[Jessie P]

I just picked up a 50 count bottle of these from my farm and feed store. Theyve been selling Guardian for about 2 months now they told me.

This isnt my first experience with their products as I had been buying them from Amazon. I’m a huge proponent of nitenpyram and lufenuron, theyre super safe and have the lowest side effects of all flea medications available. I dont know about everyone else, but Im sick to death of paying $10 a month for each of my little guys.

One thing ive noticed on their packaging is that thy no longer claim to kill fleas or have any references to capstar or program. I guessed the company lawyered up before distributing retail.

Just wanted to give my strongest recommendation to Guardian products. For anyone wondering, their products are about $4-$5 higher at retail. Still not bad to be able to pick up a 50 count bottle of small nitenpyram for under $35. Their 57mg 50 count is about $45, thats less than 2 packs of capstar! they have a webstore but theyre no longer selling on Amazon. Its theguardianpets.com

[Marla N]

I live in the north Georgia mountains. I think I’m definitely going to look into that cedarcide. I’m trying to do what I can to get away from so many chemicals. However, I do have to say, in always having used chemical products, what has worked best on my dogs for flea/tick prevention, was the generic stuff that you can get just about anywhere that also sells frontline and advantix. I think I got mine at Walmart, sadly. It’s just the generic of the advantix. As far as for heartworm, I’ve always used triheart plus. My vet carried it, before I moved up here. It’s basically the generic of heartguard. The plus also prevents hook and round worms. You can buy it online. I think that I saw it on amazon and 1800petmeds.com. I’ve been using that since I got my dog two years ago. I now use it with four dogs. My mom, since we had our very first dog some 30 years ago, always used the heartguard until our vet started carrying the triheart plus. Hope this helps.

[anonymously]

I would be more worried about the dog surviving the heartworm treatment, that is a priority.
Otherwise I would go by your vet’s suggestion, maybe a high quality puppy food (canned and dry). I might add a tablespoon of chopped cooked chicken or chopped cooked chicken liver, add a little water to meals. I might feed 3-4 small meals per day instead of 2 regular ones. I would not add any supplements unless your vet advises so, just more junk for the liver to deal with. I would not give raw food to an old sick dog.
You don’t want rapid weight gain, too stressful, just a gradual increase.
Also, see what your vet advises regarding the flea allergy, frequent baths? Be careful about vaccinations and pesticides with a senior dog like this….
Walks/activity as tolerated, keep him moving.

[Mom T]

I was given a 10+ yr. old, very neglected, St. Bernard/Husky mix male dog for Christmas! He is so sweet and fits well in our family. After a couple of vet visits he is overall healthy with a few issues being heartworms, severe flea allergy and mild hip dysplasia. He also roughly half his weight at 65 lbs.

The more I read, the more I am confused on how to best put weight on him. The vet recommended puppy food. With his age I am concerned about pancreas issues feeding him a high fat diet. What would you recommend for…
Wet and dry foods?
Additives to food such as raw eggs, oils?
Vitamins…Pettabs?

Thanks for your help!

[Marie C]

I like DinoVite!! I’ve been using it for my terrier mix younger dog (she’s about 8 months old) for a couple of months. She smelled cheesy when I adopted her. She had flea allergy dermatitis and who knows what else but vet said not yeast. She was always itching and chewing her feet. Now she doesn’t smell cheesy and she never itches. I put my 4 year-old lab on it and my 14 year old chow-Shepard mix on it. All are tolerating it well. :0)

[Pitlove]

Hi Desiree- This happened to my pitbull after switching flea and tick meds (no swollen privates though, just the “ringworm” spots). Have any changes like that been made recently? The meds are almost out of his system now and its starting to heal. He could be reacting to something that has been recently introduced; new food, new bedding, new meds etc.

[Jenn H]

This is a very interesting and important topic. Having GSDs that I have at the farm and take to many outside places I’m always looking for something with the best results and least amount of chemicals and side effects.
Here in New England ticks are relentless and pretty much a threat year round. I have used Intercepter & Advantix for yrs with great results. When my girl gets fleas I use Capstar and spray Adam’s on everything. I even spray her with a horse fly spray that is also safe for dogs. She’s out in woods and water so much that it’s a constant fight to keep ticks off of her.
When Intercepter was temporarily discontinued I went back to Sentinal. No complaints.
Admittedly I haven’t been as vigilant using the preventatives since my girl ended up with Lyme anyway despite the randomly effective vaccine and all other preventions.
I have heard that ACV is a great, natural alternative. I just can’t stomach the smell so I haven’t tried it.
I’ll be following this thread closely as I’m always open to trying something new & improved with the least chance of harm to the animal.

