[Hound Dog Mom]

DoggieDoc22 –

“One last thing, don’t buy into the marketing machine and get all hung up on ingredients. Your dog needs nutrients, not ingredients. Its protein, fat, and carbohydrate levels that are important, not corn, soy, potato, etc.”

Question, if a new meal replacement bar came onto the market for humans that contained all the essential vitamins, minerals and amino acids (synthetically added) a human needs plus adequate levels of protein, fat and carbohydrates and the main ingredients were refined grains, high fructose corn syrup and partially-hydrogenated oil would you quit eating real food and eat this for every meal? I mean it contains the necessary “nutrients”, right? Hopefully that analogy makes you understand how ridiculous your statement is.

Ingredients matter. As I told you on another thread – you can’t put ground chuck into recipe and get filet mignon in the end. Garbage is garbage. Yes, all living things need nutrients but these nutrients (or at least the majority of these nutrients) should be derived from fresh, whole, species-appropriate foods. I’ll give you some food (no pun intended) for thought.

1) Many health organizations (including the U.S. Cancer Institute and the United Kingdom Health Department) advise humans to get their nutrients from whole foods and not synthetic supplements (shouldn’t our pets do the same?). When dealing with synthetic nutrients, the chance for overdose is much higher – chance of overdose is minimal when consuming whole foods. Errors in compounding synthetic concoctions happen and pets die – for example the excess vitamin d recall. You don’t have to worry about there “accidentally” being too much vitamin d when the vitamin d source is real, whole foods.

2) You say that the inclusion of ingredients such as “corn, soy and potato” are inconsequential – what matters it the “guaranteed analysis” of the end result. So a mixture of corn, soy and potato is perfectly fine as long as the protein, fat and carbohydrate levels are where they need to be and the food is pumped up with artificial nutrients to account for the lack of nutrients in the ingredients themselves, right? Well let’s examine these ingredients that you say are fine to feed:

-Soy: contains anti-nutrients which hinder the ability of digestive enzymes needed for proper digestion; contains phytates which limit the body’s ability to absorb key nutrients such as zinc, magnesium and calcium; loaded with isoflavones that disrupt endocrine function and have been linked to infertility and breast cancer (in humans); contains goitrogens which block the synthesis of thyroid hormones; most soy is genetically modified (studies in animals have linked consumption of GMO ingredients to negative hepatic, pancreatic, renal and reproductive side effects that may alter the hematological, biochemical and immunologic parameters).
-Corn: contains lectins, has a high glycemic index, one of the most genetically modified crops (see above), highly susceptible to aflatoxin contamination.
-Potatoes: also commonly genetically modified (see above), high glycemic index, contain lectins, can contain the toxin solanine.

3) Most of the low-grade foods that contain corn, soy and the like also contain animal by-products. Are animal by-products inherently bad? No – my dogs love fresh organ meat, chicken feet, beef tracheas, etc. (from animals slaughtered for human consumption) and I love allowing them to eat fresh, quality by-products. However fresh quality by-products are not what is in pet food. Many grocery store quality brands of dog food have tested positive for pentobarbital – this means that the by-products contain euthanized animals (potentially even dogs and cats). Pento is recognized as a serious danger to wildlife. Wildlife that feed on disposed euthanized animals often die of pento poisoning – so is this a safe ingredient to be feeding to our beloved pets? I think not. Also – most by-product meals, while undoubtedly high in protein, contain very low quality protein derived from feathers, beaks and the like. This protein is poorly digested and puts a strain on the animals kidneys over time (unlike high quality, digestible protein derived from fresh meat).

Your view of pet food ingredients is simplistic, to say the least. It’s necessary to look at the bigger picture, food isn’t as simple as “fat, protein and carbohydrates.”

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi DieselJunki –

Nature’s Logic is a great product and I have a lot of trust in the company. My cats eat Nature’s Logic kibble and when my oldest dog used to eat kibble I used the Nature’s Logic canned food as a topper quite frequently. I’m also a big fan of their whole food supplement and occasionally use it in my rotation (although I’ve mostly gone to formulating my own supplements lately..).

Unfortunately, all of the Nature’s Logic foods are MUCH too high in calcium for a large breed puppy (I’d wait until your pup is at least 6 months old and through his rapid growth phase before trying this food). Generally, in order to get the actual calcium level you have to call or email the company because most companies only list the minimum calcium percentage on their packaging and website and often the actual calcium percentage is much higher than the stated minimum. Nature’s Logic, however, is one of the few companies that discloses actual nutrient levels on their website – the reason I know they’re actual is because at the top of the analysis for each food it say “Actual Analysis Units Dry Matter Basis” and there’s no “min” before the calcium percentage. All of their dry foods are 2.123% calcium and well over 5.5 g. ca. per 1,000 kcal.

When I compiled my calcium list I called or emailed every company with a grain-free food rated 4 or 5 stars on DFA. Some companies never responded to my emails, didn’t pick up the phone or wouldn’t disclose the actual calcium level so it’s possible that some 4 or 5 star grain-free foods are appropriate and not on the list, however I think I’ve covered the majority. If you do call a company to get the calcium levels be sure to ask for the actual level and make it clear this is what you’re looking for (otherwise they may give you the minimum). If they don’t have an actual level from a lab analysis ask for the maximum and calculate values based off this.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Chloralu –

