[Mom2Cavs]

Hey, all….I just started the Springtime, Inc. supplements for people. I’m using the Joint Health capsules, the Tonic Blend and the Boswellia Extract tabs. I’ve been using for about a week now, instead of the nsaids I normally use for my back and sciatica. I believe it’s helping, so yay! Of course, it could all be the placebo thing, too, lol. Regardless, I’m going to keep using them and see how it goes.

[losul]

Sorry about the delayed responses.

InkedMarie, Thanks for posting. I did find the link you provided helpful. Helped me to realize more, that while it is a really scary and serious thing, but that there is a difference between being HW positive and lower levels of worms and having significant HW disease. It also got me to thinking more about using some supportive supplements.

Shawna, again, very helpful links, not just about timing for seasonal HW preventatives, but also other things. Thank you. I’ve never posted a pic of Turbo yet, but it’s on my to do list as soon as I get caught up on things. Because of the cumulative effects, I guess the advantage multi could be started a little earlier than the others and stopped earlier for using seasonal HWP. But it’s also because of those cumulative effects and the added and unwanted flea killer, that I doubt I will use for HWP, beyond using for treatment. I also noted in your second link that advantage multi is not often even used during treatment.

I’m also thinking now that it is still senseless for me to give Turbo HWP’s year round. (once he is HW free). Even if I up the dosage months to 9 or 10 months, a break of 2 or 3 months from it, is better than no break, and shouldn’t be any risk of infection anyway during the coldest months.

Aimee, I agree 100% with your critical thinking in the the case of Mr. Piggy/Dr. Falconer.
Not so sure either about his “homeopathic” remedies, i.e. sulphur, calcarea carbonica, graphites (is that actually given internally?)

I also got to reading some other alternative treatments elsewhere such as black walnut extract, wormwood, etc. Some of those seem would be as/or more so, toxic as conventional drug treatments. But I think I will start using some garlic.

Update: Turbo had his X-rays Wednesday. The vet went over them with me, and in general thought they looked pretty good. He didn’t see anything at that time that would cause him to downgrade him from class 1 to class 2. Although he did have some things he wanted the visiting radiologist to look at and review (the heart) when he comes in again, I think on April 8. The lungs looked mostly pretty clear and pulmonary arteries he thought looked pretty good. I’m definitely leaning towards a slower kill protocol (rather than the harsh immiticide, steroids, and painkillers, and the vet seems fine with that, although he is still adamant about continuing with the Advantage multi, rather than ivermectin, me I’m not entirely sure Advantage multi will be as effective as ivermectin on fully mature worms, according to what I have read. Also if not going with immiticide, he wants to get going on the doxycycline sooner. He is saying just 2 weeks of doxy. Most of what i read says 4 weeks, or pulsing it. I also told him I had a 2nd HW test done that indicated low antigen, and that that vet thought it indicated lower worm load.

• This reply was modified 12 years ago by losul.

[theBCnut]

It’s a strain on her heart. DinoVite is a high fat supplement and her regular food should have been cut back accordingly. And in fact, you need to make sure you get every ounce of extra weight off of her. Be careful of her exercise and don’t let her get overheated.

[Chelsie J]

I’ve been giving my 12 year old Toy Poodle Dinovite for about a month now and it has helped her skin tremendously. She used to scratch and itch a lot and had awful skin rashes. Now her skin is almost completely clear. The easiest way to give the supplement to her is to mix it with a small can of wet dog food. Her regular dry food was not very good, since we have so many dogs my Dad would just buy huge bags of whatever the cheapest food was at the store. We didnt realize it was probably the equivalent to dog fast food and that she was not getting the nutrients she needed to maintain good health. You could just buy your dog/dogs a healthy dry food like Science Diet, but the bags are small and expensive. It saves money to buy a 90 day supply of Divovite and mix it with an okay dry food.

[Naturella]

Hey, guys! I need to vent… sorry to burden you all, but it’s happening…

So today I was grooming Bruno (with the Furminator – that dog sheds like an avalanche!), and my roommate saw me so he came to offer precious advice. He did help me finish Bruno up cause it was a bit of a struggle – he doesn’t like being groomed and I wasn’t doing it quite right – he was in my lap when he should have been in front of me. Either way, it all went ok, until my roommate was almost done with Bruno and noticed his doggie dander.

And then…

He began lecturing me on how I feed my dog “a bunch of random crap” (referring to the additives I have been giving him to help with his hard-ass stools, and just for general health supplementation, such as yoghurt, pumpkin, flax seed meal, coconut oil, canned sardines, raw egg, RMBs, etc.)!!! He then continued on saying how his brother’s dog (a rottie) lived to 14.5 years old (“when the average lifespan of rottweilers is 10 years”), and how he thrived on ONE food for his WHOLE life, and it was… Can you guess? THE SCIENCE DIET!!!

His next advice was that I need to not mess with my dog’s GI tract by giving him my random crap, because:
a. I will spoil him and he won’t ever eat just dry kibble again.
b. I will mess his digestion up
c. I will mess his skin and coat by adding the stuff I add.
He then went on to brag about his dog, who has only been on Science Diet as well, and how she has no pet dander and how she is the “epitome of health” according to his vet and how whatever he’s doing, he shouldn’t change ever (and he plans to do exactly that); how she never has tummy troubles because he has found one food that she likes and does her so much good and he will never change it… And how I SHOULD DO THE SAME, how I need to choose between Nutro, Blue Buffalo, or Science Diet, and find something Bruno likes, and keep him on it forever!!! GAH!

In between some of his tirade I managed to sneak in a word or 2, such as: “The random crap I feed him is to help with his stools, and is carefully researched and selected to fit my dog’s dietary needs” – response “Yeah, but you give him too much of it, plus, hard kibble is designed to be balanced and give the dogs all they need, so they don’t really need any other crap, additives, or soft food, for the a, b, and c reasons above.”
Me – “I am about to put Bruno on a fish-based food soon” (referring to his pet dander).
Him – “Why?”
Me – “Because fish is really good for dogs’ skin and coat, and has Omega 3 and 6 fatty acids, just like flax seed (minus the Omega 6) and coconut oil.”
Him – “… Yeah, but lamb is better. Casey (his dog) has been on brown rice and lamb and her coat is so shiny and soft (not nearly as much as my dog’s, I promise), and she has no pet dander, and she loves the food, and you really shouldn’t switch his food so much.”

Maybe he is right, maybe lamb is indeed better, but can someone please explain how it could be better than fish, in regards to Omega 3 and 6, and skin and coat benefits?

