Okay!
And the other things I might want to add would be fiber and vitamins? What about fruit?
(Sorry, just wanting to clarify) 😀
Would one 4 or 5 mg pill be enough for a 50 lb dog? I think I saw the pills they have on Puritan’s Pride (where we order from ALL THE TIME!) they were either 5 or 6 mg. I definitely want to get on raw feeding and she absolutely loves raw food and has no stomach issues with it but I have to get this skin rash sorted out and all healed up before I can think about anything else. It appears as if the NV instinct LID Turkey is going to work out…she’s already stopped scratching. I had noticed every day on the Earthborn that her itching was coming back more. I’ll have to return the unused portion of that.
Right now I have Mercola astaxanthin for people – 4 mg capsule. I give it when I feed them raw because they don’t even notice it’s in there!! Stick a raw meat ball in their mouth and down the hatch without even blinking. I’ve got a homemade baggie thawing out right now.
For all the meat proteins they boast, why do they say the food is 52.5% carbs dry matter with protein and fat making up 55%? That is what gets me. That doesn’t make sense. The numbers don’t add up. And they didn’t reply to Dr Mike’s questions so it is not reviewed.
i made this thread to put the awarness out there of a good food for many different issues that dogs have.. thats all. whether the food is or isnt a type of dehyrdrated raw – ive done alot of research myself and others have and the company says it not on any packaging but when i spoke to them-.
so whether theyre wrong, so be it. and i will appoligize if thats the case.
I would completly agree with everyone else on beneful and purina, whiskas, iams and those companies who advertise how amazing they are and they arent. i know there are lawsuits out there against beneful because there dogs get so sick.. i would never feed my dog nor recommend a food sold in grocery stores. or any food with corn, by products, gluten and so forth,
it sickens me as well that companys are able to get away with things, and how companys lie proctor and gamble who have no business owning pet foods, can buy natura pets .. as we have all seen the massive recalls recently. Even most vet foods arent that good either however sometimes i understand a dog needs to be on it. my dog was on medi-cal hepatic for a long time for her liver and it didnt help… when i learned about canine caviar special needs for the first time a while ago i put her on it and her liver enzymes have gone down now.. so ALL i wanted to do was spread the word that i have clients and myself on this food and its doing fantastic things for many different dog problems, or just allow them to have normal bowel movements as the food isnt filled with alot of stuff.
this thread was not intended to be a back and forth argument. there is alot of stuff i know a lot of people disagree with the things dr. mike does say, or how he gives out his stars. its not just me, im just voicing i disagree with him on some things. some things i do agree with other i do not. why should foods with 5 stars be allowed to be a 5 star food if it constantly has recalls? i base my food on ingrediants, and also recalls are taken into consideration.
i just want people to know that CC is a good food and does good things ! i could easily of started a thread of another food, but right now i know many people who arent aware of this food because in canada its newer and hasnt been around that long here, i know its been around since for about 15-17 years or so in the United States.
thats all i wanted to do.
Does anyone have information about Balance Diet? It is uncooked/not heated etc. It is supposed to be “better than raw”. Anyone ever/does use it? Thoughts? I’m getting a golden retriever puppy soon and because organic raw ingredients (besides B&E chicken necks) are expensive and hard to find in my rural area I thought this would be a good alternative. Any feedback would be *very* much appreciated regarding Balance Diet (not to be confused with Natural Balance kibble, ick). Thank you, Linda
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This topic was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by
LindaW. Reason: added clarification
You sure buy into advertising easily. Saying something provides the benefits of raw is merely adverting – dehydrated foods are heated to a high enough temperature that they are no longer raw. Yes they are less processed than kibble – but they are by no means “raw.” THK even explains this on their website. Raw foods come in the refrigerator or freezer. End of story. I don’t see what this has to do with Canine Caviar anyways?? Canine Caviar is a processed, cooked kibble containing meat meals which are doubly processed.
they are LIKE – not are raw. and some companies do infact say they are dehydrated raw.
right on Canisources website “Unlike other dehydrated foods, there is no need to hydrate CaniSource. This gives the benefits of a raw diet with the convenience of a kibble!”
