x 0.8 cm.

Use

Serve dry food guided by the table of recommended daily allowance. It is better to split the corresponding ration in two servings a day. These amounts are only for guidance, so they must then meet the energy needs of the animal, guided by the maintenance of optimal body weight. Always leave fresh clean water available to the animal.

Recommended daily

45 kg (adult weight) 60 kg (adult weight) 70 kg (adult weight) 90 kg (adult weight) 100 kg (adult weight)
2 months (old puppy) 320 gr 410 gr 450 gr 510 gr 540 gr
3 months (old puppy) 420 gr 520 gr 590 gr 670 gr 720 gr
4 months (old puppy) 460 gr 570 gr 660 gr 740 gr 790 gr
5 months (old puppy) 550 gr 660 gr 780 gr 880 gr 960 gr
6 months (old puppy) 620 gr 750 gr 880 gr 995 gr 1080 gr
7 months (old puppy) 620 gr 750 gr 890 gr 1020 gr 1100 gr
8 months (old puppy) 610 gr 750 gr 890 gr 1020 gr 1100 gr
9 months (old puppy) 590 gr 740 gr 870 gr 1010 gr 1080 gr
10-11 months (old puppy) 580 gr 720 gr 860 gr 995 gr 1070 gr
12-13 months (old puppy) 580 gr 710 gr 840 gr 980 gr 1060 gr
14-17 months (old puppy) 580 gr 700 gr 820 gr 960 gr 1040 gr
18-23 Months (old puppy) 560 gr 690 gr 820 gr 950 gr 1030 gr
24 months (old puppy) 560 gr 690 gr 820 gr 940 gr 1030 gr

[Joanne R]

I would like to see options that I can feed my large breed puppy. I have just finally decided on a good food for him, and now wonder about treats. I am giving him carrots and bananas right now and also pieces of his food, but would love to know about more options. Thanks for any light someone can shed for me.

[aquariangt]

It’s a forum, not sure what you meant by “run by professionals” but forums are a place where people gather to discuss things. Looking at your previous post, you posted at 5:30 in the morning, that could easily be bumped down to the point where no one even saw it as a recent comment being so early, and not that many people are up and posting on the forums. No need to be rude-and attempting to guilt people doesn’t get you very far, anywhere in life really. (referring to this comment: “should I say Max a 10 week old puppy’s plight is ignored”)

Take a look at the above post that Naturella linked the list of acceptable foods for a large breed puppy, the most recent list in on page 15. Eukanuba is not a good food. That entire thread is full of good information. As opposed to asking “what food can I get around here” since most of us aren’t from spain, post what foods are available, and people can help you from there

[Heather D]

Hello members. Thank heavens I have found this site though have done nothing this morning with regard housework as just been reading.
We have a Spanish Mastiff crossed with a German Shepherd, rescued from a filthy pen some 4 weeks ago when he was just 6 weeks old. Riddled with parasites internal and external. Has been to the vet’s three times now but doing very well.
previously we had a couple of English Pointers so I was aware of the growth/calcium issue and they were reared to be 14 years. Dusty the bitch, spayed, died with skin cancer. We live in Spain and she was mostly white and was a momkey for lying in the sun with her legs splayed and stomach bared to the sun, she contracted skin cancer and sadly had to be put to sleep aged 14.
Bracken her pal, though not from the same litter, died just 6 weeks after Dusty with a heart attack.
They were reared for their first 18 months on Hills prescription for large breeds and did really well with it.
Now to our new little, well quite big puppy.
He couldn’t tolerate Hills so the vet advised Eukanuba food for large breed puppies and I give him two small additional feeds of cooked turkey each day to add to his protein as the dry food is 26% and wanted to increase it. He is tolerating it well, but I want him to have the best I can afford, and buy. We are pensioners and though not destitute we have to budget.
Spain is not known for it’s care of dogs, and sadly, living in the heart of Andalucia away from the Costas most dogs are raised on dry bread, yes dry bread and anything else they can find. These are the conditions our puppy Max was born into. Locked in a large fenced and gated pen, the owner coming only once per week to bring a sack of dry bread rolls and fill their water bowls. So we have adopted the family and go each night to feed and water through the fence.
The parents and the 2 other pups are doing well, and the owner as a thankyou gave us Max.
There are just 2 pet stores within a couple of hours drive that do sell some varied brands.
We want the very best for Max and from your lists I just don’t know if I am going to find any of the foods you mention.
My question is, sorry after this ramble, if I cannot find any you mention will Max be ok continuing on his Eukanuba for large breed puppies along with his cooked turkey, and are there any other things I can give him to supplement if he has to stay on this diet?

[Akari_32]

He’s definitely doing better. Got a bit of a ways to go, but we’re getting there for sure.

I agree with you on the chemical and such side of that. What I meant by average is brands (like Pro Plan and Hills) that promote themselves to be the best of the best, and have minimal (chemical, etc) additives to them, but also have some thought and research behind them. Not that I think either of these brands are overly good, but they do have their places, and at this point I’m about ready to try anything. But I do know to stay away from certain things. The price point on these two Pro Plans is great. Like $15 a case usually. That’s something we can definitely handle. It’d be good for keeping the cost down and for some variety.

All I said to them (all of them) was that I needed a low carb food. I’m thinking Hill’s response was them thinking they were going to get my money anyways. Silly Hill’s– I’m not that stupid LOL

I know small breed foods typically have more calories per cup, which is great in my case for Haley, my 11 year old 60 lb lab mix. She can’t stomach too much dry food at once, so toy and small breed foods are typically a good choice if I can’t get a puppy or other higher calorie food. And large breed puppy foods, if formulated properly, have certain calcium and phosphorus levels and ratios. Beyond that, I don’t know if makes any difference giving large breed food to small breed dogs lol

[Akari_32]

Hey guys. Just updating. No baths in a few weeks, but his hair is growing back really well (new growth is about an inch long), and his skin is no longer red all over. Still red at his paws and up his hind legs some, and around his nose, but his body is back to pinkish-white, and he is chewing and scratching much less (and doesn’t smell nasty all the time). I’ve been giving him 3/4 of a can of By Nature 95% one day, and the next day he gets the rest of the can, and 1/4 cup of THK, mixed with however much water it needs to thin it back out to the consistency of just canned food.

