[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Jjennilee,
I would say for the most part yes. All you have to do is add the meat and anything else the pre-mix calls for in the recipe. ie Urban wolf requires you to add meat, oil, liver etc. I think most pre-mixes I know of have a statement on their website or bag that they are AAFCO compliant when the directions are followed. Some common pre-mixes are Sojos', Honest Kitchen Preference, Urban Wolf and Steves See spot live longer. The last one is not so easy to get in Canada, but the U.S.A is fine.
I hope this helps and Good luck to you and your lucky pup!

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi ScottsMomma! Thanks for rescuing a dog, he will be thanking you to! Seeing as you mentioned raw I would say that would be a great way to go! Raw should really help with any allergies and you can really customize the meal plan, anything that doesnt seem to sit well with him, you can simply move on to another protein. My shih tzu loves raw, its amazing how he took to it, and I am sure your terrier will love it too. While you are researching how to balance, Hound Dog Mom is the best for explaining that!, you can start with a pre-made raw or do a pre-mix in which you add your own meat to it. There is a great section for pre-made raw dog food here to help you choose the best, but I think a lot of people use Primal and Stella & Chewys I would to if I could get it! I have used Nature`s Variety and think its ok, Dawson loves it and he does well on it, but I like making my own then you know exactly what you put into it. But when I get busy I still use it.
For pre-mixes I know of a few, Urban Wolf, Honest Kitchen The Preference, Grandma Lucys makes one, Sojos I believe makes one, and one I think its called Steves Real Food, or something like that. I havent used them as Dawson doesnt really do so well on high potatoes, and urban wolf is the only one I can find here.
Check out the raw dog food forum, lots and lots of great help and questions that have already been answered. Here is a link /forums/forum/raw-dog-food-forum/
Oh and for the skin and dandruff, You can use coconut oil and a fish oil, I like to use krill oil, Here is an article from the whole dog journal on dosage:
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/15_9/features/Fish-Oil-Supplements-For-Dogs_20600-1.html
But now I five Dawson sardines instead of the krill oil, its cheaper and a whole food source he loves sardines!
And then coconut oil is half a teaspoon per ten pounds. I give Dawson his sardine requirements once weekly, so thursday, and then coconut oil every day, but you can do it however works best. I believe some people do every other day.
I hope this helps some! It is overwhelming when you first start, but its so much better for your dog than any kibble or canned food. I know more people with more knowledge than me will chime in!

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Everyone!
I have been working on a new menu for Dawson, trying to get more bones and more balance into his diet. So here it goes!
Am- 1 ounce Ziwipeak air dried lamb cuisine

Pm- Monday, Wednesday, Saturday Nights
– 2 oz pork ribs.
– .5 oz tripe patty. I have had no luck finding tripe here… so it may be canned 🙁 But I may be able to get some soon as the calves are getting butchered this month.

Pm- Thursday Night
-He would get 2 oz boneless meat patty (beef, pork, poultry whatever is on sale, could also be meat chunks,preferably organic.)
-Sardine, quarter of a tin.
-a cage free egg, no shell

Pm- Tuesday, Friday, Sunday Nights
– 2.5 oz boneless meat patty.
Note: 1.75 oz of liver and other organ blended into all patties for the week.

Supplements:
• 1/8 tsp pre/probiotics, daily
• 400 IU vitamin e capsule, weekly
• Sprouted Chia/Flax meal for manganese may use oysters occasionally, Thursday pm meal
• ¼ tsp cod liver oil once during the week, ½ cup organic keifir (mixed in with patties), and one cage free egg per pound of meat for vitamin D requirements, sardines will finish his vitamin D requirements
• ½ tsp coconut oil, daily
• Raw Glandular supplement, every other day
• ½ tsp homemade green super food supplement, daily

In the patties I would add pureed veggies and fruit but I didnt really count it on my calculations, it would be about a tsp per day… All kinds of veggies and fruit nothing particular, or toxic, lol!

