[Wanda F]

Didn’t even realize there were premixes. Thanks so much for the info. The veternarians Brewer has seen don’t know as much about canine nutrition as you guys do; best $19.99 I’ve ever spent. Why is it most vets. recommend/prescribe corn based food, typically Purina? I walked out of one office with a 6 pound bag ($26.99) and the first 3 ingredients
were rice, corn gluten and whole grain corn. Another vet wouldn’t even discuss a raw diet; thought Brewer would choke on the raw bones and get Ecoli or something.
I think the pre-mixes are a good idea; one meal raw, one kibble. What do you know about Nutrisca/Dogswell?I was surprised it wasn’t listed in Editor’s Choice.

[Steven A]

I switched my dogs from RAW diet to Wellness Brand Core Ocean without any problems. They went through 1 12 pound bag and for the most part enjoyed it. I decided to move them to Small Breed Core. I transitioned them from half and half Ocean and Small Breed. After a week they were on 100% Small Bread. That is when the SH*T it the fan literally.
After three days on Core Small Breed they had the runs bad 6 to 7 Bowel movements a day. All over the house. My poor wife was stuck with the situation while I was out of town. I returned the Small Breed today in exchange for a small bag Ocean and one of Wild Game. They ate a meal of the Ocean although my male is not to fond of it( he liked it at first but now is temperamental with it). He will not finish his dinner. I’m thinking of mixing the Wild Game and Ocean to get him a more palatable combination. For now it’s Ocean and wait and see if they get back to normal.

[Shasta220]

I don’t mind separating eggs. I just crack the egg and drop the yolk between the two shell-halves. If you want to do several, I’ve seen a trick to crack the eggs in a bowl, then use an empty water bottle, squeeze it a little bit, then put the end over the yolk. It sucks that yolk right up.

I’ll probably keep with the raw eggs, since it’s so much easier to crack an egg right over the food – but if I ever have a leftover egg white, then I’ll be cooking it a tiny bit.
Thanks all for the help

[pugmomsandy]

You can do homemade raw by using the Premixes like Grandma Lucy’s, The Honest Kitchen, Dr Harvey’s, Urban Wolf, See Spot Live Longer. You add your own meat and oil. If you’re worried about mixing raw and kibble, then you can feed one meal raw and one meal of kibble. Some dogs might have a problem with mixing foods, but not all. You can also get a grinder at least 3/4 horsepower. That should be able to grind chicken bones so you can buy bulk chicken at a lower cost. Find out if you have any restaurant supply stores near you that you can purchase from. You can buy items by the case. But to answer the question of what’s the next best thing to raw, I would say freeze dried raw, air-dried raw, dehydrated raw, cooked freeze dried or cooked dehydrated and canned food, then kibble.

[LexiDog]

Orijen is probably the best kibble out there. Merrick Grain Free is all good and a little less expensive.

Grandma Lucy’s Pureformane line is a great freeze dried line.

My girl inhales her food too. When I give her commercial frozen raw, I only give her 1/3 of her meal at a time spread out as thin as I can get it on a small plate so she has to work for it a little. For kibble, I use a portion pacer ball in her bowl. Basically a big ball in her food so she can’t gulp it down too fast. Dog Games has an interactive feeder bowl shaped like a 3D flower with a bunch of nooks and crannies so she has to eat her food a lot slower. Sometimes I will put 1/2 her meal at a time in her Kong Wobbler toy. She loves it and makes her eat slower.

[Wanda F]

Thanks for your great tips! I’ve checked into Darwin’s and a afew others but as much as I like Brewer, I don’t know if his monthly food bill should exceed the monthly payment on a new Lexus. That being said, I’d still like the best for him and feel I could do raw from my kitchen and fill in with Nutrisca or Orijen( for vitamins, minerals and probiotics) but in some of the “expert research” I’ve found they say feeding both is not beneficial. Something about time in digestion being different. Sometimes all of this information is overwhelming..I grew up with farm dogs and fed them whatever; they lived long and don’t remember them ever being sick. Are all of these health issues, with our canine friends, recent? Both of my last 2 dogs have had very sensitive digestive systems and allergies.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Just read the Dogs Naturally article. Apparently it’s better to feed eggs (including whites) raw because cooking depletes the nutritional value. So I may give mine all raw yolks, some raw whites and cook the unused whites for my breakfast :).

[Sue’s Zoo]

I feed raw and usually just add raw eggs on occasion but I didn’t realize the info about avidin and cooking. And I agree that separating egg whites is a pain so now that I’m going to cook some I found a couple of egg separators on Amazon and figured I’d share the info.

The second one had more reviews and a slightly higher rating. And they’re each under $5. I’m sure you can find them at a bed bath and beyond, too.

Always learn something new and useful when I read thru these forums. Wish there was a way to compile all the info. Or a good search engine for the forum!

[RescueDaneMom]

If I had to rank commercial foods in order of preference, I would say raw first, then dehydrated/freeze-dried, then kibble. Primal and Stella & Chewy’s make complete and balance raw formulas. Darwin’s is also complete and balanced plus they ship right to your door (you can’t buy it in a store). For dehydrated food, I like The Honest Kitchen. Grandma Lucy’s is similar but freeze-dried instead of dehydrated. If you want kibble, then I agree that Orijen is one of the best kibbles you could feed.