He does need a bath right now (some one *cough* mom *cough* cleaned up pee in the hallway around his cage and then thought it was a good idea to put the pee towel in the cage because she didn’t want to walk it to the laundry room…), and I’ll use his medicated shampoo, and then wash him with his new shampoo and conditioner (supposed to be really good for their skin and coat, and has keratin in it– I’ll get the name of it in a bit).

I’m looking at some other foods to add in to his diet. I’ve emailed several companies and asked for the as fed carb values of their foods. My answers so far:

Purina Pro Plan:
“We appreciate your interest in our products. Please know that this information is not something we have readily available and takes time on the part of our nutritionist to determine. We cannot provide it for each and every one of our products.

However, if you can narrow your choice to a particular flavor or two, we’ll be happy to fulfill your request. Please understand it may take some time to process this information. We appreciate your patience.”

What the crap is that?? You don’t keep this info on hand?? Yeah, ok. Anyways, I went through the review side, and picked out all the four star formulas. More than they asked for, but whatever. My thought on the Pro Plan is that maybe an “average” food rather than a “fancy” food would do him some good. Some dogs don’t do well on high quality foods– we all know this. One of those if its ain’t broke sort of deals. Just an idea for a back up food. It’ll take some time to get an answer from them, I’ll assume.

Hill’s:
“Thank you for visiting HillsPet.com and sending us your message.

Due to your special pet’s medical condition we would suggest that you speak to your veterinarian for a food recommendation. Hill’s Pet Nutrition, Inc. offers a full line of therapeutic products which are formulated for the management of certain health issues that can develop in pets. The product that will work best for your pet depends upon his or her individual circumstances and is something that your veterinarian will have to help you to determine.

We appreciate your interest in Hill’s Pet Nutrition, Inc. If we can help in any other way, contact our Consumer Affairs Department toll-free at 1-800-445-5777 8AM-5PM CST, Monday-Friday or revisit HillsPet.com.

Sincerely,

Consumer Affairs
Hill’s Pet Nutrition, Inc.”

I was hoping to get some values on Ideal Balance. Another “average” food sort of idea. But looking at the values on the can today at the store (they have dry matter basis on the Hill’s website), I’m ditching this food. Way too low protein and just 4.5 and 5%. And toooooooons of carbs. Each can has a protein source, and then three or four carbs sources. No thanks!

Nutro:
” Dear Danielle,
>
> Thank you for taking the time to contact us. Our canned food for dogs average about 5% carbs. Canned food is low in carbs because they are primarily water or broth (around 78%). We do not make anything that will have lower values than 5%.

……

Hi Danielle-
None of our dry foods will have a carbohydrate level as low as 15%. They average 30-45%. Canned food, by nature, will have the lowest carbs, as they are primarily made of water/broth. The Ultra™ and the Natural Choice® Chunks & Gravy formulas have the lowest amounts (approx. 4%). Hope this information helps!”

All of the Nutro Natural Choice and Ultra cans are right in our price range, at $21 to $28 a 12 can case. The Large Breed recipes seem to be the best looking as far as how much to feed, and protein values. And if the carb values they gave are correct, they are right where I want to stay. Very nice looking line. I don’t tend to follow the whole dog’s size and age marketing thing, but he’s only 8 pounds. Would a large breed (puppy and adult food) be fine for him? He’s two years old, and should be about 8 pounds (he’s probably 7-ish).

And theres always EVO. Good price point, but high fat. Not a food I’d have him on all the time. Maybe I’ll use it to keep his weight up. I’m having trouble keeping his weight up with out him eating us out of house and home. I’m trying to do the best by him and by moms budget. $20 a case where he’s eating the whole can every meal is not helping the budget issue. The By Nature is great, but its not high calorie enough, and I don’t think high fat enough, either. He’s an active little guy, and needs something that can keep him beefed up.

Anyway, if anyone has any thoughts or input or anything, throw it out there!

[Marlene N]

hello Kelsey I read your post and im starting to believe the same.
I have a Golden Retriever puppy too.
At 9 weeks old we were forced to change your food because the breeder was using a cheap brand called ” purina ol Roy”. (No nutritional value) We chose the blue life protection large breed brand. For the first 5 months everything seemed to be fine. Her coat was softer, her energy level and bowel movements better and she was anxious to eat her food. Then she started to be exposed to swimming in a lake, grabbing things off the street, eating grass , basically everything that comes with summertime. The diarrhea started. so we stopped her food and started her on the chicken and rice diet and then slowly gradually introduce her food to the chicken and rice and same thing the diarrhea came back full fledged.
For us -it has been going on for 2 months on and off, and we even tried to switch her over to the blue wilderness because we believed it was the grains causing it, but our second visit to the vet today, believes that the blue brand dog food is to rich in protein for dogs with senstive stomach’s. It makes sense. after a lot of research and discussions with veterinarians they believe that golden retrievers naturally have a sensitive stomach so diarrhea is something that will be regular, when it happens, our vet recommended imodium 1 tab every 12 hrs to stop the inital diarrhea runs and cramping along with the bland diet of chicken and rice. And to not feed them blue products.
So at the end of the day, we are guilty of trying to do the best thing for our pets by buying the best brand of dog food on the market with no grains, no by products, no soy or wheat and no chemicals when it would appear that this is what some dogs require.I would suggest any brands that for large breed sensitive stomach like natural choice nutrition. On another note, I saw 1 recall back in 2010 but it was for to much calcium.
right now our girl is on the chicken and rice with a slow introduction to new vet brand of dog food find that is a made by Hills, prescription I / d. we are keeping our fingers crossed that this works. Good luck!

[Naturella]

Darren,

This thread here should help: /forums/topic/large-and-giant-breed-puppy-nutrition/#post-47810

It has great info on large and giant breed puppy nutrition, as it is very important to balance the calcium and phosphorus ratio right. On page 17 or so there should be a document you can download with acceptable foods for large and giant breed puppies.

Good luck with the new pup! 🙂

[Darren S]

I have a Bullmastiff puppy on the way. Im looking for recommendations on puppy food? Don’t want to do a raw diet. Thank you.

