[Holly C]

I guess I phrased that odd. By “fish flavoured” I meant one that tastes more like fish, like Salmon, Krill, Cod oil, etc. I also take the fish oil I give my dog, and I have to say, it doesn’t taste very pleasant, and he doesn’t like it much either. I used to give Salmon Oil but with some budgeting I just buy 1000mg capsules of fish oil. I’ll have to try sardines sometime- my dog would love that!

I also give 600 iu of vitamin e, and a joint supplement. My dog has joint and hip issues, and he has a completely torn ACL. He’s due for surgery soon >:

[Mom2Cavs]

Hi, Betsy. It very well may be seasonal….Laverne has started with some itching and anal glands again, even though her stool is normal!? She was just at the vets this past Thurs. because I noticed a bump on one of her front legs. The vet expressed her glands and said they were bad, ugh. Vet said it’s probably staph and could even be caused by shampoo being left on and not drying properly or fully (this was said because of where the infection is located). She gave me some muricin salve to rub on the bump. But I may call and get an oral antibiotic for her, as well. Don’t usually like them but want to be sure this doesn’t turn into something even more difficult. Laverne is mine that has allergies, of course, and who snores a lot. She also does reverse sneezing at times. She has a murmur, about 3-4/6, (came on about 2 years ago) but doesn’t cough . Her nose runs sometimes (again allergies). She is eating Wellness Small Breed Simple for kibble and Wellness Stews or Weruva or Simply Nourish for canned topper. I have been giving the Firm Up, but was wondering if she has become intolerant of it? It could be lots of things. I do also give them coq10 3 times a week (30 mg). Right now I decided to not change anything in her diet except removing the Firm Up for awhile, and switching probiotics up. Hazel was checked as well and the vet could barely hear her murmur and rated it a 1/2…..she’s had a murmur since birth with no meds. She has no symptoms of anything and doesn’t snore at all. Rupert, who is on enalapril twice a day and has heart disease (MVD) and a grade 5/6 murmur is doing great. He snores occasionally but not that bad and does not cough at all. He has no other symptoms. I would say this is probably seasonal, but if I were you, I would have your vet or Cardiologist (if you have one) check things out thoroughly. I don’t want to scare you, but I think these things can come on suddenly. According to Rupert’s breeder his came on suddenly, but not really sure…maybe just wasn’t caught before now. I also decided to not really try to reduce the sodium (just making sure it’s not on the too high range). Like I said before, the only heart supplement I have been using regularly is coq10. You could also try adding other things, like fish oil, hawthorne, l-carnitine, coq10 and of course taurine, if you’re not doing so already. There are some all inclusive supplements like Bio-Cardio by Thorne, Vetri-Science Cardio Strength. Also Standard Process Cardio is one my vet likes (but they always prescribe Standard Process). I’ve used the all inclusive ones in the past, but recently have been trying to keep things as simple as I can. I’ve probably not answered your question but hope I’ve helped some.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 4 months ago by Mom2Cavs.

[pugmomsandy]

There are raw foods with added minerals like Stella & chewy’s and Primal to name a few. Nature’s Variety’s chicken recipe has actually passed feeding trials so I would assume their other recipes are formulated similarly (but it’s just an assumption). Answers (Detailed) has a pork recipe. And fortunately, there are more protein choices as well for raw foods like rabbit, bison and goat. You should be able to find lamb and pork relatively easy. The book “Real Food for Healthy Dogs and Cats” also includes a recipe for a vitamin/mineral mix to make complete diets. Check out Hare-Today Gone Tomorrow and My Pet Carnivore for meat, organs, grinds and whole prey. A non-fish oil option for omega-3 is algae oil and calamari oil if he has a sensitivity to fish oil as well. There are some dehydrated or freeze-dried options as well like Grandma Lucy’s (not raw) and ZiwiPeak (air-dried).

[DogFoodie]

My two year old Golden is intolerant of fish, he also appears to react to fish oil as well. Fish oil, in theory, should’ve be problematic as the protein has been removed, but he’s reacted to foods that contain fish oil.

[texasniteowl]

Thank you Betsy for replying. I too wonder about all the foods going to chickpeas and lentils. I don’t know at the moment if it is an issue for Wilson or not. The Orijen Adult does contain them, but fairly far down the list. I’ll post the ingredients below. It is primarily poultry and fish based.

Thanks for mentioning the NVI LID. I had considered trying them though I wished the protein was a little bit higher. He has had both duck and lamb before so even though they wouldn’t be novel, I could try them. And at 32% dry matter protein they are worth trying. Other than that, I have more ingredient checking to do. His most recent kibble before the Orijen was fish based (Fromm’s Salmon Tunalini) and of course, he had a month of chicken and rice.

Firm Up? Who makes that? I assume it is similar to THK’s Perfect Form?

I will check out the Swanson BioCore enzymes and I know Swanson probiotics have been recommended on these boards a lot too.

Thanks!

Orijen Adult Ingredients
Boneless chicken*, chicken meal, chicken liver*, whole herring*, boneless turkey*, turkey meal, turkey liver*, whole eggs*, boneless walleye*, whole salmon*, chicken heart*, chicken cartilage*, herring meal, salmon meal, chicken liver oil, red lentils, green peas, green lentils, sun-cured alfalfa, yams*, pea fiber, chickpeas, pumpkin*, butternut squash*, spinach greens*, carrots*, Red Delicious apples*, Bartlett pears*, cranberries*, blueberries*, kelp, licorice root, angelica root, fenugreek, marigold, sweet fennel, peppermint leaf, chamomile, dandelion, summer savory, rosemary, Enterococcus faecium.

[DogFoodie]

For us, lentils and chickpeas are a no go. I really hate the way all these pet food companies are creating such legume heavy foods.

I’ve dealt with food intolerances with my Golden since he was a tiny pup and he’s just over two now; and I’ve finally found a food, specifically Nature’s Variety Instinct LID Duck, that he’s doing well on. It’s far from perfect, but he’s doing great on it so I’m keeping him on it for a bit in order to get him stabilized. It has just a few ingredients, and that’s what I’d recommend you try, a limited ingredient diet; ie: NVI LID or Wellness LID are both great brands to try. Orijen has so many ingredients, it would be anybody’s guess what the problem ingredient was. I know my dog has a problem with fish, fish oil, chickpeas, lentils, possibly garlic and possible flax. So, the problem ingredients aren’t always just the meat proteins.

So, a couple of thoughts, Firm Up is great – so much easier than canned pumpkin. I also added Swanson’s BioCore digestive enzymes to his meals and the difference was amazing. Try a quality LID diet and while it doesn’t have to be a totally novel protein, it just needs to be something different than what your dog has eaten in the past.

[nan p]

I went by same guidelines Hound Dog Mom suggested. I have a 15 lb westie. She ate 3 meals a day to get it all in the first 9 months. I used Gradma Lucy’s with the blue ridge beef but mostly used Bravo Complete with fish oil and enzymes.

