[somebodysme]

I have a few questions to clarify a few things:

I feed kibble only right now and I see mentioned that it’s good to feed cage free eggs. My question that always comes to my mind when eggs are mentioned is this; do you feed the entire egg shell and all and if so do you food process it or just crack it and put it in the bowl to eat raw shell and all? Also, do you wash the eggs off if you give the shell? She weights 50 lbs, so ONE a day?

Another question: She LOVES to eat this one particular grass that in a runner type grass but I don’t know what it’s called, I live in Ohio so something native to our area. I’d rather give her my own grass that I know is safe so I saw HDM mention both wheat grass and sprouted flax…my question is; would one of these give her what she’s seeking out and which one? How do you sprout flax and how much would I give? If wheat grass would be the better option, where do you get that and how much to feed?

Not trying to highjack the thread…these are probably questions on others minds as well. A lot of dogs eat grass I think…

[little pea]

Having done an allergy test, I now can’t find a food… in addition one item that came up as positive was yeast. When I contacted the test clinic they could not give me a break out as to what kind of yeast….
Where do I go from here?

Many allergic items were borderline to borderline positive. Raw is not really an option as we are talking about a 110 lbs of dog.
I am currently using ZIWIPeak venison but this has green lip mussels… and she has a borderline allergy to shell fish mix. It too is a bit pricey.

[FreeholdHound]

Oh my- I need a flip chart just to READ this thread! I’m lost & clueless! Advice please..
I’m feeding kibble in the AM and kibble mixed w/ premade grinds (meat,organ,bone, & tripe) in the PM
I add in:
Ground sardines 2-3 meals per week
Crused egg w/shell 2-3 meals/week
Kefir 4-5 meals/week
Vitamin E cap (400 IU) when I remember to AM meal.
I have the Dr Stephen Langer 15 strain Probiotic coming in the mail tomorrow.
Salmon oil is not tolerated by Harry AT ALL.
Suggestions please would be appreciated!
We’re just starting out on the raw mix ins & trying to figure out supplements.

[theBCnut]

I can tell you what I do. When mine get half kibble and half raw, I give them a half dose of enzymes. When I give the raw seperately, I still give the half dose with the kibble.

[InkedMarie]

HDM, I’m feeding a combo of dry, pre made raw and THK. How often should mine get probiotics and digestive enzymes?

[Sue’s Zoo]

Hi hdm, pattyvaughn, and all the other wonderful contributors and questioners,

I’ve been reading and re-reading various posts in this informative forum topic. I’m love to have a way to print the topic and pull out all the info into a single document. May have to work on that

Anyway I will soon have my new puppy, a Shiloh Shepherd. We’ve always had GSDs, the last several we’re rescues but we went thru a breeder this time and I want to do everything possible to raise a healthy happy dog. My husband said I need grandkids based on how excited I am about this pup true but none of the kids are even remotely ready to be parents so….

Finally my questions. My breeder recommends a supplement called The Missing Link. Is anyone familiar with it? Thoughts, concerns? And I plan to feed raw or a combination of raw and kibble but l need to know if there’s a nutritional difference between freeze-dried and frozen. In other words are the ones on the list referring to frozen only or either?

Sending positive thoughts to pattyvaughn and anyone else awaiting test results.

[Cyndi]

Well, Bailey just ate her whole quail. My stomach doesn’t feel so good, lol! I watched her for a few seconds and then I just couldn’t handle it anymore. I don’t know how you guys, Patty and HDM, can watch your dogs eat a whole animal, but I can’t. Ugh! I will feed her those regularly, but, I just can’t stomach that. If it’s just raw meat, without a face or a body, I’m fine. I’m ok with the blood and liver and everything else, but holy cow, it really turned my stomach to watch her for the few seconds that I did! 🙁 BUT, Yay for Bailey!! Lol!