[FrenchieBourdeaux]

Hi,
I am new to the forum and I know this question my have been answered and if so I am sorry. I just recently got a Doug De Bordeaux mastiff and I also have French Bulldogs so I am struggling to figure out what the best food would be to feed I feed my Frenchies a Nature’s Logic which they love and do great on mixture of there raw and dry. Ludo the new boy the mastiff came from the breeders eating TOTW which I don’t like to much or trust. Well he loves the Logic and wont eat the large breed puppy food the horizon complete he wants to eat what the girls eat (Frenchies) and the girls want to it his food which they cant. So I was wondering which food I could feed them all with were they would all be happy is Nature;s Logic calcium levels to high for him and if so which one on the list would be good for both to eat the Frenchies have a lot of allergy issues so I get nerves switching but it is not working feeding two different foods. Is the Now Calcium levels to high? And if so which one on the list do you feel would be the best for both breeds. He is 10 Weeks my Frenchies are 1, 5, and 8 years old. And is there any supplements that I should have him on? Sorry for the book..lol.

[Ben M]

I just got a Bouvier puppy and was looking for a good dog food. After looking through some documents and doing some research I was leaning to the Nature’s Variety Instinct: Limited Ingredient Diet Turkey…when I went to the site to verify my decision (I saw they had reformulated recently) I found the calcium levels higher than what i thought was recommended at 1.9%

http://www.instinctpetfood.com/product/instinct-grain-free-limited-ingredient-kibble-dog-food-turkey

The have a large breed puppy formula which looks better….however the 1.2%(min) throws me a little as to what the (max) would be

http://www.instinctpetfood.com/product/instinct-raw-boost-grain-free-kibble-large-breed-puppy-food-chicken

Can someone help me out…maybe I’m looking at it wrong?

[spaniel39]

hey Mom, I had a post and needed your advice-Thank you!

Hi
HDM et all
My sophie the Komondor is now 17 months old and I’ve switched her large breed puppy
food to Adult large breed, still with the lower calcium and phosphorous levels
around 1.4 calcium and 1.0 phosphorous
But I can’t seem to find any information on if I can feed them higher levels once full grown
and adults. I have 2 springer spaniels and even though I rotate their diets, would like not
to have to get so many different kinds of dog foods
is 2.2, etc too high a cacium level for an adult large breed? Does it even matter.
The spaniels are doing well on Wellness Core Ocean (and great stools) and would love
to put Sophie on that
Thank you all
Michael (and Sophie and Samuel the Spaniel and Charlotte)

[spaniel39]

Hi
HDM et all
My sophie the Komondor is now 17 months old and I’ve switched her large breed puppy
food to Adult large breed, still with the lower calcium and phosphorous levels
around 1.4 calcium and 1.0 phosphorous
But I can’t seem to find any information on if I can feed them higher levels once full grown
and adults. I have 2 springer spaniels and even though I rotate their diets, would like not
to have to get so many different kinds of dog foods
is 2.2, etc too high a cacium level for an adult large breed? Does it even matter.
The spaniels are doing well on Wellness Core Ocean (and great stools) and would love
to put Sophie on that
Thank you all
Michael (and Sophie and Samuel the Spaniel and Charlotte)

[Naturella]

Victor has teeny kibbles, Holistic Health Extension Small/Toy Breed has teeny kibbles too. My dog was 5lbs or so when we adopted him, he was very small, but was able to eat Blue Buffalo Wilderness with no problem. I haven’t ever fed him small breed anything since the first food he was on – Nutro Natural Choice Small Breed Puppy. Since then he’s been on:
Blue Buffalo Wilderness
Nutrisca
Dr. Tim’s (largest kibble he’s ever had)
Holistic Health Extension
Earthborn Holistic
Now! Fresh
Victor (smallest kibble he’s ever had)
Nature’s Variety Instinct
Annamaet samples (good size, close to Victor)
NutriSource samples (close to HHE)
TOTW samples (close to HHE/BBW)
Nulo sample (a bit bigger than BBW)

Overall Bruno has managed to deal with all kibble sizes just fine. But you can check out Victor and other small breed varieties of good 5-star foods. 🙂

[2manycats]

I have 6 month old English Mastiff/Saint Bernard mix (fixed). She had stomach issues and is currently on Hill’s I/D from my vet. I want to switch her back to a Giant Breed pet food but unsure which one to put her on. She was on Precise Giant Breed when her issues started. Has anyone feed their Giant Breed puppy the Pet Valu Large Breed puppy? Any suggestions on puppy food for my little …. I mean big girl .. she is 60lbs. Thanks.

[Lisa K]

I was considering Wellness Large Breed puppy food for my lab puppy. I see Wellness Core: Puppy make it to the list, but not Wellness Large Breed Puppy. Wondering which one to purchase. On a side note, my friend’s ( who own’s my pup’s bro) vet told her that the lab is not considered a large breed. WE are really struggling over choosing which food is best for them. Sny help would be appreciated. Very confusing.

[Lisa K]

In the list of large breed puppy nutrition of recommended foods I was wondering why Wellness Core: Puppy is listed but not Wellness Large Breed Puppy. In addition, my friends vet told her that a lab is not considered a large breed and not necessary to give large breed food. She has my puppies brother so we are trying to figure out which puppy food is best.

[Dfwgolden]

Hi everyone!

Ok so I have serious question for xx large breed dog owners.
I have a 12 week old male Great Dane puppy.
When we got him he was on Diamond Puppy formula and doing iffy.
We feed ourdogs a grain free rotational diet.
And they have done awesome. However Bane has seemed to decline since we got him.

He’s growing normally and everything however he has had soft stool since day one.
And these past two weeks it’s literally been water/patte.
Two days ago He had to go CONSTANTLY. And just explodes I kid you not it’s like an explosion.
A norm poop just falls even if it’s diarrhea however his blows like a gun. Splashing everywhere.
Including in our new car… Three times within two hours.
And it’s not just a little it’s A LOT.

He’s been on-
Diamond Puppy
Whole Earth Farms
And recently Diamond Naturals Large Breed chicken and rice.
This last food is when he hit his worst.

After two weeks of this I took him off the food sunday afternoon. And only gave him canned pumpkin salt, plain crackers, plain yogurt (live culture) and some probiotic human capsules.

Last night I finly have him some solid food:
Wellness Simple Salmon formula.
This morning he finally pooped and it was solid! But very orange defiantly could tell it was from the pumpkin! Haha!

He has since pooped three more times all of which have been mostly solid but could be better.
Shaped but mushy.

I’m wondering if it’s poultry and the Petco guy recommended it as a way to start into a LID and see if that helps. (The simple)
He had his ears cropped about 3-4 weeks ago and was on antibiotics which could possibly play a roll? And he is down on his probiotics?
He was only on them for a week though and this didn’t start up to water until recently.