[Dori]

LadyJane. Glad to hear all you are doing. I stop flea, tick and heart worm meds quite some time ago. I also no longer have them vaccinated. They are all on raw healthy diets and are all healthier than they ever were. Blood tests always come back great. My three are homebodies also. Their excursions to the outside world are on our own property and on occasion to the vet where I carry them in and out.

[LadyJane]

We stopped ALL flea medications years ago. Our dog started having seizures whether oral or liquid drops on her coat. The vets said it wasn’t worth the risk. She is an inside dog, however does go out on occasion. We clean and vacuum regularly, wash her bedding, get her groomed and it seems to be working for her.

[Bobby dog]

Hi Boo S:
My dog was in a similar situation a few years ago. He began licking his hind legs and tail area here and there. Then, it continued to get worse as time went on. He ended up losing fur, his skin was red and infected, he was itchy, licking incessantly, infested with fleas, and very smelly.

I recommend you visit your Vet for starters. With my Vet’s guidance and allot of diligence in regards to bathing, antibiotics for infection, and a food change my dog has a beautiful coat and healthy skin today.

Bathing therapy helped tremendously. It provided immediate relief; I used Nolvalsan cleanser throughout the healing process.

It took close to a year for a full recovery. He still gets itchy throughout the warmer seasons about once or twice a month. I believe it is probably something he gets into during his travels. I just bathe him as soon as I observe this behavior. Other than that he’s an easy keeper!

Here is a site I reference for skin issues. Check out their blog and library. I also signed up for their newsletters:
http://www.healthyskin4dogs.com/

[anonymously]

Dosing Information of Fluralaner for Dogs
Medication should never be administered without first consulting your veterinarian. The dose of Bravecto™ for preventative flea control is administration of the product every 12 weeks throughout the flea season and every 8 to 12 weeks through tick season. Bravecto™ should be administered with food to maximize effectiveness. Treatment can begin any time of year but should ideally begin 1 month prior to flea or tick season. The duration of administration depends on the condition being treated, response to the medication and the development of any adverse effects. The manufacturer suggests monthly treatments to protect against flea re-infestation. Be certain to complete the prescription unless specifically directed by your veterinarian. Read more at: https://tr.im/tPTdl

[Susan]

Hi Koa, It’s Spring in Australia & the fleas are here already, last year wasn’t as bad as this year….I’ve been doing research on the net & asking people what flea product they use & no one uses Bravecto it’s too strong, it last 3 months, A few people in Australia recommend NexGard made by Frontline ….NexGard was tested on dogs over 8 years & seems to have less side effect or no side effects, I suppose it all depends on your poor dog, if the diarrhea persist see vet or email Bravecto & ask for help….also make a complaint to Bravecto maybe they will change their ingredients & make a monthly chew that wont have as many side effects….

[Susan]

Hi, I found this link, “Why flea products are a bad idea” talks about all the poisons in flea products…..scroll down & there’s a 4 natural repellent recipes you can make yourself….
http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/why-flea-and-tick-products-are-a-bad-idea-and-4-natural-repellent-recipes/

[Keryn S]

I’ve used oral flea and tick treatments for years (when available) and have NEVER had a problem. On the farm we used Proban for 20 years until it was withdrawn from sale due to difficulties sourcing a key component of the preparation.

In that time we didn’t have fleas or ticks on the dogs. Yes it did cost us a bit to treat 4 dogs (one of which was 45kg) however this was small in comparison had we had to treat for scrub tick paralysis.

I was devastated when Proban was no longer available but did manage to keep the dogs flea and tick free from regular use of flea and tick collars. It is only the scrub ticks we are concerned able in Australia as the kangaroo, dog and cattle ticks are a nuisance but don’t have the severe consequences should a dog come in contact with them.

I am now using Bravecto and love it. It’s easy to give, doesn’t leave a smell or stickiness on their coat and the dogs tolerate it well.

[Gracee Sunshine Alexiss]

