Best Puppy Foods

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Puppies Peering Over BannerBy popular demand, the Dog Food Advisor has now created lists of its best puppy foods. For quick access to these reports, click one of the following links…

How to Find the Best Puppy Foods

Choosing the best puppy food for your new baby dog can be a daunting task. After all, today there are thousands of commercial dog foods on the market.

So, where do you start?

When searching for puppy food, the best place to start is simply knowing what an ideal dog food might look like. And what a puppy needs for proper growth.

It’s no secret, we tend to favor puppy foods that are…

  1. Higher in meat-based protein
  2. Higher in natural fats and oils
  3. Lower in carbohydrates
  4. Formulated from a named (non-generic) animal source
  5. Free of animal or vegetable by-products
  6. Free of artificial flavoring, coloring or preservatives
  7. Complete in all essential vitamins and minerals
  8. Not excessive in calcium for large breed puppies1

Doesn’t Higher Protein Content Cause
Hip and Joint Problems?

No, but overfeeding does.

Contrary to popular belief, hip dysplasia and skeletal diseases in dogs are not related to dietary protein2. They’re much more likely the result of genetics3, excessive dietary calcium4 or overfeeding during growth5.

Studies have clearly demonstrated the greatest risk of developing skeletal problems later in life is directly linked to overfeeding — allowing a puppy to eat all day on demand (free feeding).

To greatly decrease the risk of your dog suffering the ill effects of serious growth problems, avoid leaving your puppy’s food in the bowl all day long.

Serve measured amounts… on a regular schedule.

The Challenge of Proper Nutrient Content

Unfortunately, when feeding puppies, you need to pay attention to protein minimums and fiber maximums. And fat content, too.

Too little (or too much) calcium can cause bone problems. And the same for phosphorus and magnesium, too.

Getting everything right can seem frustrating.

But there’s an easier way.

How to Be Sure a Puppy Food
Is Complete and Balanced

To ensure a puppy food is nutritionally complete and balanced, the Association of American Feed Control Officials has established a special nutrient profile optimized for growing dogs.

This AAFCO profile details no less than 37 nutrients that must be present in a puppy food including…

  • 10 amino acids
  • 12 minerals
  • 11 vitamins

To save you tons of time scrutinizing every pet food label, simply look for the AAFCO nutritional adequacy statement on every package of dog food.

This simple statement assures buyers a product meets nutritional requirements for growing puppies…

  • Growth
  • All life stages
  • Growth and maintenance

Look on the label for a statement like…

Product formulated to meet the nutritional levels established by the AAFCO dog food nutrient profiles for growth

Is It Safe to Feed
Adult Dog Food to a Puppy?

Puppy foods contain more of certain nutrients… and less of others.

For this reason, and even though it’s safe to feed your adult dog a puppy food…

Never feed any puppy a food designed for adult maintenance only. Adult foods can be deficient in certain puppy nutrients.

How We Selected the Foods

If you’re looking for an above-average puppy food, we’ve prepared four different lists for you to consider.

Suggested products must meet two requirements. They must be rated at least either four stars or five stars by the Advisor.

And they must meet AAFCO nutritional profiles for either growth or all life stages or they must be recommended for puppies by the manufacturer.

Best Puppy Foods

Footnotes

  1. Some puppy foods on this list may be too high in calcium to meet the special needs of large or giant breeds. We are currently planning to publish a separate list dedicated to large breed puppies ↩
  2. M Straus, Commercial dog foods, DogAware.com ↩
  3. A Hedhammar, Canine hip dysplasia as influenced by genetic and environmental factors, EJCAP, Oct 2007, 17:2 (pp 141-143) ↩
  4. Richardson, Skeletal diseases of the growing dog: Nutritional influences and the role of diet, Canine Hip Dysplasia: A Symposium Held at Western Veterinary Conference, 1995 ↩
  5. RD Kealy et al, Effects of limited food consumption on the incidence of hip dysplasia in growing dogs, JAVMA, Sep 1992, 201:6 (pp 857-863) ↩
← Older Comments
  • LawofRaw

    Yeah I believe they still do have the Maximal formula available. I just checked the old Aussie website I used to buy it from here, http://www.petsonthepark.com.au/categories/Dog-Products/Dog-Food/Artemis-Holistic-Dog-Food/ and it still shows as available. Also the Artemis Aussie website shows it here http://www.artemispetfood.com.au/products/maximal/. I’m not sure about Artemis US, but you’re right about them flogging the Osopure line which is tragically in line with the higher carb filling cost saving trend that they and other competitors are leaning towards….e.g. Canidae.

    The sad thing about the Maximal formula, is that Artemis’s marketing of it, for some reason is so lack luster, that I now realise why it was hard at times to get a longer dated bag. They just weren’t selling fast enough. Now they’re marketing their poorer line of formulas more vigorously, because I’m guessing, where they are saving money on the higher carb, lower protein kibble production, they are spending it on better marketing.

  • Pattyvaughn

    Micah was showing signs of grain intolerance at 8 weeks when I brought him home. Most vets that I have dealt with would have labeled that as an allergy.

  • InkedMarie

    Aimee: I believe I disagree with you. My Boone got his first of many many recurrent ear infections at age 16 weeks. After switching foods, I finally had someone tell me to keep him away chicken, corn, wheat, soy, rice and flax. I found a food that didn’t have that stuff and no more ear infections.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Does Artemis make Maximal anymore? It’s been a few years since I’ve fed kibble but back when I did I used that formula a few times in my rotation and liked it. A month or so ago I noticed that Artemis had launched some new formulas and re-vamped their website and I no longer see the Maximal formula listed on their website. They have some new grain-free formulas but they’re pretty pathetic (low 20′s for protein – loaded with garbanzo beans, peas and potatoes). It’d be a shame if they discontinued it, it was their best food and one of the better dry foods being made.

  • aimee

    Hi Abby,

    It would be very unusual for such a young dog to have allergies. Additionally, when food allergy reactions were ranked by type, corn was pretty low on the list.

    My last pup went through a very itchy phase. Her vet was most concerned that parasites could be a cause. In the end we think it was related to her adult coat coming in. It resolved on its own and she has never itched since.

  • LawofRaw

    I’m a raw feeder, feeding as close as I can to the “prey model” diet for my 2 dogs, so my dogs don’t have any allergy issues of any kind or any health issues of any kind for that matter. However, if you want to stick with kibble, I can recommend one brand that I did witness for myself, changing the health of my JRT in her the condition of her coat, stool, and skin, with less belly redness etc, that I transitioned from Pedigree and Purina a few years back.. It was Artemis Maximal kibble. A high protein kibble for a dry food, and with out any corn or grains whatsoever. Basically, if you look for any 5 star food that is grain free, and available in your area, you could start off with, and see how that works for your dog. Anyway, good luck. I’m off to bed.

  • Abby

    I have a 10 week old schnoodle that was placed on Hills by the vet. She seems to be scratching now. I am reading more about allergies and se that Hills first ingredient is corn. Can anyone recommend a kibble that worked for them in this situation. I understand she may have allergies to other things but I thought I would start with food first.

  • InkedMarie

    How long til she comes home, do you have time to research?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1140685339 Betsy Greer

    The day we picked out Sam, he was two days shy of eight weeks old. We waited the two days and then went back to pick him up. Our breeder would not have released him even two days prior to being a full eight weeks old ~ which I was totally fine with. In hindsight, I could actually see the benefit of waiting until 10 or more weeks. Sam had a lot to learn about mouthing that his mom and siblings might have set him straight on before he came home if he had more time with them.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Anne –

    I don’t mean to be rude, but 6 1/2 weeks is way too soon to send a pup home. A responsible breeder would never send a pup younger than 8 weeks home – I personally would never purchase a pup from a breeder allowing it to be taken away from its mom and siblings prior to 8 weeks old, that would be a huge red flag to me. While everyone is excited to get their adorable little pups home as soon as possible and I’m sure breeders are excited to get the pups out the door as soon as possible, this time period is a critical one in the socialization process and it’s necessary that pups experience this stage of their life with their mom and siblings.

    With that said, it’s going to be critical to feed a food with appropriate calcium levels and to keep your pup lean while growing as excess calcium (>3.5 g. per 1,000 kcal.) and excess calories (overfeeding) has been shown to contribute to the development of orthopedic disease (hip dysplasia, elbow dysplasia, etc.) in growing large breed puppies. Controlling nutritional factors is especially important for large breed pups coming from a questionable genetic background (responsible breeders will have obtained hip/elbow clearances on the parents through OFA or PennHIP prior to breeding and thus greatly reduce the odds that a pup from the litter will experience developmental orthopedic disease). So feed your pup a food with 3.5 g. calcium per 1,000 kcal. or less and feed the amount that keeps it lean. I can’t tell you exactly how much to feed because it varies greatly from dog to dog based on breed, size, activity level, stress level, etc.

    Here’s a link to the large breed puppy forum, there are links to some informative articles and a list of appropriate foods:

    http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/forums/topic/large-and-giant-breed-puppy-nutrition/

  • http://www.facebook.com/kalecee Anne Ramsay

    I have a new puppy coming home (6 1/2 weeks old) and I want to know how to determine how much food to give at each feeding, she is a female german shepherd, can you give me any advice please?

