[crazy4cats]

Have you tried feeding freeze dried raw or canned food as mixers? My dogs are lab/retriever mix and will pretty much eat anything. Unfortunately, even socks. 😬

[DogFoodie]

I have a dog that won’t eat any raw, but Answers. He will literally walk away from any other. Maybe dousing it with some of their fish stock or goat milk will entice your pup.

My first thought was the same as C4C, is it cold when you feed it? You could put his portion in a container or plastic bag and submerge it in a hot water bath.

Also, is pork something different for him? Maybe try a different protein.

I wish I could feed mine Answers all the time, but I’m having trouble finding a vendor near me that will carry it consistently. In my opinion, it’s the best commercial raw.

Good luck!

[Maria K]

I tried that last night and he smelled it and walked away. I also tried hand feeding it, trying to make it a reward, and trying to make him work for it. I also gave him a piece of raw chicken breast and he tried it a few times but just kept spitting it out. I put the whole breast out and he just smelled and walked away. The raw mix isn’t expired I checked. I also purchased some of the beef formula so I’m defrosting it now and will see if he likes that any better.

[crazy4cats]

Hi Maria K-
I feed frozen raw mixed in my dogs’ kibble two or three meals per week with no digestive issues. Is the raw food cold when you feed it to him? You could try warming it up a bit in the microwave or even lightly cooking it to see if he’ll eat it. If he then will eat it, you could cook less and less til he’s eating it raw. Good luck!

[S G]

I bought the Pure Vita Turkey kibble and am going to try mixing it with the organic natural planet canned turkey to see if that helps firm up his stool. I also bought slippery elm supplement as it’s the main ingredient in Perfect Form that you recommended too. I really don’t think he has worms, parasites but will take him in and ask the rescue if they can over the bill IF this new diet/supplements don’t work. I’m going to also continue adding pumpkin for a while into his food and probiotics since i still have both but need to eventually simply his diet to exclude supplements, i don’t mind mixing kibble with canned if that’s what he needs to have firm stools. Thank you ALL for recommending HIGH QUALITY fiber foods. It just goes to show not all dogs are the same, where one dog could only tolerate RAW(my shitzu) and this rescue seems to need some kibble. I’m really against most kibbles, as most have LOW QUALITY ingredients and grains/carbs, but there are so many NEW HIGH quality ones on the market nowadays, it may be the way of the future for keeping a rescue dog healthy. I’ll let you all know if this works.

[Susan]

Hi Lisa, with yeasty dogs the dog starts scratching & gets real smelly of yeast only when the dog is sensitive to a certain ingredient in his diet, or he can be allergic to something in the environment as well, so it makes it really hard to pin point what the dog is sensitive too & is making him smell awful & itch.. I always thought the same its the high starchy carbs making my Patch itch & smell then I later learnt its the starchy carbs my dog is sensitive/allergic too that makes him smell & get real itchy… High carb diets aren’t the best & yes try to find a kibble that’s around 40% & under in carbs, a dogs digestive tract is short & made to digest a raw diet…
I feed “Taste Of The Wild” Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb it only has 38% carbs. My boy seems to do really well on the TOTW Lamb kibble..

When my dog eats oats, barley, chicken, corn meal, carrots & probably other grains I don’t no all of them yet, that’s when he starts to smell within 2-3 days of eating the kibble… When he eats a kibble with just rice & fish he does real well, I was surprised, I always try to buy a kibble from a pet shop, so if I need to return it to get my money back its easier then buying online & having to pay for the delivery back to the online store, then while I’m at the Pet Store I can try another kibble….
If you can cook or do a pre-made raw then that’s the healthiest diet to feed, have a look at “Balance It” there’s recipes on their site you fill out the questionnaire, what health problems your dog or cat has, then recipes will come up for your dogs health problem & you add the “Balance It” to balance the diet..
https://secure.balanceit.com/

[Maria K]

My pup and I are trying a commercial raw formula for the first time. I was mixing the Answers Detailed Pork patties (1/2 patty broken up) mixed with 1/2 cup of his kibble (Acana Wild Atlantic). I know they digest differently but was wanting to do somewhat of a transition if possible. He wouldn’t eat any of it. I’m more of a “if you’re hungry, you’ll eat” type of owner so I didn’t give him anything else and repeated the process for 3 meals. Still no eating. This morning I split them up to see if he just wasn’t eating period or if it really was the raw, he scarfed the kibble and left the raw untouched. I did it again tonight and the same reaction. I put some in his favorite toys to freeze overnight and will try that in the morning but was wondering if there were any tips that could help. I have heard great things about rotating raw into their diet and would love for it to be an option for us.

[S G]

I have a new rescue for the last 4 weeks battling diarrhea.
The rescue didn’t give me any of his previous kibble and couldn’t tell me what brand it was anyway, just said it varies because they get donations. My other dog eats a super healthy canned Organic Natural Planet so I was trying to do the same for the new rescue, but it’s giving him diarrhea. I’ve borrowed some kibble (low-quality) from a neighbor to see if weaning him would help but he won’t touch it if i mix in kibble because my other dog is eating the good canned stuff next to him! I tried mixing in brown rice which helped a little bit, then I tried mixing in pumpkin which helped firm it a little more but it’s still pretty soft and has some mucus (no blood and only has 2 sloppy stools a day and he acts completely normal and happy), so i really feel it’s his body trying to transition rather than any health problems. I am also now adding probiotics but no change yet. I think this particular dog needs more fiber, can someone recommend a QUALITY kibble with good source of fiber that I can mix with his canned Organic Natural Planet to see if that will help? I would prefer a poultry to match his canned or lamb kibble but one that has a good source of fiber to help me with firming his stools. I prefer to stay with the highest quality brands, (i had a shitzu who had severe inflammatory bowel disease at the age of 4 and had to feed him RAW diet which extended his life another 8 years!, so i prefer the highest quality canned and kibble as raw was a hassle to feed and don’t want to go there again). Again, higher fiber, quality fiber but still high protein is what i’m looking for in a quality dry food to mix in with Natural Planet. Thanks again for any suggestions. Desperate to get his stools firmer!!!

[Susan]

Hi Lisa, it may be the kibble your dog just doesn’t do well eating a hard processed kibbles some dogs don’t do well eating all kibbles….
Your dog could be suffering from Environment allergies more then food sensitivities, with food sensitives your dog will have sloppy poos, even diarrhea, vomiting, rumbling, gurgling bowel noises, jelly poos, looks like poo & jelly, red paws, itchy smelly ears, red around his mouth from food, anal gland problems rubbing bum on carpet & grass…
Have you tried cooking his meals elimination diet or tried premade raw diets instead of kibble?
Your best to see a Dermatologist so they can work out what your dog is allergic too, is it dust mites, is he allergic to things inside the house or grasses, trees, plants pollens, is it food related ?