I feed my Great Dane (also a rescue) a 50/50 mix of The Honest Kitchen and commercial raw. I try to rotate as many different brands and proteins of raw as I can. I use Primal, Stella & Chewy’s, Tucker’s, Vital Essentials, and Genesis Raw (local to FL). I do keep a small bag of Orijen Adult on hand for when I forget to thaw out raw or I’m in a hurry.

If I were you, I would try to locate a small, independent pet store or pet boutique. They tend to carry the quality kibbles and also raw/dehydrated foods. They will usually special order things for you as well.

I hope this helps and good luck!

[InkedMarie]

Have you thought of either ground raw (Hare Today, My Pet Carnivore and Reel Raw) are the places I know of to order from or pre made raw (Darwin’s & Primal are two I like)?

[Wanda F]

I’ve had Brewer for 2 years; rescue Lab. who spent most of his young life at the shelter. He came with numerous stomach, stool and skin problems (even thought the neighbors had poisoned him because he was so sick)…after several vet. visits who suggested corn based food I went to Dog Food Advisor and tried Dogswell-Nutrisca…he’s certainly doing better but I want the best for him so I tried raw but realized I was too uncertain how to get it balanced and he’s a “gulper” so meaty bones and whole chicken pieces are a hazard. Now I’m looking at Orijen…seems the next best thing to raw for this special boy. Any advice???

[pugmomsandy]

I use Wagatha’s organic dog biscuits. They are wheat free, just not grain-free. I have used Instinct biscuits before and they weren’t small. They’re grain free freeze dried Raw Boost treats might work too.

[theBCnut]

Jake’s mom

You did exactly what I would have done. If they don’t consume the bone completely then after a couple hours when they get tired of it, I throw it away. Some people refreeze them and give it again later, but I have plenty of bones, so have never felt a need to save them.

Sue

Dogs handle the germs just fine, so I don’t risk cooking even a little bit of the bone. I do tend to give bones in their crates, so they don’t get raw meat all over the house though. Also, good luck on finding raw meaty bones that are low fat. Ribs are fatty, though lamb is much leaner than mutton. I think brisket is the sternum area. The leanest raw meats are chicken and turkey with the skin removed, but they aren’t as much workout for the teeth.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 7 months ago by theBCnut.

[Sue’s Zoo]

Zohar, Feeding raw meaty bones, it that’s what you’re thinking of, depends on the size of your dog and how they eat. I have two large breed older pups that are all on raw within the last 3 months. The older one (8 yrs., 80 lbs) took to raw like a champ but takes her time chewing her raw meaty bones (so far smaller turkey necks, also chicken necks, wing, feet and backs. And she LOVES them.
The other two are under a year (95 lbs and 70 lbs). They chew most RMBs but quite often, with turkey necks, will swallow a large chunk at the end and then regurgitate several pieces of bone about 3-4 am. It’s never been a real problem but not great to wake up, clean up and wonder if all is ok for the next hour. So I’ve recently started using a meat mallet on turkey necks to break down the bone slightly before feeding. Seems to be the answer as there has been no bone regurgitation since I started.
A couple of tips I found elsewhere: to cut large, heavier bones into smaller pieces use a garden type Lopper. Works great on turkey necks. Be careful about pieces that are too small as it is easier to choke on something that is just a little too big to swallow rather than something large that they break into smaller pieces themselves. That said, I’ve also heard of holding some of them with tongs while they eat until you’re confident they can manage the size, etc. on their own. I have to say it was kind of scary at first and it’s never good to be over-confident that you never question what you’re doing.
And even if you don’t have a butcher, there are SO many raw pet food providers available now! You can buy lots of different raw meaty bones from any of them. Just research to make sure it’s the quality you want.

https://www.mypetcarnivore.com/
http://www.rawpaws.org/display/main/Raw+Paws+Home+Page
http://reelrawdog.com/
https://www.hare-today.com/

And last, I heard of a website that provides info and links to many organic farms (meat and veg). Maybe there’s one near you! Check here for places that might be close to you: http://www.eatwild.com/index.html

Good luck!

Still confused TOO!

• This reply was modified 11 years, 7 months ago by Sue's Zoo.

[Sue’s Zoo]

I have two large pups (10m, 95lbs; 7m, 68lbs). Thanks to this website I’m now raw feeding though I’ve stressed about it quite a bit (mostly unnecessarily I”m sure). But when I talked to my holistic vet she suggested if I needed more bulk in diet especially when problems occur, oats would be the way to go. I haven’t researched this further but thought I’d pass it along as something you could check further.

Good luck!

[Susan]

Hi, I’m a vegetarian to, I hate meat, all those poor animals getting killed.. I was thinking of giving Patch a raw meaty bone once a week but Im worried as he has Pancreatitis, in the book im reading at the moment the vet suggest Raw Brisket bone or Mutton flaps as they are ideal because the dog needs to really use their teeth to crack crush & tear these down to small pieces, their gums & teeth benefit enormously from this activity. I dont know what a brisket bone is or what’s a mutton flap, but the rib bones sounds good, Ive seen BBQ ribs u can slice 1 off, but mite be a bit small for Patch it would be gone in 1 minute. I’d have to have a look at them all at the butchers & ask the butcher what meat bones would have the least fat beef, lamb or pork, also does anyone pour boiling hot water over the bone to kill any germs & bacteria….