As for the rest, the convo ended with him saying that he doesn’t usually like to tell us (my husband and I, which he NEVER tells him – he only speaks to me about the dog) how to take care of the dog, cause he feels like “we” (read “I”) get pissed off, but he wants us to do what’s best for Bruno…. I don’t know how I didn’t lose it and yell at him that I already am, and that all I do and feed is because I do daily research on it, and educate myself on what is good for Bruno… I just thanked him for helping me with the grooming and went to wash my dog…

Sigh, annoyed… The other problem/reason why I didn’t pour some emotions and knowledge down his head, is because:
a. he clearly won’t take it
b. he is helping us financially with the place a lot, i.e. paying more than us
c. I’m a chicken (or, how I like to think of it, I pick my battles).

SO, this is it… I just really needed to vent… Sigh, I will go walk my “messed-with” dog… Poor guy, having all kinds of variety with his food… I should be ashamed of my dog parenting skills… LoL,.. Sigh….

[aquariangt]

that’s a good point sandy made-there are a lot of foods out there that meet your criteria except the fiber options. But there are plenty of ways to supplement that that are easy and affordable

[andrew b]

So I have a Staffy who is almost 18 months. She has already been allergy tested, and on a scale of 0-4 scored a 2 on numerous things, different types of grasses/weeds, dust and so on, with yeast also registering. We have also done a food trial prior to intradermal testing with Royal Canin HP and her itching really never got better on it. The main issue is she scratches herself bloody. Her neck, under her arms, her face. It’s a sin. We use Temaril-P when needed and it does help, have tried Atopica which didn’t work at all, have tried a new medication called Apoquel that didn’t work at all. Usually when she’s extremely bad(she was at the vet Tuesday, she sees a dermatologist at UPenn), she comes back positive for a yeast infection on her skin. She also started immunotherapy 5 months ago.

The worst of foods(on a relative scale) she has eaten would be Taste of the Wild as a puppy, and when the itching started around 4 months, we have tried, all for nearly 2 month periods, Earthborn, Acana, Nature’s Variety LID and now back to Earthborn since it doesn’t seem to matter.

Where am I going with all of this? Before I fully delve into trying a raw or cooked diet and seeing if it helps, should I just try the lowest carbohydrate food I can find to try and cut down on the yeast issues? If this doesn’t work, I am going either raw, freeze dried or cooked at the end of May. I was going to try Brothers Complete Allergy Formula but I’ve read it’s fairly high in carbs. Would I be better going with something that is 25% or so carbohydrates based on this site’s calorie weighted analysis, perhaps Orijen or Nature’s Variety Raw Boost, or something else?

We’ve tried so much…supplements, oils, she gets Phytovet CK baths 2-3x a week, and it doesn’t improve unless she’s on Temaril and we obviously don’t want that, but when she’s bleeding and will scratch herself for minutes straight unless you stop her, you have no choice.

Any ideas welcome, especially food related. Thanks all, love the site, been lurkin forever.

[Shasta220]

I’ve not dealt with UTI in dogs (my cat has it though. She was on meds which helped, but ultimately it’s due to the fact that she is an EXTREMELY picky eater, so it’s impossible to get anything healthful into her), so I’m not sure what food to recommend. Cranberries sounds good, but they also make various UT supplements, I wonder if adding one or two of those might help?

[pugmomsandy]

B-naturals supplements are next on my list to try.

[godzilla]

Hi. My dog was diagnosed with crystals in her urine and the vet insist I feed her royal canin urinary food, but how does that food actually help? I asked about supplements and he brushed me off. I have been feeding her 4 and 5 star food and now I feel like I am feeding her bad dog food. I am adding cranberries to her diet also. I just don’t want her to have surgery and yes, I am seriously considering another vet who does not brush me off. Any suggestions?

[Shasta220]

I know pumpkin is a great addition for a dog lacking fiber, but is there a general rule of thumb for how much to add per pound (or 10-20lb, etc) of dog.

Also, I’m very curious about apple cider vinegar. On a FB page, there are several bull-breed owners who add acv, claiming it’s helpful for joints. I’d like to add some to my dogs’ diets, since it’s very cheap (even for raw/organic), and anything to further help my old girl is great.
Is there anyone on here who gives their dog acv? If so, what are all the health benefits?

[JASTECH]

Update: Two more of my kids have passed away, this has sickened me. I have four that I am still trying to keep alive. I have the empty gallon jug of Dyne to remind me and to show others as a Warning. This has upset me and my son as to why they would add PG to a supplement used for weight gain. I will contact the company this week then report back here their responce.

Thanks, JASTECH

[Naturella]

Shasta,

This is amazing that your lab has had such a turnaround! It is so amazing to see and hear success stories of better food, so I am always ecstatic to see my friend who switched to good food.

As for my other friend, I took her to my favorite store today, and they hooked her up with over 15 samples of 4-and-5-star foods for her old rottie who has been on Beneful and Pedigree so far… She was happy, I was beyond excited, and I can’t wait too see which one he likes/does on best, and which one she gets. I think she should incorporate a joint supplement in whatever she feeds anyway. But I think we’re on a good track there! Hoping for a smooth transition and great results. Also, I did recommend to her to start with may a 3- or 3.5-star food first, and then go to a 4- or 5-star one.

Shasta, I would have never guessed you are a teenager! You rock! 🙂

And also, I agree with both Shasta and aquariangt – although some people feed Beneful and the sort because of price, it is true that good foods can be found for much less online or at clearance/sales racks in pet stores/boutiques. But I can understand how uninformed people can suffer from commercials and misinformation, and I also believe that once they are open to at least checking this website out, they will also get hooked. Like with Shasta, that’s what happened to me. I just stumbled upon it googling something, and bam. That was it for me. I just wish people weren’t so headstrong about what they choose to feed and at least entertain the idea of learning something from someone else… My roommate, however, said to me, after I had had Bruno for about 2 months – “You have had a dog for how long, 2 months now? What do YOU know about dogs. I GREW UP around dogs and have had my own for over 3 years now.” Then it was clear to me that he just wouldn’t ever take anything I tell him, and, sadly, even his vet recommends this site, and other foods (NOT the SD), but he would still not listen, or research so meh… It is what it is.

