Maybe it's time for a diet change?

Dog Food Advisor Forums Canine Nutrition Maybe it's time for a diet change?

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  • #43916 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Awwwww, try getting some on your hands! I rub coco oil (the same I feed, rub on them, and put on my toast or in my coffee) on my hands in the winter before I go to sleep. I get real bad chapped skin because I never wear gloves. Bad to the point of bleeding expecially my cuticles. lol And don’t forget to try some on your toast! But, feeding him some will be good for him too. 😉

    #43917 Report Abuse

    I’ll follow your posts and see how the new food and shampoo helps. I may order the Malaseb. It has really good reviews everywhere it’s sold.

    #43921 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    And one other option for moisturizing his skin is to try the olive oil moisturizing/flea dip treatment I use before you give him a bath. You don’t have to leave it on for as long as I do. I do that because I incorporate it with barn or yard work and I don’t have to be neat about applying it when I am outside. The oil kills them pretty much instantly once it comes into contact with them. You could even apply it in the tub right before his bath, leaving it on for a few minutes until you see their lifeless bodies. lol Just be sure you apply it to his entire body (except his facial area) starting at his neck working your way to his tail if you do decide to try it. 🙂

    #44119 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    Bobby Dog, you underestimate our super fleas. Dawn dish soap doesn’t even kill them! I may try an oil dip after a while once I see how this shampoo is working though. Which seems to be pretty good right now, actually. After just two baths, his skin is less red, and he’s itching less. We have an other bath data for tonight, which I’m sure he’ll be just thrilled about :p

    I’ve also been adding some coconut oil to his food, as well. Makes it look even more gross, since I make his food the night before it’s used, and reheat it before I feed it to him LOL It’s like greasy, confused jello XD

    Also, the canned food should be here today or tomorrow, I think. I’ll start him on two days of canned, one day of THK, when it does, since the canned food is 1/2 can a day. Get a good rotation thing going, and keep it interesting.

    Also, since I’m cutting out carbs as much as possible and giving him weird mushy food and such, I need to find him a chew that won’t count as a meal (so no raw right now. Later, though). I used to give him a Greenie a few times a week when I left and no one else was home to give him something to do for a few minutes while he was locked up (which is why I don’t want to do raw– his small size would make any raw yummy a meal and I won’t be home to clean up after he’s done), so I need something else. Obviously, chews are out, since they are like entirely grain and starch products. I was thinking raw hides, though. They shouldn’t have carbs, right (in theory lol)?

    #44120 Report Abuse
    arwyru24
    Member

    Just stumbled upon this convo and I am so glad that I did. Thank you for the heads up on the by nature Bobby Dog, I think I am going to give them a try next month, because this last month I ordered all foods that I really can’t afford to be feeding every month lol.

    #44121 Report Abuse
    arwyru24
    Member

    Our breeder has been issuing major warnings about issues/side effects with Trifexis. I know it is possible with all such medications but she was adamant that we not use that one. The dog we have gets Vectra 3D and the cats used to get Revolution, however the last time I used it my sensitive skin guy lost the fur that was at the application site. So I asked my vet and he said it sounded suspicious so I am switching them to Activyl. They are indoor only cats so ticks and other nasties aren’t as much of an issue as simply avoiding a flea infestation. I had a choice of Activyl or regular Vectra but I have read that Activyl is the safer of the two, although buying from online sources is really suspect so I only get that stuff through my vet.

    #44124 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hey Akari:
    You’re right, I must be underestimating your superfleas! I have never have seen a flea survive a good dose of shampoo during bath time before. They always die fairly quick while I bath Bobby no matter what shampoo I use. I even use a soapy water dish to kill fleas when I flea comb. Most of the time they never make it to the water, they just die trying to get out of the suds.

    Well try the oil, I am not a scientist, but to me it looks like the oil breaks down the outer shell because they just seem to fall apart in front of my eyes in very little time. If nothing else, he will have a moisturizing treatment!!!! 😉

    I was giving Bobby rawhides last month until Labs forwarded info to me about the chemical process used to make them. I am looking into other stuff for him to chew on since RMB’s don’t interest him. If I were you I would incorporate RMB’s into his diet when you are home and able to watch him. Maybe in place of a meal or just reduce one of his meals. Since you know he likes them, does well eating them, why not make it simple plus it gives him variety.

    Sharon:
    I forget how I came to my conclusion, but I will look at my info later and catch up with you on the catfood thread. I do feel certain I have tracked down the co-packer. Of course it still makes me apprehensive that they won’t share this pertinant info with customers; what else won’t they share when necessary?

    #44145 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    I know about Trifexis and the problems it’s been causing. Unfortunately, it’s the only thing that works for fleas around here. Like I said, super fleas. Haley has no reaction to it, and Bentley used to get sleepy on it when he first started, but after a few doses, he now does fine on it. When he was on it, and the fleas weren’t biting him, his hair grew back. Now that he’s been out for several months, and the fleas are back in full spring time force, he looks terrible.

    However, my coworker just bought a box of Comfortis (the flea-only Trifexis), and her dog just started having seizures after never having them before. From what I hear, they are pretty mild and there are symptoms that show the dog is about to have one, so they see pretty controlled. I don’t know if she plans to take her dogs off it or not, though I should hope so.

    Bobby dog, the only way our fleas die in soapy water is if I’m flea combing for them and some hair comes off in the comb, and I rinse it in some soapy water. The fleas are stupid enough to cling to the hair and drown after a few minutes. Common flea meds don’t work here anymore, which is why I’m pretty much stuck with Trifexis, though I did hear about that new Activyl, and plan on checking into it. I’m also hoping my generic Program (Little City Dogs brand) works well, because it’s cheap, and there are no side effects at all ever reported. I don’t really like how rigorous Trifexis is, but the fleas are so bad here that it’s necessary. Thankfully we’ve been lucky so far…. But I have a new plan for Haley at least when she’s done with this box in few months. As bad as it sounds, Bentleys medications are not my problem. I’ll give mom the info, and even do all the work, but I will not pay. I’ve got my own dogs and etc’s to pay for. What she does is up to her at this point.

