[pugmomsandy]

How old is your dog? Two of my dogs had an elevated liver enzyme at one check up and then normal the next. It is not just diet that can affect it but also things like medications and pesticides (ingested or topical like heartworm/flea/tick meds) that are filtered through the liver. Ask you vet about milk thistle and have the enzymes rechecked. What are you currently feeding your dog?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Well the heatwave was short-lived – I checked the forecast and it’s supposed to be back into the low 50’s (daytime) and mid 30’s (nighttime) by the weekend. So I may be able to postpone the first dose until the end of May after all.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[theBCnut]

I think that if daytime temps are in the 80s, the overnight temp may not be assumed to be low enough long enough to affect the larva.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Really? I’m going to have to look into that. I know I’ve always read that if at any point in time the temperature dips below 57 the cycle needs to start again. Dr. Becker’s article says: “During the time the heartworm larvae are developing from L1 to L3 inside an infected mosquito, which is approximately a two-week period, the temperature must not dip below 57°F at any point in time. If it does, the maturation cycle is halted. According to Washington State University heartworm report from 2006, full development of the larvae requires ‘the equivalent of a steady 24-hour daily temperature in excess of 64°F (18°C) for approximately one month.'” So I suppose – according to Washington State University – if the overall temperature averages over 64 for a month you’d need the preventative even if it dips below 57 at times. Well it’s only been up to the 80’s for about a week (it was snowing only three weeks couple weeks ago – north country lol) – definitely has not averaged over 64 for a month. I put my sticker on the calendar to start the first dose Thursday so I’m sure they’ll be fine either way.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[theBCnut]

I read that if the daytime temp was in the 80s you should not go by the night time temp.

[Cyndi]

Wow! You learn something new every day! Thanks for the education on that, really! I never knew all that. I just know that mosquitos get really bad around here. I didn’t know temperature had anything to do with them carrying heartworm.

Thanks! 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

The Heartworm “preventative” doesn’t really “prevent” heartworm – it kills existing immature worms. So you start later than you’d think because you would be worming for an already existing infection (I hope that makes sense). Also – keep in mind just because there are mosquitoes there isn’t necessarily hearworm. If the temperature drops below 57 degrees at any point in time the heartworm development cycle (within the mosquito) will have to start again – it has to be over 57 degrees for two consecutive weeks. Right now where I am it’s over 80 degrees during the day and I’ve seen mosquitoes but it still gets into the 40’s at night. The map is just a guideline – monitor the temperature. I usually end up starting at the end of May or very beginning of June.

[Cyndi]

Yeah, it says 7 for my area too. That doesn’t seem right to wait til July to start. I think in Northeast Ohio mosquitos are really bad by then… My vet has always said to start April or May.

[InkedMarie]

I may not be understanding the map correctly. Unsure what the #7 means

[theBCnut]

That doesn’t sound sensible to me.

[InkedMarie]

Ok, I se the Dr Becker map….I’m in nh. First map says 7….that can’t mean to start in the 7 th month, can it? That would be July. Second map says 10, which is October and makes sense. I forgot about the milk thistle last week. 🙁

[Cyndi]

Well, from what I’ve read on this site, I personally trust your judgement 100%. I was skeptical about not giving heartworm preventative and have been doing every the natural way. And I know that heartworm is nothing to mess around with once a dog has gotten it. Thank you, once again, for your opinion and your help. I am so glad I found this site, and all the knowledgeable people on it giving advice.

Thank you again! 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

In the past I’ve generally used regular Heartguard (not Heartguard Plus), but this year I got Valuheart (the generic). I just look for one that only has Ivermectin and not Ivermectin/Pyrantel. It’s recommended to give every 30 days but I (like Marie) give it every 45, less total doses a year and the studies done on the product have shown them to be effective for 45 days. The milk thistle is to help protect the liver. Dr. Becker has a map on her site that shows what month you should give the first dose and what month you should give the last dose depending on where you live. Remember – it’s a personal choice whether or not you want to give a heartworm preventative. I’m not trying to persuade you in either direction, just giving my point of view. Whatever route you go make sure you do a lot of research on the pros and cons of not administering, limited administration (like what I do) and administration per manufacturers recommendations (every 30 days, year round) – there will be risks no matter what you do so it’s very important to make the most informed decision possible.

[Cyndi]

Hound Dog Mom, what brand of heartworm preventative do you use for your dogs? I was on the fence about not giving it anymore, because I read alot about it, but the mosquitos are so bad in my neck of the woods. I did start her last month on one dose, but I was very hesitant about giving it again. I have Tri-Heart Plus, that I bought from my vet.