He is on dewormer and flea/tick. Sintenal. And has received his last round of puppy shots. No rabies yet.
My dad brought up the possibility of Giardia and Coccidia. Had a fu work up done today he he’s clean as a whistle on his fecal Giardia and blood.
Our vet is a dane breeder herself

Bane is eating and drinking normally and has shown no signs of “illness” he’s just his goofy self as always!

My biggest
Concern however is the fact that if he does do good on wellness simple that we won’t be able to keep him on it.
It’s $68 for 27lbs.
And with him already eating 6 cups a day and is having 4 other dogs.
You get the gist.
I live in the Dallas/Ft. Worth Texas area and believe it or not my food choices although broad are limited to either $&!+ or high dollar.

We’ve done 4Health and Diamond and Proplan and purina one (which believe it or
Not the weight loss formula did fantastic for out over weight senior golden)

The vet said it’s possible he has a grain and poultry allergy.
Which limits my choices even more as even “duck and oatmeal” formulas contain chicken fat.

I leave for a month long Vacation with Bane to Poplar Bluff Missouri on the 15th white it being so Rural that lowers my availability even more.
Meaning I don’t have time to try a raw diet for him.

I need something that’s no more than $45-$50 a bag that can basically “hold him over” until I get back In 4 weeks.

I’m in need her Hound Dog mom! Lol.

[latis2270]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,

First of all, thank you so much for your dedication to, and excellent work in filling in some of the gaps in the grey area that is proper giant breed puppy nutrition. Finding this forum has eased a lot of the stress I’ve accumulated in looking for the right food for my puppy after hearing/reading conflicting opinions of what he should be eating from our vet, Saint blogs and non-giant puppy info sources…

I have a lovely 9 month old fixed male Saint Bernard. He is hovering around 85 pounds and growing fast with lots of energy, the appetite of a lion and a very healthy, lean body shape. Unfortunately he is having problems with digestion of his current food as his stool is consistently soft/diarrhea on the tail end of going to the bathroom (it always starts out solid). He is currently on Wellness Large Breed puppy formula and after reading your article and lots of reviews of other people having issues I see that it’s time to switch.

After researching some of the food on your list, I have my eye on the Earthborn Holistic brand, possibly the coastal catch variety. I do have a couple of questions and wonder if you might have an opinion-

1) I have read several of your responses for people asking about portions to feed a puppy on an adult food and understand, of course, that it is based on individual needs. But I am trying to ballpark where to start him based on his age as an older puppy with higher energy levels and a good amount of activity. His appetite is monstrous as well, I feel like he could eat way more than what we give him but of course I am respecting a healthy diet and trying to maintain a safe weight for his growth. We feed him a bit more than what the Wellness bag recommends because he seems so hungry and it has not affected his weight at all. Should I start him off at 1 1/2 of what the chart says? Not sure if 2 times the amount is too much as he’s not such a small puppy anymore….

2) Although your list has the EH varieties listed as 5 on DFA, the DFA website itself lists them at 4. I double checked to see that the calcium percentage is still the same as listed on your chart, and it is. But do you think the 4 score is a negative reflection on the brand if it dropped from a 5 to a 4?

Thanks so much for all of your help!

[LabOwner]

Are Wellness Complete Health Chicken Brown Rice and Salmon Meal Large Breed Puppy Food or lue Buffalo Wilderness Chicken Large Breed Puppy Food good options for a lab puppy?

• This reply was modified 11 years, 5 months ago by LabOwner.

[Trout-lily]

Thank you everyone for your advice on where to buy dog food. I’m debating about wellness, fromm, natures variety, or earth born holistic. I have issues with not knowing where the food is coming from as my parents just spent thousands of dollars from salmonella poisoning with their (our) beloved black lab. The vet hospital claimed it was sweet potato treats from china that most likely caused the issue. Luckily she is fully rehabbed but it has caused us to be cautious about where our dog products are coming from. Anyone have recommendations for a trusted puppy brand off of the ‘large breed puppy food list’ for my 14 week old Berner?

Also, do I stop watching the calcium levels after the pup is fully grown? I want to say Berners reach maturity after 2 years but that seems like an awful long time to be on puppy food.

Thank you!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Qi X –

While I wouldn’t consider standard poodles to be a large breed, however I do know that they are somewhat prone to hip dysplasia so you may want to consider feeding one of the formulas in the list with appropriate calcium levels. You could feed your adult toy poodle the same food as the puppy or check out any of the 4 or 5 star rated foods. If he prefers a smaller kibble, as some small breeds do, some good options are Victor, Amicus, Nature’s Logic, Nature’s Variety and most any formula labeled for “small breeds.”

[Tara M]

My 11 month old GSD mix has been dealing with chronic diarrhea for about 3 months now. My vet first prescribed antibiotics, Pepcid (for constant grass eating) and Proviable-DC with a tentative diagnosis of beginning signs of IBS or IBD due to high level of bad gut bacteria. She was on Authority Large Breed Puppy (chicken formula) when symptoms first started, the we transitioned to the Lamb & Rice with the same results.While on the antibiotics, Shyla’s symptoms were resolved but within 5 days of finishing, she was right back where we started. Our vet refilled the Pepcid and antibiotic with longer dosage time with a recommendation for a prescription diet. I know my vet uses Hill’s ( a brand I do not trust) and I’m not in favor. I am really wanting Shyla to be completly off the antibiotics and know it is time to go grain free and work from there to determine if this is a food intolerance but am lost as to which would be the best for her, especially when I’m on a budget with three rescues in the home. I need a good quality food but affordable as due to her weight class, she requires 4 cups of kibble daily. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated to this novice dog mama.

[Tara M]

Please help. I have a 11 month old GSD mix (resuce) who started showing signs of either food intolerance or beginnings of IBD or IBS (per vet). We have her on Proviable-DC, Pepcid, and an antibiotic (2nd round). My vet is pushing for a prescription diet, which I know them to use Hill’s, a brand I do not trust. I really would like to change her diet to something better in the hopes of eliminating all antibiotic usage, but am on a budget with three rescues in the home. Any advice? She has been on Authority Large Breed puppy (chicken formula) and Lamb and Rice.