And another dog that I take pride in being put on good food is my own. When Bruno was first found, he had the worst case of fleas the vet had ever seen. His fur was falling out, and he had patches of sores and wounds all over. The couple that found him (the second ones; the initial “founders” did not even give him food or water for 2 days before the other couple visited them and took the puppy from them) did a great job de-fleeing him, having him dewormed, given food and water, and a good safe space to live for a while until found a forever home (that would be us!). They had him on Purina-Something and he looked fine (I wasn’t able to tell he had fur missing before), and only had 2 scabs left from when he had sores. It wasn’t until we got him on Blue Buffalo Wilderness that his fur got really shiny (that’s when I realized it had been dull before!), and he started growing fur on his tummy (I thought it was supposed to be bare, not that it was actually missing fur!). So good food helped my little guy too, and like others, at first I did listen to the pet store associates and even my roommate (the Science Diet guy), but even then, I preferred grain free and higher protein food, I guess by instinct. So once I found this site, I have never looked at dog food again, let alone any grocery store’s pet aisle, lol.

[enny]

Here are the latest results from Consumerlab’s tests for Chondroitin, Glucosamine and MSM for dogs and cats. 1800Petsmeds joint enhancer for small dogs and cats: only 70.5% of listed glucosamine hcl.
Joint Complete for Dogs and Cats (Liquid Solutions): 76% of glucosamine sulfate listed.
Joint Max Triple Strength Soft Chews: 135% of listed MSM.
Liquid Health Naturals K9 Glucosamine: only 16% of listed Chondroitin Sulfate.
Cosequin DS Plus MSM (Nutramax Lab): Approved
Cosequin Joint Health Supplement for Cats: Approved
Hope this helps users of these supplements.

[Shasta220]

I’d agree with the others, check with their website and possibly shoot them an email/phone call. Add extra supplements or other canned foods if it’s a concern, and if Nature’s Logic has different protein sources, then try to switch out the varieties if you can. That’ll help “fill in the gaps.” Also I can never emphasize oral hygeine enough for a dog who has nothing but soft food…dogs on canned (for some reason, especially small dogs) tend to get icky teeth fast.

[pugmomsandy]

There are many foods similar to Nature’s Logic that are “complete and balanced”. I use Hound & Gatos, Wellness Stews, Merrick classic and 96%, and Weruva. Or you can add a multivitamin supplement to her feeds.

[teslarocks]

I have been feeding my dachshund Nature’s Logic canned food (various protein sources) exclusively for past 6 months and she doing well on it. However I just noticed on label that is “intended for intermittent or supplemental feeding only”. Hopefully I have not hurt her. I want to stay on a canned diet only as she has trouble chewing kibble and I don’t want to go raw. Are all canned foods like this or does anyone know what cans I can try that are a “full meal”?

Thanks

[theBCnut]

Taurine is naturally in meat, but freezing and thawing can cause the meat to lose some taurine in the drippings. If she will eat grinds, use whole carcass grinds and make sure to mix the fluid back in before feeding. Hare Today and My Pet Carnivore both have them. I tried the taurine supplement that Hare has, but my cats completely rejected it. Cooked egg is better than no egg, lightly cooked is even better.

[Shasta220]

Sandy, I doubt she’d eat tripe. We don’t have access to it anywhere to see, but if she’s refused all other organs we offered, I doubt she’d eat it.

I’ve not tried giving her feeder animals…I honestly doubt we’d buy live animals for her, I’m far too squeamish. Occasionally when she goes outside and catches a bird/mouse, she’ll eat most of it, but usually not.

I knew about taurine and how important it is…I’d look into buying a supplement of it, but gosh she is so dang picky, I just don’t know if she’d accept it. Where is taurine naturally sourced from? Is it an animal-product?

I’ve thought about commercial raw, but we don’t have access to it here, and I sincerely doubt she’d eat it, as she detects any extra stuff we grind in her meat (egg yolks, supplements, etc.)

Gosh I feel so bad for her though! Her pickiness is keeping her from being the healthiest she can be… -_-

[Dori]

Hi Losul. First, how’s Turbo doing and have you been able to calm down a little? I hope so.

I really appreciate that in the midst of what you’re going through you’ve taken the time to get info for me and pass it along. I came out at the same conclusion that you did but you have no idea how gratified I am that they are your findings also. I’ve been doing a lot of research also on the different HW meds since Turbo was diagnosed and decided that since I have to do something, and living in the South, I will do it all year long long.

I do have another issue that I’m really taxing my brain over. I know a lot of you don’t like the idea of HW med that includes the flea ingredient. But living here in Georgia we have a lot of mosquitos, and fleas. Because we don’t normally get cold freezing weather for enough days in a row (this winter being the exception) nothing, and I do mean nothing, seems to die. I’ve gotten mosquito bites myself in the dead of Winter here. Fleas are pretty much a year round thing. Ticks? Not so much. I need some thoughts on my situation and my girls. Do I go with just the HW med or HW and flea? I’m mostly concerned about Katie getting flea bites with all her allergies she would probably have a pretty bad reaction. Good Lord! I sometimes feel this will never end. I go to sleep thinking of all these issues and wake up with the same thoughts wondering “Did I actually fall asleep?” or has these been some really long nights. Of course, if it’s not only these issues then there’s the food issues (allergy dog to food and environment, scents, you name it she can’t handle it). Then there are the supplements. Katie has started scratching again, no change in food, no fleas or anything on her. I started removing supplements one at a time for a couple of days and it seems she’s not doing well with the Mercola digestive enzymes. The other two are doing fabulous. I didn’t know they could have a reaction to digestive enzymes. I swear this little girl is going to have me pulling out what little hair I have left. Shawna referred to Katie as a delicate flower. I wish those were my kind thoughts of Katie. But she’s so damn cute, sweet, and with all her issues she’s just the happiest “go with the flow” little girl I’ve ever had the pleasure of having in my life. Not to mention it was because of her that I found this site (whilst pulling some hair out, mine, not hers) and my other two girls have been the beneficiaries of this fabulous site and my goto fabulous/wealth of knowledge posters. Thank you again for being so caring not only about your dog but all dogs. Some of you posters are so amazing.

[hpmiro]

I would say it’s ok to feed all 3 dogs the same food, but if some are less active then others than its probably a good idea to keep an eye on them and see if there’s any issues with weight. If so then cut back on the feeding amount. Slow feeders would be a great way to individually feed your dogs and slowing down the feeding has proven to be beneficial anyways

I think supplementing your dogs and any dog isn’t a bad idea. Just like us, our pets could only benefit from an added supplement. There’s lots of great options out there as far as supplementing goes, I would visit a local pet shop or boutique as they tend to know a bit more about their products and I find them very helpful! Organic Pet Superfood by bixbi has a pretty awesome line.

[Jackie B]

There’s a Hypoallergenic dog foods list in the Best Dog Foods section on the main site.