[Hound Dog Mom]

During flea season I bathe the dogs every 2 – 3 weeks with Dr. Harvey’s herbal protection shampoo, then I brush them with a flea comb and the next day I apply Sentry Natural Defense topical (comes in a tube like Advantix/Frontline, but it’s chemical free and contains only essential oils). They get Earth Animal’s herbal flea and tick tincture in their food 6 days a week. I wash their bedding every 2 – 3 weeks and add borax to the detergent. I spray the yard every 2 – 3 weeks with Vet’s Best Flea & Tick Yard and Kennel Spray (has peppermint oil and clove extract). This will be my second summer going natural. Last summer I used no chemicals and had no issues with fleas or ticks (and my dogs are outside a lot).

I’m with Marie on the heartworm preventative deal – that’s something I’m not risking. There’s a story online somewhere (maybe dog aware?). About a woman who raised deerhounds – raw fed, no vaccines, no preventatives, etc. She had, I believe it was, two of her dogs get diagnosed with heartworm one summer. Many will say dogs raised naturally and with a strong immune systems won’t get heartworm, but that’s not true. They may be less susceptible but they’re not immune. I work at a shelter and have seen too many dogs die of heartworm and many more that have had to endure the harsh treatment to get rid of the heartworm once they have it. Not something I’m chancing with my crew. They get heartworm preventative May – October every 45 days. I use the preventative that only does heartworm (not the preventative that also has a dewormer) and I administer milk thistle for one week after they receive the preventative. I also have them tested two weeks prior to receiving their first dose of the year and two weeks after receiving their last dose of the year.

[InkedMarie]

I don’t use topicals either but I do use Heartworm preventive. Heartworm is not something I’m willing to chance. I do give it May to October, every 45 days. less than most people do.

[Cyndi]

I ordered that Mercola Natural Flea and Tick Defense the other day. It should be arriving today. I can’t wait to use it and I really hope it works. I am going to use that and I also have been using Diatomaceous Earth and give Bailey a bit of garlic. I will NEVER use a topical flea treatment again, nor will I use a heartworm preventative. In doing all my research that I have been doing over the last few months, I have read alot of not so good things about both. I’ll be sticking to the all natural stuff.

I’ll keep you posted about the Mercola stuff and let you know what I think about it.

[pugmomsandy]

Hi Betsy,

I used it last year and didn’t have any problems. I’m in TX. My senior girl also liked to sunbath and lay outside alot and she and others didn’t get fleas. I haven’t seen mosquitoes yet around here but I’m sure they’re coming! At the end of the year I also tried out Halo Herbal Dip. I used it concentrated and put a couple drops 4 or 5 on their harness. It can be put on cloth. And also mixed with water for a spray. I would carry a collar with some drops on it out with me when I went out and I didn’t get bit either. I just bought some essential oil or eucalyptus citriodora to add a few drops to the mercola bottle. I also put in a little neem oil. I treated my yard with garlic, neem and cedar oil sprays last year too and once maybe last month. I have about 6 bottles in the cupboard. And none of my pugs got heartworm or tapeworms since I don’t give anything for that. They all had their check-up in April.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 7 months ago by pugmomsandy.

[DogFoodie]

Hey guys,

We’re on the verge of flea season, aren’t we…

As much as I’d like to avoid unnecessary chemicals, I plan to use up my on-hand supply of Trifexis for Sam and Heartgard / Frontline for Bella.

I was looking at the Mercola Natural flea and Tick Defense: http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/natural-flea-and-tick-control.aspx

I wondered if anyone here had ever tried it and if so, what did you think of the results?

Thanks!

[spoonyspork]

Okie, I’m sorry this is so long, but want to give as much background as possible for the best choice in foods.

I have an older dog — 14 years old, lab/plott hound mix, currently approximately 60 lbs and looks a little on the lean side to my liking.

We’ve been feeding him Taste of the Wild (can never remember the exact one as I just grab it based on color — it has ducks on the bag?) dry since adopting him 5 years ago, and he has thrived pretty good on that. When we first got him from the shelter he had bald patches all over (almost completely bald on the bottom half) caused by a severe allergy to fleas, and was also rather overweight. Within a few weeks he was lean and shiny with a much higher energy level, etc.

Well over the last year he has begun to show his age. He’s been developing benign tumors all over (each is kept checked by the vet), and his hair has again been falling out. He also constantly has a flea problem despite lots of flea treatments and keeping both inside and outside as flea free as possible (we have no carpet in the house and his bed is switched and washed weekly). In spite of this, he still has a very high energy level and good weight though he’d been starting to look a little TOO lean despite upping the amount of food.

