If this food is helping, then certainly stick with it. If not, then possibly try an elimination diet….not always are allergy tests accurate. Try to do a super simple home made diet, or stay with the food (making sure she has no more allergic reactions), then add chicken for a week or two. Then try rice, or potatoes, or any other suspect allergen food. It’s time consuming, but well worth it.
Most of the time, for allergy prone dogs, home made and raw diets do the best anyway. It’d also be better since you could know exactly what goes in her bowl, no more looking at the ingredient list!
About the treats, I am disappointed with natural balance treats since they add molasses (sugar)…. Try some home made treats (keeping em simple….fruits, veggies, meat, and coconut flour or something if necessary. Bake in the oven for about an hour until nice n dried)
Gizmo, my 7-year-old papillon, gets rawhide and bully sticks. He likes both, but prefers bully sticks.
If you’re going to give rawhide, just stay away from anything made in China or any other country with subpar or inferior standards.
Personally, I go out of my way to ensure whatever I buy Gizmo is made in the United States. If not here, the a country that has similar standards like Canada, the U.K., Holland, Australia, New Zealand, etc… .
I can’t wait! But in the mean time, check out catinfo.org. There are a few charts of canned food on this site. On this site, dry is not recommended, only canned, dehydrated, raw or homemade. Fish is high in iodine which can lead to hyperthyroidism if fed in excess. You can easily read ingredient labels to avoid fish in wet food.
Everyone, you have been so extremely helpful!!! Thanks so much! 🙂
I have been looking at the Furminator Nail Grinder – but when you say you use a dremel, do you mean like a real (hardware?) tool?
Also, I also think it may be hurting Bruno when the clippers close down – something with the pressure of it I think. And although we never did draw blood on him, we did get the quick once – I was going very slowly, he yelped, I stopped, no blood. I cut that nail higher with no problems, but I think that may have traumatized him.
Carlyn, I think this is a cool idea – Bruno loves digging anyway, and we may even try that board-and-sandpaper thing, but do you think it will hurt his paws at all though? He;s a vigorous digger!
I usually still file his nails with a human nail file for real nails even after he has them clipped/ground, because they are still scratchy. It takes a while, but he lets me do that better. So I can try the nail file for acrylic nails too, that may work better! I may get that first, then the sandpaper board, then either the Furminator grinder or a dremel if that is what we need. And if all else fails, well, I will just take him to the Petsmart people – he hasn’t had a problem with them, I just wanted to see if doing it myself would be a better investment.
Hi Jakes mom:
Then you will really appreciate the download if you, like me, are not looking to dive into a full or partial raw diet. Commercial raws are expensive for both cats and dogs. My hypothyroid kitty likes NV medallions, but won’t eat it regularily. The cost of feeding all five cats commercial raw is something I could not afford.
I would rather prepare my own raw diet rather than use a commercial if I were to feed it anyway. I have been researching them and I need to gain more knowledge about the needed protein/fat/vitamin levels for dogs and cats to be sure I don’t over or under supplement and cause health problems. It is going to take much more time for me to research a raw diet to do it right and time is limited for me right now.
Bobby dog, Jake likes beef liver. I have not found beef heart yet but he’s eaten everything else so I’m hopeful.
I thought the usda site was very helpful. I was surprised that they mentioned raw food, would have expected it to be food that people usually eat, but I searched “calories raw chicken” and it came up. It’s the usda nutritional database if you look for it. You can search a category like poultry or type in a specific like chicken.
No time to check the ABC thing yet. We have 3 techs out on sick leave right now so I’m working a lot of extra hours. Sounds interesting,tho. Just what I need as I really don’t think I’ll go completely raw. Can’t afford the complete raw like Darwin’s and don’t want to get involved in buying supplements and trying to concoct a healthy combo. Will count on good quality dog food to supply the specifics and add in some raw. Certainly a bit of heart or liver is a better treat than most of those things in the store!
I agree with Carlyn (Shasta220). And I actually think the NutriDent ingredients are not THAT bad, I know what more of the ingredients mean than those in Milkbone for example. Before I knew all I do now, we bought Bruno a bag of the Nylabone equivalent of Greenies, NutriDent for puppies, and aside from making his stool green, they didn’t cause him any discomfort, but I doubt they cleaned his teeth at all. Once I learned about bully sticks and other dehydrated natural chews and raw meaty bones, I would not get him any of those commercial “dental” treats ever again. 🙂
I still genuinely think that Greenies do way more harm than good. If you want fresh breath, google “DIY greenies”. There is a great recipe for a natural breath-killing recipe (uses herbs, chlorophyll, and activated charcoal…..texture is more like a biscuit tho).