Wow thank you all so very much for all your imput. I will try my best to answer all your querries. I was not on the search for a puppy but my aunts female yorkie was in heat and the neighbors male found out before anyone else. Upon finding out she was pregnant they took her to regular vet visits and she gave birth with no complications to 2 females. So my family has been trading puppies for yearz and I was the only one who hadn’t been blessed yet so I was given first choice and I chose my Gracee. Anyway yes she was fed some not so good food for a Lil bit but that by no means makes her a poop pup maybe not from a reputable breeder but a good girl otherwise. Now I do have one terrible thing to confess… After acquiring her at 8 weeks I was eating some big fat green GRAPES and it was really hot that first day and I did it I gave her a grape and yes she ate some and licked some juice. To my absolute horror about a month later I had ran across an article that said grapes and raisins are extremely toxic and can cause almost immediate kidney failure. I felt so bad but figured the damage was already done and I never noticed any Wierd behavior or anything during that time. Course I wouldn’t know what to look for but being a lab tech I am taking her in this week to get her kidney functions and possibly her fasting lipids checked. Ok so yes she is on Revolution and she is due for her next dose how ever I’d like to get her on something that lasts a Lil longer. I heard tossing eucalyptus leaves and or twigs bark or branches into strategic places can eliminate most fleas is this true? And as far as I know her parents don’t have mange of any kind. she was treated for round, pin, whip, and one other kind and then I had to get a specific treatment for the tape ickees and got rid of them they seemed to be the worst and drove my baby nuts keeping her up all night… stupid things. I check her every night for re infestation but so far so good. And no bloating is apparent. I do think a fecal sample and skin scraping will also be done on our next visit. Even though worms may not be present there ovas may be which means new hatchlings. I apologize for not answering every question asked but wanted to keep this post a Lil shorter. I will reread the correspondences again and try to give the info asked for. Thank you all so much for caring about my baby. I’m so greatful to have found this forum. Oh wait so she is due for her 3rd and last vaccination so I should hold off on this last one to make sure it’s not related to her itchyness? I think her itchyness for the most part is from using human shampoo and water that was too warm and bathing her too much I started at 8 weeks and bathed her almost once a week I was told that was excessive and hind site usually being 20/20 I agree. I was also wondering if the 1rst 2nd and 3rd vaccines are the same and if not whats the difference? and is she gonna get her rabies this time? and is it possible for me to purchase the vaccine myself and give it to her myself? oh and I took her for a walk (in my arms) I forgot we have a couple flocks of wild turkeys that walk through the neighborhood and next door had homing pigeons that still stick around and nest we also have owls hawks turkey vultures skunks racoons possums and they all leave droppings is this an extra problem that she might need a different vaccine for possibly? the lepto vaccine? and next year she will be camping with us in the Stanislau National Forest where there are bears and deer. I might as well throw this in as well I have access to fresh venison pretty much the whole deer season is this good for my growing yorkie? if so how much and how often and how should I serve it to her? and can she eat the bones? horns? hoofs? is there anyother part of the animal that may or may not be good for her. thank you all so much for all your valuable information.
respectfully,
Michelle and Gracee (my sunshine)

[anonymously]

I didn’t mean to sound harsh. I looked it up and what you said about seizures makes sense.
I really don’t know much about oral flea/tick preventives and haven’t had any experience with them.
PS: Note to self: Think before you speak.

• This reply was modified 10 years, 1 month ago by anonymously.

[Mary H]

Never had a pet have a bad reaction except for one cat when I used a generic product. Just bathed him to remove the topical. He just lost some hair. All of my pets have used either Frontline or Advantage (dogs/cats) & have lived to be 11-16 years. Sorry for those that have lost pets. I know cancer have become an issue lately especially in goldens & I have 2 ( 1 & 13 yrs.) Studies are being done but will take some time for conclusion. I live in country & have fleas/ticks galore. Natural just doesn’t work for me.

[Pitlove]

My dog has been on NexGard his whole life and we recently just switched to Bravecto for certain reasons. Never had a reaction to any oral flea and tick med. Bravecto is also safe for dogs who have seizures, NexGard is not.

I am really really sorry for your loss

• This reply was modified 10 years, 1 month ago by Pitlove.

[anonymously]

I avoid the oral stuff, except for heartworm which I give every 6 weeks (not 4) in mosquito season only.
They are all pesticides, I use the least amount that I can to protect them. I have been using advantix II topical in the summer, but it depends on the dog, I have a small one that gets frequent baths, so I have gone back to alternating with preventic collars (amitraz).
I use deterrent “natural” sprays too…but I really don’t think they do much. They don’t kill the ticks/fleas.
I’d go all natural, but I lost a dog to Lyme and I don’t want to go through that again.

I don’t know when it got so complicated to own a dog. I’m leery of vaccines too. I decline them after puppy shots. But, there is still the rabies….

PS: I have never observed any adverse effects, but I have not used oral flea/tick preventives. One dog got a rash from the collar, so I can’t use it on him. He is elderly and doesn’t go far, so I just bathe him frequently.
I am sorry for your loss.

[Barbara M]

Merck’s vet (whom I spoke to the next day when I reported it) agreed it had to have been a reaction to Bravecto. My vet too, said although she hasn’t seen it in her practice, she felt it couldn’t be anything else but a reaction to the drug.
Some dogs do fine with it, thank God for that, but I’m hearing more and more that there are terrible reactions that HAVE been reported. Many confirmed deaths.
Fleas around here have built up an immunity to Frontline. If I ever get another dog, and this was and is so painful that I don’t know that I will, I would only go the natural route…even if it means bathing 2-3 times a week. I will never use a man made chemical again on a dog. The more I thought about it, it is meant to be a poison. The insert even says not to handle the pill, nor to breathe any of the scent of it in. How safe can that be for our beloved pups?
After the initial reaction, the next 7 weeks were filled (daily) with vomiting, diarrhea, excessive thirst, not eating, incontinence, disorientation, confusion, itching, sores. All this in a puppy who was so full of life, so healthy. There was never a health issue before dosing. I am beyond grief. I was just wondering if anyone on here has had similar experiences with any of the oral stuff.

