[Martha S]

I received my first order of Reel Raw about two weeks ago, and having starting incorporating it into our raw rotation. Here is my personal review.

The food arrived on time and frozen solid. Apparently, you do not return the coolers to the company, like we do with Darwins each month. (This really makes no difference to me, as the cooler drop off for Darwins is close to where we live.) I had ordered the Ultimate Combo #1, which is 50 pounds of ground, rmbs, and chunked meats. I figured we would try a little of everything.

After two weeks of randomly picking through several of the items, I have found them all to look like they where fresh when frozen. I thawed each one pound pouch on the counter top and it literally looks like meat that I bought from the grocery store. DH almost cooked some accidently mistaking it for our “people” groceries. Our dog really has enjoyed everything we have given him thus far from the Combo #1.

Conclusion…..two big thumbs up! Not sure how long 50 pounds will last us, especially since it will be in rotation with other raw brands we use (Darwins, Tucker’s, Primal, Answers) but I will certainly be ordering from them again.

And there’s my 2 cents worth.

[Nancy C]

BCNUT – Thank you! Will print all this off. I did not know those details re BDN and that is not good at all. My Golden eats that food like there is no tomorrow, licking the bowl as though something would come out of the bowl if she licks enough. IT is very digestible and because of that I will start the GSD on it just as a move TO raw. It’s not “total” raw or “REAL” raw but its a start and this GSD needs an easy start.
My Golden started it a month ago so I will start adding Darwins 2 oz at a time TO the BDN to transition her onto Darwins… Will add 2 oz every other day til she’s done. I think I will keep the GSD on the BDN if he digests it well for a month or so and do the same with Darwin’s. Once they both are on Darwins then I can give them something like a chicken bone at night some nights — and just have a few digestible selections on the menu, probl including BDN and Darwins. Had also liked Vital Essentials and Answers. Thought I might see how they do with those, but that’s on down the road.
I would like to have your opinion as to this plan.
Thank you.

[Nancy C]

OH MY I just figured out that BC stands for BORDER COLLIE ! Duh! My dear friend has two BCs and both are Therapy dogs with our local hospital – the Children’s Hospital. They are such wonderful and beautiful dogs! So you ARE a BC NUT!!!

Thank you for that info. I guess he COULD sometime handle these LAMB bones, which is nice to know.

I guess I need to find out from BIG DOG NATURAL about the Calcium and Phosphorus amounts so to plan for our dog. I think I am going to use some Darwins too and they are very forthcoming about those ingredients.

Our GSD can eat 1 1/2 pounds of raw food a day, according to the Calculators on raw food sites. He MIGHT need 2 full pounds. Will have to experiment I think. I had figured that down the road I can just give AXEL BDN or Darwins for breakfast and measure out on a scale the remaining weighted “True Raw” food at night, like some part of a chicken or even a part of a Turkey Neck. Does this make sense? Thanks.

[Nancy C]

Cyndi:
First your dog is beautiful! I love the way he looks right into the picture! And with seeming purpose! 🙂 I know he’s a sweet one.

Thank you for your post also. You all are really helping me. My GSD was gone for three months for training and while he was gone I decided on RAW. Like you, I read the major books, watched Becker’s videos, took notes, read on line, and my binder is jammed. He had all those troubles on Origen and Acana and i just decided kibble was not worth it.

I will brush his teeth in addition to doing the bones. Thank you for that info. Have some HARE TODAY turkey necks frozen now but he is not YET on raw. I am working with a Homeopathic Vet who is wonderful and who has recommended Big Dog Natural although DFA people did not feel good about what BDN not coming forth with info re GA. I asked BDN about it and they said they could not tell their “secret” (which she inferred had to do with the fermentation of the veggies and the air drying process). The Homeopath vet feeds BDN to his 6 dogs – several are Great Danes – and he loves the food and the company. He also feeds Darwins. He has suggested that I go cold turkey when I transition the GSD using chicken and the turkey formulas (BDN) to begin with for several weeks. One Protein. (THat is what Tracy at HARE TODAY also suggested.) Once he’s doing great on that I will pull out the Turkey necks. After that I think I can start veering out a little. Tracy at HARE TODAY emailed me to take my time and NOT PUSH IT — that getting in a hurry will mess up his digestion. She’s SELLING RAW and TOLD ME TO SLOW DOWN! (That’s a sign of a good person!)

The woman who 1/2 owns Ziwipeak has two labs and she said she feeds them Ziwi at breakfast everyday and then gives them a raw very meaty bone for supper at night. I never got into Ziwipeak myself but it was interesting to hear that she does that. Says they are a picture of health.

Now it appears I must find out about CALCIUM so I do not overdo it. Any references about that?
Thank you again for your input. This is such a great site and I have met wonderful people.
With Gratitude,
Nancy C.