My only question is, is the bone balancing the calcium in the boneless meat, or do I have to supplement additional calcium. And anything too little, too excessive, I gauged this at a weight of about 15 lbs.

I also have another with two meals of pork ribs and also two meals of chicken thighs. But it`s kinda is the same.

I was also thinking of getting this cookbook, especially if this recipe isnt balanced, lol!
http://www.completeandbalanced.com/
Its available in Canada at Dawsons vet, Here is a sample recipe:
http://www.completeandbalanced.com/samplerecipepage.html
Some recipes can be fed raw. Any thoughts, or concerns.

[Shihtzumom20]

Thanks Hound Dog Mom! I am getting pretty obsessed with Swanson’s, I already have other things to add to Dawson’s green blend picked out! It is so much more fun making your own green blend/raw!
I am sure I will have more questions later! Especially if I go full raw! (which is likely I think!)

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Hound Dog Mom, thats ok I have to wait on his supplements anyways! Thank you for suggesting Swanson’s I love them! Everything is so easy to find and pretty cheap! Plus the shipping to Canada is very reasonable.
Im glad you like my recipe! I will make sure to add in the liver and other organs, I was thinking I would give the raw glandular every other day, or do you think it should be every day? I found a baby food organic, its banana, sweet potato and blueberry puree, then concentrated lemon juice and absorbic acid. No artificial flavours or colours, BPA free package, they have many other fruits, vegetables single and combos. Would this be ok to use? Is the tablespoon enough? And the clacium citrate, I was wondering if I should only give it every 3 out of 4 days since the rmb (on the 5th day)will have bone in it? For the green supplement I really wanted to add in wheatgrass but I didnt find any on swansons, so I went with spirulina instead. For the flax meal how much/when should I give him? Oh and the tripett, how much of that would I give him? I can get the canned easily.
Sorry for all the questions, but I am very excited! I am finally doing it! When I really looked into the balancing it wasn’t too bad, but it did take me awhile! I do like feeding the ziwipeak in the am so I have some reassurance he is getting what he needs!

[Shihtzumom20]

They already shipped them out yay!! They were really fast! Now its a waiting game. Would anyone be able to tell me if I should use 90% or 95% ground chicken? And how my recipe holds up? Thanks!

[Shihtzumom20]

switched up the whole food supplement a bit, now its spirulina powder, turmeric powder and alfalfa leaf powder, I ordered all my supplements from swansons and really liked it! I hope they get it shipped ok! I should get it in a couple weeks and then can start feeding raw!

[Shihtzumom20]

oops forgot the veggies, because Dawson hates them I’m not sure what to do, he doesn’t even like fruit really. I think I will add in like a tablespoon of veggie/fruit baby food and if he will eat that then make up a veggie mix of sweet potatoe, bananas. carrots, any fruit thats on sale, kale, cook/steam it puree and put it in ice cube trays and give him one or two ice cubes per dinner, depending on how well he eats it either every day or with his grind only not rmb day. Oh and I was thinking of adding an extra small rmb with an am meal after his ziwipeak, I guess that would depend on how well he is keeping his weight?

[Shihtzumom20]