Smack pet food “We make the world’s best raw dehydrated food for dogs and cats” OH and right off of DFA’s website he has 5 stars given to this company – /dog-food-reviews/smack-dog-food/
i can keep going on if your still 99.9% sure and want to claim raw is raw.. not dehydrated.. again thats your opinion.
I hate to break it to you but I’m 99.9% positive that none of those companies claim to be raw.
no one is saying that raw is exactly a raw kibble, there is so many dehydrated raw companies out there. canisource, k9 choice, honest kitchen, these are all types of good dehydrated raws. i would always recommend going with real raw , but not some people dont always have the time, nor funds, or want to deal with raw itself.
when your not just feeding your animals and working in the industry its different. everyone will always have their own opinions.
Raw is raw,not cooked nor dehydrated.
i will still beg to differ. ive done my research, and i completly dissagree with a lot of the things this Dog food advisor says about his grading.. he has under 5 stars foods: EVO, innova, canidae… those foods arent that great. this man has his opinions and other people have theirs and thats why there are forums available.
canine caviar offers GRAIN FREE options of there foods. its flash cooked for 6 sections at 180 degrees. the maker of the food is on record saying this all . so i will beg to differ
REGARDLESS IF YOU FEEL ITS NOT RAW – ITS STILL A FANTASTIC FOOD !!!!!!! IT HELPS DOGS AND I WOULD GIVE IT 5/5 AND I WOULD ALSO GIVE EVO, INNOVA, CANIDAE AND MANNNNNY OTHER CRAPPY FOODS THAT ARE RATED 5 STARTS A MUCH LOWER RATING.
rating those types of dog foods makes me laugh, most people that walk into my store would NEVER go onto that food because they are SMART enough to know that theyre crap .. theres no way they can compare to a 5 star food like acana or orijen but theyre rated the same…. its bullsh!t
Actually, you’re very incorrect. 🙂
1) Raw diets are high in moisture – one of the main reasons they’re more species-appropriate.
2) Species-appropriate raw diets do not contain starches and grains.
3) Species-appropriate diets are high in protein (>40%)
4) Raw diets contain living foods with intact enzymes – cooked kibbles do not.
5) Canine Caviar contains meat meals, if you think they’re dehydrated. Meat meals are cooked at EXTREMELY high temperatures the RECOOKED in the kibble – about as processed as you can get.
6) There also is not a whole lot of animal-based protein in this with the chickpeas being so high on the ingredients list (which is why this food is not rated 5 stars). Raw diets contain predominantly animal-based protein (>90%) – I would guesstimate this food at ~70% animal-based protein, at the most.
actually yes the food is similar to a raw diet.
the food is flash cooked for 6 sections and its dehydrated so there is more protein in there. ive done my research with this company and its like a dehydrated raw diet. there are many other dehydrated raw diets out there in kibble form with lower protein levels.
Tripe is usually only lightly rinsed so your dog is getting a good amount of greens(depending on what the cow ate last), probiotics, and digestive enzymes as well as protein and fat. It’s the other things you might want to add.
Also, if you are feeding a meal that you know is high in calcium and phosphorus, but pretty well balanced, you can add tripe to lower the overall amounts, but not throw off the balance.
Tripe is loaded with probiotics and enzymes so I wouldn’t add those. You can add veggies and vitamins to balance the meal though. Or if you’re not feeding it as the sole diet and your dog’s other meals are balanced you could certainly feed it for a few meals a week on its own without throwing anything off – tripe is a pretty well rounded food.
Thanks! pugmomsandy, so, I shouldn’t add anything to the green tripe? Or I shouldn’t add any other protein source? I’m pretty sure I should add veggies and fiber/probiotics/enzymes/vitamins, no?