I also sometimes homecook for my dog. I use a book by Rick Woodford, Feed Your Best Friend Better. It is easy and uses common ingredients. There are instructions for if you want to supplement with it or if you want to feed all homemade. Easy.

[Jackie B]

Cats, especially males, need plenty of wet food. As people have already stated. If I was able to have a cat, I would seek out a brand like WildKitty where you can make your own raw at home. I feel like it is the optimum food for cats. That being said, if you want to do kibble and supplement with canned, any can is better than none. But a canned food without red-flag ingredients (same standard as for dogs) would be my pick.

A friend of mine who fosters many cats and kittens says Authority is her budget-friendly but still quality canned food choice.

Also, you can get a pet watering fountain. Cats love them. I have a CatMate brand one for my dog.

[losul]

Hello again Dori.

I wouldn’t EVER want to discourage milk thistle use in totality. I really do believe in it’s potent powers to protect and even help heal the liver. But it’s also because of these potent powers I think awareness/caution is warranted, and especially in regards to possible interactions with other drugs/botanicals, and under certain other circumstances.

I think the last time I looked into this, was well over a year ago. The bookmarks I had on it died with my last computer. It’s hard to get detailed and reliable info from anywhere but the manufacturers, as to actual expected half lives, exactly how the drugs are metabolized, etc. and am having difficulty getting that reliable info again. It’s also hard to get reliable studies on various herbs and supplements,

Going by other resources I think it can be established that ivermectin is primarily metabolized by CYP3A4 in the liver, and as far as I’m concerned, for me, there is enough evidence that milk thistle does inhibit CYP3A4, even though there are few studies as to exactly what extent, dosage rates, potency hard to be determined etc. on milk thistle or almost other botanicals/herb. Most sites I’ve seen, classify milk thistle as a CYP3A4 inhibitor of undefined potency, which would be usually be the case in unregulated and essentially non-standardized supplements. That study referenced in the link i posted the other day, implies relatively high inhibiting potency for milk thistle.

http://www.hcvadvocate.org/hepatitis/hepC/mthistle.html

Not sure exactly how milbemycin, moxidectin, is metabolized, but I would have to assume it’s much the same way as ivermectin, as they are all in the same class of drugs. Apparently ivermectin has a longer longer half life in dogs than i recalled, and milbemycin a little longer than ivermectin. But these, when given in oral dosages, are at least predictable as to their peak plasma concentrations, especially when given without a meal, it’s within hours. Because of the slowed release method of topical moxidectin, peak concentration times for that cannot reliably be determined, I’ve read anywhere between 8 to 21 days after dosage. I would have liked to have incorporated milk thistle into Turbo’s regimen at some point, but as of now, I don’t see how i can confidently do that using moxidectin, and what i don’t know yet about moxidectin. Because all these HWP’s are in the same class of drugs, for now I have to assume they are metablized much in the same way as ivermectin.

If a medication has an expected half life of 24 hours, it doesn’t mean the medication will be cleared in 48 hours. It means that every 24 hours the remaining plasma concentration should be expected to be divided by 2.

I suspect that most advice for milk thistle is for very low dosage, only once a day, and after a reasonably safe time period, at least a day or two after HWP administration? Given in that way, I wouldn’t think there would be significant alterations in elimination time or efficacy, However, I wouldn’t listen to any advice that says to give it before, concurrently with, or immediately after any HWP. Nor any loading up on dosage of it. Additional precautions should be dogs with the defective/suspected defective MDR1 gene, which are already much more susceptible to these drugs crossing the blood/brain barrier, dogs on certain other drugs, or are being given high doses of ivermectin, or the others.

“Dogs with defects in the P-glycoprotein gene (MDR1) can be severely poisoned by ivermectin.”
“Since drugs that inhibit CYP3A4 enzymes often also inhibit P-glycoprotein transport, the risk of increased absorption past the blood-brain barrier exists when ivermectin is administered along with other CYP3A4 inhibitors. These drugs include statins, HIV protease inhibitors, many calcium channel blockers, and glucocorticoids such as dexamethasone, lidocaine, and the benzodiazepines.[21]”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivermectin

Note: I think ivermectin and other like drugs given in the low dosages as given normally for heartworm protection, are usually considered safe for dogs with the defective MDR1 gene, unless other factors come into play.

The only time I would ever consider loading up on milk thistle for a dog is if poisonous mushroom ingestion is strongly suspected or in acute aflatoxin poisoning. In which case, high dosages could save the dogs liver and it’s life.

[Cyndi]

From what I know, you definitely need to get “taurine” in her. I believe that’s what it is that cat’s can suffer a deficiency from. There are quite a few reviews I’ve read on Hare Today, where I get my raw meat for my dog, from people who feed their cats a raw diet. They sell mice, and baby chicks and whole sardines and stuff. You might want to look into that…

Good luck! 🙂

*Edit* & Hare Today does sell a Taurine supplement.

https://www.hare-today.com/product_info.php?cPath=24&products_id=291

• This reply was modified 12 years, 1 month ago by Cyndi.

[Dori]

I, too, use much lower doses than suggested on the different supplements. My girls are all toys, and I feel that they don’t need the dosing recommendations of the jars. I also don’t add them to every meal (they eat twice a day). Depends on what I’m feeding them on any given day. I don’t use a protein booster because they are all on a raw diet and their diets are all pretty high in protein to begin with.

[Mom2Cavs]

Yep, I understand what you mean lol….especially when the dogs don’t eat very much in the first place. Anyway, I always look at feeding guidelines on supplements, but sometimes they sound like too much! So…..I always start out with a very small amount, less than 1/8 tsp. for my little guys, and go from there. I can always tell if a supplement is too much for them if they start having loose stool, or not wanting to eat their food like they usually do, etc.

[crazy4cats]

Hi All-
That Nature’s Logic fortifier looks interesting. It looks like it contains probiotics, digestive enzymes and a protein boost. Seems like it would be easier than adding all separately. How much does it suggest to add? It doesn’t show feeding recommendations on their website. Are you having good results with it? Thanks for any input. Sometimes I feel like I’m feeding more supplements than food. Lol! And I have big dogs.

[Shasta220]

I’m sorry, but I will go through the sob story of Millie. We rescued her as a 5wk kitten. I thought she was old enough to start cat food, but Dad insisted on dropper feeding her for a few days. I have no clue if that had anything to do with it, but she refused cat food when we offered it to her about a week later.

We tried dry, canned, organic, flaked, pouched. She sniffed it and backed up as if it was rotten. We got desperate enough to try “starving” her, offering NOTHING but cat food. She went a week without any food, and still had zero desire for cat food, even after force feeding it to her.