[Bobby dog]

Jakes mom:
I am not sure who is enjoying the RMB’s more at this point, you or Jake! lol I have tried some soup bones before; I am not even sure if they are appropriate. This was before I took an interest in what I was feeding Bobby and my cats.

Bobby’s a funny little dude because chewing on the bone or eating the raw meat off of it didn’t really interest him, he just wanted to bury them. He buries anything you give him outside though, even biscuits. He doesn’t even chew on bullysticks. He does chew like a maniac on his squeaky or plush toys. He’s four years old and has the most beautiful white teeth you have ever seen and I do not brush them.

I am still going to go for the beef heart but what I am really interested in trying is a turkey neck. Maybe a different texture may interest him, IDK. I will check out everything that is out though because you never know what you will come across.

These updates make me want to go grocery shopping sooner! Thank you so much for the updates though, they are helpful for me!!!! 😉

[jakes mom]

Bobby dog, Jake had a beef bone tonite and he loved it! Either he likes beef more than chicken or he’s just more used to raw now but he had no hesitation about it like he did when I first gave him a chicken back. I’m not sure what kind of bone it was. It was packaged as “scrap bones for stewing”. Had a decent amount of meat on it. I think it was a cow vertebrae by the looks of it. The cats enjoyed some of the meat, too. Beef is a hit at my house I guess! Next time, pork ribs maybe! You should try giving Bobby a nice meaty bone, this one kept Jake busy and happy for almost 2 hours!

[aquariangt]

I am not very versed in large breeds, but brands that don’t suck from petsmart (and again, this is just based on BRAND, nothing to do with large breed nutition-though I will type in ones that aren’t grain inclusive as per BC’s comments on wolf hybrids, also which I have no concept of):

Wellness Core
Nulo
Castor and Pollux Ultramix
Freshpet Vital
Simply Nourish Source

Really the only ones I care about there-and I only feed 1.5 of them. I did however see at my Petsmart the Nature’s Variety Instict (including Raw) were on their way in, so that’s good.

Also-love the name Khaleesi. I have a Daenerys 🙂

[jakes mom]

Zohar, I don’t eat meat either but have recently started feeding a bit of raw food to my dog and cats. These forums are a wonderful resource, BCnut has been a great help to me. The only thing I would add is that maybe you don’t need to bother making a trip to a butcher shop. A local grocery store has beef and pork ribs and you can ask them to cut a slab of ribs into pieces for you. Good luck, I’m sure Penny will love a rib bone! My dog, a beagle/basset mix is a 30ish pound dog and he also loves chicken backs.

[jakes mom]

OK, thanks BCnut. I am just looking for stuff to give the dog and cats more as a healthy treat as opposed to really “feeding raw” so not worried about calcium or other nutrients, still counting on the kibble to supply that. I have been looking at just raw stuff like the bones, hearts and gizzards, chicken backs and chicken and beef liver. I’ve seen a lot of smoked hocks and knew not to give anything like that so was interested when I saw the fresh hocks. Have noticed that a lot of the chicken parts are “enhanced” so have avoided that as well.

[theBCnut]

If you were starting a raw diet, I would recommend consumable bones and yes, we do feed raw chicken bones, as well as turkey, duck, quail, etc., just not cooked. But for a kibble fed dog that needs some chewing satisfaction and some teeth cleaning, I recommend rib bones, pork, lamb, goat, beef. These bones are pretty safe for your dog to eat the whole thing, if he really loves chewing, but they provide a bit more challenge, so do a great job on teeth. You can get a slab of ribs and ask the butcher to cut them into individual ribs. Whole beef ribs are probably a bit big for your dog so you would want to have him cut those in half unless you find short ribs. Give one a couple times a week.

[Zohar F]

Hi there – I’m a vegetarian who has never stepped into a butcher shop or eaten meat since I was a kid. I’m not opposed to feeding raw dog bones (I do feed meat based dog foods), and I keep reading about the benefits of raw bones, but I have no clue where to start. I understand you go to the butcher – but what bones do I ask for? My vet told me to ask the butcher to cut a beef knuckle into quarters and give that to Penny, but then I read knuckles are bad and too hard and can break teeth. Marrow bones are good and bad. Soup bones are good and bad. Never feed weight bearing bones. Never feed chicken bones but then do feed chicken necks, backs and thighs? I AM SO CONFUSED. I’m scared to walk into the butcher shop and ask him what to feed because what if he gives me the wrong bone.

I just bought a smoked ham bone at the pet store which I was told is different from cooked – but I took it away after reading horror stories online that smoked is the same as cooked.

Can someone give me a definitive answer on what to give Penny? She’s a 25-30 pound terrier mix who loves to chew. She gets high quality kibble – so I’m more searching for recreational bones that will keep her busy, clean her teeth and not break her teeth (although nutritional benefits are welcome). What types of bones do I ask the butcher for? Detailed answers much appreciated!