Hi mah4angel!
I don’t really follow any “recipes”, I kind of make it up as I go along. I’m still in the “adding new things” phase. I posted what I was feeding, at the time, a few weeks ago, in the other thread just to get HDM’s opinion on if I was doing ok. What I was feeding then, has since changed a bit because I’ve added a few more things to Bailey’s diet.
Right now, I mix up ground beef, beef organ grind & ground green tripe and I give her about 1/2lb of that in the morning along with either a cage free egg or a pouch of sardines (I do one or the other every other day) & Dr. Harvey’s Multi Vitamin Mineral & Herbal Dog Supplement , and a half of a one a day vitamin, some coconut oil and a spoonful of yogurt. I just started giving her ground whole prey rabbit, so I’ve been doing that every other morning instead of the beef, organ, tripe grind.
For dinner she gets either a half of a turkey neck or a chicken back & a chicken foot and either chicken or turkey livers, chicken gizzards and chicken hearts. I usually rotate the livers and gizzards and heart and do 2 of the 3 every day. I also fast her Sunday evenings.
I get all my grinds and the heart and livers from Hare Today. I still have yet to find a really cheap place to get things, but I’m not spending all that much. I have a local butcher that I get my turkey necks and chicken gizzards from.
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This reply was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by
Cyndi.
Thank you very much. Based on the standard of less than 3.5g/1000kcal of calcium, I have added Darwin’s beef raw frozen food to my Rottweiler puppy’s diet. She’s also eating Primal’s Duck (1.22% Ca DMB), lamb (1.28 % Ca DMB), and Venison (1% Ca DMB). I’ve looked at several other varieties from different brand of raw frozen but haven’t found anything else with an acceptable calcium level. Any other suggested brands/varieties?
When I get it at a store it was about 3 or 4 bucks a lb retail markup. When I buy with my co-op it’s at a bulk discount rate 1.60-1.95 per lb. I’ll have to see if it saved me anything this time around with splitting the delivery fee with the group to Texas. I bought 3 cases.
5lb rolls (40lb case): Retail Price 500lb 1500lb
Green Tripe (GT5) $1.85/lb ($9.25/roll) $1.70/lb $1.60/lb
Tripe/Trachea (TT5)$2.00/lb ($10.00/roll) $1.80/lb $1.70/lb
Xkaliber (XT5) $2.15/lb ($10.75/roll) $1.95/lb $1.85/lb
*Green Tripe Puppy (PT5)$2.35/lb ($11.75/roll) $2.15/lb $2.05/lb
2lb rolls (40lb case):
Green Tripe (GT2) $2.00/lb ($4.00/roll) $1.80/lb $1.70/lb
Tripe/Trachea (TT2) $2.15/lb ($4.30/roll) $1.95/lb $1.85/lb
Xkaliber (XT2) $2.30/lb ($4.60/roll) $2.10/lb $1.95/lb
Tripe/Organ Meat (TOMB)$2.00/lb ($4.00/roll) $1.80/lb $1.80/lb
I wouldn’t necessarily add anything to the xkaliber. Tripe on it’s own is perfectly balanced with a calcium to phosporus ratio of 1:1. The xkaliber has additional bone which probably balances out the addition of organs in this particular blend. You would have to contact the company to get the exact numbers on the calcium and phosphorus in the the xkaliber since there is only a nutritional info link on the “tripe” product only. It seems to be a compete food in of itself. When I make a batch of food I make sure to add certain amounts of meat/organs/bone to be balanced and I’ll add some tripe. But when I feed tripe, it’s by itself. Is that confusing? I can’t seem to get into words what I mean to say!! Also you might want to introduce tripe slowly as it is high in fat – 95% fat to protein ratio!