HPP stands for “High Pressure Processing.” HPP is a process in which extremely high pressure is applied uniformly around and throughout a raw food product. HPP is used to destroy bacteria and is said to do minimal damage to the flavor, texture and color of raw food (although if you ever buy a product that has undergone HPP and compare it to a non-HPP product you’ll notice that there is a sort of “rind” formed around most HPP products and the color is noticeably grayish – at least in my experience). HPP also extends shelf life. All the benefits of raw food without the risk of bacterial contamination, sounds great right? The downside is that beneficial bacteria, some enzymes and some functional proteins are destroyed as well. Because the “friendly” bacteria is destroyed along with the “bad” bacteria if the food is ever stored improperly and happens to get contaminated with “bad” bacteria there is no “friendly” bacteria to keep the “bad” bacteria in check and prevent it from growing out of control. Oftentimes re-contamination can happen during the manufacturing process (like during all the recent kibble recalls for salmonella contamination). The raw foods that are HPP are: Stella & Chewy’s, Nature’s Variety Instinct and Primal (poultry varieties only). Individuals with immune-compromised dogs may have no other option than HPP if they wish to feed raw, however for a healthy dog I think HPP should be avoided. A healthy dog is fully equipped to handle the bacteria present in raw meat. There are also steps that can be taken to destroy bacteria without altering the nutritional value of the food: apple cider vinegar, coconut oil, raw garlic and alfalfa all have antibacterial properties (not to mention a myriad of other health benefits) and can easily be added to raw food for those concerned about bacterial contamination. If your dog is on a raw diet it’s also a good idea to supplement with a high quality multi-strain probiotic – this will keep the colony of good bacteria in your dog’s gut strong so if bad bacteria ever does come around the dog will be better able to combat it.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi DieselJunki –

If a dog isn’t getting enough omega 3’s in it’s diet, it can cause skin and coat issues. However, you’re feeding extremely high quality foods rich in omega 3’s so I don’t think that’s the issue. I wouldn’t recommend supplementing with any additional omega 3’s as too much omega 3’s can be just has bad as not enough – the omega 3 to omega 6 ratio should be between 1:5 and 1:10 (omega 3:omega 6). I would try supplementing with a little coconut oil – coconut oil is rich in medium chain triglycerides and can help the skin and coat. The Answer’s goat’s milk you’re feeding does have added probiotics – supplementing with more wouldn’t hurt though. If you can get kefir that would be a great option to rotate with the goat’s milk – kefir is extremely rich in probiotics and most varieties have 10 strains or more. I wouldn’t bathe him too often – that can dry out the skin. Get bath wipes to use in between baths if you need to. My dogs get about 4-5 baths per year. I use Earth Bath shampoo and conditioner and spray them with mink oil afterwards – it leaves their skin and coat nice and soft. From the picture you posted it looks like he’s a pit(?) – pits (unfortunately) are notorious for skin issues.

[DoggieDoc22]

Best dry food to feed Yorkies hands down would be Royal Canin’s Yorkshire Terrier, or their Yorkshire Terrier Puppy if we are talking puppies.

If you aren’t familiar with Royal Canin, they are the industry’s leader in science and research, accounting for over half of all research done in the dog and cat food industry. They develop diets based on thorough feeding trials and scientific studies to meet the specific needs of the pets that each of their diets target.

The important things to keep in mind when feeding Yorkies are that:
1. They are notoriously picky eaters – The reason for this is that Yorkies actually have a reduced sense of smell when compared to other breeds. They have a lower number of the neurons used for sensing smell than the average dog. Royal Canin’s Yorkshire Terrier formula has a unique blend of aromas and flavors to stimulate the Yorkie’s fussy appetite.

2. Yorkshire Terrier’s, as I am sure you are aware, are well known for their long, silky coats. The Yorkie, unlike most other breeds, do not have an undercoat, and instead have long individual hairs. This makes them susceptible to breakage, and feeding a diet that strengthens their coat is extremely important. The Royal Canin diet is rich in Omega 3 fatty acids from fish oil to help support their delicate coats.

3. The Yorkie, being a smaller breed, has a longer life expectancy than the average dog. Royal Canin’s Yorkshire Terrier formula contains antioxidants to maintain healthy cells and help to fight the effects of aging.

As far as supplementing, it is important to choose a diet that is complete and balanced, if you choose the right dry kibble there is no need at all for supplementing, and doing so will actually have a negative effect.

[DieselJunki]

I feed him Nature’s Variety Instinct: Rabbit with a few spoonfuls of Tripett and an ounce of Raw Goats Milk in the morning and an ounce at night.

I have been looking into the probiotics.

However having a puppy and the problem with him having accidents in his kennel and then laying in it he will need to be bathed. I am looking for advice on a shampoo and conditioner that people have used with success that is gentle and if I should be adding a coat supplement to help things along (Like adding an Omega 3 oil to his food). I read that a high quality expensive hypoallergenic shampoo and conditioner that doesn’t contain soap and is low lathering to gently clean your pet’s coat while adding softness and body is what I need to be looking for but looking online there are just so many and not to many that say low lathering!

I had also read of people putting olive oil on their dogs food and they said it helped tremendously. Anyone have experience with this?

[pugmomsandy]

This is another whole food supplement. It doesn’t have rice or natural bacon flavor like the one mentioned just above.

http://natureslogic.com/products/fortifier.html

[DieselJunki]

So I know I ask a TON of questions but honestly after I google the condition and get so many answers I just feel a whole lot better coming to the Dog Food Advisor community for help.

I had been noticing Moose had been itching an aweful lot lately. I haven’t seen a flea and I have already administered his dose of K9 Advantix II last week. Today while going to the pet store with him I notice a massive amount of dandruff coming off him. I checked the spots I had put the K9 Advantix II to make sure they didn’t look red and his skin looked fine aside from being dandruffy all over. I know it’s not good to bathe often however since I’ve had him I’ve bathed him 3 times total so far. The reason being sometimes he has an accident in the middle of the night in his kennel and ends up laying in it until I wake up at 8am. I tried puppy pads but he just chews em up. I had bought a puppy shampoo at Petco but perhaps this is making things worse? Should I add some kind of coat supplement to his food? Find a better shampoo, maybe get a heavy conditioner?

