[GSDsForever]

With loose stool problems like you’re describing, I will give a dog a something like cottage cheese and white rice, bland & highly digestible, for a few days. (You could also use boiled plain chicken breast for the protein.)

That usually will clear up whatever is going on. And it allows the dog’s system to recover. In fact, often you will not see the dog produced stool for a day or so, and then it will be minimum. Make sure the dog has sufficient water, whenever a dog has diarrhea (or vomiting).

I really doubt that your dog needs the specific Iams food, but that mix of foods from 2 Wellness products and Orijen (why the mix?) may not be right for your dog. Try a single recipe blander, simpler, moderate in protein & low to moderate fat diet for a bit. You need low residue, which is just another fancy way of saying highly digestible, but it doesn’t have to be a specific formula & brand with that in the title or be a vet diet. Watch the treats too.

Do not overfeed, underfeed until you get it right, divided between two meals a day (no free feeding), and watch to make sure your puppy does not eat too fast. Do not play/exercise/walk/have excitement for your dog within 1-2 hours of feeding, backwards & forwards. Feeding should be during a time of calm & rest.

A tablespoon of all natural plain yogurt, with live active cultures, can also help with problem stool/digestive upset.

It’s good that your vet gave probiotics, as the antibiotics destroy beneficial bacteria. I don’t typically jump right away to antibiotics and would encourage you not to do that either. They are overused, cause problems, and rack up your vet bills unnecessarily.

[Naturella]

Just 3?!?! OMG! This is hard! LoL.

I may have to say, almost the same as C4C’s – raw eggs (MAYBE with lightly cooked whites if I have a bigger dog in the future, but for Bruno it wouldn’t make too much of a difference so I feed the whole egg raw), canned sardines including their water/juices (mmmmmmm, Omega Fatty Acids… ), and RMBs (gotta keep the teethsies clean 😀 ).

But if I could include more, there would be raw virgin unrefined COCONUT OIL (sardines are probably better, hence they made the cut, as they not only have the Omega FAs, but are a meat protein, with some bone for calcium, if I’m lucky a little fish organ left in there too), yoghurt/kefir, goat milk, canned food, dehydrated/air-dried/freeze-dried foods (I’m squishing them in one category), raw organ meats (livers, gizzards, kidneys, HEARTS, tongue, green tripe, whatever I can get my hands on. Yes, I know the heart, the tongue, and the gizzard are muscles. I count them toward the organs.), various fruits and veggies as treats (not in the kibble), and as needed canned plain pumpkin, Perfect Form, and maybe plain brown rice and boiled chicken for extreme tummy upsets.

[GSDsForever]

Yes, of course — digestibility and good absorption of nutrients and such, unless . . .

*there is a substance put in there specifically to harden & shrink the stool as found in even some crappy formulas made by smart companies to appeal to customers, or

*nondigestible plant material is included in big quantities, either from large quantities to fill up a dog in a weight loss diet or to supply other nutritional benefits (but usually good brands will just limit the amounts in this case)

I remember Wellness’s Yogurt, Apple, & Banana Well Bars (treats) being very well liked by the dogs and producing GIANT stools — probably from high percentage of whole grains & fiber in them. We miss those treats, as they smell great!

• This reply was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by GSDsForever.

[Meghan M]

To second GSDsForever, I emailed Sammy Snacks asking about ethoxyquin and here is the response I got:

“Thank you for your interest in our products. We pride ourselves on providing the highest quality of pet food and treats available on the market at an affordable price. As part of that we hold all of our mills to higher standard than most brands. We provide all of them with clear and concise list of what ingredients are not allowed in our products (of which ethoxyquin is one). We also provide them with a list of suppliers that we don’t allow to sell them ingredient that are included in our products. All of them must agree to these requirements or they would no longer make our products. I also don’t trust anyone else when it comes to the Sammy Snacks and Ancestry brand, that is why we order tests on all of our product. One of the many things that is tested for is ethoxyquin. All of our proteins and fats are preserved with vitamin E (sometimes called tocopherols).

I hope this helps and please feel free to contact us with any more questions.

Thanks,
Matt Frey
CEO
Sammy Snacks Inc.”

I may eventually add this food to my rotation. The only issue I had is the amount of Omega 3s listed. Her current food (Infinia) has a minimum of 0.3%, while the Ancestry has only 0.4%. I’m not sure if that makes it a lower-quality food compared to some of the others, but I did note the other brands had much higher levels: Zignature at 1.0%, Wellness CORE at 0.8%, Victor at 0.7%, and Legacy at 1.4%.

I also looked up Timberwolf’s dog food, and really liked the Wilderness Elk Platinum, the Black Forest Platinum Grain Free, the Ocean Blue Platinum Grain Free, and the Lamb & Apples Platinum Grain Free. I hadn’t heard of this brand before, so I’m glad I was introduced to it!

I found a store nearby that sells Victor, so I think I will start with this food based on the recommendations, along with the fact that it is the lowest protein level out of my top 3 favorites. As long as my dog does well on this for awhile, I’ll see how she does with Wellness CORE, Legacy, and possibly Zignature.

I did have a question, either specifically for GSDsForever, or for anyone who can provide input. You talked earlier about how processing is imperative for digestibility and nutrient preservation. Do you know of any dog foods (either that I have already listed, or outside brands we haven’t discussed) that have good processing techniques and gentle cooking methods?

Again, thank you all so much for your input! I feel a lot more confident about my choices – it is still overwhelming though, because there are so many options! I’m just glad that I’ve narrowed the options down to a few, and I guess now it is just a process of elimination to see how she reacts with some foods versus others.

[GSDsForever]

Allergy & Food: I would try a single novel protein/novel carb source diet, including restricting all treats (can only be that protein/carb).

This needs to be something your dog has never eaten before, ideally both the meat/protein source and the carb(s). You feed this a long while and other monitoring (you and your vet), then slowly add back in one protein at a time. You see what makes the symptoms disappear in your dog.

Heartworm Preventative: There are only so many active ingredients effective in heartworm prevention. Heartguard would have the same ingredient as Iverhart, Ivermectin. Your other option is the main active ingredient in the formerly made Interceptor, which now only is available with other anti-parastitics in the formula.

You do need to use one of them, as heartworm is very deadly & brutal on a dog.

You can also have the main active ingredient compounded for your dog at a compounding pharmacy, in whatever form and flavoring/inactive ingredients (in case of severe allergy to what you’ve already tried) and exactly custom to the weight of your dog.

Dry skin & shampoo/conditioner — Please see my thread I already started on that topic here, asking for help.

[Dori]

I’m looking forward to seeing Sugar in your avatar. Even if you’re on a windows machine you can still go to gravatar.com and sign up and then they’ll walk you through the steps to post picture. I just can’t walk you through it because I’m on a Mac.

As to the foods that I feed, they are all commercial raw foods from companies that I like and trust and all three girls have done very well on all of them. I feed all three girls the same meals. I also rotate proteins within the brands and I also rotate with different brands. All proteins with the exception of any and all poultry (fowl) regardless of how or where it is listed in the ingredients. Nothing with feathers because Katie is highly intolerant. These are the companies I feed.

Primal Formulas Raw Frozen and Primal Pronto Raw Frozen and sometimes Primal Freeze Dried
Vital Essentials Raw Frozen Foods and sometimes Vital Essentials Freeze Dried
Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw Food Only
Answer’s Detailed Raw Frozen
OC Raw Frozen
Nature’s Logic Frozen Raw

Once or twice a week I split a can of sardines in water with no salt (from grocery store) between the three girls.

For treats I give them small pieces of organic (if available) fruits and veggies. Apples and cucumbers must be peeled because they carry a lot of bacteria and are waxed to make them pretty for us. Make sure to not feed any seeds or pits from any fruits as they are toxic to dogs. Of course as I’m pretty sure you already know, no raisins, grapes or onions.

If you want any more info, please ask.

[Melissa M]

I just wrote a whole long post and I lost it! My female did eat this morning but my male refused. He is hungry though because he drooled while I ate my toast! Very stubborn little guy! My female has nice formed stools this morning which she hasn’t had in a while. That was nice. They both have some deadly gas though! It’s new to their tummy’s so it will pass–literally! My male will not get any treats today (crossing fingers here–one look and this mommy might cave) so hopefully he’ll eat his dinner.