  • Shawna

    Hi AlexJ,

    I completely agree with you about the importance of healthy foods!! However, I disagree with the website on a few ingredients.

    1. Fruit juice — fruits are great in moderation but fruit juice provides all the sugar without any fiber. And the sugar in fruit, fructose, is processed by the liver. Too much fructose can cause liver issues.

    2. Potatoes — do provide a source of simple sugar but dogs don’t NEED carbs for glucose needs. They can derive all the glucose they need from the amino acids in protein if they are fed enough protein. I do feel vegetables are important for antioxidants, vitamins etc but I think there are better much options than potato.

    3. Grains — dogs do not need grains. Grains cause more harm than good especially in a diet that has not been checked for nutritional adequacy. Grains have anti-nutrients that bind to minerals like zinc, magnesium and calcium. If feeding grains you need to make sure to add additional minerals to the diet to compensate what is chelated by the phytates.

    Grians also have enzyme inhibitors which prevent the enzymes like trypsin from digesting foods eaten.

    4. Vegetable oil — in the states most vegetable oils are of poor quality. Most are highly processed and hydrogenated making them damaging to health not healthful. Heathier organic, extra virgin coconut oil is easy to find and much better.

    5. Omega 6 — Quality sources of fish, not farm raised, are actually not a good source of omega 6 fatty acids. Chicken fat is a much better source. Grass finished beef has an ideal ratio of omega 6 to 3 but doesn’t have enough to supply the overall needs so fish and dark meat chicken should be added to the diet. Hemp seed oil, pumpkin seed oil and a few others are also good sources of linoleic acid — the good omega 6.

  • AlexJ

    People don’t know how important healthy food are. I have 12 years old Golden Terrier and I always prepare him homemade food. Do you know dogs can live 27 years! I think the best thing you can do for your dog is to give them healthy food. you can find healthy homemade food recipes here please don’t give them commercial food.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi cisco –

    Don’t worry about maximizing his growth and getting him as big as possible. A dog is going to get as big as they’re genetically programmed to get regardless of if they reach that size in 6 months or 12 months – you can’t change your dog’s genes. You should focus on slow and sustained growth, this will help to decrease the risk of orthopedic growth abnormalities. Nutro Natural Choice is a 3.5 star food – so if you want to upgrade check out the 4 and 5 star foods. Pick out a food that says it’s approved for “growth” or “all life stages.” If you can afford to feed entirely raw, dehydrated or canned – this is much better than dry dog food. If not, try to occasionally “top” your pup’s kibble with a quality canned, dehydrated or raw food. Some other cheap, but healthy “toppers” are eggs, tinned sardines, plain yogurt, cottage cheese and left over lean meat. Topping kibble with canned, raw or fresh food with increase the species-appropriateness by increasing the moisture levels and protein levels.

  • cisco

    want* food*

  • cisco

    i have a 6 month old chow chow and wont to upgrade his food to maximize his growth. I want him to as big and strong as possible :) . I have been feeding Nutro natural choice. What puppy should i get for him? and any other advice is welcome.
    thanks

  • InkedMarie

    Hi Kim, I’m very sorry for the loss of your boy but wanted to say congrats on the upcoming dog!

  • Rene@WWW

    Thanks for the advice! We did get our pup from a highly regarded and reputable breeder with all the health clearances. Our puppy is tall and lean, so weight doesn’t seem to be the issue. Maybe we have been too active with him at a young age. Hopefully with rest and dietary changes this will be something that he will grow out of.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Afterthought: In addition to switching him to an appropriate food and limiting high impact activity, I’d supplement with a natural anti-inflammatory: turmeric, tart cherry, boswellia, yucca and bromelian are great. Adding extra omega 3′s (fish oil) can have anti-inflammatory benefits as well.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Rene@WWW –

    Orijen is a wonderful food, but unfortunately none of Orijen’s formulas are appropriate for large breed puppies. Excess calcium intake (>3.5 g. per 1,000 kcal.) has been linked to increased incidence of developmental orthopedic disease in large breed puppies. All of Orijen’s formulas (including their large breed puppy formula) are too high in calcium. Some veterinarians and breeders recommend feeding an adult food to slow growth in large breed puppies – this is very poor advice. Foods formulated for adult maintenance can be lacking in vital nutrients necessary for growing puppies and are often much too low in protein and fat. I would recommend picking a 4 or 5 star foods the meets the AAFCO nutrient standards for “growth” or “all life stages” that has 3.5 g. calcium per 1,000 kcal. or less. It’s also important to carefully control your puppy’s portions to maintain optimum body condition (don’t overfeed!) and to limit high impact activities (i.e. running, jumping) until the puppy is 18 months old. While limiting high impact activity, keeping the puppy lean and controlling calcium intake can help to prevent orthopedic disease, the most important factor is genetics. I hope you purchased your puppy from a responsible breeder who had OFA or Penn Hip clearances on the parents. Here is a link to the large breed puppy nutrition forum, here you’ll find links to articles written by veterinarians and nutritionists and a list of 4 and 5 star grain-free foods appropriate for large breed puppies: http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/forums/topic/large-and-giant-breed-puppy-nutrition/

  • Rene@WWW

    We have a 6month old lab who is growing like a weed! Fed Iams for Lg. breed puppies by breeder, than we started adding Orjens for puppies. He seems to be having problems with running and jumping at times, esp. After periods of high activity. X-rays are clear for his hips and knees. Vet suggested a food change to adult. Any ideas out there?

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Kim –

    You can continue to feed NV Instinct, it’s a wonderful food. All of the NV Instinct foods meet the AAFCO nutrient profiles for all life stages meaning they’re appropriate for puppies and adults. If you’re expecting your pup to be over 60 lbs. when full grown I’d stick to the LID Turkey and the Rabbit varieties only until he’s 6 months old – these two formulas are the only NV Instinct formulas with appropriate calcium levels for large breed puppies during their rapid growth phase. If you don’t think he’ll be over 60 lbs. feel free to rotate between any of the formulas.

  • Kimber

    Hi all,

    I just had to put my 16 year old Golden/Chow mix to sleep on Friday. He was my baby, and I miss him terribly. His best friend and companion, Roxie, is so out of sorts, and really needs a playmate.

    I am adopting an 12 week old collie/terrier mix in two weeks. It’s been quite a while since I had to buy food for a puppy! I would love some suggestions. I currently feed my dogs Nature’s Variety LID, which they love.

    Thanks for the advice

    Kim

  • http://www.thegreedypinstripes.com/ BryanV21

    Unless there are any sort of health issues going on with the dog, then I’d simply look through the 5 star foods here and find out what food is available in your area and fits your budget.

    If you have any questions about particular foods then let us know, and we’d be happy to help.

    BTW, congrats on the new pup.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Dogs ‘R Awesome –

    Congrats on the new pup! :)

    I’d suggest picking out a 4 or 5 star food that is approved for “all life stages” or “growth.” Rotating foods every so often is great too – it’s good to have at least two or three different “go to” brands, but the more the better. If you can afford to feed raw, canned or dehydrated foods they are much healthier than dry food. If you can’t afford a diet of entirely raw, canned or dehydrated you can “dress up” dry food by topping with a high quality canned, raw or dehydrated food or healthy “leftovers” (lean meat, eggs, plain yogurt, tinned sardines, etc.).

  • Dogs ‘R Awesome

    Hi, I might be getting a terrier mix from the shelter, and I was wondering what to feed him. He is small and has long legs. He’s 8 months old and I was wondering what food to feed him. Thanks in advance!

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  • InkedMarie

    I had no idea! If the canine friskies is as good as the feline Friskies, I wouldn’t buy it

  • Hound Dog Mom

    In Europe Purina sells Friskies dog food.

  • InkedMarie

    Friskies…..isn’t that a cat food?

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Andre –

    Friskies and Purina One are both very low quality foods.

    Here is the review for Purina One:

    http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food-reviews/purina-one-smartblend/

    Here is a review of Friskies:

    http://www.dogfoodanalysis.com/dog_food_reviews/showproduct.php/product/77

    I would pick out one of the 4 or 5 star foods on this site. I’m assuming you’re from Europe and unfortunately I’m not sure which formulas are available there. So you’ll just have to pick some out and figure out which brands you can and can’t get.

  • Andre

    Hi, a week ago I adopted a 2 month old dobermann and i could use some advice about what type of food i shoud feed him .
    I heard they sometimes have high blood pressure so I should avoid to much salt in his food.
    As I can’t afford 70 € per month on food, I’ve been feeding him Friskies; however (as I’ve been told) it’s a poor quality food. I’m thinking about changing to Purina One.
    I would apreciate some feedback on these brands and if possible some suggestions on good ‘quallity for price’ puppy dog food.

    Thanks. :)

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  • http://www.facebook.com/lily.eggink Lily Eggink

    Okay, thanks for your reply.