[Melissaandcrew]

John-LOl. I have the largest size chest freezer you can get, plus a smaller one. the small one houses the marrow bones and ribs(5lb/$3) I think my problem is that I get carried away with things. I grind the quarters and backs as I have major gulpers and I feel its safer for them, so its time consuming. I don’t want to have to break out the grinder three times a month, so I try to do all at once when I can. For ex, at the beginning of the month, I ground up 240lbs quarters. Then next day I cut up 180lbs beef heart into chunks.. I grind quarters every month, but other items I try to get 2-3mths worth of to cut down on days spent prepping. right now, I am making their meals out of what is in the freezer to try and use some of it up as its a pain digging to the bottom to be sure to rotate. Yesterdays meal was ground duck necks, and ground beef. Today is beef heart chunks, liver/kidney mix, ground chicken with their veggie blend(this time sweet potatoe, kale, spinach, dandelion greens and raspberries) a little fish oil/vit e and they should be good.

[USA]

Hi Liz and Mr Lou!

You have very good instincts and Mr Lou is lucky to have you! And of course you are lucky to have Mr Lou!

The frozen green tripe is an excellent source of digestive enzymes and should eliminate the need for adding digestive enzymes to Mr Lou’s diet. Because he received an antibiotic shot which kills the good as well as the bad bacteria I would add probiotics to help replenish his gut. I use this one from Vitacost and it looks like they deliver to Canada.

http://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-probiotic-15-35-35-billion-cfu-60-vegetarian-capsules-9

Start slowly. Half a capsule every other day added to his largest meal. If everything is Okay after 6 days you can go to 1 capsule a day sprinkled on his food. After a month you can reduce it to 1 capsule every other day if you’d like.

k9choicefoods looks like a good food. I couldn’t find the numbers for Protein and Fat but I like the way they raise their animals and their quality seems outstanding.

I would stay away from kibble for multiple reasons. It is a super processed food that is as far away from raw as you can get. The quality will NEVER come close to the raw food you are feeding Mr Lou and feeding a whole food in it’s natural form without any alterations or processing is the absolute best in my opinion.

The Honest Kitchen uses quality ingredients but their foods are too heavy in carbs for my liking. And with any food that has it’s moisture removed who knows exactly how long it takes to re-hydrate it 100% or if it is even possible to re-hydrate it 100%. I just wouldn’t take the chance if I were you. But if you do use a dry food use very little and re-hydrate at least for 24 hours.

The water you understand so just keep up the GOOD WORK and keep drinking while eating or after exercise to a bare minimum. There is mixed evidence on raised feeders but I tend to agree that if you use raised bowls it will allow more gulping or air so I don’t recommend them.

Sardines contain the fish oil you are looking for in a whole food form which is always better than a supplement. Mr Lou is a big boy so after starting really slow a 3 oz tin (packed in water) once or twice a week should be good. If Mr Lou doesn’t like sardines then 2 fish oil capsules daily should be fine.

For supplementing plain raw meat I would use Steve Brown’s dinner mix and not a dehydrated food like Preference by The Honest Kitchen (carbs and re-hydration again)

Here’s to a healthy and happy life for both Mr Lou and you (it rhymes)!!!!!!!

[Liz W]

Thank you Cyndi for “bumping me up” as you can see if you follow this thread “USA Dog Treats” has given me some very good suggestions and validated what I’ve already been trying to do.
Thanks so much for the suggestions USA Dog Treats! I didn’t realize that even after I hydrate the Honest Kitchen and Kibble well, they could still swell more or cause bloating. Thought that by hydrating the HK the day before and keeping it in the fridge it would be fine. Something obviously was NOT fine and I too have wondered if I didn’t soak the kibble long enough or what. I don’t want to make the same mistake again.
I started back on the three meals a day NO Kibble and NO HK for now… I may have to adjust the amounts as he has some catching up to do but I don’t want to increase the amounts too fast. I think an ideal finishing weight to keep him a bit leaner would be between 110 and 114. That is what I’m going to shoot for. I am presently feeding him about 12 -13 oz morning and supper and a lunch of about 8-10oz. I will adjust the amounts as slowly as I see if he begins to put on weight.
I just introduced frozen fresh green tripe to each meal… so far only about an ounce or two in any one meal. He loves it and I was told it’s extremely easy to digest and will provide all needed enzymes to his stomach. Do you agree?
I haven’t introduced probiotics at this stage as I’m not sure what to try or when… don’t want to make too many changes too quick but he just came off of an antibiotic 12 injection. I’m not sure if that’s as hard on the stomach as taking it orally but I’m sure there is some adjusting that is going on in his whole system. What do you think of using Acidophilus & Bifidus that I keep on hand in the fridge for myself as a probiotic for him?
The meat source I have found here in Canada that I like, is called K9 Choice (www.k9choicefoods.com) They sell in bulk 40lbs which is a bit more affordable for some of what I feed but what I like most is that the balance is right (approx 80/10/10) fat % is also very good and the animals are all raised on their own farm land and are grazing, free roaming and living long lives before they are humanly slaughter in a very non-stress producing, fast, humane way… away from the other animals. I like it that all the animals get to be the way nature intended, not crammed into feedlots/pen or horrible conditions. Although they are not listed as “human” consumption, I have talked to the owner and he said he believes his meat products are far more “healthy” for man or dogs than what is being sold in grocery stores due to the condition and treatment of their animals and the way they are “processed”. I would really like to believe him.
I will look into Steve Browns pre-mix when we travel in the States. I’ve never seen it here in Canada but I will check the website and see if they deliver here. I know Honest Kitchen also makes a premix (same hydrating issue I guess) but they did tell me to rehydrate and then refrigerate and it would not swell in the stomach. It would work for me to just take the pre-mix when I travel and then just add hamburger or what ever kind of ground meat I could get. Something I didn’t think of, so thank you so much for that tip. If I do the premix and ground meat, or on sale roasts!… how much sardines would you feed a 110lb dog? I used to add sardines and then stopped and substituted fish oil tabs that I was taking but couldn’t tolerate. (lousy fishy taste after)
I have never exercised before or after eating… my dogs always have rest periods of an hour or more before or after even if we are only taking a gentle stroll.
Another thing I do think you are right about… he drank too much water after his meal the night he bloated. I am now a fanatic to remove all but a cup of water because he likes to kind of rinse his mouth after he eats. Then I put out about a 2 cup bowl and freshen it up in between meals. I do believe this was another contributing factor to that horrible event.
Yes, the vet did attach the stomach to the rib wall and explained that it should never flip and twist again. He did say bloat however was still a possibility. He also had his spleen ripped away so it had to be removed which I guess is another bad thing that doesn’t always happen. My poor boy.
I did give him a big HUG from you… you are a saint to take the time to help me and encourage me. All I want is for this boy to have a few more good years with us.
Thanks so much for all your help… much appreciated.
Liz and Mr. Lou!

[Lilmonster]

Hi everyone!

Another lurker here eager and (almost) ready to make the switch to raw. Like other newbies, I have so much respect for everyone here for not only committing so much time and effort to their fur babies, but also taking the time to answer endless, potentially stupid questions from nervous dog moms like me! I would never even have known about raw diets, let alone been able to work up the nerve to take the plunge if it weren’t for this forum, so thanks to all of you!