It’s said on here that giving a Greenie is like giving your kid a candybar. I suppose I wouldn’t be opposed to it once in a blue moon, as every kid gets a candybar once in a while. BUT, if there are healthier options that are just as satisfying then I’d rather go with them.
Zuke’s do have much better ingredients, yes, and they are a tad spendier, yes. I use them maybe once every few months. Any dental chew does ZERO good for my lab who is missing a top molar, since she only chews on one side.
Brushing is still the best way. If you want a tooth-cleaning treat, give them a chunk of raw bone-in meat (I give frozen chicken, actually. Works better than dental chews IMO. Doesn’t leave that nasty gunky residue on the teeth, either!)
Also, I honestly couldn’t possibly care any less about a seal of acceptance. No matter what fancy labels/tests/seals go on, my gut instincts and my dogs will be the judges of what works and what doesn’t work…
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This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by
Shasta220.
Hi C4c:
Haven’t been on here all day. I was outside working then wouldn’t you know it the electricity went out for two hours just as it was turning dark. When it came back on there was no water in the barn. I am not a handyman by any means. After checking all the circuit breakers and having no luck I finally had an ah ha moment, reset the breakers in the barn, duh!
I have just been shopping at Wal-Mart, but it looks like I might have to check the grocery store for beef hearts. The Wal-Mart I shop at has a variety of fowl but I haven’t been able to find beef hearts the two times I looked. I will ask someone next time I am there to make sure they don’t have something in the back that maybe they don’t normally put on display.
I really have no recommendations for you as far as which meat; you can’t go by my brats! lol The chicken gizzards and hearts didn’t go over well in my house. I lightly boiled them, Bobby woofed them down, the cats still turned their noses up at them, sigh. Akari and Jakes mom seem to be having better luck introducing chicken to their crew than I have been! And it looks like Jake likes beef heart as well. I am going to try beef heart next. Who knows, Bobby and the cats may not like the meat raw so I may have to lightly cook it. We shall see, I will make adjustments as necessary.
I have not done a complete ABC day yet. The last item I need to introduce Bobby to is a heart or I guess liver. When I do introduce him to it I was just going to follow the 20% rule of thumb and just feed the usual amount of kibble. As soon as I find a heart meat (or some kind of meat) that Bobby likes then I will do a complete ABC day.
It looks like Jakes mom found the website that we needed so I think we will have all bases covered.
Jakes mom:
Good idea checking out that website. I will check it out tomorrow! Thanks 😉
Thanks, I will definitely check that site.
I looked on the USDA nutrition site today. They have a big list of all kinds of food. I looked up chicken and got a list of everything from KFC chicken to raw chicken liver (bingo!). Tells you everything you’d want to know from calories (kcals) to protein, carbs, etc. For example 100grams (about 3.5oz) of chick liver is 119 calories. So now we can figure how much to decrease our kibble depending on what else doggy is getting that day. I just checked on chicken today, maybe look up pork or beef when I get a chance. Also per 100 grams:
hearts 153 cal
ground chick 143 cal
giblets 127 cal
gizzards 94 cal
God called your name so gently
That only you could hear.
No one heard the footsteps
Of the Angel drawing near.
Softly from the shadows
There came a gentle call.
You closed your eyes and went to sleep.
You quietly left us all
Hi Jakes mom:
It’s an awsome download you can find on Steve Brown’s website. I do want to purchase his book, but as you read above I probably will never go completely raw for various reasons. I downloaded his PDF a while ago and it explains very easily how to enhance any kibble (from Ol’ Roy to 5 stars) with vitamins through whole foods you can buy from the grocery store. I highly recommend it for $2.95, it is more than worth it! Here’s the link:
http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html
Hi katj813 –
It’s great that you’re adding wet food to your dog’s dry food. Wet food is actually much healthier than dry food – especially if you go with a good quality product. The reasons for this is that wet food more closely resembles a dog’s natural diet – high in moisture, higher in protein and less processed. Providing high quality (unprocessed) protein is especially important for seniors (such as your boy) because as dogs age they become less efficient at breaking down dietary protein yet their body’s need for the amino acids that protein requires doesn’t diminish.