[Bret O]

Found the answer in another reply. Thanks to Hound Dog Mom:

Hi yevincent –
Yes – calcium needs to be converted to a dry matter basis for wet foods due to the high moisture content. Calculating calcium levels on a kcal. basis (versus percent of weight basis) is the most accurate way to evaluate the appropriateness of foods as it accounts for varying caloric densities between different foods. For a large breed puppy you’d want to feed a food with 3.5 g. calcium per 1,000 kcal. or less. I’ll walk you through the calculation. Let’s say the food comes in a standard 13.2 oz. can, has 400 kcal. per can and the company tells you there is 0.3% calcium on an as-fed basis.
1) Convert 13.2 oz. to grams (easier to perform calculations using grams): (13.2 oz.)(28 grams/1 oz.) = ~397 g.
2) Calculate how many grams of calcium are in the can of food: (397 g.)(0.003) = 1.19 g. calcium per can.
3) Calculate how many grams of calcium per 1,000 kcal.: (1.19 g. calcium per can)/(400 kcal. per can) = 0.00298 g. calcium per kcal. (0.00298 g. calcium per kcal.)(1,000 kcal.) = ~2.98 g. calcium per 1,000 kcal.
————————————
If you wanted the calcium level on a percent basis:
1) 100% – % Moisture = % Dry Matter
2) [(As Fed Calcium %)/(% Dry Matter)] X 100%
BTW – I’d highly recommend Tripett as a canned topper for large breed puppies. It’s not a complete and balanced food as it’s green tripe only but it makes a great topper if you’re feeding a balanced kibble. Green tripe is high in protein and naturally has a balanced calcium to phosphorus ratio but contains very low levels of each (only about 0.3% calcium on a dry matter basis if I recall correctly). The best part is dogs go nuts for it.

[Trout-lily]

Hi
I am a new mom of a 14 week old bener. My breeder told me the old wives tale of reducing the puppy to adult food after she is 4 months but now I’m reading that this is not the case. Luckily I’ve been feeding her Wellness puppy food since we got her at 10 weeks and I see that it’s on your approved list. I have two questions; 1.) When is the proper time to switch my giant breed to adult large breed dog food and 2.) where do I find most of the dog foods in your approved list? I tried searching for other varietys to mix it up a bit but I’m finding that petco and petsmart don’t carry most of the brands on the list. I’m starting to freak myself out from reading some of the posts of hipdisplasia in young pups but I figure this forum would be a good place to start to gain my sanity back. Thank you so much for sharing your research.

[spaniel39]

I have had great luck with Sophie my 120 pound Komondor on
Nutrisource Large Breed Lamb (she was on large breed puppy previously but now
she’s 15 months old).
It gets great reviews and reasonably priced especially compared to Orijen or Acana.

Before that, she did well on canine Caviar Lamb Puppy dinner but was very expensive
plus they had a labeling problem, where there was a misprint on the bags showing
the puppy formula calcium level over 2% and did nothing about it
(Oh, the food inside is ok, we just need to use up the bags!!!)
Another good one I used but don’t anymore is Artemis’s Osopure Duck and garbanzo beans
but the big bags are $70.

Personally, not into the “raw” diet for my pups;
I do supplement their diet (have 2 springer spaniels also) with a very lean
Hamburger or turkey burger—cooked—once a week or 10 days.
They love green beans, blueberries, cooked spinach.
It’s great to supplement with veggies, etc

GLTA!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Bethany D –

Science Diet’s Large Breed Puppy formula has calcium levels appropriate for large breed growth. However, you may wish to check out the review for the food here.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 6 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi OnyxMom –

All of TOTW’s foods are too high in calcium for a large breed puppy, including this formula.

Personally, I would recommend avoiding foods that contain fish and instead adding canned sardines or salmon, cage-free eggs or high quality fish oil to the food for omega 3’s. The processing which the meat meals undergo to be made into kibble and the storage time very likely leaves the omega 3’s in kibble rancid by the time the food is consumed.

[OnyxMom]

Hello everyone!

I have a 5.5 month old Newfoundland Standard Poodle mix puppy (Onyx) who weighed in at about 60 pounds 2 weeks ago. We were feeding him Blue Buffalo large breed but the food doesnt agree with him, he itches constantly on it. And, his poop is Never good. I hate picking up mushy mess always. gross.

So, I was thinking about switching to Taste of the Wild’s salmon stream puppy formula, He was on this food before we got him and he loved it and was doing well on it. Im picking TOTW because of the following reasons:
1. It’s actually pretty reasonably priced for a 4 star food (on DFA) and I am a grad student so money is an issue.
2. The calcium content is at 1.4% and as recommended in this article (http://www.ivcjournal.com/articles/feeding-large-breed-puppies/) since it should be around 1.5% it seems okay to me.
3. The salmon is supposed to be good for his coat, he has the poodle hair, and I would like for it to be shinier than it is now.
4. He loves salmon anything.

I’d say Onyx is quite healthy and has a BCS of 4. Other than the occasional bout of diarrhea especially if he’s been digging up dirt, he is pretty happy and healthy.

Can anybody tell me if this is a terrible idea please? Here’s the link for the TOTW nutritional information – http://www.tasteofthewildpetfood.com/products/puppies/dry_food/pacific_stream_puppy_formula/

Thank you!

[Bethany D]

Hi HDM,

Thank you so much for your research and insight regarding large breed dog foods. I have a couple of questions regarding food choices for my golden retriever puppy who will be coming home with me in a little over a week. I currently feed my other two dogs (an adult lab and golden) Taste of the Wild but it appears the TOTW puppy food is too high in calcium. I am investigating other large breed puppy options. I haven’t seen much written on here about Hill’s Science Diet Large Breed Puppy. I don’t necessarily like that chicken meal is the top ingredient but do you have any other thoughts on that option?

Also what do you think would be the most cost effective food that would be appropriate for a large breed puppy? The Fromm Gold LBP is intriguing. I am on a bit of a budget for dog food, but I also don’t want to compromise my puppy’s health with cheap or inappropriate dog food. Thanks for the advice!

[theBCnut]

The only issues with size are if the dog can handle the size of kibble and if the large breed is a puppy, making sure the food has the right calcium levels for a growing large breed.