Some background info: My fiancé and I just adopted our little one, Lily, two months ago from a rescue. She’s 41 lbs and the vet estimates her age at around 1, much younger than the rescue thought – her teeth were pretty yellow when we first got her but presumably because she wasn’t given anything to chew on to clean plaque, so they thought she was 2 yrs 8 months (!), which leads me to think she sadly may have been malnourished as a puppy since they were feeding her as an adult. As soon as we gave her bones and chew toys her teeth became pearly white. Anyway, we switched her to Fromm’s Surf and Turf kibble when we got her, but we noticed she started itching more and more. Took her to the vet to ask about the itchiness as well as a suspected UTI, but the diagnosis for the itching was understandably vague. We’re not sure if it’s a food allergy or environmental – she doesn’t have fleas, and we’re pretty sure it’s not a yeast issue. She doesn’t smell yeasty at all and I think the vet would have picked up on that. So after a recent bout of diarrhea due to too many high fat treats after a training session, I figured it would be a good time to begin the transition to raw after her system cleared up. I fasted her for a meal then fed her a mixture of white rice and pumpkin for two meals, which brought her poos back to normal, then began feeding her a 50-50 mix of ground turkey and pumpkin with the See Spot Live Longer mix added in. The vet is holistic and also trained in Chinese medicine, and she suggested that I switch to beef instead of turkey since chicken and turkey is considered “hot” and could be contributing to the itchiness, so yesterday I made the switch to ground beef and her poo was still fine this morning. But then I remembered reading somewhere (I think on preymodelraw) that it’s not recommended to start with beef, but I think for the time being I’ll stick with it just to avoid changing her diet too many times (unless anyone here would strongly advise against starting with beef?). At the moment, her daily food (divided into two meals) is 1 lb 90% lean ground beef + 2 tbsp SSLL + 1/2 tsp hempseed oil + 1 tsp coconut oil (just started adding it) + 1 human probiotic. She is also currently on a one week course of antibiotics for the urinary problem.

I have Steve Brown’s Unlocking the Canine Ancestral Diet, ordered the Dr. Becker’s book, and have read through many of the threads on this forum but like other newbies I’m getting lost in all the information and feeling as overwhelmed as Cyndi was in the thread where she first started, lol. I’m thinking of sticking to the ground boneless meat with the See Spot Live Longer mix for a bit while I figure out all the supplements that are needed and place my meat orders. A few questions that I’d really appreciate if someone could help out with:

– I know you can’t add the See Spot Live Longer dinner mix to bone-in meats, but am I also correct in assuming that if I begin adding RMBs in the PM and continue to feed boneless ground meat + See Spot Live Longer mix in the AM that it would be too much calcium? Ideally I’d like to continue using the SSLL simply because it’s the easiest way for me to not have to worry that her nutrition is unbalanced while I’m still learning to balance her meals myself. I did see the most recent topic mentioning CarnivoreRaw but that’s a bit out of my budget. Hound Dog Mom, do you use the Twinlab Daily One with or without iron? Also, I noticed the Twinlab does have calcium in it, does that not matter because the amount is so low? If I choose to go the multivitamin route, can I then add other things like fruits and veggies and such without worrying about overloading on a specific vitamin/mineral or will I have to be careful with what I add?

– This may be a bit much to ask, but if one of the veterans has the time to respond I would be so grateful. Could someone make a list of the essential vitamins/minerals (or alternatively, foods that will provide those vitamins and minerals) that MUST be added to a diet that consists of boneless meat in the AM and RMBs in the PM, and the approximate amounts? This is the part I’m feeling especially in over my head with. Vitamin D, vitamin E, fish oil, manganese, so many different things I’m seeing that they need, it’s hard to not feel kind of scared to do it all from scratch, which is my eventual goal. I think I’m having a hard time figuring out what is absolutely necessary vs. optional but ideal.

– So from what I’ve read so far it seems to be a good idea to start her on chicken backs and quarters, then begin alternating boneless meat every other meal. How many meals should I feed the backs and quarters before I begin incorporating boneless meals? Also, should I already be giving her supplements during this time, or should I wait until she adjusts then begin adding supplements. As for stuff like organ meats, heart, and green tripe, how long should I wait before beginning to incorporate those? I promise I have read the other threads, but I’ve seen a few different recommendations on timelines so I thought I’d pose the question again just so I can be clear about it.

Thanks in advance to anyone willing to take the time to answer my questions!

[Susan]

Hi Regina, My Patch didnt do good on the Eukanuba tin low residue, I looked up the Eukanuba tin low residue & the Iams Tin low residue & they have the same ingredients, also when I put it in the fridge the next day you’d see the white fat that had hardened on the side & top of the food, the fat is too high at 4.5%.when you converted to kibble fat thats around 21% fat thats high…There’s too many ingedients also in the low residue tin, there’s fish, chicken liver, chicken & beef..Have you tried cooking a low fat meals….I give Patch light Tuna in spring water drained then mix in a bit of boiled pumkin for breakfast, he does real well on the Tuna better then on the boiled chicken breast…also have you looked at the Low fat diets in the review section, look for something lower then 3% fats in wet foods….also you say that Alf wont eat kibble, have you tried soaking the kibble in water to soften, then draining the water off.. I do that with Patches Eukanuba Intestinal kibble & the Wellness Simple Duck & Oatmeal kibble, have you tried adding some low fat tin food or some tuna on top of the soften kibble, to make him eat…..I know when Patch had his gurgling stomach/bowel I’d make him a piece of dry white toast with a little bit of thinly spread honey on the toast & his bowel would stop gurgling & rumbling, its gases going tru his bowel, also Royal Canin make a tin food called (Gastro Intestinal Low Fat) its only 1.75% fat, maybe try the Royal Canin low fat tin food, Ive read a few people on the Dogpancreatitis yahoo group use the Royal Canin low fat tin food with great success…I hope Alfie gets better…but look at the fat % content, it took me 1 year to realise that it was the higher fat% making Patch ill, the stupid vet didnt even realise until I saw another vet that said lower his fat under 9%..I did then Patch started to get better again & no more rumbling & gurgling stomach/bowel..

[magnoliasouth]

Hello all! My daughter works for a vet and can get Royal Canin at an enormous discount. She has her dog on Satiety right now and I have to admit that she’s doing very well on it, despite the ingredients it lists. But that’s not my question. lol!

My dog has severe skin allergies. To be honest, food changes haven’t affected it in the least. I’m thinking she’s actually allergic to grass. Still, the vet wanted my dog to go on the RC Anallergenic food and until now, she had been eating Wellness Ocean Formula.

The problems are the ingredients listed in the Anallergenic food.

Corn starch, hydrolyzed poultry by-products aggregate, coconut oil, soybean oil, natural flavors, potassium phosphate, powdered cellulose, calcium carbonate, sodium silico aluminate, chicory, L-tyrosine, fructooligosaccharides, fish oil, L-lysine, choline chloride, taurine, L-tryptophan, vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol (source of vitamin E), inositol, niacin, L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), D-calcium pantothenate, biotin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), riboflavin (vitamin B2), thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), vitamin A acetate, folic acid, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement], DL-methionine, marigold extract (Tagetes erecta L.), histidine, trace minerals (zinc proteinate, zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese proteinate, copper proteinate, copper sulfate, manganous oxide, calcium iodate, sodium selenite), rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols and citric acid.

How weird is it to have corn starch as the primary ingredient? What exactly is “hydrolyzed aggregate”? I thought corn and mystery “poultry” are allergens?

Now my daughter did ask about the hydrolyzation and was told that it has something to do with processing it to remove allergens. Not sure how true that is.

The thing is that I’m a human nurse. I know full well that just because a vet’s office sells a particular product, doesn’t mean it’s the best product. It’s all in what they get out of it. Sadly a lot of people don’t know this. I swear I think it should be illegal. It’s the same thing as lobbying, which I think also should be illegal. Decisions should be based on opinions, not money. Sorry, I accidentally launched into rant mode… and I digress.