[jakes mom]

Akari, I agree with everyone else’s comments and would just add one thing. The cat’s face is sensitive, maybe you’re annoying him, especially if you’re touching the very sensitive whiskers. There’s also something called hyperesthesia, a syndrome where kitties are ultra sensitive to touch, especially on the back. I doubt that’s the case with you, I think he’s probably just young and rowdy!! I have a cat who’s very touchy about his back. He likes me to pet him but I need to watch how he’s acting and know when to quit.
Raw food people…I was at the store this afternoon and saw fresh pork hocks and pig tails! Also ox tails on sale for soup. Has anybody fed a pig tail? Looked like a good size but I wasn’t sure so I didn’t get them. Are any or all of them ok? I was pretty sure the hocks would be ok?
C4C, I know what you mean about the strange looks from some people, but have you also noticed that some of those people, the ones with just one or 2 cats, seem to come to us for advice? lol

[Matt C]

Jesse James Hagen-Daazs
D.O.B. December 14, 1995 / D.O.D. January 01, 2011

“PALS”
Jesse James was a very special friend to me during our time together. We came together at a time in my life when I was just starting out on my own, and in need of a loyal friend. He was such a friend to me throughout the 15 years he was by my side.
He & I shared many adventures together. Sometimes it was just a quick trip to the corner store for a soda. Other times it would be week long road trips; camping, hiking and fishing our way throughout Arizona. His favorite words to hear were: “Jesse; wanna go for a ride in the Jeep?” He loved visiting family or friends for an afternoon barbeque and a chance to test out their swimming pool. Or a quick trip to the Salt River, to go swim out to greet the passing Tubers; usually with a stick (sometimes ½ a tree) in his mouth as an invitation to play fetch with him. And sharing my dinner with him when there wasn’t enough money for dog food until payday. (He didn’t mind of course) Or just sitting on the front porch at night with me, watching the rain for hours. And in his later years, helping us to raise our Scottish Deerhound girl “Sheba”; now 6 years old, and missing her big brother. Her gentle cries and whimpers continue today still as she constantly looks for him, waiting for him to come home.
I was blessed to be there as this little Yellow Labrador took his first breath as he was born. Fifteen years later I was there to hold him one last time in my arms as he took his last breath on our way to the emergency vet. This after coming home to find him unexpectedly coughing and unable to stand. As it became ever more apparent that he was quickly dying as we rushed to the hospital; I will never forget the wagging tail, and the absolute trust in his eyes as I spoke to him to try and comfort him in what would be our last moments together. As I held him in the back seat of the car; I silently prayed, “If you’re going to take him anyway Lord; please take him now.” My prayer was immediately answered. He lay there silent and peaceful. His suffering had just ended. Mine had just begun. I gently; reluctantly closed his eyes with my hand. My old friend was gone. Time stood still for what seemed an eternity.
He was buried very early yesterday morning, wrapped in my Wife’s old baby blanket that he loved to sneak off with and curl up in; despite the scolding that would surely follow. I tucked a new Rawhide bone and his favorite toy between his paws and under his chin; just how he’d often sleep with them. He was buried in a 2 acre pasture under an old cottonwood tree between Murphy Brown, his mother, and Wheezie, his sister. Jesse was the last of 10 siblings to pass.
He lived a long and happy life, and the memories of our time together will be forever etched in my soul.
You will be deeply missed my dear friend; but never forgotten. You are part of me.
January 3, 2011
———————————————————————————————————————
I just received a phone call from my close friend this morning, who owns the property where Jesse was buried 3 years ago. He was faced with no option but to sell the property today; due to the divorce he is going through. A divorce he did not ask for. Despite his best efforts to keep the land and the house he built 14 years ago, before this marriage, there were no options. This, the home where both his children were born and raised. The pasture where our dogs often played and were laid to rest. Where I would visit Jesse beneath that cottonwood tree whenever I came by. Where good friends always came together to enjoy life and share stories. It is a special place to me as well.
After my friend moves out his home by the end of next month; I know I will not likely get to visit Jesse in his final resting spot again. This saddens my heart today. But I know my friend’s pain far outweighs anything I am feeling right now. He has countless memories of what was once his home. The last home he ever really wanted. Now he must move on in his life against his choosing. So must I.
January 24, 2014

I found a way today to make it by one last time to put 12 Yellow Roses on Jesse’s grave. I sat here for quite some time today, lost in the memories of a great dog. It started getting dark and I headed for home; where another Labrador, Wyatt James of Willowynde would surely be waiting for me; wondering where I’m at. February 22, 2014