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/the-stink-on-tripe/
This article mentions Mary Voss who is greentripe.com:
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/11_7/features/Raw-Green-Tripe_16043-1.html
Uhm…nothing in kibble form is similar to a raw diet – especially not a kibble like CC with only around 30% protein. It’s decent as far as kibbles go (although a little heavy on plant protein), but no comparison to a raw diet.
Hi dnaolson –
I feed my dogs a raw diet and they get raw meaty bones daily – these are great for dental health. My dogs are aged 11 months to 8 years and none of them (even my senior) have smelly breath or build-up. I try to brush their teeth daily – I forget sometimes, but they generally get their teeth brushed at least 5 times per week. Aside from specially formulated prescription kibbles (like T/D) the only food that’s going to promote dental health is a raw diet with raw meaty bones. There are some dental chews available but I have yet to see any with quality ingredients. And regardless of what your dog eats you need to be brushing its teeth, all dogs should have their teeth brushed at least 3 times per week. Hope that helps.
I’ve been feeding raw for a few years so I have a good feel for balancing – I know what foods contain which nutrients, how much bone to feed, how much organ meat, which types of fats to add, etc. I started off using recipe books, but for the most part I now formulate my own menus. A lot of it is just variety. Each meal doesn’t have to be balanced but if you feed a variety of healthy and species-appropriate foods the nutrients should balance over time. Just like with people – each meal we eat isn’t completely balanced but we eat a variety of foods. I actually have several of my menus posted under the “Recommended Raw Food Menus” topic on the raw thread if you want to check them out. Towards the end I actually have a couple that I ran a full nutrient analysis on – just for kicks – and they conform to the AAFCO nutrient profile for all life stages.
Not this thread, the other one about starting off with raw feeding ^_^
Thanks you guys!!
You should post some of your recipes, Cyndi! I read through this thread and your story with Bailey is awesome! I’ve been incorporating little bits of raw into my Louie’s diet already and HIS POOPS ARE SO GREAT RIGHT NOW! 😀 I think the addition of the flax seed and the yogurt has really helped his tummy (enzymes and fiber), but I really think the raw has been helping. Maybe I’m just crazy (I am crazy but, still… hehe) 😀
HDH, I wanted to get the EXKALIBER grind from greentripe.com, how would I use that in a well-balanced diet (since you mentioned boneless meat and not only is the EXKALIBER not boneless, it also has organ meat as well)? In general, it looks to be a good idea to sometimes incorporate bone-in grinds, and sometimes use boneless meat. I also wanted to be feeding RBM’s (I’ve already started with pork necks) for dental health 😀
That’s awesome. 🙂 I’ll have to look into wholesalers around my area.
How do you make sure with raw that you’re giving a puppy everything they need in a balanced way?
That would be my main concern were I to go full raw with him.
How much is the green tripe and the XKALIBER? It says to call for pricing, but it’d be much easier to just ask here and then head off to work and check back later lol.
mah4angel, I know exactly how you feel. I have only been feeding my dog raw for a little over a month and a half, but I researched and read everything I could for a few months before I finally pulled the trigger and did it. I don’t feed my Bailey nearly as complex as what HDM and other feed, but my dog IS 100% completely on raw now and doing great. I feel silly now for being so nervous about starting, but I agree I did get REALLY overwhelmed and almost decided not to get into raw feeding. But, luckily you, like I did, found this site and any questions you have someone can answer them. If it wasn’t for HDM and others on here, I don’t think I’d still be feeding raw to my dog. I had so many questions and everyone so graciously answered them. It DOES get easier, trust me! If I can do it, anyone can! Good Luck! 🙂
I agree with Patty. Also wanted to note – Tripett is a canned product. Even if there were parasites in the tripe, they aren’t going to be alive after processing. Same goes for freezing. Freezing food for at least two weeks kills most parasites. My dogs have eaten raw for years – including green tripe (lots of it!) and whole prey animals in which they consume the stomach and intestines. My dogs get fecal checks about every 4 months and none have ever tested positive for anything since I’ve been feeding raw (I don’t use any chemical intestinal parasite preventatives either).