Have you tried “California Natural” Lamb Meal & Rice it has just 3 ingredients, no peas, no fish oil, just Lamb Meal , Rice & Sunflower oil, a lot of vet use “California Natural” kibbles
or cook or feed pre made raw diet for has dinner & give the California Natural for breakfast…
When they have allergies the only thing you can really do is bath weekly or the days they’re real itchy bath to wash off the pollens & allergens on their skin, find a food that agrees with them & work out what is causing their allergies..

[Maria K]

Acana Regionals Wild Atlantic is a good kibble. Answers Detailed Pork formula is a good commercial raw option. It comes in patties.

[Maria K]

Acana Regionals Wild Atlantic is a good Potato free dry kibble. Answers Detailed pork formula is a good commercial raw option. It comes in patties.

[Kristin S]

I am trying to put weight in my two year old mutt. She is thin and always has been. I hate HATE seeing her ribs and her spine. She is about 60-65lbs and needs to gain at least 5 lbs and would probably do okay with 10lbs. She’s very active and unfortunately, a very picky eater. I am going to start feeding her all RAW but I’m pregnant and can’t stomach the raw food right now.

Can anyone recommend a high quality kibble for a highly active dog??

Thank you very much!!

[anonymous]

Food allergies are rare. Food sensitivities usually result in GI disturbances such as vomiting and diarrhea. Environmental allergies usually result in pruritus (itching).

Have you tried the search engine here, this subject comes up at least once a week.

Hope this helps:

By Klaus Loft, DVM
Angell Dermatology Service

Anyone who suffers debilitating environmental allergies tied to changing seasons, pet dander or household dust mites knows first-hand the misery of a scratchy throat, itchy eyes or painful rashes.

Not everyone knows, however, that our pets can experience similar allergic reactions — and other very bothersome dermatological issues. But our pets need not suffer in silence. Modern veterinary science has evolved such that advanced, comprehensive treatments are now available to treat a range of skin conditions.

Top pet dermatological issues

Our four-legged friends suffer from some of the same skin issues as we do — and several that we do not. The most common conditions we see at Angell include:

•Parasites, such as mites, fleas and mange (scabies)
•Infectious diseases, such as Staphylococcal pyoderma (“Staph”) skin infections, yeast and fungal infections and skin fold infections
•Systemic diseases, such as autoimmune diseases
•Skin cancer, such as Squamous cell carcinoma, cutaneous lymphoma, Mast cell tumors
•Allergies, such as flea allergy dermatitis, adverse food reactions, environmental allergies, etc.

All of these conditions can become serious and, if untreated, dramatically reduce quality of life. But the tremendous strides made in veterinary innovation, however, is very good news for our pets. Specifically, the testing and treatments for allergies now rivals human healthcare in its sophistication, quality of care and long-term health outcomes.

Unlike humans, dogs and cats cannot tell us about their dermatological health issues. So we as pet owners must look for the signs. The most common indicators that a pet is suffering from some kind of allergy involve frequent episodes of ear infections, red raised or open sores on the skin, constant licking or biting of paws or groin — sometimes causing wounds that will not go away.

Allergies present a particular challenge because there can be hundreds (even thousands) of potential allergens that impact pet health, from foods to pollen from grasses, weeds, trees, dust mites and more. Today’s specialty veterinary hospitals have access to the very latest diagnostic tests to get to the bottom of what’s ailing our pet. Among these tests is the Intra Dermal Test (IDT).

IDT is generally considered the gold standard of testing for identifying allergens that cause pets to suffer from chronic skin and/or ear diseases. IDT involves injections of a series of concentrated allergens into the skin to determine which of them generate allergic reactions in a given animal. The use of fluorescein — a chemical that illuminates the inflammation caused by the injected allergens in order to visualize the strength of individual reactions — is key to accurately diagnosing pet allergies, and is just one of the many ways veterinarians use new technologies to improve care and diagnostics.

The results of IDT (as well as a review of the pet’s medical history) can then inform comprehensive immunotherapy treatments to relieve suffering. Veterinary dermatologists rely on IDT to build customized treatment plans for patients called Allergen Specific Immuno Therapy or “ASIT” for short.

ASIT involves a series of injections specifically created for the allergic animal’s skin. These injections, of diluted allergens, are designed to make a pet less sensitive to their allergens over time. In most cases these injections must be continued for life to reduce symptoms, but they are highly effective. Seventy to 90 percent of pets experience a reduction in symptoms as a result of ASIT treatment. These treatments can be delivered even more easily via droplets under the tongue, perfect for pet owners who are squeamish about giving injections to their pet.

This treatment is very new to the North American field of medicine (both human and veterinary) and underscores just how far innovation in veterinary medicine has come.

When it’s time to see the vet

Many pet owners are understandably concerned about taking their animals to the veterinarian because the cost (to say nothing of the fear some animals experience when going do the doctor) may outweigh any perceived reduction in suffering. To help pet owners know when it’s time to bring Fido to the doctor I’ve compiled my “Top Ten” list of dermatological symptoms that should never be ignored:

•Intense itching of the skin (head shaking, running the face into the carpet, furniture, etc.)
•Biting at the skin that creates red, raw crusting areas of the skin
•Multiple ear infections (head shaking, odor from ears, scratching at the ears with hind legs)
•Paw licking or chewing and frequent infections of the skin in the webbed skin of the paws
•Staining of the fur of the paws and nails on multiple feet
•Reoccurring skin infections in the groin, under the shoulders, perianal areas (on or under the tail)
•Greasy scaling skin and/or fur with odorous skin
•Hair loss, or thinning of the fur
•Dark pigmentation of the skin that is chronically infected
•Sudden depigmentation of skin

Allergies and other dermatological issues can be as frustrating for pet owners and their veterinarians as they can be for pets. I encourage any pet owner whose animal is experiencing any of these symptoms to consult with their veterinarian.