  • http://www.facebook.com/lily.eggink Lily Eggink

    In case you didn’t see my original post.. it was over a month ago.  You are the first to comment on it… AFTER I was sarcastic about the help….   Thanks  (and I agree labs are awesome, just had my first litter, 10 pups!!!!   :) Yeah!)

  • http://www.dfwpugs.com/ sandy

    I’m not sure how often this site gets updated but it is for big dogs. Maybe you can cross check it with the foods listed in the forum for large breed puppies.

    http://bigdogshugepaws.com/nutrition#listrec

  • Bob K

     JussyPhillip – Agree with Hound Dog Mom.  Get the right food for the right dog.  A Great Dane Puppy should not be eating regular food that a small adult dog would eat.  Puppies have different nutritional needs than adult dogs and small breed puppies have different needs than large breed puppies, they are rarely interchangeable.  In an emergency, I would feed the dane puppy if I had the food for free and nothing else to feed my dane but for the price of Royal Canin there are many excellent 4 and 5 star rated large breed puppy foods available.  Remember to transition slowly to a new dog food, take the dog to puppy school and lots of exercise.

  • Storm’s Mom

    Hi Lilyeggink – I found a website for Q Holistic dog food, but when I went there, all of the links (and most of the images) on the site were broken. Therefore, without a website list of the ingredients, guaranteed analysis, etc it’s impossible for anyone – including Mike, the Dog Food Advisor – to rate this food.

  • LabsRawesome

    Lily Eggink, Glad to see that you could stop by the site, and be so helpful…NOT!!!! Oh yeah and it’s Dog Food Advisor, not Advisory.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    JussyPhillip –

    Head over to the forum section. Under the “Diet and Health Issues” topic there’s a sticky thread on large and giant breed puppy nutrition. There are several articles posted and also a list of recommended foods. You need to watch calcium levels for giant breed puppies. I’m not sure what the calcium level is on the Royal Canin small breed dog food, but I can tell you I wouldn’t recommend Royal Canin even if the calcium levels were appropriate. Check out Dr. Mike’s review on Royal Canin – it’s a pretty low quality food and it’s expensive – with the money you’d spend on Royal Canin you could feed your dog a much better quality food.

  • http://www.facebook.com/lily.eggink Lily Eggink

    Glad to see that these comments are read and replied to by the Dog Food Advisory….  NOT!!!!

  • JussyPhillip

    Is it safe too feed a giant breed puppy(Great Dane) A small breed dog food? Royal  Canin, I was told I could, but I’m not sure if it will affect her?

  • Lilyeggink

    Q Holistic from Ruffin’s Pet store is a high quality dog food.  Compares with 4 and 5 star dog foods.  But I don’t see it on your lists anywhere?!

  • Storm’s Mom

    It’s a *decent* food, but it’s not on either the 4- or 5-star lists that are linked to from this page (links above) ..it’s a 3 star food, which, for me, isn’t good enough, I wouldn’t touch it. So I personally would take those 4- and 5- star lists to your local store, see what’s there, in your budget, etc and go from there, maybe pick up a few, each with different proteins (ie, one chicken one, one fish one, one lamb one, etc)  I’m a big fan of grain-free and potato-free foods, personally. Hope this helps!

  • Bucsfan1985

    We just bought 2 beagles, one is 6 mo old and the other is 3 mo old. The breeder said he fed them Diamond puppy. I had bought dog food prior to picking them up. I bought Nutro Natural Choice Puppy. Is this a good food?

  • Jake

    Thanks so much…I have some pumpkin so will try that and I do think we need to change foods. He has been tested for coccidia, giardia. Just can’t say how much response is appreciated!

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Jake –

    I’d recommend adding a probiotic/enzyme supplement and a spoonful a plain canned pumpkin to the food and see if that helps clear things up. If you haven’t already you may also want to bring a stool sample to the vet to test for coccidia and worms. If this doesn’t work and the stool sample is clear try a different food. A lot of people are having issues with Blue Buffalo: http://www.consumeraffairs.com/pets/blue_buffalo.html

  • Jake

    Help!!! 13 week old pup has been eating Blue Buffalo Wilderness and has had really loose stools. Nothing wrong, has been to the vet, all tests negative. Just wonder whether he is getting enough fiber. Healthy otherwise, bright eyed, shiny coat. Thanks!!!!!!

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  • InkedMarie

    Aren’t 2 week old pups still feeding off the mother?

  • Evnair

    My pom puppy is 2 weeks old.When shall I start giving additional food.

  • doggonefedup

    Hi Shawna,
    I kinda figured that, because that is the other place where I heard it also. There was another individual that was inquiring. They just didn’t want to hear it from me or Sandy……….go figure!

  • Shawna

    Hi doggone ~~ It was from Dr. Becker that I originally got the information on 14 known.  However this was info from a few years back.  I’m quite certain in that time frame additional strains have been identified as populating the canine digestive tract..  For that reason I will use the following, slightly different, wording in any future posts :) .  “There are at least 14 known strains”..

    I can not prove Dr Becker as my source for two reasons

    1.  The original article on probiotics has been updated with different wording.  Those of us familair with the site (and the page) know this because there was a very blatant misprint that has been corrected etc.

    2.  The forum has been closed and previous posts (including those by Dr. Becker) are no longer viewable.

    For any interested, this is my favorite source of info on probiotics and soil based organisms.  http://www.edwardsdrugs.com/PDF/…/Dysbiosis%20and%20Probiotics.pdf

    I was having trouble with a run time error and couldn’t pull up the page.  If the link doesn’t work google “dysbiosis and probiotics”.

  • doggonefedup

    Labs,
    I understand…. :>

  • LabsRawesome

     …….HERPES………

  • LabsRawesome

     OMG! HERE WE GO AGAIN.

  • doggonefedup

    no problem dug, I was trying to be helpful by offering a solution. I understand…..

  • dugitup – dog food guide

    Thank you

    It was Shawna who said:

    “the 14 strains known to populate the canine digestive tract”  

    I just wanted to know if Shawna had any documentation that there are 14 known strains of probiotics or whatever she was referring to in the digestive tract of a canine.

    Thank you everyone for your answers but this is a question that only Shawna can answer so please give her a chance.

    Don’t worry, if Shawna chooses not to answer I won’t ask again.

  • dugitup – dog food guide

    doggone

    I am asking Shawna because she is the one who said:

    “the 14 strains known to populate the canine digestive tract” 

    Only Shawna can clarify what Shawna said.

  • doggonefedup

    Dugitup,
     You are welcome. I believe if you go back to that link and click contact us Dr. Becker would be happy to answer your question since she is the authority. I would be curious to know the answer also. 

  • http://www.dfwpugs.com/ sandy

    There are 14 strains in the mercola product.  It has the usual strains found in most products (even human ones) BUT also contains some that are canine specific for a total of 14, not 14 dog-only strains.

  • dugitup – dog food guide

    Thank you doggone. I clicked on your link and I watched the video.

    Shawna said: 

    “RX only has 4 of the 14 strains known to populate the canine digestive tract.”
    (and)
    “It is hard to tell from the bottles alone but Mercola’s product is a superior product (with all 14 stains)”
      
    I just realized in the second quote Shawna said “stains” not strains.

    Nowhere in the video or on the page you linked to or on the label of the product does it say that the 14 strains are “the 14 strains KNOWN TO POPULATE the canine digestive tract.”

    I am trying to clarify if there are only 14 known stains of probiotics in the canine digestive tract as Shawna states or if the mercola product simply contains “14 beneficial bacterial strains” as mercola states on the page you linked to.

    Thank you

  • doggonefedup

    Dugitup,
    Why not just go to:
     http://probiotics.mercola.com/probiotics-for-pets.html
    Where Dr Becker talks about “Total Probiotics formula benefits your pet with 14 beneficial bacterial strains.”  If you have any questions after that just ask her since she is the authority on the subject.

  • dugitup – dog food guide

     Shawna
    Can you provide us with the studies that determined there were 14 strains of probiotics known to populate the canine digestive tract?

    Thank you

  • http://www.dfwpugs.com/ sandy

    I have the Green Bulldog shampoo as well.  Haven’t used it yet.

    Purified water, organic aloe vera, coconut based surfactants, glycerin, allantoin, panthenol, organic essential oils of neem/citronella/tea tree/eucalyptus/peppermint, organic extracts of: sage, arnica, lavender, chamomile, calendula, alfalfa, thyme, milk thistle and mint; some vits, organic sunflower seed oil/flaxseed oil/borage oil, sodium benzoate (preservative), potassium sorbate (preservative)

  • doggonefedup

    Shawna,
    I usually get the
    Complete Probiotics For Pets 3-Pack from Mercola. The boys get it added to their food a couple times per month. I referenced the RX Biotics only because it was sitting in front of me at the time. One of my vets had given me a partial container to try. I’ve never used a HCL supplement since I always wt the kibble in advance.

  • Shawna

    Hey doggone ~~ I completely missed this post…

    I took a look at RX Biotic and in my opinion, there are better products on the market.  RX only has 4 of the 14 strains known to populate the canine digestive tract.

    It is hard to tell from the bottles alone but Mercola’s product is a superior product (with all 14 stains) and appears to be cheaper as well.  RX has 35.45 grams and is approx $24.00 per bottle.  Mercola’s is a couple bucks more and is 90 grams.