    I do plan on raw bones, but I want something I can give him when I’m leaving the house for a few hours. Something that isn’t a a hard glob of chewy carbs and chemicals lol

    #44146 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Is Sentinel an option? The Vet Tech gave me some info on Activyl the last time I took Bobby in, I never looked into it because I changed HW meds. I agree the older flea chemicals don’t seem to work anymore.

    I have been looking at a few different chew options for Bobby, I’ll pass the info along to you when I can find them. I got a little frustrated researching chews, there seems to always be a caveat with everything. lol Do you ever worry about accidents leaving your dog unsupervised with bones, chewies, dental bones, or rawhides?

    #44148 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    I did recently give Bobby a beef trachea to chew on which he enjoyed. I haven’t really looked into them like a should though.

    Suggestions for chew treats from http://www.daneangelnetwork.org/rawhide.htm:

    The following products are all digestible and safe for your pets.

    Budda Chew Products- all digestible chew bones and treats

    Muscle Chews- all digestible, contains no hide product.

    Bull Pizzle Chews- all natural alternative to rawhide.

    Healthy Edibles- all natural health chews, completely digestible and contain no sugars or fillers. Available at http://www.drsfostersmith.com

    Kong rubber products are great chew toys, which can keep dogs very busy, especially when a little peanut butter and dog biscuits are wedged inside for them to work out.

    #44152 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    I forgot, in my Chewy order I got a few days ago I also ordered a Merrick beef tendon. Bobby really liked it and it kept him busy for about an hour. You can probably find them in pet stores if interested.

    http://www.merrickpetcare.com/consumer/products/product.jsp?id=67&page=0&view=list&sort=category_3&order=asc&name=Doggie_Wishbone_Tendon_Treats&categories=Dog-Treats-Natural Chews&age=All_Life_Stages

    #44153 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    I’m also from Florida, the flea capitol of the world and the only bathing technique that I’ve found that kills fleas is to thoroughly wet the dog and use tons of shampoo so I end up with a very foamy dog and then I let the dog go play while still foamy for 10-15 minutes, while I suds up the next dog. After letting the shampoo sit for 10-15 minutes, the fleas have drowned and I rinse them off.

    The problem is that while this kills all the fleas on the dog, it does nothing for the fleas in the environment, and we have plenty of those down here.

    #44156 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Just looked at the Dr.’s Foster & Smith Healthy Edibles, I am going to pass on those. They contain some ingredients I like to avoid feeding Bobby.

    #44543 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    I am not sure if Bentley has seen his Vet for diagnosis yet, but I read this article posted by HDM with some interesting info on yeasty dogs. Maybe you want to reconsider giving Bentley honey due to its sugar content and try bee pollen instead. If he has a yeast condition this could be why you saw initial improvement then nothing; the sugar from honey feeds yeast.
    http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2011/05/03/eating-these-foods-can-make-your-dog-itch-like-crazy.aspx

    #44801 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    Bobby, I don’t know how this got past me lol Thanks for the video! I sent it to mom, since it’s everything I’ve been telling her the last couple weeks.

    And I remember you asking about how me ordering dog food at WalMart went. It actually went very well! The lady we talked to was actually very nice (wow, a nice employee at WalMart??) and she ended up finding a whole case in of PB 95% Chicken in the back for me. She even said I could order a case for myself if I ever went back in and the shelf was empty again (I managed to dig all the way back to the wall and found a can of chicken hiding in all the beef and chicken and rice ones, and took it up to customer service with me, and they called her to find me more). So go give it a try! 🙂

    #44825 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hey Akari:
    I am very jealous of your Wal-Mart experience. I just spent the afternoon there today, lol. First I stopped at my local pet shops for sales and to use my Wellness & Holistic coupons. My fav pet store gave me 10 lbs of samples, yeahhhh! By the time I made it to Wal-Mart I was pretty well stocked up. I did find they had the Beef stew and the Turkey & Chic 95%, which mine normally does not stock; they always have all the chicken recipes. I went through self checkout and forgot to scan my coupons. I had to go to customer service. There was only one employee taking care of a line of five people. Finally she called for help. So I had my fill of Wal-Mart, but I am going to ask someone again next time I go! 🙂

    Then I went to TSC to stock up on horse feed, dog and cat food. They sent through a 10% off everything coupon. They were completly wiped out of 4Health for cats, ugggggggh!

    Tomorrow I am heading to Pets Supply Plus to use my $5 off $20 coupon. They sent through an e-mail coupon for 1/2 off Cali Nat’l, Evo, or Innova dry dog or cat food. After these shopping trips, if they don’t eat what I have, they will starve for the next month. lol

    I am glad you saw the post! Every now and then I come across something that I find interesting and I think might help (I hope it’s not too annoying! lol). Anyway, I also stumbled across some flea prevention info that might interest you as well. I believe it would be a less costly way to administer the same products you have chosen for your dogs recently for flea meds, but it will also include HW preventative.

    #44840 Report Abuse
    zcRiley
    Member

    Hi Akari 32! I know it’s frustrating & expensive when your precious pooch has signs of a miserable existence. I’ll be very brief as I want to throw out FOUR key items to attack and most importantly resolve the origin of the problem. Spend the money, keep the routine simple (stop adding things), be patient for results. Malaseb Shampoo. The Miracle Pack (Probiotic Miracle & Enzyme Miracle for a healthy digestive system). Brothers Complete Advanced Allergy Care (Dry Dog Food). As a reminder, a lot of raw food or canned food is NOT a “complete” diet, which in turn you have to start adding things (more money). Maybe you can save some money for a full blood work panel testing in the near future if all else fails. I wish you & your pups the very best of luck.

    #45134 Report Abuse
    Anita L
    Member

    I am SO glad I found this convo! I live in AL (I am definitely seeing super fleas…ugh!) and am having the same problem with my 2 dogs. 1 is 55 lb aussie/blue heeler mix and the other is 100 lb lab mix. They are both miserable. I have been using Benedryl to help their itching, knowing its only temporary (and everybody needed some sleep). I have been working on the food and trying to deal with the yeast aspect as well.