Dermatology – Common Issues

[Susan]

Hi Nicci, can you afford a pre-made raw diet or cook her food?? I have read bad things about the Dynovite, your better off balancing the cooked meal with something else, add about 3 small sardines to one of her meals a day, you need to make sure you keep up her omega 3… Tin Sardines in Spring water are excellent for their skin, joints, brain, heart…

You could buy a bag of the Kirklands & try it & see if she has a reaction just take it back & say she wont eat it if she reacts… don’t forget she could be having environment allergies to grass, trees, plants flowers, it may not be the food….

Baths, weekly baths or bath as soon as she starts scratching real bad, bathing washes off any pollens, allergens on their skin that’s causing them to itch & scratch. Patch is bathed weekly every Thursday in Malaseb medicated shampoo & leave on for a good 5mins the bath lady massages him as long as she can & after his bath he feels so much better…. he eats “Taste Of The Wild” Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb & I feed a cooked meal for dinner…
3
Go on Rodney Habib Face book page & follow him he posted a easy to make balanced raw diet made by Dr Karen Becker, you can cook it as well everything can be bought from supermarket.. he also has so much good info

[Lazaro B]

Thanks everyone for your advice. He has no IBS or IBD. He does lick his paws, but they are not red or raw. He does scratch, but not to an extent. The more I read the comments, the more it seems to make sense that it could be environmental allergies. As of right now, I’m almost done with the transition from WEF GRAIN FREE HEALTHY WEIGHT to FROMM whitefish formula. Malaseb shampoo is something I’ve seen and heard of. I’ll have to check it out. VeRUS is something I’ll check out also. I do want him to have some variety when it comes to his dog food which is why I want him eat at least 2 other types of limited protein sources, like bison and venison or beef. I will also look into California naturals and Wellness.

[Susan]

Hi Lazaro, it very rare for dogs to be allergic to meat/proteins & when they are they will normally suffer with stomach & bowel problems (IBS & IBD) are you sure your dog doesn’t have environment allergies, my boy has both Seasonal allergies, he starts itching, scratching & has red paws when spring starts & he also has food sensitivities, he will have sloppy poo, wind/gas pain & red paws after he eats chicken.. He’s been diagnosed with IBD. When he eats barley, corn, wheat, oats ingredients in vet diets or supermarket kibbles he starts to smell real yeasty & is real itchy but doesn’t have his sloppy poos or wind/gas problems, just become real smelly of yeast….

The only way you can be 100% positive what ingredients he is sensitive too is to do a cooked or raw elimination diet.. Its real easy, if you think he cant eat chicken then cook some chicken breast, cut into small pieces, just bring the chicken to the boil & take off stove & rinse in boiling water & its ready & also boil some sweet potato, you can freeze small meals, enough for 2 weeks..

Do not mix all the kibbles together, Why?? just scoop out of your air tight container the kibble you what to feed & when introducing a new kibble just open both kibbles & add the recommended amount over the 7 day period.. I feed 1 brand kibble for breakfast then for dinner I feed another brand kibble or a cooked meal..

Your best to feed a limited ingredient fish kibble cause the omega 3 is what is needed for the skin, fish kibbles are normally higher in omega 3 fatty acids…

Baths you should be bathing once a week to wash off any pollens & allergen on his skin & paws, I use Malaseb medicated shampoo, it leaves the skin & coat feeling real soft & kills any bacteria on their skin & paws……You can bath daily with the Malaseb medicated shampoo…I walk Patch 3-4 times a day as well & sometimes he’ll come home & start itching, so on his walk a plant or grass has started to irritate his skin & paws, that’s when I have to bath him if he’s uncomfortable with itch, baths make them feel more comfortable when they are itchy,

Fleas, some dogs have Flea allergies they are allergic to the fleas salvia, 1 bite & my boy will scratch for days, so make sure your boy doesn’t have 1-2 fleas that’s causing him to itch, again weekly baths & a flea spot on will help stop any fleas..

Limited ingredient kibbles, “Wellness Simple” Salmon & Potato, “Wellness Complete Health” Grain Free.
http://www.wellnesspetfood.com/dog-wellness.aspx

“California Natural” has kibbles with just 3 ingredients…
http://www.californianaturalpet.com/products

[Susan]

Hi Leslie, yes my rescue boy has IBD diagnosed thru Endoscope & Biopsies.. He has Food Sensitivities & cant have real high fat or high protein over 28% kibbles, like I wrote above it has taken me 3 yrs to work out what he can eat & can’t eat if your feeding turkey with the kibble have you thought of feeding him a raw diet or a cooked diet & stop feeding him kibble. There’s balanced premade raw diets….
You have to read the ingredients in the Science Diet formula & Fat, Protein & Fiber percent & look at all the kibbles you have tried & see where the difference lays, is the protein, fat or fiber too high, look at ingredients what’s the protein in Science Diet? Science Diet usually uses chicken, what ingredients are in the Science Diet usually corn gluten brewers rice, beet pulp etc then look at the ingredients in the other kibbles you have tried, see if there’s an ingredient in all the kibbles he had diarrhea….
also look at what oils & fat that are in the ingredients like fish oil, Salmon oil, my boy can not eat these oils, the American TOTW uses Salmon Oil but the Australian TOTW uses Canola Oil…. the best thing to do is start an elimination diet it takes a while but you will know what he cant eat, also maybe see a vet that specializes in IBS & IBD..
Have you looked at Science Diet Ideal balance?? it has better ingredients the their Science Diet range…

[crazy4cats]

Hi Christina-
I don’t know a lot about feeding raw. But, I was curious about how big your pup is going to get and it’s age?

[Susan]

Hi, please get your Science Diet puppy food that your pup does good on, now read the Fat % the Protein % the Fiber % try & find a kibble with grains not grain free, cause the Science Diet uses crappy grains & there’s good premium kibbles with good grains & sweet potatoes that will be better then the Science Diet your feeding…
With the TOTW did the try “Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb”?? it’s an all life stages kibble & has the least ingredients & the protein is only 25%, fat is 15%, I have a IBD boy & he does really well on the TOTW Sierra Mountain Roasted Lamb, it doesn’t have Garbanzo beans or lentils, Legumes, stay away from kibbles with Chickpeas, Lentils, Legumes…. have a look at “Holistic Select” Puppy/Adult its a grain free or the Holistic Select Anchovy, Sardines & Salmon & Rice or look at “Wellness Simple” range… Look for kibbles with limited ingredients that have brown rice there’s even “California Natural” it has limited ingredients only 3-4 ingredients & no peas, when my boy first stared eating kibbles with peas he got real bad wind…. Cause your pup is use to eating the Science Diet kibble you have to slowly introduce new foods in his diet once he’s doing well on a premium kibble, its taken me 3 yrs for Patch, & now he can eat apple, lean pork, lean beef, broccoli, carrot, egg, tuna. salmon, sweet potatoes, pumkin, raw almonds… I slowly started introducing all these foods once he was doing well on a kibble, TOTW Sierra Mountain, then I would give a couple pieces of peeled apple as a treat for 2 weeks, then 1 spoon pumkin with his kibble, then sweet potato etc… You will get there…
The other day I tried Artemis Turkey & Garbanzo beans, I had originally ordered Artemis Duck & Sweet Potato kibble but Pet place had sold out & gave me Artemis new formula & poor Patch was sick with diarrhea for 2-3 days until he was put on Metronidazole… 🙁 I’ll have to return & say he wont eat it, always check if the kibble is money back guaranteed.