    The other product I like (marketed for human use but I give it to my toy breed dogs) is Garden of Life Primal Defense.  It includes soil based organisms.

    One thing to watch with kibbles — those that are cooked at higher temperatures are potentially carcinogenic due to the heterocyclic amines created by the high heat cooking of meats.  Starches create carcinogenic by-products when cooked at high temperatures too.  However, not all kibbles are cooked at temps that are most likely to create these carcinogens… :)

    It does take longer to digest kibble (which seems as it would be more taxing on the system) but I do agree that healthy dogs are completely capable of fully digesting kibbles…  Older dogs and dogs with digestive issues may need an HCL supplement on top of the enzymes and probiotics.

  • ain

    do u have any other dog? 

  • exis08@rocketmail.com

     PLEASE!!!!!!!!! DONATE ME A DOG I LIKE ROTTWEILER DOG SO MUCH!!!!! I BEG U MY LYF HARPERQUINNBESTFRIEND

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  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi HarperQuinnsbestfriend:

    I understand how money can be tight while in college, but luckily there are some quality foods available for reasonable prices. Check out Whole Earth Farms, Harmony Farms, Pro Pac, Eagle Pac, Nutro Max, NutriSource, Nature’s Recipe, and HealthWise. All of these foods are a much better option than puppy chow and most can be found online on sites like wag.com, doggiefood.com, and petflow.com (all sites offer free shipping on orders over $50 I believe).

  • melissa

    There are many great foods out there for puppies- Take the time and look through the comments, write down a list of the best ones, and then price them out for your area(things vary widely) What works for one, may not work for another, but I would switch her from the puppy chow.

  • HarperQuinnsbestfriend

    Hi!
    I adopted a golden retriever puppy a few weeks ago and I’m looking for a good quality puppy food to switch her over to. She came with a bag of purina puppy chow but from what I’ve read I need to abandon that as soon as possible. Money is a small issue since I’m a college kid but I just want what is best for her.  She turns 11 weeks today and she is full of energy. She will be an inside dog with daily walks and right now we are fighting a flaky skin issue on her back. Recomendations and advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

  • BryanV21

    First of all, just a bit of advice, turn off all-caps. A lot of people take it as somebody yelling at them.

    I’m not sure about the calcium content of each of these, as some of them are high, and therefore aren’t ideal for large breed puppies. But Orijen and Fromm Gold are two of the more popular puppy foods I sell.

  • Fernando

    I HAVE A GREAT DANE AND I GIVE MY DOG SCIENCE DIET FOR PUPPY, BUT I DONT KNOW IF IT’S THE RIGHT KIND OF FOOD IT SHOULD IT!!
    MY DOG’S 2 MONTHS OLD

  • http://www.dfwpugs.com/ sandy

    That means one bottle should last each pug 1 year!!  Ha-Ha!!  No really – they rarely get a bath!!  I was thinking about trying out a dry shampoo.  Not sure. I did get the Mercola one but have yet to bath anyone.

  • Pugsonraw

    Hi Sandy,

    I got some of the Mercola Shampoo & and conditioner this week and tested it out yesterday.  It smelled great but took alot of shampoo to work up a lather. I swear I used about half the bottle to wash two pugs!

    I usually don’t use a conditioner for pugs, and they were staring at me like what are you doing to us. 

    The shampoo reminds me of Dr Bronners castille soap as their hair was super squeeky after using it. 

    I think I will stick with Malaseb shampoo…  

  • SanDnMila

    yeah I called them immediately when I noticed the error but because it was on a saturday before closing hours I was unable to go back there for the refund for the item that I didn’t purchase in the first place. So I stayed in contact with them through email and had the item delivered anyway since I paid for it and was disappointed that the Best Buy date was old on it, and they shipped it out again after I had contacted them. I’m glad that they were able to straighten it out.

  • doggonefedup

    Hey Shawna,
     I just got back from taking mother-in-law to doctors visit. I personally use the KFC (kibble-fresh-canned) method.  The kibble completely digests and gives the boys something to crunch down on. They need that…the crunching….that is. what is lost in the kibble is recovered with the canned and fresh. All three are completely digested.
     I here what you are saying about “beneficial-bugs” in dehydrated & not in kibble from high temp processing but porcine enzymes and “Rx Biotic” for example are easily added to kibble and no worries about re-hydrating or digesting.    

  • Alexandra

    Kibble.

  • Rjss1119

    I am getting alittle confused.. would the blue buffalo be considered kibble, dehydrated or freeze dried….

  • InkedMarie

    you must be up here too, in new england! I ordered from them a couple times, had no issues. They didn’t have the jolly balls I wanted but shipped them as soon as they arrived. Did you call and speak to Tony? I think that’s his name, the owner?

  • Shawna

    Three of my eight dogs can not properly digest the carrots in the Grandma Lucy’s products..  Quite evident without going to the extremes your uncle went to :) ..  The other five seem to have no problem.  I actually take the chunks of meat in the foods that have meat and cut them up into shreads — so one dog doesn’t get chunks of protein while the others get much less.

    Theres just soooooo many disadvantages to kibble that I just couldn’t in good faith recommend it to a dehydrated or freeze dried food (when not too high in fat).

  • Shawna

    I do know what you mean about certain ingredients in some of the products not reconstituting as well as they should.  But, I still would take it over kibble any day…Pending the nutrient analysis is to my liking :)

  • Shawna

    Hi doggonefedup ~~ I can’t say for GSD’s cause I’ve never been responsible for feeding one (we had three when I was a child though —- AWESOME dogs).

    However, I would NEVER recommend kibble or feed kibble myself (including to my kidney disease dog) over freeze dried. 

    It may not reconstitute correctly but the moisture is still there and if the enzymes in the food work properly (as they would still be living and active once eaten) the food would be broken down and utilized.

    Freeze dried also retains more nutrients then any other source of food (other then raw).  Synthetic nutrients are not required.

    The thing I dislike about most freeze dried foods is that they are too high in fat.

  • Rjss1119

    Thank you all so much for taking the time to respond with great info.  I am going to research before a make a final decision. Most of you seem to mix wet and dry.. Do I need to do that?  We are always on the go and I plan to have Yella with us as much as possible.. Dry food is so portable. Last night I soften her kibble with warm water and she ate it so much better.. Could it be a teething issue as well?

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Yeah, I agree with the freeze-dried thing. Freeze-dried doesn’t rehydrate well. I’ll occasionally buy the little nuggets as treats, but I’d never feed it as a meal.

    p.s. Good looking dogs.

  • doggonefedup

    I had an uncle that would do things to the extreme. He got me involved with German Shepherd dogs. He went as far as taking a fresh stool sample placing it into a linen baby diaper and flushed water over it until there were just some solid granules left in the cloth. It appeared to be bits of meat and vegetable. That only happened when freeze dried or dehydrated food was part of the diet. I had no idea what he was trying to do but I did see the results. Does that prove anything? probably not but it did leave an impression.

  • Alexandra

    Ok, that makes sense to me. Thanks!

    I usually do one meal Brothers and the other raw. And some meaty bones 2-3 times a week. My crew is thriving.

  • doggonefedup

    HDM,
     I stand corrected. I use freeze dried and dehydrated interchangeably, but I know they are completely different processes.

  • doggonefedup

    I tried Grandma Lucy’s Artisan, basically instant mashed potato with some other stuff mixed in. even if you simmer it in hot water the meat and veggies just don’t come close to what they were in their original state. the potatoes will “reconstitute” enough to look and taste just like any other instant mashed potato flakes sold for human consumption but they will never be as good as fresh made mashed potatoes.   I just found some old photos. the resolution may not be that good but here goes. The first photo facing the camera  is the Strongheart raised dog, from the mid 60′s. he is about ten years old in the picture.  The dog in the right side photo is two or three years old from the late 70′s he was raised on a mix of kibble and canned Abady’s dog food.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    I agree with the moisture thing, I think all foods need moisture. THK isn’t freeze-dried though, it’s dehydrated. I’ve tried several dehydrated foods (THK, NRG, Sojos, and Addiction) and never had a problem with any rehydrating. When the correct amount of water is added and it’s left to sit for 15 – 20 minutes all the types I’ve used have been canned food consistency.

  • melissa

    doggonefedup-

    I am not sure what you mean by “reconstitutes properly?” I feed the Grandma Lucy’s as a topper to kibble from time to time, and I have never had a problem with it(the pureformance line) I use 1 1/2 cups hot tap water to 1 cup of dry, and within 5-10 mins(I let it soak a bit longer than some people)it seems to be fully reconstituted. I do stir it a few times to be sure there are no dry spots though…

  • doggonefedup

    Alexandra,
     One word…MOISTURE…!
    I’ve tried Honest Kitchen, So-Jo’s, DNA, and Grandma Lucy’s and not one of them reconstitutes properly. I let one of those sit on water on my kitchen counter for three days and it never properly reconstituted, I won’t say which one.  In my opinion with past experience freeze dried just loses something and the GSD’s system seems to be very sensitive to that. Actually I think any of the bloat prone breeds may have the same sensitivity. Kibble is okay because it is never really dry, at least not like freeze dried. Even kibble needs to be wetted and should always be accompanied by either fresh or canned, in my opinion. I have seen a GSD do better on Strongheart canned food than ANY dry food, and I’ve been feeding GSD’s for over fifty years. I think personal experience trumps all the scientific studies. How many different “scientific studies” have been done on hip dysplasia and with how many different results? yeah those studies provide a good starting point but it still doesn’t beat experience.