I do know that dry food isn’t much better for their teeth but I just don’t like the wet. My neighbor’s dog is strictly on wet and boy, her breath could kill you!! I just don’t like the look of it and I can already see my two dog’s expressions on their little faces like, you expect me to eat that?? Remember, these two are unfortunately used to eating human food probably more that kibble so they need to be broke of that habit! Slowly, but we’ll get there I hope!

[Beverly D]

Hi Dori, Thanks much for info. Yes, we always bring her food that she has eaten for years, and her same treats. Not sure why things would change so drastically after 7 years. She has boarded here since a pup, her groomer is there, as is her vet. Do you or anyone out there have any thoughts on the various raw dog foods? I have been doing some research and this was mentioned as a possible way to go. We have been giving her probiotics, and I am s-l-o-w-ly thinking (or maybe I am just THINKING I am seeing) that I see a change for the better. Very frustrated. Appreciate your help!

[Dori]

Beverly D. I’m wondering if you know whether they gave her a different food. I’m assuming that when you board your dogs you brought enough food for them. Also, do you bring them water also or are they drinking the facilities water. Maybe their water system needs to be checked. Too much chlorine or fluoride in the water if it’s city water. If well, maybe too many minerals. One of my dogs is a Maltese and a couple of years ago when I boarded her she came back with reddish tear stains, reddish feet and a reddish beard. I had to conclude that it was something she ate or drank. Also stained reddish were the hairs all around her vulva. Also a big one, have any of the employees been handing out treats (which is very sweet and I know they all mean well and like to do that so the dogs don’t fear them). You may be feeding grain free and the facilities treats may cheaper treats that contain grains. Or something in the treats your dog had an issue with. I find that it’s typically something like that.

[John P]

Dori:
I think rotational food might be my best bet at this stage in the game, but I have a few questions/comments for you:
1) How would you recommend introducing the new foods I’m researching to make sure Iggy (and Bella, my other Wheatable) can tolerate them before I rotate in a second, third, and fourth food (and so on)? It usually takes a little while for the itching to show up in either Iggy or Bella. On the other hand, I learned very quickly that bison was too closely related to beef for Bella (she has violent reactions to beef). Within hours, she was incredibly sick. So, I guess my question is how long would you wait before introducing each food and how many foods would you feed at a time when you’re trying out a new one? Would you switch to it exclusively for a short period?
2) I have always made my own treats. This started when I rescued Iggy as a puppy. He was extremely malnourished but wouldn’t eat much of his puppy food at a time. Bella, who is two years older, has never had any problems eating (especially if it’s bad for her — haha), so I had to find ways to get get nutrition into him throughout the day when he felt like eating without necessarily leaving food out all day long. I worked with my super awesome vet to come up with some “recipes”, I played with them to Iggy’s liking, and Iggy and Bella have been enjoying them to some extent ever since. They have always been anti-inflammatory, grain-free, and high-protein, with a good fat-to-protein ratio. I don’t use treats very often, but when I do, they’re always from my own kitchen.

crazy4cats:
Pardon my ignorance, but what is a “topper”?

Pam P:
This is great information! Like I said, I’m new to this site and new to the dog food world beyond what I have found in the aisles of my local pet supply warehouses. Please bear with me as I bombard you with questions/comments as I did with Dori. Here goes:
1) What is kefir? I’m afraid to leave this page in my tablet to go Googling for fear of losing everything I have typed so far, plus I’m betting your summation will be far more knowledgeable than anything I can find on Wikipedia.
2) How exactly do you find out if a company uses synthetic vitamins and minerals? Does a limited-ingredient brand such as Acana use them? I’m guessing something like that would be on the ingredients list, but is there a separate list as one might find on a cereal box? I tried to play around with Editor’s Choice the day I joined, but I couldn’t find the purported ingredient benefits of membership. That could be both a limitation of my browsing device and a limitation of the short amount of time I had available for browsing.
3) Do you mix the oils directly onto the foods before feeding? How do you know how much to give per kg/lb — does someone have a guide somewhere online? Again, this might be something I could search online. My Wheatables both have the soft blonde hair of the Wheaten breed, but it doesn’t have the luster it had when eating the Organix. I realize that could be due to many things besides just what I fed them at the time. I know when I first rescued Bella and before I got Iggy, my old vet introduced me to Dr. Udo’s pet line of holistic products. Do you have any experience with those? I believe he has a vegan oil blend (with several of the oils you mentioned) designed to do just what you said. The only reason I bring it up is it would have dosing guidelines. My worry comes from the fact that Iggy is at risk of being underweight (always has been), and Bella is at risk of being overweight (always has been), so I want to be sure and dose exactly according to what they should be getting.

InkedMarie:
Thanks for the hints! You saved me a lot of headache and searches by pointing me in the right directions. If I can use Dori’s rotational recommendations, I’ll need some novel proteins because so many have already been eliminated due to established allergies and intolerances (mainly poultry). I really appreciate the help!

Melissaandcrew:
Okay, I own several books on Wheatens. They are adorable, but that very adorableness is their downfall, which is why I have rescued two. However, I haven’t ever encountered specific literature on (nor have any of my vets told me about) skin conditions due to intestinal problems. I know about the inheritable digestive enzyme-related diseases. Do those also cause skin problems? If so, what kind? I will Google this further as soon as I can. However, your first-hand perspective would probably help me more than anything else.
Also, thanks for telling me you are also a proponent of rotational feeding, although to a more relaxed extent than Dori. This helps me decide that some form of rotational feeding is the next move for our pet family. I wish I had thought to do this sooner.

Pam P:
Nice to see you again! Thanks for the advice on the vaccines. Iggy and Bella missed their last routine vaccinations because they were extremely inflamed at the time, and the vet didn’t want to risk it. I will mention everything you said to my vet, and we will go from there. She has been extremely good to work with me so far. She got out of vet school right about the time Iggy joined our family, so she knows our history well, and she seems to be more flexible than some older vets.

Thanks again to everyone! I’m sorry I wasn’t more concise. I just have so many questions. If you don’t feel like answering but just want to send me to a website, a link is fine too. I’m off to do all of that Googling I promised to undertake. This community is amazing!

[dana i]

Hi! I’ve been reading this forum all day today, but am overwhelmed by all the choices. I’d really love to hear people’s actual experiences and thoughts– what is on paper does not always match what makes the dogs happy and healthy.

I have two lab mix dogs– both rescues.
Diesel is a 1 year old Lab/Shephard mix who has allergies. 65# dog
Dudley is a 1 1/2 year old lab/Greyhound mix who has gas issues when he eats ANYTHING other than the current food… (even treats) 83# dog

They were both given horrible diets before they came to me.
I have them on Science Diet Lamb and Rice Large Breed formula.

At the time, it’s the ONLY thing that I found that helped Diesel’s allergy symptoms (they are completely gone on this food but when I try anything else it comes back) and Dudley’s gas is now a very rare thing on this food.

However, reading it seems that people don’t like this one and that there may be better out there… And the fact that when I went to buy it today I found it went up in price AGAIN. uugh. Maybe now is a good time to switch…

I want what is best for them, with budget kinda on the mind at the same time.

Right now, it takes us 11 days to go through a 33 pound bag of Science Diet Lamb and Rice large breed formula dry food and used to cost us around $45 a bag but did just go up to about $50.

I’d really love to get them something better. Maybe something that also makes their poop a little smaller too? (I know–wishful thinking? LOL)

Any suggestions based on the gas/allergies?
I priced raw diet– which I would LOVE LOVE LOVE to do, but it’s way out of our price range from what I am reading.

I CAN and will supplement a little bit of our cooked food on top (If I can avoid the gas and allergy issues– that will take a little experimenting)….

I have a feed store 1 mile from my house that sells some food but he’s kinda expensive on some items. I also live near Petco, Petsmart and have Amazon prime… I live in Texas, suburb of Dallas if that helps.

Any thoughts or tips would be greatly appreciated!

[Brian K]

Regarding commercial treats, I prefer freeze dried treats that are 100% meat. They are portable, light, and the dog loves them. Though expensive, Orijen has a line of these…I like the “Tundra” which has venison, elk, and trout. We also like Bravo! freeze dried treats….the Bison is a big hit (it’s just freeze dried bison). We used to offer Wellness “Just for Puppy” treats but he is less enthusiastic about these now that he gets real meat treats from time to time.