[Christina R]

Hi everyone,
i have a question that i have been deliberating over for a while now and am rather worried about. I don’t feel comfortable feeding my dog a whole bone to eat. I know i won’t get the teeth cleaning benefits if i grind up the bone but i should still get the calcium to phosphorus ratio even if i feed it finely ground up, right? The calcium won’t over or under absorb.

The second question i have is can i mix different raw meats together for my puppy? I have seen several pictures of raw salmon, liver, etc. all mixed together in one bowl. Is this safe to do or do i need to make sure to give only chicken with chicken liver and not say ground pork with chicken liver? I know this is not good for humans but is it different for dogs?

[Jill B]

Hello! I’m so sorry this happened to your pups! I have 2 Lhasa Apsos- one is 14 and the other is 13. I just switched over from Fresh Pet to Merrick. Thy seem to like the Merrick Backcountry canned and the freeze dried raw nuggets mixed with it. I also cook ground beef or chicken to mix with it. I used to feed them Purina One Beyond dry food and they did fine on that too. For my dogs and their food, it’s all about how they appear. I look at their energy level, their coat and skin condition, their poop frequency and appearance of their poop. I know it’s gross, but I look for solid, well-formed logs. If it’s too soft, too watery, or too dark, it’s not right. If they are pooping more than twice a day, that’s too much. It’s good you are a member of this forum. There are a ton of high quality foods out there. You just have to find the ones that work for your dogs. Mine have been on SO many different foods-Innova, call of the wild, solid gold, natural balance, nutrisca, Newmans own…I could go on and on! Good luck to you and your pups!

[anonymous]

No one can diagnose your dog or prescribe treatment over the internet, nor should they try.
If it was my dog I would attempt to collect a urine sample (empty clean prescription pill bottle will do) and head to the vet (asap) to see what is going on. Get a feces sample too.
If you have been feeding raw, anything is possible.
http://skeptvet.com/Blog/?s=homemade
http://skeptvet.com/Blog/category/nutrition/

[Hattie H]

I’ve just begun my self education into better dog nutrition and weight loss and could use some advice. I have a 7 year old female lab that weighs 80lbs. We travel a lot and thus her activity level varies week to week from very little when it’s just her and I at home to highly active when we she’s with her 3 year old Australian Shepard cousin. I determined she’s a 7 on the body condition scale and that her ideal weight is likely around 65lbs -70lbs. Based on Internet searches, talking to people, and using the different formulas I’ve come up with a wide range of recommended daily calorie intake, from 850-1400, to get her to her ideal weight. I’ve been feeding her 1300 cal/day for a couple weeks and was going to drop it closer to 1000 as I haven’t seen any weight loss. When I started this weight loss campaign I also switched her from blue buffalo to a mix of Fromm Gold senior (3 cups/1077kcal) and honest kitchen Keen (.5 cup/235kcal) I was advised to put her on a senior food based on her age and activity level but the senior foods typically have less protein and from my research I’m seeing that a lot of people recommend higher protein. The protein/ fat amounts for these foods are 23/11 and 21/15, respectively.

Aside from needing to shed a few pounds she has no other health problems and recently got blood work done everything came back great. She just turned 7 a week ago and I want to get her in optimal health so she’s with me for a very long time. The plan is to keep researching and learn all I can about dog nutrition and start adding in raw and better foods as I figure out what those are…

So, does anyone have thoughts or advice on the calorie intake, food choices, protein amount?

[Molly S]

Also Cat Food.

I had a bag of Purina, from one PetSmart. It was Pro Plan for dogs. Was totally infested with meal moths and a web across the top of the bag. This was 10 years ago.

I started going to a PetSmart in a nicer part of town. It was newer and cleaner. Everything was fine until 2 months ago I purchased a bag of Purina One dry food for cats. I stored it with 2 other bags of Purina food. It was infested and it infested the 2 other bags I had it stored with.

Purina blames this problem on improper storage and accepts no fault. I think it’s cheap grains that draw these bugs/worms/maggots in, and cheap materials for the bags allow them easy access. You can google this problem online, with Purina products, and there are 100’s and 100’s of issues.

I quit going to PetSmart and I will not buy any Purina products.

I’m ordering from Chewy and buying Evolve. It’s a good food at a decent price. They have no bug or recall issues. And their bags are a great quality.

[Susan]

Hi have a look at Artemis Osopure Turkey & Garbanzo beans or Duck & Garbanzo beans
but it has peas….Have you done a food elimination diet to be 100% that she is sensitive to all these ingredients?? Have you seen a Dermatologist instead of a vet?
I know you wrote you don’t have the time to cook but if you cooked once a fortnight or monthly & freeze the meals in sections…
I buy Lean Pork mince & add parsley, broccoli, carrot, kale & Almond & Flax meal & 1 whisked egg & mix all together & make 1 cup size rissoles & bake in oven then cool then freeze & also boil sweet potato pieces & freeze & take out the day before & put in fridge for the next day…. when I first started I only added pork mince & parsley then I slowly added the other ingredients to see how Patch went…..
Your not going to find a kibble that doesn’t have the all the ingredients she is sensitive too…maybe look at wet tin or the Honest Kitchen meals you just add water or you buy your own meat & add the Honest Kitchen base mixes…. have you tried Raw Diet the pre-made Raw??
Its very rare for a dog to be allergic to most proteins & when they are they will suffer with IBD…..