  • Alexandra

    Hi Doggonefedup,,

    I am curious, in your post, why no freeze dried foods? I have never offered them to mine, I feed a mix of Brothers and raw. But what make the freeze dried foods bad for GSDs?

  • Denise

     I had a 14 year old Lab/Shepherd that ate Orijen.  I was very pleased with the food.  When she was diagnosed with cancer and I knew I wouldn’t have her too much longer I switched her to Acana (made by the same company as Orijen) Wild Prairie so I could use it for a new dog.  I have a 14 week old Lab who is thriving on this.  The Acana is listed as a 5 Star dry dog food and it’s for all life stages.  So I can give it to my new puppy.  She loves it but I’ve never had a picky dog (or cat) eater. So thankful since I have friends who have very picky pets.  I’m very happy with Acana and Orijen foods.  Clover eats it like she’s never had a meal before!  She didn’t eat the Science Diet she had at the shelter that fast!  I switched her slowly from the 5 lb bag I got from the shelter since she was experiencing lots of changes from the shelter to my house.

  • doggonefedup

    Rjss1119,
    I have been around GSD’s since 1959 and started training in the early 1970′s. I agree with Alexandra. If she does have a clean bill of health you should be able to easily feel her ribs but you should not be able to see them. The last thing you want to do with a GSD puppy is empty the garbage can into her food dish if you want her to live more than 6 or 7 years. Forget any freeze dried foods, that may be okay for other dogs but not German Shepherds!  Always use canned foods with your kibble, unless you decide to use a raw diet. If you do go raw (barf) make sure it is not loaded down with raw vegetable matter. GSD puppies can not process raw veggies. Go to the Abady’s dog food website and read what they have to say about dog and puppy nutrition. That is your first best place to start to figure out what changes you need to make to your dogs diet. Merrick puppy plate kibble mixed with puppy plate canned is an excellent combination for developing puppies. You want a food that is 2.5% calcium, 1.5% phosphorus, 37% protein, and 22% fat.  Let her eat until her belly is full but not blown up like a balloon. After a while she will start to regulate the amount of food she eats on her own.  Good Luck with whatever you choose to do.  

  • Jess

    I have been raising GSD’s since 1977 and the best combination I ever fed was Orijen L.B.P mixed with a little canned Innova L.B.P. I also used Horizon Legacy. Calcium #’s are little high but Tony, Grizzy and Briz all grew exactly like they should have. Soooo much better than feeding Blue or honest. They aren’t even in the same league. Feeding a product that is manufactured in house is almost as important as the ingredient list. Blue is outsourced to CJ foods and honest refuses to say who makes their junk.

  • Alexandra

    Hi Rjss1119

    As a fellow GSD owner I would first ask, are you seeing ribs? Is she in a growth spurt? How much are you feeding? Has she had blood drawn to see if there is under lying factors? Such as IgA deficiency? Pancreatic issues? GSD’s are prone to these problems. How is her stool? Negative for worms? Giardia?
    Feeding her everything under the sun will not only pack on the pounds to fast, but can also affect her growth rate, possibly increasing chances for hip displasia.

    I would look some of these things first.
    I kept my Dante lean while he was growing, keeping the growth controlled.

  • Rjss1119

    I have a 4 month old white GSD. Since her first meal she has been eating blue buffalo puppy.  Just got back from the vet and she said she is toooo skinny (29 lbs).  I was told to start feeding her everything including people food mixed with her food.  I think with our 4 kids crumbs she has just gotten a little more picky.  Not sure if I should switch to another dog food, add people food or add wet to the dry???  Help!!

  • doggonefedup

    Gio,
     You can find some good advice on dog food and proper nutrition for GSD’s on the Abady’s dog food website at
    http://therobertabadydogfoodcoltd.com/index.html
     I’m not saying to use Abady’s dog food but it is a good reference and starting point for deciding what foods will be best for your GSD. With truth in advertising laws imposed by the federal government they can not make false claims. I personally used their foods for over 20 years when I was actively training and working my GSD’s  with excellent results.   

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Gio,

    Congrats! I love white shepherds. :)

    Any of the four or five star puppies foods on this site would be a great choice, but since she’s going to be a big girl look for one with 1.3% calcium or less (high levels of calcium can lead to the development of hip dysplasia in large breed puppies). It really will depend a lot on your budget and what foods are available to you. I started my last bloodhound pup on the Honest Kitchen’s Love, which is rated 5 stars and has 1.1% calcium. Some other foods to look at would be: Innova Large Breed Puppy (4 stars, 0.9% ca.), Petcurean Now Puppy (4 stars, 1.2% calcium), The Honest Kitchen’s Thrive (4 stars, 1.3% calcium), Acana Wild Prairie (5 stars, 1.3% calcium), Holistic Select Large Breed Puppy (1.1% calcium), Wellness Large Breed Puppy (4 stars, 1% calcium). There are other too, these are just some suggestions. :)

  • Gio

    Hi i am getting a white German shepherd and i want to now what type of food i should feed her. By the way she is 8 weeks old. So please give me some advice. Thank you for your time :)

  • SanDnMila

    She can always smell it when I mix the warm water with the dehydrated food, the few minutes it takes to rehydrate are like torture to her. lol I’ll try that though, thanks melissa :) I think with the warm weather and her teething just didn’t mix well with the warm water in her belly.

  • melissa

    SanDnMila-

    You could mix it up earlier and let it cool down if he warm water bothers her. I mix it up in advance when I use it as a topper to simplify feeding the herd, lol, and I know the GL says its good for up to 48hrs after reconstituted as long as its in the fridge.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Yeah it can be warm or cold or frozen into ice cube trays for the summer. I use it to make broth for my dogs on their fasting days.

  • SanDnMila

    Great tips, thanks! I think I will stick to the Answers, they added it to their order when I told them they were out so hopefully they should have it friday when I go, it’s also the only place around that I get Tripett, not sure if they have Ice Pups there I’ll see if they can order it, I have read about it before and I like it that you can serve it warm and cold. The broth might bother her stomach if served warm?

  • Hound Dog Mom

    SanDnMila,

    You can usually buy goat’s milk at the store – I know even my Walmart sells it. It’d be fine to use when the Answer’s is out of stock. I would stick to Answers when it’s available though because it’s unpasteurized and contains probiotics. Low sodium or homemade no-salt-added broth could be an option too – the Honest Kitchen makes a powdered broth that can be added to water called Ice Pups.

  • SanDnMila

    Yesterday Mila threw up her lunch, kibble with warm water. :(
    And seems to be that the warm water is what did it because it’s happened before when she’s had dehydrated meals (THK Love, Grandma Lucy’s Pureformance). I’ve added Additional Answers goat milk before to her kibble instead of the warm water and she loved it and it didn’t bother her, but the store that I get it from out of town was out of stock the last time I went there. I can do that with the kibble but what do I do about the dehyrated food instead of using warm water? I’m starting to give it to her only a little as toppers which seems to help a little. The weather was warm yesterday so I’m sure that just upset her stomach even more.

  • LabsRawesome

    If people have a question, their are a bunch of people willing to offer advice. There is no reason to get all rude and demand that people stop posting because their not doing it “your” way. I swear some people think the world revolves around them. lol. If the posts don’t pertain to you don’t read them. Plain & simple. But if you have a question, go ahead and ask, you’ll get a bunch of help.  :)

  • Toxed2loss

    Hi SanDnMila,
    I enjoy reading the other posts for the same reason! ;-)

  • Toxed2loss

    Eve’sHumanMom,

    That’s o.k. :-) We both got to express our view points, and isn’t that nice in a world that seems to be rushing past so fast that nobody listens to each other anymore?

    Here’s a little more to think about: If we could ONLY share our experiences with a particular dog food, I’d have made about 3 posts and never been back i.e. “my dog did (or did not do) well on this food.” Same with the other very knowledgable, helpful posters that are regulars here. ALL the dogs that we’ve collectively helped, wouldn’t be. That would be a tragedy.

    Which brings me back to DJN’s question, “What are (we) serving?” I should have answered him, “We are serving up help and hope to every person who asks for it, and to countless individuals that quietly read along.” Food for thought. :-)

  • SanDnMila

    Mila started losing her baby teeth yesterday while playing at the dog park. My baby’s growing up so fast :)

  • SanDnMila

    I enjoy reading the conversations even when I’m not a part of it, I’ve learned a lot especially from you. I don’t know why so many have a problem with that. Your dog may not have hip dysplasia or any other ailments, but maybe someone you know does, why not be more educated about it so you can help someone. It seems some people are on this site just to be difficult without really enjoying what the site is all about. smh

  • Eve’sHumanMom

    Dear Toxed,

    Yeah, that’s why I don’t know.