Some reasonably priced and highly rated canned options you may want to consider are 4Health (sold at Tractor Supply), Kirkland Cuts in Gravy (sold at Costco), Pure Balance (sold at Walmart), Natural Life (sold at Walmart and some grocery stores), Whole Earth Farms (sold at Petco, specialty retailers and many online retailers) and By Nature 95% Meat (sold at specialty retailers and online retailers). All of these options are, to the best of my knowledge, around the same price or cheaper than Nutro’s canned food.
Some other options would be using a dehydrated food as a topper. Dehydrated foods, when re-hydrated, are similar in consistency to canned food and when re-hydrated tend to be cheaper on a cup per cup basis.
You could also consider adding healthy human food toppers such as leftover lean meats, tinned sardines or salmon (great source of omega 3’s), cage free eggs (raw or cooked – also a great source of omega 3’s), plan yogurt (probiotics) or kefit (probiotics). Just be sure that if you use unbalanced extras like these that they account for less than a quarter of the meal or else you could risk throwing off the nutritional balance of his food.
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This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by
Hound Dog Mom.
I have tried a few samples of it, and really want to try the venison and/or rabbit kinds! 🙂 Bruno loves the freeze-dried raw bites, and we also give him a sample of the rabbit cat formula as treats – it has awesome protein and one sample spread in over a month as treats won’t hurt him, I don’t think! 😀
It seems like I have heard around here that allergy tests are usually very inaccurate. You can take the same dog in for a test three different times and have each result differ. I’d try an elimination diet for a while, using these suspect foods (usually done by a home made simple diet and adding one suspect allergen at a time to see if a reaction occurs).
It’ll take a while for an elimination diet, but that’s about the only way you can tell for sure.
I don’t know too many foods’ ingredient lists. Seems like Victor uses Sorghoum instead of rice/barley as the carb source. I know a home made/raw diet is tricky to do, but it might be easier if you could possibly grind the meat/supplements and portion out daily meals in the freezer? Then when you take her to the pet sitter, you can just give her a container. This might be a possibility at least until you could find a food that works well 🙂
Also agree with aquariangt, there will probably be no easily accessible kibble that avoids all those ingredients (assuming that she really /does/ react to them all), so canned may be a better option since it’s much easier to avoid problem ingredients.
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This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by Shasta220.
You’re welcome C4c!!! 🙂
I hope more people check it out. I understand tight/limited budgets and have to follow one myself. There are many books on my list to read, but buying textbooks, living expenses, my family, and providing care for my zoo are more of a priority right now. But, a download for $2.95, can’t beat it!
The download is so helpful since I cannot go raw at this time (cost and no space in the freezer) not sure if I ever will go completely raw, but I definately want to feed Bobby as well as I can. The download certainly helped me do that. I think anyone will agree $2.95 for the information inside is more than worth it. The best part is the whole foods are really things you can buy at any grocery store, nothing exotic, you can make it really affordable by looking for sales, it is explained well, and is easy to follow. You don’t even have to make a whole meal of it, you can add extras to each meal through the week. It’s one of the best buys I have made recently!! lol
Hey! I am looking for a little help. I recently had my 4 year old Boston Terrier allergy tested. I just got the results back and am having a very difficult time finding an appropriate food for her so I’m hoping others can help!
Her list of food allergies include
-chicken
-turkey
-peas
-carrots
-eggs
-barley
-tomato
-rice
-soybean
-corn
-white potato
Does anyone here know of any foods that don’t include these ingredients? I am having no luck with any of our local pet stores. It has been suggested I try a raw diet for her but I am hoping to avoid this! I work 12 hour shift work and have to take her to a “sitter” while I work so a dry food would be best.
My vet suggested “Iams Veterinary Diet Skin and Coat Plus KO”. I haven’t heard many positive reviews on Iams or this food so I am unsure.
I have just transitioned her to Nature’s Variety Instinct Lamb Meal. This one is free of all her allergens with the exception of peas. Peas are the third ingredient on the list. I had no idea she was allergic to peas and I had never noticed a reaction to them before. I would really like to keep her on a 4-5 star food.
Thank you in advance for any help!!