Hello Everyone,
So I have decided to take the plunge and make homemade raw for Dawsons pm meal! He will still get ziwipeak in the morning, for a couple reasons one its convenient mornings tend to be pretty busy! And I like their quality of meats so I think it is important Dawson gets it. He is getting the lamb variety so I think I will mostly use chicken for his dinner, but I may switch it up for beef every now and again as a treat.
Here is what my menu looks like, HDM could you take time to check how balanced it is I would greatly appreciate it!
So every am Dawson gets ziwipeak air-dried lamb. 1 ounce
pm- (3 ounces totatl) 90%-95% lean ground chicken, 200mg calcium citrate, ¼ tsp Carlson Cod Liver Oil, ½ capsule vitamin E, ½ tsp of organic wheatgrass powder+ organic kelp powder+ organic turmeric powder (mixed together in equal parts), Raw multiple Glandular supplement
*NOTE* Every 4 days Dawson consumes 1 pound of meat. On the 5th day he will get an rmb, either chicken wing with no skin (want to keep the fat fairly minimal) or beef/pork rib equaling three ounces.
Every pm meal for supplements he will get his (minimal lol) whole food supplement, and the calcium citrate but NOT on rmb night. Only 2x per week he will get 1/2 capsule vit E, and twice every 4 days he will get 1/4 tsp Carlson cod Liver oil.
I wasnt sure if I should include some liver/organ in his meal since he gets the ziwipeak in the morning and it has organs, I was hoping the raw glandular supplement would take care of that? I was also unsure what I should get for the chicken, I dont want a lot of fat since Shih tzu’s are prone to obesity and we are heading into fall/winter lol! I decided to use the cod liver oil for his vitamin d for now till I get used to it, but then I may try to give more variety using keifer, raw eggs etc.
I also want to add canned trippett, and 1/4 tin of sardines in the four day period. I think by using both the cod liver oil and sardines he would meet his omega 3 requirements and not need krill oil. But if thats wrong I will get the krill oil too! I want to take it anyways so I will have it on hand. I cant access the canned tripett website today. My computer wont let me into it, could you tell me how much and when I should I add it in?
Well how did I do? Please let me know if anything is in excess, missing or unnecessary!

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi HDM, was recommended this product on a fb group and was wondering what you thought of it!
http://www.naturalcanine.com/green_power.html
I really like the looks of the see spot live longer dinner mix, I want to feed raw in the pm, am is ziwipeak air dried, and this may be just what I need! I liked urban wolf, but I want to stay away from potatoes, they make Dawsons eyes really watery! And I believe you are one that is OK with grocery store meats? Its all I can get right now, not too much in the ways of organics around here, but it is better than commercially made foods?… I was thinking of doing Nature’s Variety raw again, but have been on the fence…
I also am going to add in turmeric and some krill oil for supplements, he does love sardines, if he ate a can a week could I cut out the krill oil? A can drained is 80 grams. Or switch between krill and sardines if that would be helpful?
Have you ever heard of omega-alpha products, used some for my horse, and saw they had pet products I am mainly interested the probiotics and enzymes:
http://omegaalpha.ca/en/product/114/Probiotic_8_Plus_trade/
If you liked it, I thought it may be an option for Canadians!

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,
I see what you mean about the Greens supplement now, I will just use a regular human multi vitamin. So here is my “meal plan” so lets see how close to right I get it, Lol!
am- Ziwipeak Daily Dog air dried cuisine-Lamb

pm- (I would make up a batch of a pound then divide it into his appropriate meal size)
– 1Ib boneless lean ground meat (chicken, beef, or pork) could I also use chunks for his size?
– 1/4 Ib vegetables, cooked and pureed… perhaps I could use organic baby food? To see if he will even eat any “slop” veggies?
– daily 1/4 tab multi-vit without calcium
-800mg calcium
– krill oil or another fish oil or sardines whatever I feel like that day lol.
– Swansons Glandular supplement, 3x a week or daily?
-Swansons Fruit concentrate, daily? or 3x a week?
How is that looking? Then I may need to add in the fiber, he does already get 1 tablespoon or so plain natural yogurt with his evening meal as his BM’s were fairly mushy on the Grandma Lucy’s Artisan. Speaking of that I guess I will use my leftovers as a kong stuffer or a quick meal… maybe give it a couple times a week in the am instead of his ziwi till its gone. He likes it well enough and I feel ok about it, but I would like it more if it didnt show up in his poop so much looking the same way it went in! Oh and maybe add some garlic into his meal… Does anyone know where I can get the Bugs Off Garlic in Canada? I looked on the website but it wouldnt ship to Canada at least when I last checked.
I completely agree, you are so patient with is newbies Hound Dog Mom, all your advice and time is greatly appreciated!