[Dori]

Hi Chabs. I feed all three of my dogs (they are the three in my avatar) commercial raw foods. I also feed rotation with the different brands and also with the different proteins within the brands. All with the exception of anything fowl or fowl in the ingredient list. One of my girls, Katie, is highly allergic and intolerant. The brands that I rotate within are Primal Formulas, Vital Essentials Raw, Answers Detailed, Stella & Chew Raw, Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw, OC Raw. I used to feed Darwin’s also but they have upped their fat content and raised their prices so though all commercial raw foods are pretty expensive, I don’t appreciate a company raising their prices due to a fat increase. More nutritious ingredients I would have been fine with but not fat. I feed my girls pretty high fat foods as it is. I feed high protein, moderate to higher fat and low carbs. As for dehydrated foods (not strictly raw in the truest sense) I use The Honest Kitchen (now that they have removed alfalfa from Zeal), and Big Dog Natural. Once in a blue moon I would use freeze dried but freeze dried is the most expensive way to go. I used to need freeze dried when traveling with the dogs. I’m not one to drive around with frozen foods in coolers. Now that The Honest Kitchen has removed alfalfa from their Zeal formula (the only one that Katie could eat until she developed an intolerance to large amounts of alfalfa) I’m using THK and Big Dog Natural for traveling with the dogs. Yes, the commercial raws are expensive but not as expensive as having to spend a lot of money at the vet with issues that now no longer exist so it all paid off for me and my girls. 🙂

By the way, though your vet may have meant well, tear staining is not necessarily from the water but more an issue with foods being fed. Somewhat of a grain intolerance or allergy. There is not a type of water that I have not tried throughout the years. Tap, filtered, bottled, distilled, reverse osmosis. I even went so far as to put in a whole house water filtration system. I have an additional filter in the fridge. None of that worked. Changing them to grain free and then raw is what did the trick.

• This reply was modified 9 years, 7 months ago by Dori.
• This reply was modified 9 years, 7 months ago by Dori.

[Kristin C]

Thanks for mentioning BDN Cindy. I have not heard of it and am very interested so I emailed them with a few questions. I’m afraid their pricing might be too good to be true though. I’ve been using Darwin’s for the last few months and their trial was worth it, but they’re changing their formula and not offering any samples so I cancelled after my first auto shipment. Plus their meat turns brown in the frig and that can’t be good. My homemade raw stays nice and pink unless it’s older. I see you’ve queried on BDN on another post so I’ll keep my eye out for anyone else chiming in on whether they add supplements to it. I may just try it as “supplemental” feeding.

[Julian R]

Hi Kristin,
I adopted my chow/akita mix almost two years ago and I started feeding him raw meats more or less after a month of his arrival. I started slow, mixing ground beef with canned wet food. I eliminated kibble right away or should I say he rejected it once he was presented with an alternative diet. After about a month of a raw/canned mix, I just fed him raw meats. Once I have made the full decision of a raw diet I searched for commercially available raw meats (http://www.darwinspet.com) but it was not a cheap option. I turned to my local meat markets and bought chicken (breasts, necks, hearts, thighs), turkey legs (cut in pieces), pork neck bones, beef kidney and heart, and ground beef. I followed the advise from (http://www.dogaware.com/articles/wdjhomemade2.html) to understand the proportions needed (lean meat:bone:fat:organs).
Now let me provide potential answers for some of your questions.
How much raw food per day should I feed him? Raw diet is more nutritious than kibble and canned food so there is not need to feed them as much. Based on your dogs desired weight I would estimate 3-3.5 oz daily.
Should I start out getting packaged raw food? It tends to be more expensive and if there are good meat markets in your area with a good selection, you can buy what you need at a lower price.
Should I just give him the bones or grind them up? Most dogs can handle bone (make sure they are uncooked) but one has to be careful since choking can still happen. Avoid chicken necks since they can cause choking in small dogs. Pork necks are a good option since they are meaty and dogs can easily break them (at least medium-large dogs). Now since you have a small dog you can give him small pork neck bones but not too small that he will try to swallow it whole. Supervision is key here.
What meats can he eat? chicken, beef, pork, venison, rabbit, turkey, duck, lamb, etc
What should his daily, weekly, etc… diet consist of? The article in dogaware.com provides a very straightforward guide to establish your weekly dog diet, in summary it states that it should be 30-50 % meaty bones, 45-65 % lean meat (including eggs and dairy products) and 5% or less of organ meat.
How slowly should I introduce him to raw food? Start slow mixing 3/4 of of his usual food with 1/4 of raw. Increase slowly over a 2-4 week period.
What meats are good to introduce/start out with? Chicken is usually a good start and lean ground beef is also good. Do not feed him chicken with the skin since it will be too rich for him.
What things should I get to start out with(what kind of meat grinder, what kind of storage containers, etc…)? I don’t use a meat grinder and most likely you can ask your local butcher to do the grinding you need. I ended up buying a freezer for his food and I thaw enough for 2-3 days inside the refrigerator. I keep thawed food in a closed large glass container inside the refrigerator.
How should I handle the meat? I have a cutting board, knife and other utensils to handle his food which I do not use for anything else. I wash everything with plenty of dish soap and hot water. I obviously I wash my hands thoroughly after handling raw meats. How much will this cost per month? For my 62 pound, I spend in average $70 a month. What veggies and fruits should I include in his diet daily, weekly, etc…??? About 6 months ago, I found out about a dog raw food vendor that distributes a great variety of raw food in NJ, CT, MA, NH, and VT. (http://www.topqualitydogfood.com/). They don’t mail so one has to picked up at specific services areas where they stop and it is once a month only. Anyway, they have meats mix with veggies and fruits which I give to my dog. You can see more information about giving vegetables and fruits to your dog. Keep in mind that vegetables should be preferably cooked and give as a puree mixed with meat for better absorption. How much low-fat cottage cheese, veggies, etc… should I feed him daily, weekly, etc…??? Cheese is as an occasional part of his diet but I dont feed him daily perhaps once a week but not too much.
What kind of fish can he eat? most fish except salmon or trout fromPacific Northwest. I feed my dog Chilean Salmon.
Should I add fish oil or probiotics or whatever else to his daily, weekly, etc… diet?? It is recommended to complement his diet with fish oil. I am not sure about probiotics, though.