It’s really not that bad once you get used to it – it can be intimidating at first though. Sandy had a good suggestion with gradually incorporating a little raw until you get more comfortable. Also keep in mind my recipes are bit more complex because I choose to balance the nutrients without the addition of synthetic vitamins and minerals – you certainly could simplify a recipe with a multi-vitamin. i.e.) 1 lb. boneless meat + 1/4 lb. cooked veggies + 1 multi-vitamin + 800 mg. calcium + fish oil – using this general recipe you could provide variety by rotating between different protein sources (turkey, beef, chicken, etc.) and adding “extras” such as yogurt or eggs on occasion.
Hi EHubbam –
Glad he’s enjoying his food with the canned!
Raw can be done cheaply or it can be done very expensively. I’ve gotten VERY savvy at cutting costs over the years and am now feeding all three of my hounds for ~$350 per month (not too shabby when you consider I’m going through around 200 lbs. of meat a month + fruits/veggies and other extras like eggs and kefir + supplements). Homemade is MUCH cheaper – I get all my meat from a wholesale supplier that supplies local restaurants and grocery stores (truck come right to my house, I order ~300 lbs. per shipment) and I order my supplements from Swanson’s (low cost human supplements).
Day 3 on mixing in some canned food and he is LOVING it. 🙂 I’ve never seen the boy eat so voraciously!
We’re doing NV Instinct Rabbit Kibble right now, going to get a bag of the LID Turkey when he runs out of this. Then I’ve got a few different varieties of canned that I just add a decent size tablespoon of to his kibble and mix it in. Right now I’m just using NV Instinct cans until I get Cal/Phos numbers back from Hound and Gatos. At which point, we may try mixing in some of those as well. I’m rotating the canned recipes every meal to keep him interested (So far, so good!).
(Side note: Apparently in Sept 2013 H&G’s is releasing a line of grain-free kibbles, so I’m interested to see what those will be about!)
I talked to a friend about going partial raw/full raw and she said it’s not quite as expensive as I’d think, so we’re looking into that as well.
Thanks again for your help! I don’t think I would be near as confident with our food choices had I not found this thread and all the great help you have given!
Mine don’t last that long.
mah4angel,
If you want to incorporate some raw into the diet you can use up to 20% of raw food to your current regime without worrying about unbalancing the diet. An easy way to add raw is to feed green tripe. It is a perfect food by itself as well. greentripe.com for raw tripe and Tripett for canned tripe. Actually, Merrick and Solid Gold have a canned tripe as well. I also like to use freeze dried raw too and my dogs are small so it doesn’t cost alot and it is convenient.
You can get greentripe.com products easily since you are in Cali. I get the green tripe, xkaliber, tripe stuffed cow hooves and trachea from them.
Based on what I’ve seen of Hare Today, it’s totally great! BUT I live all the way over here in California, and the shipping costs will equal the price of all of the food in my cart no matter what I do 🙁
Does anyone have any suggestions as far as retailers for me that are similar to Hare Today, but closer to me?
These meals look so complex and scary to me! I’m trying to do some shopping but it’s very overwhelming.
It looks really fatty in the packaging, but I wasn’t sure if that was excessive or normal.
What proteins are lower in fat? Also, do you ladies recommend Hare Today for buying the raw? What are their shipping costs like?
I just wanted to start a thread to tell everyone about Canine Caviar 🙂
Its very similar to a raw diet but in kibble form. There is many options to choose from aswell.
Grain free has 3 options – venison, duck, herring (all are single protein, no potatoe)
Lamb and pearl millet
Chicken and pearl millet
Special Needs
Puppy grain free
The special needs diet can replace almost all Science diets from a-z from the vets office. Personally i have my girl who has a liver disease on it and is doing better then ever.