But last week I thought sure I was about to lose him. Long story short, he was diagnosed with vestibular disease and sent home, told it usually improves on its own and the cause is usually never figured out unless it’s tumors on the nerves or an obvious ear infection, but if he improves it’s likely not tumors. He did improve, but the next day his appetite was gone and later started squirting diarrhea that was more blood than stool (hours prior it was normal stool)… so straight back to the vet where he was additionally found to have a GI infection, and put on antibiotics and a wet canned food (Hills I/D). Additionally, the vet suggested I put him on a combo flea/worm pill since topical stuff doesn’t seem to be helping him anymore. His stool sample didn’t show worms or larvae/eggs. I said no to the pill as I wanted to research it first (which I’m pretty sure will be a ‘no’ after reading the side effects! Even just the common side effects were terrible)

It’s been a week now, and he’s slooooowly gained back an appetite as well as near normal mobility (slight head-tilt as I was told would probably happen as well as random missteps or falling over if he tries to take off at a run too quickly)… and now will not *touch* his dry food beyond a couple bites. He doesn’t seem to be being picky about it (and really isn’t a picky dog at all as a rule) — he seems to have trouble actually eating it — after a few bites his head starts to tilt worse and he seems to lose focus and get dizzy, then lose interest. I do have to put his bowl somewhere off the floor as keeping his head down for the amount of time it takes to eat seems to make him dizzy again. His stools are almost normal again though he still seems very raw and sore while trying to ‘go’. I was considering getting more of the I/D from the vet as I thought surely they gave it to us based on it being something easy on his stomach… but reading the ingredients here I’m kind of surprised he didn’t get *worse* on it.

So now my actual point! He is out of the ‘food’ from the vet so this afternoon’s meal will have to be something different (don’t worry; he’ll eat *something* if I don’t get an answer for a while!). I have the looong list of ‘best wet foods’ and was thinking of just switching to taste of the wild wet formula, but I wanted to make sure that is the ‘best’ choice as far as cost-effectiveness as well as with an older dog with the background he has (fleas, skin condition, benign tumors, etc).

I will say I have tried some freeze-dried ‘raw’ diets in the past and my dogs just never seemed to do well with it, and the extra cost, mess, amount needed to feed our large dogs etc just didn’t seem worth it. I will also say I am now somewhat leery of taste of the wild in general, as I may be taking the other dog to the vet as she’s been having very loose stools the last few days too (no blood or pure liquid like his were, but we’re keeping an eye on her) and she just started being fed from the same freshly-opened bag he’d been eating from last week (she had been eating from the older bag while he’d been eating from the freshly opened bag. Trust me it makes sense — they get different amounts that are separated by meal so sometime one ends up eating from a different bag than the other for a couple days)

Okay, I think I’ve given as much info as possible, lol. Thanks for any help!

[Cyndi]

Thank you BRR3, very much! & Thanks pugmomsandy, I will check that out….. My biggest fear, and the reason I haven’t started my dog on all raw yet, is because I’m so afraid I won’t be able to give her or find the right variety she needs. The more I read up on what people feed their dogs the more confusing it is. I’m the type of person who likes easy. Yes, call me lazy, I admit I am, but it sure doesn’t sound easy to find all the things raw feeders feed their dogs. I have grocery stores by me, only one local butcher though. I haven’t checked with these places yet to find out costs and what’s available. I know it would get easier over time, once I get the hang of it, but I guess I’m just scared, because it’s up to me to make sure I’m giving her the right variety. I blame myself for the death of my other dog, because I had to put him down because I didn’t want to put him thru a bunch of tests and stuff at his age. The vet didn’t know what it was that went wrong with him and I believe it was a combination of feeding crappy commercial dog food, topical flea stuff and/or vaccinations.

I’ve looked up sample menus of raw feeders, hoping I guess to find that “one” that makes me say, ‘Yeah, THAT I can do’ but there is just so many things that people feed and to me it’s just overwhelming. I’m just afraid that I would give my Bailey the wrong things or not enough of the right things or whatever.

Thank you all for all your help. I guess it’s just up to me when I feel comfortable enough to make the switch. I really do appreciate all the help. I’ll just keep reading and researching and eventually, hopefully, I’ll just do it…

[Cyndi]

Hi, I will try to make this as short as possible. Ok, I have a newly adopted dog Bailey. She is a 1 1/2 yr. old border collie/Pit bull mix and she weighs 50lbs. I HATE all the stuff I hear about commercial dog food. I am just recently into researching everything. I had a doberman who died at the age of 11 from an undiagnosed problem and I have a feeling it was from either commercial dog food crap, vaccines, topical flea stuff or all of the above. I am fully committed to doing better by my new dog. I just recently switched to Nature’s Variety Instinct kibble (I was using Purina One) which I feed her for breakfast. For dinner, I switched her to Deli Fresh by Freshpet. I really, really want to switch her to a raw diet, but I have no clue where/how to start, what foods to feed or not to feed, if I can afford it, etc. I’m afraid once I start I won’t know what to feed and and how much and if I am giving her the right variety of stuff. I’ve looked up raw “menus” online, but it sounds like there is so many different things that I would have to feed Bailey, that I might end up going broke. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated…