I advise you to take a look at the books recommended if you can or at least check the websites. Also, try to connect with owners of small dogs that feed them raw. I strongly believe it is the best diet for dogs but it requires some learning from the owner.

[cindy q]

Thanks Kristin, I just tried Big Dog Natural freeze dried after someone on this board recommended it and my dogs love it! I have a Standard Poodle and a toy poodle they both absolutely love it. My toy will sit and cry while she is waiting for me to mix it. I e-mailed the company with questions before I ordered and they responded within 10 minutes of me e-mailing them each time. I e-mail Darwins with questions and they responded 3 days later.

[Marla J]

To Marilyn E.
Thanks for the advice about Darwin’s. I have an introductory order coming soon. also, I used to hand out treats all the time to train my dogs, and then I found gentledogtraining.com. These trainers live in my city, but they have a training package with DVD you can order online which teaches you great stuff on how to train through leadership vs treat dispensing. I love it! They are the ones who recommended a raw diet, as they use it for their 8 dogs.

[Nancy C]

No but I have been using Big Dog Natural, a dehydrated air dried. Can’t say enough about it but I own no stock and don’t know anyone in the company. All flavors include fermented veggies and Tripe in every meal. My 10 1/2 yr old Golden transitioned to it from kibble cold turkey without the first problem. Never even a softer stool. BDN was recommended to me by a homeopathic vet who feeds it and Darwins to his 6 dogs. My neighbor started using it with her three dogs with the same experience. She also went cold turkey from kibble and it was a piece of cake for all 3. You might want to try it. Customer Service (Chris) is great help.

[pugmomsandy]

I agree with crazy4cats. I would definitely contact the company. They should easily give you the phosphorus content. You and your vet might check into the Lamb Kidney Support formula from here:

http://www.myperfectpetfood.com/products.html

Or the kidney diet from Darwins:

http://www.darwinspet.com/our-raw-foods/our-raw-dog-food/intelligent-design-ks/

[Nancy C]

Dear Ladies, How I share your feelings and fears. But knowing how good raw seems to be I felt that I must give it a try. Here is my experience and it is one of many – but I have learned at DFA Hearing others’ Experience helps. Due to my 15 mos old GSD having terrible problems due to transitioning to a high end food from TOW due to the recalls- we ended up for 6 weeks at the vet (due to diarrhea) who put him on antibiotics and HILLS POISON WD Formula to heal him. He lost 6 pounds over several weeks. A nightmare.
I was scared of raw, but felt I MUST TRY. So I hired a Homeopathic Vet to help me through to raw. (My reg vet is not into nutrition) He recommends raw for dogs. He also recommends two brands of raw which he feeds to his own 6 dogs: Darwin’s and Big Dog Natural. BDN is a air dried -dehydrated raw to which is added TRIPE to every formula and the veggies are fermented. BOTH these aspects support digestion. First I started with our 10 1/2 yr old Golden Retriever. He suggested that I start with the BDN – would probl be easier to digest. I went Cold Turkey. Chris at BDN strongly advised AGAINST mixing raw and kibble. She all but guaranteed cold turnkey would work fine. One morning I held my breath, stopped kibble totally and fed the BDN as directed. It was a piece of cake! Dog did not skip a beat. The vet said it is bec this food is SO EASILY DIGESTED. And my dog licked the bowl for over a 1 1/2 minutes! Loved the food. There was NEVER any diarrhea nor ANY signs of ANY difficulty. It was magic. I am leaving her on this for 1 month and then will start introducing the Darwins WITH BDN 2 oz at a time. I told my neighbor about BDN and she ordered it and today told me she went COLD TURKEY with her THREE dogs and no problems at all. EASY! She’s now into her second large order of the food! So I will start my GSD soon. He just arrived from training and I want to acclimate him to being back home and I too shall go cold turkey with him. Chris at BDN says one of her customers is a GSD Breeder and he LOVES the food and gives it to ALL HIS DOGS! So, hope this helps a smidgen. Good luck to you!
Nancy Calloway
Oh PS — I do not have stock in BDN, I am in NC they are in NJ, I do not know the owners nor do I know ANYONE there. Chris in Cust Serv is very helpful and nice. I never heard of the food until the Homeopath vet told me about it.

[InkedMarie]

I’m not happy with the new Darwin’s, don’t like that they’ve raised the fat. I personally don’t see the need for fruits or veggies in Boone’s raw so he gets grinds from Hare Today or Reel Raw.

[DogFoodie]

I’ve also used Darwin’s, Hare Today and My Pet Carnivore. I love to order from MPC and they also have a home delivery / pickup route, which I’m on. Pickup nets me all I want for $10.00. You can also order some raw from Wag.com. I’ve ordered NV from them, which ships frozen in an insulated container with dry ice for no additional charge than regular shipping (free with minimum purchase).

[Nancy C]

Marilyn: Great info. thank you.
My into order of DARWINs is in the freezer. I transitioned my 10 1/2 yr old Golden Retriever to Big Dog Natural dehydrated raw first. It is fermented and green tripe is in every meal; both help digestion. My homeopathic vet recommends BOTH these raw brands on his site, also feeds them to his dogs and he suggested the Big Dog Natural would probably be easier to digest cold turkey. Our dog transitioned beautifully without a loose stool, diarrhea or any transitional symptoms. Was a piece of cake and she loves the food. BDN is a very small company and the Customer Service is great. Ask for Chris. The number is on the website. After several weeks on BDN we will move to DARWINS as part of rotation. it is true raw & I anticipate no troubles. Their website is great and people seem to like the food.
There are several other raw foods I plan to use: ANSWERS Raw food, OC Raw, VITAL ESSENTIALS, & Hare Today. All have websites. There are other good ones! These suggestions come from the generous, helpful posters at DFA. (I really don’t have much experience but have studied raw all summer.) Best of luck. Hope this helps.