Where to Bury a Good Dog
I am thinking now of a retriever; whose coat was golden in the sunshine, and who, so far as we are aware, never entertained a
mean or an unworthy thought. This retriever is buried
beneath a cottonwood tree, under four feet of pasture loam, and
at its proper season, the cottonwood strews its leaves upon the green
lawn of his grave. Beneath a cottonwood tree, or a fruit tree, or
any flowering shrub of the garden, is an excellent place to
bury a good dog.
Beneath such trees, such shrubs, he slept in the drowsy
summer, or gnawed at a flavorous bone, or lifted his head to
challenge some strange intruder. These are good places, in
life, or in death. Yet it is a small matter, and touches
sentiment more than anything else. For if the dog be well
remembered, if sometimes he leaps through your dreams
actual as in life, eyes kindling, questing, asking, laughing,
begging; it matters not at all where that dog sleeps at long
and at last.
On a hill where the wind is unrebuked, and the trees are
roaring, or beside a gentle stream he knew in puppyhood, or
somewhere in the flatness of a pasture land, where most
peaceful cattle graze. It is all one to the dog, and all one
to you, and nothing is gained, and nothing lost — if
memory lives. But there is one best place to bury a good dog.
One place that is best of all.
If you bury him in this place, the secret of which you must
already have, he will come to you when you call — come
to you over the grim, dim frontiers of death, and down the
well-remembered path, and to your side again. And
though you call a dozen living dogs to heel, they shall not
growl at him, nor resent his coming, for he is yours and he
belongs there. People may scoff at you, who see no
lightest blade of grass bent by his footfall, who hear no
whimper pitched too fine for mere audition, people who
may never really have had a dog. Smile at them then, for
you shall know something that is hidden from them, and
which is well worth knowing. The one best place to
bury a good dog is deep in the heart of his master.
In Memory of; Jesse James Hagen-Daazs
December 14th, 1995 – January 1st, 2011

[Shasta220]

Wolf shepherd as in wolf hybrid? I’ve never owned a hybrid (well, except for my 25% guy, but that hardly counts). But I have friends who raise and train hybrids for pets – they only feed their wolf hybrids a raw diet. They say kibble isn’t good for a Wolfdog at all, especially anything grain-inclusive.

Other than that, definitely check out the large breed thread. Lots of helpful advice on there 🙂

[Naturella]

Lynn, I have not yet fed Fromm or Merrick, but I intend to. I have fed samples of Victor (all Grain Free ones), and samples of Nature’s Variety Instinct and plan to feed them as part of my dog’s rotation in the future. Bruno (my pup) REALLY likes all of Victor Grain Free except for the salmon one – he’s not crazy about it, but he eats it mixed in his current food (Earthborn Holistic Coastal Catch with Vets Choice Holistic Health Extension Original). As for NVI – he ate the samples mixed in his previous mix (mostly Dr. Tim’s Kinesis Grain Free – Nutrisca Chicken – Vets Choice Holistic Health Extension Grain Free, but when it was getting low I threw a bunch of samples in there – NVI Chicken and Duck&Turkey Raw Boost, NOW Fresh, and NutriSource Chicken), but he really likes the freeze-dried raw bits the most, and the NVI rabbit cat food, lol.

[T]

Hey, everyone! Glad to see this discussion… One of my favorite topics.

As for proteins, different people classify them in different ways, but in general:
Hot: venison, lamb
Warm/hot: chicken
Neutral: Beef, rabbit, duck
Cool: turkey, fish, pork

Some people say beef and turkey are also warm. Since most animals are eating chicken, or lamb when I meet them, I end up recommending beef, turkey, duck, rabbit and fish a lot. I am in Phoenix, AZ, very dry and hot much of the year. Seems like animals can tolerate the warmer proteins in the winter, though. Seasonality should influence food choice as well as the constitution of the animal (hyper/”fire” animals may benefit from cooler foods).

It’s OK to feed a little bit of warming food with the cooling diet! Balance is the key word. Also, the cooking method has influence on food energetics. For example, raw lamb would be cooler than boiled lamb. Boiled lamb would be cooler than baked lamb, etc. Green veggies are cooling, in general. Dairy is cool and damp (now I know why I get sinusitis from eating a lot of ice cream!).

I am dreaming of putting together a seminar on the topic of pet foods, food energetics, etc. one day.

Tabitha Thompson, DVM CVM
http://naturalalternativesvet.com

[dogluver95828]

I wanted to tell everyone that my pitt was having a horrible rash in his crotch and unerarm areas. bad, he scratched till it was raw. I spent 2 years searching on the internet and found the problem! I kept treating it as an external problem and it was an internal problem. he had a yeast inblance in his intestines. So i tried 2 tsp lemon juice once a day and it was gone in a week and has stayed gone. the info i read said to use lemon juice or unfiltered apple cider vinegar. If you pit has a rash that wont go away then try this, what have you got to loose? oh yes, and puree lemons dont work, tried that, rash came back. has to be lemon juice. I am so happy i am not having to wash his crotch area everyday. It wss so bad i cried cuz i felt so bad for him and i didnt know what to do. i searched and searched on the internet for about 2 years and it paid off. Tried all diff foods too, didnt work. so if your dog has a bumpy red rash on his crotch and under the armpits too, that is the sign of an internal yeast infection or inbalance. Wow, we are so very happy now. About twice it started to flare up again and i just washed it and was gone the next day! Such and easy solution too!