[Mom2Cavs]

I’m assuming you mean Springtime, Inc. And yes, I’ve heard of them and have used them off and on for many years. I really like them. I’ve used their Fresh Factors (great whole food vitamin which I like because Lucy hates most things mixed into her food) and I’ve used their Joint Health and their new Advanced Joint chews. They worked great for my deceased Shih-Poo, Desi, who had both rear luxating patellas. And the Advanced Joint worked when Lucy hurt herself once. I’ve also used their Omegas 3-6-9 and liked them, as well as their Bug-Off Garlic chews for fleas. Love the stuff and they always have b1g2 deals…and if you buy so much you can try free stuff.

[Mom2Cavs]

Well….no, I have no problem with it. In fact, I’ve used it before. I must say that I didn’t see a change in my dogs either way (better or worse condition using it), but my dogs didn’t have any issues to address to begin with so maybe that was it. I was using it to assure they were getting enough nutrition at the time. I’ve done lots of different things over the years lol. I think it’s similar to missing link but I do think it might have some enzymes or probiotics in it, where as missing link doesn’t (one formula now does, I found out…Wellness formula). The company is not that far from where I live. It’s located in Kentucky, right over the river from me, so I could actually pick up the product if I wanted. The owners really seem to know their stuff. I’ve met the woman (half of the married owners) and she’s really nice. Their customer service, in my experience, has been great. They advocate a more species appropriate diet, as well, and give you a “recipe” for making one with ground beef and adding their product on their site. They have various products for sell, not just Dinovite. They have omegas, natural flea products, natural shampoos, treats, and products for cats. Bottom line, I don’t think it’d hurt to try their stuff. Btw, they do recommend trying it for 90 days at minimum to see the difference. And I will admit that I probably didn’t use it that long before I stopped. Some people think it’s rather expensive, as well, but I think it’s on par with lots of other things like it. I hope this helps some.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I got talked into trying Trifexis back when it first came out. My older male dog tolerated it fine but my female vomited everytime I gave it to her. I then found out I didn’t want all the extras in Trifexis (flea preventative, broad spectrum dewormer) – it’s too much chemicals. I switched back to the regular Heartguard that just does heartworm and I only administer it during heartworm season (late spring to early fall where I am) and I no longer use any chemical flea and tick preventatives or wormers.

[KC-Cajun]

My dogs were on Sentinel forever with no problems. After the recall, the vet prescribed Trifexia for heartworm/fleas. My lab is doing fine, but my beagle became very ill with lethargy and terrible diarrhea for weeks. It’s gotten much better but she still has occasional diarrhea, which she never had before. I switched her to another heartworm med and she tolerated it okay. The vet insists it wasn’t the Trifexia and that it was a coincidence that the diarrhea started 12 hours after her first pill. She suggested it may be a colitis or irritable bowel syndrome that just happened to start after taking the Trifexia :). Coincidences do happen, but I’m a bit skeptic.

But why the bouts of diarrhea since October? About once I week I’ll see something “loose” in the yard. She’s been on 4 treatments of Flagyl and probiotic packets and it just won’t go away. Before I spend $$$$ on further tests and treatments, perhaps someone here had the same problem and found a cure.

[shelties mom]

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2010/11/30/harmful-chemicals-in-flea-collars-and-sprays.aspx
Flea meds can cause skin irritation, there are other natural ways to control fleas. First you need to remove the cause, it may be the Advantage you are using. Mercolahealthypets.com have several education articles on the dangers of using these products on your pets.
http://search.mercola.com/search/pages/Results.aspx?k=flea&r=sitename=”AR4BaHR0cDovL2hlYWx0aHlwZXRzLm1lcmNvbGEuY29tCHNpdGVuYW1lAQEiASI=”

[DieselJunki]

So I know I ask a TON of questions but honestly after I google the condition and get so many answers I just feel a whole lot better coming to the Dog Food Advisor community for help.

I had been noticing Moose had been itching an aweful lot lately. I haven’t seen a flea and I have already administered his dose of K9 Advantix II last week. Today while going to the pet store with him I notice a massive amount of dandruff coming off him. I checked the spots I had put the K9 Advantix II to make sure they didn’t look red and his skin looked fine aside from being dandruffy all over. I know it’s not good to bathe often however since I’ve had him I’ve bathed him 3 times total so far. The reason being sometimes he has an accident in the middle of the night in his kennel and ends up laying in it until I wake up at 8am. I tried puppy pads but he just chews em up. I had bought a puppy shampoo at Petco but perhaps this is making things worse? Should I add some kind of coat supplement to his food? Find a better shampoo, maybe get a heavy conditioner?