[Tina]

Anyone own a Golden Retriever? If so what do you feed yours?
My Golden Retriever Angel is 8 years old and has these problems;
*dry skin
*itchy skin
*red skin
*scabs all over back, chest and tail
*weak hip and joints
*Gains weight really quick
*eats very fast
*Very gassy
She is on Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Senior along with Hill’s Science Diet Large Breed Adult and Wellness Simple Salmon and Potato mixed in. She has only had chicken her entire life. These are the brands that she has tried as a puppy and a adult;
*Eukanuba Puppy
*Purina Pro Plan Puppy
*Purina One Adult
*Hill’s Science Diet Large Breed Adult
*Royal Canine Golden Retriever
*Blue Buffalo Large Breed Senior
*Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Senior
*Wellness Simple Salmon and Potato
None of these I was happy with and none of them did the trick except for Royal Canine (kinda). What can you suggest? I’m open to ANY suggestions, including all life stages dog food. She will eat anything and I mean anything at all. My only stipulation is that I can find the brand in multiple stores. She never gets bored of the same brand or flavor.

Thank You All

[Taylor D]

I have been an avid follower to this forum and website and decided to finally register to participate, not just because I have a question, although I do 🙂

I own three female Golden Retrievers. Misty is 10, Daisi is 6, and Lena is 7 months.

After much research and reading Hound Dog Mom’s list of Large Breed Dog Foods (I even printed it out) I decided to feed Lena Wellness CORE Puppy for her first year.
She made the switch great (she was eating Blue Buffalo Wilderness at breeders) and is doing great on it. Her coat is sooo soft.
The thing I have noticed is if I give her too much of that kibble, she will get soft poop.
I know this is a high protein/ high fat food and I should be giving her less than what the bag says.
She is a good weight now, nice and lean, no ribs or hips showing, although I can feel her ribs. But she is small for her age!
She weighs 30 pounds and she is 7 months!
She is only gaining about 5-10 pounds a month.
I am feeding her 2 and a half cups of the puppy food a day, divided among three meals, for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.
She does fine on that amount, poop is fine. When I try to increase the amount, she gets soft poop.
I do pour some fresh raw goat milk in with her food each meal when I am increasing her food, and sometimes it keeps the soft poop away but not all the time.
I know why she gets the soft poop, and I know she is of good weight for her size, no ribs are showing.
But she is small for her age and breed.
Is it possible she is not getting the calcium she needs, because of the decreased amount I am feeding her, because of the protein rich food?
Wouldn’t the calcium levels listed for the food be for an average serving size?
Wouldn’t it be okay to feed her a food slightly lower in protein maybe around 30-32%, instead of the 36% in Wellness Core Puppy, but with slightly higher levels of calcium?

Their is a Slow Growth Method of feeding Goldens or large breeds that some breeders recommend following. Even with the Slow Growth Method, Lena should weigh at least 65 pounds for her age.

I also know high protein is not a problem for large breeds.

I was just wondering if I could switch her to a good 4.5-5 star grain free food with 30-32% protein with higher levels of calcium. Or even a 35%+ protein food with higher levels of calcium, since I would still be feeding her less than the amount listed on bag.

[Jackie B]

/forums/topic/large-and-giant-breed-puppy-nutrition/

Make sure and check out the large and giant breed puppy food discussion. You can add a little canned plain pumpkin to his food also, that should help with his stool (as long as he doesn’t have worms or giardia, etc).

[Corey K]

Thank you for all of the feedback. Think I still need help so will give more specifics in hopes that there might be some easy answers but I fear not cause things at my house are far too crazy! I live with my husband and adult daughter and between us we have 4 dogs. 3 of them have food issues that cause me questions:

Missy – 12 year old bearded collie – Would eat nothing but frozen Bil Jac her entire life until she got acid reflux issues 6 wks ago and changing her food was extremely tough. She is now eating (begrudgingly) one cup of natures’ recipe easy to digest chicken dry food, one half cup of rice and one half cup of either boiled ground chicken or boiled ground beef per day.

Max – 11 year old bearded collie – no health issues – will eat ANYTHING including what he finds in the back yard when he beats me to it. He is currently, happily eating two cups per day of the natures’ recipe easy to digest chicken dry food.

Frankie – 3 year old dane mix – he is currently eating IAMS large breed proactive years 1-5. Many days he wants nothing to do with it. Also concerned about what I am reading about IAMS testing on animals, but the plus is they do sell it in 50 lb bags at my Costco. I tried mixing in canned with the dry and he wants nothing to do with the wet food. He is having some teeth issues, with mild gingivitis and we are working on that so not sure if that is factoring in.

Last but not least my daughter’s new puppy Rerun – he is 4 mos old. Rerun is half beagle and half siberian husky – now 30 lbs – vet estimates will be around 60. She is currently feeding him Kirkland signature puppy. He does not seem to like it. He eats very little of it and wants no more.

I feel like 60% of my life right now revolves around feeding dogs and it is becoming more difficult to manage than I can handle. Of course with the 4 of them in the house, feeding is an event, not just an all day graze – you eat what you are given or you dont get any – but now that everyone but Max has decided to become picky – it now involves each of us coralled to a designated space with our charge for the better part of an hour to hour and a half while we coax whichever dog we have to eat so that we can go on with life.

I know that most might want to provide the advice that we just have too many dogs, and I’ve talked way long enough without going into why we have this many dogs at this time in our lives lol! I think I’ve read enough to have learned that the better the quality of food the less tasty. Do I need to find a middle of the road senior food that is palliative enough for my older dogs to eat and wont bother their stomachs? (is there such a thing?) If I can coax my dane to eat the IAMS for awhile longer, what happens when he gets to 6 years old – the bag says 1-5 and he’s almost 4 and weighs 100 lbs. What about this puppy – do we start trying other puppy foods to find one he likes? We tried adding canned (have only found adult canned where I shop) and he then eats the canned and spits out the dry. Very sorry for such a long post – and look forward to any suggestions!!

[Tina]

Anyone own a Golden Retriever? If so what do you feed yours? My Golden Retriever Angel is 8 years old and has these problems;
*dry skin
*itchy skin
*red skin
*weak hip and joints (she is on cohesion for this)
*sometimes over weight
*eats very fast
She is on Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Senior along with other small bags of stuff mixed in. She has only had chicken her entire life and as a younger puppy/adult was on;
*Eukanuba Puppy
*Purina Pro Plan Puppy
*Purina One Adult
*Hill’s Science Diet Large Breed Adult
*Royal Canine Golden Retriever
*Blue Buffalo Large Breed Senior
*Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Senior
None of these I was happy with and none of them did the trick except for Royal Canine (kinda). What can you suggest? I’m open to ANY suggestions, including all life stages dog food. My only thing is that I need it to be inexpensive, not cheap but not like $80 for a 24lb bag.