Eventually she got to eating kitchen meat scraps, hot dogs, and cheese (I’m repulsed too, but I simply knew /nothing/ about feline nutrition back then. It’s in the past now and can’t be changed – so please don’t chew me out, I’ve scolded myself enough for letting my parents feed that to her LOL!)…

A couple years ago we took her to the vet for urinary issues. They gave her some meds and she cleared right up, but it’s back now.

Her current diet is *shameful face* raw chicken legs. I wish we could some how get some supplements into her diet, but I’ve tried adding a basic supplemental powder (I added about 1/4 of a day’s worth into some ground meat), and she immediately detected it and refused.

I’m just wondering what the most basic raw diet is out there that I can get away with. I can’t try ANYTHING that’s commercial, as she’s turned her nose up at it ALL, I promise. She likes muscle meat/fat from almost every protein source, and she eats almost the whole leg bone of the chicken, so I’m not at all worried about her calcium. I’ve offered her heart/gizzard/liver, and she refused. Occasionally when I grind her meat, I can sneak about 10% liver/heart into it, but that’s it. I tried adding an egg, but she doesn’t like them (occasionally she’ll eat them cooked).

So, what /will/ she eat? She, obviously, likes her muscle meat/fat/bone, and she likes cheese/milk (no yogurt), peanut butter, and coconut oil.

I’m just wondering if anyone else has a cat as miserably picky as her, and how they manage to get at least SOME of the required nutrients into the diet….because I’m sick and tired of cleaning her messes (I thought her walking into the litterbox and forgetting to turn around was just her personality, but after doing some research, I found that “missing” is a further sign of urinary problems).

Please don’t tell me “just take her to the vet” because we have. They’ve done all they can do – it’s all up to her and what she will/won’t put in her mouth.

Sorry for being so long-winded, and sorry if it was confusing at all…but I’m a bit confused myself. Why can’t she be like the other cats and just eat some balanced canned/dry food? I don’t know -_-

[pugmomsandy]

I use Sprngtime’s Longevity and Fresh Factor. Sometimes I use Only Natural Pet Super Daily Greens. Oh – and I’ve also used Dr Harvey’s supplement. I would probably use some from b-naturals too.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 1 month ago by pugmomsandy.

[Dori]

I like Mercola supplements. I use Mercolas complete Probiotics for Pets and Mercolas Digestive Enzymes. I trust both Dr. Mercola and Dr. Karen Becker. I also supple with Nature’s Logic Sardine Oil two or three times a week. If I give my girls whole canned sardines in water than I don’t add the Sardine Oil. I do supplement with Coconut Oil every day. Coconut oil does not, it is my understanding, interfere with their diets or any other oil. Coconut Oil is more of a antioxidant. Works differently than fish oil. I prefer sardine oil to other oils and my girls do well on these supplements. One of my girls gets glucosamine/chondritoin daily and supplements from Ark Naturals (Grey Muzzle) for heart and cognitive function (that’s my 14 year old girl). Oh, my 14 year old Maltese gets Nzymes antioxidant daily. Hope any of this helps. It’s what I do for my girls. Works for them anyway.

[Mom2Cavs]

I like Springtime, Inc. supplements. They’re whole food. Also Standard Process is good, their Whole Body Support is a good, whole food vitamin/mineral one. Wholistic Pet has some good supplements, too.

[weezerweeks]

Thanks Sandy any suggestions for another whole food supplement besides natures logic that has different things where I can rotate. Thanks

[pugmomsandy]

Do don’t have to supplement every meal since the canned food is complete. Try NL and the joint supp for one meal, prob/enz in the second meal. Fish oil two or three times a week, especially if you’re using a human dose, he’ll get more than enough.

[Mom2Cavs]

What you are giving him sounds like a good plan. The Nature’s Logic fortifier is a whole food supplement and I believe should not be “too much”. I really don’t know if you mean you might overdose him on something or if it’s too rich. But, either way, it should be a healthy supplement to add if he tolerates it. All the rest are fine, too. The doses for all these supplements for such a small dog should be small, as well. If you are worried about changing the taste of his food and him not eating, then you could use something else to help deliver the supplement, like yogurt, cottage cheese, etc…. to put some of the supplements in and give as a treat. As for the joint supplement, you could always get one that is packaged like a treat and give it that way, so it doesn’t have to be mixed into his food. The coconut oil would probably be licked right off your finger as a treat, and if the fish oil is a gel cap you could wrap it in something, like cheese, or use cream cheese and cover it and give as a treat, as well. The probiotics and enzymes shouldn’t change the taste of the food. And as far as him being healthier without all the supplementation….sometimes supplements can cause issues, like allergic ones, or loose stool, etc., so it is a choice you have to make, whether or not to give, and if you do want to give supplements to try to find those that the dog can accept either in his food or as a treat. I should know all this because I have smaller dogs who don’t eat that much food and I do like to give supplements. Lucy, my Mixed Breed, has a rare type of skin cancer (I believe she’s in remission, atm, yay!) and she takes a liquid maitake mushroom supplement in her canned/dry food every morning. I was very worried she might not take it in her food and I’d have to get creative, but she has with no problems…very good, lol. I also give Standard Process supplements, which are powders, and sometimes they will give a little loose stool, so I back off a little. If I feel I’m overloading them with supplements I tend to break it all up between morning and evening or give as a treat during the day. Sometimes I don’t give a supplement every day, but every other. I also evaluate their supplements at times to determine if I still need to give something or if I can stop for awhile. I also like to rotate supplements, too. I will give Wholistic Pet for awhile and them I’ll switch and give Nature’s Farmacy stuff, or Springtime, Inc. I’ve used cream cheese to give pill type supplements to Lucy because she’s picky. The Cavaliers tend to just eat anything I give them lol. These methods have worked with my dogs and I hope some of the suggestion help.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 1 month ago by Mom2Cavs.