    So here’s my question:
    Akari32, When you say you will be treating your home and yard with DE, what is DE? (probably a dumb question and something I should know, but I am so overwhelmed with all of this right now, I can’t even think of the simplest things). I have really benefited from following your “adventure” and BobbyDog’s helpful suggestions. THANKS to you both!

    Also, Zolicylus, I have recently started on the Miracle Pack (one step in the right direction) and this is not the first time I’ve heard about using Brothers Complete Advanced Allergy Care. I have come SO close to buying it but keep holding out. Right now we are using Nutrisca Salmon & Chickpea. I’m seeing a switch in the near future. So THANK YOU!

    #45143 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    Not Akari, but DE is diatomaceous earth.

    #45160 Report Abuse
    Anita L
    Member

    Thanks for all the info BCNut and BobbyDog!

    I will definitely be going to TSC tomorrow for the DE.
    Our 55 lb Aussie/Blue Heeler (Gazpacho or Spocho) mix is the one that is having the worst reaction with the fleas (hot spot and hair loss -wise). Doc said she is allergic. He put activyl on her and said don’t bathe her for the next 3 or 4 weeks. But she has no hair on her butt (baboon butt)! He also gave her a shot for the itching. That was Friday and today, Mon, she is itching horribly. So now I am realizing about the house, the yard, the bedding, etc. We do not have carpet (hate it!). Actually we have slab right now due to water damage, ugh! But we do have a rug in the den and a rug in the bedroom. The rug in the den is a shag rug! I am dreading treating it but I know I have to. Any suggestions on this?

    Spocho is also 9 years old and has trouble with her hips. The DE sounds like it would help her greatly! I am thinking that I will add it to the other supplements (Miracle Pack) which I give in plain yogurt. They love it!

    On the treats, I do have some milk bones, marrow bones and raw hides left. I’m thinking I need to quit being cheap and throw them out. I have done so much research on the food that I haven’t gotten to treats and don’t even know where to start. Suggestions?

    On the food, my pups only get kibbles (the quality kind). Now I am wondering if I need to add a canned food (quality kind of course).??????

    I will also be picking up the medicated shampoo and the p/i sounds great too. I have coconut oil that I use already (on my skin, my hair, cuts/scrapes, and the list goes on). I tried to put it on Spocho’s butt once and it def seemed to soothe her right away, but a few mins later she was licking it off….is that normal?

    I’m also thinking of adding coco oil to their supplements. What would you recommend on this? How much and how often?

    Sorry for so many questions. I appreciate any answers!

    #45193 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    Work DE into the rug. It’s supposed to work on all kinds of bugs.

    Coconut oil is 1 teaspoon per 20 lbs of body weight. Start with a small amount and work your way up to the whole amount. They like the taste so don’t be surprised if they lick it off of their skin when applied topically.

    #45195 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hi Anita:
    I will sort through your questions and add some links to the over the counter remedies that I used to completely heal Bobby! Remember, all dogs are different. Bobby had no health issues other than flea dermatitis, flea infestation, bad diet (please remember, anything they eat must be quality ingredients, it really makes a difference), and yeasty skin.

    It sounds like you already have been to the Vet and there are no other health issues?

    Did the Vet give him a steroid shot for the itching?

    I really suggest feeding canned with kibble. Moisture is really important for healthy dogs and especially important for dogs that have some health issues. I always feed kibble with canned or fresh meat lightly cooked, or dehydrated, freeze dried or frozen raw for every meal. If you are going to TSC for DE, check out the 4Health canned dog food. It’s 99 cents/can and DFA rated 4.5 stars. I feed 4Health, Pure Balance from Wal-Mart ($1/can for stews and $1.25/can for 95%), and Earth’s Pride ($8.99/6 pack) from BJ’s as my main canned rotation.

    4H DFA review:
    https://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/4health-dog-food-canned/

    4H TSC link:
    http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchDisplay?storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&langId=-1&pageSize=&beginIndex=0&searchSource=Q&sType=SimpleSearch&resultCatEntryType=2&showResultsPage=true&pageView=image&searchType=1002&autoSuggestURL=AutoSuggestView%3FcoreName%3DMC_10001_CatalogEntry_en_US%26serverURL%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252ftsc-prod-lb01.crossview.inc%253a3737%252fsolr%252fMC_10001_CatalogEntry_en_US&searchTerm=4health+wet+dog+food

    I was wrong; you can buy 20 lbs of food grade DE for $12.99 at TSC. They carry it in the livestock feed section.
    http://www.tractorsupply.com/product__10151_-1_10051_2789

    Check out the Activyl site to see what they say about bathing your dog. Most products are waterproof, but you never know. The Vet Tech at my Vet’s office gave me info on it, but I never checked it out after I settled on Sentinel because it already had the flea egg killer in it and I want to use as little chemicals as possible.

    For treats, stay away from carbs or anything sugary, it will only feed the yeast. I have never fed them, but posters here recommend The Honest Kitchen Beams. I haven’t fed treats from the pet store recently and find many have carbs and starches so I just make very, very small meatballs for Bobby (I freeze them) using 2 lbs of ground beef, an egg or two, fresh garlic, tumeric, and I add fresh basil, cilantro, or parsley if I have it. I also throw in any veggies I have, but if you decided to make something like this I would leave the veggies out for now. You can also slice meat as thin as you can and place the slices in the oven on the lowest temp and cook until they are like a jerky consistency.

    It is not unusual for them to try and lick off the coco oil if they like it. It is a wonderful product and is good to feed and apply to skin irritations due to its antiseptic properties. Just try to supervise your pups so it can soak in, it really will make them more comfortable and the fleas don’t like the oil.

    Probiotics is an important step to get their immune systems back on track too! Probiotics has helped my cat tremendously. I use plain Kefir or plain greek yogurt right now for him. He has grown hair in places that I thought would never come back! That is another story. I think you will see a tremendous improvement within a week of using probiotics with their coats and skin.