[Tina]

Anyone own a Golden Retriever? If so what do you feed yours? My Golden Retriever Angel is 8 years old and has these problems;
*dry skin
*itchy skin
*red skin
*weak hip and joints (she is on cohesion for this)
*sometimes over weight
*eats very fast
She is on Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Senior along with other small bags of stuff mixed in. She has only had chicken her entire life and as a younger puppy/adult was on;
*Eukanuba Puppy
*Purina Pro Plan Puppy
*Purina One Adult
*Hill’s Science Diet Large Breed Adult
*Royal Canine Golden Retriever
*Blue Buffalo Large Breed Senior
*Nutro Natural Choice Large Breed Senior
None of these I was happy with and none of them did the trick except for Royal Canine (kinda). What can you suggest? I’m open to ANY suggestions, including all life stages dog food. My only thing is that I need it to be inexpensive, not cheap but not like $80 for a 24lb bag.

[Tina]

Nutritional Adequacy Statement or “AAFCO Statement”

AAFCO is an organization that sets the nutritional standards for pet foods sold in the United States.
This legally required statement verifies the testing method used to determine nutritional adequacy.
The statement indicates whether the food provides complete and balanced nutrition for a specific lifestage of your dog (growth, adult, pregnant/nursing), or if the product is nutritionally adequate for all lifestages.
Beware if the package states the food supports “all lifestages.” The product likely contains excessive levels of some nutrients necessary for the most demanding lifestage, which is growth. For example, it might contain higher levels of protein and calcium for puppies, but those levels are inappropriate for an adult or senior dog.

The Best Life for Man’s Best Friend
Adult dog with puppy

Whether you have a new puppy or the dog you’ve loved for years, caring for your dog properly ensures many happy years together. As you care for your dog, even the little things – perfectly selected food, exercise and love – can make a big difference. We want to be a part of your dog’s happy, healthy life, so we’re here to share information on proper nutrition, fitness and special needs.

Knowing the age of your dog is important in choosing their nutrition. If you have a dog and aren’t sure of his exact age, your veterinarian can help estimate that for you.

Adult dogs include dogs of the following ages:

1 to 7 years old for small and medium breeds
1 to 5 years old for large breeds and
1 to 4 years old for giant breeds
As you care for your dog, it’s important to remember that his needs change as he grows. Caring for your dog according to his lifestage means you’re giving him the best care.

[RescueDaneMom]

Case-

I have a Great Dane. I agree that it depends on the size of the dog. The most important thing is to NOT feed a food that is only approved for Adult Maintenance by AAFCO to your puppy. I would feed an “All Life Stages” or puppy food (they truly are the same thing) until at least 1 year. If you have a large breed, then 2 years. If you have a giant breed (like a Dane), then 3 years. I also agree with aquariangt about vets. My vet and I butt heads over what I feed my dog. I choose to feed The Honest Kitchen and raw. My vet says that feeding Purina or Iams is just as good and all I’m doing is wasting my money on expensive dog food. I told him that we’ll have to agree to disagree and we don’t speak on the subject anymore.

I hope this is helpful. Just my two cents 🙂

[pugmomsandy]

It depends on the size of the dog. For large/giant breeds, picking a food with the proper amount of calcium and phosphorus and proper calcium:phosporus ratio is more important than picking a food for “growth” or “all life stages” during the first year to 2 years. Large/giant breed pups need controlled amounts, where as toy/small or medium does not require the controlled amounts. You can be feeding too much calcium and phosphorus even though a food is rated for “growth” or “all life stages” during the large/giant breed puppy phase. So I would feed a large/giant breed pup a food with proper Ca/Phos for a year or two.

I deal with toy dogs so I would hypothetically switch as young as 8 months to “adult” food, but personally, I feed “all life stage” or “growth/puppy” food all the time to my toy dogs, even to seniors.

It is somewhat confusing and not as black and white as just “puppy” or “adult” food. If you have a large/giant breed pup, there is a forum topic for that:

/forums/topic/large-and-giant-breed-puppy-nutrition/

and there is a link to a document created by Hounddogmom with foods appropriate for large/giant breed pups in there. I think around page 15 and an updated list around pages 34-35. I haven’t looked in that topic for a while since I have only toy dogs!

• This reply was modified 11 years, 6 months ago by pugmomsandy.
• This reply was modified 11 years, 6 months ago by pugmomsandy.

[aquariangt]

Correct. Marketing is marketing is marketing. Check that label and that will tell you if it’s appropriate for your puppy.

Case-it kind of depends on the breed, I have a sheltie, a miniature schnauzer, and a westie. They are done growing earlier than larger type breeds. I don’t know the science behind the two levels of food, other than ALS/Puppy foods tend to be higher in protein, but I’m not sure exactly when it’s “safe” to switch-but I’ve given 9-10 month olds “maintenance” food before

[spaniel39]

Jason B
I now have a 1 year 2 month old 130 pound Komondor
I started her off on Canine Caviar Puppy Dinner (lamb)
but was pretty expensive
I had great luck with Petcurean NOW large breed puppy
Now Fresh Large Breed Puppy (5 stars)
But it’s not inexpensive at about $59 for a large bag.
NOW FRESH™ Large Breed Puppy food recipe is made with 100% FRESH turkey, salmon, duck & 100% fresh Omega 3 & 6 oils from coconuts and canola. NOW FRESH™ also features zero grains, gluten, wheat, beef, corn or soy. Zero rendered meats, by-products or artificial preservatives.

This recipe also features:

Calcium and phosphorus to promote your puppy’s growth
New Zealand green mussels to support hip and joint health
Added L-Carnitine to support heart health/fat burning
Pre + Probiotics to support digestion
Added Taurine to support vision and heart function

[SaintsDontCarryBrandy]

Our family has had Saint Bernards since before I was born, but the diet choices weren’t either as varied or as useful as they are now. “What’s cheap?” reigned over “What’s the best diet?” Now I have a Saint Bernard puppy (9 weeks) coming into our household who’s been raised on Sportmix Wholesome. It averages 3.5 stars, but given its first few ingredients are major flags, I’m not willing to “save a few bucks” in exchange for a less healthy and shorter-lived pup!
I can’t access HDM’s Large Breed Dog Food list on Google (argh); am considering Victor Grain Free, but am open to any dog food good for giant-breed dogs (my pup’s dad is 220 and a strapping boy, so he isn’t likely to be small…) Saints develop at a rapid pace, so their dietary needs are similar to other giants (Newfies, Mastiffs, Danes, Pyrenees, etc.)