[PennyLanesMom]

Thank you Melissaandcrew for your information.
We are currently using Royal Canin Intestinal Low Fat 20
We really like how our dog is doing on it. She has completely recovered from pancreatitis once again. I’m never putting her on anything else. She loves the food and it keeps her healthy –
I’m glad to hear your dogs are doing well.
I was curious to find out if anyone used any supplements or probiotics for their dogs with pancreatitis.

[mlp576]

I have been using a whole food supplement and my dogs have been doing amazing. There moods are calmer yet they seem to have more energy. The coat looks amazing and my oldest is getting up the stairs easier. http://www.friendsfurlife.rockyandbella.com I totally recommend it. I use Pedigree maintenance however surviving and thriving are 2 different things all together. My Aunts dog is diabetic and told me that she has been able to cut down on the amount of meds for him so that is a testimony in itself.

[mlp576]

I have been using a whole food supplement and my dogs have been doing amazing. There moods are calmer yet they seem to have more energy. The coat looks amazing and my oldest is getting up the stairs easier. http://www.friendsfurlife.rockyandbella.com I totally recommend it. I use Pedigree maintenance however surviving and thriving are 2 different things all together. My Aunts dog is diabetic and told me that she has been able to cut down on the amount of meds for him so that is a testimony in itself.

[mlp576]

I have been using a whole food supplement and my dogs have been doing amazing. There moods are calmer yet they seem to have more energy. The coat looks amazing and my oldest is getting up the stairs easier and she is no longer eating grass and throwing up. http://www.friendsfurlife.rockyandbella.com I totally recommend it. I use Pedigree maintenance however surviving and thriving are 2 different things all together. My Aunts dog is diabetic and told me that she has been able to cut down on the amount of meds for him so that is a testimony in itself.

[mlp576]

I have been using a whole food supplement and my dogs have been doing amazing. There moods are calmer yet they seem to have more energy. The coat looks amazing and my oldest is getting up the stairs easier. http://www.friendsfurlife.rockyandbella.com I totally recommend it. I use Pedigree maintenance however surviving and thriving are 2 different things all together. My Aunts dog is diabetic and told me that she has been able to cut down on the amount of meds for him so that is a testimony in itself.

[mlp576]

I have been using a whole food supplement and my dogs have been doing amazing. There moods are calmer yet they seem to have more energy. The coat looks amazing and my oldest is getting up the stairs easier. http://www.friendsfurlife.rockyandbella.com I totally recommend it. I use Pedigree maintenance however surviving and thriving are 2 different things all together.

[pugmomsandy]

I currently use krill oil, probiotics and enzymes couple times a week. Mostly mixing it in with their kibble or canned food. I don’t supplement raw food usually although hiding a capsule in a ball of raw meat works very well. I’m currently using the Mercola brand but there are several others. Nordic or Grizzly for fish oils. Nzymes brand. OnlyNaturalPet.com has a selection. Sometimes I just give them a raw whole sardine instead of fish oil and then sometimes I just feed them raw tripe which has enzymes and beneficial organisms. Another brand I use is Garden of Life.

[sharyorkie]

Does anyone use supplements? Such as salmon oil,probotics,digestive enzymes?? Would love to hear your suggestions
Thanks

[DieselJunki]

(Apparently I can’t post in the Supplements section as I’ve tried twice now and it won’t show up)

Do you feed one or both?

http://probiotics.mercola.com/probiotics-for-pets.html
The probiotic I’ve been looking at.

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/digestive-enzymes-for-pet.aspx
The digestive enzymes I’ve been looking at.

[Hound Dog Mom]

mom2goldens –

Supplementing with digestive enzymes can help with gas.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Oh, it’s fine – I just wanted to clarify about the hip dysplasia in case you didn’t understand. Some people actually think it’s something old dogs get.

All healthy dogs should be on a high protein diet, even the less active ones. I’d look for a grain-free food with at least 30% protein – supplementing with high quality canned food and/or healthy leftover and/or fresh raw is a great way to improve the quality of kibble as well.

[HuskyMom9710]

I was feeding 4 health from tractor supply for 2years but I just switched to blue buffalo because my other dog was not doing great on the 4 health. I was and still am thinking about switching them to a grain free food, I have been going threw a lot of reviews on different brands but it is just making me more confused on what one to go for. They are pretty lazy dogs so would that high of a protein level be good for them?

Okay thank you I will look up some of those supplements. And I am sorry I originally worded it wrong, I knew that they just don’t all of a sudden develop hip dysplasia. I did contact her breeder when she was a year old and she informed me that her parents where not OFA certified. which I feel like they should have told me that while purchasing her.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi HuskyMom9710 –

First of all, if your dog is 4 years old she can’t develop hip dysplasia. Hip dysplasia is a developmental orthopedic disease that happens during puppyhood. If a dog is going to have hip dysplasia it will have it by the time it’s full grown – however, if the hip dysplasia is mild the dog may not show symptoms until later in life. There’s no foolproof way of preventing dysplasia but responsible breeding (only breeding dogs that have ofa or penn hip clearances), controlling calcium levels during growth, keeping the pup lean while it’s growing and not over exercising the dog while it’s growing can drastically decrease the odds that the dog will develop hip dysplasia.

What are you feeding your dog? A high-quality species-appropriate diet is the foundation of good health. Grains are inflammatory – so if your dog isn’t on a high protein, grain free diet currently I’d look into switching to one.