[Hound Dog Mom]

Vitamin A can be harmful in excess because it’s a fat soluble vitamin – however you need to feed too much of it in order for it to build up. A capsule of cod liver oil per day would not come anywhere near toxic vitamin a doses. One capsule of Carlson Super Cod Liver Oil provides 2,000 IU vitamin a – the toxic dose (which needs to be given daily for months to create toxicity) is 113,600 IU per pound of food consumed on a dry matter basis. So assuming your dog eats one pound of food per day (dry matter) the dog would have to eat 50+ capsules of cod liver oil per day to result in vitamin a toxicity. I’ve ran a full nutrient analysis on my raw menus and they are well below the AAFCO’s safe upper limit for vitamin a levels. One of my menus I analyzed came out to 52,412 IU/kg and the other to 78,326 IU/kg – the AAFCO’s upper limit is 250,000 IU/kg. The problems arise when people substitute cod liver oil for fish body oil and use it to meet their dog’s omega 3 needs. Cod liver oil should not be used as an omega 3 supplement – it should be used in small doses as a whole food source of vitamin d. One of the reasons I use Carlson, in addition to the fact that their products are stringently tested for contaminants and contain high levels of vitamin e to preserve the fats, is that their cod liver oil is lower in vitamin a than many other brands.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 4 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Hound Dog Mom]

My favorite training treats are ZiwiPeak food, Vital Essential’s freeze-dried nibblets and Nature’s Variety Instinct freeze-dried raw (in the nuggets). I like to use complete and balanced foods for treats whenever possible and the dogs seem to really like these foods.

[theBCnut]

I never have to do worse than partially thaw and cut into 1/4s and refreeze and that is bad enough.

[SandyandMila]

Well because Gertie has been eating raw for so long and has no issues, I think Bailey can do it too. I love Grandma Lucy’s and THK, they make great products. You can still still feed the raw ground meat with a premix, Bailey might like it.

[Cyndi]

Lol! I think you mean ‘if Hound Dog Mom can do it, Cyndi can TRY to do it!’ Lol!

[Cyndi]

Damn HDM, I dread mixing up the 1 lb packages of beef, & organs & tripe to portion them up. I’m glad I don’t have to portion up THAT much! That would suck!

[SandyandMila]

I’ll have to portion the tripe and turkey necks when my boyfriend isn’t home. hehe Good luck though, if we don’t see u on here we’ll know why.

[Hound Dog Mom]

I’m getting my meat order tomorrow from my supplier and dreading it. 350 lbs. of meat to portion, pack and freeze. It will be an all day affair. 🙁

[SandyandMila]

If Gertie can do it, Bailey can do it. 🙂

[SandyandMila]

Those are the 4 I’m planning on feeding (following one of your templates, somewhat) with rabbit on Sunday. Just waiting for my Hare Today order comes in then it’ll be all raw. 🙂

[Hound Dog Mom]

Pork is a staple protein in our household. My dogs mostly get pork, beef, chicken and turkey. Cheapest and easiest to find.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi EHubbman –

It’s all pretty confusing when you start out isn’t it?

I would like to start out by saying I strongly disagree with those that say supplements aren’t necessary for a raw diet. The thing is, if a dog was eating whole wild prey daily this may be true but that’s not practical in real life. It would be next to impossible to feed an actual prey model diet so people approximate it by feeding ratios of muscle meat, organ meat and bone (80:10:10) that mimic the ratios found in a whole prey animal. While this is a good estimate of the dog’s natural diet, it’s not going to provide all the nutrients a dog needs for various reasons: 1) Your dog isn’t getting the whole animal. When a dog eats prey in the wild it eats everything – all the organs, the glands, the brain, eyeballs, fur, feathers, sinew, some intestines and intestinal content, it even picks up some dirt of the ground where it’s eating. 2) Commercially raised meat such as what is available to us in the supermarket is not as mineral dense as wild prey. 3) Domestic dogs are bombarded with toxins on a daily basis that their wild relatives aren’t – i.e.) flea treatments, heart worm treatments, vaccines, exhaust fumes, cleaning chemicals, etc. etc. – and for this reason benefit from additional antioxidants in their diet that are provides through fruits, vegetables and whole super foods.

You do not need to supplement with enzymes when feeding a raw diet. Raw food contains enzymes. These enzymes are destroyed when the food is cooked and this is why kibble and canned foods should be supplemented with enzymes. Probiotic supplements are also a waste of money unless you have a dog with serious digestive issues. Feeding green tripe and/or plain yogurt and/or kefir at least a few times a week will maintain a healthy population of gut flora in a healthy dog.