Am reading everything I can get my hands on. I’m willing to get better quality dog food; would appreciate any advice, as well as thoughts on feeding raw vs. great-quality package food. Thanks!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Nat R –

Just so you know, no studies exist demonstrating that protein has negative effects on giant breed puppies or adults – anything you read about this is myth and nothing more. There is, however, a lot of research proving the protein is not harmful.

Feeding Large Breed Puppies by Susan Winn DVM (Featured in IVC Journal)

“A common misconception found in many internet articles is the claim that dietary protein should be controlled in large breed puppies to prevent skeletal abnormalities. This theory was disproved some years ago (Nap, 1991). Most commercial puppy foods contain more protein than is thought necessary, but studies have shown that protein contents of 23% to 31% (dry matter) do not have a deleterious effect on growth.”

“Decades ago, we considered some adult diets appropriate for puppies. However, a calorie-calcium mismatch is probably common. Adult maintenance foods are often less calorically dense than puppy foods. Additionally, these diets may have calcium and phosphorus levels that are higher in relation to energy density than a large breed puppy diet. If a rapidly growing puppy has to eat more food to obtain enough calories for growth, a calcium overdose is possible.”

“Most nutritionists recommend that large, fast growing puppies eat diets containing AT LEAST 30% protein and 9% fat (dry matter basis).”

The Effect of Breed Size on Nutritional Considerations for Growing Puppies

“Excessive intake of dietary protein has been suggested as a contributing factor to skeletal developmental problems, such as osteochondrosis, in large breed dogs. This hypothesis was tested by feeding Great Dane puppies either 15%, 23% or 32% dietary protein (13%, 21% or 29% of energy). While the low protein diet reduced growth, no detrimental effects from the higher protein diets were observed.”

This is a FANTASTIC article (one of my favorites) on large breed nutrition written by Susan Lauten PhD – I would HIGHLY recommend reading it in its entirety, however here are some of the highlights:

Nutritional Risks to Large-Breed Dogs: From Weaning to the Geriatric Years

“Currently, no evidence exists to suggest that high-protein intake contributes to the development of orthopedic disease in growing large-breed puppies. Previous studies suggesting a risk for high protein and DOD were confounded by higher energy intake in high-protein foods. In general, large-breed puppy diets are formulated to contain approximately 30% protein (DMB) similar to other puppy foods.”

“…feeding adult foods to large-breed puppies before 1 year of age is not recommended because the calcium-to-energy ratio is generally lower in adult foods compared with large-breed puppy food. Feeding an adult food can actually result in greater intake of calcium than feeding puppy foods. Because the puppy must consume a larger portion of adult food to meet energy needs for growth, total calcium intake may actually be higher than with a properly formulated large-breed puppy formula.”

Here is the link to a study done on Great Dane pups that was featured in the Journal of Nutrition. The study concluded: “the differences in protein intake per se did not affect the occurrence of disturbed skeletal development in young Great Danes.”

Do You Know What to Feed Your Large Breed Dog? By Karen Becker DVM

“Studies have repeatedly concluded dietary protein levels have no effect on the development of skeletal problems in large and giant breed dogs. But still today, many breeders of large dogs, owners and even some veterinarians will tell you protein is the problem, even though there is no evidence to prove it. Protein excess is not the problem. In fact, it’s often a dietary protein deficiency that contributes to skeletal problems.”

You may find this of interest as well. Here Dr. Becker interviews a Newfie breeder (not Great Danes I know – however Newfies are generally considered to be a giant breed). This breeder feeds his dogs HIGH protein raw and his dogs don’t experience many of the health problems typical to giant breed dogs and his dogs live much longer than most giant breeds (he had a dog live to be 17 – the typical life span of a giant breed is about 8).

Sorry to bombard you with reading, but large breed nutrition is one of my favorite subjects and I like to make sure people have the facts. 🙂

• This reply was modified 11 years, 6 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.
• This reply was modified 11 years, 6 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Nat R –

There’s no reason a Great Dane can’t eat a high protein food and, in fact, they should. It’s also not true that they should not eat puppy food as puppies, they need to eat a puppy food with controlled calcium levels appropriate for large breed growth. There’s a lot of information about this on the large breed puppy thread. Many many years ago it was believed that high levels of protein caused joint issues, it’s been known for quite some time now that this isn’t true however there are still a few vets, breeders and pet owners that believe this myth.

[Akari_32]

I keep my lab mix on almost exclusively on high protein (30+ %), grain free foods because she does terrible on most grain inclusive foods (drops weight, poor coat). Every dog is different, and not all grain free are created equally. Saying that all labs must have a certain type food (or all of any breed, for that matter) is like saying a certain diet is appropriate for all people, regardless of their individual needs.

Definitely check out the large breed puppy thread. I’m not sure of it’s on there, but I’m partial to Wellness CORE. My dogs do great on all the ones I’ve tried, and with local sales and Wellness’s $5 off any size bag coupons, I get it for about $2 usually. I also like the looks of NutriSource. I’m just now venturing into the brand, with Super Performance, a high calorie, grain inclusive food, but they have something for everyone. The dogs are just now about 50/50 into that, so I don’t have much to say about it in action yet, but many people use the brand and love it on here. I’m not sure if any of their foods are appropriate for a LBP, but it could be something to look into later on when your guy is an adult, if not. 🙂

[jen.mcco]

Curious if there is a listing of foods that include grain by any chance– I do rotation diets with my older boxers (5 yrs and 9 yrs) which include grain/grain-free/raw– WE do not feed corn/wheat/soy products and everything I feed is on the 4 or 5 star list– However we will be getting another boxer puppy in 3 wks– Although I would like to rotate his diets as well I would like to know if there are any 4 star foods that are acceptable for a large breed puppy that is not totally grain free-

[LabTX]

Hound Dog Mom, I’ve been reading a lot of your posts on the Large Breed Puppies topic and was wondering if you had some insight for a large breed adult puppy. I have a 7.5 yr old, 65lb, chocolate lab who has been on a RAW diet for the last 2-3 years. She has been through BARF, Tuckers, and most recently OC RAW. My wife thought it would be easier if we switched her back to dry food. The savings would be nice, but I’m worried about her health more than anything. Are there any decent dry food replacements that are going to do as well as the RAW? I will say, I have never seen a dog so excited to eat in my life. Sometimes I wonder if she’s constantly hungry on the RAW because of the way she acts, but she maintains a healthy 65lb weight.