[Marilyn E]

I’ve been feeding Darwin’s for 2 years and am very pleased with the quality. (darwinspet.com). I have a standing monthly order, and it arrives by UPS. They send return labels so you can ship the boxes back, which is Eco friendly. If I don’t get around to taking them to UPS, I just leave them out on the next delivery day and the driver takes them. Darwin’s has 2 lines of food, one is free range, no hormones or antibiotics; the other is human grade, USDA inspected. Darwin’s is an complete diet–includes veggies, organ meats, ground bone.
To answer the other part of your question: I supplement the raw with probiotics, coconut oil, omega 3s, and Spirulina-Astizanthan (Mercola Healthy Pets online). I do feed treats cuz I don’t know how you train without it, but if I don’t use meat leftovers, I use high quality treats, such as freeze-dried liver, Real Meat brand dog treats, or ZiwiPeak dehydrated raw food.

[Nancy C]

I started transitioning my 10 yr old Golden R to RAW 8 days ago. She ate kibble for TEN YEARS! I was scared. With the help/ advice from a good Homeopath DVM I started with Big Dog Natural, a dehydrated raw. He suggested it because he knows the company, it is an excellent food which he feeds his 6 dogs (rotates w Darwins). The strength of the food is that it is FERMENTED and every meal has GREEN TRIPE included. Both these 2 ingredients are excellent digestive aids. So when I fed the first meal — Cold Turkey – NOT mixed with kibble due to the different digestion times for kibble and raw (There are varied opinions on feeding raw and kibble simultaneously). Customer Service and Dr. Loops recommended cold turkey – NOT MIXING THE TWO. Customer service all but guaranteed me there would be no problem.
I was very nervous but I followed their advice. There was NOTHING TO TO IT! Worked beautifully plus my dog LICKED THE BOWL for over 1 1/2 minutes. She LOVED the food. NO DIARRHEA and NO LOOSE STOOL which I was expecting! NONE. This was a PIECE OF CAKE! She has Significantly smaller stools. After a few weeks on this raw food I will ADD DARWIN’S. Then will ADD other raw foods.Have Darwin’s patties, Tripe and Turkey Necks from HARE TODAY in my freezer. The homeopath said that going to BDN would be easier and a great intro into raw. They are on the net. Great Customer Service. The ONLY thing that is “difficult” is that you have to let the food REHYDRATE for about 12 to 15 min before feeding. Can do that at night and leave in frig so to feed your dog immediately in the morning. Check out the website and good luck.

[neezerfan]

Darwin’s free trial is a great deal! I use that as part of our rotation, now.

[George D]

Hi Stewart, I started her when she was 4 months on orijen dry mixed with their freeze dried line, she likes it and no problems. I’ve tried stella and chewys frozen patties and she also likes them. I’m leaning towards half dry ( orijen ) and half raw. Any other suggestions on good brands? Was also thinking of trying Darwin’s free trial.

[Nancy C]

Okay – For whoever is interested, I am presently transitioning my 10 yr old Golden Retriever to Raw. I acquired the help of a homeopathic vet to be my coach for the transition of my two dogs due to the horrific time I had with my GSD in the spring. Dr. Loops has a website on which he strongly recommends raw. He specifically recommends BDN and Darwin’s. His 6 dogs all eat rotations of those two foods. In consultation with him on Friday he suggested that I try the BDN first , due to the fermentation and the tripe which is in ALL of BDN food. After a few days I will introduce Darwin’s which arrived Friday. The woman at BDN all but promised me the golden would do fine, saying so many very sick dogs have transitioned to this food with ease. She claims that the tripe and fermentation are key to digestion.
Yesterday morning I gave my golden 1/2 cup of BDN with NO KIBBLE. (The BDN company recommended NOT mixing the two together due to the different digestion times. They were confident that she would do fine).
Hannah gobbled up the food and licked the bowl like there was no tomorrow.
Early afternoon I gave her some homemade bone broth.
For supper she ate 3/4 cup of only BDN. All was well.
TOday it was 3/4 cup again and tenacious bowl licking.
During our walk she pooped small poops as the woman at BDN said she would. It was normal in consistency and NO DIARRHEA (yet ?) and the stool was not even “soft.” It was moist, smaller than usual and just fine. Yesterday’s stool was the kibble from Friday and it was large and lots of it. Today’s, which reflected yesterday’s BDN, was VERY different.
The woman told me to watch the poops, that they would tell all.
That’s my story of the last 28 hours.
It appears that by tomorrow she will be on her protocol of 1 cup 2x day.
This transition has been a piece of cake.