I’ve asked my daughter to speak to the RC sales rep. In fact, this is specifically what I texted her:

Subject: Questions to as your RC sales rep. 1. Why do they use meat by-products? 2. Why aren’t meat products the primary ingredient in any of their foods? 3. Why is a corn product the primary ingredient in the Anallergenic food, when corn is a primary allergen? 4. What does “hydrolyzed poultry by-product aggregate” mean and define “poultry”? If “poultry” means chicken, why is that (also a primary allergen) in the Anallergenic food too? I have more, but we’ll stop there for now. Just tell her I’m not trying to grill, I’m trying to understand and give her a chance to explain it to me.

Perhaps someone here knows the answers already or can make suggestions or whatever.

[tapiskootskiyas t]

Hi Glen B.
As my user name implies, yes I am a musher.
I can only speak from my own experiences so please keep in mind I “ain’t no perfeshnl”.
That in mind, I can see you truly want to honor this responsibility you’ve accepted.
Lotsa KUDOs to you.

I can honestly say tho that as humans we have a tendency to overfeed our dogs and sadly with too often the wrong types of food.
Why???…. because we think they are always hungry.
Not really the case.
I can go around my kennel with 10lb chunks of meat feeding as I go.
If I have any left and any of my dogs see that they will act as they are starving.
They will go so far in their starving act as to stash their meal and go argue with their brother or aunt or…just to try muscle away some more.
I feed fat more only towards fall and during winter. Just raw, unadulterated fat.
Beef, moose, pork, deer, all kinds of foul….you name it.
I use it mainly as a source of heat energy for my dogs.
Matter of fact, I do the same for myself. More butter, fatty cuts of meat, nuts, fish.
And more amino acids. Don’t, repeat Do Not feed raw egg to your dog. It depletes their amino acid levels. 1 scrambled egg per day is great. Yes, in the wild they would eat them if they found them. But they would also instinctively know where and how to increase their amino acids to balance.
I am 56 years young, smoke 1-8 cigs per day, 5’9″ tall, weigh 180, wear sz32 pants(with long johns under) & 44-46 jacket, snowshoe my trails(pack them for my team)…..
I can go on for quite some about my activity level but…
My point is, if my dog seems happy and healthy I would assume he most likely ain’t sick and suffering. Dogs don’t lie.
Also, if the vet couldn’t find worms or any other affliction your dog is most likely good to go.
It takes time to build lean, strong muscle. Fat builds up a lot quicker.
Point in question, I have seen but 1 “over weight” runner in many years following the marathons, sitting on my couch watching the TV, NOT!!.lol
Most chicken today is raised ii intense farming methods. They are butchered young, about 6-8 weeks of age. Older chickens have a higher level of amino acids. Hence the more wholesome flavour in soup made from a worn out layer or an open-range grazed, 6 month or year old.
Most beef are slaughtered on their second year, even if they are “feedlot beef”. Also, yes, beef is higher fat content. Since you get your chicken cheap, maybe ask a butcher for some beef and/or pork fat trimmings. Probably get it free. I do.
My dogs get extreme trotties from milk and milk products. Just about killed a whole team once. “watered” them with watered down baby formula thonking “energy”…. went mushing away in the bush miles from home. If they weren’t loyal to me and follow me, I wouldn’t have had the heart to go on without them…. wouldn’t be telling this big long story to you today.lol
My (approx)recipe for active working dog from 50-80 pounds, daily, in winter 4-7 lbs red meat, about 8-16 oz raw fat, cook 1 tbsp rice(I use WildRice), I cooked egg, 1 tsp raw veg oil, 1/8 tsp doggie vitamins, and always fresh water.
The red meat has liver kidney, heart and lung in accordance with whole animal weights.
Actually, I now feed my dogs whole animal diet. Viscera, epiderma, skeletal, the whole works, including(not excluding much of anything) goose, duck, pork, moose, fish, deer, elk, etc., etc..
Cheaper and easier, and yes, healthier .
However, my dogs are pure northern spitz breeds of sled dogs. For all intensive purposes, practically domesticated wolves.
I won’t and can’t promise all this info will work for Pitbull, but I can ascertain to you that all domestic dogs are 90%-99% wolf DNA.
Please reconsider the raw eggs. It is actually cuts down on the body’s ability to convert food to usable energy, not very healthy for dogs.
Whole raw fish is an excellent diet. Just cut off thorns, horns, barbles form the likes of catfish.
I am truly sorry if my “novel” has bored, offended, angered, insulted, or hurt you in any way.
My intention is to assist other dog lovers assist their dogs to have a healthy, long life.
Please take what you can use.
HAGD
Musher.. out for now

[Hound Dog Mom]

Fish oil is one product in which I don’t recommend trying to take the cheap way out. It’s important to only purchase high quality, human-grade supplements from reputable suppliers – avoid generic brands/store brands. Carlson’s and Nordic Naturals are two very good brands that I have used and would use again. You want to be sure your fish oil contains an antioxidant such as vitamin e or astaxanthin to help prevent oxidation. With the exception of the few companies that use airless pumps, I would avoid fish oil in pump dispensers (the pumps let it air and promote oxidation). Make sure to refrigerate the fish oil and dispose of any unused fish oil after 2-3 months (so in otherwise, avoid purchasing in bulk). I also testing the freshness every week or so, break a capsule open and smell it and squirt a little on your tongue to taste it. If it smells fishy and/or tastes extremely fishy (it will taste slightly fishy) it’s rancid – toss it! There’s also the option of mixing tinned sardines and/salmon into your dogs food for omega 3’s. This is what I usually do.

[LabsRawesome]

Holly, you should use Human grade fish oil for your dog. Human grade is higher quality, and has higher standards than pet grade. Human grade is usually much cheaper too. You don’t want your fish oil to smell or taste “fishy” that would indicate that the oil is rancid. I buy human grade fish oil for my dogs, and keep it in the fridge, to keep it fresh.

[Holly C]

I use Nature Made Fish Oil capsules. I give one capsule (I cut it open and put the oil on the food) in his morning meal with his supplement. Seems to help. Only problem is that it doesn’t taste fishy because it’s for people, so I’ll get generic ones next time. My dog loves fish flavoured anything.

It bothers me that it’s two/three times as expensive at petsmart for special doggy fish oil, and it’s no different. Plus, I prefer capsules to squirt bottles. The bottled ones tend to stink up the fridge after a while.

Should I give more than one capsule to my 55 lb dog? I think one is enough.