You will need to add supplemental omega 3’s. You can do this by adding a quality fish body oil, cage free eggs or feeding a fatty fish such as sardines. If you want to feed sardines the recommend servings are (based on 3.75 oz. tin): 5 lbs. 1/4 tin, 15 lbs. 1/2 tin, 25 lbs. 5/8 tin, 50 lbs. 1 tin, 100 lbs. 1 3/4 tin – per week. If giving fish oil you want to add enough to provide about 100 mg. combined EPA and DHA per 10 lbs. of body weight. While the majority of a dog’s omega 3’s should come from animal sources, some plant based omega 3’s can be beneficial as well. If you’re feeding predominantly poultry, flax should be given to balance the fats and if you’re feeding predominantly red meat hemp seed should be given to balance the fats. My dogs get a cage free egg 3 days per week, Carlson brand salmon oil complete (with astaxanthin) daily and I also give small amounts of sprouted flax, sprouted chia, etc. If not supplementing with vitamin d, you should give cod liver oil as well. Carlson makes the highest quality cod liver oil – my girls each get 1 capsule of Carlson Super Cod Liver Oil daily which provides 250 IU vitamin d. If giving fish oil it’s very important not to skimp on quality – fish oil is one supplement you don’t want to find a bargain on. The cheaper brands are often rancid at purchase and don’t contain enough antioxidants to prevent oxidation. Coconut oil, as Patty pointed out, is comprised of MCT’s. Coconut oil can be given in addition to (but not instead of) omega 3’s. Coconut oil has antibacterial and antifungal properties. You can give up to 1/2 tsp. per 10 lbs. of body weight daily. My girls get coconut oil daily, I find it’s a healthy way to increase the fat level of their meals.

As Sandy pointed out, vitamin e is also necessary to add – this is especially important when supplementing with omega 3’s as vitamin e prevents the delicate fats from oxidizing in the body. For dogs <25 add 50 – 100 IU per day, 25 – 50 lbs. 100 – 200 IU per day, 50 – 75 lbs. 200 – 300 IU per day, 75 – 100 lbs. 300 – 400 IU per day, >100 lbs. 400 IU per day. I use NOW Foods Gamma E Complex – it has all 8 tocopherols and tocotrienols.

Other supplements my dogs get:

-A homemade super food mix. I generally use 1 part kelp, 1 part alfalfa, 1 part spirulina, 1 part wheat grass and 1 part bee pollen although I’ll sometimes sub in a different ingredient for variety. I buy most of my ingredients from Swanson or Starwest Botanicals in 1 lb. bags. This provides vital trace nutrients to the diet. I’d recommend about 1 tsp per 25 – 30 lbs. (roughly) for a supplement such as this.

-I give my dogs colostrum 3 days per week. Colostrum is high in immunoglobulins which helps strengthen the immune system.

-They get a glandular 3 days per week (opposite the colostrum). I use Natural Sources Raw Multiple.

If you read through the raw menu section I have my dog’s full menus (with supplements) posted.

I prefer to balance my dog’s diets using whole foods versus adding synthetic supplements. The nutrients from whole foods are more efficiently assimilated by the body and contain all the necessary co-factors for optimal absorption and utilization. There’s also a much lower chance of overdosing on nutrients when using whole foods.

If you have any more questions don’t be afraid to ask. 🙂

• This reply was modified 12 years, 4 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.

[Cyndi]

Hi HDM, I’m actually going to visit family, so I won’t be staying in a hotel. (even though I’d rather stay in a hotel, lol!) But I am going to gross them all out by bringing a whole quail for Bailey to eat while I’m there. Lol! 🙂

I’ll have to look into the dehydrated or even a pre-mix and see if I can get any of that before I leave. That would be easier than trying to remember to bring everything I feed her in a 5 day period… Bailey has never had any of that before, so I hope, if I do go that route, that none of that messes with her system.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi Cyndi –

First, if you haven’t thought of this already, make sure there’s a fridge in your hotel room. I travel with Gertie a lot and generally I pack a pre-mix and stop at a grocery store to pick up meat when I get to the hotel room or I just bring a dehdyrated food such a Grandma Lucy’s or THK and feed that.

[Cyndi]

Lol! I try not to let stuff like that bother me, but it still does, lol!

[theBCnut]

I know what you mean. I couldn’t keep up either and I kept getting certain things mixed up(still do) so I started an index card file to tell me what certain supplements are good for and what dose to give. I still have to go back through a couple threads and pick out th info I wanted to save. Like cod liver oil, I think you give it for the Vit D, but I’m not sure. And You have to be careful to get the right brand(I don’t remember which) or don’t give it very often, because it has too much vit A, again I think. That is one I don’t worry about because I only feed part raw. But one of these days…

BTW, cocnut oil is digested differently because it is a medium chain triglyceride, so it isn’t taxing to the pancreas if you find you need to add more fats to your dogs diet for some reason. It has both antibacterial and antifungal activity and it is good for the coat.