Not ready, even close, to going all raw so I want to keep feeding the kibble to make sure all the bases are covered as far as nutrition. Don’t want to get involved in adding all kinds of supplements, etc. I’m thinking of the raw as healthy treats, not meals, at this point. I am in awe of the knowledge on the raw food forum!
Just started with some chicken backs , liver, hearts and gizzards. Cats and dog all seem to be enjoying it altho the first couple of backs had the dog a little puzzled. Next question, how do I balance the raw and kibble? I don’t want to be feeding too many calories. I gave Jake a little less kibble for his evening meal when he’d had a chick back earlier that afternoon.
I am very jealous that hearts and gizzards went over so well at your house and Akari had luck with gizzards too. lol
I guess we do need to figure out the kibble ratio next when feeding our pups something raw. I don’t think you can go wrong with at least cutting back on the kibble the day he gets a raw treat.
Livers are definately on my list next!
Now let’s see what C4c has luck with.
Raw update time….hearts and gizzards very popular at my house! Jake bouncing up and down and cats shrieking! lol! Chicken livers good, too, just bought beef liver to try tomorrow when it thaws. He still has some chicken backs to eat, too. I don’t want to give too much and risk GI issues. And I don’t know how to figure in the raw food calorie-wise. I gave a little less kibble when feeding some raw, don’t want to be adding too many new calories.
C4C, most of my cats like the raw livers, hearts and gizzards. I started to cut them up and one cat took a piece whole and had a good time chewing it. It was also still slightly frozen so that made it take a little longer, too. She really seemed to enjoy it.
John B, at this time I like to feed 60/40 kibble to raw. When I can hunt I will go back to 100% raw. I like to rotate kibble main proteins and Fromm 4-Star gives me a good variety. With raw its the same, rotate with chicken, deer, fish, pork, rabbit and all organic fed. I would use a digital scale to weigh out portions, then adjust as needed.
John B, at this time I like to feed 60/40 kibble to raw. When I can hunt I will go back to 100% raw. I like to rotate kibble main proteins and Fromm 4-Star gives me a good variety. With raw its the same, rotate with chicken, deer, fish, pork and all organic fed. I would use a digital scale to weigh out portions, then adjust as needed.
Since Millie doesn’t really care for dry kibble, look into Grandma Lucy’s Pureformance Chicken and The Honest Kitchen Zeal formulas. There are a very few frozen raw formulas but they are hard to find and tend to be expensive. I’m not a huge fan of Bravo! but hey have a turkey formula that does not have a lot of fat. Primal has Venison and Rabbit that are low for raw but I find these to be expensive. Good luck! Let us know how things work out.
I like to use different products. Right now I’m using Springtime supplements but I have Actiflex 4000 (horse version) and cetyl myristoleate and krill oil to use in rotation. You can give supplements all year that maintain joint health. For increased activity, you can also give the supplements that have an increased amount of anti-inflammatories/herbals that also help relieve pain/discomfort. Since she already eats some raw food, you can let her have a chicken foot or some raw trachea a couple times a week for the cartilage to maintain joint health.
This Actiflex 4000 dosing came from a raw feeding group: 50-75 pounds: 1 ½ tsp. daily loading dose for 5 days, ¾ tsp. daily maintenance dose
Hey C4c:
K3 can be listed several ways, one way is Menadione sodium bisulfate complex. It is one ingredient that is a pet peeve of mine (among others). A few years ago in one of my anatomy classes my Professor discussed K3 and I guess it just stuck in my head. Here’s some good info about it being included in pet food recipes (they explain it better than I ever could). There are many other sites that have info too, but probably the dogfoodproject IMO explains it a little more in depth and keeps it simple.
/choosing-dog-food/menadione-in-dog-food/
http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=menadione
My cats do eat some food with K3 in their rotation; Purina being one of them. If I could get them to eat better quality canned food all the time I would, but they are stubborn and we all know you can end up with terrible health problems if you starve a cat. One of the reasons I researched the food ingredients for my “grocery store list” of pet food. If they are going to be addicted to Purina, the least I can do is find the best recipes out of all of their lines.
I do feel bad about kibble ingredients, but not near as bad when I first found this site. I feel I am making more informed decisions about the quality of kibble I am feeding and now it is only half of Bobby’s diet and the cats are only getting at most 1/8 C /day of kibble. So as Jakes mom wrote, “when you know better, you do better.”