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,
Thanks for replying! The ingredients for the Green’s Multi are:

Ingredients per serving (16.9g): Medicinal Ingredients – Vitamin A (palmitate), Vitamin C (ascorbic acid, ascorbates), Vitamin B1 (thiamine mononitrate), Vitamin B2 (riboflavin), Vitamin B3 (niacinamide), Vitamin D (cholecalciferol), Vitamin E (d-alpha tocopheryl acetate), Vitamin B5 (d-pantothenic acid), Vitamin B6 (pyridoxine hydrochloride), Vitamin B12 (cyanocobalamine), Folic acid, Biotin, Calcium (citrate), Magnesium (citrate), Zinc (proteinate), Chromium (proteinate), Selenium (proteinate), Manganese (proteinate), Iodine (proteinate), Vanadium (HVP chelate), Molybdenum (proteinate), Lipotropic factor – Inositol. Also contains naturally occurring – Beta Carotene, Iron, Choline. In a base of greens+ – Natural fresh fruit flavour blend with stevia, Phosphatide complex (26% phosphatidyl choline from 97% oil-free lecithin), Organic alfalfa, barley, wheat grass & red beet powders, Spirulina, Apple pectin, Japanese Chlorella (cracked cell), Organic soy sprouts, Organic whole brown rice powder, Seven non-dary bacterial cultures containing Lactobacilli and bifidobacteria (2.5 billion per serving) in a special base of fructo-oligosaccharides, Malic acid, Royal jelly (5% 10-HDA), Bee pollen, Licorice root extract standardized to 10% glycyrrhizin, Acerola berry juice powder, Siberian ginseng extract standardized to 0.8% eleutherosides, Milk thistle extract standardized to 80% silymarin, Citric acid, Organic Nova Scotia dulse powder, Ginkgo biloba extract standardized to 24% ginkgo flavonglycosides and 6% terpene lactones, Japanese green tea extract standardized to 90% polyphenols, European bilberry extract standardized to 25% anthocyanidins, Full spectrum grape extract standardized to 95% procyanidolic value and 500ppm Resveratrol

Would this be ok? If so how much would he get? If not is there a multi-vitamin you would recommend? Or could I make up your whole food supplement and that would provide all he needs?
Could I use the glandular supplement as well? How often would he get that? I still will try with the veggies for sure, maybe “hidden” in raw meat he will gobble them down!
Thanks for your help!

[Shihtzumom20]

So I am trying to get myself organized to start feeding Dawson his raw meal in the pm. I saw Hound Dog Mom’s simplified recipe and I would like to start with that. Is there a certain multi-vitamin that would be better? Could I use the Green’s multi-vitamin? Here is a link:
http://www.nutritionhouse.com/greens-multi-507g-p-251.html#.UdiqkPlO_jA

I was also looking at the Swanson’s glandular and concentrated multi-fruit complex, could I use a mixture of these things? or would I still need a multi-vitamin? I like using krill oil for him anyways, but he does like sardines, could I feed him a sardine for a meal a couple times a week and that would be ok? Or would it just be best to use the krill oil?
He also hates vegetables… He picks the carrots out of his grandma Lucy’s and he just isn’t a fan of vegetables in general. Any suggestions?
I would follow Hound Dog Mom’s 1Ib boneless meat+1/4 cup cooked vegetables (unless you could suggest an alternative)+multi-vitamin (could I use the Green’s for this? if I could and then maybe need to add one or two things that would be nice. Or another multi-vitamin you like)+calcium+krill oil, or the sardines? Or would the sardines just be an “extra” that he would get?
I would like to start him by next weekend if all goes to plan!

[Shihtzumom20]

Thanks for the reply Patty 🙂 Im hoping to do half raw and half ziwipeak!