    Everything that I used on Bobby you will find at Wal-Mart, drug stores, health food stores, on-line, or pet stores very easily. I will post tomorrow what I used to help Bobby and hopefully something or several things can help your guys as well.

    #45286 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hi Anita:
    Here are the supplements, foods, and products I used (and still do along with some new additions) to get rid of Bobby’s flea dermatitis and yeasty skin. Olive oil flea dip, Nolvasan shampoo, raw eggs, bone broth, unrefined organic coconut oil, sardines/fish oil, MSM, and DE. Not too complicated or costly! This along with a new diet plan that I began last September helped to restore his health.

    Dogs with severe yeast issues more than likely need a carb free diet to starve the yeast; carbs feed yeast and bad bacteria. All kibble has carbs because they require starch to bind the food into a kibble form. Your dogs would probably benefit from a grain free and low carb food preferably with no potato. Bobby’s yeast issues were bad, but it was not necessary to eliminate kibble from his diet. I did feed kibble that had low carbs and I only feed kibble that has average to low carbs now.
    http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2011/05/03/eating-these-foods-can-make-your-dog-itch-like-crazy.aspx

    Since September I have fed DFA rated 3-5 star kibble along with DFA rated 3-5 star canned food. After a few months on the new diet, I started alternating canned with fresh foods, dehydrated/freeze dried foods, or frozen commercial raw. By continuing with the supplements, feeding quality food and treats I went into this flea season with a healthy and fresh smelling dog. Fingers crossed no fleas on Bobby and it is rainy and very humid where I live, fleas are in full force.

    It is very important not to make too many changes at once; this includes new foods! Start supplements in low doses slowly working towards the desired dose. If everything is okay, add another supplement. As far as shampoos, olive oil flea dip, and applying coco oil topically I used them right away and regularly without any worries because they provided immediate relief and were important for treating the yeast.

    For a flea dip I used olive oil (from the grocery store) which has no long lasting effects, just immediate relief for the skin and to kill the fleas without chemicals. I did this outside so I did not have to worry about being tidy. Start under the chin and in the collar area working your way to the back, belly, and leg areas all the way to the tail. With Bobby I would just pour it on then massage it in to be sure his skin and between his toes were coated. His fur is not too thick or long. He loved the massage that came with it not to mention he was not itchy and uncomfortable while it was on him. The fleas pretty much disintegrate. Your dogs’ coats may be heavier than Bobby’s if you decide to try this, be sure to separate the fur, pour a little, and then work it in. I always left it on for an hour letting him run around and play, but you will definitely see their lifeless bodies after a short time so an hour is not necessary. Then I shampooed it off, it is easy to shampoo out; I even use olive oil as a conditioner for my hair.

    I bathed Bobby once a week using Nolvalsan shampoo mostly. I always shampooed twice leaving the first application on for at least 10 minutes. I can’t find Nolvasan on-line so they may not make it anymore. Hibiclens or the drug store equivalent has the same ingredients as Nolvalsan. Malasab shampoo is a popular choice and highly recommended by many posters on DFA. I also used EQyss Micro-Tek medicated shampoo when the condition became less severe. You can find Micro-Tek on-line and in some pet stores. With your size of dogs I would look into a large bottle of Malasab shampoo, but in a pinch you could always purchase the Hibiclens or generic equivalent at a drug store.
    http://www.drugs.com/vet/malaseb-shampoo.html
    http://www.eqyss.com/pet_microtek_shampoo.asp
    http://www.vetstreet.com/nolvasan-shampoo

    The biotin in eggs is great for the skin and hair. I fed Bobby one raw egg a week. However, he recently decided he no longer likes raw eggs so we have poached eggs on Sundays. He gets a one minute egg and I get a two minute egg. lol
    http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/feeding-your-dog-raw-eggs-good-or-bad/
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2005/02/09/raw-eggs.aspx

    I made bone broth and fed it once a week. I still feed him bone broth weekly; Bobby weighs 44 lbs and I feed him ¼ – ½ C of broth.
    http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/reasons-your-dog-love-bone-broth/
    http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2013/12/02/pet-bone-broth.aspx

    The coconut oil must be organic and unrefined for all the benefits. I fed it 3x/wk as well as used it topically when needed as a soothing and healing salve; I tried feeding it 2x/wk after his skin healed, but found he benefits most eating it 3x/wk. Previously I bought Spectrum brand from Wal-Mart, 14 oz. for $8.99; they were cheaper than my health food store. I recently found organic unrefined coco oil at my BJ’s, 36 oz. for about $10. So if you belong to a price club, look for it there.
    http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/02/coconut-oil-is-good-for-your-dogs.html
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/16_11/features/alternative-treatments-updated_20861-1.html?pg=3
    http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/the-health-benefits-of-coconut-oil/
    http://www.greenpasture.org/public/Products/InfusedCoconutOil/index.cfm

    I started out feeding tinned sardines packed in water once a week, but I failed to keep it in my pantry on a regular basis. So I switched to a fish oil supplement. You can find many good fish oil supplements for dogs on-line and in pet stores. I used CVS 1000 mg fish oil tabs 3x/wk and I still supplement his diet with it. Tinned sardines packed in water would be the healthiest choice. I tried cutting back to 2x/week, but he developed a little dandruff so I am now back to 3x/week.
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_12/features/Fats-Chance_20658-1.html
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_9/features/Fish-Oil-Supplements-For-Dogs_20600-1.html
    http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2009/06/13/the-frequently-missing-ingredient-in-your-pet-s-diet-that-could-devastate-their-health.aspx

    MSM helped to relieve and heal his itchy skin. MSM has other benefits that may be helpful for your dogs as well. I use only100% pure MSM powder with no fillers or flavorings. You can find pure MSM marketed for dogs on-line and in pet shops.
    http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/msm-raw-fed-dogs/
    http://www.vetinfo.com/msm-for-dogs.html
    http://www.natural-dog-health-remedies.com/msm-for-dogs.html
    http://essentials4all.org/100__Pure_MSM.html
    http://wolfcreekranch1.tripod.com/naturvet_msm.html