Come on the raw journey with us!! lol At least I have Bobby the garbage disposal when my raw selections don’t go over well with the cats. Me and him will be finishing up the Kefir. lol
Also, on that Little Big Cat site I found an article about probiotics for cats. My kitty is starting to turn his nose up to Kefir. So I am researching what human probiotics I can supplement him with, nice site. 🙂
Bobby dog-
While I thought the article was very informative. It makes me feel bad that I feel any kibble to my cats and it is the majority of what my dogs eat. 🙁 Moving forward, I have been working to improve all their diets over the past year. 🙂 You guys actually have me thinking about trying to add some raw to the cats diet. I do worry about their teeth. There is no way I would be able to catch 4 cats to brush their teeth! So, chicken gizzards, huh? Hmmm, gonna look in to it. I was wondering about the K3 in the cat food. Is that how it is listed in the ingredients? I don’t really know what it is.
Akari-
Yes, you are definitely turning in to a crazy cat lady. You are laughing at the cat taking food off the counter. Non cat people would be mad. I’m so proud of you! 🙂
C4c:
Enjoyed the article, thanks! I also bookmarked the page and added Dr. Dodds book to my reading list; it keeps growing.
Akari:
Sounds like Kitty is getting a taste for some raw!! Yeahhhhhhh :p
Hello, Its the bowel that is rumbling not their tummy, My boy was suffering rumbling of the bowel (Tummy) & vet said it was Colitis & he needed a low fat diet, since Ive had Patch on a low crude fat & low fat diet he has not had rumbling of the tummy (Colitis)… Ive also read that dogs that suffer from Colitis, Pancreatitis & IBD are better off not eating kibble as kibble is harder to digest & some kibbles are high in crude fat & very hard, Ive read that dogs are better off on a Raw diet or cooked Diet, I boil chicken Breast boiled pumkin & 1/2 egg & mash it all up so it all digested.. I buy 1 kilo of chicken breast cook then freeze, I also do the same with the pumkin, I cut up in small pieces boil then freeze, the egg I boil every second day & just take out the chicken pumkin frim freezer the night before, I still give Patch his kibble at night only but its a low residue kibble made by Eukanuba called Intestinal it breaks up easy, but if ur in America they dont sell this vet diet, its called Iams but the ingredients are different not as good as the Eukanuba Intestinal..If you dont want to cook maybe look for a lower crude fat kibble that’s not as hard, I found if the kibble has Potato or sweet potato the kibble will be hard also the grainfree kibble seem to be very hard. Just add some water to a couple of kibbles in a glass & wait 1 minute then see if u can they crush the kibble inbetween 2 spoons. A good kibble should just break up.. I found the Holistic Select adult health kibbles aren’t hard when water is added they soften within 1 minutue then I drain the water this has also helped Patch..
Very interesting article! I kept the window open on my phone so I could read the other ones at the bottom of the page lol
Oh! And I tried some more raw with the kitty today! I found a 1 pound tub of frying chicken gizzards at Publix for $1.79, and I always grab a few when they get them in (someone must order them because they aren’t always on the shelf). Since these were for frying, they were already in little pieces (and smaller). Kind of in quarters. I put a few pieces over his food tonight, and he went straight for them, and loved them! My roommate also said that she has left some chicken out to thaw on the counter, and he had it on the floor playing with it… LOL
Hi Frenchiegirl!
Just wondering how you’re doing with the Natures Variety Raw Bites at this stage? Did you find that your dog put on extra weight from them? One of mine has piled on weight and the other has developed a bout of pancreatitis – the only reason I can find for this is that the raw bites are too fatty?? But the irony is that they both seem to really like them (and one of them is really picky!!) so I am are really upset that they may not be able to eat them any more.
I have two rescue dogs – Millie (8years old, spayed female terrier mix) and Fonzie (3years old, neutered male cock-a-tzu (cocker/shih tzu mix)
I have issues with both, but the main one at present is with Millie who has a bout of mild/moderate pancreatitis. This is the second time she has had it, with a more serious incident two years ago. Her CPL reading is 360, which is way above the reference range of 0-200 ug/l and her Red Blood Cell count, hemoglobin, cholestrol and lipase readings are way up as well.