[weezerweeks]

I have my little yorkie on canned food. He only gets 1/3cup a day divided by 2 so each meal is not very much. I want to give him the correct supplements but it’s hard because it changes the taste of his food. I give him natures logic fortifier, mercola’s digestive enzyme and probiotic, coconut oil once a week, Nordic natural fish oil every day.I’m also starting him on joint supplement because of his luxating petalla.since he’s only on canned food how would you supplement him each day. The natures logic has so many things in it I’m afraid it’s too much.should I give it every day along with the enzyme and probiotic and what other super food should I use instead of this or to rotate. I am trying so hard but I’m getting so confused because their are soo many supplements. Sometimes it seems he was healthier just eating kibble with no supplements except fish oil.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Sorry Sharon! I just saw this post. The online database is http://www.alacalc.co.uk/ I signed up for the 3 free recipes to test it. So far I’ve been able to add HDMs Whole Food Supplement and her Veggie/Fruit mix as a recipe then as an ingredient to one of her suggested recipes Beef/Turkey. I also recently found data on raw, bone-in items so I could add turkey necks etc (http://dogaware.com/health/kidneytable.html). After that I can download a spreadsheet which gives the calculations of about 50 different nutrients. I’m seriously considering purchasing for 15 recipes. It costs $50 but I will feel so much better about doing my own ‘recipes’ if I can make sure everything is well-balanced. (Will post on this on FB, too)

[weezerweeks]

Patty this is the joint supplement I was asking u about and yes they make it for horses.

[Honeybeesmom1]

Hi Akari, I don’t know why your sweet Bentley coughs. Maybe dry food on his throat?
I give my other 2 dry food w/ a tiny bit of water – but Honeybee only eats canned & dehydrated. He inhales dry food and he just doesn’t do good on it. He coughs when his trachea is acting up or when he gets itchy skin. I didn’t even see the pollen when I had him outside yesterday…or he never would have been out! Keeping him inside is easy…it’s COLD out and he don’t like it. LOL He also gets this way in summer with the grass. Breaks out in hives and skin turns red.
What do you think of Dr. Harvey’s Emune Boost supplement with bee pollen and other good herbs? Maybe that would do Bentley and Honeybee some good.
I rinsed his feet with water and vinegar and no outside for awhile for him. They can keep us on our toes, huh? Lil stinkers!

[Mom2Cavs]

I agree with you, but my old vet didn’t look into things and wanted me to keep my Mix Breed on the Royal Canin SO for life when she had a uti with struvite crystals. Well, it said right on the bag that is was supplemental and not to be used for a long period of time! Let’s just say that anitbiotics killed the uti and the struvites went away. She has been on RC SO since then and that was years ago. Anyway, my vet now, a holistic vet practice, knows quite a bit about canine nutrition. He even does podcasts on onevetmed (or something like that lol). Very knowledgeable. Like I said before, he believes in raw feeding and carries Nature’s Variety, all forms, and Steve’s Real Food in his clinic and that is what he feeds his Goldens.

[crazy4cats]

Hi-
No, I wasn’t worried about it until this thread was started! I just get worried when I hear talk about intestinal damage due to the parasite fiasco we had. Both of the enzymes I have are part of a multi-enzyme supplement. My dogs are doing pretty well right now. So I won’t worry too much. Thanks, BC nut. (But you will always be Party V to me!)

[Shasta220]

I tend to avoid Eukanaba, as it’s not very quality. The suggestions of Victor and other GF foods were good, then adding digestive supplements (like probiotics and fiber from pumpkin). My boy used to go a LOT too. He made 6-10 full-sized piles daily. We moved him to a better quality food without all those junky fillers, and he went down to 2-4 piles daily.

[theBCnut]

No, they don’t all contain it, just the “better ones” do. One of my dogs requires a pretty good dose of digestive enzymes, and I do rotate, but I’ve never noticed any problems with him even if I give him a double dose of enzymes with bromelain. I don’t think I’d feel good about giving him an enzyme supplement that was just bromelain though. As long as it is just part of a multi-enzyme supplement and you aren’t seeing problems, I wouldn’t worry. That said, I do rotate everything, including what enzymes I use. If you are worried, then I would use the one with bromelain every other or every third day. The intestinal lining repairs very quickly once whatever is causing damage is removed unless the damage is severe and you would know it if it was.

[Shawna]

I just posted this to HDM on the regular site but thought you might not see it..

“The doxy makes the worms sterile so resistance shouldn’t be an issue with any worms picked up from the doxy treated dog. One of the benefits of giving doxy is that it makes the dog no longer infective to other dogs.

From heartwormsociety.org “Microfilariae from dogs treated with doxycycline that were ingested by mosquitoes developed into third-stage larvae that appeared to be normal in appearance and motility, but these larvae were not able to develop into adult worms, thus reducing the risk of selecting for resistant sub-populations.” http://www.heartwormsociety.or…

I see advantages to the fast kill as well as slow kill methods. I personally would use the slow kill with SP Canine Cardiac Support and herbs mentioned in Dr. Goldsteins book for heartworm treatment plus. But I understand Losul’s desire to get the worms out as soon as possible too… And Turbo seems to be a good candidate for the fast kill method when doxy and heatguard (or another form) are used first to lessen the risks of immiticide treatment.

I’d give raw eggs to keep glutathione levels up. Cardiac support by giving an organ supplement or giving organic heart. I like Standard Process because it has anti-inflammatory factors that work specific to the organ being used for as well as “food” for the specific organ. Anti-inflamatories like turmeric. I personally would give small amounts of garlic and use probiotics regularly. etc etc etc Chlorella is an excellent detoxer.

Edit — been a HORRIBLY busy at work last few days.. I’ve missed much of what has been discussed :(..”

Another thing to consider is that although nobody wants to get that diagnosis, it is really not as bad as some try to make it. You caught it early. Even before symptoms appeared. He has every chance of doing well no matter which way you go. After re-reading your post I do see where your vet is recommending doxy and heartworm before the immiticide. That makes me feel more comfortable with his recommendation!!! 🙂

Here’s a link that may not provide new info but hopefully will take a little of the scare out of the diagnosis.. This is naturopathic vet Dr. Jeannie Thomason’s site http://www.thewholedog.org/heartworm.html

PS — I found several folks that had dogs with a minor infection like Turbo’s. One said her dog was free of heartworm nine months after starting the slow kill method. Some of the results you are hearing from could be from immune compromised dogs as well. Turbo is way ahead of the pack in that regards. That is also why I would be less freaked about the fast kill method for him!!! You’re a good puppy parent and Turbo has every chance of having no complications because of it.

I’ve always read to use ivermectin when doing slow kill. I’d do more research before choosing slow kill and anything but ivermectin. A quick google search says this about moxidectin “Ivermectin is the medication most commonly used to kill the microfilaria (larval stage.) There are other medications that will kill them (such as milbemycin) but ivermectin kills more slowly. When too many microfilaria die at once, it can cause shock and collapse for the dog. Thus, ivermectin is preferred because of the slower kill rate. Other products like selamectin and moxidectin do not kill the microfilaria efficiently enough to clear them reliably. Fortunately, ivermectin is available in several monthly heartworm preventive medications. Examples are Heartgard ®, Tri-Heart® and others.” http://vetmedicine.about.com/od/diseasesandconditions/a/CW-HeartwormTreatments.htm

Of course, one comment on vetmedicine site is not enough to base something like this on but do research more before deciding. I’ll try to check it out too.