[Susan]

How do you know its food allergies?? You sure they dont have Enviornment allergies, My boy gets itchy red paws & itchy skin & he has enviornment allergies, only 1-5% of dogs will have true food allergies, Im reading a book at the moment & its rare for dogs to have food allergies, Dr Rob Zammit writes, the number of dogs that really have a food allergy is fewer than the number of dogs diagnosed with the condition, far too often, if a dog has a non-seasonal propensity to scratch it is diagnosed as having a food allergy without proper testing..the only way you’ll know if its food is you must do an elimination diet, A reasonable elimination diet is cooked rice & lamb, no snacking inbetween meals,.In the case of true food allergy improvement will be seen after 7 days with the dogs skin looking normal by the end of 3 weeks. If ur dogs improve on an elimination diet it could be useful to include additives such as polyunsaturated oil, omega oils & other natural oils found in various herbs, the critical thing is to add only 1 additive at a time. The best starting point is omega oils add this a the recommended dose for aleast 6 weeks , if there’s no deterioration in symtoms then add another additive can be given if the lamb & rice is working then the next additive should be in the form of raw bone, these must be sheep origin, so use mutton flaps, lamb necks or brisketbones from sheep again no other additives must be given for another 6 weeks. You may want to pick another meat, but only use the raw meaty bones from that animal….also bathing should be done weekly with a good oatmeal base shampoo too keep the oils in the skin, if ur using all those product they are not working maybe its a time for a change with products, I use Malaseb medicated shampoo & I saw an improvement within 3 weeks, skin started growing back also Blackmores has a excellent dog range called Paw (Pure Animal wellbeing) I also uses the Paw Nutriderm replenishing conditioner this can be left on the skin moisturising the skin weekly… The basis of the diet could become a good quality super premium dry food as long as the ingredients are similar to those used during the elimnation diet…

[Shasta220]

If this food is helping, then certainly stick with it. If not, then possibly try an elimination diet….not always are allergy tests accurate. Try to do a super simple home made diet, or stay with the food (making sure she has no more allergic reactions), then add chicken for a week or two. Then try rice, or potatoes, or any other suspect allergen food. It’s time consuming, but well worth it.

Most of the time, for allergy prone dogs, home made and raw diets do the best anyway. It’d also be better since you could know exactly what goes in her bowl, no more looking at the ingredient list!

About the treats, I am disappointed with natural balance treats since they add molasses (sugar)…. Try some home made treats (keeping em simple….fruits, veggies, meat, and coconut flour or something if necessary. Bake in the oven for about an hour until nice n dried)

[Suburban Gal]

Gizmo, my 7-year-old papillon, gets rawhide and bully sticks. He likes both, but prefers bully sticks.

If you’re going to give rawhide, just stay away from anything made in China or any other country with subpar or inferior standards.

Personally, I go out of my way to ensure whatever I buy Gizmo is made in the United States. If not here, the a country that has similar standards like Canada, the U.K., Holland, Australia, New Zealand, etc… .

[crazy4cats]

I can’t wait! But in the mean time, check out catinfo.org. There are a few charts of canned food on this site. On this site, dry is not recommended, only canned, dehydrated, raw or homemade. Fish is high in iodine which can lead to hyperthyroidism if fed in excess. You can easily read ingredient labels to avoid fish in wet food.

[Naturella]

Everyone, you have been so extremely helpful!!! Thanks so much! 🙂

I have been looking at the Furminator Nail Grinder – but when you say you use a dremel, do you mean like a real (hardware?) tool?

Also, I also think it may be hurting Bruno when the clippers close down – something with the pressure of it I think. And although we never did draw blood on him, we did get the quick once – I was going very slowly, he yelped, I stopped, no blood. I cut that nail higher with no problems, but I think that may have traumatized him.

Carlyn, I think this is a cool idea – Bruno loves digging anyway, and we may even try that board-and-sandpaper thing, but do you think it will hurt his paws at all though? He;s a vigorous digger!

I usually still file his nails with a human nail file for real nails even after he has them clipped/ground, because they are still scratchy. It takes a while, but he lets me do that better. So I can try the nail file for acrylic nails too, that may work better! I may get that first, then the sandpaper board, then either the Furminator grinder or a dremel if that is what we need. And if all else fails, well, I will just take him to the Petsmart people – he hasn’t had a problem with them, I just wanted to see if doing it myself would be a better investment.

[Bobby dog]

Hi Jakes mom:
Then you will really appreciate the download if you, like me, are not looking to dive into a full or partial raw diet. Commercial raws are expensive for both cats and dogs. My hypothyroid kitty likes NV medallions, but won’t eat it regularily. The cost of feeding all five cats commercial raw is something I could not afford.

I would rather prepare my own raw diet rather than use a commercial if I were to feed it anyway. I have been researching them and I need to gain more knowledge about the needed protein/fat/vitamin levels for dogs and cats to be sure I don’t over or under supplement and cause health problems. It is going to take much more time for me to research a raw diet to do it right and time is limited for me right now.

[jakes mom]

Bobby dog, Jake likes beef liver. I have not found beef heart yet but he’s eaten everything else so I’m hopeful.
I thought the usda site was very helpful. I was surprised that they mentioned raw food, would have expected it to be food that people usually eat, but I searched “calories raw chicken” and it came up. It’s the usda nutritional database if you look for it. You can search a category like poultry or type in a specific like chicken.
No time to check the ABC thing yet. We have 3 techs out on sick leave right now so I’m working a lot of extra hours. Sounds interesting,tho. Just what I need as I really don’t think I’ll go completely raw. Can’t afford the complete raw like Darwin’s and don’t want to get involved in buying supplements and trying to concoct a healthy combo. Will count on good quality dog food to supply the specifics and add in some raw. Certainly a bit of heart or liver is a better treat than most of those things in the store!