[mary s]

Wow, well, thank you all for your opinions. First, THK is on Hound Dog Mom’s list as OK for Large breed puppies, and she even mentions in a post, that before she started feeding raw it was what she fed. It sounds like some more current “suggestions” differ from what she was putting out there at the start of this list. Second, regarding research…..I lived my research regarding traditional vet med. I had two littermate brothers with IBD. They weighed 52 and 58 pounds with bloody mucus filled poop, and could have died from the IBD. 3 different vets wanted to scope them, keep them on metranidozole (sorry, I’m sure I spelled that wrong) and steroids indefinitely. The raw diet, supplements, and homeopathic remedies are what saved their lives, and they went to 85 and 75 pounds. and lived to be 12. It might be beneficial for some of you to look up true homeopathics before some of the judgements. However, I am not interested in a debate either. I just came here for some help. Anyway, while disappointed, I am more certain of what I am doing. And thank you to whomever said they were glad he was doing better, because he is…..no blood, perfectly formed poop – without the harsh medications that only suppress the symptoms anyway. I think we may be in the wrong pew, but I wish you all the very best of luck with your dogs 🙂

[HoundMusic]

Can anyone point me in the direction of a good puppy food (or all life stages formula) for a four month old Beagle pup? Looking specifically for something that has moderate levels of calcium and lower levels of phosphorous.

Currently feeding one that is 1.58% calcium & 1.2% phos, and that is TOO HIGH for this pup. Intervertebral disc disease runs RAMPANT in this bloodline, and high phos/protein foods during growth, and afterwards, can be disastrous for this condition. I started him on this current brand a little over a week ago, and immediately noticed a very slight bunny hopping and rear leg “hitching” many of these hounds will develop with high protein feeds that cause super rapid growth spurts (which he just had).

I’ve had good luck growing such pups with raw when doing a higher meat:bone ratio – however, while two days of it did stop the hitching, I was noticing bouts of shivering that only stopped when switched back to dry food. I have absolutely no idea what was going on there – been feeding raw going on 15 yrs (on & off), and never saw anything like it, but I think raw is out of the question, at least for the time being.

Any suggestions welcome. I’ve had him on four different foods in 5-6 weeks and am ready to pull out my hair :/

[anonymous]

“Xanax may have a paradoxical effect in some dogs, and cause excitement or exacerbate aggressive behaviors. Long term treatment carries a risk of physical dependence. Withdrawal symptoms include sensitivity to light, vomiting and shaking. Dogs are kept on Xanax for very short periods of time at the lowest possible dosage, to avoid physical dependency”.

The above is an excerpt, click on link for full article https://www.vetinfo.com/xanax-dogs-anxiety.html

[Sherri S]

My husband and I are mostly vegetarians. He eats more meat than I do. The problem with raw meats is a potential problem with E. Coli or Salmonella that occurs in the slaughtering process. In fast slaughtering machines they try to get animals to run through as it slices them up into thousands of pieces. As many of you may recall, Chipotle had a similar problem. At a slaughterhouse (which I am opposed to doing to animals, anyway, btw), ALL of the creature’s body including intestinal tract is often mixed in together, especially in he fast slaughtering machine type. This is why meats were cooked in the first place. To reduce bacteria in the meal itself especially intestinal tract. When we defecate, thousands of bacterial often leave our bodies (humans and dogs). These same areas where our bowel movements occur are full of bacterial and sometimes viruses. Also, fish uncooked can give you a parasite called neorickettsia helminthoeca which is very poisonous to dogs. A vet can also check the feces for nanophyetus salmincola to check for laid eggs. Our dogs get a very good diet of cooked veggies (uncooked can puncture the intestine or cause a disease such as Hepatitis in humans). This is usually due to some countries using human feces as fertilizer which can transmit Hepatitis to other people. I hope this helps.

[Sirius K]

I have a 2 and a half year old mastiff. He is absolutely lovely and has been more or less in good health his whole life. He isn’t on an 100% raw diet, though a lot of what I give him throughout the day is raw meat/slightly cooked meat/meat-based actually good quality treats (I do heavy research before buying anything lmao)

Anyway, so my dog loves steak. So do I. Steak used to be a birthday treat, but since we moved into a place on our own and it’s just the two of us– anyway, he gets steak a lot now. He’s all about that. Lol. I cut his portion into pieces to give him before I season or cook my portion.

Anyway, at the nearby farmer’s market, I recently bought a calf heart (organic, grass-fed, very nice looking) — I haven’t had full on raw beef heart before and neither has my dog. It was frozen when I purchased it and it’s been frozen up until I tossed it in my fridge to thaw. Seeing as it’s a muscle, I figured he would view it similar to steak.

I cut him a couple pieces today because he seemed interested, but he wouldn’t touch it!
This is the first time he’s turned down (meat) raw food of any type. He’s usually only the type to turn down most fruits and vegetables (that are safe for dogs of course) lol.

Did he just think it smelled weird or something? Raw heart does smell rather strong even to me– so I’m sure it smells a hell of a lot to him. But he really likes his other smelly treats– like the green tripe sticks by Barkworthies. So, do you know what’s up?

I’m about to soak some pieces in apple cider vinegar because I read a few places that it would cut down on the smell. But yeah. I was fully planning on sharing this bounty with him. Haha. I don’t know why he isn’t interested. I’m half worried something is wrong with the beef heart I bought and that’s why he won’t eat it, but everything checks out and it seems really fresh.

He loves chicken hearts and all that good stuff.
Anyway, any ideas?
Thanks. 🙂

• This topic was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by Sirius K.

[Acroyali]

Just a few of my own thoughts:

When I was in the transitional stages, one of my cats choked…on kibble. He was excessively hungry, and I was removing the 24 hour a day buffet in order to get them acclimated to meal times. He was OK, but any living thing can choke on anything. Bones can be scary, and if someone isn’t comfortable feeding bones I never would suggest it dissuades them from feeding a healthier diet than they’re already feeding. Hare Today offers boneless grinds (meat only) as well as boneless chunks of meat. I believe chicken and turkey both come this way, check the product description to be sure.

I’ve used boneless chunks as “reminders” to chew. I never give an excessively hungry dog anything bone-in; bones come after the main meal, which is mostly muscle meats and organs. It works for us, hopefully it can and will work for others.

I have and do brush teeth on a few of my dogs as a precaution. The issue I have is getting more brushed than the stuff we see at first glance. Getting the gumline on the inside part of the back molars with a toothbrush is next to impossible. Your dogs’ teeth may look wonderful when you lift their lip up. But if they yawn or pant and you get a glimpse of gross stuff on the INSIDE of the teeth, chewing is their best bet to get their teeth cleaned up.