  • Aimee

     You’re welcome! 

  • Toxed2loss

    Hi Eve’sHumanMom,
    I see what you and DJN are trying to say. He’s not the first to make that kind of comment. In fact I’ve heard it several times in the last 6 months. My comment was to give the other side. The fact is that Dr. Mike condones our discussions. The site isn’t just for testimonials about how dogs did on one food or another. That information is available, if they just scroll back through the thread comments. It’s also a fact that the community serves more than one narrow audience. Should the rest of us be banned because we enjoy a deeper, more serious discussion? I don’t think so, neither does Dr. Mike, the site owner. The bottom line is that we ALL can’t assume that the site is here for our narrow needs and only ours. Just like every other community, when anyone enters here, they will find conversations in progress.

    It would be rude if someone entered a real room and demanded that everyone stop talking about what they were discussing and only talk about what the new person wanted. In this online community, they can follow the conversations at the top of the thread, read the articles to find their answer, scroll down to earlier posts, skipping the current and to them, boring/confusing conversation, or post a direct inquiry, that will be answered fairly quickly. Thats a lot of options.

    I do think it’s rude when someone comes on and post something that basically says, “Hey! I want to know this, you should all be talking about This so that when I show up, this one time, my answer is right here waiting for me and I don’t have to try very hard to find it.” Without even reading Dr. Mike’s posting policy and site info… Thats not saying that’s what you or DJN said, but its been the gist of some of the comments. Can you see my point?

  • Jennifer

    Thanks Aimee – I appreciate the recommendations and the advice :)

  • Eve’sHumanMom

    Hi.  It’s just that I’ve seen similar situations over the past two months or so that I’ve been visiting DFA.  Y’all have to admit it can be a bit off-putting, even intimidating to come here wondering about Poochi’s food, and stumble across an animated, even intense and sometimes technical debate.  Your average visitor here probably doesn’t even have the gumption to say, as DJN did,  ”Hey…um what’s going on?” much less post their question.  They just give up.  Nor is your normal visitor a one track minded nerd like me, who finds it interesting and informative and is unphased by it (unlike the recent trial of the new Disqus :-) .)  Not sure what the best solution is, but just saying coming across some of the discussions here can make the casual visitor give pause.

  • Johnandchristo
  • Toxed2loss

    Not what, who. :-)

  • DJN

     What are you “serving?”

  • Toxed2loss

    Hi DJN,
    You did miss the note, and Dr. Mike’s statement, that says the site is about dogfood reviews, and all things dog. We’re asked to keep it about dogs and be polite and civil in our discussions. Dr. Mike let’s us operate like a group of friends who share a passion: Healthy dogs. He graciously allows us plenty of latitude, and we do digress to off topic subjects, like any group of friends would.

    Many of us who are regular posters volunteer our time and knowledge. We hang out, or check in here, waiting for someone to come along that we can be of service to. In the meantime we’ve become a community of friends. It’s unrealistic and somewhat selfish for occasional posters to get offended because we have our discussions while we’re waiting to serve…

    If you have a question, ask. Lots of people will be all over it.
    ;-)

  • DJN

    Um, isn’t this a DOG FOOD website? Or did I miss the note that said we were going to discuss/argue about genetics, diseases, and food science? I agree with the dude who said this isn’t the place to discuss hip dysplasia. You’re all WAY too serious and everyone is trying to show the other how much they know. Hound Dog, you have WAY too much time on your hands, unless you do this for a living, in which case you are certainly good at your job.

  • Concerned2

     Just because you are breeding 2 dogs free of HD does not mean you are preventing it from happening.  It is a farce that you need to feed your dog puppy food.  There are many feeds out there that are suitable for all life stages.  The amount of calcium in an adult food formulated for all life stages is sufficient to feed a growing puppy.  It is always suggested to feed a quality kibble formulated for all life stages to larger breed dogs who are more susceptible to genetic HD.  One would have to look outside the box to produce a dog free of HD as far as “genetics” are concerned.  You may have 3 generations clear of HD however, if you are not carefully researching the pedigree further back in generations you may miss an HD dog.  HD can skip several generations.  HD is also 50% owner error.  Affectionately referred to as killing them with kindness.  For the first year of puppy’s  life you must maintain a healthy body weight and not allow your dog to put excessive weight on their joints.  Exercise is important but you must keep it low impact.  Do not introduce sporting/competition dogs to hurdles, jumping, climbing etc until he or she has had time to develop. Do not allow your dog to free feed or gain unnecessary weight in order aid in the prevention of HD.   Swimming is an excellent low impact exercise as well as walking. 

    Breeders should be giving new puppy owners instructions specific to helping prevent HD.  Because OFA does not have a data base for prelims and as far as I know, pennhip has not yet created a data base, you may ask your breeder for proof of the findings.  If anyone wanting to research their dogs pedigree, you can inquire through the club they are registered for further generations.  There are also several registry data bases available online to reserach several generations.  Ask your breeder if they are using a data base. On the OFA website you can search for official OFA by entering the registered name of the dog and/or registration number.  Pennhip I have found to be a more reliable source of determining the presence (or lack of) HD. 

  • Toxed2loss

    Kaliberknl,
    I also must respectfully disagree with your statement, “This is not the appropriate place to discuss HD.”

    I’m learning a lot from this discussion. I’m glad that you are all posting. I appreciate the informed contributions, and the different viewpoints. :-)

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Melissa, I have experience with this also and this is why I’m so adamant about emphasizing the importance of both getting a pup from a responsible breeder and maximizing genetic potential through environmental factors. My 7 year old male bloodhound has grade 1 CHD. His sire tested good on his OFFA, his dam tested excellent and both his grand-sire and grand-dams and great-grand-sire and great-grand-dams passed OFFA exams. I got the x-ray because my insurance company covers orthopedic conditions as long as they are not pre-existing. He has no symptoms whatsoever of CHD and 7 is old for a bloodhound (life expectancy is 8 – 10 years). He goes for long walks, runs, and plays and is never in any pain and his gait appears normal. Most people in my shoes would not have had a dog like him x-rayed and would never have known his hips were anything less than perfect. So unless all offspring produced are x-rayed and evaluated, a breeder cannot rightfully make the claim that they have eliminated this condition because the reality is most pups that are sold to non-show/non-breeding homes will never be x-rayed and unless they show severe symptoms there would be no way of knowing they do indeed have CHD. The orthopedic specialist that evaluated him told me he believes that the rates of CHD are greatly understated due to the reason that most dogs without show potential will never be x-rayed.

  • melissa

     Hound Dog Mom-

    You are correct saying that many cases of HD do not express themselves via symptoms. My husband and I adopted a severely dysplasic dog-his only symptom was a slight hop and fail to fully extend his rear legs in stride. He had been in a shelter, contracted Canine influenza, spent a week-10 days in an intensive care unit, and then came to another rescue. They boarded the dog with us for his recovery. Within a week I noticed the rear end, and at his recheck(chest xrays) mentioned it to my vet who did xrays. His left hip joint is not there, and his right is very minimal. The rescue opted to euthanise as “noone would adopt a dog in his condition”. We however felt that since he was so sweet, he deserved a chance, and we stepped up. Through diet and excercise, he remains active and does not require pain meds to this point. : )

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Thank you melissa, that is the point I was trying to make. No one is responsible and I never claimed anyone was, however it is the job of the breeder AND the owner to take every measure possible to minimize the risk.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Actually the CHD discussion is appropriate because it stemmed from a question someone had about a food appropriate for their large breed puppy. Also, I don’t doubt that you are a responsible breeder and breed healthy dogs and I never denied that responsible breeding can decrease the odds. However, it it clearly stated in black in white on the OFFA website (among several others) that responsible breeding does nothing more than decrease the odds, not eliminate. In addition,I wholeheartedly agree that the use of vertical pedigrees are much more accurate than horizontal pedigrees alone, however unless every pup  produced by a sire and dam are x-rayed after the age of 24 months and the x-rays are reviewed by the OFFA their is no way of making the claim that all pups produced by a sire and dam are CHD free – as many cases of CHD never manifest themselves in physical symptoms.

  • melissa

    Kaliber-

    With all due respect, since the topic of HD was brought up here, this is the place to discuss the conversation. While owners should not be made to feel as if they are SOLELY responsible for HD, breeders should not either. Its perfectly possible to breed two excellent dogs and end up with a pup with HD, even if “borderline”  The disease is polygenic and its impossible to predict the outcome, but one can do everything in their power to help minimize the risk-both owner and breeder.