    I also used DE as a flea powder and for treating his environment. Some posters use garlic to repel fleas. Here’s some info:
    http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/garlic-for-dogs-poison-or-medicine/
    http://www.springtimeinc.com/product/bug-off-garlic-dogs/All-Natural-Dog-Supplements
    http://www.enonvalleygarlic.com/About_Garlic.html
    http://www.allicinfacts.com/

    I was not fully aware of the important benefits of probiotics for our pets. I now feed kefir twice a week to Bobby for the probiotics. This would have made a tremendous difference with the healing process if I had used it during his skin/flea issues; if I only knew!
    Probiotic info:
    http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2010/10/26/advantages-of-using-pet-probiotics.aspx
    http://probiotics.mercola.com/probiotics-for-pets.html
    http://www.medicine4animals.com/23/Does-Your-Cat-or-Dog-Suffer-with-Digestive-Problems,-Skin-Problems-or-Poor-Immunity.html
    http://ottawavalleydogwhisperer.blogspot.com/2012/05/foods-rich-in-probiotics-beneficial-for.html

    ABC diet:
    This is a download I highly recommend; it is $2.95 and worth every penny! I feed the ABC diet now throughout the week rather than in one meal. This is an easy way to enhance any kibble diet with fresh foods. I found this download after Bobby’s issues were cleared up, but I definitely would have followed it during that time. I believe it would have helped with the healing process.
    http://www.seespotlivelonger.com/home/sll/page_41/see_spot_live_longer_the_abc_way___electronic_down.html

    I recently started giving Bobby unflavored beef tendon and beef trachea chews. Here’s some healthy treat suggestions:
    http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/02/10/easy-to-make-pet-treats.aspx

    #45287 Report Abuse
    crazy4cats
    Member

    Hi Bobby Dog’s mamma-
    I hope Anita comes back to get all of that great information. I am definitely going to print it and give to my sister. She is having a terrible time with one of her dog’s skin and hot spots. Thank you!

    #45300 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hey C4c:
    I hope she comes back too! I also hope some or all of this info can help your sister’s or anyone’s dog for that matter. Also, be sure to print out my previous post about DE and the post with the link for using povidone/iodine solution to clear up yeasty skin for your sister. I did not use the pov/io solution because I did not know about it, but that would have definately speeded up the process of killing off the yeast!

    It was nice to resolve his issues without harse products. As I wrote, Bobby was healthy other than the flea infestation, flea dermatitis and yeasty skin. I contributed to the problem with bad diet choices. Once the food/treats changed and supplements were added the rest was a little more time consuming, but worth it! I just had to make time to use the olive oil flea dip once a week, give him a bath at least once a week, use the coco oil topically daily, use DE when needed topically, wash his bedding weekly, and vacuum daily. I started this routine last September. Using the olive oil dip wasn’t necessary past October and bathing weekly tapered off in less than a two month span and settled to about 2x/month until about February. And I am a little embarassed to say I have not bathed him since March; I do brush him weekly. He is getting a bath this afternoon because I have some visitors coming tomorrow. lol My persistance to rid him of his feas and yeasty skin paid off because I have so much time to do other things this summer, well I just don’t know what to do with myself!!!! 😉

    #45301 Report Abuse
    arwyru24
    Member

    So much great info here Bobby’s mom, thank you very much, I have been really interested in coconut oil

    #45309 Report Abuse
    crazy4cats
    Member

    Funny! I just bought my first small jar of coconut oil yesterday at Fred Meyer. I have to be careful not to eat too much of it myself! It’s yummy and expensive! I see now that Costco’s big tub is a great deal. I wanted to start off small to see if I liked it first though. Now, I have to figure out how much to give to the spoiled dogs. LOL!

    #45311 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    I know what you mean! I love the taste of it and could probably spend the day trying to figure out what to put it on next. I have some nerve complaining about how Bobby loves it! lol He goes nuts when I open the cabinet I store it in and he knows the sound of the lid opening.

    When I was buying some flowers from a local farmer this spring a lady was talking about how she started adding coco oil to the chocolate she used to make her homemade Easter eggs. You know I interupted that conversation to find out how much she added to her chocolate! 😀

    #45318 Report Abuse
    Susan
    Member

    Hi, how much Coconut Oil would you give an 16-17 kilo dog thats about 37lbs????? & is the refined oil the best????? Ive written it down somewhere.. Also Patch has Diarrhea problems, vet saying IBD.. he hasnt had no diarrhea since last December after a food change, do I introduce him to the coconut oil so slowley, he’s starting to smell like a yeasty stinky dog..Im thinking he never had the yeasty smell last winter, so Im thinking maybe the banana & toast that he gets of a morning is causing the over yeast growth ..I started the toast as he has bad reflux in the morning, the toast keeps his chicken & pumkin down, Ive stopped the chicken as new vet is thinking he may have intolarences or allergic to the chicken, Im crossing my fingers & hoping it is the chicken thats making him ill of a morning…Thanx

    #45324 Report Abuse
    crazy4cats
    Member

    Hi Sue-
    I just found an article in the dogs naturally magazine that recommends 1/4 tsp coconut oil per 10lbs body weight twice per day. Hope this helps.

    #45326 Report Abuse
    zcRiley
    Member

    ANITA, all this fantastic advice & info, huh? In case you’re overwhelmed, you can also reverse your process of elimination by eliminating everything plus all treats except for the Miracle Pack (start that with tiny tiny increments). My own pooch couldn’t wait for trial & error awhile back, I stopped everything cold turkey. Stopped the shots, the meds, everything. It was cleansing time.

    START WITH: Nature’s Variety Instinct Turkey Meal Formula (Dry). It has ONE protein & does NOT contain grain, gluten, potato, dairy, eggs, chicken, beef, or fish (half of which feeds yeast/allergies etc). , just add 1/4 cup of water to your portion for moisture & the correct amount of the Miracle Pack). And absolutely nothing else. No treats. Hard to do? Yes, it is. Will your dogs survive? Yes, they will. Then you graduate to Brothers Complete Advanced Allergy Care dry food. You’ll see the ingredients & know what you just “added”. Then move on to grain free treats only.