[Nancy C]

Hi Pugsmom: My intro box of BigDogNatural just arrived yesterday. Their customer service is wonderful. My Question to you since you have experience: I’m transitioning my 10 yr old Golden to Raw. Historically she can eat anything anytime. The Homeopathic vet I talked to yesterday highly recommends this food and Darwin’s for raw dogs. Says he uses both (rotates) with his 6 dogs with great results.
The Customer Service urged me yesterday to feed it Cold Turkey – not to mix with kibble due to the length of time kibble requires to get digested. (That seems so severe esp for an older dog) but their rep was very clear about not mixing bec could cause gas and stomach upset. She said with the tripe and fermented veggies the dog will do FINE on it alone. The plan is to move to Darwin’s next. My Darwins arrived yesterday too. The vet yesterday said he thinks BDN will be more readily welcomed by the gut than even the Darwins, due to the fermentation and the tripe. But he really likes Darwins as well.
In her video Karen Becker suggests NOT mixing kibble with raw but to feed kibble and offer the raw separately as treats during the day, increasing the treats and reducing the kibble gradually.
The BDN woman said if I still feed kibble should feed it separately as a meal without raw, and feed the raw as a separate meal.
Any insights/ suggestions FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE will be welcome.
Thank you.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I’ve noticed that Darwin’s feeding recommendations are way off as well. I can’t think of any reason other than to make the food appear cheaper to feed than it actually is.

[DogFoodie]

I wish I could recall his name, but there was a guy who posted briefly on the review side at least a year ago who mentioned that he fed his dog about three times what I fed mine when I feed mine Darwin’s. Our dogs were similarly sized. I remember being shocked at the amount he fed, but thought it was so different from what I feed mine, because his dogs were more active than mine; and, if memory serves, he fasted his dogs one day a week so it averaged out to be somewhat less over the course of the week. I rotate so often and use a variety of foods, so I don’t use any one food long enough to notice a weight loss when I am feeding Darwin’s, but I can imagine that might be the case.

My Cavalier needs to drop some weight. Maybe I’ll pull out the Darwin’s and feed it exclusively to her for a while and see what happens.

[“Blue”]

Inked, I did check the Darwin’s this evening. An 8 oz. (1/2 pound) pack of Darwin’s is right on a full cup.

I’m not hung up on having to feed him 1230 cal./day. I am hung up on Darwin’s telling me to feed my dog about half the calories he needs. I can only presume in order to mask the truth of how expensive it is to feed my pet their food.

BTW, you weren’t supposed to remind me to watch my dog. 🙂

[“Blue”]

InkedMarie, You got my curiosity up so I went back to their site. I haven’t seen their recommendation for Cups at all. But it looks like you’re seeing a pound of their food is equivalent to a cup. I’ll check that this evening.

On this page http://www.darwinspet.com/resources/how-to-feed-raw/ I found 2 references to amounts fed. First says large dogs may eat 2% of their body weight and small dogs up to 4% per day. Second is a bullet list, which includes 8 lbs. per week for 50 lb. dog, which is pretty much inline with the 9 lb. they gave me when ordering on the phone. (You get this same 9 lb. when going thru the web ordering steps too.)

If I calc 4% of body weight, 55 x .04 = 2.2 x 7 days = 15.4 lbs. per week.
15.4 x 16 oz. x 36 Cal. = 8870 Cal. per week
8870 / 7 = 1260 Cal. per day.
Wow, there’s the magic number to keep his weight up.

I’m sure they are a good company with quality products, but I’m starting to think they recommend low feeding quantity numbers on purpose.

• This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by "Blue".

[InkedMarie]

I don’t believe they’re rated here because it’s not a pre made raw like Darwin’s, Bravo etc.
They have great shipping prices! I’m happy with whist I’ve gotten.

[InkedMarie]

I can’t do math to save my life so I use the dog food calculator here on DFA. I looked up Darwin’s Zoologics chicken which is 592 calories. I used that, your 55 pound dog, typical activity level and it says a little over 2cups which is pounds of food a day.

[“Blue”]

I have bought both Darwin’s and Natures Variety Instinct Raw frozen foods and am having difficulty reconciling their recommended feeding amounts. (Disclosure, sometime in the past 2 months I replied to a similar dry kibble post and suggested the OP use the feeding guides on the package as a starting point but to watch the dog’s body shape using the healthy dog image silhouettes available for that purpose. In other words, if your dog looks fat, feed less, if he looks thin, feed more.)

According to the Dog Food Calculator my 55 lb. dog needs 1230 Calories. For now, forget about differences in one dog’s metabolism, daily exercise, etc. “1230 Cal.” This request to help me understand is about the math, not the individual dog.

NV says my dog needs 1250 Cal. per day (close enough) and that I should feed him 19.5 oz. per day. Their nutrition info says their chicken patties have 49 Cal. per oz. which means 955 Cal. to be fed. Why tell me he needs 1250 and then tell me to only feed 955? That’s a Cal. shortage of about 25%.

Darwins says to feed my dog 9 lbs. per week. Their nutrition info says the chicken recipe is 36 Cal. per oz. That gives 5184 Cal. per week, /7 is 740 Cal. per day. That’s a Cal. shortage of about 60%.

Guess what I’ve been seeing in my dog for the past few weeks. Yep, he’s lost weight.

Can anybody explain why these (or any) companies are so conservative in their recommendations? Am I doing the math wrong? (even if I am, he’s lost considerable weight.) Is there some bit of knowledge I’m missing about feeding raw as relates to weight gain/loss?

Please don’t tell me to follow my own previous advice. Evidently I’ll surely go broke trying to feed him commercial raw.

Thanks,
Steve

[InkedMarie]

I’ve used Darwin’s & was very happy with it. I can’t help with your dog with kidney disease but I would call Darwin’s & ask to speak to James.

[Michelle D]

Wow, I totally meant Darwin’s. Should have reread better.
I will definitely talk to my vet about taking him off raw. I was just wondering because Darwin’s has a kidney diet now. Thanks

[Pat G]

I have not heard of Dawson. I have used Darwin’s which I was very happy with. If your dog has kidney problems the protein may be to high in raw foods. I think Dog Food Advisor has a section of recommended dog foods for kidney problem. I took my dog off of raw because of pancreatitis.