[Naturella]

I agree with Carlyn (Shasta220). And I actually think the NutriDent ingredients are not THAT bad, I know what more of the ingredients mean than those in Milkbone for example. Before I knew all I do now, we bought Bruno a bag of the Nylabone equivalent of Greenies, NutriDent for puppies, and aside from making his stool green, they didn’t cause him any discomfort, but I doubt they cleaned his teeth at all. Once I learned about bully sticks and other dehydrated natural chews and raw meaty bones, I would not get him any of those commercial “dental” treats ever again. 🙂

[Shasta220]

I still genuinely think that Greenies do way more harm than good. If you want fresh breath, google “DIY greenies”. There is a great recipe for a natural breath-killing recipe (uses herbs, chlorophyll, and activated charcoal…..texture is more like a biscuit tho).

It’s said on here that giving a Greenie is like giving your kid a candybar. I suppose I wouldn’t be opposed to it once in a blue moon, as every kid gets a candybar once in a while. BUT, if there are healthier options that are just as satisfying then I’d rather go with them.

Zuke’s do have much better ingredients, yes, and they are a tad spendier, yes. I use them maybe once every few months. Any dental chew does ZERO good for my lab who is missing a top molar, since she only chews on one side.

Brushing is still the best way. If you want a tooth-cleaning treat, give them a chunk of raw bone-in meat (I give frozen chicken, actually. Works better than dental chews IMO. Doesn’t leave that nasty gunky residue on the teeth, either!)

Also, I honestly couldn’t possibly care any less about a seal of acceptance. No matter what fancy labels/tests/seals go on, my gut instincts and my dogs will be the judges of what works and what doesn’t work…

• This reply was modified 11 years, 8 months ago by Shasta220.

[Bobby dog]

Hi C4c:
Haven’t been on here all day. I was outside working then wouldn’t you know it the electricity went out for two hours just as it was turning dark. When it came back on there was no water in the barn. I am not a handyman by any means. After checking all the circuit breakers and having no luck I finally had an ah ha moment, reset the breakers in the barn, duh!

I have just been shopping at Wal-Mart, but it looks like I might have to check the grocery store for beef hearts. The Wal-Mart I shop at has a variety of fowl but I haven’t been able to find beef hearts the two times I looked. I will ask someone next time I am there to make sure they don’t have something in the back that maybe they don’t normally put on display.

I really have no recommendations for you as far as which meat; you can’t go by my brats! lol The chicken gizzards and hearts didn’t go over well in my house. I lightly boiled them, Bobby woofed them down, the cats still turned their noses up at them, sigh. Akari and Jakes mom seem to be having better luck introducing chicken to their crew than I have been! And it looks like Jake likes beef heart as well. I am going to try beef heart next. Who knows, Bobby and the cats may not like the meat raw so I may have to lightly cook it. We shall see, I will make adjustments as necessary.

I have not done a complete ABC day yet. The last item I need to introduce Bobby to is a heart or I guess liver. When I do introduce him to it I was just going to follow the 20% rule of thumb and just feed the usual amount of kibble. As soon as I find a heart meat (or some kind of meat) that Bobby likes then I will do a complete ABC day.

It looks like Jakes mom found the website that we needed so I think we will have all bases covered.

Jakes mom:
Good idea checking out that website. I will check it out tomorrow! Thanks 😉

[jakes mom]

Thanks, I will definitely check that site.
I looked on the USDA nutrition site today. They have a big list of all kinds of food. I looked up chicken and got a list of everything from KFC chicken to raw chicken liver (bingo!). Tells you everything you’d want to know from calories (kcals) to protein, carbs, etc. For example 100grams (about 3.5oz) of chick liver is 119 calories. So now we can figure how much to decrease our kibble depending on what else doggy is getting that day. I just checked on chicken today, maybe look up pork or beef when I get a chance. Also per 100 grams:
hearts 153 cal
ground chick 143 cal
giblets 127 cal
gizzards 94 cal

[Ray M]

God called your name so gently
That only you could hear.
No one heard the footsteps
Of the Angel drawing near.
Softly from the shadows
There came a gentle call.
You closed your eyes and went to sleep.
You quietly left us all

[Bobby dog]

Hi Jakes mom:
It’s an awsome download you can find on Steve Brown’s website. I do want to purchase his book, but as you read above I probably will never go completely raw for various reasons. I downloaded his PDF a while ago and it explains very easily how to enhance any kibble (from Ol’ Roy to 5 stars) with vitamins through whole foods you can buy from the grocery store. I highly recommend it for $2.95, it is more than worth it! Here’s the link:

http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi katj813 –

It’s great that you’re adding wet food to your dog’s dry food. Wet food is actually much healthier than dry food – especially if you go with a good quality product. The reasons for this is that wet food more closely resembles a dog’s natural diet – high in moisture, higher in protein and less processed. Providing high quality (unprocessed) protein is especially important for seniors (such as your boy) because as dogs age they become less efficient at breaking down dietary protein yet their body’s need for the amino acids that protein requires doesn’t diminish.