Supplementing with Omega 3’s (fish oil) can help with inflammation. Some other natural anti-inflammatories are turmeric, boswellia, yucca, bromelian and tart cherry. Digestive enzymes given on an empty stomach can help inflammation (like medizym). Glucosamine, chondroitin, msm and hydraulic acid can help to maintain and regrow deteriorating joint tissue and fluid.

Some supplements I’d recommend:
1) Wysong Arthegic for inflammation (sea cucumber, turmeric, boswellia, devil’s claw, yucca, ginger, red pepper, cetyl myristoleate) with Wysong’s Joint Complex for joint maintenance (contains collagen and msm).
2) Welly Tails Hip and Joint Rx (omega 3’s, tart cherry, glucosamine, chondroitin, msm, hydraulic acid, green lipped mussel).
3) Vet’s Best Advanced Hip and Joint for maintenance (glucosamine, chondroitin, msm, hydraulic acid) with Vet’s Best Muscle and Joint for inflammation (bromelian, boswellia, turmeric, yucca).
4) K9 Joint Strong (glucosamine, chondroitin, msm, turmeric, cetyl myristoleate) – also have a version with white willow for pain relief.

[HuskyMom9710]

Hi, I have a 4 year old husky who seems to be already developing some slight hip issues. She gets really stiff in the back end a lot of the time. also when we are petting her and if she is standing up her back legs tend to give out and she falls down.. (that part may just be from my wood floors, or maybe because she gets excited?). I am wondering what type of supplement would be best to try??? I have had this talk with my vet and she did not seem too concerned. I am just so scared of her developing hip dysplasia, (I know there is no way of preventing it.)

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi bella5255 –

If your dog is in the early stages of renal failure he shouldn’t need a reduced-protein diet. You don’t want to reduce the protein levels until the final stages of renal failure (when your dog is uremic – BUN is over 80 mg/dL, creatinine is over 4 mg/dL and the dogs is starting to show clinical symptoms of nitrogen buildup). The high quality protein provided by a homemade diet will not be hard on the kidneys in the way that low quality rendered proteins in most kibbles would be and is fine for dogs that have not yet become uremic – reducing the protein levels during the early stages of kidney failure will do more harm than good. I would just feed a standard balanced homemade diet and use very lean meats. Fish oil has has shown to help with kidney disease – because your dog has pancreatitis though, don’t give too much. Glandular supplements can help – Standard Process makes a great supplement called “Canine Renal Support.” Another supplement that I see recommended frequently for dogs with renal failure is “Vetri-Science Renal Essentials” – it contains vitamins, minerals, amino acids and herbs shown to be beneficial for dogs with renal failure. Here’s a link with some good info: http://dogaware.com/health/kidney.html (there’s even some sample homemade diets for dogs with kidney failure here).

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi DieselJunki –

It looks to me like your pup is knuckling over. You breeder gave you horrible advice, supplementing with calcium and reducing the protein will not help and could potentially make the issue worse. Calcium needs to be in balance with phosphorus – the ratio needs to be between 1:1 and 2:1 calcium to phosphorus. Commercial foods have a balanced ratio, so by supplementing with addition calcium you will likely throw the ratio off. You never ever want to supplement a balanced diet with calcium (unless advised by a veterinarian) and especially not for a growing puppy. Too much calcium in the diet actually contributes to developmental orthopedic diseases, such as knuckling over. Knuckling over, along with excess calcium, can be caused by overfeeding, having your pup walk around on inappropriate flooring (slippery floors) or by feeding low quality foods containing nutrients that have a low bio-availability. The good news is, if this is knuckling over (which I suspect it is) it can easily be reversed with no permanent damage. Get your dog on a balanced quality food with appropriate calcium levels and monitor intake (DO NOT overfeed). Also, get your pup to a vet asap! The vet should check to see if the dog has any parasites or underlying issues that could be causing nutrient deficiencies and the legs may need to be splinted for awhile. The following is some info on knuckling over:

http://vri.cz/docs/vetmed/51-2-71.pdf
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2905020/ .

You may also want to check out the articles posted on large breed puppy nutrition (if you haven’t already):

/forums/topic/large-and-giant-breed-puppy-nutrition/

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi wtjham –

A healthy dog should be able to switch foods cold turkey with minimal digestive upset. All three of my dogs eat a homemade raw diet and get something different at each meal, none have any issues. When my oldest dog used to eat kibble I switched to a new brand at the end of each bag (about every 3 weeks) and rotated through different canned food toppers daily with no issues. My newest pup (just turned 7 months old) came to me at 8 weeks on Pro Plan – I switched her to raw cold turkey and she had no problems. To decrease the chances that your pups experience digestive upset you may want to mix in a spoonful of plain canned pumpkin and give a probiotic supplement during the first week or so of the switch. Good luck and congrats on the new pups!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi dave and AngieH –

The difficult thing with colitis is that it can have many different causes and it can be acute or chronic. Dietary changes often can help ease the symptoms of colitis. Most dogs with colitis respond well to increased levels of dietary fiber and/or a hypoallergenic diet. Many dogs with colitis also seem to better tolerate foods that are lower in fat. When trying a new food make sure that you don’t feed anything else to your dog during the trial period (no treats!) and give the diet three to six weeks to see if there is improvement (remember, the improvement won’t be immediate and in some cases your dog’s diarrhea can even worsen in the initial stages of the switch as the dog is becoming accustomed to the new food).

For increasing the fiber level, rather then looking specifically for a high-fiber food, I would recommend just adding some canned pumpkin or psyllium to a high quality food. Both are high in fiber and will increase the overall fiber content of the food being fed.