For the past 6 – 8 weeks I have been feeding them Natures Variety Raw Bites in the honest belief that I was doing the very best for them. They both seemed to like it and have shiny coats etc but the end result with Millie (who is the pickiest eater on the planet!) is pancreatitis and the end result with Fonzie is excessive weight gain – 2kg+ since I began this diet!! I am devastated as Millie was actually enjoying her food for the first time ever (she has always refused dry kibble) but what good is that if she is suffering illness as a result?! To make things worse I was over-feeding them up to a few days ago, which may have caused the pancreatitis to flare up – or maybe the food would have caused it anyway.
I desperately want to feed them a good, nourishing and wholesome food but I am completely frustrated by the choice available and the vastly differing opinions I get in the pet stores. To make matters worse I am leaving them in kennels for 12 days in just under three weeks time when I go to Ireland and I have to have them settled on a suitable food before I go. Please help!
Primal has a great starter kit that has lamb, beef, chicken and duck. There are only four oz of each but it is not expensive and has a variety. I personally like primal because of the quality ingredients and amount of produce seems to be more than other commercial raw.
See if he likes any of the other proteins.
HoundDogMom feeds her hounds completely raw and has found a way to do it economically. Her recipes are in the forum as well. I also make my own raw but have small dogs that would only eat 6 oz per day! I would definitely recommend getting a couple of used freezers so you can buy in bulk and make some homemade. The initial expense would be worth it overall. Are you part of a co-op? Check out eatwild.com. They have a list of some farms/co-ops. Also there is a yahoo group called “carnivorefeed-supplier” that you can join to find local raw food suppliers that sell in bulk. I’ve bought nearly 400 lbs before at one time which lasted me a whole year. Also join your local yahoo BARF group. They will have resources for finding raw dog foods.
Shawna
How much Fiber 35 do you give your dog?
My dog’s BUM is elevated so vet wants to do more testing.
I feed her raw already but want to add the Fiber 35 before she’s tested.
Thanks
Kari
Hello all!
I have followed this forum for some time now but this is my first official post! Yay! Okay, so I am trying to do some research on Joint Supplements and Omega 3 fatty acids to give my 2 year old Golden Retriever (almost 3 on May 25th). We have her on a wonderful diet that consists of Orijen kibble and Merrick canned food for breakfast, a raw meaty marrow bone or a stuffed kong for a snack and a raw Stella & Chewy’s patty for dinner. Her diet does wonders for her health and we learned much about it from this website. As she gets older, I would like to put her on joint supplement. I notice from time to time her joints will pop when she gets up or stretches. We do live in an area that has all 4 seasons and in the winters it gets well below zero. Now that it is springtime we really enjoy taking her out for very long, extensive hikes. She loves to run and swim during our hikes and I would like to have her on some type of anti-inflammatory (omega-3’s?) and a joint supplement. Now I have been doing a ton of research but that just creates a million questions:
First and foremost – Should we give her joint supplements/anti-inflammatories year round? Or do we only give them on days when she will be more active than normal?
Secondly – Which joint/anti-inflammatory would you recommend? I have done research and am seriously considering the Wholistic Pet Organics product line. Has anyone used this and would they recommend it? http://www.thewholisticpet.com/products/canine-product-line/joint-support.html/ Also, does anyone give their pet krill oil vs. salmon oil for omega 3’s?
Thirdly – I am a big fan of holistic medicine and don’t usually like big brand dog medication distributors. Is there anything we can do for her joints, besides swimming and keeping her lean, that will help without any supplement?
And last but not least – if you do recommend a supplement and it’s human grade, what dosage would I give my 65 pound girl?
Thanks so much in advance for your help, I greatly appreciate it!
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This topic was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by
Ysabella J.
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This topic was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by Ysabella J.
Our 3 year old English Mastiff (235 Pounds) has been on a raw diet all his life. We love him dearly and wouldn’t change a thing. I wonder how some of the raw feeders are doing with the expense of raw. We use Darwins, Hare Today, a local provider in NJ called Big Dog (Dehydrated Food) and we’ll buy chicken and some organ meat from our supermarket. Our guy eats 4 to 5 pounds a day, even a 4 pound daily diet is over $10 a day. How do you guys do it?? Do you supplement with canned or kibble, is the diet homemade?? HELP
I am currently feeding my 5 month old Dobie 1/2 kibble(pro plan puppy) and 1/2 raw Abady(puppy formula for large breeds) with a bit of chicken broth thrown in to keep it moist. She recently has started playing then eating and never finishing it totally. Was wondering if anyone had any suggestions?