I used to be a huge fan of recreational bones until a recent tooth fracture on one of my larger dogs. Now I know why some owners call them “wreck” bones 😉

I have never had the unfortunate experiences described here by some from puncturing or choking to death, and hope I never do. I know of one person who had a boxer choke on an ox tail and the dog died on the way to the vet. I’m SUPER weird about choosing large things for my dogs to chew on for this reason; even if they don’t totally consume the whole thing at once. There’s no doubt in my mind that dogs have suffered and even died from consuming raw bones, but there’s also no doubt in my mind that dogs have suffered and even died from consuming tainted, moldy, spoiled “safe” dry food (covered in salmonella, BTW), or have suffered greatly from eating a poor choice of food *for them* and have had the symptoms suppressed with drugs.

JMO.

[Acroyali]

It could most definitely work. However, I wouldn’t start out feeding all those protein sources at once. Pick one (chicken is usually good) and make sure they do well, then add in another. Go slow. I started out feeding a single protein source for about 2 weeks, then added another, etc, as well as organs. (Keep in mind things like hearts and gizzards are considered muscle meats, not organs; though gizzards are great for teeth on smaller animals that can’t swallow them whole.)

I personally don’t feed pork or fish for various reasons. It all boils down to what you can ethically source, what your animals do well on, and what is affordable. Turkeys are really cheap after the holidays; if you’re in the states, you can get turkeys (even organically raised) for cheap after Thanksgiving. (Our stores have whole duck, too, during the holidays.)

If at all possible, it might help to locate a pro-raw vet (they’re out there, trust me!) who can help if you run into any issues. Our primary vet is 2 hours away, simply because the clinic is very holistic. And as bad as the term “holistic” is thrown around anymore, they truly embody the term in their practice. Best of luck.

[Susan]

Hi Kaleena, what about adding blended veggies like broccoli, apple, carrot, celery, I use to add 1-2 spoons of the blended veggies to 1 cup of raw, I would make up a batch then freeze in ice cube trays & cover with cling wrap…
also tin sardines in spring water or olive oil add about 3 sardines to 1 meal a day, if you go on Rodney Habib face book page he has a balanced raw recipe easy to make made by Dr Karen Becker & Steve Brown…. also are you feeding 2 meals a day??
When I started feeding a raw diet cause my boy ate kibble he was very hungry eating the raw diet & I had to feed 2 meals a day & he still wanted more, so I gave him 1/2 cup kibble so he would settle & sleep at night, I’d hear his stomach grumbling with hunger, I told the Naturopath who’s Maintenance Diet I had him on & she said yes it can take a while for them to get use to not eating carbs, kibble is full of carbs….. Here’s the Maintenance Diet I followed.
http://www.naturalanimalsolutions.com.au/education.php

[marie d]

Hi, im trying to get some advice for taking my boy off kibble and putting him onto raw please. Im so nervous to get it wrong and cause him any harm so would really your help. A little background on him, he is a 9 1/2 year labrador that has been on kibble his whole life. I stupidly thought that as we were getting him the expensive kibble we were feeding him the best. He has been on royal canin gastro for the past 2 years due to him having gastro issues sll his life. The vet came to the conclusion he has an intolerance to fat so needs to be on the low fat diet which has worked for him as we havent had any gastro issues for 2 yr now whilst on this food. Whst he has though is cancer now twice in the past 18 months, both mast cell tumours which led us to start looking into whats in his food. We really want to get him off kibblebas strongly feel that this has contributed to him getting cancer. Ive red so much conflicting info on how to change from dry to raw and am so confused as to what will be best for him. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Sorry for the long post 🙁

[InkedMarie]

Glad I feed ground raw with bones to gnaw on; I can’t imagine watching a dog choke to death. Sorry you had to, Aimee.

[Kaleena R]

So I’ve been researching and have decided i’d like to do raw feeding for my dogs. I have looked into how to do it the most cost effective way for myself and have come up with a proposed “plan”. Would just like opinions and advice to let me know if its sufficient or what I need to add or subtract!

So the plan is 3 days a week feed chicken quarter (bone and meat), 1 day a whole rabbit, 1 day a whole duck,and 2 days of pork(bone and meat). I would also give 1 egg a week and every other week switch duck out for turkey.

Is this sufficient? Enough variety for health?

[Spy Car]

Hey Cannoli,

Homes are filled with a myriad of items that can be considered choking hazards for dogs (and children). People starting raw feeding should monitor their dogs to make sure they get the hang of chewing bone (which is about as natural an instinct as canines could have). Feeding larger sized pieces of bone-in parts (like chicken quarters) that can’t be gulped is always smart, as is supervising a dog new to raw feeding.

But dogs are hard wired to chew. The risks of choking on appropriately sized chicken bones are very low and diminish to near zero as dogs get accustomed to it. Intestinal blockages from items like chicken bones are exceedingly rare. I’d worry a lot more about socks.

The calcium (and its bioavailability) from bone is not in question. Concerns about absorption are misplaced. Getting calcium from bone is what canines were shaped by evolution to do. It is superior to artificial supplementation.

The PMR style of feeding with 10% bone keeps the Calcium Phosphorus ratios at the perfect 1.2:1 levels recommended by the leading authorities as optimal. It is spreading a false fear that rotational feedings with calcium supplements are necessary to maintain mineral balances:it simply isn’t so.

The act of chewing is good for dogs. It is relaxing for them. It builds good dental health (encouraging strong gums and clean teeth) and builds strong neck and jaw muscles, in a fashion that feeding calcium powder does not.

If an owner wishes to brush teeth on top of raw feeding, great! I just know how many conventionally fed dogs I know and they nearly all have tartar-stained yellowing (if not rotten teeth) in marked contrast to raw fed dogs whose teeth stay nice and white (with fresh breath).

When we get phobic or fearful about very natural ways of being it has a cost. This is true both with dogs and with children. One can cut off “play” because someone might get hurt, but that comes at a cost. The risks of feeding soft edible bones to dogs is very (very) low, Cutting them out of the diet due to inflated assessments of the risks has a cost.

The advantages to feeding soft edible bone vastly outweigh the risks. Feeding powdered calcium is sub-optimal.

Bill

• This reply was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by Spy Car.
• This reply was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by Spy Car.
• This reply was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by Spy Car.

[Spy Car]

Removing soft edible bone from the diet (or replacing it with pre-ground bone) removes one of the prime benefits of feeding raw in the first place. It really makes little sense unless there is a good cause for doing so (like an old dog with dental issues).

Chewing soft edible is important for good dental health in addition to providing calcium. It is a reason for embracing raw feeding, not something to figure out how to avoid.