[Susan]

Hi I’m so sorry for your loss, what did the vet say happened?? & did you contact the company so an autopsy could be done……
My cat got real ill from Revolution Spot-On, I rung Revolution straight away & they told me to take my cat to a vet ASAP & they paid the vet bill…..
When I rescued my boy the rescue lady gave me, 1 lead, his paper work, 1 worm tablet & 1 Comfortis tablet for fleas, but I never gave the Comfortis tablet to Patch after she told me she has had a few of the little rescue dogs nilly die after taking Comfortis, she said you need to know the proper weight, you must 1/2 the Comfortis tablet & give with a big proper meal after you give the 1/2 Comfortis tablet you must watch the cat or dog for 1 hour to see if they vomit & vomit back up the tablet, the company gives you another tablet if the dog or cat vomits up pill then after 1 hour & everything is OK, you give the other 1/2 Comfortis tablet 10-12 hours later with their dinner…but after she told me all that I thought gee I’m going to just use the normal Spot-On treatment, so I used Frontline spot-on then about 3 months later it didn’t really seem to be working, I had just applied 1 Frontline Spot-On & Patch still had fleas, so I had to wait 3 weeks the vet said I have to wait, then I bought the Advantage Spot-On, later thru the night 3am Patch vomited blood, his left side of face & ear were swollen by the time I realised what was happening & Patch was ill from the Advantage Spot On & rung the vet she said Patch has just past the 24hrs, so he’s over the worse of it now, then the vet explained that Frontline Spot-On only penetrates 2-3 layers of their skin, where the Advantage Spot On penetrates thru to their blood, so that’s why Patch was so ill……. now I just use the Frontline Spot-On only when needed in Spring & Summer & the Frontline spray on his legs & around lower tail & lower back, Frontline seems to work the best & Patch has no side effects, he’s very sensitive to medications etc..

[Barbara M]

I lost my dog 7 weeks after giving her an oral flea medication. The problems started immediately and just continued to get worse. She was a perfectly healthy 9 month old pup, and she passed away 1 week ago. I am devastated. Has anyone had similar problems?

[C4D]

Hi Michelle C,

Awe, poop pup! It sounds like you might have gotten her from a less than stellar breeder. Most breeders start puppies on puppy food, not adult and if it was Dog Chow, that’s very close to the bottom of the barrel. I’m not sure if she’s reacting to the food or not, but I would rule out a few other possibilites first.

Dogs generally get tapeworm by ingesting a flea, which carries the larvae, so she and her mother probably had fleas too. Once the flea is ingested, the tapeworm begins it’s lifecycle inside your dog. (This is ust a quick FYI on tapes, since I’ve dealt with them before).

She also may have gotten Demodex mange from her mother. It’s on all dogs, but puppies often get them from their mother and her symptoms sound like this could be the case. Your vet can do a skin scrape to determine if it is mange. I strongly suggest having this done. Here’s some info on mange:

https://www.aspca.org/pet-care/dog-care/mange

I’m curious as to why you’re looking for a weight control food for a puppy? You mentioned flea control, but has she been wormed and a stool sample taken to check for other worms? Several types of worms need multiple dosaages. If she has a bloated belly, it’s likely she may still have some worm issues.

• This reply was modified 10 years, 1 month ago by C4D.

[weezerweeks]

I forgot to mention that I use Dr. Beckers spray for fleas and ticks and I don’t have to use any chemicals,just Heartgard for heartworms.This is a Mercola product and it works great.

[Susan]

Hi Michelle, my vet told me, when a dog is itchy around the lower back & top of tail area it’s normally fleas, check that she doesn’t have that one flea, some dogs are allergic to the fleas salvia, one bite & they go nuts with scratching & scratching, like my boy does….
I bath him in Malasab Medicated shampoo, weekly when spring & Summer come the Malaseb relieves their itchy skin, kills any bacteria & leaves them feeling beautiful & soft then I use the Paws Nutriderm Replenishing conditioner…. its Oatmeal & Ceramides for dry itchy skin…
For fleas I use the Frontline spot on, then about 2 days later I use the frontline spray, my vet recommended the frontline spray she said she has found work the best if you don’t want to use tablets….Patch suffers with IBD & Skin Allergies & had a reaction to the Advantage spot on, spewing blood, side of face & ear swelled up, it was awful…..the Advantage goes thru to the blood where Frontline only penetrates a couple of layers of the skin, I just bought the small bottle of Frontline & you put on a glove & spray around the tail area, back legs & front legs, I have problems when walking thru the park & fleas will jump on my boys legs then he brings home 1 hitch hiker (Flea) & starts going nuts rubbing his lower back up & down the walls, rolling on the carpet…I have found the frontline spray to work really well…… http://www.frontlineplus.com.au/Howtouse/Pages/how-to-use.aspx