Hi Mountainhound,
I take a different approach when evaluating a food. I start by looking at the company and evaluate if they have sound nutritional information. I want to know who formulates the food, what their nutritional training is and ask questions about quality control.
When I contacted this company I talked with Scott Freeman who formulates the diets. He holds a degree in marketing. He has no formal nutritional training and this is quite evident when talking to him. He doesn’t understand some very basic nutritional concepts. He is not someone who I’d want formulating a diet.
The diets fall way below AAFCO in some key nutrients (Vit D, E, Zn) and the company gets around this by feed trialing one formulation and then using the family rule to put an AAFCO statement on the foods.
The nutrient analysis on the website are not the analysis of the products. The same levels are reported for nearly every product and every nutrient. Scott said nearly 6 months ago that the website just needed to be updated. Three months ago he told me he had sent all the new info to the webmaster and it would all be posted within days, but the same numbers are still posted.
Some real head scratchers can be found in the NA. The Beef Ca is reported as 2.123% and the phos as 2.95% YIKES! An inverse ratio! Scott said these numbers are incorrect but months later the same numbers are still being reported/ posted as the actual analysis. I asked him if the Beef Ca level was ever actually 2.123 % (which is a calcium level reported in many of the diets) or was it actually higher than the 2.95% Phos. He said he had no idea where the reported 2.123% Calcium number came from.
I asked him about the ash levels in the venison meals and he said it was over 25%
I asked him about quality control. He doesn’t do any testing on any of the ingredients before going into production, he relies on the spec sheets that come with the shipments. Other companies I’ve talked to do their own analysis on incoming ingredients to verify the spec sheets are accurate. He seemed uncertain as to what post production testing was done by the co packers.
I think this company is good at one thing…. marketing which makes sense as that is the only field that this company’s formal education is in.
You can draw you own conclusions but I couldn’t ever recommend this food.
Thank you for the replys. Is there some ratio of raw diet (chicken, deer, etc) to dry kibble? Is kibble the main diet and some raw mixed in? Or is one total meal raw then other meals are kibble. She is 11 weeks old now, and only been on dry kibble. I want to slowly introduce raw meat. We give her fruit (strawberries, apples, bananas with veggies carrots, sweet potatoes,) as treats and training food.
I think feeding a variety of raw is the best we can do. My large breed ate 3 large chicken quarters, raw of course, he’s had entire large rabbit, deer leg, turkey complete or whatever else I come up with for raw meat. He eats Fromm dry kibble w/o any problems. I think the hip and joint issues are mainly on man made breeds, they seem to be more prone to cancers ect too. I think we’ll better support these breeds systems feeding raw. JMHO
I hate it when Bobby finds bunny nests!!! I have put my fair share back in the nest. Bunnies don’t seem to hide their nests too well from him. If I remember correctly bunnies only come by for feedings a couple times a day. The first time Bobby found a nest I thought it was abandoned until I checked it out on the Internet. The bunnies looked okay so I put them back and kept Bobby away until they were gone; that was quite a task.
That is exactly how Bobby acts with a new type of food, not too thrilled but usually eats it. I hope I can get him into the swing of things with trying and liking raw. If I could even find a few things, hopefully with the bone, I would be a happy camper.
Nutro isn’t as good as it use to be years ago. I won’t feed it or recommend it.
Canned food is normally 72% moister, you would do better to use Raw or dry kibble that you have weighed out and then soak with water. It will save you money too.
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This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by
JASTECH.
My dog loves treacheas too but unfortunately she would throw up the cartilage pieces. They looked like little pieces of shaved plastic about an inch and a half long. I don’t give hem to her anymore. These were the dried ones. Would it make a difference if they were raw?
Guysguysguysguys! I found something this cat won’t eat! (Besides raw chicken, but I’ll work him on that lol) Whitefish. Yep! I made up his food yesterday and since it was small cans I had to mix them to get the right amount ( I mix canned and dry together so that he doesn’t get picky on me). He’s never cared about what I mixed together and some of his wellness cans are tuna, but I had a can of Blue Buffalo weight management whatever and it was whitefish. In the morning he ate it, but he was like “what the crap is this?” And then after I got home from work (around 6:30), I was immediately shoved off to my grandparents for dinner and we didn’t get home until like 9 or so, so I couldn’t feed him his 3 meals, and had to give him a big meal before bed.