Some reasonably priced and highly rated canned options you may want to consider are 4Health (sold at Tractor Supply), Kirkland Cuts in Gravy (sold at Costco), Pure Balance (sold at Walmart), Natural Life (sold at Walmart and some grocery stores), Whole Earth Farms (sold at Petco, specialty retailers and many online retailers) and By Nature 95% Meat (sold at specialty retailers and online retailers). All of these options are, to the best of my knowledge, around the same price or cheaper than Nutro’s canned food.

Some other options would be using a dehydrated food as a topper. Dehydrated foods, when re-hydrated, are similar in consistency to canned food and when re-hydrated tend to be cheaper on a cup per cup basis.

You could also consider adding healthy human food toppers such as leftover lean meats, tinned sardines or salmon (great source of omega 3’s), cage free eggs (raw or cooked – also a great source of omega 3’s), plan yogurt (probiotics) or kefit (probiotics). Just be sure that if you use unbalanced extras like these that they account for less than a quarter of the meal or else you could risk throwing off the nutritional balance of his food.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 8 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Naturella]

I have tried a few samples of it, and really want to try the venison and/or rabbit kinds! 🙂 Bruno loves the freeze-dried raw bites, and we also give him a sample of the rabbit cat formula as treats – it has awesome protein and one sample spread in over a month as treats won’t hurt him, I don’t think! 😀

[Shasta220]

It seems like I have heard around here that allergy tests are usually very inaccurate. You can take the same dog in for a test three different times and have each result differ. I’d try an elimination diet for a while, using these suspect foods (usually done by a home made simple diet and adding one suspect allergen at a time to see if a reaction occurs).

It’ll take a while for an elimination diet, but that’s about the only way you can tell for sure.

I don’t know too many foods’ ingredient lists. Seems like Victor uses Sorghoum instead of rice/barley as the carb source. I know a home made/raw diet is tricky to do, but it might be easier if you could possibly grind the meat/supplements and portion out daily meals in the freezer? Then when you take her to the pet sitter, you can just give her a container. This might be a possibility at least until you could find a food that works well 🙂

Also agree with aquariangt, there will probably be no easily accessible kibble that avoids all those ingredients (assuming that she really /does/ react to them all), so canned may be a better option since it’s much easier to avoid problem ingredients.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 8 months ago by Shasta220.

[Bobby dog]

You’re welcome C4c!!! 🙂
I hope more people check it out. I understand tight/limited budgets and have to follow one myself. There are many books on my list to read, but buying textbooks, living expenses, my family, and providing care for my zoo are more of a priority right now. But, a download for $2.95, can’t beat it!

The download is so helpful since I cannot go raw at this time (cost and no space in the freezer) not sure if I ever will go completely raw, but I definately want to feed Bobby as well as I can. The download certainly helped me do that. I think anyone will agree $2.95 for the information inside is more than worth it. The best part is the whole foods are really things you can buy at any grocery store, nothing exotic, you can make it really affordable by looking for sales, it is explained well, and is easy to follow. You don’t even have to make a whole meal of it, you can add extras to each meal through the week. It’s one of the best buys I have made recently!! lol

[Randi M]

Hey! I am looking for a little help. I recently had my 4 year old Boston Terrier allergy tested. I just got the results back and am having a very difficult time finding an appropriate food for her so I’m hoping others can help!

Her list of food allergies include
-chicken
-turkey
-peas
-carrots
-eggs
-barley
-tomato
-rice
-soybean
-corn
-white potato

Does anyone here know of any foods that don’t include these ingredients? I am having no luck with any of our local pet stores. It has been suggested I try a raw diet for her but I am hoping to avoid this! I work 12 hour shift work and have to take her to a “sitter” while I work so a dry food would be best.

My vet suggested “Iams Veterinary Diet Skin and Coat Plus KO”. I haven’t heard many positive reviews on Iams or this food so I am unsure.

I have just transitioned her to Nature’s Variety Instinct Lamb Meal. This one is free of all her allergens with the exception of peas. Peas are the third ingredient on the list. I had no idea she was allergic to peas and I had never noticed a reaction to them before. I would really like to keep her on a 4-5 star food.
Thank you in advance for any help!!

[jakes mom]

Not ready, even close, to going all raw so I want to keep feeding the kibble to make sure all the bases are covered as far as nutrition. Don’t want to get involved in adding all kinds of supplements, etc. I’m thinking of the raw as healthy treats, not meals, at this point. I am in awe of the knowledge on the raw food forum!

[jakes mom]

Just started with some chicken backs , liver, hearts and gizzards. Cats and dog all seem to be enjoying it altho the first couple of backs had the dog a little puzzled. Next question, how do I balance the raw and kibble? I don’t want to be feeding too many calories. I gave Jake a little less kibble for his evening meal when he’d had a chick back earlier that afternoon.

[Bobby dog]

I am very jealous that hearts and gizzards went over so well at your house and Akari had luck with gizzards too. lol

I guess we do need to figure out the kibble ratio next when feeding our pups something raw. I don’t think you can go wrong with at least cutting back on the kibble the day he gets a raw treat.

Livers are definately on my list next!

Now let’s see what C4c has luck with.