[shelties mom]

InkedMarie,
Just saw your previous post about your yeasty dog. My male sheltie was always itchy, female was not as bad but was scratching also for the past few years. Saw the vets multiple times, tried chinese herbs, vinegar foot soak, frequent baths, different natural shampoos etc.. but nothing worked. I often gave them fruits of all kinds daily, in the summer they get even more in addition to all the tomatoes and berries from my garden. They itch worse in the summer but they don’t get fleas, I don’t use flea meds. Then last fall I decided to do an experiment, I stopped feeding them fruits, tomatoes or any night shade veggies, their itching began to reduce more and more, they are 90 percent better. You may want to look at the diet, maybe there is something in the food that is causing the itching.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I personally don’t use any chemicals on my dogs. I use Sentry Natural Defense topical which has pepermint oil, lemongrass oil, cinnamon oil and thyme oil and I put Earth Animals No More Ticks herbal tincture in their food 6 days per week during flea/tick season. My dogs are outdoors a lot, I comb them with a flea comb daily during flea/tick season and have never found a flea or tick on them. All their snap tests have always come up negative for lyme as well. Dogs with weak immune systems are more likely to attract parasites (both internal and external) – so the best and safest way to prevent flea infestations – imo – is building up their immune system. When my dog ate low quality kibble I always had flea issues (I used Advantix on him and he had a flea/tick collar purchased from the vet during the summer). Since I’ve switched to a grain-free raw diet, eliminated chemical flea and tick preventatives, eliminated chemical wormers and limited my use of heart worm preventative and vaccines – I’ve never had any of my dogs get fleas, ticks or intestinal parasites.

[Saireah]

I’ve never had an experience with fleas. On Friday night, I found a flea running across our foster puppy’s stomach. We received him the night before, but didn’t put his flea formula from the rescue on him since we were concerned our current dog would lick it off as they were getting acquainted. My current dog has only ever been on Frontline from the vet and I can’t recall any flea issues with my family dogs when I was younger.
At that moment, I killed the flea and immediately put Frontline on Quinn and the small bit of K9 Advantix II (for dogs 11-20 pounds) that the rescue gave us on our foster puppy. On Sunday (nearly 48 hours), I gave him a bath due to his itching with some sensitive shampoo. I’ve combed through his hair and can’t find any more fleas, but he’s still itching. For those of you who have had experience, what would you suggest? Could it have been less effective because I believe he’s actually at 20 pounds or because I bathed him a few hours too early? I’ve read that K9 Advantix II purchased from PetSmarts, etc, are not as effective as products from the vet. Should I just wait it out?

[Alexandra]

Hi Aimee,

“They” is the AKC.

That’s what I mean, how often does the animal get tested? And as you said, they are reflective of the day of the test. It smells fishy to me, because of that.

Maybe it does, I feel that the AVMA is doing the anti raw at the request of the companies that many of them prescribe.

The homeopathic battle can be linked to traditional vets taking a hit as owners are waking up to issues stemming from over vaccinating. Alternative therapies to help our pets, saying no to flea and heartworm prevention, which causes more harm to the dog then a flea bite will.

I think they are doing this not for “health” as they claim, but to keep their group in money. Ultimately, who benefits from this? The vets. And what concerns me it it the close minded ones that benefit the most. My traditional vet doesn’t want to hear about the benefits of raw, never mind that my four year olds teeth look like a two year old, pearly white. No body odor, smaller stool volumes, etc. am I to lie and say kibble all the time to avoid the lecture?

[aimee]

I took a look too. It seems AVMA is inviting AKC into a discussion revolving around animal health. I looked at the AKC rules and reg for showing and their section on health seems very limited in scope and outdated. Maybe I just was looking in the wrong location??

The take away I had was the AVMA wants to encourage the clubs hosting the shows to establish health recommendations for the exhibitors based on local disease incidence. They are recommending that all exhibitors dogs be free of parasites but I too didn’t see this as AVMA saying all dogs had to be on heartworm and flea and tick prevention just that they not be carrying. : )

I also took a skim through the AVMA’s Prinicples of Vaccination and it seems if anything AVMA is saying use vaccine judiciously based on risk assessment.

[Melissaandcrew]

ALexandra-

Just took a quick look and I am not getting the same thing you got : )

1) it says the guidelines would be vaccinated as appropriate for the shows area-this makes sense. If parvo is a huge factor in a show area, it only makes sense that all dogs coming to the show be current or titered The question would come into play as to what each individual show is requiring(which some shows already do!) I am betting that exemptions would not be an issue since the vaccine status is verified by your own veterinarian : )

2) Dogs would have to have certificate for interstate travel(this is a basic health exam and form that gets filled out) Believe it or not, many states already have these laws in place, owners just ignore them or never look into them. Rescues/transporters for rescues keep a travel log and any dog travelling through an affected state are certain to travel with required paperwork

3)No where does it say flea/heartworm preventative is required. It says the dog must be internal and externally parasite free. For me, that is a no brainer. This can be accomplished with a fecal and visual check at the health exam for transport.