A few ladies at the dog park all use Comfortis tablets, I don’t use on Patch cause he has IBD & I don’t like giving him any pills but I was using the Comfortis on my cat & the cat stopped bring home the fleas, the ladies at the dog park swear by Comfortis they said they were giving the 1 monthly tablet for 3 months then they noticed they didn’t have to keep giving the monthly tablet & stopped over winter & Autumn months, the fleas stayed away, but you must know your dogs proper weight & only give 1/2 tablet with food breakfast at first & then watch your dog for 1 hour just incase they vomit the pill back up, then if your dogs is OK, then you give the other 1/2 tablet with their dinner…If your dog does vomit up the 1/2 tablet the vet told me to come back & Comfortis give you another tablet this was for my cat the first time I tried it on my cat didn’t vomit….

When Patch is trying to scratch around his tail & rubbing up & down the walls cause a flea as bitten him, if I have the time I bath him in his Malaseb shampoo so the fleas get off him, but if I haven’t the time to bath him then I use some Sudocrem to relieve his itch its for Nappy Rash, Dermatitis, Eczema, Sudocrem is excellent as a stop itch cream, even Aloe Vera cream is also good to quickly relieve the itch..

Antiseptic Healing Cream

Also once fleas bite your dog, your dog will get tapeworms again, tapeworms are from fleas… so I wait about 2 weeks then I give Patch an Allwormer, I have found Milbemax is a milder allwormer & doesn’t upset Patches stomach & bowel like the other allwormers do…..Once you control the fleas you’ll stop the itch & stop the tapeworms…

[anonymously]

I would talk to your vet about postponing any further vaccinations at this time.
http://www.thedogplace.org/VACCINES/Rabies-exemption-form-states-2012.asp
Note: The labels on rabies vaccines state that they are for “the vaccination of healthy cats, dogs…” There are medical conditions for which vaccination can jeopardize the life or well-being of an animal.

I would also reevaluate what you are using for flea/tick and heartworm prevention, for obvious reasons. When did the pruritus start?

I would keep her diet simple. No supplements or over the counter meds that have not been recommended by a veterinarian that has examined her.

If it was my dog, I would make an appointment with a dermatologist.
The best choice would be to see a board-certified veterinary dermatologist, if one is available near you (here is a list: http://www.acvd.org/).

Per the search engine here /forums/search/allergies/

[Gracee Sunshine Alexiss]

I got my baby yorkie Gracee at 8 weeks she was on purina super cheap adult dry dog food don’t even know how she chewed it. Changed gradually to Wellness trufood. She has received 2 sets of shots and due for the 3rd tomorrow. She’s on Revolution for flea conyrol, heartworm prevention. She had tapeworms but finally got rid of those completely nasty things eeeyyyukkk ! For the last 3 weeks she is so itchy I scratch her all the time around her hiney especially I check for fecal matter and sometimes there’s a bit so I remove it of course she also seems to be itchy around her armpit area where her hair seems to be kinda thining. But when we are training she is always stopping and tending to her rear area I always check where she is tending seems to be her little nub and the backs of her little legs. Please help me find some relief for my little darling I just love her so much and it breaks my heart to see her so uncomfortable. I did try to add some coconut oil but was unsure of the amount and frequency and I had concerns of her lipids going of the charts. Thank you for obliging my super long post. I tried to find some answers before my post by I have to go to work and I’m impatient I guess. Any and all suggest are welcomed. I would also appreciate a #1 food for complete nutrition and weight control. Thanks everyone for your valuable time.
Gracee ‘ s Momma

[Pitlove]

Hi- Firstly, thank you for rescuing her and I hope the fighting dog was rescued as well and rehabilitated and given a chance at a home as most are not.

Since Aurora is still a puppy and was probably not fed a proper diet if she was being used as a bait dog, its critical now that she recieve proper nutrition. She is a large breed and large breeds, especially GSD’s, are predisposed to orthopedic and growth disorders that are devastating for both the dog and the pet parent. I would highly recommend keeping her on a large breed puppy food that has controlled levels of calcium and phosphorus til she is at LEAST a year old, if not older. However, I did switch my large breed to an adult food at a year and he is fine. GSD’s by breed standard are on the thinner side, so make sure she is not underweight, but at an ideal weight for her breed and age. Extra weight from overfeeding also contributes to these growth disorders.