Did you ask him his reasoning for recommending the rabies vacc at this time? Is it that he is not aware of the problems, disagrees that problems could arise, thinks they are overstated or what? Does your state allow exemptions? Why not put it off?

Here’s data from several people that have actually USED the slow kill method and cleared heartworm. And likely these are dogs that are nowhere near as healthy as Turbo however I don’t know that. Just a guess. http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?365271-Slow-Kill-Heartworm-treatment

It’s also the method that most rescue use around here. And again I would try to get Dave’s Hounds input. BUT, when it really comes down to it you will do what you think is best for Turbo and EVERYONE here that is truly your friend will support your decision because we all know that you are the one that has to live with that decision not us… We all will support you no matter what your choice. And as stated before, I think Turbo is a good candidate for the immiticide option as he is young, healthy and has the right person in his corner!!!!!!

• This reply was modified 12 years, 1 month ago by Shawna.

[crazy4cats]

Hi Mommadog-
Have you got rid of the infection? Was it giardia? Mine had a tough go with giardia and now are also sensitive. I am currently using Victor grain free with a digestive supplement and they seem to be doing much better. Good luck.

[hpmiro]

What food are you on now? I would try Firstmate. Its a limited ingredient food that has about double the amount of fiber then your typical dog food. Have you tried supplementing with pumpkin or the like?

• This reply was modified 12 years, 1 month ago by hpmiro.

[losul]

I just discovered Tuesday evening that our dog Turbo has heartworm infection. It came as a huge shock, as i thought I was being meticulous with his care and his diet. Almost as bad, I am probably to blame for it, and I am sickened and upset by this. I was using
Heartguard+ chewables. I was trying to minimize his toxin exposure, so I didn’t give year round, just for the approximately 7 months mosquito season, and every 35 days instead of 30. Also, because Turbo is 34 pounds and I had the box for 26-50lbs, I was only giving him 2/3 of the chew. Lastly I was keeping the HG in the refrigerator, and now I found out that HG isn’t supposed to be refrigerated and they can’t guarantee the efficacy when refrigerated. I just called them and reported the case to them, telling them all the truth about the situation.

I don’t want to write our life story, sorry about the lengthy post, I’m just trying to get all the info out, so I can hopefully get some good advice to help me make the best decisions. Turbo is approximately 32 months old, 34 pounds, a boston terrier mix, we think maybe mixed with staffordshire or pit, but almost certainly mixed with some kind of bully type. We adopted him from our County’s Animal control about 1.5 years ago. He spent somewhere around 1/2 of the first 14 months of his life in 2 different sessions at the County shelter, and evidently 1 session at a City shelter. It was the first dog we have had in about 7 years, after having had many previously, for most of my life. We were out of the loop on most things dog, so I got very studied up on it, wanting to do things as right as possible, before we even started looking for another dog. I knew the type ( boston terrier or mix) I wanted and knew that I would put him on a raw diet before we even got him, and so be it, within 3 or 4 weeks we had him on about a 60% raw, 40% commercial diet, with no problems ever, except some gas for awhile.

Turbo is very handsome, charming, and playful, but can be rude, stubborn, very assertive, sometimes defiant. We love him the way he is, he’s always been a joy, and no real problems at all, except some assertion/agression (not fearful aggression) towards certain dogs, usually only the largest dogs or bully types. He’s completely different (quirks) than any other dog we’ve ever had, but for us, he’s really a perfect fit, and is always well behaved in the house.

We’ve been in search of a great dog Vet since we got Turbo. Tuesday’s visit was the 4th different vet. I had set up an appointment ahead of time for his upcoming rabies shot, and to test the waters with a new (and hopefully permanent) vet. In the meantime Turbo had a really strange and scary issue that happened Saturday evening and lasting into Sunday. An hour or so after he had his Saturday evening meal, and totally not typical, he began “hiding” in a corner of the house, or he would go to either the basement door or the back door. We take him through the basement into the garage when we go in the car. He goes out the back door into our yard. He also started very visibly trembling, looking very sheepish, and scared. He would not take a treat at all, so totally untypical of him. Once outside, he did not want to come back in at all, wanting to lay on a chair on the deck instead, even though it was quite cold and he doesn’t like cold for long. We’d make him come back in only to do the same again. Sitting in the corner at the end of the hall or at the basement door or the back door. He acted like he just wanted to be out of the house and maybe even away from us, seemed afraid of me for no reason, and the trembling hard, very scary. So not typical, Turbo has NEVER been fearful of anything that I know of, but he just did NOT want to be in the house at all. I eventually took him for a short car ride, and he seemed to have perked up some. So we got back into the house just a little bit reluctantly. He then took a treat fairly eagerly, but after taking a second one, he suddenly just dropped it and ran away to the corner again. The trembling and strange behavior again too. We nearly took him to the emergency clinic. It later subsided though, and eventually he went to bed right beside me, where I watched him the rest of the night. He seemed to sleep well. Next day, just a little more of the same scary stuff, and then he ate his typical raw morning meal. Soon after eating he started acting better throughout the day (Sunday). He never vomited nor had diarrhea nor showed any obvious pain through the whole ordeal.

Baffled, I spent most of Sunday researching the trembling symptoms. Nothing seemed really to fit at all, but I was concerned about problems like kidney/liver. I contemplated all sorts of things such as Lyme or tickborne illness ( he had a tick on his ear that I didn’t catch right away, it was November and we had already had several hard freezes. The tick left a pea sized nodule that lasted about two months. Friday evening he chewed on a cow hoove awhile until I took it away from him, because he had broken off a rather large sharp shard. Saturday morning he had his typical raw meal, but his evening meal was not quite as typical. Usually he gets 2/3 cup kibble matched with 1/3 of a can food, or 3/4 cup kibble and an egg, or sardines. This time I gave him less than 1/2 cup kibble + about 4 ounces of canned salmon + 1 egg cooked in coco oil, and i added about 1/2 t of nutritional yeast. i think I’ve added a very small amount of yeast to his raw mix before, but not completely sure. So thoughts of a bad reaction to the yeast also came into play, along with thoughts of too much fat at once. Even the thought of a ghost in the house came up.