[Alexandra]

To those of us that show, have shown, or plan on showing:

As more us lean toward holistic treatments for our dogs with regards to the vaccines, the AVMA is going to bring its overblown ideas to the AKC. This spring they are to sit down with the AKC and update the clubs rules with regards to vaccines and other preventative uses. The AVMA is proposing that the AKC mandates that exhibitors dogs need to have all vaccines as required by the area the show is in. They MUST be on heartworm and flea and tick preventatives. Dogs that show out of state must be certified by a vet in their home state that they meet the protocols of that show.

This will impact those of us who show and don’t do all the yearly vaccines. I for one, will no longer support the AKC and look to other venues to compete in, if this comes into effect.

[Shawna]

No, Audrey has never had any other issues except the kd. Blood pressure is good.. Her kidneys didn’t develop properly before being born. I do everything in my power to make sure she has little to no inflammation in her body. I don’t have any toxins in my home that the kidneys/liver have to filter. I looked at the ingredients in all the products I used (swiffer sweeper cleaning liquid etc) and checked their MSDS or the CDC to see if each ingredient was kidney friendly. I got rid of almost all cleaners etc I was using prior to Audrey coming to me. Many (actually most) of them were “green” too.

She also only gets reverse osmosis or distilled water.. The tap water in my area is not truly “clean” (has fluoride etc).

I do give her nutraceuticals as well — she gets enzymes with EVERY meal. She gets the pro and prebiotics as needed. She gets a product called Canine Renal Support from Standard Process which I think has been a HUGE part of her health. I also give her Canine Hepatic Support to help her liver. The liver is more likely to get stressed because the kidneys aren’t doing their part. She gets extra vitamin B complex and C — these are water soluble vitamins and are lost in excess due to the large volumes of urine so they need to be supplemented. Most vets don’t discuss these kinds of things that will help our kd pups live a longer healthier life…

Audrey has NEVER had a rabies shot. She is exempted for life. She’s never had any vaccines except her first puppy shots (distemper, parvo and adeno). No lymes, lepto, kennel cough etc. They know that vaccines can stress the kidneys. She also has never had flea/tick or heartworm meds, pharmaceutical dewormers etc. ALL of these add insult to injury.

I haven’t used it but I’ve spoken with others that have had very very good success with an herbal regimen by Five Leaf Pharmacy (my father is a Master Herbalist so he could make these for me at less than half the cost—otherwise I probably would have tried them).. He liked the formulas.. http://caninekidneyhealth.com/

[Toxed2loss]

Hey Labman,
You didn’t say what you were feeding, in your post above. Not sure if you’ve posted that somewhere else on the site, but it is important. Your dog’s food is the foundation of her health.

Back before I knew better, I fed really bad dog food to my beloved pointer cross, Morgan. Ol’ Roy, I’m ashamed to say. I was just flat out ignorant!! When she was 12 she slept most of the time, she barely moved, just like yours. Well, my husband decided he needed a new bird dog, so he went out and bought a highly trained purebred, 3 yr old field registered pointer. The owner had health issues and he made it a condition of the sale to feed “high quality” food. Well, he knew more than us, but not as much as he should of, too. He was feeding Iams lamb & rice. A whole lot better than Ol’ Roy!!! So we put both dogs on the better food. Dang!!!! But after a few weeks that dog got up one day and followed my husband 1/4 mile out to the back fence. He turned around and saw her there, wagging her tail and was so worried he carried her (60 lbs) in his arms all the way back to the house. She was lively and healthier for 2-3 more years.

Fast forward to what I know now, feeding your dog THE BEST nutrition makes all the difference! (That’s not Iams!) its balanced raw. If you don’t want to, or can’t, feed raw, then a 5 star meat based kibble. Brother’s Complete is my best pick of kibbles. Hound Dog Mom has posted a lot of recipes and information on raw feeding under that thread, and I’d encourage you to check it out if raw is the way you’d like to go. Shawna is the best resource for nutritional information. Mike P & JohnandChristo rock for feeding kibble plus toppers! Dogs should be living 20-30 years. They were 80 years ago. But that was when they weren’t being feed corn & wheat based dog food. They also weren’t routinely exposed to toxins from flea & tick pesticides, worm pesticides, heavy metals poisoning in vaccines and being over vaccinated… Reducing the environmental toxins will improve your pups health, too! Supplements are just supplements. They can help a little, but they work best synergistically with optimal nutrition.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Yeah, definitely. Vitamin e, fish oil, Pet Kelp and the Flea Free all contain different ingredients with different purposed and would be safe to use together. Then once you’re done the bag of Pet Kelp pick out a new supplement next time.