[theBCnut]

WOW!! That is a lot of questions. Some of them HDM is the best source for answers, but I can tackle a few.

Probiotics are the good micro-organisms in the gut and they are a huge part of the immune system, because they compete with bad micro-organisms and thereby keep their numbers small. They are naturally occurring in tripe.

Prebiotics are food for probiotics, they are fibers that the probiotics love, they aren’t all created equal though, some prebiotics feed the bad stuff just as well as the good.

Enzymes carry nutrients where they need to go in the body and aid in digestion. There are already enzymes in raw meat, but in processing for kibble they are destroyed. Dogs make enzymes, but some do not make enough, because they were made to get them out of their food. And the body adjusts enzyme production to match the diet, so if a dog was getting a high carb, low protein diet for a long time, it may take a while for its body to get used to the different need for enzymes when the diet is changed. Digestive enzymes are the ones that are specific to digestion.

Spirulina is a blue green algae that is chockful of micronutrients, which are all the little things that a body probably needs, but science hasn’t determined how much of what or what for, so dog food companies don’t have to add them back into the food.

Fish oil, fish body oil are sources of omega 3s and need to be fresh so putting it in a bag of kibble may not be a good thing. Krill are little shrimp, otherwise the same applies to fish oil. Krill oil is supposed to be better. It has some of those micronutritents in it and a higher level of quality omega 3s.

As for why some say use them, don’t use them etc. There are what I consider raw food purists, that don’t feed anything except whole carcass raw prey. Period. They believe that since that is how wolves evolved, that is what you should feed dogs. Then there are those that recognize that we don’t live in that world anymore. That the world we do live in has pollution and food animals that were not raised as prefectly as we could want and therefore are lacking some of those things that if we lived in a perfect world they would have. They feed antioxidant rich foods to help rid the body of toxins and other foods to help make up for the perceived lack in the prey animals. And then there is every shade in between.

My fingers hurt, someone else will have to provide more. Or I will later.

[theBCnut]

I know what you mean. I drive myself crazy all the time.

[SandyandMila]

Yeah that’s smart. That’s probably why a lot if the commercial raw companies don’t have pork, people would be worried whether it was safe to feed.

[theBCnut]

They don’t usually suggest starting with pork because it is high fat. And when I started using pork, I mixed it with turky to reduce the overall fat. Now I don’t worry about it anymore, but to start with I was careful of not shocking everybodies system.

[Cyndi]

Yeah, that’s true, but it WILL drive me crazy. I’m only going to be gone 5 days.

[EHubbman]

Complete newbie here! Reading the forums, I see so many things on prebiotics, probiotics, enzymes, digestive enzymes, fish oil, krill oil, emu(?) oil, cod liver oil, fish body oil, coconut oils, etc, the list goes on and on! (What the heck is spirulina?)

What are these things, and what do they do? What are the pros/cons of giving them? Where do they come from (supplements v. naturally occurring, such as in a specific part of a raw diet)? When is it appropriate to give them, and how much per day per weight of dog?

Sorry for all the questions! Like I said, complete newbie, and looking in to starting a raw diet with my little guy. Some people say “yes, supplement!” While others say “Yes, but only THESE supplements,” while still others say “no, don’t supplement! If you feed raw right, you don’t have to!”

There’s so much info out there and this fourm has been such a wonderful help on other issues, I thought I’d throw this one out there.

Thank you for the help!

[SandyandMila]

I have a 5 lb. box of pork neck bones I haven’t opened yet because I’m waiting for my Hare Today order to come in. By then it’ll be about 3 weeks since putting them in the freezer and I’ll be starting and all raw diet. I think I’ll start with the neck bones and see how she likes it. Just wanted to know what others thought of ground pork. 🙂

[theBCnut]

How long are you going to be gone? If it’s just a few days I wouldn’t worry much about what you forget.

[Cyndi]

That WOULD be a good time to use a premix, but I’ve never used those. I’m just gonna have to make sure I remember to bring everything I add to her food. I just know I’m gonna forget something, lol!