    No oatmeal anything shampoo (feeds yeast). If medicated shampoos give an allergic reaction, try Aroma Paws Rosemary Tea Tree (Yeast & Bacteria Healing Formula), it’s all natural. There’s a matching spray, too.

    Trifexis is the best (fleas). Comfortis is good but not for ticks.

    And lots & lots of clean water to drink. Good luck with whatever method you choose!

    #45331 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hi Sue:
    Along with C4c’s answer to your question you will find on page four of this thread in my June 25, 2014 at 2:14 am post there are four links to info on coco oil that will interest you. The answer is yes, in order to receive all the wonderful benefits of coco oil it must be unrefined or virgin organic coconut oil. Hope it helps your pup and I hope he loves it as much as me and Bobby do! 😉

    #45335 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    Just an update on Bentleys new routine:

    His hair is growing back, and he’s very noticeably less itchy. I keep meaning to get some whatever/iodine stuff, but when I get off work, the only thing on my mind is getting the heck outta there lol But I’ve been using that shampoo from PetFlow. Says to use it a few times a week for a month, then once a week after that. Do you think it would be ok to rotate through three different types of medicated shampoo? I’ve got some ProSence Allergy and Itch Shampoo in addition to that Vets Choice and whatever that Pet Flow stuff it.

    But he loves his new foods (having quality issues with the PB right now, so he’s gotten raw for the last couple nights lol). Mom keeps insisting that he’s starving, and keeps feeding him treats and junk. I’m ready to kill her. Come to find out, she’s been feeding the cat as well. Not only does that screw my rotation up, but it wastes the food because he doesn’t eat later when he’s supposed to! She may come up missing…. Anyways, Bentley just needs to adjust to his new diet before I change how much I’m feeding him. Right now he’s getting a half can a day. I do think I’m gunna have to up it to 2/3 to 3/4 after a while. He has a bunch of raw treats, so I’m gunna try to avoid upping his canned, and just fatten him up on raw treats. We’ll see lol

    Also, he’s starting to get tear stains. There is nothing I hate more on a dog than tear stains. I don’t think you understand I hate them lol Hopefully it’s just a detox thing from dry to canned, but if it persists, I won’t be happy.

    #45338 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Akari:
    That’s great to read!!!!!! 😀 Just stick with the shampoo from Petflow, it is clearing out the yeast on his skin. It contains the ingredients to kill off the yeast, unless you have some Malasab or Nolvasan (or the equivalent of Nolvasan from the drug store) on hand. The other shampoos you mentioned before have oatmeal or don’t have anything to kill the yeast and will just dry out his skin.

    Treating the outside is as important as the food that goes in!!! Try to get the point across to your mom that she is contributing to his condition by feeding food that helps the yeast grow. It should be easy to convince her now since his hair is growing back! You are doing what is helping him, no carbs just protein.

    And I read about your meat shopping spree! I am going to lobby my local grocery store to carry more raw meat choices for Bobby! haha I am jealous of your store’s selection.

    #45339 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    Ok, I’ll use that for now.

    She doesn’t care. She still feeds him candy, or bread or some crap, and then when I yell at her for it she says “you only live once! You still eat ice cream don’t you?” I may be allergic to milk, but it doesn’t give me a nasty, fully body skin infection. My stomach just hates me for a few hours. Big difference, there, ******. She also refuses to pay for the $50 worth of food and shampoo I bought I for him, and went off at me last night for me not having any money. “I’ll pay for his food when he’s eating what I want to feed him.” Whatever. When I don’t give you the money for my bills that are under your name because I have to feed your dog, don’t come crying to me.

    That particular store carries a lot of weird meats. There’s a large population of Ukrainians, Russians, and Haitians, etc, around here, so that Publix orders in lots of meats they use in there cookings. The one I work at, down the road, doesn’t get anything fun in, though I’m sure they could. I’m more sure how other companies work, but just ask you never know :p

    #45340 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Akari:
    One more thing, I know I have written that I haven’t tried the pov/io solution that Dr. Becker recommends, but I definately would if Bobby ever gets yeasty or has some skin condition in the future.

    I was thinking about how she demonstrated apply it. Growing up and working with horses all my life you come across some nasty tempered ones that would just assume kick you in your head than let you help them get better when they are injured. You always end up brainstorming about better and easier ways to treat an ill tempered injured horse.

    Sometimes, depending on what I am treating, I use a spray bottle to apply pov/io solution to my horses and that is probably how I would apply it on Bobby. I would still mix it as Dr. Becker recommends. I would apply the solution outside so I didn’t have to worry about cleaning up, then dab any excess off with a moist cotton towel, and let the solution dry on the dog outside. Remember to use a towel or wash cloth you don’t care about because the iodine will stain.

    #45341 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    That’s a tough one Akari. I commend you for taking care of the little guy without your mom helping or supporting your effort. She still might come around as he continues to heal. It would be difficult not to see you are making a difference in his health since not only is fur growing again, but he is physically more comfortable because his skin is not itching so much. Keep positive thoughts. ;D

    #45342 Report Abuse
    Anita L
    Member

    WOW!
    Just…
    WOW!

    Y’all are ALL awesome!

    Yes, this is all a lot to take it at one time. So I started a document where I could copy and paste and put it together by topic and sort it all out (or at least attempt to). I will definitely only be adding (or subtracting) 1 thing at a time. Right now, with the Miracle pack, good food and no treats, we’re already making positive steps and some improvement. I’m SO thankful I found this site and all of you!

    I have stopped the bad treats that I have on hand. They will be going in the garbage.
    The food they are getting is grain free. That has been in the last couple of months. I have still been working on which grain free doesn’t have the garbage…..Zolicylus, I like that you said start with NV Instinct Turkey Meal then transition to Brothers.

    I’m still pondering adding the canned food as a topper…..I’ll have to remember to check the carbs in those.

    On the Miracle Pack, that has been gradually stepping up to the correct dosage over the last couple of weeks and I can tell a big difference this week.