For choosing a hypoallergenic diet you want to pick a food that has a protein source and carbohydrate source (if applicable) that your dog has never been exposed to. Making a homemade food is a great option here.

Two supplements I would definitely start immediately
1. Probiotics – these will help replenish the good bacteria in the dog’s digestive tract and keep pathenogenic bacteria in check.
2. Digestive Enzymes – These will give the dog a boost in digesting their food so the dog’s already stressed digestive system doesn’t have to work as hard at producing its own enzymes.

Some other supplements you may want to try that have proved successful for some dogs suffering from colitis:
1. L-glutamine – An amino acid that helps to repair the mucosal lining of the digestive tract.
2. Slippery Elm – An herb that helps to sooth the digestive tract and relieve inflammation.

I think in the case of colitis, that a high quality home-prepared diet would be best and most easily customizable to the dog’s individual needs. However, here are some commercial foods that are hypo-allergenic and lower in fat that may be worth considering:
1. The Honest Kitchen’s Zeal – Dehydrated, fish-based food, 9% fat on a dry-matter basis.
2. Grandma Lucy’s Pureformance Rabbit – Freeze-dried food, 15% fat on a dry-matter basis.
3. Nature’s Variety Instinct – Limited Ingredient dry foods are all under 20% fat on a dry-matter basis and include a turkey, duck and lamb variety.
4. Addiction’s Dry Foods – salmon-based, venison-based and lamb-based options, all around 13% fat on a dry-matter basis.
5. Addiction Dehydrated Foods – brush-tail, kangaroo, venison, lamb offerings, all around 9% fat on a dry-matter basis.
6. Addiction Canned Foods – brushtail, venison and salmon are only 10% fat on a dry-matter basis.
7. Great Life – Dry foods Buffalo Rx and Duck Rx are both 13% fat on a dry-matter basis.
8. Tiki Dog – canned food with some low fat hypoallergenic options.
9. California Natural Grain-Free – kangaroo, salmon, lamb and venison options, all 13% fat or less on a dry-matter basis.

*Some of the foods I recommended are a little low in protein for my taste, unfortunately when feeding a commercial food most of the foods that are lower in fat and that contain a novel protein also contain less overall meat and thus less protein – this is why I think homemade is the best option. If you are feeding one of the lower protein dehydrated or kibbled foods I’d highly recommend adding one of the recommended canned foods to boost the overall protein content. Also, this is not an exhaustive list – check out the foods Dr. Mike has reviewed on DFA and you’ll likely be able to find more – these are just some brands that first came to mind.

Good luck!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Dr. Mike –

This is a great question and I think it will make for a great discussion as everyone’s criteria are so different.

First off, in answering it for myself, I’m going to assume we’re looking for dry dog foods – otherwise I, obviously, would give preference to raw foods.

1) The first thing I look at it protein content. I won’t typically consider a food with under 35% protein – however if the food fell between 30% and 34% but had several other exemplary qualities I may make an exception (I would never go under 30% though).

2) I then look at fat content. I typically like dry foods with at least 15% fat (I feed much higher fat levels with raw, but dry foods are generally fairly low in fat).

3) I then look at ingredients. I always want a meat ingredient first – no exceptions. I prefer a fresh meat followed by at least one meat meal – but I would not rule out an otherwise good food if it only contains meat meals. Although there are some exceptions, I typically won’t feed a food that contains by-products. I never feed a food that contains any unnamed animal ingredients – such as animal fat, animal digest or animal by-products. I won’t feed foods with grains and look, instead, for foods that use potato, tapioca, legumes or pseudo-grains (or some combination of these) as a binder. Other ingredients that I look for and would not feed to my animals are: chemical preservative (such as BHA), menadione, artificial colorings, propylene glycol or any sort of sugar (sugar, molasses, honey, etc.). I also prefer to see a short list of added vitamins, minerals and amino acids – this tells me that much of the nutrition is derived from the ingredients in the food itself and there’s less reliance on synthetic supplements.

4) I then look at the company. I won’t rule out a company if it’s had recalls, but I do take into consideration how many recalls the company has had, how far apart they were and how the company handled the recalls. I like a company that is open about where they source their ingredients and that doesn’t source from China. I typically call or email the company’s customer service before feeding a food and if either a) I don’t get a response b) the customer service rep seems knowledgeable c) customer service is rude or d) I get the impression the company is giving me the run around when I ask a question – I will not feed the food.

[marmaduke]

Thanks Hound Dog Mom!!

I have sourced frozen beef offal (liver, kidneys, heart liver etc.) from a local butcher and he said that he will save me the beef necks from his kill days, I have also ordered the Dr. Mercola Digestive Enzymes for Pets (until I can get some fresh or frozen green tripe) and have started the boys on the Carlson’s Very Finest Fish Oil and a Vitamin E supplement @ 400UI per day, I have also sourced frozen raw chicken backs, necks and pkgs of chicken hearts, gizzards, liver…based on my previous menu with the veggie/fruit slop and the ground raw chicken with bones…what would you suggest for a menu? Do you buy ground beef and fish from the grocery store?

Does the beef offal on it’s own provide enough protein or does it have to be mixed with a meat source?

I live in Ontario Canada so the products like Darwin’s Naturals are pretty much out of the question as they are only in the States…

I really want to keep my Goldens on a RAW diet as I feel it is a much healthier diet for them compared to the store bought kibbles and even the “premium” brands providing I can provide them with the nutrition they require to be a healthy happy animal (they are pretty healthy and happy now, but I worry about not feeding them correctly)…

Thanks for all your advice…

Duke

[InkedMarie]

She is such a food hound, I sort of forgot about that with shelties LOL. I have to be careful how many treats I give her. We picked up some Buddy Biscuits soft chews. I’m afraid to give her something crunchy, I don’t know if she’ll gum it or swallow it whole.

