Hi Spycar,
It appears that you still are not understanding the study that Skeptvet refers to. There were three separate experiments: Palatability, Digestability and Weight loss
Let’s look at the weight loss study “Experiment design The experiment was divided into two phases. In the first phase, overweight condition was induced in all dogs by consuming a high‐energy diet (Royal Canin Professional Energy 4800, Aimargues, France) ad libitum for 16 weeks; at the end of this phase, their BW and food intakes were stable. ……The second phase consisted of a 14‐week weight loss period during which dogs were divided into three groups, each receiving one of the experimental diets. ”
It seems that to do a weight loss study the researchers needed some overweight dogs with which to do it. They allowed the dogs free access to a diet by Royal Canin. NOTE All dogs were on the same diet and not on the experimental diets during the weight gain period. And no mention of coconut oil in the induction phase which is called phase one.
You wrote “they free fed the dogs for 16 weeks and it is of little surprise that dogs ate more and got fatter on the more delicious menu option” When you write ” on the more delicious menu option” I read that as you saying the dog had multiple food options. They did not. The experimental diets with various levels of coconut oil were not available to them. There was only one diet in phase one, a min 28% fat diet designed to sustain long periods of activity. The high fat diet led to weight gain in the beagles, a breed recognized for becoming overweight, when it was fed free choice. Note no mention of coconut oil in phase one.
It was after the 16 week free feed when the experimental diets were fed to the dogs for weight loss. This was phase two. The overweight dogs were divided into three groups and each group was fed a different experimental diet in a limited amount. It was this subsequent, phase two portion of the experiment that skeptvet is referring to. He wrote ” One study that added coconut oil to dog food to see if it would help with weight loss found that dogs on the diet with coconut oil lost less weight and had more body fat than dogs on diets with other sources of fat.” The key sections to pay attention to are “added coconut oil to dog food” and “weight loss” The only experiment in which both coconut oil was added to dog food and weight loss was tracked was phase 2 of the weight loss experiment. AND it is clear from the paper that the experimental diets were restricted for this phase of the experiment.
Skeptvet wrote ” dogs on the diet with coconut oil lost less weight and had more body fat than dogs on diets with other sources of fat.”The authors of the study report “Body weight (BW) reduction was lower (C0: 20.1 ± 2.32%, C20: 14.6 ± 1.43% and C40: 15.7 ± 1.23%, p < 0.05) and FM was higher (FM, 18.7 ± 3.42%, 27.9 ± 3.90% and 28.2 ± 2.88% for C0, C20 and C40, respectively, p < 0.05) for diets C20 and C40 than for C0.” Skeptvet simply restated the results. The authors wrote “Body weight (BW) reduction was lower” and skeptvet wrote “lost less weight” The authors wrote “FM was higher” (FM stands for fat mass ) and skeptvet wrote had more body fat. The diets with added coconut oil are C20 and C40.
You seem to have the various phases of the weight loss experiment and the palatability experiment, which was a separate experiment, all mixed up in your head. You wrote.” … he makes a claim that dogs fed “coconut oil lost less weight and had more body fat than dogs on diets with other sources of fat.” This statement refers to the author’s conclusion of phase 2 of the weight loss experiment that skeptvet restated. But then you go on to say “What he leaves out of the summary is that the dogs in the study found the food with more coconut in the mix (relative to vegetable oils) much more palatable than the dogs with foods high in vegetable oil, and these dogs were allowed to eat their fill.” This statement that you wrote refers to the results of a palatablilty experiment, a completely separate experiment from the weight loss experiment. It has no bearing on and is irrelevant to the weight loss experiment which is why skeptvet didn’t include information from the palatability experiment. He wasn’t addressing palatability of coconut oil, he is addressing effects of coconut oil on weight loss. Then somehow you conclude that skeptvet is guilty of ” Not honest science here. No mention by Skept Vet that the study lacked portion control.” It is clear that portion control was present for the weight loss experiment phase he is discussing. Very honest science from skeptvet! ! Then you state ” Big suprise that dogs given unlimited access to food ate more of the delicious food. Good grief.” It isn’t clear to which experiment or experiments you are referring to. It looks like you are referring again to the palatability experiment in which the dogs had multiple food options and unlimited access but you could mean the induction phase in which no experimental diets were fed and the dogs had free access to a Royal Canin product.
I hope you can now see that skeptvet was completely honest in his reporting. He is reporting the author’s conclusions of phase 2 of a weight loss study in which overweight dogs were fed portion controlled amounts of three different diets.
You wrote “You notably ignored all the other problems with Skept Vet’s methods”
Well not really as I said “To me it appears that you are starting out with a strong bias against skeptvet and then proceed to take things out of context, read into whatever he writes your own skewed interpretation and then call him out. Makes no sense to me.”
Bill you can find all kinds of stuff on skeptvet including a recent CV by googling “skeptvet” if you need help let me know!