[Elaina S]

I would also like to nominate Darwin’s. My very picky eater can’t get enough of it so I am thankful to have a product that is both healthy and appetizing.

[Dori]

Hi Kristin. I switched all three of my girls a bit over two years ago due to all the issues that Katie was having. At that point while I researched dog foods and her issues on line I was fortunate to come across the Dog Food Advisor and as I have mentioned more times than I can count my girls and I will be eternally grateful to Dr. Mike. Unfortunately it was Dr. Mikes loss of Penny that set him on his quest to find a better dog food his canine and we have all benefited from it. I still grieve for him, his family, and, of course, Penny. Anyone of us that has lost a dog or any other pet understands his plight. He actually did something about it that has benefited so many of us and our pets.

Anyway, your question to me, specifically, was what am I feeding Katie. I feed all three of my little girls the same exact food because I don’t want to take a chance that my “delicate flower Katie” gets into anything other than what seems to work for her. I mostly feed commercial raw foods: Primal Formulas, Answers Detailed, Stella & Chewy’s Raw Food, Darwin’s (on line delivery and auto-delivery only), Natures Variety Instinct Raw, Vital Essentials Raw. I rotate their foods between these are probably other raw foods also. I do add at times proteins that I’m preparing for my husband and myself. I add either Natures Logic Sardine oil, or canned sardine’s in water two or three times a week. On the days that I split a can of sardines in water amongst the three of them I omit the sardine oil (kept refrigerated-important to keep oils refrigerated), I add a little coconut oil to their meals once a day every day. I also give them as snacks organic fruits, veggies. I do not feed any commercial treats whatsoever. To many recalls, too many issues with gmo ingredients, too many ingredients not disclosed from China. Katie has too many food intolerances for me to feed any commercial treats. Most are bound by oatmeal, barley, or some such grain. I choose not to do that. We adopted her at the age of 9 weeks old. She was the runt of her litter and was going to be “euthanized”. Friends told me about her knowing what a complete SUCKER I am. I need to have that tattooed on my forehead. She has food and environmental issues. She has had many dental issues and at the age of 8 months old she had a severe luxating patella issue that was severe enough that she had to have surgery, water treadmill therapy, etc. etc. With all her issues she is the mushy gushiest lovey dog I have ever come across in my 65 years of age. You get what you give. The reason for my reply to you initially is that I truly believe that you have to pay it forward in this life. Some people read and study the science, I have always learned and lived from experience. Not saying that the science is wrong or that anyone that wants to go that way is wrong, not at all. It’s everyone’s choice. I choose experience. I know that Katie was a mess, completely a mess when I got her at 9 weeks. She is a fabulous dog and a real happy camper at this point. She loves everyone and everyone loves her. Anyway, Kristin C. That’s my experience with Katie. I have also thanked Dr. Mike, Sandy S., and HDM as well as anyone and everyone here on DFA for their kindness, knowledge, and love of animals. MY other two dogs that have had no issues concerning diet whatsoever, Hannah my 15 year old Maltese, and Lola my 5 year old Yorkipoo but have benefited exponentially from everyone here on DFA. That’s what I’ve learned from my fellow posters and that’s what I’ve tried to “pay it forward”. Gotta go now. My husband is yearning for some “Cold Stone” ice cream. He has macular degeneration and can no longer drive so I reap the benefits from his ice cream urges. Hot Fudge sundae for me. I hear it calling my name.

• This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by Dori.

[Kristin C]

As a follow up, I feed Darwin’s and Nature’s Variety raw and Orijen 6 Fish kibble. I usually add cottage cheese or yogurt to the kibble meals. My homemade consists of 65% meat, 10% organ, 5% liver, 15% pumpkin or sweet potato, 5% veggie pulp from my juicer, plus eggs. I add a half teaspoon eggshell per each pound of meat and some fish oil and vitamin e. RMBs consist of chicken backs, turkey or duck necks. My homemade is chicken and beef, beef I can get more variety of organs. Sometimes I use a pre-mix (Sojos grain free) if I don’t have time for the veggie pulp. I usually give 1 or 2 small dried beef trachea during the week too, not too many other treats.

[Nancy C]

In September I am transitioning my 2 yr old GSD over to raw and have developed a plan, thanks to the wonderful friends at DFA. 🙂 My 10 yr old Golden Retriever deserves better food too. So I wondered if a chicken wing on top of her bowl of kibble is a good start? She’s had kibble all her life. She is great about rotating any brand anytime. Switches on a dime easily. I put it in the bowl: She sniffs and EATS it. Recently when I prepared an organic chicken for our dinner I handed her the livers and heart raw and she gobbled them. No problem. What I am scared of is she won’t know to smash the wings before swallowing and then she will choke. I don’t want to lose my dog. Someone told me yesterday her dogs sometime spit UP wings but then they eat them back down. She says it is normal to smash them by chomping down a time or two with back teeth and then let them slide on down the throat. This Golden is 55 pounds. Not huge and not heavy. Do any of you give chicken wings to a dog her size or smaller? Do you have a better idea? Should I just go on and order Darwins or Answers and start her on Raw that way? I plan to give her Probiotics the night before just to prep her intestinal tract. Thoughts, advice are appreciated. Thank you.