A lot of her issues could be brought on from stress, especially if feeding her a protein that I highly doubt she was exposed to didn’t help. Also, and this may seem obvious, but make sure you check her really good for fleas. GSD’s have thick double coats and with the conditions she was likely in as a bait dog, I doubt she was on a flea preventative. Fromm is an excellent food, so I think thats a great choice. Both of the Taste of the Wild puppy formulas are safe for large breed puppies so I’d go with High Prairie since you have already tried a fish based formula that did not work. Also cleaning her ears regularly with an ear wash and removing the gunk with a cotton ball or gauze will help reduce any ear infections or yeast in the ears.

My vet told me that licking the paws is usually associated with an environmental allergy, so its possible that something she is being exposed to now outside is affecting her.

[C4D]

Hi Bethany C,

Wonderful luck for your pup to find a caring owner like you!

The others have given you some very good information. I do foster very underweight dogs and dogs with various parasites as they come from very rural areas. The giardia or coccidia that Bobby dog could be a very real possibility. I’ve had foster dogs that tested negative the first time and it was found on a more thorough or subsequent testing.

The best way to see if the dog has an issue of parasites is to put it on a very simple boiled chicken or boiled hamburger (strain the grease) and plain white rice diet for a few days. This should get the tummy back on track as it is a very bland diet. You could add a spoon of pure pumpkin to the mix also. If you don’t see an improvement on the diarrhea within a few days on this diet, you should have the dog’s stool tested again for parasites, including hookworm, giardia and coccidia. I’ve found hese particular parasites seem to cause the most problems with weight loss and loose stools. Tapeworm is also a very real possibility that isn’t caught in a normal stool sample, almost a guarantee if the dog had fleas, but it doesn’t usually cause diarrhea. The tests are not very expensive. Unfortunately, if it’s a parasite issue, no amount of dog food, no matter what the quality, will help until the parasites are gone.

If the dog does well on the bland diet, you can slowly introduce a nutritious food. We all want our really thin dogs to gain some weight, but you have to do it slowly as their system isn’t used to being well fed. I find that by slowly increasing my foster’s portion, they will put the weight on, but it takes time. Too much food too fast just overwhelms their system and cause more diarrhea. Many rescues advise adding a bit of extra carbohydrates like rice, oatmeal and/or sweet potatoes, along with their regular dog food, to help increase weight. Canned food also can help, but again, it must be added slowly to prevent GI upset. Satin Balls are another rescue trick that might work, once you have the diarrhea under control.

Here’s a link to the recipe:

http://www.gpalouisville.org/Recipes.htm

Some other budget friendly dog foods are Pure Balance (Walmart, made by Ainsworth pet food company), Sportmix Wholesomes or ProPac Ultimates (Midwestern pet food company). These foods aren’t as cheap as Puppy Chow, but their are so much healthier. You feed less of these formulas, so they aren’t as expensive as they seem. C4C and BD are correct. Bad breath is a symptom of poor dental health or some other issue.

Good luck with your rescue and keep us posted!

[Pitlove]

Yes, Dawn will kill the fleas that exist on the dog, but so will any shampoo. It doesn’t have to be marketed to kill fleas. They will die from ingesting it. However, Red is right, Dawn does not actually do anything to repel them and over time using Dawn too much, will cause your dogs skin to dry out. This is knowledge I got while working as a bather at a grooming salon.

[Anonymous]

Dishwashing liquid kills fleas? What do you think? I don’t think so.
Bathing may reduce the numbers of fleas temporarily, but it provides no lasting protection, and dogs with flea allergies will continue to suffer if they are not protected from flea exposure.
If you have carpeting in your home, you may have to get it professionally treated (fumigation), fleas love carpeting. Hope this helps.

Also, have you tried the search engine here, for example /forums/topic/hartz-flea-shampoo-advice/

[That-One-Guy]

I was doing some research on Dawn being used as a flea killer and the results were kinda mixed, if not leaning towards positive. This summer I gave my dog a bath with a couple teaspoons of Dawn, about 3 baths in 4 and a half months. It seems to do an ok job for about a week or two then the fleas come back. While I was doing research, everyone was saying how natural Dawn was and from looking at the ingredients on their website it is far from natural. Anyways I wanted to know how other peoples experiences were with Dawn.

Ps I’ve been using the original Ultra Dawn blue bottle, I’m still not quite sure what the difference is between ultra and regular, if somebody knows could you please share?

[C4D]

Hi Kristin C,

I’m in complete agreement with you on dogs being fed a more natural, balanced diet and that is the building block to fending off diseases. It often helps dogs that already are diagnosed with various conditions such as diabetes and seizures, etc. It sounds like your doing all the right things for your dog with the heart murmur too.