[weimlove]

Ok, that seems easy! So to start out, do you think as long as I add the vitamin e and fish oil that the pet kelp is ok to use? Also, if I ordered the flea free product, would it be ok to use all of those ingredients together?

[husky3]

Wow, thank you for your response!! I have been searching for an answer for a very long time…

I was not aware of Potatoes having toxins… It’s interesting that you bring up allergies, I was just thinking the other day that she might be allergic to something. I noticed her lips/muzzle seemed a little more “plump” than normal… But I chalked that up to her being overweight, since she is not itchy, has a beautiful thick coat, and no skin problems.

She is up to date on all her vaccinations, and since seeing our new vet (who is wonderful, might I add), we’ve recently decided that we will only go with the mandatory Rabies vaccination which is due next month. They run a titer blood test to confirm they don’t need additional vaccines. She has never had any GI problems, and she gets Trifexis once a month for any possible worms/fleas. I’m not sure what other environmental things could be bothering her, what other environmental things were you referring to?

I have notice a slight change in her physique since we upped the exercise, but still no actual weight loss after 8 months of decreased calories and increased exercise. I will look into the Brothers Complete, and, quite frankly, I’m afraid to try the RAW diet, I’ve heard it’s difficult to make sure they are getting all the nutrition they need, in addition to the protein. I may have to suck it up and try it though, or at least incorporate it into their diet a couple times a week. 🙂

I am very excited to research all the great information you provided, and I think I will have an allergy test ran to see what foods she might be sensitive to. Hopefully we will finally find our answer!

Thank you again for your response, I really appreciate your input. 🙂
Hope you have a Happy New Year!

[Toxed2loss]

Hi Sophia,
I checked out the product that HDM recommended and its a very good product. Nice find HDM!

I use a salve make myself with coconut oil, beeswax & essential oils, or a water based iodine salve. I’ve also recently treated ear problems with astaxanthin. It works better than anything else I’ve tried. I get the caps from Dr. Mercola. Make a pin hole in one end & put one (5 lb Pom) or two (50 lb poodle) in each ear. I squeeze the rest in their mouths. Worked in just a few applications, with occasional follow ups as the toxins work their way out of the tissue.

The itching & “allergies” are more likely due to the frontline & vaccine reactions than anything else. Hop over to the “vaccinating” thread and read my posts there, if you haven’t already. Then be sure to read my post on the “Detoxing” thread. If you clean up her diet & environment, and boost her immune system, you can relieve all those symptoms. It will take time. 🙂 But its worth it.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I always keep a jar of Dr. Harvey’s healing cream on hand for any sort of skin irritation.

http://www.drharveys.com/products/show/24-organic-healing-cream

[sophia]

I think the fleas (maybe) are gone, however my dog did a number on her skin. She ripped fur from her legs and I can see clusters of flea bites there. She’s still very itchy, to the point where she’s causing bleeding in her ears (which WERE recovering from infection) and very red skin. I am going to keep up with flea treatment as if they are still there, but is there anything safe to put on her skin for relief in the mean time? can you use benedryll ointment on a dog? She takes benedryl in the pill form for allergies, but I am not sure if there is a difference. Neosporin? homemade creams? Anything safe to rub in her ear? I’ve got to get her to stop itching them before she bursts an ear drum.

[pugmomsandy]

I use the Flea Free during the warm months and also use Halo Herbal Dip with some added neem oil, Mercola flea/tick spray, and Only Natural Pet Herbal Defense Oil. I alternate. I like the different smells. Last summer was the first one without chemicals and I did not have any problems in Dallas/Fort Worth Texas. I also used garlic spray alternating with a neem oil spray on the yard every couple weeks.

[weimlove]

Patty & Betsy-
That is good to know, thanks for sharing! I will definintly discuss other alternative options with my vet. It can be difficult to find a low dose medicine that only prevents heartworm.

[Toxed2loss]

Here’s another vet’s take.. He practiced & lived in Santa Cruz, where there was a prevalence,
“Heartworms

This parasite is a source of great anxiety among dog caretakers. (I don’t believe that one “owns” a dog.) Thanks in large part to the scare tactics of many veterinarians in promoting preventive drugs, many people believe that contracting heartworms is the equivalent of a death sentence for their dogs. This is not true.
I practiced for seven years in the Santa Cruz, California area, and treated many dogs with heartworms. The only dogs that developed symptoms of heart failure were those that were being vaccinated yearly, eating commercial dog food, and getting suppressive drug treatment for other symptoms, such as skin problems. My treatment, at that time, consisted of switching to a natural (that is, homemade) diet, stopping drug treatment whenever possible, and eliminating any chemical exposure, such as flea and tick poisons. I would usually prescribe hawthorn tincture as well. None of these dogs ever developed any symptoms of heart failure.
I concluded from this that it was not the heartworms that caused disease, but the other factors that damaged the dogs’ health to the point that they could no longer compensate for an otherwise tolerable parasite load. It is not really that different from the common intestinal roundworms, in that most dogs do not show any symptoms. Only a dog whose health is compromised is unable to tolerate a few worms. Furthermore, a truly healthy dog would not be susceptible to either type of worm in the first place.