  • Kaliberknl

     This is not the appropriate place to discuss HD.  I think we can all agree to encourage people to buy puppies from responsible breeders and to encourage folks who have not gotten puppies with healthy genes to offer the best environmental opportunities to their puppies.  However, your interpretation is mistaken on several fronts.  Diet alone will neither cause nor prevent HD.  Poor diet will merely exacerbate signs in dogs with susceptible genotypes. Parental phenotype means nothing without both vertical and horizontal pedigree evaluation as is explained on the OFA web page. I graduated from both  Penn State and the University of Pennsylvania and have great respect for both institutions.  However, Penn State has nothing to do with Penn Hip and OFA is the gold standard, not Penn Hip.  Using it, I’ve had six generations of dysplasia free dogs.  My dogs have never been fed any specific diet or given any exercise restrictions beyond common sense.  This is a matter of public record and you can look for the data in the pedigree of my boy Kaliber’s Dream in Color at the OFA web page if so inclined.  Folks dealing with this crippling disease ought not to be made to feel as though they are responsible for their own dogs’ suffering and my heart goes to to them.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Interesting.

    This article from Cornell University states that puppies of breeds predisposed to hip dysplasia have up to a 25% chance of being dysplastic even if the parents had good conformation (much higher than the estimates on the OFFA website) and that environmental factors affect the time of appearance and rate of progression of hip dysplasia. 

    (http://bakerinstitute.vet.cornell.edu/animalhealth/page.php?id=1104)

    The information on Penn State’s PennHIP page states:
    Hip dysplasia is a disease of complex inheritance, that
    is it is caused by many genes. Veterinarians and dog breeders have
    attempted to eliminate CHD through selective breeding strategies.
    However, the reduction of CHD frequency in pure-breed dogs has been
    disappointing…The development of CHD is affected by environmental factors.”(http://research.vet.upenn.edu/pennhip/HipDysplasia/Introduction/tabid/3337/Default.aspx)

  • LA

    When we start to wean bulldog puppies – we put them on a large breed food – it just works best for them and helps to reduce Panosteitis.

  • aimee

    Jennifer, If you read the comments section on Mike’s article on hip dysplasia I’ve posted confirmed Ca levels from a number of diets. I hope to add to the list.

    http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/canine-nutrition/hip-dysplasia-dogs/

    I would not feed a food from a manufacture that won’t tell me the actual Ca level in the diet as I read manufactures often only list min. so they appear to be appropriate.

    Innove LB lists Ca as max and actual as .9% and Innova puppy actual analysis is 1.07%. Innova prime (5 star) Salmon and Herring has 1.49% Ca but it is higher in fat which on an energy basis comes in close to the desired 3.5 grams Ca/1000 kcals.

    When looking for food if the company posts a nutrient analysis that should be on average what the food contains

    You often do need to call the companies to ask actual Ca amounts in their diets when they only list min… but they may not tell you in which case I wouldn’t feed the food.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Kaliberknl,

    This would be false. Nothing can “eliminate HD.” Good breeding programs can do nothing more than decrease the likelihood.

    This is quoted directly from the OFA website:

    “Mating dogs of ideal conformation can be expected to result in a larger number of offspring with ideal conformation compared to offspring of a mating where one or both parents have less than ideal conformation. However, both litters will present a range of conformational characteristics.”
    *Notice they clearly state greater number with ideal conformation, not all.

    “Polygenic traits are influenced by environmental factors which may minimuize or maximize genetic potential.”
    *In other words environmental factors (such as calcium intake) will help to ensure a puppy from parents with perfect conformation will be have perfect conformation also.

    They then clearly state: that following their breeding selection criteria will “REDUCE the frequency of undesirable traits.”
    *Big difference between the words reduce and eliminate.

    They even include a chart “Progeny Results of Matings Between Parents with Known Hip Scores”

    Excellent X Excellent = 3.6% of offspring dysplastic
    Good X Good = 5.8% of offspring dysplastic
    Fair X Fair = 9.4% of offspring dysplastic.

    http://www.offa.org/pdf/monograph_2012_web.pdf

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Jess, the articles I posted aren’t my personal experiences. The articles I posted are based on scientific studies ad/or written by veterinarians and I have a hard time believing “you experiences are unsurpassed” in comparison to those of Dr. Mike (who obviously realized the importance of proper calcium intake for large breed puppies) and all the vets who have written about it. Also I can assure you I do have experience raising large breed puppies, I’ve owned large breeds my whole life. Bloodhounds, a GSD, Labs, and a Chesapeake. I’m not “trying to prove you wrong” I’m putting the facts out there so individuals coming to this site looking for an appropriate food for their large breed puppy will know what to look for and prevent their dog from potentially suffering from this painful and debilitating condition.

  • Kaliberknl

     Agreed…OFA has the statistical numbers to show responsible breeding can eliminate HD.

  • Jess

    I am soooo done here…..

  • Jess

    Do you want to argue about this or what???? To disagree with people and act like you “know more” they do, seems to be what you are all about. MY EXPERIENCES WITH THIS IS UNSURPASSED. It is obvious to me, that you have never dealt with it…..and that you just like to down play the knowledge that others have gained by their PERSONAL EXPERIENCES….

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Jess,

    You are correct in that Hip Dysplasia is hereditary. Dogs that come from parents who had OFA or PENN hip health clearances are much less likely to develop this condition. However, genetics are only part of the equation. Environmental factors are at play as well, including: 1) High calcium intake, 2) Growth rate (gaining weight too quickly, over feeding), 3) Over exercise as a puppy. It’s generally recommend that large breed puppies eat a food with 1.3% calcium or less to decrease their risk of developing hip dysplasia.

    http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/canine-nutrition/hip-dysplasia-dogs/

    http://siriusdog.com/dysplasia-hip-dog-chd-ofa-pennhip-2.htm

    http://www.soyouwanna.com/benefits-coral-calcium-dogs-8007.html

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1687006/

    http://www.vdrrottweilerbreeders.com/environmental_hip_dysplasia.html

  • Jess

    Sorry for ranting, but I have dealt with it numerous times, because I am the guy who takes those dogs that might have been put down because of the hips. It is way more important to make sure the large breeds get exercise, but yet not to over do it.

  • Jess

    Hip dysplasia is not caused by high calcium, can it hurt, YES, only because of growing to fast. The causes of hip dysplasia are considered heritable, it is inherited!! Plain and simple. You could be feeding zero calcium and a dog can still come down with it, if both parents had it. This is a real sore spot with me because all the so called internet vets seem to now everything about hip dysplasia, but have never ever dealt with it.
                    
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_dysplasia_%28canine%29

    It is also in human’s!!!!!

     http://www.hipdysplasia.org/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_dysplasia_%28human%29

    Why do you think that they give G.S.D’s numbers based on the hip’s??? They can actually detect hip problems very early. I have dealt with this issue for over 40 years and anyone with large breed dogs should read as much as they can on this subject and just not believe it is just caused by high calcium, because that is just down right false.

  • SanDnMila

    I’ve had to email some of the companies that don’t have the calcium % listed on their website and some “all life stages” can be really high, you can call or email they should be able to help you if you’re still undecided.

  • Jennifer

    Thanks to everyone for your comments, they are very helpful.  Hound Dog Mom, I have taken your advice and decided to focus on calcium content rather than protein – if there is someone out there who disagrees, I would love to hear what you think as I am trying to be as informed as possible.  Another thing I found was that dog food companies, for the most part, only list calcium minimums, not maximums.  That is unfortunate. Is it better to go with a known maximum?  I haven’t found a single food 1) has 5 stars and 2) Has an acceptable maximum calcium level.  Somehow, I keep coming back to Wellness – they list their maximums – and to compare them apples-to-apples, their minimums are the same as those who don’t list their maximums.  I don’t know if my chart will post correctly, but here is what I found in my search:

    Brand
    Calcium Minimum
    Calcium Maximum

    Innova LBP
    0.90%
    No Maximum Listed

    Innova Puppy
    1.07%
    No Maximum Listed

    Orijen LBP
    1.50%
    1.70%

    Orijen Puppy
    1.50%
    1.70%

    Blue Buffalo Life Protection LBP
    1.20%
    No Maximum Listed

    Blue Buffalo Puppy
    1.30%
    No Maximum Listed

    Wellness Super5Mix 
    Puppy
    1.30%
    No Maximum Listed

    Wellness Super5Mix LBP
    1.00%
    1.40%

    Wellness Core Puppy
    No Minimum Listed
    1.50%

    Nature’s Variety Prairie LBP
    0.90%
    1.60%

    Fromm Puppy Gold
    No Minimum Listed
    No Maximum Listed

    Fromm LBP Gold
    No Minimum Listed
    No Maximum Listed

    Organix Puppy
    1%
    No Maximum Listed

    Natural Ultramix Puppy
    1%
    No Maximum Listed

    PetCurean NOW LBP
    1.30%
    No Maximum Listed

    Earthborn Holistic Puppy/Meadow Feast
    1.20%
    No Maximum Listed

    Acana Wild Prairie
    1.30%
    No Maximum Listed

    Holistic Select LBP
    1.10%
    No Maximum Listed

    Honest Kitchen Love
    1.10%

    Also, even Honest Kitchen doesn’t have 5 stars – what’s up with that?