[tapiskootskiyas t]

Melissa.
I use a dog team to haul wood, hunt, go to the store. Not because I’m secluded but because I want a small enviro footprint and of course I love dogs.
Dogs are 99% wolf DNA. Dogs are omnivores that are just about 90% carnivore. They ain’t like a bear.. …or a pig.
I have fed my dogs whole carcasses of deer, moose elk, beef, pork, goose, rabbit, you name it, whole fish is awesome, beaver, excellent.
The first thing they(dogs((and wolves))go for is the liver, kidneys, heart and lungs. The dogs then go for the fatty net looking thing around the stomach/s and guts. Of course the dogs ingest some of the plant food matter that is in the digestive tract of.
Sorta the same as when humans eat a salad.
Dogs don’t make up their own amino acids which is why I don’t feed raw eggs to mine.
I had noticed my dogs do not eat about the last 3 feet(in a larger animal)of the big gut (just before the anus).
But they do eat everything else, epecially with deer, moose and the larger wild 4 leggeds but do pretty ell the same with rabbit and fowl.
I decided to look more closely. In the gut the pellets(poop) have a greenish slimy substance on them. The closer they get to the anus the less greasy stuff until all that’s left is the brown pellets.
After talking to the vet that was here at the time, and doing some research in books at the time, that slime is essentiLly vegatable oil, loaded with amino acids. The partially digested plant material…hmph….wow
Vitamin C in the marrow, vitamin B in the brain,…..
A prey has pretty well everything in it that a predator needs to live a healthy life.
Also, a dogs body takes 11 days(or so)to engineer a battalion of enzymes to properly digest a new food which is why several dog food companies as well as a host of dog nutritionalists say to “chip” dogs on to a new food.
My dogs are very healthy.
My old leader ran in front for 14 years from the time he was 1&1/4 years old. He passed away peacefully at the age of 16 human years just before his 17th birthday. He would have 117&1/2 if he was a human.
I like to think it is in part because I had an open mind about diet for 90% carnivore 10% omnivore.
On the other end of the spectrum, I made a foolish mistake this spring thinking I would save myself some time and money and the fact that I am starting to get a little…. umm… lazy will do. I bought 2 pallets of commercial dog food instead of gassing up the truck and cruising the hiways for fresh accident killed dog food. I am 56 and used dogs since I was 6 and for the first time in my life I have witnessed hot spots/sun spots on a dog.
Back to meat for me. LOL…I am still learning.
I hope this unintentional yarn helps.

[Melissaandcrew]

Thanks guys-its bad news, but we are hopeful that she does not show symptoms until much later in life and that through medication(when symptomatic) we will be able to prevent progression to chronic heart failure and she will lead a long ‘normal” life. She has been on fish oil forever due to the first problem, and I am going to add in Co q 10 “just because”

[Naturella]

Betsy,

Yeah, it was his longest diarrhea yet… 4-5 days. He did eat little on Friday, and not at all on Saturday of last week – he may have not felt very good… After that I added plain brown rice with some boiled fish meat – no help. I tried bread (pita is what I had available) and it helped! He had bread for 2-3 days (not JUST bread except for his first feeding – the next were his kibble mixed with THK as a topper and bread). Those helped him keep it all down and not go as often, and gradually firmed up his stool. He has been good since Tuesday, off bread, and on his normal food.

And yeah, we can call and ask the guy, but I doubt he would have noticed… He is not as intuitive with his dog it seems and is kind of like “well, he’s a dog, dogs smell and eat whatever and are fine”… Plus he feeds Pedigree (yuck), no wonder his dog smells… But we could try… I’m just happy he’s over it!

And oh, I really hope his glands don’t get inflamed from the expression and scooting or something, and I hope it is just cause it was a new procedure/feeling for him.

Would you or anyone know WHEN is it a real time/need to get your dog’s anal glands expressed?

[Naturella]

What Sandy said! 🙂
Fish-based food and coconut oil have done wonders for my Rat Terrier mix Bruno’s coat. Also, after a bath, I rub him down with a mix of sunflower oil with vitamins A, D, and E, and olive, coconut, chamomile, avocado, and shea oils. It makes him extra him soft and shiny! 🙂

[pugmomsandy]

You can try switching to a fish-based food (that would hopefully have more omega-3 in it). You can also give a fish oil supplement, or feed sardines a couple times a week, and also give coconut oil.

[Debbie L]

One fact about Ivomec, or Ivermectin, it is not recommended to give it to Collies as it could be toxic to them. I don’t think I’d give it to a dog mixed with Collie either to be on the safe side.

I also give my dogs the little round odorless garlic capsules, as well as fish oil capsules. It is my belief that fleas are developing an immunity to all those chemical flea treatments, and feel that naturally treating the dog from inside out is best.

Coconut oil is said to repel fleas either rubbed on the dog or small amounts added to the food each day. Avon Skin-So-Soft is also reported to be effective against fleas.

[Kim L]

Very long story short, my vet recently noticed a really slight heart murmur in my 17-pound Shih Tzu Lhasa mix. She suggested Krill oil (as opposed to standard fish oil) to help with his heart and his flaky skin.

I currently have him on Horizon Pulsar Fish Formula (very low glycemic as he has issues with yeast). However, as it is a fish formula, I would not want to give him too much fish oil. This is what Dog Food Advisor says about the fish oil already in the food: “The sixth ingredient is salmon oil. Salmon oil is naturally rich in the prized EPA and DHA type of omega-3 fatty acids. These two high quality fats boast the highest bio-availability to dogs and humans.” I have been looking into Dr. Mercola’s krill oil, and it says to give about one pump per 10 pounds. Does that seem excessive with fish-based food, or no?

This may be a silly question, but I just do not want to give him too much if the food already contains some, and also want to be sure that Krill oil is, in fact, better than an omega-3 fish oil supplement. Thanks!

[Melissaandcrew]

I alternate brands and forms, so nothing is ever the same-sardone oil, salmon oil, krill oil-sometimes liquid pump, sometimes capsules on the days I do not give sardines or other fish.

[Zach M]

I have the book, but didn’t know that sardines have a lot of fish oil. I guess it was right there in front of my face lol.

[DogFoodie]

Hi Zach,

Sardines are awesome!

If you haven’t already checked out Steve Brown’s e-book, you should! The download costs $2.95 and is worth every penny. He explains how to add fresh whole foods, including sardines, to supplement and improve your dog’s diet. He refers to it as the ABC method. http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html

Edit: I don’t use fish oil because I have a fish intolerant dog who can’t even have fish oil even though it should be OK because the protein has been removed. If I did use fish oil, I’d try Springtime Natural’s product. I’ve used Mercola krill and it didn’t seem to bother him. I have used Udo’s Choice DHA Blend, a vegeterian product for him.

[Zach M]

Wow guys, you leave for 2 hours and come back to an abundance of answers. Thanks! And a question, do tinned sardines give a proper amount of fish oil? I like the idea of “Sardine Sunday”, C4C! It could become a new tradition out our house too!

[losul]

I give tinned sardines and salmon sometimes, but I also get a bottle of this every 3 months.

It’s way more than 1 35lb dog can use in 3 months, so I use it myself also. I keep in the door of frig and give 1 pump daily, eezy peezy, as Aimee would say, lol.. At 3 months it begins to taste fishy as it peroxidizes, even though it is preserved with mixed tocopherols, so I throw it out and replace. At 4 months it’s most definitely starting to taste rancid.

You can buy a smaller bottle, but it costs almost as much as the large.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 5 months ago by losul.

[weezerweeks]

I use Nordic Natural fish oil ,Krill oil from Mercola and once a month sardine in water.

[Bobby dog]

I try to feed sardines in H2O, but I don’t always keep them in stock. I mainly use CVS drugstores 1000 mg fish oil capsules.

[LabsRawesome]

Hey Zach, I use Costco’s Kirkland Signature. http://www.costco.com/Kirkland-Signature%E2%84%A2-Omega-3-Fish-Oil-Concentrate-1%2c000-mg.%2c-400-Softgels.product.11072245.html If you scroll down in the link I left, you will see the product details. I keep mine in the fridge, because heat and light will degrade fish oil and turn it rancid.

[Zach M]

I was just wondering what kind of fish oils you guys use. Please comment below.