[Shihtzumom20]

*my fellow Canadian’s have a long weekend,lol. Hope everyone else is enjoying the rest of there weekend, lol*

[Shihtzumom20]

Hello again, I have been on the site many times since my last post and was hoping to get some more help again. Since my last post I took Dawson off Big Country Raw, I wasnt impressed with there customer service, most of the time my questions were brushed off and when I would place my order they seemed annoyed. Plus I found some things in the dinners I was not impressed with. So shortly after Dawson had a “sickness” episode (he was no longer on BCR) he vomited like 20 times before noon, and it was just bile. He was extremely lethargic and wouldnt eat or drink anything, but his bloodwork was relatively normal and in 2 days he was starting to be back to himself. He started drinking water on the 3rd day then the next day his appetite was back.Im fairly certain it was the freshpet he was eating that made him sick. After that episode I was afraid to start him back on raw, so I ordered in some ziwipeak air dried which he absolutely LOVES! Then once he was feeling better, i fed him ziwipeak in them am and then canned in the pm, I wanted to give him a meal with moisture in it like his raw meals. I switched his canned out for Grandma Lucy’s Artisan which he likes, and I like some things about it but its not ideal.
he has been doing well on that, but there is an Irish Wolfhound breeder at school who feeds her (very large,lol) gang raw. When we went to visit her and her wolfhound she had at school (who Dawson loved, I guess he likes the Big Girls, lol) she gave Dawson a tripe and veggie mixture to take home and try. Well He loves that and his tummy has seemed to be ok on it, which is what I had been worried about, so I was thinking about starting him back on raw, but im still nervous. I was also thinking of continuing his ziwipeak in the am, and trying the orijen freeze dried for his pm meal, but I was wondering if that would be too much fat for him to handle? He walks 2x a day, but I worry about inducing pancreatitis in him. Plus I like that the meats are free-range, antibiotic, hormone free. For raw the best I could probably do for a while would be grocery store as I cant seem to find organic free-range around here. At least until I can find a good source of meat… I really want free-range, antibiotic free meats for his tiny body, unless its ok for him to have typical “store bought” meats? If you think raw is still the best option I would like to prepare it myself this time around.
Sorry for the extremely long post, you guys are such a wealth of knowledge and the vets at school are very pro-Hills, Iams types. I really do like ziwipeak and so does Dawson, but I also want to feed him a meal with moisture in it as I think thats important too. Any input would be greatly appreciated! If you think is current diet is really decent, or if the ziwipeak, orijen freeze dried would be excellent for him, or if raw still would be the best (perhaps for his pm meal) even with store bought meats. And if you think of anything else that might help him after hissickness`supplements, tips etc. Thanks in advance, and hope you are all enjoying the long weekend!

[Shihtzumom20]

Sorry HDM I guess I was writing at the same time as you, I like the idea of making my own veggie/fruit blend, that way I can cook and puree them, and see what works best for him. I never notice any other veggies (except the kelp) or fruits in the blends for that matter, so maybe they just put the carrots in raw for some reason? I will ask when I make my next order. Is the fruit concentrate something you can buy at a nutrition store?
Hehe Patty, that made me giggle! I saw a few pictures yesterday of a dog eating the head of an animal, and know I couldn’t handle that. Good thing Dawson couldn’t eat a deer or calf head!(though dont some dogs lick out the brains?)

[Shihtzumom20]

I wish I could get Hare Today!I will have to try giving Dawson some berries! I guess I will limit the blends that have carrots and more veggies. It seems when I see carrot fragments scooping out his food, I see them in his poop, so I guess it is something he doesn’t digest too well. They have a new blend coming out at the end of march with alpaca, pheasant and elk! Quite the interesting combination!
I love that idea of making fruit popsicles! That would be a great idea especially for the summer. Im not sure I could feed brains and eyeballs as of yet though! Are beef tracheas good for teeth cleaning? The chicken wing he had went over very well, so I will see if I can find some on sale around here. Is a chicken neck safe for a small dog to eat?