Bill

[Cannoli]

Hi Jessica K,

I understand what your vet was saying. My own doctor told me the same thing when I told him I eat my meat on the very rare side and indulge in sushi once a week.

Now poultry I don’t feed raw to my dog. Poultry scares me…

I source my red meat from reputable, organic, human grade facilities. The same place that has been shipping my steaks to me for years.Never got sick eating very rare meat from them so I feed it to my dog.

[Cannoli]

Hi Spy Car,

I don’t consider raw finely ground vegetables to be unnecessary if fed 10% or less of the dog’s diet.

Veggies provide a plethora of additional vitamins that are not found in a meat base diet.

[Jenn H]

My pup, his mother and a littermate all began suffering from similar skin problems at the beginning of spring. Not to the severity of your dog. It appears to be environmental allergies with them.
For my puppy I would use a product I have for my horse. Eqyss Micro-Tek shampoo. “Soothes on contact”. Then I would spray the really bad areas with Eqyss Micro-Tek Equine Spray. (They do make it for dogs. It’s the same stuff, but more costly.) This stuff is amazing. I’ve used it on myself.
For his ears I use epi-otic from the vet. When I ran out I put the equine spray on a cotton ball. Make sure to dry out the ears when you clean them.
He also gets raw honey from a neighbor 2x/day. That has been the ultimate fix. As long as he gets the honey he doesn’t have any problems. After 1 wk without it he begins to get itchy and hot spots. Same with his brother.
Honey must be raw, wildflower honey that is within 50 miles from home.

Food intolerance could certainly be a factor for your dog. I would try an elimination diet if you think that’s a cause.

Tick borne diseases can go into remission and you may never have another flare up again. I have another dog that has had Ehrlichia and now Lyme. I have a bunch of horses with Lyme also. I haven’t known any of them to present with those symptoms you described.
You really need to make sure the dog has a tick borne illness before giving doxy. It’s a pretty hardcore antibiotic. You certainly don’t want to give it needlessly. It can also cause stomach issues. Maybe your dog isn’t breaking down proteins well. If they do have a tick borne illness then the immune system is already taxed. The slightest allergen can become a big problem. My girl takes a probiotic (2 hrs before or after her antibiotic when on it) to help her immune system and minimize the side effects of doxy as much as possible. Fortiflora has been working great for her. She’s on it indefinitely right now, but I continue probiotics at least 2 wks after antibiotic treatment has stopped.

[tara k]

I live in SE Virginia. We do have Lyme’s here. And, several years ago, they said he had a “tick disease” but that it was not Lyme’s. Maybe I should have him rechecked for that? I also tried another allergy medicine a few months ago but it did not seem to help. It was crazy expensive. Not sure if it’s the one you are suggesting, but I am calling the vet now to make an appointment.
I have not tried feeding raw but am considering that now. I was looking for possibly a freeze dried option that won’t break the bank! he’s 70-75 pounds.

[anonymous]

Please consider making an appointment with a board-certified veterinary dermatologist, asap. Environmental allergies have nothing to do with the food. If you care to disclose the state/location you are in, I will do a search regarding a dermatologist. Allergies don’t go away and they get worse with age. The good news is that the condition does respond to treatment, but, it is lifelong treatment as there is no cure.

per the search engine here /forums/search/allergies/

PS: I had to change my user name to anonymous 101, formally anonymously….in case that concerns some of the regulars here.

Hope this helps:

By Klaus Loft, DVM
Angell Dermatology Service

Anyone who suffers debilitating environmental allergies tied to changing seasons, pet dander or household dust mites knows first-hand the misery of a scratchy throat, itchy eyes or painful rashes.

Not everyone knows, however, that our pets can experience similar allergic reactions — and other very bothersome dermatological issues. But our pets need not suffer in silence. Modern veterinary science has evolved such that advanced, comprehensive treatments are now available to treat a range of skin conditions.

Top pet dermatological issues

Our four-legged friends suffer from some of the same skin issues as we do — and several that we do not. The most common conditions we see at Angell include:

•Parasites, such as mites, fleas and mange (scabies)
•Infectious diseases, such as Staphylococcal pyoderma (“Staph”) skin infections, yeast and fungal infections and skin fold infections
•Systemic diseases, such as autoimmune diseases
•Skin cancer, such as Squamous cell carcinoma, cutaneous lymphoma, Mast cell tumors
•Allergies, such as flea allergy dermatitis, adverse food reactions, environmental allergies, etc.

All of these conditions can become serious and, if untreated, dramatically reduce quality of life. But the tremendous strides made in veterinary innovation, however, is very good news for our pets. Specifically, the testing and treatments for allergies now rivals human healthcare in its sophistication, quality of care and long-term health outcomes.

Unlike humans, dogs and cats cannot tell us about their dermatological health issues. So we as pet owners must look for the signs. The most common indicators that a pet is suffering from some kind of allergy involve frequent episodes of ear infections, red raised or open sores on the skin, constant licking or biting of paws or groin — sometimes causing wounds that will not go away.

Allergies present a particular challenge because there can be hundreds (even thousands) of potential allergens that impact pet health, from foods to pollen from grasses, weeds, trees, dust mites and more. Today’s specialty veterinary hospitals have access to the very latest diagnostic tests to get to the bottom of what’s ailing our pet. Among these tests is the Intra Dermal Test (IDT).

IDT is generally considered the gold standard of testing for identifying allergens that cause pets to suffer from chronic skin and/or ear diseases. IDT involves injections of a series of concentrated allergens into the skin to determine which of them generate allergic reactions in a given animal. The use of fluorescein — a chemical that illuminates the inflammation caused by the injected allergens in order to visualize the strength of individual reactions — is key to accurately diagnosing pet allergies, and is just one of the many ways veterinarians use new technologies to improve care and diagnostics.

The results of IDT (as well as a review of the pet’s medical history) can then inform comprehensive immunotherapy treatments to relieve suffering. Veterinary dermatologists rely on IDT to build customized treatment plans for patients called Allergen Specific Immuno Therapy or “ASIT” for short.

ASIT involves a series of injections specifically created for the allergic animal’s skin. These injections, of diluted allergens, are designed to make a pet less sensitive to their allergens over time. In most cases these injections must be continued for life to reduce symptoms, but they are highly effective. Seventy to 90 percent of pets experience a reduction in symptoms as a result of ASIT treatment. These treatments can be delivered even more easily via droplets under the tongue, perfect for pet owners who are squeamish about giving injections to their pet.