It seems to me that the real problem is that allopathic attitudes have instilled in many of us a fear of disease, fear of pathogens and parasites, fear of rabies, as if these are evil and malicious entities just waiting to lay waste to a naive and unprotected public.

Disease is not caused by viruses or by bacteria or by heartworm-bearing mosquitoes. Disease comes from within, and one aspect of disease can be the susceptibility to various pathogens. So the best thing to do is to address those susceptibilities on the deepest possible level, so that the pathogens will no longer be a threat. Most importantly, don’t buy into the fear.

That having been said, there are practical considerations of risk versus benefit in considering heartworm prevention. The risk of a dog contracting heartworms is directly related to geographic location. In heavily infested areas the risk is higher, and the prospect of using a preventive drug more justifiable. Whatever you choose to do, a yearly blood test for heartworm microfilaria is important.

There are basically three choices with regard to heartworm prevention: drugs, nosodes, or nothing.

There are currently a variety of heartworm preventive drugs, most of which are given monthly. I don’t like any of them due to their toxicity, the frequency of side effects, and their tendency to antidote homeopathic remedies. Incidentally, the once-a-month preventives should be given only every 6 weeks.

The next option is the heartworm nosode. It has the advantage of at least not being a toxic drug. It has been in use it for over 10 years now, and I am reasonably confident that it is effective. It is certainly very safe. The biggest problem with the nosode is integrating it with homeopathic treatment. But at least it’s less of a problem than with the drugs.

The last option, and in my opinion the best, is to do nothing. That is to say, do nothing to specifically prevent heartworm, but rather to minimize the chances of infestation by helping your dog to be healthier, and thereby less susceptible. This means avoiding those things that are detrimental to health, feeding a high quality homemade diet, regular exercise, a healthy emotional environment, and, most of all, constitutional homeopathic treatment. Of course, this will not guarantee that your dog will not get heartworms, but, under these conditions, even the worst-case scenario isn’t so terrible. If your dog were to get heartworms, s/he shouldn’t develop any symptoms as a result.

For what it’s worth, I never gave my dog any type of heartworm preventive, even when we lived in the Santa Cruz area where heartworms were very prevalent. I tested him yearly, and he never had a problem.” Dr. Jeffery Levy DVM PCH http://www.homeovet.net/content/lifestyle/section4.html

[DogFoodie]

Hi guys, PattyVaughn was wanting to get a message to Weimlove. Patty is having trouble posting in the forum so I’m hoping this message reaches you on her behalf.

Pattyvaughn
My posts are disappearing on the forum right now and there is a poster there, Weimlove, that lives in Florida that is asking questions involving heartworm prevention and flea prevention that I would love if someone would relay info to. She is planning on going with Heartguard and there are a few dogs every year that turn up heartworm positive at the proper dose in Florida. Heartguard is losing its effectiveness, so she should discuss that with her vet too.

[DogFoodie]

Hi guys, PattyVaughn was wanting to get a message to Weimlove. Patty is having trouble posting in the forum so I’m hoping this message reaches you on her behalf.

Pattyvaughn
My posts are disappearing on the forum right now and there is a poster there, Weimlove, that lives in Florida that is asking questions involving heartworm prevention and flea prevention that I would love if someone would relay info to. She is planning on going with Heartguard and there are a few dogs every year that turn up heartworm positive at the proper dose in Florida. Heartguard is losing its effectiveness, so she should discuss that with her vet too.

[Hound Dog Mom]

From Pattyvaughn:

“My posts are disappearing on the forum right now and there is a poster there, Weimlove, that lives in Florida that is asking questions involving heartworm prevention and flea prevention that I would love if someone would relay info to. She is planning on going with Heartguard and there are a few dogs every year that turn up heartworm positive at the proper dose in Florida. Heartguard is losing its effectiveness, so she should discuss that with her vet too.”

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi weimlove –

I’m a fan of flea free, I used it two summers ago. I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend it, I believe some other posters here have said they use it as well. This past year is the first year I’ve gone chemical free for fleas and ticks, the year before I had my dogs on Trifexis as well. My male never had a problem with the Trifexis but on two different occasions my female puked and I had to redose her. Knowing what I know now I regret giving them something with so many chemicals! It covers fleas, heartworm and it’s a broad-spectrum dewormer in one – kinda explains the puking, all those medications in one pill must be stressful to the system.