Our dog adores the Natural Balance “Jerky Bark” limited ingredient treats which we received as a gift, but I’m not a big fan of the fat content and preservatives…maybe I’m being overprotective.

[deja]

We have a dog recently diagnosed with epilepsy and I’m on the search for a new food because I suspect the one she’s on now contains these preservatives (a prescription Science Diet food). I’ve been finding it very difficult to find definitive information on whether foods use BHA/BHT/Ethoxyquin. I figured people on this website might have more experience/information.

Do you know of dog foods that the company has stated do not contain BHA, BHT, or Ethoxyquin? Either on their websites or through response to email inquiries.

Personally I’m also looking for non-raw food that does not contain rosemary (not easy to find!), and is also not too high in fat (less than 17% preferably). But I think I can narrow those down myself more easily, so I’m mostly looking for help with the preservatives. So far Life’s Abundance is the only one I’ve found that also meets my other requirements. Natural Balance says no BHA/BHT/ethoxyquin as well on their rolled food and some treats, but I can’t find comments on any of their other food.

[Dori]

Hi John P. First let me say that I’m a commercial raw feeder grain free foods so I’m not going to really be of much help with kibble. I do know that a lot of people on this site consider Acana and Orijen made by Champion to be a quality company. The only kibble that, on rare occasions, I have put in rotation is Nature’s Logic Kibble but only the Sardine. All others contain either some sort of beef or poultry (eggs). One of my dogs has many many food intolerances and sensitivities. The list is quite long so I won’t bore you as they don’t pertain to your dog. But she is highly intolerant of all things poultry which includes all fowl. Below is a partial list of what I feed my three dogs and they all do very well on them, I’ve left out any of the beef that I feed because your dog has an intolerance to beef. I feed all my dogs the same food because of my allergy girl, Katie. I feed a rotational diet so here goes.

OC Raw: Fish & Produce Patties, Lamb Patties, Rabbit Patties, Goat Patties

Primal Raw Formulas and/or Primal Pronto Formulas: Venison Patties, Rabbit Patties

Vital Essentials Raw: Fish Patties, Rabbit Patties

Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw: Venison (also contains lamb), Rabbit (also contains pork)

Stella & Chewy’s Raw: Venison, Lamb, Rabbit
I’m not a great fan of Stella & Chewy’s but will feed it if I’m in a pinch.

Natures Logic Kibble: Sardine (It contains millet which is a pseudo-grain. Katie can’t tolerate grains but for some reason the millet in Nature’s Logic doesn’t seem to bother her. Could be because I feed it so infrequently and never for more than one meal every so often.

I’m an advocate of rotational feeding for my three dogs so I rotate their food pretty much with every meal and don’t feed them the same protein without a three day break in between. It’s the only way I can get around Katie’s food issues. Dogs with allergies should also avoid corn, white potatoes, rice (all), soy. They are all pro-inflammatory so you’re basically feeding the allergies and making things worse. You need to feed non-inflammatory foods and ingredients as best you can. It’s pretty difficult to avoid every single thing all the time but it helps a great deal to do your best.

Hope some of this has helped. I’m sure someone else will chime in soon to help with kibble feeding.

Oops! Don’t forget about checking to see what’s in the treats you give your dogs. For treats I only give pieces of fruits (no grapes) and veggies. No seeds or pits with the fruit please (toxic), I also peel apples and cucumbers. I don’t feed any commercial treats due to grains and too many recalls for my liking. Too many pesticides used on both. Good Luck and if I can answer any questions please ask.

I just wanted to mention that the only fish that Katie cannot eat is salmon. All other fish foods she’s fine with but is very sensitive to salmon.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by Dori.

[GSDsForever]

Meghan,

First of all, can I just say what an impressive amount of thoughtful research and care you’ve provided for your dog? Honestly, wtg! Your dog is very, very lucky to have such an obviously caring owner.

I think nearly all the brands you’ve listed are really good choices made by reputable trustworthy companies, with the exception of Innova, a Proctor and Gamble product. I agree with Akari and would avoid Proctor and Gamble brands, just as I avoid Mars/Purina/Nestle/etc. and Diamond manufactured brands. P&G brands bought out from Natura include Innova, Evo, California Natural, Karma, and Mother Nature treats.

I am not familiar with Sammy Snacks Ancestry and so cannot recommend it before knowing more about the company and its history. I would advise caution with newer/less familiar brands until you have some good information beyond just ingredient labels and guaranteed analyses. This company could be great, however!

If you want to know more information about Horizon, Zignature, Earthborn, and Wellness, I am really familiar with these brands & and would be happy to share what I know.

Of those, I think the Horizon Legacy Fish and Zignature Trout & Salmon would be my first choices. And not only do they both have excellent amounts of Omega 3 (and Omega 3 to 6 ratio) from exclusively wild caught fish, and the Omega 3 is not derived from plant oils (which are unlikely to be absorbed), both are ethoxyquin-free.

I appreciate that these brands you mention are available at lower price points. I’m on a small budget too! Remember, just because a more expensive brand exists, it doesn’t always make it a better food from a better company. Ditto for who has the best marketing vs. makes excellent food with high quality ingredient & processing standards.

[Naturella]

D_O and aquariangt, I see, ok, so high-value treats are good for learning new things and enforcing commands that Bruno struggles with. But low-value treat parties work too. I shall keep that in mind! 🙂

Bruno needs to work on recalling, heeling, waiting (not allowed to get a treat from my hand until I say so; we use “leave it” for things he wants to get from the ground and he’s actually pretty good with it) and staying on command, and hopefully learning to potty quicker when taken out to do so, lol.

All his other little tricks like sitting, shaking “hands” and alternating the paws when told so, laying down, rolling over, turning around in a circle, going up and down on command, pawing at something specific, giving high-fives and high-tens, sitting with front paws up (on his butt), standing on hind legs, jumping, going into his crate and onto his bed, going to “see” (more like lick) me or Brian on command, giving kisses on command, barking on command and being quiet when told so (FINALLY!!!) – he is pretty good with those, but still need to polish up the ones noted above. I am also trying to think of what else to teach him, maybe walking for some time on hind legs, or bringing various items on command… IDK. If I can get to an agility course, I would love to teach him agility type “tricks”, but we don’t have one super close to where I live. Maybe one day! 🙂

Also, aquariangt, I don’t think I will be going to Colorado anytime soon, and quite possibly if we go, it won’t be for dog training, lol. But I hear it’s beautiful and outdoorsy, so if we move to the North West we may visit Colorado. But feel free to share whatever else you want (I promise not to bug you about it!), just whatever is good about training for a person who doesn’t train professionally to know. 🙂

Thanks again for all the tips, everyone! As usual, it is much, much appreciated! 🙂

[aquariangt]

Treat parties for new commands and commands you struggle with are great! Nothing wrong with extra treats for something tough, I often make one little treat last forever (great for stays especially) mixing all those tactics together is great, and it’s good to keep me guessing. For old things I also move into treating every 2-4 times instead of every time, the. Two in a row, then skip a few, etc… When you are getting ready for the good citizen for example, you can’t have treats, so it’s good to get to that point without treats. And I see no problem with giving lots of high value treats for learning things, I don’t only pull them out a couple times in a session.

Unless any of you are planning on coming to Colorado for dog training, you aren’t clients that would normally pay me, so I have no problems sharing 🙂 ( I do however get loads of people mooching for free advice, mostly I don’t care but if it’s intensive, I’ll tell them to setup an appointment. The worst is people who call me about dog training that I don’t know from Adam, and ask me a million questions hoping for free answers, grr…) anyhow, off topic, you all are my internet dog friends so no worries.