Thanks Patty!

• This reply was modified 12 years, 4 months ago by Cyndi.

[theBCnut]

I’ve used ground pork with a premix. It’s not OK by itself. I still freeze it for safety before I feed it.

[theBCnut]

I haven’t traveled with my raw fed dogs yet. But I think if I did, that might be when I used a premix, so all I would have to do is find a lb of some kind of meat.

[SandyandMila]

Is ground pork ok, or should it be more of a grind mix with bone and organs?

[Cyndi]

Thanks, SanDnMila! I order from Hare Today all the time, and I knew that, but that didn’t even cross my mind, lol! I have SO much on my mind these days I just plain forgot that I do that all the time too. I thaw my grinds out to portion them out and then refreeze. I guess I was just worried about thawing and refreezing the stuff again and again. I’m sure it will still be fine though.

[SandyandMila]

Refreeze* not referee lol

[SandyandMila]

Hare Today states on their websit that ” it is fine to referee and will not effect the quality of the products”. And that’s after shipping for a couple days, so u should be ok. I probably won’t get my first order til next week so I don’t know personally, I just got that info from their site.

[Hershy]

Hi, Patty,
Thanks for your post. Well said about the topic of Vets and animal nutrition…always room for improvement, right?…by me, too! I definitely plan to do a much better job feeding my “kids” a delicious and healthy diet.

HI, HDM & Patty,
And looks like I may get a second chance with my Charlotte girl. I am thankful that Charlotte’s cancer screen came back negative yesterday evening, but Vet held back saying there was none, in that she said she sampled only a small portion, so could still be early stages. I’ll take that, and look at it as another chance to do a better job with her. If she has it, at least it is very early.
Thanks, HDM and Patty, for encouraging me to go ahead with the test. Of course I needed to know. Not sure what I was thinking.
Now, moving forward with her new diet, mostly raw. I will start with her, and slowly add the other 3. Although I have already transitioned all to 4 & 5 star kibble. I top my puppy, Crystal’s, Nutri-Source Lg. Breed puppy food with Merrik Grain Free Tripe, and the 3 big dogs have been getting Pro Balance Canned as a topper.
I can’t thank you all enough for this education I continue to receive. How I nourish my dogs will keep improving, and I will definitely keep in touch with this forum.
Will soon add the raw food forum to my list of preferred reading : )
Patty, hope your dog’s result was at least as good.
Thanks, again!

[EHubbman]

Ok! Back from the vet!

I was seriously not impressed with the care we got from the one I’d been bringing family pets to since I was six, so we went elsewhere. That seriously miffed me. They’d been great with all our other pets, but then I brought in my little guy at 14 weeks (!) and I think the vet just had it out for him because he’s seen as a bully breed. Vets shouldn’t be breedist, methinks, because they see good and bad examples of all breeds, big and small, bad rep or not. Off my soapbox, though. She wouldn’t believe me when I said he had tapeworms and even brought in a sample with the segment clearly sitting right on top, among other things. I talked to her about giardia and she’s like, no he doesn’t have it, without testing and seemed quite reluctant upon my insistence of it.

SO! New vet, recommended from a friend, who also happens to be a vet tech there, which was wonderful. They were going to run the EPI and fecal pathogen test, but the vet did a wellness check on him and his body condition, activity level, and personality were all awesome, so we’re starting first with a diet change. She said the funny color stools were because the last vet’s response to my saying “please help, diarrhea for a month now” was just to throw antibiotics at him that did nothing, so his gut is all sort of out of whack. The did a wellness check, fecal float, coccidia and giardia tests, and a few other things I don’t remember off the top of my head.

We’re trying a royal canin RX GI food (ewewew, I cringe at the ingredient list!) for two weeks. So for two weeks, all he’s allowed to ingest is the GI food, and boiled chicken as training treats. She wants to keep him on the Fortiflora (because she’s used to it) just for now, but when I asked her about the 15 strain supplement you told me about, she was all for it. We went for the abrupt change because his gut is so messed up, and once he’s stable we’re going to slowly transition him to raw. I love that I found a vet that is all for raw and can’t wait to help me swap to it!!! She seems amazing, and I love her team. 🙂 If, though, the 2 week seriously limited diet does nothing, though, then he gets to go through a gauntlet of testing. She’s almost completely certain, though, that it’s dietary and not anything seriously wrong, which helps me breathe easier.