Monday morning I called the vets office an\d told them I thought we needed to put the rabies shot on hold, and instead get him checked and do some blood work to get to the bottom of this. Tues evening: I explained everything to the techs and the vet as best I could, even that I home prepped over 1/2 of his diet. He asked me what I was feeding him and I told him him briefly, just didn’t come out and say”raw”, but I think he knew it. He didn’t ask if raw and seemed satisfied with what I was feeding and supplementing. This
vet spent alot of time with us, well over an hour, didn’t admonish for anything, wasn’t arrogant in the least, didn’t “push” anything , and so far I think I like him O.K. He examined Turbo and was pleased with his apparent health. So he didn’t push any lab work at all. I still elected to go with an outside lab wellness blood work, along with an in house tick borne illness and heartworm check.

I was floored when they came back and said he was both pos on the antigen and microfiliae HW tests. He was negative on the tickborne. He explained the clinic’s HW protocol; 1) monthly HW preventative for 2 months prior to treatment, and continuing throughout treatment and beyond. 2)Doxycycline. for 2 weeks prior to treatment.3) first immiticide treatment (injection); dexamethasone injection, tramadol injection. Hospital overnight, strict confinement until returning for next treatment.4) doxycycline again for 2 weeks prior to immiticide treatment. 5) 2nd immiticide treatment. ( 2 injections 24 hours apart), dexamethasone and tramadol injections given daily with each treatment. Hospitalized for 3 days and 2 nights. strict confinement at home 30 days 6) Heartworm check 6 months afdter last immiticide injection to confirm elimination of heartworms.

He also explained the clinic’s preferred HW preventative – Advantage multi – a topical application, (imidacloprid for fleas which Turbo does not have + moxidectin, the HW preventative, which is supposedly absorbed through the skin). I didn’t even realize they had a topical for HW. I told him I would rather not use an insecticide for fleas that he didn’t need. He said alternatives (such as heartguard) could be used but may not be as effective, in his opinion. I then mentioned that I recalled hearing about a “slow kill” method. He seemed a little stunned, and said that that method was actually more dangerous, wasn’t as reliable and it could take much longer if it even worked. I again expressed my concern about all the toxins, especially the arsenic/immiticide.

He didn’t think the trembling episode was HW related at all, although he didn’t offer any real explanation for it. Also he thought it would be fine for him to go ahead and get the rabies vaccination, or I could wait for the outside lab’s bloodwork results in a day or 2. I told him we would definitely wait.
—–

Here’s where I need advice;

Do you think I should get another HW test from another vet along with a second opinion?

Should I consider a slow kill method vs the clinic’s protocol?

Should I use heartguard or another ivermection based HWP vs the advantage multi, moxidectin based? Is their any other moxidectin based without other insecticides included? Is there another one more effective than the others? Are there any other HWP’s using some different drug altogether?

Should I continue to put on hold the rabies vaccination? if I put off more than a few more days, then he will be past due again, will probably only be able to get the 1 yr vs the 3 yr, and would have to be re-vaccinated again in a year.

Does anyone have anyone input about what could cause the trembling episode?

Any other opinions/advice?

———–

Update: The vet called with the bloodwork results. Everything looked “perfectly normal” he especially stressed the liver and kidney values, the blood cell and platelet counts and values, thyroid, and some other things I don’t recall now, I don’t have a copy yet. What a big relief on that much. I had some more questions to ask, such as should he have X-rays, ultrasound, etc. He could, but didn’t think neccesary nor did he advise it. I asked about the microfilariae count, he said a fair amount? Somewhere I had read about the 3 classes of HW infections. I asked what “class” his condition would be, he replied definitely class 1, which I saw described somewhere (going by memory)as asymptomatic to mild, no radiologic signs, nor signs of anemia. He still encouraged going ahead with the rabies vacination, and strongly urged getting started on the advantage multi soon. But he seemed much more amenable now to a slow kill method, maybe along with doxycycline, before I even asked again, even seemed to kind of go along with it, though he still didn’t recomend it, he still recomended their protocol. He also expressed concern that these worms may be resistant to ivermectin, and it could take a very long time to kill them using it. So he again really encouraged using their Advantage multi. I guess this multi is a new thing.

——-

Any advice/opinions would be very much appreciated, as I’m feeling lost and very worried over this. I think my questions still remain the same after getting the blood work results.

[Mom2Cavs]

I use quite a few and rotate off and on, too. Currently, all 3 dogs are getting Nature’s Farmacy Digestive Enhancer morning and evening in their food. It’s a prob/enzyme supplement. I am also giving Standard Process Whole Body Support (a whole food vitamin/mineral) morning and evening. Lucy gets a liquid Maitake Mushroom supplement from Vetri Science in the morning. I believe this addition has put her cancer into remission! Twice a week the girls all get an Omega supplement. Currently, I’m using Vetri Science’s 3/6/9. I occasionally give coconut oil, as well. For the Cavaliers I will be adding in Standard Process Cardio Support 3 times a week. Also, every Monday they all get a urinary chew that has cranberry and vit. c. Whew…I think that’s it lol.

I also love Springtime, Inc. supplements and use Fresh Factors, Joint Health Chews, Bug Off Garlic Chews and rotate them off an on with the other ones I mentioned above.
Some of the other probiotics or enzymes I like and use are Wholistic Pet Digest All Plus and Fresh Digest. I also like Wholistic Pet Salmon Oil, Springtime 3/6/9 and Nordic Naturals for omegas.

[weezerweeks]

My vet and I are trying to decide on the joint supplement for my yorkie,he’s been having a little trouble with his luxating petalla even though it’s only a 1. I showed him the mercola joint supplement that I have and he’s concerned about the Bromelain because it has been know to cause trouble with the digestive lining. Have any of u ever heard of this? I have a super smart and animal loving vet,his 7 dogs go to work with him everyday,2 golden doodles,1 lab,3carin terriers, and one westie.you should see him driving down the highway it is quite funny!

[pugmomsandy]

Fairly regularly I use Springtime Inc. Longevity, Fresh Factors, Bug Off Garlic (or Flea Free Supplement liquid), and I got some free bottles of their Advanced Hip and Joint and Joint Health Chewables at checkout. springtimeinc.com

And a couple times a week, I give Mercola krill oil and ubiquinol, Swanson’s Dr. Langer’s probiotics or Mercola probiotics, Mercola digestive enzymes, Immunel (swanson), and a glandular product (currently Pet G.O.) http://mypetsfriend.com/pet-go.html and ProDen Plaque Off, vit E and C, and Mercola Bladder Support.

When I make dehydrated foods, I like to add in some raw apple cider vinegar.

I’ve just started to add some sprouted seeds to their raw food. 4 Legs of Love from SproutPeople.org. http://sproutpeople.org/just-for-pets/sprouts-for-dogs/