[pugmomsandy]

No, it would not be too much fish with added sardines. Just like it would not be too much chicken if you added some real chicken as a topper for a chicken kibble. As far as the large portions are concerned, that’s where a big freezer comes in handy and a grinder. You could purchase various meaty bones and cases of organs and muscle meat and then use them according to the recipe you choose. X lbs of necks, X lbs muscle meat, X lbs organs, etc. Or you could start with a Premix where you only add in muscle meat (ground chicken or beef or pork, etc) and the Premix and some oil. The Premix has vitamins. When I order by the case, I prefer 2 lb chubs over 5 or 10 lb chubs but I have small dogs.

[Jenn F]

Her weight is good, she is about 80lbs. She was a bit more when we got her, but she did need to loose a few! The “gravy” is hip & joint health with fish oil, since she wont just eat the hip & joint pills like the other 2. But we stopped giving it to her since she apparently doesn’t like it. Her foster had 2 other dogs & she ate with them, no probs & foster mom feed her yogurt & coconut oil (that’s why we tried to feed it to her)! But she does eat a little better when she eats by herself in the kitchen, but she still never finishes it all & its still a struggle to get her to eat.

[theBCnut]

Since I have squeamish people living in my house and they may have to feed, I use raw as a topper, actually I feed about half and half, but I still mix kibble and raw. I know several people who do likewise with no problems. Or you can feed it as a seperate meal.

To use See Spot Live Longer, you can adjust the amount you make as you need to. Two tablespoon of SSLL per 1/2 lb of boneless meat, one tablespoon of SSLL per 1/4 lb of boneless meat, whatever works for you. DHA is in fish oil and if you don’t feed a meal of oily fish once a week, you need to give fish oil.

You can also give raw meaty bones as long as you don’t exceed 20% of the diet with unbalance foods..

[pugmomsandy]

A fat supplement could be a tablespoon or two of olive oil or coconut oil or even fish oil or combo oils. Oils are fat and calories and have over 100 calories per tablespoon. A dry addition just to add overall calories could be Abady’s granular food. It has nearly 800 calories per cup so you could add in a couple tablespoons of that. A canned food high in fat is Nature’s Logic Lamb or Rabbit. They have more fat than protein hence the lower rating (not because it has lots of red colored ingredients). Hound & Gatos canned chicken and pork recipes are also high in fat (40% plus). You can also make some “satin balls” and send it to the trainer to feed.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 5 months ago by pugmomsandy.
• This reply was modified 11 years, 5 months ago by pugmomsandy.

[theBCnut]

It is an issue for dogs too, but cats are more likely to be stereotyped as supposed to be fed fish. And cats can be more sensitive to toxins.

Fish oils are for the omega 3s, I do give fish as a natural source of omega 3s, but you have to give the right kind of fish.

[jakes mom]

Tried the other Freshpet flavor today , beef/chicken variety does not contain fish. The same 2 kitties like it, the others don’t like either flavor, or maybe it’s the texture they don’t like, who knows. On the fish subject, another question. Is it just an issue for cats and not dog food? And why is fish oil recommended in some diets but not feeding actual fish? Does it depend on the type of fish? I know smaller fish are considered safer.

[Vianca V]

InkedMarie, thank you for your suggestion I had been considering the core reduced fat too. As for my rescue, initially he had been diagnosed with a fungus 2 years ago, in may my primary vet decided to put him in a more aggressive treatment in order to finish with his condition, unfortunately it really didnt go well his skin got even more agravated and he became slightly anorexic and lethargic. After a chat with a friend of mine who manufactures natural dog shampoo she suggested I visit her vet. Her vet who really impressed performed a uv light test, a Skin Scraping/Trichogram, and a Skin Cytology. He diagnosed him with staph a bacterial infection, Candida, and allergies. He prescrived Apoquel 5.4 mg, Ku Shen Si Wu, Dandruff Formula 0.5g Caps, Cefpodoxime 100mg, and a antibacterial antifungal shampoo and conditioner. He also like I mentioned put him on Royal Canin Hypoallegenic Small Breed 8.8 lbs, these are the ingredients :Brewer’s Rice, Hydrolyzed Soy Protein, Chicken Fat, Natural Flavors, Vegetable Oil, Sodium Silico Aluminate, Dried Beet Pulp, Monocalcium Phosphate, Calcium Sulfate, Salt, Fish Oil, Fructooligosaccharides, Potassium Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Sodium Tripolyphosphate, Taurine, Chlorine Chloride, DL-Alpha Tocopherol Acetate (source Of Vitamin E), Inositol, Niacin Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source Of Vitamin C), D-Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Riboflavin Supplement (Vitamin B2), Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Vitamin A Acetate, Folic Acid, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Marigold Extract (Tagetes Erecta L), Zinc Proteinate, Zinc Oxide, Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Copper Sulfate, Magnanous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite And Rosemary Extract, Preserved With Natural Mixed Tocopherols And Citric Acid. Wold love any suggestions

[Glen B]

I recently rescued a 7-8 year old Pitbull that is too thin. I had him tested for worms and that came out negative. I think the problem is he runs around outside a few hours a day and would like to try and fix it with diet before anything else. I have no idea how much he weighs right now, but by looking at him I’d guess he needs to gain 10-15lbs.

He’s been on raw for a week. He was looking better on Taste of the Wild kibble, but for the price it was costing a week..it obviously isn’t cost effective.

I’ve been looking at “Satin Ball” or “Fat Ball” recipes in addition to his regular raw. My concern is that by putting grains in with raw meat, wouldn’t I be messing with his digestive system? Is the point of the grains wheat germ or oats specifically just for the carbs? I’d like something like oats since I could just get it out of the bulk bins at the health food store..but will it mess with his digestive system or is it just adding calories? I rather just add some carbs for calories rather than substitute with kibble.

Is it possible to go too high in fat? I’m also adding about 1/2 cup of whole milk yogurt to his food along with fish oils and 2 raw, jumbo eggs with shell a day..since I can get eggs super cheap.

Why do people say beef puts more weight on than chicken? I can get a case of chicken leg quarters much cheaper than I can full fat beef..ground or whole. I’d like to keep this as cheap as possible and am already a member of the local co-ops.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Dawn –

If you’re feeding a balanced raw diet, it’s not necessary to add any supplements. However, there are many supplements that may be beneficial. Probiotics are a great way to support gut health – you can purchase probiotic supplements or mix in some kefir or plain yogurt with his meals. Omega 3’s are a wonderful way to support a a healthy skin and coat, provide ant-inflammatory benefits and support the immune system – you can purchase a high quality fish oil or feed tinned sardines and/or cage-free eggs a couple times per week. There are various nutraceuticals that have various health promoting properties you may want to consider – I personally like to make a “blend” of items such as bee pollen, spirulina, kelp, chlorella, turmeric, etc. Swanson Vitamins is a great site to shop for supplements, I do the majority of my supplement shopping for both my dogs and myself there. They’ve got a lot of great stuff and the best prices I’ve found.

[Bobby dog]

Hi Anita:
Here are the supplements, foods, and products I used (and still do along with some new additions) to get rid of Bobby’s flea dermatitis and yeasty skin. Olive oil flea dip, Nolvasan shampoo, raw eggs, bone broth, unrefined organic coconut oil, sardines/fish oil, MSM, and DE. Not too complicated or costly! This along with a new diet plan that I began last September helped to restore his health.