[Nancy C]

Deborah – I heard back from him late last night. I was mostly interested in the prices per day bec I have a GSD AND a Golden Retriever– two big dogs. He said that the AMOUNT to mix with water is on the back of the bag/ box. I did the figuring and it’s at about $8 a day IF the amount is accurate for my dog. An 8 lb bag makes 32 pounds of food and will last about 2 to 3 weeks he said. That fits my calculations.
It could easily take more than they recommend. One never knows for sure. And I have a second dog… So I am looking at other producers, checking prices. Darwins, (Not dehydrated) for ex is Organic which also means GMO Free and it is $6 a day for Turkey, $6.75 for beef and $5.25 for chicken. I do not know if k9Naturals is GMO Free or Organic, but there is no mention on the website of it.
Today I am pouring over DFA Raw to see what else is recommended by some of the old timers. I also do not want anything HPP. (I don’t know if k9 is HPP and need to find out). As one of the old timers said, the pickings get mighty slim.
This is a time consuming process. I learned so much from the posters this morning at the Nature’s Variety discussions. Wow. So much to learn about Raw. Thank you again too. I am so grateful to the kind helpful people there, just like you! I talked to Jaqualine, one of the owners of ANSWERS raw food, yesterday. Wow she was so helpful and knowledgable. She also has a GSD and was able to give me first hand advice.
Have a good day! Many thanks to you!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Nancy –

I haven’t tried K9 Natural but I have tried Darwin’s and Answer’s. A lot of posters here use Darwin’s and like it a lot. I think Darwin’s is a good product and I don’t have any issues with recommending it but it doesn’t meet the needs of what I look for when choosing a food for my dogs. I have large, highly active hounds and Darwin’s is just too low fat/low calorie. I love Answer’s, it’s probably my favorite brand of commercial raw. I love that there are no synthetic vitamins and minerals and the fat to protein ratio is perfect for my dogs. I’ve spoken in depth about the product with Jacqueline Hill, the Vice President of Operations and Product Development, and I was very impressed with the ingredient and manufacturing standards. I don’t feed pre-made raw too often because it’s so expensive, but when I do Answer’s is one of my go-to brands.

[Nancy C]

Hi Deborah:
I’m very interested in your experience w K9 Natural. When you started it did you notice any weight loss or gain? I have a 72 pound GSD and am planning to go raw. But when we travel I need a good dehydrated food which means that I will probably feed raw raw in the mornings and dehydrated at night or several times a week at least. Can you share a little more about your transition and anything else? Also have you tried Darwins or Answers? Or has anyone who has just read this? Thank you.

[Bobby dog]

Hi Tracy:
All of the food recommendations you have received are excellent choices, raw and kibble! Hopefully you can find one that works.

I just have one suggestion for you. I understand budget requirements and even though NV raw might not be in your budget right now as a main diet I would like to suggest maybe try feeding it on a rotational basis. I feed my dog kibble with canned, lightly cooked fresh meat, or commercial dehydrated/freeze dried/frozen raw food for each meal. Most of the time the raw he gets is used as a topper in place of canned food rather than an entire meal of raw (budget issues, lol). I try to feed raw weekly; sometimes more often sometimes not. Regardless of how often I feed raw, he does love it and I believe the variety is good for him.

Check out NV’s website. If you sign up for news letters they send out monthly coupons for their products. Most of the time it’s for their frozen raw. I buy small bags and feed it to both my dog and cats. Check out Darwins too as InkedMarie suggested. I have not fed that brand, but it is recommended by many posters on DFA.

[InkedMarie]

Tracy, if you want to feed raw, look at Darwins.

[Nancy C]

Hey – Thank you. This is Nancy C. I was inquiring bec a highly regarded Homeopathic Vet recommends DARWIN and Bid Dog Natural food for those people who are not going to feed raw implemented with the extra nutrients which he lists on his website. The homeopathic vet is very meticulous, but I could not figure out WHY it is not reviewed here.
Thank you!

[Dori]

If you live near a Pet Smart, they carry Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw. It is a very good commercial raw diet that takes all the guess work out of your preparing raw yourself and wondering how to balance it all out. I feed commercial raw foods and Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw is one of the foods in my rotation. Others I use are Primal Raw, Stella & Chewy’s Raw, Darwin’s (fabulous food and one of the raw foods with the lowest amount of fat that I have found), Vital Essential’s Raw, Answers Detailed Raw. There are quite a few others, just wanted to give you some ideas. Some are more difficult to find, but as I said Nature’s Variety Instinct Raw is sold at Petco and Petsmart and a lot of small pet food stores also.

I have read on occasion on this site that some dogs that are prone to seizures are having difficulty with rosemary. So as HDM stated, I too would avoid it. Why take chances.

Also, please go with a grain free food. Dogs have no need for grains, potatoes, rice, corn, soy and, in fact, these ingredients cause many different issues in dogs. Switching to raw made a world of difference with my three dogs.

As HDM stated, traditional vets are not nutritionists. Pay no attention to their advice on feeding unless you are going to a holistic, homeopathic vet. They are very hard to find. And certainly do not feed your dog any of the foods that the traditional vet sells. Very little actual quality (if any at all) real food in what they sell. Pedigree, Purina, Iams are also terrible foods. Lots of fillers and very little quality proteins.

• This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by Dori.