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Guys!
I just wanted to give an update on how Dawson is doing on his “real” raw diet! So far he has loved and therefore devoured every meal he has had, which is something for him! He bounces and dances until I put his bowl down. He has loved all the proteins, so far he has had chicken, turkey, duck and beef. What a change for the better! I have also noticed that his eyes are nice and clear and he doesnt have constantly wet “cheeks”. His fur is so soft! It is so nice to have him eat with such vigour instead of throwing his meal all over the floor.
I have a question though, there are carrots in the “dinners” , but I noticed they look the same coming out as they did going in! I was thinking about changing to the 100% meat blends that dont include veggies, or should I not worry too much about carrot pieces? If I do switch to the 100% do i have to worry about more supplements, he gets krill oil, vitamin D and vitamin E. He is getting locally pre-made raw Big Country Raw. Plus I am wanting to add more things like turkey necks, and he Loves beef trachea (so far it is dehydrated), I believe that you guys said it could be up to 20% of his diet, is that right?

[Shihtzumom20]

Thanks Hound Dog Mom!

[Shihtzumom20]

Thank you Hound Dog Mom! I got all his supplements today and I get his food tomorrow, and then we are ready to go. I really appreciate you taking the time to look at the website and help me make sure it is balanced. And for your supplement blend, is that 1/2 a tsp each of everything or 1/2 a tsp of everything that has been all mixed together?

[Shihtzumom20]

Thanks Hound Dog Mom,
I feel so much better feeding this to Dawson now that you have checked it out! I was very surprised at the price as well!
Would you recommend I give Dawson your vitamin/mineral supplement? I know I saw a couple variations on the raw food menu thread. If you recommend that how much would I give him? One of my good friends has organic cage free eggs, so I could get him some eggs for vitamin D, he would get just under 2 pounds of food a week. (2 pounds in eight days) I already have his Krill oil picked out, so I need vitamin e and then a vitamin d source, is that correct? I saw in one of your menus, you gave vitamin A reduced cod liver oil, would that be suitable?
And thank you for explaining how to convert to % dry matter, it makes a lot more sense now!
Thank you for your time and all your help Hound Dog Mom!

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,
So here is the chicken dinner ingredients:
Big Country Chicken Dinner
Ingredients
Ground chicken with bone, beef liver, fruit and vegetable puree. Garlic and kelp.
A complete and balanced meal choice. Protein-max 16%. Fat-min 12%. Moisture-62%. Fibre-2.6%
The chicken dinner has the highest fat, the rest are not over 10%. Of course I don’t really know how to convert it to dry matter basis, I did see how on here but I think my calculation was way off, lol!
Other than the fish I don’t see any fish oil added, would you say to add in the krill oil? I think they want you to feed the fish dinner every now and again, but they use cod, haddock or sole.
I guess I will hold off the joint supplement, do rmb’s help supply glucosamine and chrondroitin? He is getting his first chicken wing for his evening meal! I am so excited, I showed it to him and he wanted to take it so I think he will like the true raw diet! But he is still young with no issues so far, so since he is getting it naturally I think he will be good for now!
Thanks for all your help HDM! He is at me right now for his chicken wing!
And I like your schedule for vaccinating, I think I personally would feel better if he got his one year shots, and then I might titer him at 2 and go from there.

[Shihtzumom20]

Hi Hound Dog Mom,
Thanks so much for your reply! After doing some more research I decided to still go with a premade raw, it is a small company and all the ingredients are human grade, and from southern Ontario. It is called Big Country Raw. I have been looking at supplements and have been thinking of adding Krill oil to his raw. Would this be recommended? They do have a fish dinner, but it has salmon and tuna in it, so I think I would like to avoid that. Should I start supplementing him with Krill Oil? I like the benefits, then I read on another forum here that too many Omega 3’s can be bad too. So I was wondering what you guys think of that? And also do you guys use a joint supplement for your dogs? I have been trying to research on the internet but having been having much luck in whether to supplement or not. He is only a year and a bit, so I don’t know if I should wait to start a joint supplement or if it is beneficial to start him on it young. Also if someone could direct me to the vaccinating thread that would be greatly appreciated(if there is one)! He is coming up to his 1 year shots and I am not sure whether to get them or not, any advice on supplementing and vaccinating are greatly appreciated, thanks so much guys!

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