Dogs with severe yeast issues more than likely need a carb free diet to starve the yeast; carbs feed yeast and bad bacteria. All kibble has carbs because they require starch to bind the food into a kibble form. Your dogs would probably benefit from a grain free and low carb food preferably with no potato. Bobby’s yeast issues were bad, but it was not necessary to eliminate kibble from his diet. I did feed kibble that had low carbs and I only feed kibble that has average to low carbs now.
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2011/05/03/eating-these-foods-can-make-your-dog-itch-like-crazy.aspx

Since September I have fed DFA rated 3-5 star kibble along with DFA rated 3-5 star canned food. After a few months on the new diet, I started alternating canned with fresh foods, dehydrated/freeze dried foods, or frozen commercial raw. By continuing with the supplements, feeding quality food and treats I went into this flea season with a healthy and fresh smelling dog. Fingers crossed no fleas on Bobby and it is rainy and very humid where I live, fleas are in full force.

It is very important not to make too many changes at once; this includes new foods! Start supplements in low doses slowly working towards the desired dose. If everything is okay, add another supplement. As far as shampoos, olive oil flea dip, and applying coco oil topically I used them right away and regularly without any worries because they provided immediate relief and were important for treating the yeast.

For a flea dip I used olive oil (from the grocery store) which has no long lasting effects, just immediate relief for the skin and to kill the fleas without chemicals. I did this outside so I did not have to worry about being tidy. Start under the chin and in the collar area working your way to the back, belly, and leg areas all the way to the tail. With Bobby I would just pour it on then massage it in to be sure his skin and between his toes were coated. His fur is not too thick or long. He loved the massage that came with it not to mention he was not itchy and uncomfortable while it was on him. The fleas pretty much disintegrate. Your dogs’ coats may be heavier than Bobby’s if you decide to try this, be sure to separate the fur, pour a little, and then work it in. I always left it on for an hour letting him run around and play, but you will definitely see their lifeless bodies after a short time so an hour is not necessary. Then I shampooed it off, it is easy to shampoo out; I even use olive oil as a conditioner for my hair.

I bathed Bobby once a week using Nolvalsan shampoo mostly. I always shampooed twice leaving the first application on for at least 10 minutes. I can’t find Nolvasan on-line so they may not make it anymore. Hibiclens or the drug store equivalent has the same ingredients as Nolvalsan. Malasab shampoo is a popular choice and highly recommended by many posters on DFA. I also used EQyss Micro-Tek medicated shampoo when the condition became less severe. You can find Micro-Tek on-line and in some pet stores. With your size of dogs I would look into a large bottle of Malasab shampoo, but in a pinch you could always purchase the Hibiclens or generic equivalent at a drug store.
http://www.drugs.com/vet/malaseb-shampoo.html
http://www.eqyss.com/pet_microtek_shampoo.asp
http://www.vetstreet.com/nolvasan-shampoo

The biotin in eggs is great for the skin and hair. I fed Bobby one raw egg a week. However, he recently decided he no longer likes raw eggs so we have poached eggs on Sundays. He gets a one minute egg and I get a two minute egg. lol
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/feeding-your-dog-raw-eggs-good-or-bad/
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2005/02/09/raw-eggs.aspx

I made bone broth and fed it once a week. I still feed him bone broth weekly; Bobby weighs 44 lbs and I feed him ¼ – ½ C of broth.
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/reasons-your-dog-love-bone-broth/
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2013/12/02/pet-bone-broth.aspx

The coconut oil must be organic and unrefined for all the benefits. I fed it 3x/wk as well as used it topically when needed as a soothing and healing salve; I tried feeding it 2x/wk after his skin healed, but found he benefits most eating it 3x/wk. Previously I bought Spectrum brand from Wal-Mart, 14 oz. for $8.99; they were cheaper than my health food store. I recently found organic unrefined coco oil at my BJ’s, 36 oz. for about $10. So if you belong to a price club, look for it there.
http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/02/coconut-oil-is-good-for-your-dogs.html
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/16_11/features/alternative-treatments-updated_20861-1.html?pg=3
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/the-health-benefits-of-coconut-oil/
http://www.greenpasture.org/public/Products/InfusedCoconutOil/index.cfm

I started out feeding tinned sardines packed in water once a week, but I failed to keep it in my pantry on a regular basis. So I switched to a fish oil supplement. You can find many good fish oil supplements for dogs on-line and in pet stores. I used CVS 1000 mg fish oil tabs 3x/wk and I still supplement his diet with it. Tinned sardines packed in water would be the healthiest choice. I tried cutting back to 2x/week, but he developed a little dandruff so I am now back to 3x/week.
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_12/features/Fats-Chance_20658-1.html
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_9/features/Fish-Oil-Supplements-For-Dogs_20600-1.html
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2009/06/13/the-frequently-missing-ingredient-in-your-pet-s-diet-that-could-devastate-their-health.aspx

MSM helped to relieve and heal his itchy skin. MSM has other benefits that may be helpful for your dogs as well. I use only100% pure MSM powder with no fillers or flavorings. You can find pure MSM marketed for dogs on-line and in pet shops.
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/msm-raw-fed-dogs/
http://www.vetinfo.com/msm-for-dogs.html
http://www.natural-dog-health-remedies.com/msm-for-dogs.html
http://essentials4all.org/100__Pure_MSM.html
http://wolfcreekranch1.tripod.com/naturvet_msm.html

I also used DE as a flea powder and for treating his environment. Some posters use garlic to repel fleas. Here’s some info:
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/garlic-for-dogs-poison-or-medicine/
http://www.springtimeinc.com/product/bug-off-garlic-dogs/All-Natural-Dog-Supplements
http://www.enonvalleygarlic.com/About_Garlic.html

Homepage

I was not fully aware of the important benefits of probiotics for our pets. I now feed kefir twice a week to Bobby for the probiotics. This would have made a tremendous difference with the healing process if I had used it during his skin/flea issues; if I only knew!
Probiotic info:
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2010/10/26/advantages-of-using-pet-probiotics.aspx
http://probiotics.mercola.com/probiotics-for-pets.html
http://www.medicine4animals.com/23/Does-Your-Cat-or-Dog-Suffer-with-Digestive-Problems,-Skin-Problems-or-Poor-Immunity.html
http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/05/foods-rich-in-probiotics-beneficial-for.html

ABC diet:
This is a download I highly recommend; it is $2.95 and worth every penny! I feed the ABC diet now throughout the week rather than in one meal. This is an easy way to enhance any kibble diet with fresh foods. I found this download after Bobby’s issues were cleared up, but I definitely would have followed it during that time. I believe it would have helped with the healing process.
http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html

I recently started giving Bobby unflavored beef tendon and beef trachea chews. Here’s some healthy treat suggestions:
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/02/10/easy-to-make-pet-treats.aspx

[RescueDaneMom]

Hi Kate,

In theory, the Grandma Lucy’s pre-mix (once meat is added) should be a complete and balanced meal for your dog. You shouldn’t need to worry about other supplements though adding krill oil or fish oil can be beneficial. You can also add kefir, yogurt, or raw goats milk for probiotics.

Primal’s recommendation of feeding 2-3% of body weight is for raw food which is less calorically dense because of the amount of water in raw food. I don’t think the 2% rule carries over to dehydrated food like GL’s. I would feed the amount of food that keeps your dog in the right weight range. Feeding guidelines are just that…guidelines. Some dogs need more or less than what is suggested. It’s going to be trial and error to see what the right amount for your dog is.