Counter conditioning is quite simple, and exactly what it sounds like. Helping your dog not be afraid or anxious in a situation that puts them over threshold, causes fear, or is otherwise a hard position for them to be in. I do this the exact opposite way of what you see the dog whisperer do on tv ;-). I’ll use my sisters Westie for a really basic example with cars. He was terrified of them (can’t blame that eh?) but it was to the point where he would yank, bark, go crazy- unsafe really. So every time a car drove by, we worked on focusing on her, making her a pez dispenser, hand out as many treats as he would take, and reward when the car was gone. Clickers help with this as well. Eventually he got to the point where he could sit and focus without treats, and then click and treat party. Now she doesn’t even have to stop walking, but from time to time gives him a treat anyway. This tactic can be used for a lot of different counter conditioning, and I really like the clicker and having some shaping skills worked in for a lot of it as well

[Naturella]

D_O, thank you for sharing this! Are high-value treats ok to give in larger amounts until the dog learns a new trick? I guess I can try to break some of them up, or cut them small… Would they still be considered high-value by Bruno then too?

[Naturella]

@aquariangt, this was super helpful actually! And I’ve been eying the THK Quickies for a while, I may just invest in some in the future, when at least most my kibble samples have been used up. 😀

I never thought to use high-value treats for commands Bru struggled with! I would just use extra low-value ones, for example 3-4 pieces instead of just one kibble. But I will try to implement that! Maybe Bruno will learn to go potty quicker if I am about to give him a piece of a knick-knack or something! And to come when called (lil’ sucker struggles with recalling when in a new environment too). Also, I don’t know if this is “training proprietary info”, but what is counter conditioning fear? Basically teaching a dog to not be afraid? If you can’t explain (like, if you normally get paid to explain this), then you don’t have to.

Also, would it be safe to throw him a stuffed Kong to help with any potential separation anxiety when we leave the house? I don’t think Bruno’s really bad, he just looks super miserable when we’re leaving, but he finally stopped getting into the trashcans (his only menace), and more often than not we find him just waking up from a nap when we come home, so he’s good now about not destroying anything.

[Dog_Obsessed]

Yup, you got it right! I like to use high-value treats when training new commands, and low-value treats when reinforcing them. We also met with a trainer on Sunday to work on Lily’s dog reactivity, and we are using high-value treats when practicing the exercises, even without dogs present.

[aquariangt]

I keep 3-4 treats on me at a time. Regular, bulk of what I’m using treats-usually 2 varieties (i try to keep it low cal as possible) A high Value Treat, a treat too of natural unsweetened peanut butter. With Dani I also keep both a fleece tug and a Bumi for throwing, as those are rewarding to her and good for certain speed situations. Liesl has no interest in that 🙂

The regular treats i use (i like to use 2 for variety) for just run of the mill training, walks, classes, completing obstacles, etc… I throw in a high value treat every now and then to keep them on their toes 😉 I also use them for certain things they may be struggling with-say Bruno was having a lot of trouble with his recall, use a high value treat. I almost always use high value treats when training Leave It. Peanut Butter I only use for 2 things (usually, those big eyes can turn me into a sucker dad) Recalls, and completing a course in agility.

That was all a jumbled mess. my short version:

Low Value (as Dori said, not low quality, just less exciting): Everyday training, commands they know, group classes for warm up etc…
Examples: Zukes, Boulder Dog Food Chicken Bits, The Honest Kitchen Quickies, Bare Bites

High Value: Commands you’re struggling with, counter conditioning fear, recalls (maybe), Leave Its
Examples: Freeze Dried Stuff (Simply Sojos, Stella and Chewys, Fresh is Best)

Special High Value Awesomeness: I like this for recalls because they are so important, and then after a course or something where they don’t get a ton of treats
Examples: For me-Peanut Butter because they love it. I would possible lump in the Fresh is Best freeze dried organ meats as well, because I’ve seen dogs fall off of things for it 😉

Hope that was semi helpful

[Naturella]

Hello, all!

As per the usual, I have a question. Just want to see if I have it right – the difference between high-value and low-value treats is basically how much the dog would like one over the other, and generally you can get the dog to “trade” a toy or something else if you offer a high-value treat, but you can use low-value treats for training. Is this correct at all? I just keep seeing these distinctions in other blogs/websites, so I need to enhance my knowledge. 🙂

[Naturella]

Hey, all! So, today Bruno had his first beef green tripe can – Solid Gold Green Cow. It smells like vomit. Like someone had lamb innards and then vomited them, lol. Naturally, Bruno LOVED it! Then again, he loves everything, lol, little vacuum cleaner. I gave him about 2 heaping tablespoons (it’s a big can, we gotta use it up soon) and reduced his kibble too, so he had a nice dinner. His breakfast was Acana Pacifica with some yoghurt, and the dinner was Wysong Quail with the green tripe.

I also got him a new Kong toy, the regular but in black for heavy chewers, size small. It won’t fit his food serving, but I plan to use it for just goodie treats, like the tripe, doggie “ice-cream”, etc. So I stuffed and froze his new little Kong, 2 hooves, Casey’s medium-sized Kong (I have permission to give her dog-friendly treats and concoctions), and the remnants of a horn (won’t be buying those anymore as they are not naturally-shed. Hooves probably aren’t either, but mine 2 were a gift, so I will still use them). And we still have some of the can left in the fridge probably for both breakfast AND dinner tomorrow… Or I can feed half tomorrow, half Thursday, we’ll see. 🙂 But yeah, Bruno likes it a lot, I just really wish I either had more stuffable toys, or they sold small (up to 6oz) cans of green tripe so I can feed it quickly. Oh well. I was so excited to have the Kong and stuff it with the tripe that he had dinner a little early today. He didn’t mind, lol! 😀

• This reply was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by Naturella.

[Naturella]

Hey, all, sorry I’ve been MIA – I had a family friend – a high school classmate of my Mom’s, she’s like a substitute mother or just a mother figure to me, very loving of Brian and I, visit Atlanta for basically just under 36 hours, so we were spending some time with her and I couldn’t respond to your posts.

It is good to know that other dogs also do need to do the whole sniff-around-think-about-it-go-somewhere-else-think-some-more-sniff-some-more dance… Males OR females. Sometimes, Bruno would get as far as even lifting his leg and then deciding against peeing, and moving on… This is particularly annoying, lol, cause he’s more than halfway there. And Bruno also dry-marks too, lol (he’s all out of urine but still has to try to lift his leg and try to squeeze a drop out). We also have tried with treats and the clicker even, but it still was taking a while to go. Ideally, when we have a yard, I would do like BCnut, let the dogs in the yard to do whatever, wherever, but on walks they won’t get to mark and sniff around. And as for Bruno, IDK, should we still try to teach him the one-spot policy, or just let it go altogether? We will try to get him to play inside before going out some and even run around and jump some so he can move his intestines quicker when outside, lol!

• This reply was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by Naturella.

[Akari_32]

I was making up some meals for Bentley last night, and remembered I had a ton of beef tracheas in the spare bedroom (where I keep all my dog food, cat litter, treats, supplements, etc) so I pulled out the open bag with 5 pieces in it, and stuffed them with smelt, ground beef, and beef heart.

http://i765.photobucket.com/albums/xx294/Akari53/BFA7C9FE-0F3A-4837-BE3B-00B8BA705AA0_zpspjjcylps.jpg

I’ll have to post pics of how they go over when he gets one. They’re randomly mixed in with his other meals in the freezer lol

[Beth M]

Our Chocolate Lab was diagnosed yesterday.She is staying in the animal hospital for a few days for treatment.I am very concerned about feeding her dog food and treats once she comes home.Any advice for care of a diabetic dog would be greatly appreciated.Best brand and type?

[Mieke v]

Hello all,

Just wanted to let everyone know that our dog had all of these symptoms as well. Gulping, licking, sometime frantic eating of grass or anything, odd posture, random vomitting, random loose stools with mucus, and the list goes on. We switched him to Honest Kitchen Zeal for 2 weeks along with a dosage of 10 mg Famotidine (acid reducer that you can obtain at any grocery or drug store) at each meal. He weighs 55 lbs. No other food or treats. After two weeks we introduced rotation with Wellness Core (canned) and continued the Famotidine. He was symptom-free within a day or two. He has not had any further symptoms now in three months. We took him off the Famotidine after about one month but carefully watched him for licking, etc. Now he is on a rotation of HK Zeal one day, one day Wellness Core (canned) or Merrick Grain-free Wilderness (canned). We always make sure that the HK Zeal is a full day between the other two. If your dog is not digesting the HK fully, suggest pre-mixing and leaving in fridge. We also increased his physical activity to one 3-mile fast walk with water pack per day after he was symptom-free. Strongly recommend switching up foods and going ultra-low fat, grain-free. It saved his life! So grateful to this forum and our local fancy pet store which helped us.