This treatment is very new to the North American field of medicine (both human and veterinary) and underscores just how far innovation in veterinary medicine has come.

When it’s time to see the vet

Many pet owners are understandably concerned about taking their animals to the veterinarian because the cost (to say nothing of the fear some animals experience when going do the doctor) may outweigh any perceived reduction in suffering. To help pet owners know when it’s time to bring Fido to the doctor I’ve compiled my “Top Ten” list of dermatological symptoms that should never be ignored:

•Intense itching of the skin (head shaking, running the face into the carpet, furniture, etc.)
•Biting at the skin that creates red, raw crusting areas of the skin
•Multiple ear infections (head shaking, odor from ears, scratching at the ears with hind legs)
•Paw licking or chewing and frequent infections of the skin in the webbed skin of the paws
•Staining of the fur of the paws and nails on multiple feet
•Reoccurring skin infections in the groin, under the shoulders, perianal areas (on or under the tail)
•Greasy scaling skin and/or fur with odorous skin
•Hair loss, or thinning of the fur
•Dark pigmentation of the skin that is chronically infected
•Sudden depigmentation of skin

Allergies and other dermatological issues can be as frustrating for pet owners and their veterinarians as they can be for pets. I encourage any pet owner whose animal is experiencing any of these symptoms to consult with their veterinarian.

[Freddy w]

Also you may want to try a raw diet
Like chicken and raw hamburger

[Patty M]

Any opinion on this food from Merrick? Not sure if it is new. I see the other Backcountry versions have 5 star ratings.

I’ve had my dog, Georgia, a mixed breed lab for about 10 months now. She is 1 1/2 years old. She’s always had really soft poop and was being fed Diamond Naturals Grain Free. So I recently started trying new foods. She seems to like this food and is doing well so far.

[Spy Car]

As I mentioned in the other thread, both you and your dogs are likely to be a lot better off following a Prey Model diet as opposed to using recipes by Dr Pitcairn that undermine the advantages of a raw diet by including unnecessary (and counterproductive) grains and vegetables and excluding highly positive soft edible bones.

Feeding whole foods in the right ratios will eliminate the need for supplementation, and optimize health. Also easier on you.

Dr Pitcairn’s approach is outmoded and not widely followed or esteemed in the raw feeding community. It is too much like trying to emulate commercial food at home, instead of feeding a natural whole food diet.

As to bones, I don’t personally feed turkey legs, but some people do. I do feed turkey necks. All chicken bones (raw) are good.

Oily-fish is good, but limit to twice a week feedings (not daily) as most of the most-beneficial fish species have a substance that can block Vitamin B12. This substance, called Thaminaise, passes quickly. It is not a big deal unless you feed a lot of fish on a daily basis.

What are health cuts for dogs are cuts that include plenty of fat. Lean cuts, like inexpensive trimmed beef heart and be supplemented with animal fat. Dogs need to transition to fat burning, so better to being with lean meals and work up slowly. And you need organs.

Once growth plateaus you are better feeding once a day (post wind down from the day’s activities). When not fed grains/carbohydrates (as it ideal, and a prime reason to do a raw diet) dogs turn to the superior (for them) fat metabolism. When fat burning dogs have nearly unlimited stores of energy, so don’t need multiple meals throughout the day. Better if durning their active time they run and play on empty stomachs (especially in large breeds that have risks of GVD aka bloat/torsion).

I’d ditch Dr Pitcairn, which is what I’d suspect you’ll hear from virtually all the raw feeders you encounter. It is both a hassle and a diet with highly questionable downsides.

Bill

[crazy4cats]

Hi Justin-
I agree with Anon. I wouldn’t add any supplements to the kibble unless your dog develops a condition that warrants them. I do think adding fresh or canned foods along with some water is a great idea. Just remember to feed less kibble to make up for the added calories.

I feed my dogs mostly Whole Earth Farms and Nutrisource kibble and add either canned food, tripe, egg, sardines or commercial raw to it. Good luck to you!

[InkedMarie]

Dogs have no need for grains and raw food with grains makes no sense. You need to join a raw food community to find out how to feed your large breed puppy. Don’t count on stretching your dollar. If your budget is thst tight, a smaller puppy may have been smart but you already have the dog so now I time to find other raw feeders with large breeds

[Molly F]

I realized I should have posted this as a new topic, not buried at the end of another topic!
So, sorry if it’s a repeat for some:
Hey all!
Brand new to the site and to raw feeding!
I am probably going to be working off Dr. Pitcairn’s recipes, and I had a question about supplements. I’d prefer whole food ingredients, so I’m probably going to use eggshell for calcium. I’m wondering if eggs themselves could provide enough vitamin A? I’m thinking of doing an egg based meal in the morning and meat and grain in the evening, using whole sardines for the omegas.
I’m going to check with some local meat producers to get the healthiest meat available and will probably add bones at some point. I read that turkey leg bones aren’t really safe (feel free to add your experience) but what about raw chicken legs?
My puppy is a 7 1/2 mo old German Shepherd from fairly beefy stock (dad was 110lbs, mom was 80!!!), so of course I’ve gotten myself all scared about proper calcium ratios. If I give her whole sardines, those bones shouldn’t throw off the ratios too much, right?
I know many people recommend a more “primal” style diet, but I’m on a tight budget these days and the grain component will Really help stretch my dollar!

[Spy Car]

Courtney, I’d advocate you really consider PMR.

Feeding soft edible bone (like chicken bones) really isn’t scary. An 80/10/10 model of diverse sources will keep the nutrition on track.

One place where I’d diverge from the advice of some raw feeding websites is on the issue of delaying organs. I think this is a very bad idea on two fronts. One, the nutrients from organs are vital (especially in growing puppies). Two, delay increases the odds of a dog developing an aversion to organs. I’ve read of people delaying organs (and advocating the practice) and then saying they need to virtually force-feed them later (as organs are not optional).

My advice if you choose PMR is to introduce organs as soon as you have stable stools. Organs can lossen stools, so it is a good idea to start adding them in in wee amounts and build up to PMR percentages over time.

Relax about chicken bones. Do monitor the dogs as they start to make sure they are not gulpers (bigger pieces help ensure chewing). There are hard bones that are best avoided to prevent tooth damage, but chicken is easy.

There is no value in adding carbohydrates to the meals. Dogs process fat much more efficiently as their primary energy source, with sustained energy and peak aerobic capacity vs the quick peaks and valleys of carbohydrates that cut stamina and aerobic capacity.

Bill