Usually he just munches all night, but this morning over half of it is still there LOL The BB did have a strong fish smell. I don’t think he liked that to begin with. Fine by me, but don’t waste the food, you brat! You could at least pick at it Lol I woke up entirely too early this morning, and he came up and bothered me and tried to eat my fingers, then decided he’d go back down and eat the food anyways, but I took it up since I want him to actually eat his food today and it’s been sitting out all night.
So there we have it! A food he actually won’t eat. I’m so proud LOL
Akari:
I was thinking what Jakes mom just wrote, that Capstar wasn’t a preventative but I am not positive. Maybe the Cedarcide mentioned on the other thread will work for you.
Jakes mom:
That sounds like an adorable dog! I am sure the changes you have made in his food will help keep Jake around for quite some time to come! 🙂 Bobby is 44 lbs and he is a rescue dog from a Tennessee shelter so I am not sure what he is. I (and many other people) have guessed some kind of Cattle Dog, Blue Heeler (he has the coloring of a Blue Heeler), Border Collie, Terrier mix or not, who knows… Maybe even some sort of hunting dog is in him because he points and he is obsessed with birds. I don’t hunt and have never been around any type of hunting dogs so IDK.
I was asking what size Jake is because I thought I would copy from Jakes dinner menu since it seems to be going well for him. Bobby isn’t a gulper and he doesn’t eat his meals fast so although I will monitor him when I try out chicken backs or other things, it sounds like they would probably eat about the same size in raw selections.
Cats are just terrible sometimes! lol Do you think they would appreciate their meals more if they knew the thought we put into it?
Naturella:
You never know how an animal will react to a med. Just keep an eye out for anything unusual and make a note of it to see if there is a pattern that develops. That is one way to determine if Sentinel does not agree with him.
I am sure you can find a map (I haven’t looked) of flea seasons for the area you live in somewhere on the Internet. Maybe someone will be able to direct you in the right direction for a map on this forum. 🙂
I would also check with my Vet about the flea season in your area. For example, I would not have thought about changing how/what I administered for HW & flea protection without the discussion I had with my Vet. I have horses I am aware of the immunities that are being seen in parasites with worm meds for horses, but I thought I had it covered for Bobby. So I am very glad I had the wellness visit with my Vet to keep up to date on the parasite battles for cats and dogs in my area. After discussing your concerns with your Vet and researching further on the Internet, I am sure you will be able to make an informed decision as to the best preventatives for your precious puppy.
I have to write I have found ticks crawling on me after taking a walk through the woods even after the first few frosts in my area; it’s strange. I still feel uncomfortable administering a med that contains flea prevention year round when he does not need it year round. So I will continue looking into other meds. I may not find anything that fits the bill any better, but at least I will know either way.
I’m using the Royal Canin lowfat GI food – ridiculously low fat only 5%. There’s nothing on the commercial market that even comes close. I switched her to Wellness Core Weight Management to see if she could tolerate a little higher fat and also add in a bit more protein, six weeks later her triglycerides were up and her pancreatic enzyme levels had also gone back up. So, back to the drawing board.
I hate the idea of putting her on canned food because she’s a schnauzer and canned food makes a huge mess on her doggie beard, but I guess that may be a way I need to go.
Thanks all.
Oh – “paltry protein” means “small amounts of protein”. I didn’t like having so many carbs going through my girl in relation to protein.
Hi C4c:
Among other things that is one of the drawbacks of Purina, not only do they add fish to just about all cat food, they also include the bad K3 in just about every recipe they make for cats and dogs. 🙁 I have found a few canned dog foods without K3.
Jakes mom:
Sounds like he had a good day! What size of dog is he? I lightly boiled the gizzards and hearts and Bobby is happily eating them. I froze most of them.
BCn:
I am going to keep an eye out for pork, lamb, goat and beef necks too.
Akari:
Did the cat get fleas from your dogs? Or is this as you wrote a preventative measure?
Thanks for the advice!
I’ve tried giving the raw to him at different temperatures, but it doesn’t seem to make much of a difference. Is cooking it ok if there is bone in it?
I have considered mixing in Triplett (he has it once in a while mixed with his kibble), but I don’t want him to always expect Triplett and the raw mixed together.
I feed him orijen freeze dried medallions for supper a few times a week. Does this have the same benefits as raw?
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This reply was modified 11 years, 11 months ago by
ab1028.
2 months, 1 week ago