[Susan]

Hi Christine, the Gulping is Acid Reflux, my boy started getting this when on the Royal Canine HP that’s when all Patches problems started, 2013, fast forward 2 years, Patch had Endoscope & Biopsies done December 2014 & he has Helicobacter, IBD, they get real bad acid reflux, burping, heartburn, he was put on triple therapy Metronidazole, Amoxicillin & Zantac cause he cant take Losec but they are normally use Losec, he was on this 3 weeks, as soon as the triple therapy stopped within 1 week Patch was gulping & swallowing again, at night early hours of morning is worse, I’ve been giving 3ml Mylanta this really heaps…Patch was put on another triple therapy Metronidazole, Clarithromycin & Zantac, the Clarithromycin made him so ill, I had to stop all meds, that was last week, I have also stopped any kibbles, no more kibble, I have been buying turkey breast mince 99% fat free about 1 kilo =(2.2 pounds) I add 1 egg & mix thru mince & then I make about 4 long meatloaf & with the left over turkey breast mince I make real little turkey balls as treats, I put on baking tray & bake, I boil a heap of butternut pumkin & freeze 20g squares, I section the turkey when cooked & freeze, to 1 cup of cooked turkey after I’ve mashed all up, I add about 1 heap spoon boiled pumkin….pumkin soothes the GI tract…… Patch is on this diet for 6 weeks to let everything rest after the strong antibiotics made him ill….

You need a real low fat diet as fat makes acid reflux worse, high protein kibbles normally have high fat, also limited ingredient diets are best, if you can, feed a wet diet, as kibble is too over processed & makes things worse with acid reflux & gulping.. Your dog is small, you could cook & freeze like I’m doing, boil a heap of potatoes & freeze sections for the day & buy some fresh white fish & freeze after cooked. I use to use tin tuna & spring water then I tried tin salmon but the fat was too high in the salmon…so far turkey breast has been the best…

“Wellness Simple” limited ingredient has Grainfree Salmon & Potatoes or Turkey & Potatoes in wet & dry, the fat is min-12% here’s their link to have a look, just scroll right down to the bottom for the Simple range, I use to feed the Duck & Oatmeal & the Lamb & Oatmeal as Patch cant eat potatoes & these flavours had the lowest fat, min-11% & min-12% fat but that’s min fat-11%, so u add another 1 & 1/2 more for max fat%…
http://www.wellnesspetfood.com/recipes.aspx?pet=dog&ft=1#Complete

[Naturella]

@Oleanderz, we have the same dog puzzle at home! Bruno loves it! 😀 And she is just adorable. She’s not huge, but probably still can be classified as a “large breed”? Idk… Sorry. We got just a small guy, and the roommate’s dog is about 55-60 lbs, but she doesn’t look too big either. I think the medium bags of each food should be lasting her about a month, no? How long does each of the large EB bags last her? Also, on sportdogfood.com all of the GF Victor bags come only in 30-lb bags, just FYI. But it’s still a great food, and even if all the other bags you feed are mediums, it’s fine if the Victor are the large ones.

Anyway, as for the tripling the toppers – I highly recommend buying this e-book: http://www.dogwise.com/ItemDetails.cfm?ID=DN330EBK – it is just under $3.00 but very informative about adding fresh toppers (such as eggs, canned sardines, raw or cooked meat) and in what proportions based on the dog’s weight. You won’t necessarily have to triple the toppers just because she weighs 3 times more than Bruno – maybe double them, the book will tell you, particularly about the eggs and sardines. But, for example, Bruno used to eat 1/2 of what Casey (our roommate’s dog) eats, and she ate 2 cups of food/day, at 55-60 lbs. He ate 1 cup ever since we got him at under 10 lbs or so,
and a little pup. When I began introducing toppers, I put him on 3/4 cups of dry/day, and then added toppers and treats, and that was when we were exercising very vigorously in the summer. I think then he was getting a bit more than 1 cup dry calorie-wise, but he was burning it off and his body needed the extra boost. Now he’s at 1/2 cup dry with toppers (we’re not getting as much exercise :/ ), so calorie-wise he’s still at around 3/4-1 cup per day, and then the occasional treat. I watch more his body condition than weight, and speaking of, here is a good link for that too: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=8&ved=0CDMQFjAH&url=http%3A%2F%2Fresearch.unc.edu%2Ffiles%2F2012%2F11%2FCCM3_032387.pdf&ei=M5jjVJCwLYOuggSfnoSwAw&usg=AFQjCNHtVxv9oSG6wDJy-eYgbHFmyKag_Q&sig2=T1KHIfunn_GiCqOKGXYcfg&bvm=bv.85970519,d.eXY 4-5 is ideal, so that’s what we strive to keep Bruno at. That’s what I should strive for myself, lol!

And lol! Well, whatever works for you, your fam, and Luci! LoL. And good, glad we’ll be having you around! 🙂

[Naturella]

@Oleanderz, I would probably be the odd man out here, because I don’t see most of what I do for Bruno as “spoiling” although others have told me that he is spoiled, lol. If I feed him good food with good toppers, take him to the dog park, play with him, do his nails, brush and bathe him, get him healthy treats and keep track of what treats he likes (it is pretty easy – he likes everything, lol), get him a new antler when the old one is almost chewed up, get him novel chews/toys, I don’t see any of it as spoiling. Now… we’re not really into dressing him up and probably wouldn’t buy him doggie shoes unless we lived somewhere real hot or real cold most of the year, so he only has one raincoat that he doesn’t like so he never wears, lol. Only clothes we would get him are probably NY Jets gear, lol! 🙂

And we don’t really know his Birthday, but it is probably something like early March… March 1st maybe, IDK. So I can just pick a date, but I am so finicky, I can’t decide when I want to think he was born, lol. But I do know the day we adopted him, July 27th, 2013, so that’s his “gotcha” day and I didn’t celebrate it last year, but I want to from now on. I would probably feed him a balanced all-raw meal or something, go to the park/lake, let him run, play, swim, then wash him up and snuggle him up!

I guess one way we “spoil” him is that during the night he’s not allowed on our bed – he sleeps at the foot of the bed in his favorite bean bag, which used to be my husband’s desk chair, lol. Well, Bruno claimed it and we let him, especially because Brian has an office chair now. So Bruno has the bean bag, and a bed in the bathroom (Costco bed, really nice, washable covers), and a bed on the deck that used to be his bathroom bed till he started eating his RMBs on it, so now it’s an outside bed for that purpose, just to eat RMBs on. Nowadays he has dried chicken or duck feet inside instead of an RMB on Sunday, cause it’s been so cold, but when it warms back up, he will have his RMBs again!
But, back to the spoiling – in the morning, when we start waking up, Bruno wakes up too and sleepily staggers onto the bed and comes over to shower us with puppy kisses, and we snatch him up, put him under the covers with us, and snuggle him for some snooze time. He loves snoozing in our arms in the morning. He is so peaceful and cute when asleep/sleepy! So I guess that’s his daily spoiling. 🙂

[Naturella]

@Oleanderz, Lucille looks so cute in your pic! 🙂 But the link you posted says I don’t have permission to view it or something…

Yes, I would probably have her stay overnight. She won’t hate you, I promise. And yeah, I would say she is about medium… I think large breeds are the ones 50+ lbs when adults.

And awwh, you’re welcome! I hope it helps! I really tried to make it as diverse and balanced at possible. I would say that for a start, 4 brands are fine to rotate between. By the time you finish the suggested schedule, you can decide whether to repeat it or add more to the mix. I personally always add more, cause there are so many foods I want to try on Bruno, but many of the pros here stick to just a few brands and rotate between them and the flavors. I think 4 brands is a good start.

If Luci doesn’t have a grain allergy, it won’t hurt her to have grains again. It is only 2 formulas with grains anyway, and if you notice her reacting to them, just keep alternating between the Kinesis and RPM GFs.