Although I’m not a fan of the GI food ingredients and fortiflora, I’m ok with it for now, just to get him sorted. I want to give this vet a chance to try what she knows before I just go “Ew, no.” and be the brat that asks for help but won’t accept what’s given as help. That and because she wants to start working him toward raw asap. Who knows. We’ll see where it goes.

Not sure I’m gonna be able to deal with the puppy eyes when he doesn’t get to have his dried trachea…or bully sticks… or duck feeties…. o.o Haha!

[Cyndi]

Hi everyone! I guess, by reading this thread, my question is for Hound Dog Mom, or should I say “Hot” Dog Mom! Lol! Sorry! I will never do that again, lol!

Anyways, I am driving to New Jersey next week with Bailey. It’s a 7 hour drive. I have a cooler for her food. My question is, I’m wondering if, in 7 hours, if her food will thaw out, and does it matter if it does and if I can just refreeze it once I get to where I’m going? I have like 4 ice packs and I will get some regular ice to cover her food once it’s in the cooler, so I don’t know if stuff will completely thaw or not, but I would imagine it’s ok to refreeze the stuff.

Another question, for anyone that has traveled with their dog that is raw fed, is there any problems that you ran into or anything that might help me in knowing ahead of time, so I can prevent it from happening to me? Like, maybe you forgot something, or didn’t use enough ice, or in my case I’m wondering how I’m going to make sure her dinner is thawed enough to eat, cuz she’ll be eating on the road…

Any help/tips anyone can give me would be GREATLY appreciated!

[Hershy]

Thank you, for getting back to me so quickly. I appreciate your wisdom and advice. You’re right. I need to know. I didn’t mean to make the cost of the test seem like the first consideration. I am on a pretty tight budget, but I will find a way to do what I need to do. I am putting the cart before the horse. I pray she doesn’t have cancer. She’s my special girl! I guess I have to prepare myself for the worst. I called them and told them to go ahead with the test. But I do know, if she does have it, I will not make her undergo a bunch of chemical treatment (as far as I know). I will to the alternative route for treatment, if necessary. And thank you for the information on what things to avoid, and to give. She is going to start on a raw diet as soon as I can get it together! I was making my own for part of last year, but got too busy. Poor Charlotte has been on inferior food for most of her life because I didn’t know any better. I have always switched up foods a little, but usually didn’t end up being to a food that was any better for her. They all claim to be the best. I am so grateful for this site. Why don’t dog food companies and especially VETS! learn about dog nutrition?? And then to recommend SCIENCE DIET!? I just wish I had seen this site 5 years ago,and maybe Charlotte wouldn’t be having these issues now.

I’m picking Charlotte up from the vet this evening, so am hoping for the best.
Thanks, again.

[Cranberry]

What are your thoughts on Dr.Harvey’s fine ground, Sojos grain free, and THK preference? I am having trouble deciding on which one to feed my dogs(6lb and 11lb chihuahuas). They will not be eating raw, so which one do you think is best? I am also worried about the sugar content. My smallest one goes into a hypoglycemic seizure(?) if she doesn’t eat in the morning. Currently they are eating kibbles and bits which has so much sugar that it is making me worried about changing.

While I have a topic, what are your favorite canned foods? Last time I fed dr.harveys/sojos I ended up using canned food as the meat, so I’ll probably end up doing that again. The two brands that stick out to me are Addiction and Wellness 95%.

[SandyandMila]

Yes the primal chicken mix is the only one I’ve tried so far and just got the Bravo burger blends but haven’t tried it yet. I feed commercial raw in the am and either RMBs or that mix in the pm and the kibble and canned on the weekend for dinner. I haven’t used the Preference yet, maybe return it for baby veggie puree or the whole food supplement? And again the whole food supplement can be given whether commercial and homemade raw? Should I be worried about the brewers yeast in the Nature’s Logic? Mila’s skin and coat has been damaged due to allergies, not sure if the brewers yeast will make it worse? That’s the reason why I’ve switched her to raw and adding krill, sardine, coconut oils and supplements to get food. Thanks for all the help.