[InkedMarie]

Thank you all for the advice!

[InkedMarie]

Pug Mom Sandy: the Only Natural Pet joint supplement….I find this:

BIXBI Joint Supplement for Dogs & Cats

http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/products/Only-Natural-Pet-Super-Daily-Vitamins–Joint-Support/999066.aspx

In Clover K9 Connectin

did you mean any of those? Yes, I could use a mortar & pestal but to be honest, with three dogs and a cupboard of stuff, I’d just as soon buy one already ground/liquid!

[pugmomsandy]

Maybe you can give her a couple pieces of the Vital Essentials freeze dried nibblets as treats. They’re small enough that she would probably swallow them. When I give it to my dogs, they have little nibblet sized poops! Even the Stella and Chewy’s Carnivore Crunch might work as well since they both have ground bone.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Marie –

Welly Tails has some good supplements you might want to check out. They have a powdered joint supplement which I have used on my dogs in the past and liked – it has glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM, green lipped mussel, hydraulic acid, tart cherry and omega 3’s. They also have another supplement (haven’t used this one) called senior dog vitality which has glucosamine, msm, hydraulic acid, green lipped mussel, omega 3’s, digestive enzymes and 6 strains of probiotics. I’m also a big fan of Wysong’s joint supplements – they’re sold for people but can be used for dogs too and come in powder filled capsules, you can just open it up and sprinkle it on the food. They have one called Arthegic that helps inflammation, it has boswellia, sea cucumber, turmeric, ginger, devil’s claw, yucca, red pepper and cetyl myristoleate. Their other supplement is called Joint Complex and supports the joints, cartilage and connective tissue, it contains proteoglycans, glycosaminoglycans and MSM. I think for a dog with severe arthritis the Arthegic and Joint Complex would be very effective if used together.

[pugmomsandy]

Ground psyllium or coconut fiber per meal for stool: 25# dog – 1/2 tsp, 40# – 3/4 tsp, 50# – 1 tsp. Or you can try pumpkin.

If you give both the salmon oil and coconut oil, the total fat content might affect her stool, so just watch that and just give one or the other if needed.

Dr Harvey’s has a green powder joint supplement as does Only Natural Pet. And there’s also Actiflex 4000 liquid. http://www.coxvetlab.com/products.asp 25-50 pounds: 1 tsp. daily loading dose for 5 days, ½ tsp. daily maintenance dose (Actiflex 4000). The K9 version has “beef flavor” but the horse one does not.

Are you able to grind up chicken wings or feet? There’s some good all natural joint supplement there. Or you could grind up tablets in a coffee grinder or mortar and pestal!! (sp?)

[Melissaandcrew]

HI Marie-

A few things-Rescues often have nasty dry or oily skin/coat until they have been on a better diet for a few months-sometimes they even blow coat and start to look naked.. But, once the coat starts to regrow, its usually a healthy coat. Dogs with dental disease often rub at their faces because of the rotting teeth which of course hurt. Poor girlie.

Once her mouth heals(usually 10-14 days) you can add dry in, but soak it a bit. Most actually can eat the kibble once the pain is gone. I have two rescue with no teeth and they not only eat dry, but one still “chews” a rawhide bone : )

The bathing should help the dry skin as the groomer will(should) use a heavy conditioner, but one treatment may not be enough to remove all the dry skin. I find that briskly rubbing them helps to move the dry skin into the hair, and then frequent brushing(soft bristle brush) removes the dead skin cells from the coat. We also supplement these ones with fish oil etc, but that helps control further issues, but does not resolve the current one-

[InkedMarie]

As some of you know, we adopted a 9yr old sheltie on Saturday. She has no teeth and has been eating Grandma Lucy’s PureFormance chicken since she got here. She loves it, thankfully! Since day one, I have been giving her Mercola’s probiotics and digestive enzymes. She was on amoxicillin but got the last one yesterday morning.
These are the other supplements my other two get, in addition to the Mercola products:

apple cider vinegar
salmon oil (I use one by Vital Choice)
coconut oil (one of them gets this)
Bug Off Garlic

Her coat is disgustingly dry: the dandruff just flakes off & rains down to the floor. She is scheduled for a bath on Monday February 4th (or whatever that Monday is). What is best to use, internally, for her coat? Both the salmon and coconut oil? If yes, both daily?
Her poops are pretty soft, which I assume is from the dehydrated food. Should I add some pumpkin to her meals? With every meal? I don’t know if I should attempt to add in a dry food or not, with her having no teeth.
I think she has some hip problems. She’ll be ten in June so can use some type of a joint supplement. Any suggestions for one that is powder or liquid? No teeth, don’t want her to attempt to chew something.
She does have an appt at the holistic vets in three weeks. She has a little hair loss on her eyelids, that and the icky coat have me wondering if she has a thyroid issue but she seems to be at a good weight.
Also, when should I start adding more stuff in? I started putting the Mercola stuff in on Sunday morning.
thanks all!

[marmaduke]

What do you feed for an animal based Omega 3 and vitamin E supplement? I was going to give the boys an Omega 3 fish oil with vitamin E gel cap with their meals…how much to give them? I have read that for a 50lb dog, approx. 400-500 UI or 350mg per day…

Also, what do you give for fish as a protein instead of chicken?

Thanks

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Mrs4444 –

Sorry to hear about your dog. Below is a link to an article by Dr. Becker that discusses pano. Dr. Becker says she’s had success supplementing with proteolytic enzymes, calcarea carbonica, arnica and Standard Process’ Musculoskeletal Support. Another poster on this site has a golden pup with pano and I believe she’s supplementing with turmeric and omega 3’s and having luck with that. Also, make sure you don’t let your pup play too hard – heavy activity can aggravate the condition.