Eggs: dogs’ digestive tracts are much shorter than ours, so the probability of them getting salmonella is much lower. They were meant to eat raw food. If it bugs you though, you can totally lightly or fully cook the whole egg and give it to her. You can use coconut or olive oil to cook it in, or no oil if you’re poaching it. It is, in fact, recommended that you lightly cook the egg white, and not cook the yolk at all, because there is an enzyme (I believe) in the egg white that could mess with the dog’s body properly absorbing the biotin in the yolk. If you cook the yolk, some of the biotin goes away too, is my understanding. So cook the egg white lightly. BTW, for Luci, I would probably give her 2 eggs together when I do give eggs, and a whole 3.5-oz can of sardines if I were to give her any. She is 3 times Bruno’s size after all. 🙂

Now, for food storage and rotation. As long as you keep it in a dark, cool, dry place, as long as you use it up by the BEST BY date, you should be fine. I personally have a bit of a stocking-up (NOT hoarding… Not yet, hopefully not ever!) problem with dog food because of amazing deals, so I basically stocked up enough food to last Bru till the end of this year. Luckily, I will be able to use it by or close to the BEST BY dates. But for the future, I would probably still get 3-4 months’ worth at a time, depending on deals, because in case a food doesn’t work out for him and I have to scrap it, I don’t want him to be foodless till I order or buy the next bag. So, what you can do, is stock up with say, the first line of medium-sized bags of EB, Dr Tim’s, Nulo, and Victor (medium-sized should be good, just so you see how she’s taking it) and start going through them and when you get to the Nulo, order the next line. This way you will always have about 4-5 bags at a time in case something goes wrong. Plus, at all times there will be an EB there if she can’t or won’t eat any of the other foods. But I hope she likes them!

As for the keeping track – make sure your family doesn’t feel like Big Brother is watching, lol. It is mostly important for feeding to keep track of times, amounts, and toppers, etc., as well as making sure no treats are given till she learns to eat her food quickly when put down. It shouldn’t take her too long. After that, still make sure she’s not getting too many treats to make her skip her next meal. And that’s about it. Exercising with a dog can be fun, so I’m sure someone will do something with daily, it doesn’t have to be super tracked, but you can do it if you want. I probably will track everything one day when we have kids and another dog though, lol! But that’s still far in the future.

One last thing that I’m sure you probably know, but I will just throw out there – all the foods in Luci’s future rotation, including EB, are pretty calorie-dense (Especially Dr. Tim’s Momentum). So keep track of how much she is being fed also, because she may just be one of those dogs that can self-regulate and between possibly too much food and too many treats, she is skipping meals. Use the bag feeding guidelines as a guideline only, not as a rule, and just adjust accordingly. She should have a waist when looked at from above, and her ribs should be easily-felt.

I am happy if I have been able to help with anything. Please do stay around in the forums, keep us posted, and let us know if you have any more questions! 🙂

[aquariangt]

If you’re trying to cut out certain things you wouldn’t want to offer ANYTHING that contained the item. IE, if you’re trying to cut out Beef, no treats with anything beef. Stick to what you’re working on with an elimination diet, find treats and chews that mimic the ingredients you’re trying out.

As far as fish-I believe that would depend on the dog, but maybe someone with Fish allergies (like DogFoodie) can chime in, I know she can’t even use anything with salmon oil.

[lovemypuppy]

I was scolded by the vet tech for giving my 11 week old boston terrier puppy a catfish skin chew (Beam, by The Honest Kitchen).

Initially the tech called it salmon and told me my puppy didn’t need fish oil. I corrected her, letting her know it was catfish skin chews and that I thought they were a good choice because they were more digestible than other chews out there (I ignored her comment on fish oil because I didn’t want to get into an argument with her). She said the fat content of the catfish skin chews was too high and would put my puppy at risk of developing pancreatitis. She also said to only give Nylabones.

I later discussed with a different tech at a different vet office hoping to get some clarification, but unfortunately they too were leery of the high fat content for the same reason. They added that small dog breeds, and BT in particular, were at increased risk of pancreatitis.

Has anyone else heard this in regards to Beams being too rich in fat for a puppy or dogs at risk of pancreatitis?

Do Beams actually have a high fat content? Looking at their packaging it doesn’t appear so (min protein 88%, min fat 4%, moisture 8%). The freeze dried Orijen treats we were giving for house training have quite a bit more fat. So now, I’m really confused on how much fat is OK.

• This topic was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by lovemypuppy.
• This topic was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by lovemypuppy.

[mountainhound]

I would never feed any prescription food to a dog with joint issues, the bulk of those ingredients are highly inflammatory and will cause more harm than good. Feed a good quality raw diet (even premade raw will probably be cheaper than Hills), raw food contains natural sources of glucosamine/chondroitin from ground up cartilage. Lack of carbs will help with inflammation and pain reduction. You can also give her treats like tracheas and duck feet since those are good sources of glucosamine. I’ve had good results with a supplement called Liquid Health, its tasteless and easy to mix with ground raw food.

[Dori]

Hi Kimberly C. It sounds as though your dog is having food intolerances/sensitivities. First off he should be on grain free foods. Avoid corn, soy, white potatoes, rice and all poultry. That’s for starters. You also mention that your dog has seizures. Very important is to avoid any foods that contain rosemary in any form.

I have three small dogs all of which are on commercial raw dog foods. One of my girls has a multitude of food intolerances which is what led me on the road to raw feeding about three years ago. I started by eliminating all the ingredients I mentioned above. I feed commercial raw foods. I’m not inclined to make my own because, well…. truth be told I just don’t feel like doing it. Here is the list of commercial raw food companies that I have researched to death over the years and that I trust. Primal Raw Pronto, Primal Raw Formulas (these are Primal’s complete and balanced foods…you don’t have to add anything to them in the way of supplements). Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw Dog Foods, Vital Essential Raw Foods, OC Raw Dog Food, Answer’s Detailed Raw Frozen. I also from time to time have on hand their freeze dried foods (they’re raw and you can feed as is without hydrating). As for dehydrated foods, the only one I use is The Honest Kitchen’s Zeal formula. The others contain some type of poultry or white potatoes that I choose not to feed. I feed what is called a rotational diet. I rotate different brands and different proteins within the brands with the exception of any and all poultry. I also do not feed any commercial treats. For the most part they all contain some sort of grain and there have been way too many recalls of dog treats for me to take a chance with my dogs. For treats I feed them little pieces of fruits and vegetables. Sometimes I puree them. Sometimes they’re cooked from our dinner. For the most part since I use them as treats for them I’m not particularly concerned about how much nutritional value they get from the fruits and veggies. The enjoy them, as they would a commercial treat, and that is my intent in giving them to them. If they get some nutritional value from them, even a little, that’s great; if not, that’s not the purpose I give them the treats. Of course you know you can go on google and just google what fruits and vegetables you can feed your dogs or go in reverse and type in what fruits and veggies you should not be feeding your dogs. Always, of course avoid onions, grapes, raisins. As for fruits, never feed anything that still has it’s pit or seeds. They tend to be toxic. As for apples I always don’t feed the peel. Apples are sprayed continuously to detract worms. They are also highly waxed to appear pretty for the consumer. I think I read somewhere, but don’t now remember where, that the skin of an apple has more bacteria than any other fruit on the market. That would probably hold true for cucumbers on the market due to the same reasons. I feed both but I peel them. Hope any of this has helped you. If you have any other questions, please ask.

Please remember to check any and all foods you feed your seizure dog so that you avoid rosemary in any form. Studies have shown (in people so far as no study has been done in animals as of yet) that if one has a predisposition to seizures, rosemary can trigger a seizure.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by Dori.

[Lyndel M]

Hi again,

Thank you for all of your comments. However, can I say that I was responding to another member’s query as to how to stuff chew toys when she is using a raw food diet and I provided with options from my own my own research and provided a link.
However, given some of the confusion that, i) it is cruel to make a puppy work so hard for its food by giving all of its food in a chewtoy, ii) that they can’t get all of their nutritional needs met from a chewtoy due to the difficulty of getting all of food out, especially the raw meat out; iv) the raw food may go off or the chew toy become contaminated with raw food left in there and cleaning difficulties etc. Yes! I agree to most of those responses.
A puppy has very specific needs indeed. He/she needs a balance of 70% protein, 20% carbs !0% veg/fibre. Their protein should also include 10% organ meat, with only 5% of that being organic liver.
I am going on my own research and as most of your know there are many benefits to using stuffable chew toys and food puzzles. Dr Ian Dunbar (a UK vet and one of the first positive dog trainers) recommends that for the first few days to a week only feeding you puppy either by hand or in chew toys to teach them i) bite inhibition;ii) to teach the a chewtoy habit so they only chew on appropriate chew toys. However, in his day in the 80’s kibble was viewed as the best food for all dogs and he did feel his puppy’s chewtoys with kibble.