[Dori]

Hi Cyndi. I’ve been reading this forum and wondering what, if anything, I can add. One…..Wait until blood test results come back. I hope that you had your vet do a complete CBC and also thyroid work up. Thyroid lab results always take a few more days to come back then the rest of tests. Hannah has been hypothyroid for years (loss of hair, etc. etc.). Another thing is that if you can afford it please don’t go with Bravo (recalls and other issues that I have heard about from friends that used to feed Bravo). Primal is an excellent choice. Obviously so is Darwins (in the long run, cheaper that most commercial raw diets). Also Answers Detailed, Stella & Chewy’s Raw, Natures Variety Instinct Raw. Obviously there are many other fine quality commercial complete and balanced raw diets. Please wait, breathe, and wait for test results. Then……weigh your options. The last option you should go with, imho, is kibble, especially with a dog that has been eating raw. Wait and see what’s going on with Bailey before jumping ship. Keep us posted.

[Debra J H]

If you really want top notch, Darwin’s raw food has some specialty diets now and has one for kidney issues. I do know this is a very serious condition. I too have Cavaliers and know of three Cavaliers who got protein losing enteropathy after eating tainted kibble. One was getting the Iams recalled and two others got it after being put on Science Diet ID.

• This reply was modified 9 years, 10 months ago by Debra J H.

[Lorenza S]

I have been giving our dog Lotus brand grain free kibble mixed with Merrick’s canned grain free for the last year with really no difference in the amount of eye gunk. It comes and it goes…. but in the last month I have been going over to Darwin’s natural selection raw also mixed in with Lotus kibble in place of the Merrick’s grain free canned food. Our dog now has gunk almost always and now has a little hot spot between his toes. This month has been a real change for the worse and I cannot tell if it’s due to the change over to Darwin’s Raw. It seems to be illogical that Darwin’s is the reason. Could it be just that it is summer and more humid and more pollen? Also, is Darwin’s worth all the expense and trouble? And is it better than Stella and Chewy’s frozen raw patties? A lot of questions here so I’m grateful for any answers that you can give me….

[Kenneth N]

Hi Freeholdmom..I’m Freehold Pugpoppa. Three pugs all with issues. Currently we give he boys tripe treats, homemade dehydrated veggies, beef, or turkey. We have tried freeze dried Orijen treats We feed them Darwin’
s and stay away from Raaw Energy because I do not trust Kitt.

[Dori]

Melissa I am so sorry to hear your sad news. Hopefully your pup will remain asymptomatic and with a loving mom like yourself will live a long happy life.

Losul: I too would never put any of my dogs on prednisone without a definitive reason and after getting at minimum a second opinion. Putting pup on those meds is only masking what the real problem is which I believe is probably something in the food she’s feeding.

Lisa C: I would not put my dog if it was vomiting on a daily basis on any type of medication whatsoever without knowing definitively what the problem is. Nor would I have an endoscopy done on a dog that is in the condition that your dog is in. I don’t think he’d survive the surgery. My advice to you is to introduce slowly a commercial raw diet staying away from chicken and all poultry in the title and further down in the ingredient list. I’m not saying that poultry is the culprit but if that’s what I’m feeding then I would change the protein. Commercial raw foods that I feed are Natures Variety Instinct Raw, Primal Formula raw, Vital Essentials raw, Stella & Chewy’s Raw, Answers Detailed, Darwin’s Raw (only available on line directly from them on an auto order basis). Stay away from poultry, commercial raws are grain free (dogs do not need grains), stay away from white potato and tomatoes. The last two are inflammatory and your poor dog does not need anything to cause more inflammation that it’s going through. I would go to the store, buy one of the raws, also some digest enzyme, a can of pure pumpkin (not pie filling type) and immediately start transitioning your dog to a commercial raw food. Yes, of course your dog is going to initially have some diarrhea that will be due to his physical condition and the switch but that will right itself pretty quickly. I don’t mean to scare you but if your own vet is telling you that your dog looks like a survivor of a concentration camp and also won’t do surgery then I really don’t know what your waiting for to make the food change. Though I typically agree with ACV, I don’t in a case of constant vomiting due to its acidic nature that is worse coming up then going down. This is from my own personal experience with my illness and nausea and vomitting.

I don’t mean to sound so harsh and as if I’m scolding but I’m really quite concerned about your dog. I only found this particular forum today. I can’t believe has long this has been allowed to continue.

[loopoo]

Trying to find a food without a soy based vitamin, like pulling teeth. Unfortunately Natures logic has alfalfa( dogs are allergic to that… anyone know any other brands? stinks as I phoned a few raw food suppliers that had a balanced mix, even Darwin, their vitamins are soy sourced( so far Honest Kitchen is the only soy free one i know, but had hoped to add another to the mix….

[Kelsey K]

Hi all!

First time poster here. HDM, thank you for all of this great information you’ve compiled! I very well could’ve missed it in the previous 73 pages (let me know if these questions have already been answered!), but I had a few questions about raw food and puppies.

I am a first-time LBD owner and will be bringing home an 8-week old berner boy in a month. I’d love to get him on a raw diet ASAP but am worried about the calcium content. My FIV+ kitty boy is currently eating Natural Pet Pantry (NPP), and I love how healthy it’s kept him.

Can I start feeding raw to a Bernese at 8 weeks old or should we start with kibble first? Any suggestions on a specific commercial raw? I’ve been looking at Darwin’s or NPP, but am totally open to anything and everything! If not raw right away, what’s the best kibble for a BMD? I’m eyeing Fromm, but I want to do everything right!

Thanks in advance for the help!

• This reply was modified 9 years, 10 months ago by Kelsey K.

[DogFoodie]

I’m using Stella & Chewy’s raw frozen right now. I’ve also use Darwin’s, which I think is great. Lots of folks use Primal and think highly of it. I’ve also used Nature’s Variety and liked that a lot.