  • SanDnMila

    Just looking a little further down I was able to find this information :The Honest Kitchen’s Love (1.1% Ca.), Innova Large Breed Puppy (0.8% Ca.), Petcurean NOW Grain-Free Puppy Recipe (1.2% Ca.), Acana Wild Prarie (1.3% Ca.), Holistic Select Large & Giant Breed Puppy (1.1% Ca.), Earthborn Puppy Vantage and Meadow Feast are 1.2% calcium. I think feeding a “all life stages” or “growth maintenance” will be good as long as the calcium levels are low unless specified by the breeder. I hope this help, I’ve only been on this site the past 2 months and am not an expert but have picked a lot of advice along the way, you definitely came to the right place.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Jennifer,

    First of all, in my opinion, the main thing you need to worry about when picking a food for a large breed puppy is calcium content. Excessive calcium consumption by large breed puppies while they are growing contributes to the development of hip dysplasia and other orthopedic problems. I’m definitely all about high quality foods, but for the first year of a large breed puppy’s life I think the calcium level is even more important than the ingredients or protein level. I’d rather have to feed my dog a lower quality food for a year and prevent hip dysplasia than have a dog live out their life with orthopedic problems. With that said, the reason you are noticing that most high protein foods have excessive calcium levels is because most high protein foods utilize meat meal to boost protein content and meat meal is extremely high in calcium. It’s very difficult to get a protein level over 30% without utilizing meat meal. Generally I recommend looking for a food with 1.3% calcium or less (with 1% being ideal). Before switching to raw, I fed my last Bloodhound puppy The Honest Kitchen’s Love formula for her first 6 months – it’s a 5-star, dehydrated, grain-free food with 1.1% calcium with 31% protein. Petcurean makes a 4-star grain-free kibble with 1.2% calcium called NOW Grain-Free Puppy (go with regular not large breed, it actually has less calcium). Remember once your pup is full grown you can always switch to a higher protein food with more calcium. :)

  • Jess

    You’ll never find it… Don’t drive yourself crazy worrying about those numbers. Just get yourself a 5 or 4 star L.B Puppy food and feed that….

  • Jennifer

    Can someone help me with some questions?  I am learning that calcium is a significant factor for large breed puppy food.  I have read that ideally the calcium content should be under 1.2% for lbp food.  But there are a lot of lbp foods out there that have a higher calcium content than this.  Also, protein content seems to be important as well.  I can’t seem to find a food with a low calcium content (under 1.2%) and a high protein content (over 30%).  I have, however, found several foods that hover around 1.5% calcium.

    Are there any other considerations to choosing a large breed puppy food other than the calcium content?  For instance, is it better to choose a food that is not labeled as a lbp food but has a lower calcium content than a food that IS labeled for large breeds but has a *higher* calcium content?  I found that Wellness Large Breed Puppy has a calcium content between 1-1.4% and a protein content of 26% but Wellness Core Puppy has a calcium content between 1-1.5% (a mere .1% difference!) but a protein content of 36%.  Wellness Core would appear to me to be the better choice, but I am wondering if I am missing some other important piece.  Similarly, many of the lbp foods I’m looking at seem to have higher calcium ranges than the recommendation of 1.2% that I read about (here: http://www.newmanveterinary.com/large.html).  

    Can anyone help me sort this out?

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Kvance_wy,

    Don’t worry about asking questions, that’s what this site it for. :)

    1.) Yes, if calcium is slightly above the recommended 1.3% for large breed puppies meat can be added to lower the overall percentage (although even is meat is added I wouldn’t recommend going above 1.7%). This is due to the fact that meat contains high levels of phosphorus but only minimal levels of calcium. Calcium and phosphorus are linked and dogs need to consume these minerals in a ratio between 1:1 and 2:1 calcium to phosphorus. In other words, there can’t be less calcium then there is phosphorus but there also can’t be more the twice as much calcium as there is phosphorus. You can add fresh meat or a canned all meat food with no added calcium (such as Wysong’s Au Jus diets) – just don’t feed more that 20% in meat or canned all-meat foods or you risk throwing off the calcium to phosphorus ratio. Another option would be adding tripe, it is available in canned form from Tripett. The nice thing about tripe is it has a naturally balanced calcium to phosphorus ratio (1:1) but extremely low levels of both minerals so by adding tripe you would be able to lower the calcium percentage but at the same time not have to worry about throwing of the calcium to phosphorus ratio.

    2.) I don’t believe I mentioned anything about citric acid but there is some speculation that the presence of citric acid in dry food increases the odds of the dog bloating (gastric torsion).

    3.) If the kibble has everything that you want but is a little low on protein it’s definitely okay to add some fresh meat. Also, you will find that as a general rule most high protein kibbles are also high in calcium so you may need to go with a little lower protein to get a good calcium level.

    4.) A raw diet is based on raw meat, bones, and organs in an attempt to feed dogs a more biologically appropriate food. I feed my dogs a raw diet. The general meal plan is 80% muscle meat, 10% organ meat, and 10% bone. I then add 1/4 lightly steamed and pureed fruits & veggies, whole foods supplements (such as kelp, alfalfa, spirulina, and bee pollen), omega 3′s in the form of fish oil, and extras such as unpasteurized goat’s milk, eggs, and cottage cheese. I believe this is the most natural and healthiest way for a dog to eat.

    5.) Taurine is an amino acid. It is non-essential for dogs because they can synthesize it from other amino acids; it is essential for cats because they cannot synthesize it. Raw meats (especially heart and brains) are good sources of taurine, cooking destroys up to 50% of the taurine. Some dog foods add it as an extra assurance even though it’s generally not necessary, but it needs to be added to cat food. I believe that generally when manufacturers opt to add it to dog foods it’s added to lamb formulas because lamb doesn’t supply all the amino acids necessary for dogs to synthesize the taurine on their own.

  • Kvance_wy

    Hi Hound Dog Mom,
    Sorry to bother you again but I have a couple more ?s if you don’t mind. You told me before if calcium is a little too high I could just add wet food on top of the dry kibble to dilute the calcium but did you also say something about only if the dry doesnt contain citric acid because it would cause something? I can’t remember if that was you or someone else who told me. Or does it matter.
    If I find a kibble that has most of what I want but a little low on protein can I just give him some cooked meat or treats to add more protein to his diet?
    What exactly is a raw diet, raw meat or cooked?
    What is Taurine and is it important. I notice some kibble brands don’t include it in their data.
    Thank you again!

  • Kvance_wy

    I would like to thank all of you who responded to my ?s. All your info and suggestions really helped me alot and now I know more of what to look for to help my dogs’ health. This is a great site! Thank you again.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Kvance,

    23-25% is likely the AAFCO required minimum protein level for growth and development. What this means is that 23-25% protein is the bare minimum a puppy needs to not have health problems – not the ideal amount. My dogs eat a raw diet that averages between 45% and 55% protein depending on which meat I decide to feed them that and which extras I decide to add in. Ideally 49% of calories should come from protein, 44% of calories from fat, and only 6% of calories from carbohydrates. Unfortunately, this is difficult to find in a kibble as kibble is a bakery product and requires some form of starch (carbohydrate) to hold together. I would recommend looking for a food that contains AT LEAST 30% protein. As long as you’re feeding a kibble you don’t need to worry about feeding “too much protein” because even the top quality kibbles are lower in protein than what dogs are intended to eat.

  • Addie

    Wag.com is offering free two day shipping if your order is $49 or more. I know doggiefood.com has a map showing how long shipping takes to all the states, so if you use them, you have a definitive answer on how long it will take to arrive. If you’re on a budget, just go through the possible dog foods on the different sites, and check out prices, and see what works best for you. 

  • Kvance_wy

    Hi Jaclyn, Thanx for your info. How long does it take to order like that?  You know honestly I never really thought too much about the ingrediants and what they do, I knew not to buy real cheap but not that there really was a big difference until now that Ive been really searching. Now things make so much since  when our Boxer got real sick. When my mom was a vet tech they always recommended Exclusive, Eukanuba (sp?) and Science Diet but that was almost 20 yrs. ago.

  • jaclyn

    you should look into getting dog food delivered… a lot of websites will have discounts – like 15% off, etc, plus free shipping if you spend over a certain amount…  you’ll spend a lot more on vet bills if you feed him crappy food— skin issues, diarrhea, etc.

  • Kvance_wy

    Good Morning Hound Dog Mom,
    So I will probably have to order online but Im still not sure which food would be better then. Do you know what the protein % would be for a Rott puppy? My husband found a site where it said 23-25% then others said just make sure its not too high or too low. He’s raised Rotts but never paid attention to ingrediants and stuff. He just wants me to change the food before we run out of the Iams so we don’t have to buy another bag. He would just feed Ol’Roy if I wasn’t around.

  • Hound Dog Mom

    Hi Kvance_wy,

    Whole Earth Farms is a great quality bargain food however I believe I heard the calcium level is a little high (you could just call or email the company). Nature’s Variety is great (but high in calcium like most 5 star foods). Infinia is good ingredient-wise, however I doesn’t meet AAFCO standards for puppies only adult maintenance – it’s too low in protein. Check out wag.com, doggiefood.com, petflow.com or naturalk9supplies.com. They all offer free shipping on orders over a certain amount with no weight restrictions. I live in a small town also and my only option really is walmart so I have to order all my stuff online. The prices online are generally cheaper too, so when you get the free shipping it’s a good deal.

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