We do not intend to feed all of my puppy’s meals in a kong and we will not be leaving our puppy unsupervised…ever! We have used chew toys with previous pets and of course know the importance of cleaning. While our puppy is getting positively conditioned to his portable crate, his chew toys will be in there for him to chew on for entertainment and teaching him to self-sooth for those times in the future when he will need to be on his own. Outside of his crate (which by the way, will only be used in this way for the first few weeks), his food will be hand fed and given as treats in his training sessions.

I have found and spoken to a holistic vet in my area and will of course be guided by her expertise. We will also be supplying certain omega -3 & 6 rich oils for a shiny coat and skin health and other vitamin supplements. We love and have always loved dogs, however, this will be the first time that we will be introducing raw food into the diet after our growing awareness of how poor the quality (even premium) commercial dog foods are. Given the controversy around raw vs cooked food, my partner and I have decided to offer a mixture of both home cooked and raw food.

As most of you know that daily physical exercise is essential for a healthy pet, I am a big advocate of not allowing our pet just sit all day with nothing to do except sleep and wait anxiously for us to come home for his walk. So chewtoys are great for reducing anxiety and boredom and providing mental stimulation.

As our pup grows, we will of course be providing some of his meals in bowls and some in puzzles, kongs etc and some still by hand.

It is great to see though that some of you who are concerned about the issue of animal cruelty are being outspoken about this, we are all definitely on the same page there. I am passionate about preventing cruelty to all animals and humans. Have a good day!

[Naturella]

@Oleanderz, you are on the right track and in good hands with the pros of this forum! 🙂

So, about exercising – obviously not while she’s recovering from the surgery, but anytime she’s well, appropriate exercise depending on health conditions (joint and bone health, any other underlying conditions, etc.) – usually good long walks/jogs/runs, depending on what Lucille can physically do/endure will be good. Fetch sessions, swims, etc. are other ways to exercise that seem like a game.

Yes, Dr. Tim’s does have big bags! Unfortunately, only big bags… I really wish he packaged in 4-5 lb bags cause I have fed 15-lb bag of his Kinesis GF, but it lasts a while, and I like to rotate more often. One day when we get another dog in addition to Bruno, I will so get 15-lb bags and be cool with it! 🙂 Victor has 30-lb bags of the GF formulas and 40-lb bags of the grain-inclusive formulas.

I am very happy with using THK as a topper and would continue to use it! It makes it so easy to make my dog flavorful, nutritious, extra-hydrating “soups”. I probably would do one topper at a time, so either EB’s tub, or some THK, etc. Treats are still ok to be given, but I’ll get to that in a second. I usually still add a tiny bit of water even when I add canned. IDK about the EB tubs’ consistency, but I like pate style canned, so when I add water, it becomes nice and mushy with the kibble. But that’s just me. Like Dori said, you don’t have to ALWAYS add water, I just choose to do so and Bruno doesn’t seem to mind at all. And he still drinks his water from the water bowl too. Also, once you get Lucille accustomed to rotation, you can totally mix brands, for example using Victor or Annamaet kibble with Earthborn tubs, or Nulo canned, etc. Nulo is also pretty good, and if you email/Facebook the company, they will send you coupons for it. Annamaet sent me samples, and so did Dr. Tim’s. At sportdogfood.com you used to be able to purchase Victor samples for 33 cents/piece, and get up to 3 samples per recipe. So you can totally try them out first before buying, but I really think that all of these are high-quality foods.

Now, I second Dori on everything – free feeding is not a great practice, nor is treat “overloading” while trying to establish good eating habits. So do as she recommends, if you want – cut treats out, pick up food after 20min if not eaten. Try again at the next meal time. I have a feeling though, that once you start rotating and adding toppers, she will be pretty excited to eat her varying meals.

Also, like Dori said – most fruits and veggies are just fine, EXCEPT for onions, grapes, and raisins. I feed Bruno the same things Dori listed, and more, and he’s doing fine. Again, no seeds or pits cause they may be toxic. If you read the ingredient lists of many of those foods, they include a wide array of fruits and veggies that are safe for doggies to eat. So don’t stress it TOO much, but if you ever decide to add broth instead of water to Lucille’s meals, just make sure it has no onions in it.

Ok, so below you will find Bruno’s meal setup for the year – food lineup and toppers per meal. I am now out of the Sojo’s for the weekend toppers, but have a few cans laying around, so that will be the topper/meal instead of Sojo’s. We are currently on the second food in the food list – Wysong.

[Dori]

Hi Oleanderz. If you are going to wait to have her spayed until the summer when you are home from college then you can start to transition her to a different and better food right away. Just do it slowly as all transitions should be done with a dog that is not accustomed to rotation feeding.

As to fruits. Many of us routinely feed our dogs fruits (small pieces depending on the size of your dog). Bananas are perfectly fine. I think what Naturella was trying to tell you is that certain fruits and veggies should never been given to a dog such as grapes, raisins, onions. If you are given your dog a fruit make sure not to give any seeds or pits. They can be toxic. For feeding apples, remember no seeds and no peel. Apples are some of the most heavily sprayed fruits of all with pesticides trying to keep worms at bay and then all the wax that is applied to make them look pretty for the consumer so it is always best to peel them. We shouldn’t be eating the peels ourself unless purchasing organic apples from your local farm market. I give my dogs apples, bananas, blueberries, carrots, cucumbers, peaches, pears, all types of melons, broccoli, the list goes on and on. You can google what fruits and vegetables are safe to give your dogs. Or in reverse you can google what fruits and veggies should not be given to your dog.

I don’t think that weight loss or gain is going to become an issue once she’s spayed. I’ve never had that occur with any dog I’ve had spayed or neutered and all my dogs have been spayed or neutered.

If your dog drinks a lot of water or at least a normal amount of water that you don’t also have to add water to a wet food. If feeding just dry food than it is always a good idea to add a little warm water to the kibble. Helps break down the kibble sooner thereby with digestion and helping the kibble to break down and move through the system sooner and the more water a dog drinks the healthier their kidneys will be also. Most dogs don’t really drink as much water as they should especially with a dry food. The longer a food sits in their system the more possibility there is for bacteria buildup which is why it’s always advised to make sure a dog always has free access to water. The only exception to that I find is when you have a puppy and you are trying to potty train but that’s a completely different method for another day.

Another thing if I haven’t mentioned it somewhere along the way is what you say is your dog’s “strange” eating habits. The correct way to feed a dog is to put his/her bowl of food down and leave it there for 20 minutes then pick it up regardless of how much she has eaten. Even if she didn’t eat any of it, pick it up. At her next meal time, not when you think she’s hungry, but at her regularly scheduled p.m. meal, put her food bowl down and again, leave it for 20 minutes. Same routine. Pick it up regardless of what she ate or didn’t it. You may have to initially stay with her in the room while she eats so that she doesn’t decide to follow you around. Once she’s retrained you won’t have to do that. Keep doing this for both her meals every single day. In a few days all dogs figure out that when food appears they must eat it because it’s going to disappear. I’ve never known a single dog that didn’t learn that. Leaving her food down all day for her to pick at it has led to her “strange” eating habits. You just have to teach her that when food is given she is to eat it and if she doesn’t she will have to wait until the next meal time. While you are retraining her you MUST NOT give her any treats during the day and in between meals or she won’t be hungry to eat her food. It’s okay if you give her a little treat later in the evening after her meals have been eaten but while training with the correct way to feed and eat she cannot be given any treats. She’s probably getting so many “treats” that she’s not really all that hungry when food comes along or she prefers her treats and knows she doesn’t really have to eat the food because treats will be coming her way.

• This reply was modified 11 years, 1 month ago by Dori.

[Bobby dog]

Yes, I ended up making treats out of them; not a favorite food for my dog.