Its great food for diabetics, sensitive stomachs, dogs who throw up alot, colitis, ibs, kidney problems, pancreas problems, and more.
the food has a proper alkaline level and pH level as well. i have seen this food do fantastic things for dogs (i work with clients directly helping choose dog foods and nutritional based questions).
For any dog with allergies this food i great because there is no grain, no potato, and no chicken in 3 of its options.
For dogs with sensitive stomachs, colitis, ibs, any tummy problems, the entire line has pre and probiotics in the food too, as well as peppermint to help calm the stomach. Check the food out for yourself and put your dog on it and you will see amazing results.. !!
The food i would Suggest eliminates Chicken, Potato and ANY grain altogether.. its called Canine Caviar. it has venison, duck, or herring available for the grain free diets. its very similar to a raw diet but in kibble form (dehydrated raw pretty much).
this food has prebiotics and probiotics in the food so its Fantastic for allergy prone dogs, it also has Kelp which is good for fighting off any pollutants as well.
I would HIGHLY recommend this food since you would not have to add any supplements to the food at all. look the food up, its extremely limited in the ingredients and you will understand what each ingredient is which is always a benefit.
this food will help with dogs who throw up a lot, i work in a global pet foods in Ontario and ive seen this food do fantastic things for dogs with the exact same symptoms. i hope this helps.
The food i would Suggest eliminates Chicken, Potato and ANY grain altogether.. its called Canine Caviar. it has venison, duck, or herring available for the grain free diets. its very similar to a raw diet but in kibble form (dehydrated raw pretty much).
this food has prebiotics and probiotics in the food so its Fantastic for allergy prone dogs, it also has Kelp which is good for fighting off any pollutants as well.
I would HIGHLY recommend this food since you would not have to add any supplements to the food at all. look the food up, its extremely limited in the ingredients and you will understand what each ingredient is which is always a benefit.
Canine Caviar is perfect for a dog with Colitis. Its formulated with Pro and Prebiotics in the kibble and the foods is also flash cooked for 6 sections making it extremely comparable to a Raw diet (which ultimately is always the best in my opinion).
With Colitis you want limited ingredients as well, as to not bugger up the system. You could do the Duck, Venison or Herring formula which is all grain free as well, and the entire line of food has Peppermint in the food which is perfect for colitis and IBS systems in dogs.
its an American company and has been around for over 15 years now. because its so closely similar to a raw diet but in kibble form this would be ideal for a dog with Colitis.
Of course switching foods isnt always the first choice, however with Canine caviar there is absolutely no need for a transition which is very nice as well..
I’m pretty sure my marrow bones are several months old.
I clip the bag closed after I open it and have had stuff be fine for well over a month. BTW, dogs don’t mind freezer burn like people do. My dogs get all my freezer burned meat, for that matter, they get other peoples freezer burned meat too.
The yeast starvation diet is how I started feeding raw. It really worked amazingly well for my dogs.
How long do the raw marrow bones stay fresh in the freezer once the bag has been opened? I’m going to feed Mila’s first raw bone tomorrow! 🙂
LOL well now that you bring up Rabbit, The Rabbit I get from Hare Today looked like chicken. It was the same color as chicken but it was tougher. Well I ordered the Vital Essentials from a local Company and when I got there to pick it up the patties were bright red and I thought to myself that it did not look right but I took it home and tried it with my dogs the next day after I thawed a patty over night and it was a Big no go with my dogs….none of them wanted to touch it. I took it back and told them what had happened and they said it was more red because the company adds in extra blood for more nutrients and I thought to myself well looks like some color was added too. I wasn’t impressed with it but the place where I took it back said it was one of the best Raw patties on the market.
Well I went to a different store but same chain store and the guy working there told me that Natures Variety Instinct was the best on the market but it has veggies added so its for sure a no go in this house. A lot of different advice out there.
2 months, 1 week ago