I also believe that way too many chemicals are being put on our dogs and personally use minimal, if any topicals. I actually just pull the ticks off my dogs, identify them (we have deer and brown dog ticks in abundance in my area as well as Lyme Disease) and try to keep them out of areas of known infestations. My guy that got the ticks got no less than 6 in less than a week’s time. I’ve also used some natural repellants on my dogs after getting ticks with great success.

I’m not disagreeing with you. I’m just saying it would be interesting to hear what happens if you decide to try omitting the Advantix. Here’s an interesting link on fleas from Dr. Peter Dobias:

http://peterdobias.com/blogs/blog/34542021-can-feeding-a-raw-diet-prevent-fleas

Good luck with your pups!

[Kristin C]

Lucky? 1 dog going from 10 ticks per week to none, and 1 dog never having ticks living here is lucky? I think there is more to tick and flea infestation than is being discussed. If I am brave enough next year I will completely omit the Advantix and just go with feeding a raw diet plus B-vitamins and see what happens. I will say that I have almost completely eliminated one of my dogs heart murmurs by feeding her raw heart, so I do believe a lot has to do with diet.

[Kristin C]

C4D-I was just asking a question about the possibility of the immune system being a factor. I actually live in Salem, CT, Lyme tick heaven. We live on 2 1/2 acres where my dogs have regular free roam in the woods. One of them (6 yrs) has had 10 ticks a week in the past (with Advantix). Since switching her to raw food, plus B-vitamins, even with a half dose of Advantix I can’t remember the last time she had a tick. My younger dog (2 yrs) has never had a tick, and she has spent a considerable time roaming the woods, and she is on the same raw food, B-vitamins, half dose of Advantix. I was worried a few months ago about fleas since they were both itchy, but I added more chicken to their raw food diet and that solved it.

[C4D]

Shawna, I completely agree with you on DE. It also works for fleas in the home if dusted on the carpeting (very gently, using a mask) and especially in the baseboards.

Red, I actually agree with you in the comment on tall grass. I live in an area that is “crawling with ticks”. Of my 3 dogs, only 1 gets any ticks on him and I literally have to drag him out of the tall grass near a wetland that is notorious for ticks.

I don’t agree with you and skeptvet on most issues, no surprise that aimee does. I’ve used many of the “natural” treatments and they do work as DogFoodie and AquarianGT have said and have found that they work quite well, including using a natural treatment for Demodex mange and the dog has been clear for 10 months now.

Kristin C, I do think the immune system might possibly help fleas, but ticks just seem to attach if the dog is in the right place at the right time. However, if you’re using Advantix, even at a half dose, that would negate your assumption as you are still using a pesticide to curb a possible problem. You would have to not use it to see if it works.

[Kristin C]

Is it possible the immune system of the dog contributes to the frequency of flea and/or tick problems? No one seems to have mentioned that in this post so just wondering. I feed my dogs B-complex vitamins with their raw food, plus am currently giving them each 1/2 Advantix dose every 8 weeks and there has not been one tick on either of them this summer. No fleas either as far as I can tell. I think they are both pretty healthy is my point, and I am considering taking them off Advantix completely next season, keeping up with the B-complex, liver treats and raw food.

[Shawna]

David M,

Diatomaceous Earth (food grade only) is pretty effective at controlling fleas. It can be messy though. It’s a flour like texture and is applied to the coat of the dog. It doesn’t prevent fleas from getting on the dog but once they do the diatoms have edges that slice the endoskeleton of the bug (flea). The flea then dehydrates and dies. You have to be careful during application that it is not inhaled as it can damage the lungs but one on works for a week or two (or until the pup is bathed). It’s inexpensive and an be applied as much as needed. It can dry out the skin if used excessively though.

Only one of my six ever has an issue with fleas (mostly at the end of the season when the weather starts to change). I use DE exclusively on her and it works every time. She’s a Pom so application is tedious to get down to the skin but she’s small so not horrible. I separate her fur, drop a large pinch on the skin and then rub in. I only put it in the areas I see / feel flea dirt versus all over.

[Shawna]

No, I don’t think limonene has been pulled. Merck Vet Manual discusses it.

“d-Limonene

d-Limonene is used for flea control on cats and for other insect pests. At recommended dosages, the solution containing d-limonene appears to be safe. Increasing the concentration 5 to 10 times in sprays or dips increases the severity of toxic signs. These signs can include drooling, tremors, lack of coordination, and dangerously low body temperature. In dogs, ingestion of d‑limonene by mouth causes vomiting.” http://www.merckvetmanual.com/pethealth/special_subjects/poisoning/insecticide_poisoning.html

I wholeheartedly agree that just because something is natural doesn’t make it inherently safe. That was not the argument here though, it was whether natural is “effective” or not. When evaluating safety you have to look at quality of product too.