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/02/27/three-common-bone-growth-conditions-in-puppies-and-young-dogs.aspx

[Mom2Cavs]

First, let me say that I’m not a vet. But, I would suggest a visit to your vet to determine the type of crystals and to see if there is an infection present. There are different types of crystals and treatments vary. Struvite crystals seem to form if there is an infection, but Oxalate crystals are a different matter. There are also other types. One thing is certain, though, and that a dog that is prone to uti’s or crytals needs lots of moisture in the diet. Moisture is actually good in any animal’s diet, imho. If I were you, after speaking to my vet, I would check into 4-5 star, high quality foods. Whether you feed all canned, regular raw or freeze dried raw that’s been rehydrated, or kibble topped with wet food of sime kind (either of the above mentioned or wholesome people food) moisture is necessary to help flush out the kidneys. If you feed only kibble, then I would still add water or no-sodium/low-sodium broth to it. There are also supplements that might help with urinary issues like cranberry, vit. C, omega 3’s etc. Again, I would ask your vet for recommendations. There are also regular posters here that have had dogs with kidney issues from birth that may post with some great suggestions. Good luck to you and I hope this helps!

[marmaduke]

Ok, did some research and I do beleive that the lack of digestive enzymes is probably the main cause of the gas and stool munching. 😛 I have seen some undigested “slop” in their stools as well, which leads me to beleive that they are not processing their food completely.

I have sourced some green tripe from a local butcher who kills beef…I can purchase 20lbs for $10…I cannot find how much to give them per feeding though…the only thing I have been able to find is an approximation of 5-10% of their protein weight per serving. Any thoughts or suggestion on how much green tripe to feed them? Also, is there any trick to preparing the tripe?

There are a couple of products on the market that I have found that are enzyme supplements…Dr. Mercola Digestive Enzymes and another is Prozyme All Natural Enzyme Suupplement. The 1st seems like it is more animal based (Betaine HCl, Ox Bile Extract, Bromelain (pineapple), Papain (papaya), Pancreatin which includes Protease, Mylase and Lipase) and the 2nd is plant based looking at the ingredients (Lactose, Aspergillus oryzae fermentation product dehydrated, Aspergillus niger fermentation product, dehydrated, pineapples (stem,fruit).

We do include Pineapple in their “slop” mixture, but I guess it does not fully constitute the lack of digestive enzymes that they need.

Thoughts?

[shelties mom]

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/03/05/common-cancer-for-pet-dogs-and-cats-mast-cell-tumors.aspx

Also read the comments on the bottom from owners who have the same experience. Switch to natural food diet, eliminate carbs and supplement with omega-3 fatty acids to start.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi astroweeks –

I know that for a dog with SBS you want to make the digestion process as efficient as possible so adding a high quality digestive enzyme supplement and multi-strain probiotic supplement would be a good idea. I would also add some unfiltered apple cider vinegar – vinegar is an acid and will help the food to breakdown easier in the stomach. I’ve also read that fiber can help SBS dogs by slowing down the digestion process – so maybe some canned pumpkin would help. I’m not sure if you’re giving him any nutritional supplements, but depending on how bad his digestion is you may want to talk to your vet about adding additional vitamins, minerals and essential fatty acids to ensure he’s not becoming malnourished. If possible, I would also look into getting him on a higher quality food that’s higher in fat and more calorie-dense to help him put on some weight. I haven’t read a whole lot about SBS so, unfortunately, that’s about all the help I can give you. Maybe someone else will chime in with some more suggestions.

[Hound Dog Mom]

cakes42257 –

Science Diet Healthy Mobility is junk. You can get the same benefit by feeding your dog a quality food and supplementing with a quality joint supplement. Glucosamine, chondroitin and MSM are all great for joint maintenance, but you may also want to consider adding a natural anti-inflammatory – such as turmeric, boswellia, yucca, tart cherry or omega 3’s.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Marmaduke –

The first thing I would recommend is having the dog checked by the vet – occasionally stool eating can be due to intestinal malabsorption or intestinal parasites. If medical causes are ruled out I’d supplement with a quality enzyme and probiotic supplement. Some dogs don’t secrete enough enzymes naturally so they consume feces because feces are rich in enzymes – although enzyme deficiencies are more common when dogs are on processed food diets. Enzymes can help with gas as well. You could look into a supplemental stool eating deterrent – but check the label as most contain MSG. The other thing I wanted to point out is that you should not be feeding only chicken – this is not enough variety and your dogs will not be getting all the nutrients they need. Ideally, an even mix of red meat and poultry should be fed. At the very least I’d recommend alternating chicken with beef but the more different meats you can feed the better. While flax is a good addition to poultry based meals, you need an animal-based omega 3 as dogs don’t convert plant-based omega 3’s to DHA very efficiently. Lastly you need to add some vitamin e – this diet provides no vitamin e. Hope that helps!

[patvl246]

I supplement my Mastiffs raw diet with Natures Variety Instinct Raw Boost Venison and Lamb. Are there any recent reviews on this particular kibble

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi momtopoms –

Fruits and vegetables really aren’t absolutely necessary if everything else in the diet is balanced and the Nature’s Logic supplement does have some freeze-dried fruits and vegetables in it, so this would probably be enough. However, some other options that you could try:

1) Wysong has a supplement called “Wild Things” – it’s a powder made of freeze-dried fruits, vegetables and super greens: http://www.wysong.net/products/wildthings-dog-cat-supplement.php

2) Essex Cottage Farms has a supplement called “Garden Vegetables”, also a freeze-dried powder: http://www.efarms.cc/Products%20Page.htm

3) Nature’s Farmacy has a whole food supplement called “Cornucopia” and 3 tbs. is the equivalent of a pound of fresh fruits and vegetables: http://www.naturesfarmacy.com/store/details.php?prodId=321&category=

Also, if your dog doesn’t mind pills you could also consider fruit and vegetable concentrate pills made for humans (just read the ingredients list carefully to make sure there is nothing toxic to dogs – such as onions or grapes). There are many different brands that make these, but some I can think of off the top of my head that would be safe for dogs would be Puritan’s Pride 10 Vegetable Multiplex, Wysong’s Salad and Schiff’s Fruit & Vegetable tablets.