    Sun or Mon, I was reading some of the links Bobby’s Mom posted about the Po/Iodine. I was making a mental note to go buy some and then realized I may already have it. I checked my first aid supplies and I DID have it. I was doin’-a-lil dance. I used it on the hot spots expecting Spocho to run. As soon as I layed that warm wash cloth with Po/Io solution on her, she just relaxed. It was awesome! She hasn’t been eating at it as much and the skin is looking better. One small step…..

    I read something about soaking their feet in “Detol Antiseptic lotion” and then washing with Malaseb Shampoo. Exactly what is “Detol Antiseptic lotion” and where would you buy it (if at all)? The pups are now down to just chewing their feet (sometimes legs) and scratching their neck and ears. I have some tea tree hydrosol for the their ears, but was wondering about those poor feet.

    As for the yeast…..I know all too well about it…from personal experience. When I learned, after having my daughter (now 7) that we both had yeast, I researched to the hilt to find out as much as possible and anything natural. One thing that helped us the most was a 1:10 vinegar solution on the yeast (showing on the outside); wipe with the vinegar solution, let air dry, then do an anti-fungal cream (rotating creams). Would it possibly help to soak their feet in the vinegar solution (instead of the Detol), then wash their feet….say in between baths?

    The definitely always have clean water to drink whether they’re outside or in (mostly in now b/c of heat)…spoiled babies! LOL

    Bobby’s mom, I did look at the activyl site and it said it was ok to bathe them after 24-48 hours. So Malaseb Shampoo, here we come! Hot Oil Treatment too if I can get help!

    Coconut oil: definitely going to have to learn how to distract after applying it topically. Bobby’s mom, I’m glad you said that about checking the price club stores. We have a Sam’s Club and they have it! For SO much less than what I’ve been picking up at WalMart (hell on earth…IMO).

    Bobby’s mom, it took me a while, but I was determined to check out all the links you posted. Great information. At least I feel like I have more of a plan now instead of taking “a stab in the dark” over and over. I downloaded the ABC e-book but I have not had a chance to read it. But I will be in the next few days.

    I swear it has taken me 2 hours to put this together…pups want out, pups want in, daughter needs something, husband needs something, laundry, oh wait! cats are hungry too….LOL

    And speaking of cats, now I’m realizing how I need to change their food and add probiotics, etc. Bless their hearts! It’s mother and daughter and they are old: 12 and 13. I don’t want them to be miserable for their last years. They still bring me prizes to the door…mostly birds.

    This is all I can think of for now. I will be continuing to follow this post and will also update with results.

    I just can’t say how wonderful it is to find ONE place like this for help! THANKS!!!!

    #45343 Report Abuse
    Susan
    Member

    Hello Bobby dog, I’ve just been reading those links, Ive found a few un-refined coconut oils, but what is cold pressed mean, does it mean its not hard or is it white & hard like lard, also what’s a few good eating brands, I know Im in Australia we mite have the brands, Ive been reading how Coconut oils helps with digestion & kill bacteria..Also I’ve read about buying a proper fresh coconut & cutting it open into pieces & letting the dog chew on the coconut as the shell cleans their teeth..but I’ll just try the oil for now also buying coconut pieces & using as treats are also good, would that give a dog diarrhea. I want to stop Patches little pieces of banana of a morning & I was thinking a little piece of coconut instead of banana.

    #45344 Report Abuse
    Anita L
    Member

    Keep your head up Akari! Sounds like you’re doing great! You got this! 🙂

    #45345 Report Abuse
    Akari_32
    Member

    How much is the coconut oil at Sams, and how how much do you get? Since both these creatures like it, I’ll be buying a larger can next time. I just bought the little can to start with, and it was like $4 for maybe 12 oz. Seems expensive… Lol

    She’ll get over it eventually. There’s a disease in my family that involves not listening to me. It’s pretty contagious, but thankfully Karma comes around and takes care of it. She’ll be buying the iodine stuff this weekend. She just doesn’t know it yet 😉

    #45346 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hi Sue:
    I have no experience feeding fresh coconut to dogs, but I have read about it and it sounds interesting, might try it in the future.

    Cold pressed is what you are looking for, that is the best process of making the oil so it retains all of the healthy benefits. So you might see, cold pressed, unrefined, or virgin on a label.

    As far as brands, I only use organic and I have bounced around many different brands such as Nutiva and Spectrum. I have just settled on the brand sold at BJ’s (my price club) because it is so much cheaper than Wal-Marts price. Basically look for organic and a label stating it is unrefined, virgin, or cold pressed and you should be good to go.

    Anita:
    A few things about the info I posted. The treat recipes I posted by Dr. Becker are fine except I would only make the whole meat treats, not the recipes with potato flakes, veggies, or fruits. Or you could probably make those recipes minus the potatoes, veggies, or fruits. For now focus on feeding protein not carbs. The same for the ABC diet; If you decide to add healthy foods to the kibble your feeding, I would skip the veggie and fruit additions for now so you don’t keep feeding the yeast.

    By the way, Steve Brown, author of the ABC diet, is very popular around DFA and you may want to check out his other books along with his website. I have not fed any of his products or read anything other than info from his website and the ABC download so I cannot recommend anything other than to check him out.

    I don’t know what Detol Antiseptic lotion is. If I were in your shoes I would make a pov/io foot bath for them, easy enough since you already have it! Nothing to loose if it doesn’t help.

    As far as canned food goes, I highly recommend it over kibble as most do on this site, but it just isn’t in my budget to feed my dog only canned. Canned food is more species appropriate as well as provides extra moisture. If budget isn’t an issue with you I also have many other 5 star brands I have fed if you want to give it a try.

    Here is a link to the GF Potato free kibble thread on DFA for some kibble ideas. I believe if you keep reading other posters have mentioned some more brands in addition to the initial list.
    https://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/forums/topic/grain-and-potato-free-dog-foods/

    I add a 1/4 t of organic ACV with the mother to each meal for Bobby. I did not start this because of his skin issues, but for his acid indigestion issues; it worked wonders for it. I also use it for my acid indigestion. After researching it I also found it has benefits for the skin as well.