[Anonymous]

Bathing may reduce the numbers of fleas temporarily, but it provides no lasting protection, and dogs with flea allergies will continue to suffer if they are not protected from flea exposure.
If you have carpeting in your home, you may have to get it professionally treated (fumigation), fleas love carpeting. Hope this helps.

[David M]

Yeah Dogfoodie, he’s been off and on with fleas all summer. We tried Dawn, a “natural shampoo”, and most recently this Hartz crap. I’m also very leery of Frontline and all the other patches or whatever they are. Especially since he’s a small dog.

• This reply was modified 10 years, 2 months ago by David M.
• This reply was modified 10 years, 2 months ago by David M.

[aimee]

I remember limonene…. from citrus peels wasn’t it? It was all the rage at one time but then pulled due to side effects i think. Natural doesn’t = safe. If you are using something that kill fleas and ticks there will always be pro’s and con’s no matter what you choose.

[Shawna]

I think when one wants to see the world as black and white, it will be black and white regardless of what research is or is not available (not meaning you aimee).

“About 70 plant extracts were tested for their ability to repel the attacks of blood-sucking arthropods. It was found that a CO2 extract of the seeds of the Mediterranean plant Vitex agnus castus (monk’s pepper) can be used as a spray to keep away especially Ixodes ricinus and Rhipicephalus sanguineus ticks from animals and humans for at least 6 h. In addition mosquitoes, biting flies and fleas are also repelled for about 6 h.” http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00436-004-1297-z

“The interest in the use of monoterpenes for insect pest and pathogen control originates from the need for pesticide products with less negative environmental and health impacts than highly effective synthetic pesticides. The expanding literature on the possibility of the use of these monoterpenes is reviewed and focused on the effects of limonene on various bioorganisms. Limonene is used as insecticide to control ectoparasites of pet animals, but it has activity against many insects, mites, and microorganisms.” http://www.oaj.tsv.fi/index.php/AFS/article/view/5697

There are more if one only took the time to actually look.

[Anonymous]

“Lyme is transmitted by ticks, not fleas”.

I believe the product in question claims to kill fleas and ticks. Fleas can be just as troublesome, if not more so.

[DogFoodie]

Lyme is transmitted by ticks, not fleas.

“There is no credible evidence that Lyme disease can be transmitted through air, food, water, or from the bites of mosquitoes, flies, fleas, or lice.”

http://www.cdc.gov/lyme/transmission/

[aquariangt]

I use a natural flea and tick spray, and I live in the foothills of the mountains, so I have a lot of “nature” around me. Never had any flea or tick problems!

[Anonymous]

I am just going by what veterinarians(the ones that were helpful) including specialists have told me. Also, I am including my own experience with trying various methods of flea/tick control for many years. I have had 3 dogs test positive for Lyme. One suffered a great deal before she succumbed to complications of the disease. It is a nasty disease when it takes hold.
It is my opinion that the “natural stuff” is not strong enough to be effective.

[DogFoodie]

To issue a blanket statement saying that “the natural stuff doesn’t work,” is not at all accurate or fair. There are plenty of natural products that are proven effective.

David, are you currently having a problem with your dog’s having fleas?

[Anonymous]

They are all pesticides, if you read and compare the ingredients with similar products, you won’t see much difference.
Unfortunately, we need these products to combat Lyme and fleas….diseases they carry.
Some products may agree with an individual dog better than another.
See what your vet recommends. It depends on how bad the ticks/fleas are in your area.
I find avoidance (tall grass, woods) goes a long way to help, too.
I am leery of the new oral agents, however, I just don’t trust them.

PS: The “natural” stuff doesn’t work.
I use a flea/tick shampoo on my senior dog, about every week or two in the summer, I figure it’s milder than the topicals….plus he got a rash from a amitraz collar, although my other dogs tolerate the collars fine.

[Angeline H]

I have a chihuahua w similar allergies that started around same age. She was on Blue Buffalo Life Source chkn/brown rice puppy formula and was doing well on it. Since she was gaining weight, Dr. advised transition to adult. BB Life Source ckn/rice:Was fine for a while, then allergies started-thought it was caused by her food. Had her tested for allergies via blood draw sample. Result: allergy to dust mites, fleas, and molds. But not the dog food. Great environmental improvements were made, along w an Rx for sublingual allergy gtt Tx.
Sx subsided. 2+ months to go. Still have to use Benadryl prn. She still has mild allergenic Sx. Which Dr. Thinks may be from Ckn sensitives causing IBS. Being managed w probiotics and Liquid salmon oil also helps both the IBS and any minor itchiness. In short, the allergenic blood test is best. Sublingual drops better than injections.