[Hound Dog Mom]

Yes, as long as you are feeding grinds that contain meat/organ/bone in the proper proportions (such as the case with Primal and Bravo) and these grinds make up less than half of her diet (i.e. kibble for breakfast and grind for dinner) you would be fine just adding a whole food supplement (or even no supplement, but I believe whole food supplements are very beneficial). Are you able to get the Primal mixes? I used these when I first started feeding raw. I believe they’re 80% meat/organ/bone and 20% fruits, veggies and herbs. To use up the rest of your Preference I say just pick up some ground beef or turkey at the grocery store and use that following the instructions on the package.

[SandyandMila]

Can I just use the one I got periodically, it’s a big bottle that I really don’t want it to go to waste. I can add the green superfood to her diet once I get it and give her less of the multi. If I feed Preference with her homemade raw which has vitamins and minerals including kelp and alfalfa do I still need a green or multi supplement? I know HDM said u can’t overdose on them, just want to make sure I know what I’m doing. She’s already been getting bee pollen and the commercial raw she’s had has coconut oil, salmon oil, and ACV so I’d just be giving those with the homemade raw, right? The dry and wet food is only one or two days a week and will be less once my Hare Today order comes in.

[pugmomsandy]

Nature’s Logic has a whole food supplement when you feed homemade raw. The other foods (kibble, canned) are already complete and balanced (except for superfoods). You can find the green superfoods at the supermarket in the health food section and of course Amazon. I buy from Starwest Botanicals too.

[EHubbman]

Thank you so much! 🙂 I did forget to mention that he is indeed on probiotics. (Fortiflora, got it from the vet.)

So when he was still eating half bland and half kibble, his meals were:half bland, half kibble, his dose of antibiotics, probiotics, and a small amount of pumpkin to try and firm him up.

I think tomorrow we’re going to go to a different vet and get him a good once over (and a giardia test) to see what. hey have to say. I’ve been wholly unimpressed with my vet through all of this.

Thank you so much again for all of your help! I’ve been so lost with all of this that it’s so nice to have someone so well informed to talk to.

If the second vet does suggest a good change, would you think that the zignature lamb would be OK until I can research raw properly? Or would you go with something else?

(Typing this on mobile, so I apologize if there is anything that doesn’t look quite right!)

[SandyandMila]

Bummer I thought I had gotten a good product and started giving it to her today. 🙁 I didn’t find what I was originally looking for (spirulina powder, chlorella powder, wheat grass powder etc.). I feed mostly raw (commercial and homemade) but also kibble (NV or Orijen) and canned (wellness, weruva) when I don’t have raw. I also just got Preference to feed with grinds for the added fruits, veggies, vitamins, and minerals. So I would have to get a whole foods supplement + a multi? I also saw this at the store, it is human-grade but they had it in the pet section as well. Is it a better option? http://www.solgar.com/pub/supplement/1180.pdf. I’ll read your post on the other forum. Guess I’m still confused with all if this. Can I feed the one I got with grinds and my RMB meals and just add a whole food supplement, if I can find one?

[Hound Dog Mom]

Hi EHubbman –

I would try to discourage him from drinking lake water – although not highly likely it is possible for dogs to contract giardia or leptospirosis from doing this. Has he been tested for Giardia (giardia can cause yellowish diarrhea) and is he on a quality multi-strain probiotic and digestive enzyme supplement? If not, I would have him tested for giardia (you have to specifically ask for this test, it won’t show up on a regular fecal and make sure your vet sends the sample to a lab – much more accurate than in-house testing) and get him on digestive supplements. You may also want to give an herbal digestive supplement (such as The Honest Kitchen’s Perfect Form) a try – some people have had a lot of success with herbal digestive supplements.

Orange tinged stool can be a sign of small intestine bacterial overgrowth (SIBO) – meaning the intestinal flora is off balance. This is common secondary condition with dogs who have endocrine pancreatic insufficiency (EPI). I would definitely discuss this with your veterinarian.

The Zignature Trout & Salmon formula is appropriate for large breed puppies and would be worth a shot if you want to try Zignaure – I believe the formulas are all fairly similar except for different proteins sources.

Raw would be a great option – especially for a sensitive dog. If this is something you’re willing and able to do that’s wonderful. It will be necessary to do a lot of research prior to embarking on a raw feeding regimen, however. I would recommend checking out dogaware(dot)com and picking up a copy of Steve Brown’s book “Unlocking the Canine Ancestral Diet.” You can also check out the recommended raw menus thread in the raw food forum – I have many of my crew’s menus posted.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 4 months ago by Hound Dog Mom.