I know finding a food your dog will eat has probably been very frustrating but I would keep at it. It’s best to rotate whatever food you are feeding, in this case the pre-mix. I would suggest rotating between different pre-mixes to make sure all of your bases are covered with vitamins/minerals. Some other pre-mixes you could look into include: The Honest Kitchen Preference, Urban Wolf, See Spot Live Longer Dinner Mix, and Sojos (though I’m not a fan of that one). Also, I would limit the amount of tuna you feed as it can have high mercury levels. Canned sardines in water with no added salt would be a good fish to use and it is naturally high in omega 3s. Canned salmon is also good.

I hope this helps.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi OnyxMom –

All of TOTW’s foods are too high in calcium for a large breed puppy, including this formula.

Personally, I would recommend avoiding foods that contain fish and instead adding canned sardines or salmon, cage-free eggs or high quality fish oil to the food for omega 3’s. The processing which the meat meals undergo to be made into kibble and the storage time very likely leaves the omega 3’s in kibble rancid by the time the food is consumed.

[USA]

Yes, I am pretty much going to describe the treats that I make. I am proud of them and they ARE what I consider an almost perfect dog treat. Why almost perfect? Because there are two types of dogs I would be CAUTIOUS of feeding my treats. They are dogs who have dehydration issues and dogs who have phosphorous related kidney issues. Why? because my treats are under 10% moisture and they are about 80% protein.

Don’t worry about this being spam I only supply ONE local pet store and if I made more they would take more!

The treats should be one ingredient, MEAT. There is no need for any flavorings, or ingredients needed to hold the treat together or anything like that.

QUALITY counts. Since I have been making treats I have learned a lot about the pet food industry. I would never use any pet grade ingredients and that includes marketing terms like:
Made from USDA inspected (insert meat here). Yes it was inspected but did it pass? Was it inspected on the way into the USDA facility but failed to make it through the USDA facility?

I learned that it all comes down to economics. If a piece of meat whether it be poultry, beef, fish, pork or whatever COULD be sold in the human market IT WOULD! Why, economics. If something could be sold in the human market for 1 dollar a pound it will NEVER find it’s way into the pet food market at 19 cents a pound. It’s simple economics, nothing else.

That’s why the treat I would look for would be Human-Grade and have been made every step of the way in the human food chain. In other words human edible. Almost every treat maker and dog food maker uses the terms USDA something or other.

Complete transparency. I wold never feed my dog anything I could not trace back all the way to the farm where the animals were raised. What they were fed, how they were housed and so on.

I don’t subscribe to the notion of TRADE SECRET or PROPRIETARY. I am an animal lover and I would be thrilled to know that my openness and transparency enabled YOU to make a homemade treat for your dog using MY recipe. I never believed that openness would hurt your company and I always felt that a company that made a truly high quality product would be PROUD of that product and happy to share with you the details that PROVE that it’s true and not just a marketing strategy.

Sample example of an acceptable treat
Chicken Jerky :
100% Whole chicken dehydrated at temps between 140 and 170 degrees F or freeze dried. No added ingredients other than a functional treat which could add DHA or Fish Oil or Turmeric or something like that. A properly made piece of jerky will last years without any refrigeration or preservatives.

Chicken traceable to the source. Human grade every step of the way.

Made and sourced in the USA.

A fat content below 10% for muscle meats and below 20% for organs. To show they didn’t use trimmings.

A protein content no lower than 70%. Again to show that they are using whole pieces of lean meat or Organs. Also because MOST dogs eat a diet that is low in meats and high in carbs (IMHO) so I would only want to add high protein meats to their diet.

[Mom2Cavs]

I sometimes give fish oil, but tend to feed a fish based food instead because Laverne gets loose stools if I add too many oils. COQ10 is a supplement that is good for the heart and also gums. I give both made for human and dogs. The dose is usually 1 mg per pound. Right now I have on hand 10 mg capsules and 30 mg capsules that are fine to give. The 10 mg are vetri science for dogs and the 30 mg I ordered from Swanson’s. I have also given heart supplements for dogs that contain other good things to give like hawthorn, taurine, l-carnitine. Some brands I have used are vetri science cardio strength, thorne bio-cardio, nature’s farmacy heartwise. I am going to order some chews from Ark Naturals that are from their gray muzzle line for the heart soon to try.

[Jean Ann]

Hello and THANK YOU for the reply, Mom2Cavs. Lily’s vet suggested grain free, but I’ve looked on Chewy.com and found the Wellness Toy Breed which is rated 5 stars. It has ground brown rice, ground barley and oatmeal, but no corn or corn gluten. So it wouldn’t be grain free but it would be without the corn, corn gluten and wheat.

I’ve been feeding a little Merrick grain-free canned on top of my Cavaliers’ dry to help make the fry a little better, but all three of my Cavalier are voracious eaters, so no worries about appetite. Their dry was Victor and Iams Veterinary Formula because Dr. Jones doesn’t like too much protein, so I mix the two to keep the protein down. My Cavaliers get Carlson’s Fish oil, about 1000 mg, twice daily. It has made a huge difference in their heart health. Piper (6 years old) was diagnosed at 2 yrs. of age with early onset MVD, stage 0, and she actually improved at her 3 yr old check up. Maintained ever since. Presley has the same but with irregular heartbeat, and his checkups at 2 years old and at 3 were great… maintaining well. Do you give your Cavaliers fish oil?

I would like to hear about the CoQ10, though. Is it for people like my Carlson’s and you give it to your dogs? What strength, etc? Thanks again for your kind reply!
Jean Ann

[Jean Ann]

Cardiologist Dr. Charla Jones (Austin, TX) sees my Cavaliers, and she says the high protein, grain free dry foods are too rich for my dogs. Too much protein is hard on the kidneys, etc. Also, my dogs tend to gain weight on it (bad for their hearts); their normal weights range from 17 to 19 lbs. The other dry foods that are not rated well. My Cavaliers get very high grade fish oil twice daily and are doing beautifully heart-wise. Limited ingredients have about 21% – 24% protein and doesn’t taste very good, but they’ll eat it.
Also our 6 month old, 7 lb grand dog, Lily, gets dark gunk in her ears when eating the Victor dry and she started having congestion and a wet nose wheeze when on Merrick grain-free, but that could be seasonal allergies, I guess. At a loss as to what to feed her.
We fed Muenster organic for years. NEED HELP Any help out there?
Many thanks, Jean Ann Jones

[Leslie R]

I have read your reviews and the lack of positive review on the Royal Canin brand. I did not find the Satiety one reviewed but am guessing the ingredients are all comparable within the brand. My vet recommended this food after my dog got extremely ill (rushed to the hospital ill) on a grain free food I food highly rated on this site. He was hospitalized for 2 days. He had also gained a couple of pounds so she put him on Royal Canin Satiety two years ago and he is doing very well at 11 yrs old. He gets 1/2 cup in the morning and for dinner he gets Dr Harvey’s Freeze Dried food ( lots of veggies, oats, etc) with a teaspoon of oil, pumpkin and a cooked protein (switch between chicken, turkey, fish and eggs.) He hates raw meat and vegetables.
I don’t want to worry about the Royal Canin but feel concerned when I read your reviews. Am going to show this site to my vet but wanted your thoughts. He has some arthritis and some benign lipomas but is otherwise in good health with a clean coat and energy. Good appetite. Does take synthroid twice a day but this has been for a long time. Comments?