    I also have used a vinegar rinse on Bobby to help relieve his itchy skin, he seemed fine with it and it helped. I did it once or twice in the beginning and kind of forgot about it because his health improved pretty quickly with the routine I had established.

    Here’s some info I saved about ACV:
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/2_6/features/5220-1.html
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_01/features/Pet-Uses-Of-Apple-Cider-Vinegar_20435-1.html
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_01/features/Pet-Uses-Of-Apple-Cider-Vinegar_20435-1.html?pg=2
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_01/features/Pet-Uses-Of-Apple-Cider-Vinegar_20435-1.html?pg=3
    http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_01/features/Pet-Uses-Of-Apple-Cider-Vinegar_20435-1.html?pg=1

    Come on over to the other thread us cat lovers hang out on “cat food recommendations.”
    https://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/forums/topic/cat-food-recommendations/page/36/

    Akari started the cat thread too! It is a pretty big thread so you may just want to jump in and ask questions. It would take a while to read everything. Also, we all recommend catinfo.org and littlebigcat.com for cat sites. catinfo.org is my bible for cat care. You will learn alot about food on that site.

    #45347 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Hey Akari:
    I love our lady Karma! 😉 Glad your okay because you are making a difference for the little guy!!!! I know budget is always on both of our minds so remember if you need more shampoo and can’t find Malasab in stores, check out the drug store versions of Nolvalsan shampoo or Hibiclens. That will treat the yeast as well. You have a little guy to bath and ordering just shampoo on line isn’t worth the shipping. Hibiclens even offered coupons on their website. 😉

    #45353 Report Abuse
    theBCnut
    Member

    Hi everyone

    If you are using the Pov/Io, you need to know that it leaves the skin much more sun sensitive and they can burn easily, so if you apply it outside, you need to keep your animal(horse or dog) in the shade. For an animal that stays outside, it should be applied, allowed to work for 10-20 minutes, then rinsed off thoroughly.

    Sue

    Good coconut oil turns solid when the temp is under 75 F. If you want it to be liquid for mixing in food, put some in a smaller container that you can run hot water over.

    #45360 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Thanks BCn, excellent tip! I will definately remember this if I ever need it for Bobby.

    When I use it for my horse it’s for hoof infections and after the application I apply a wrap or a boot, so I never worried about the weather. My T-bred gets bad abcesses about once every five years. He used to be prone to them more often but regular use of CleanTrax has helped a great deal.

    #45362 Report Abuse
    Anita L
    Member

    Good to know BCn. Thanks!

    #45363 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    C4c:
    I know this is not an issue for your dogs now, but did you happen to read any of the MSM links I posted? What I found interesting is the mention of MSM being used for it’s anti-parasitic properties against roundworms, giardia, and some other worms. Here’s one link with a mention of it:

    http://www.natural-dog-health-remedies.com/msm-for-dogs.html

    I love MSM and first used it regularily for my horses as a joint supplement and for their skin and coats. One of my horses is in his mid 30’s so every now and then I need to up the dosage to to relieve pain/inflamation for the “old man.” Now Bobby and the cats get it too.

    #45364 Report Abuse
    crazy4cats
    Member

    Bobby dog-
    Yes, I have seen that benefit from MSM. I read hundreds of articles on remedies for Giardia when my previous vet gave up and said that my pups would just be carriers. Also, that they would write me a note if I needed to have a clean fecal test in order to board our dogs. He went on to tell me that I still could bring them in public where other dogs would be. I absolutely did not want to spread that parasite to anyone else. I don’t go to that vet anymore. So, I used every remedy that was suggested or that I read about and got rid of it. I think I read on the Springtime website that their garlic granules contained some natural MSM. Which of course I immediately liked.
    Thanks for the heads up as I still have a little anxiety over getting those pesky parasites back!

    #45366 Report Abuse
    Bobby dog
    Member

    Garlic does have natural MSM.

    What a nightmare! And on behalf of this dog owner, thank you for being responsible and considering the threat of spreading it to other dogs. I wouldn’t go to that Vet either.

    The only time I had a dog with something contagious was when I suspected my JRT of having kennel cough. When I called my Vet she asked me if I was okay with her examining her outside. I didn’t mind (nice weather), but I didn’t realize how contagious it was. She said since it was an emergency she wanted to see her right away, but didn’t want to put her other patients at risk. It was a packed office and she had several emergencies that day and disinfecting everything would take time away from other patients. She didn’t have it thank goodness, but that day made me think about irresponsible owners that don’t take precautions and put other pets at risk.

    #45370 Report Abuse
    Anita L
    Member

    Akari,
    At Sam’s it’s BetterBody Foods Organic Extra Virgin Coconut Oil (56 oz) for $14.98.

    Bobby’s Mom,
    Again…WOW!
    I have checked out the links and love them. Can’t wait to get over to the cat site. I read a piece of it the other day and am very excited!

    I have the food list (GF Potato Free). Money is an issue. We are a 1 income family (by choice) but I finally decided to suck it up on the dry food and re-arrange a few things to make that work. Now, I’ll be looking for ways to make the canned food fit in that budget. I have your list from earlier.

    My other question on the canned food is how much to give them? Is it on the can or are there other suggestions? Considering I’m using it as a topper….

    On the ACV…..I have a personal problem with it. A few years ago, I had a major soar throat that wouldn’t go away and felt like it was coated with fuzzy/fluffy stuff. So, in my infinite wisdom, I made this concoction “to help” (I did NOT want to go to the doctor for their steroid and antibiotics that I didn’t think I needed) of ACV, touch of ginger and cayenne, and honey and then I chugged it…..Until the next day, I just wanted to throw up! All I could taste was the ACV. I was so miserable. So I now laugh at myself (especially since I made and drank about 5-6 oz instead of 1-2 oz….more was NOT better! LOLOL)…but I still cringe at drinking ACV. But I will keep it in mind for my pups. 🙂

    One last question….just to clarify. I figured out about refined coconut being best and that refined was the same as virgin. So is extra virgin good as well…just extra refined? I’m thinking yes b/c I want to say I remember one of your links to the one you use was extra virgin. But I want to make sure….especially before I buy more today.

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