Check out the Honest Kitchen reviews for other posters experiences and concerns with this brand:
/dog-food-reviews/honest-kitchen-grain-free/
/dog-food-reviews/honest-kitchen-dog-food/

[crazy4cats]

Oh boy, Sam D-
I hope you know what you have gotten yourself in to with this question. Put on your hard helmet! Lol! It seems to be a emotional controversial topic. But, I’m with you. I feel the same way. I still have a box of it left from my bargain trials from Pet Flow I got a while back. I mix it in by dogs kibble a couple days a week. They feel the same way too. They look at me like, “where’s the meat” as well. I think it looks and smells like soup mix too. We don’t hate it and their poops are actually good the next day after eating, but something just doesn’t feel quite right. BDog has used her boxes to make yummy treats for her dog. I’m not sure that I will buy again as it is really expensive for them to be so so about it. Many love to feed their dogs The Honest Kitchen and it does have a pretty good reputation, but I don’t think its for us either. Good luck!

[Naturella]

Oleanderz – I think it is great that you still care so much about your pup’s health, even while away at college. Earthborn Holistic GF are great foods, good choice on that one. You can also have your mom rotate foods and this will allow you to take advantage of online deals for other great foods such as Annamaet, Dr. Tim’s, Victor – all very affordable also.

As for dog boxes, I have not tried them myself, but they look like a fun thing, full of surprises, and new things she can try! As long as she doesn’t have any food allergies, then dog boxes are a great way to experiment with new treats and toys! I think the BarkBox has allergy-friendly options too.

[Dog_Obsessed]

I like to use chick pea/garbanzo bean flour when making dog treats. It has a similar consistency to wheat flour. Also, using more wet ingredients than dry could help the treats be less dry.

[Gloria K]

My thought? I maybe wrong but making a young puppy work for his food when he’s very hungry just seems kind of well, cruel to me. Again I may be wrong but if a hungry puppy wants to eat he should be able to eat. He could become very frustrated if the food doesn’t come out fast enough. Don’t beat me up over this it’s just my humble opinion but that’s how I feel. I’m not one for gimmicks and creative games when it comes to feeding dogs.
I have no objection to the Kong for treats- my Mickey loves his Kong. But when he wants to eat he wants to eat.

[Gloria K]

As you already know I make all of my dogs food and treats I have a problem and hoping someone knows the answer. The first two or three times I made treats I used wheat flour. The biscuits and cookies came out perfect just like regular cookies do. However I noticed my dog developed a very red rash on the inside of his thighs. I wondered if it could have been a wheat allergy so I stopped using wheat and started using coconut and rice flours instead. About a week later the rash went away. Two or three weeks later I gave him a wheat flour cookie just to see what would happen and the rash came back so looks like he may indeed have a wheat allergy.
The biscuits and cookies that I make him now are very dry. I’ve cut back on the amount of rice and coconut flour as someone suggested using 1/4 to 1/3 cup to the recipe calling for one cup of wheat or whole wheat flour. Has anyone used these flours and if so do you have the same problem with dryness that I have? Is there a solution to this? What am I doing wrong and what can I do to fix it?

[lovemypuppy]

I wouldn’t say I’m educated, but I’m getting there thanks to sites like this! 🙂 Good point! Knowing what my finicky pup will eat is tricky since it won’t necessarily be the same as another’s finicky pup.

After speaking with some local dog peeps, I decided to switch her to raw with only one protein source (Primal Duck Formula). She doesn’t like most treats but has never turned her nose up to freeze dried meats, including duck.

I’m hoping she likes the new food and transitions well with little GI upset. I’m also hoping the single protein source will aid in sorting out her potential allergies (environmental or food). Once she is settled for a bit, I will start rotating her food … seems like a great idea all the way around.

We are so excited to have our first ever puppy-dog! She is the cutest thing ever and brings so much joy to our family!~ Thanks for the link and food recommendations!

[Naturella]

Oh, and also – tails were wagging at all times as far as Bruno and Snowy, and they just wanted to investigate, get to know, and maybe play with Astro. But with his “dad”‘s behavior, no wonder the dog was nervous – loud, demanding voice, tension in his alpha – the poor dog must have thought he was in a danger situation and he will always think that when there are other dogs around if that’s how his alpha is acting. So he will never be calm and social with other dogs… Makes me sad for him.

And any attempts on my side to just get the dogs together, make them sit, or do something at the same time for treats so that they have a positive experience around each other never worked as Astro doesn’t know how to do tricks – either attention-span is low; he was never taught; or is not food-motivated, or all of the above – he is fed mostly from the table while his owners eat, so he knows he will get the good stuff then, so he doesn’t really do treats. So he would just wander off by his owners. Meh…

[crazy4cats]

Hi Patrick and D_O-
I am using soft chew probiotics called ProFlora by PHS right now. I like them because I can easily feed them to my dogs without hiding in food or “masking” them in peanut butter or something. I have also used similar chews made by Vetri-Science. They think they are treats. I do have golden labs, however. They think everything is a treat. Lol! I give them in the evening a few hours after their dinner and they seem to work well. No stinky gas in the family room! They have 8 or 9 strains of probiotics and a prebiotic as well. Not sure if the chews are as effective, but they have been good for us so far. I buy them from Amazon or Healthy Pets websites. I find that Healthypets.com has some of the best prices on supplements. Hope this helps.

[Dog_Obsessed]

Okay. So this is going to be looong. Sorry in advance. Basically, today we took Lily to the vet because she had been scooting some the last few days. Since her anal glands had been slightly inflamed/discolored before, her vet wanted to actually see her instead of just having the tech do it. In short, they were not pretty. (not that I actually saw them.) The fluid was discolored, which the vet thought might be pus, (hey, I warned you) and there was an area near the anal glands that was inflamed. The vet prescribed a 20 day course of an antibiotic/anti-inflammatory med, and said we should schedule a follow up appointment for when that’s over. I was not thrilled about this, but it might be necessary. I’m planning to give her some yogurt to counter the antibiotic.

The vet said she thought this was a symptom of food allergies. I was afraid that she would prescribe a prescription diet, but luckily she actually knows a thing or two about dog nutrition, and suggested an elimination diet. Basically, she thinks that after she is done with the antibiotics, we should put her on a protein that she has never had before for 6-8 weeks, and then slowly introduce other foods. I pretty much know the drill for this from being on DFA. 🙂 She also suggested home-cooking, but I’m afraid we just don’t really have time for that on a regular basis. I have a bag of Nature’s Logic Venison, and while she has never had Venison in food, she has had it in treats. Is it still okay to use as an elimination protein?

Sooo…Basically I just want to know what you guys think about all of this, and if you have any ideas. I was thinking about giving her a anal gland supplement such as Glandex, but if it is food allergies then I feel like that would be just masking the symptoms rather than solving the problem. Is it still a good idea? Thanks!

Also, an update on Lily’s leg, she is still doing well and not limping much. We’re just crossing our fingers that she stays that way. 😀

[Jodi E]

My airedale swallowed a Full Moon chicken meatball and ended up having over $2000.00 dollars worth surgery & 2 weeks of intensive post-op care.
She swallowed the treat whole, it lodged in her small intestine & started to swell with fluid, causing a small bowel obstruction. Luckily I caught it right away & she’s alive & well…BUT…I wrote the company hoping to get the product recalled. The other day I received a check for $14.00 dollars and a “Thank you for your patronage” note. WTH?!!! Thats an insult! VERY poor customer service and horrible dog treats that could kill your dog.
DO NOT PURCHASE THIS PRODUCT!

[Lyndel M]

Try buying a dehydrater. They are great. You can dehydrate your own raw treats for you dog. You can puree vegetables or fruits and spread out on a dehydrating sheet, then roll into balls or small pieces and stuff into stuffable chew toys. You can also dehydrate fresh meats, raw meatloaf, fish etc. I also make stock from organ meats and bones (no salt) and freeze into kongs as well as adding fruit, veggies or meats into the liquid and freeze into kongs in summer. Goats cheese which is lactose free is good as is quinoa cookies broken up. I also make meat pastes which I stuff along those stuffable chew toys that have groves along the sides, so they can lick it out and get interested in what’s on the inside. Hope these suggestions help, mind you, they are not my own, they are an accumulation of what I have gathered from my own research.