[Mom2Cavs]

I’m sorry to hear about your Cav. Sadly, I just lost my 12 year old Blenheim girl, Stella, to SM. 🙁 I think that feeding an all can diet, as long as the canned food is labeled “complete and balanced” and not for supplemental feeding only, is perfectly fine. In fact, it’s really a lot better than feeding a total dry diet. It’s a little closer to being a species appropriate diet, at least. I feel most people don’t use canned, and use dry, simply because it can be cost prohibitive to use, especially with multiple dog households. If you can afford it, it really is better than dry. Some people also feed a raw diet. I prefer premade raw. There are lots of good brands to choose from. If raw is not for you, then there are the freeze dried formulas and rehydrate them. This is what I’m using now, although I do feed kibble and canned with them. I’m using Stella & Chewy’s, Primal, and have some Vital Essentials coming. Canned food contains moisture, which is also great for the dog. Again, I’m sorry your pup is experiencing this. Our breed, as a whole, is burdened with these illnesses and it’s so sad. If I were you, I’d pick some 4-5 star grain free canned food and contact the companies to see what the sodium level is in them and go from there. I have 2 other Cavs at home, both females….Hazel (Black & Tan) and Laverne (Ruby). Hazel has a grade 2 murmur, but so far, Laverne is fine. Actually they’re both doing very well, atm. They both share the same birthday, lol, and Hazel will be 6 this August and Laverne will be 8. Good luck to you with your little one!

[twinrescuemom]

Hi all,
I need some help. My 8ish year old miniature pinscher’s skin is an absolute mess. On the recommendations of many, many people, I decided to switch her over to a grain free diet back in November. I chose Castor & Pollux’s grain free because it came in small bites and also rated 5 stars. After about a week or two of eating this food, I noticed that she was starting to have some hair loss on her legs and also seemed to be developing dandruff. It progressed to hair loss on her ears, between her eyes, and now her belly. Not significant hair loss, mind you, but definitely thinner. The dandruff is horrendous and she actually has scabs on her ears and legs. At first I thought it was an allergy to something in the food, so I switched her over to Taste of the Wild, which my other 3 large dogs eat. It didn’t seem to help. I took her to the vet two weeks ago for the skin issue (and for antibiotics for a bite from my other dog, but that’s another story). The vet didn’t think it was allergy related. Naturally he wanted to do upwards of $200 worth of testing to determine what it was. I’m sorry, but I just don’t have that kind of money. I love my dogs, but I also have children to feed and clothe! I agreed to a skin scraping, but that yielded no results. As the vet put it, “there were no mites found.” Which apparently does not mean it’s not sarcoptic mange. He wanted to treat her anyway, because frankly I just don’t have the money to do half a dozen other tests. I decided to hold off on mange treatment for several reasons: 1)none of my other dogs have any signs 2)my children and I don’t have any signs and 3)it’s not gotten worse, it’s unchanged in the last several weeks and I’ve seen sarcoptic mange before, I know that would get worse. I did have another dog with an unknown skin issue back in October. My long hair greyhound mix had random spots of what looked almost like bug bites and also had random patches of dandruff. After a week and a half of antibiotics, her skin completely cleared up. This is another reason why I don’t think my min pin has mange. My vet also suggested ringworm (an $85 test!) but I’m on the same page as the mange. There are no other symptoms on any of the living beings in my house. I still feel firmly that it’s either an allergy to something in her food or it’s some sort of deficiency in her diet. She’s been on Clavamox for 10 days now and while her skin hasn’t gotten any better, it also hasn’t gotten worse. I’m very leery of just loading her up with meds and hoping they work (like the vet wants to do with the ivermectin). She’s never had a very good digestive system and I really don’t want to make her sick from medications. If anyone has any thoughts, ideas, suggestions, I would greatly appreciate it! I’ve started researching supplements, I really think that’s going to be what I try next. What are the best supplements for skin? Thank you all for your help in advance!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi shelties mom –

Different bone meals contain different amounts of calcium and phosphorus so you can’t know how much to add unless you know how much calcium and phosphorus is in the bone meal. When using straight calcium (such as ground eggshell) you would add 800 – 1,000 mg. calcium per 1 lb. meat when adding bonemeal, because it contains calcium and phosphorus, you would have to add slightly more – enough to provide around 1,200 mg. calcium per 1 lb. meat. You don’t want to use eggshells and bonemeal – use one or the other.

[weimlove]

Ok guys, I’m going to the butcher tommorow to get the ingredients for shadow first two weeks of raw food. I’m going to make enough food for about two weeks. At first, I plan on the butcher grinding everything up so I can make one pound patties of food until I can get a bigger freezer. I don’t know the exact amounts of ingredients but this is what I plan on using for this two week recipe: ground chicken, chicken backs, chicken quarters, chicken liver, sweet potatoes, leafy greens like spinach, vitamin e supplement, kelp mixture supplement, fish oil, and eggs with shell. For a couple of the meals I will add in THK’s preference. How does that sound? Any suggestions?